England takes first steps against Ijaz Butt

[sakss]

he ECB and the Professional Cricketers' Association have sent a pre-action letter to PCB chairman, Ijaz Butt, seeking a "full and unreserved apology" for alleging that England's players were involved in fixing the outcome of the third ODI at The Oval, which Pakistan won by 23 runs.

The letter, sent on behalf of the England team, advised Butt that "if a satisfactory response was not received, legal proceedings will be commenced against him without further notice."

In an extraordinary statement last Sunday, which he read out to ESPNcricinfo, Butt had said, "There is loud and clear talk in bookie circles that some English players have taken enormous amounts of money to lose the match [the third ODI]. No wonder there was such a collapse." He had also accused certain "august cricket bodies" of conspiring to defraud Pakistan and Pakistan cricket.

The allegations were made after the ICC announced it was investigating the third ODI at The Oval after receiving information from a newspaper before the game began alleging that bookies were aware of certain scoring patterns that occurred during the match.

"We are looking for an apology. If it does not come we'll look at other options," ECB chief executive, David Collier, had said on Tuesday. "You can't impugn someone's integrity without having proper evidence. "To date I can say that we have received zero evidence of anything having influenced any England player."

Andrew Strauss, the England captain, had said his team was outraged by the allegations Butt had made. "We are deeply concerned and disappointed that our integrity as cricketers has been brought into question. We refute these allegations completely and will be working closely with the ECB to explore all legal options open to us."

http://www.cricinfo.com/england-v-pakistan-2010/content/story/478445.html

[Down2Earth]

it'll be great if he threw some form of evidence back at them, but obviously that's highly unlikely

[MenInG]

Game on. Bring in the heavies :)

[Javelin]

it'll be great if he threw some form of evidence back at them, but obviously that's highly unlikelyHe might be calling Sir Paul Condon as a witness on his behalf.

[PaPaPak]

Ijazz Butt is going to be around forever

[Robert]

"Sue me? I will sue them!"

[MenInG]

To be fair, the accusation he made was for an ODI last year - dont think Condon is referring to that but the principle is the same

[Javelin]

To be fair, the accusation he made was for an ODI last year - dont think Condon is referring to that but the principle is the sameOnce Condon has opened the door to accusations against players of all countries, especially considering his previous role with the ICC, it will be extremely difficult for the ECB to say that there is absolutely no truth whatsoever in what Ijaz Butt said, taking into account the fact that, if Condon is right, the ECB was also in the dark when some England players were involved in fixing during the period Condon is referring to (that is unless the ECB did know, but kept it quiet ! Just as the Australians did with Waugh and Warne)

[Saj]

Interesting that Condon kept quiet when Butt made the accusations last year

[Bullet Drive]

Interesting that Condon kept quiet when Butt made the accusations last year

That is true, maybe he knew something :P

[PakPosheeda]

Interesting that Condon kept quiet when Butt made the accusations last year
English laws and courts were formed to prosecute Pakistani cricketers not English cricketers. Get that right.

Who's going to trust the next Englishman in charge of anti-corruption unit now?

[Robert]

Interesting that Condon kept quiet when Butt made the accusations last year

What would you have liked Lord Condon to say?

[Javelin]

What would you have liked Lord Condon to say?Something along the lines of :

"The ICC should investigate this thoroughly, perhaps even getting Scotland Yard involved.
After all, every country has had players involved in fixing in the past, in some cases the allegations swept under the carpet by the respective Board(s), and it would be wrong to assume that only Pakistani players are doing it now, and exclude England players simply because they are England players " ?

[KingKhanWC]

I think the difference is Butt was suggesting the England team in 2010 had been fixing while Condon is talking about the past.

[Robert]

Something along the lines of :

"The ICC should investigate this thoroughly, perhaps even getting Scotland Yard involved.
After all, every country has had players involved in fixing in the past, in some cases the allegations swept under the carpet by the respective Board(s), and it would be wrong to assume that only Pakistani players are doing it now, and exclude England players simply because they are England players " ?

Well, did Butt present any actual evidence of wrongdoing by ECB employees?

Or was he just setting up a strawman?

[Javelin]

Well, did Butt present any actual evidence of wrongdoing by ECB employees?

Or was he just setting up a strawman?Here comes the 'strawman' again! :)))

[Javelin]

Well, did Butt present any actual evidence of wrongdoing by ECB employees?

Or was he just setting up a strawman?Condon's assertion that player's from 'every' country implies players from England as well. And considering Condon's background ( - Senior Officer within Scotland Yard, and then Head of ICC's anti-corruption unit), one must assume that he did not make that statement lightly, and he had reasons for making it, ie strong suspicions.

Since no England players were ever brought to book, it can only be for one or more of the following reasons.
1) The ECB buried it's head in the sand and refused to consider the possibility that England players were involved in fixing.
2) The ECB knew about it, and buried it. (just as Australians with Waugh and Warne)
3) The ECB investigated it, and did not find sufficient proof to do something about it. This is unlikeliest of the 3 possibilities, since, presumably, Condon was in contact with the ECB during his time with the ICC.

But, you are the one now making a 'strawman' argument. You are ignoring the gist of my point, ie Spot-fixing by the 3 Pakistani's was exposed as having occurred during a Pakistan-England match, the Chairman of Pakistan was making allegations against England players, and the ICC/ECB first action was to deny everything ?
Without even a semblence of any investigation before clearing the England players ?

Put the foot on the other shoe, and think what would have happened if three England cricketers were caught spot-fixing in a Pakistan-England match, and the Chairman of the ECB was making allegations against Pakistan players, would the ICC have been as quick to clear the Pakistani players ?

It would appear that for many people, when making allegations against Sub-Continent players, Sir Paul Condon is a man of integrity, an experienced Senior Officer in Scotland Yard, cricket's former Head of the World body in rooting out corruption, blah, blah, blah,.......
But,
When he makes similar allegations against England and Australian players, he's useless and he's talking 'rubbish' !

[Robert]

You are ignoring the gist of my point, ie Spot-fixing by the 3 Pakistani's was exposed as having occurred during a Pakistan-England match, the Chairman of Pakistan was making allegations against England players, and the ICC/ECB first action was to deny everything ?
Without even a semblence of any investigation before clearing the England players ?


Of course, because there was no evidence of wrongdoing by English plays - just slander from Butt.

[RightArm Fast]

i'd love it if he ACTUALLY had evidence haha what a Joker!!

[Ironcat]

I think Zaka has grounds to launch a suit against Condon.

The first thing to question is why there was no follow-up to what Condon might have known back in the days. Secondly, why isn't there a follow-up NOW?

Either investigate what Condon is saying or sue his accusing @$$. There should be no third option.

[Usman]

Interesting that Condon kept quiet when Butt made the accusations last year

Probably because he didn't want to be the at the centre of a scandel which was blown out of all proportion. Plus Condon has been talking about former players fixing. Yes he reckons it still goes on but he didn't want to anger further the already hyper English players and media.

[Javelin]

Of course, because there was no evidence of wrongdoing by English plays - just slander from Butt.You conveniently ignored the rest of my post, especially the two paragraphs:

But, you are the one now making a 'strawman' argument. You are ignoring the gist of my point, ie Spot-fixing by the 3 Pakistani's was exposed as having occurred during a Pakistan-England match, the Chairman of Pakistan was making allegations against England players, and the ICC/ECB first action was to deny everything ?
Without even a semblence of any investigation before clearing the England players ?

Put the foot on the other shoe, and think what would have happened if three England cricketers were caught spot-fixing in a Pakistan-England match, and the Chairman of the ECB was making allegations against Pakistan players, would the ICC have been as quick to clear the Pakistani players ?

[Usman]

You conveniently ignored the rest of my post, especially the two paragraphs:

To Rob's defence, the ICC and ECB did say to Ijaz Butt to hand them the proof or shut-up. As Ijaz Butt later admitted himself, there was no actual proof. Anyone can make baseless allegations but if there's no proof, then there is nothing to investigate. If Giles Clarke would have said the same about Pakistan then for two reasons the allegations would have been taken seriously:

1) Unlike Butt, the man isn't utterly incompetent so his statements hold a bit of credibility

2) More importantly, Giles Clarke would have had some sort of evidence to back himself up.

Ijaz Butt and him alone could have made such a hash of this situation.