PDA

View Full Version : Tableeghi Jamaats to be banned from Cantts, defence areas



ahsan88
24th May 2011, 19:04
http://thenews.com.pk/TodaysPrintDetail.aspx?ID=6200&Cat=13&dt=5/24/2011


ISLAMABAD: Preaching teams (Tableeghi Jamaats) as well as those who are not permanent residents of the area are likely to be barred from entering mosques of cantonments and defence and security institutions across the country, it was learnt here on Monday.

“Security agencies have been suggesting such measures from time to time in the past in view of the growing terrorism. It has happened in the past that junior officials of the Pakistan Air Force got one-year-long leave on the pretext of accompanying the preaching groups, but when they were later arrested, it transpired that they had in fact been training with different militant groups,” a senior security officer told The News on condition of anonymity.

The officer said that the most important and consensus revelation made by the people so far arrested and interrogated for their alleged involvement in different terrorism acts was that their militancy grew on religious grounds more than all other factors. He said that after the killing of Osama bin Laden, the country faced the most serious threat from internal terrorism, which had already started.

The News has already published a report following the recent Charsadda attack about the intentions of the terrorist groups of avenging the death of al-Qaeda leader Osama bin Laden. According to the report, al-Qaeda and its affiliates have already announced that they would avenge the death of their leader in a very cruel manner.

“Security agencies of the country look much worried about the deteriorating law and order situation in the country. The problem would not be resolved by mere issuance of security warnings and alerts about the possibility of terrorism incidents in the wake of the killing of Osama,” the security officer commented.

Radiance Of Australis
24th May 2011, 19:22
Probably only 1% (or even less) of Tablighis are involved in 'preaching' hate. I attend the ladies Dars sessions whenever they come close to our locality and they are fine people with quite a lot of knowledge on Islam. I even went on Jamaat once and it was a nice experience.

I must say, they are picking out the wrong people.

Although I guess some of these hate fueling people cannot be true Tablighis. They are basically using their name to conceal their true actions, just like the terrorists do to Islam.

Striver
24th May 2011, 21:28
I am afraid this is just calling for trouble. I have friends who are part of the tablighi jamat, even I have sat in their gatherings many times.

All they talk about is:
Praying 5 times
Going in the Path of Allah ie on jamat
Reciting Quran and durood/zikr
Ikhlaaq - treating Muslim brother with respect etc
They correct one's Salah and recitation of last few surahs

Not once I've heard anything related to politics or voilence.

Tablighi jamat has some of the highly intellectual scholars ie Maulana Tariq Jameel and members like JJ

Striver
24th May 2011, 21:31
It is not farfetched some high class people living in these areas don't like the preaching hence requesting these guys to be blocked

Tapori
24th May 2011, 22:02
Well at least those Tableeghi Jamaat's members' children and wives will be happy to see them every day rather than every three months.

Of course God will be angry. Very Angry.

-

Rather than banning them, Cantt the Defence folk just allow them in and then drive them away by putting up a large loudspeaker in their colony blearing out:

"Yaa, U know, Yaa I know Yaa"

Rickshaw

srh
24th May 2011, 22:27
It is not farfetched some high class people living in these areas don't like the preaching hence requesting these guys to be blocked
well they are not high class anymore if they are requesting these guys to be blocked

Prince_Pathan
24th May 2011, 22:32
this is not good...this may lead to quite alot of angst...many people will surely oppose this...

i can see this creating more problems rather than good :moyo

shakil
24th May 2011, 23:10
I fear that this may be the start of a long list of allegations on the group. Obviously, they do have an aim of spreading Islam and ultimately help in implementing their form of sharia in the whole country. However, this is really pathetic of them to not allow any outside to pray in the mosque.

Striver
24th May 2011, 23:32
I fear that this may be the start of a long list of allegations on the group. Obviously, they do have an aim of spreading Islam and ultimately help in implementing their form of sharia in the whole country. However, [b]this is really pathetic of them to not allow any outside to pray in the mosque.

This actually nothing new, the village I'm from, many who run the main mosque are of barelvi/green pagri/tahir ul qadri style followers and they have kicked out the tablighi jamaat because their practices/beliefs are distinct from the village's. Many label them as wahabis just because they don't celebrate Eid Milad unNabi, or do zikr with lights off and putting a chair so supposedly Prophet pbuh can sit on it. Tablighis consider many of these things biddaat.

Growing number of Shias are also against Tablighis and some curse Sheikh Tariq Jameel "my used to be best friend shia" has done it.

So yeah in Pakistan if you are of opposing belief then there are good chances that you will be labelled as a wahabi etc

KingKhanWC
25th May 2011, 00:05
Not sure if this is the right move. If the authorities suspect the Jamaat it's very easy to send in undercover agents to determine if they are any credible threats from within the group.

Looney
25th May 2011, 00:11
What will that achieve ? Tableeghi people can go to middle class , poor areas and brainwash people to go and kill people in these areas ?

shaykh1985
25th May 2011, 00:13
Surely this will just create hostility...another example of creating an additional problem as opposed to eliminating them...

Gollum
25th May 2011, 00:16
Some of you guys have a very wrong idea of Tableeghi Jamaat people. The overwhelming majority of them don't have a violent bone in their body, and they have dedicated their lives to call out people to Islam. We should be careful when talking about people who call out to Islam.

kingusama92
25th May 2011, 00:19
What will that achieve ? Tableeghi people can go to middle class , poor areas and brainwash people to go and kill people in these areas ?

A point I was going to make myself.

Are the rich really people they would target? Most of them go for the uneducated/poor that can be easily wooed.

kkmix
25th May 2011, 00:22
This is pathetic really ... because not all tableeghi people are extremists ... this is pure generalizing ... It is exactly like France banning Muslim veil because it's a "security issue" to them ... difference here is that we are banning our own people ... And it is sad because if our own people can't differentiate between the real Muslim and fake Muslim (terrorist), then how do we expect others to see us differently.

insaftak
25th May 2011, 00:23
So would they block a team made up of saeed anwar, inzi, mushi and junaid jamshed

kingusama92
25th May 2011, 00:27
This is pathetic really ... because not all tableeghi people are extremists ... this is pure generalizing ... It is exactly like France banning Muslim veil because it's a "security issue" to them ... difference here is that we are banning our own people ... And it is sad because if our own people can't differentiate between the real Muslim and fake Muslim (terrorist), then how do we expect others to see us differently.

I don't think it'll last too long.

It's more of a blanket ban in order to make sure nothing is spread further. Just as a way to gain some more control over the situation.

The honest Muslims in those Tablighi Jamaats can consider this as a little sacrifice in order to make sure the idiots don't exploit.

The issue is no one complains when those individuals preach hatred. People take it all in and just leave it. How are the Police and co, supposed to weed these people out when no one complains until its too late?!

I guess they saw this as the only way forward for now.

Looney
25th May 2011, 00:31
A point I was going to make myself.

Are the rich really people they would target? Most of them go for the uneducated/poor that can be easily wooed.

exactly , even if they are knowledgeable about Islam , they maybe lured into it by offering them money or food .

kkmix
25th May 2011, 00:39
I don't think it'll last too long.

It's more of a blanket ban in order to make sure nothing is spread further. Just as a way to gain some more control over the situation.

The honest Muslims in those Tablighi Jamaats can consider this as a little sacrifice in order to make sure the idiots don't exploit.

The issue is no one complains when those individuals preach hatred. People take it all in and just leave it. How are the Police and co, supposed to weed these people out when no one complains until its too late?!

I guess they saw this as the only way forward for now.

Sacrificing is ok ... but only intellectual tebleeghis would look at it like that ... many of them would look at it as Pakistan gov't stopping them from spreading Islam ... and that the government is kafir ... trust me it will create more anger, and rightly so ... because they should be able to differentiate between good Muslim and terrorist. And this is definitely not the only way forward ... this is just pleasing one party, and you know who it is ... better way would have been to investigate the tableeghi people and allow them in.

khankhan
25th May 2011, 00:46
Good Move.

Abdullah22
25th May 2011, 01:04
What will that achieve ? Tableeghi people can go to middle class , poor areas and brainwash people to go and kill people in these areas ?

:facepalm:
The stupidy in some post make me wanna cry out loud.

Maybe the stupid is me for reading them.

Striver
25th May 2011, 01:10
:facepalm:
The stupidy in some post make me wanna cry out loud.

Maybe the stupid is me for reading them.

i think what Looney may have meant/implied is that this move is blatant and poorly thought out

Looney
25th May 2011, 01:22
:facepalm:
The stupidy in some post make me wanna cry out loud.

Maybe the stupid is me for reading them.

I should not have generalized but i am talking in the same context as the article itself , my apologies . But my point remains , poor people who are also less likely to be educated about deen and duniya will be easier targets .

Maybe they want to cut the financial funding or donations they get from these rich people ? Just a thought . This is a real bad decision and makes the people in charge look bad and weak . A very desperate attempt , i would say .

Tera Gawaandi
25th May 2011, 01:40
You dont have any spiritual-cultural TV channel in Pakistan? similar to one in India ie. Aastha TV etc.

Aly
25th May 2011, 01:56
I wonder why people are ignoring the glaringly obvious reality that if an army which was primarily built on religious slogans i.e Making Pakistan "Islam ka Qilla" (instead of a welfare state) etc, and who still uses religion and religious people as a tool to achieve its various "strategic" goals, could resort to such tactics then there must be something really wrong with such tableeghi jamats and madarssas .

I think instead of picking and choosing various religious entities among the society, our establishment should first of all take religion out of the state affairs and should start recruiting people who are loyal to the country first and then to their religious views...which ironically means stop preferring people from K.P and Punjab in the army (which we all know would never happen)

Striver
25th May 2011, 02:07
I wonder why people are ignoring the glaringly obvious reality that if an army which was primarily built on religious slogans i.e Making Pakistan "Islam ka Qilla" (instead of a welfare state) etc, and who still uses religion and religious people as a tool to achieve its various "strategic" goals, could resort to such tactics then there must be something really wrong with such tableeghi jamats and madarssas .
I think instead of picking and choosing various religious entities among the society, our establishment should first of all take religion out of the state affairs and should start recruiting people who are loyal to the country first and then to their religious views...which ironically means stop preferring people from K.P and Punjab in the army (which we all know would never happen)

An Army which WAS... now you go into their clubs whether it be PAF, NAVY, Army many of the high brass officials are drinking wine etc...

it is hard to believe that the high brass are still of a religious mindset.... incase some maybe taken as enlightened or secular who blame mullah and religion for their troubles or incompetence when their previous generals used the students of the madrassas for their needs

Aly
25th May 2011, 02:26
An Army which WAS... now you go into their clubs whether it be PAF, NAVY, Army many of the high brass officials are drinking wine etc...

it is hard to believe that the high brass are still of a religious mindset.... incase some maybe taken as enlightened or secular who blame mullah and religion for their troubles or incompetence when their previous generals used the students of the madrassas for their needs

well to be honest with you, you are just comparing apples with oranges.

I mean just because certain individual deeds of a small group of elite army officers goes against the general ideology of the army as a whole, it doesn't mean that they have given up their real religious ideology as an army.

Just to give you few examples ...

1-Porn stash was allegedly found in Osama's hideout, now could you say that Osama was actually going against his religious ideals by making it the base of your argument?

or let's forget it, since for many its just cheap propaganda on the part of the U.S.

2-You and me both know that while T.V was completely banned during the Taliban era in Afghanistan (since according to them "real" Islam doesn't allow it) yet these days we keep seeing talibans as well as various al-qaeda members very proudly making their videos (and in some cases even doing their make-ups before facing the camera :p ) and telecasting them all around he world, now does this apparently non-islamic action mean that they have given up on their extremist mindset ???..you would be a fool to even think on such lines ...

Moral of the story : Little Hypocritical individual acts here and there couldn't be taken as a rebellion against one's years old ideology :P

srh
25th May 2011, 02:41
I wonder why people are ignoring the glaringly obvious reality that if an army which was primarily built on religious slogans i.e Making Pakistan "Islam ka Qilla" (instead of a welfare state) etc, and who still uses religion and religious people as a tool to achieve its various "strategic" goals, could resort to such tactics then there must be something really wrong with such tableeghi jamats and madarssas .

I think instead of picking and choosing various religious entities among the society, our establishment should first of all take religion out of the state affairs and should start recruiting people who are loyal to the country first and then to their religious views...which ironically means stop preferring people from K.P and Punjab in the army (which we all know would never happen)
why you think a country cannot be both: Islam ka Qilla and a welfare state at the same time? It has happened before for example in Hazrat Umar Farooq RA time.
Btw I dont consider Pakistan an Islamic state. Its a muslim majority state.

Aly
25th May 2011, 03:05
why you think a country cannot be both: Islam ka Qilla and a welfare state at the same time? It has happened before for example in Hazrat Umar Farooq RA time.
Btw I dont consider Pakistan an Islamic state. Its a muslim majority state.

lol, Thank god you didn't mention the legendary state of Camelot in medieval times :P

How about giving any example from the time industrial revolution start taking place in the human civilization?, I know we glorify the era of caliphate etc very much but I am afraid the ground realities of the human civilization have changed drastically from those eras.


though just to give you a little hint , Castles can never thrive in peace..and last time I checked peace was the primary prerequisite for any kind of human welfare...I hope you get the point.

PakPrince
25th May 2011, 03:48
im in this area these days nobody even knows abt this here

and its not like our authorites are efficient or anything.

these will go on regardless.

you cant go checking into every mosque or house

shakil
25th May 2011, 04:08
This actually nothing new, the village I'm from, many who run the main mosque are of barelvi/green pagri/tahir ul qadri style followers and they have kicked out the tablighi jamaat because their practices/beliefs are distinct from the village's. Many label them as wahabis just because they don't celebrate Eid Milad unNabi, or do zikr with lights off and putting a chair so supposedly Prophet pbuh can sit on it. Tablighis consider many of these things biddaat.

Growing number of Shias are also against Tablighis and some curse Sheikh Tariq Jameel "my used to be best friend shia" has done it.

So yeah in Pakistan if you are of opposing belief then there are good chances that you will be labelled as a wahabi etc

Yes, you are right. In fact I spent quiet a few days with them too :moyo

Looney
25th May 2011, 04:12
The Green Turbans have some weird practices .

saqlain
25th May 2011, 04:17
Fantastic news, and comes about the right time. These people have no business in going to military areas and do their preaching. Those who want to listen to these guys, I am sure, they know how to find them.

NJamal
25th May 2011, 14:18
Another ********* by the current government on the orders of their masters. What message they are trying to convey? They want to label Tableeghi Jamaat as fueling Islamic extremism. Give me a break, Tableeghi people are the most peace loving people we will ever see. Disgusting stuff by the government as was expected.

10sion
25th May 2011, 23:04
Another step in the wrong direction. Well done Pakistan.

As many other members posted -- Tableegh Jamaat [TJ], is filled with people who just want to become better practicing muslims. And invite/remind others to this path and our duties as a muslim. I have seen my own school mate who was the sort of guy every parent will want their child to avoid, go through an amazing transformation after joining tableegh jamaat. This friend never passed his Grade 11 exams, used to be a chain smoker, indulge in vile acts etc. He lost his small brother in an air plane crash, and then started going on jamaats. Today, he regularly prays, never uses swear words, takes care of his dads business, sports a kandoura and a well kept beard, follows the sunnahs to the best of his ability and mashAllah there are 4[maybe more, I am not sure] people who have reverted to Islam after being in his company.

anakwalajinn
25th May 2011, 23:35
The Green Turbans have some weird practices .

The green turbans are Dawat-e-Islami and not TJ :)

Down2Earth
26th May 2011, 08:27
TJ's are very dodgy characters.

suhaib
26th May 2011, 08:34
does it really matter if they are good, militants will mingle with them and make there way into sensitive areas.

Poison
26th May 2011, 08:38
This isn't about the TJ as such ... how do you differentiate a real jamaat from a group of militants who get into the cantt mosque/live/sleep there for a few days?

Striver
26th May 2011, 08:46
TJ's are very dodgy characters.

sorry but how so?

PerfectionPersonified
26th May 2011, 09:37
Long time ago i was invloved with TJ,


I have been to Jamaat for 3 days as well and attended consistely their Friday Sermons

Two things i dont like about TJ ,

They Force You TOO much for the sake of Their SAWAAb
This is such a Big Jamaat and i havent heard them decalring Suicide bOming as Un-Islamic
Interestingly there have been suicide boming at Shrines , Immam baargahs etc But NEVER in Raiwind ---

Hmm very Interesting as "person who doesnt disapprove such actions . kind of Approves this Bombings"..

Poison
26th May 2011, 09:38
Again this isn't about one group in particular, it's a normal safety measure to prevent any sort of jamaat to enter cantonment areas, which is fair IMO. Not like the only mosque is in the cantonments.

kkmix
26th May 2011, 09:40
Again this isn't about one group in particular, it's a normal safety measure to prevent any sort of jamaat to enter cantonment areas, which is fair IMO. Not like the only mosque is in the cantonments.

which is true, but quite sad because if we cannot differentiate between Muslim and terrorist then how do we expect other to see us differently.

mamoo gogo
26th May 2011, 10:23
Rather than banning them, Cantt the Defence folk just allow them in and then drive them away by putting up a large loudspeaker in their colony blearing out:

"Yaa, U know, Yaa I know Yaa"

Rickshaw

I hope you don't do comedy for a living:boycott


Many label them as wahabis just because they don't celebrate Eid Milad unNabi, or do zikr with lights off and putting a chair so supposedly Prophet pbuh can sit on it.

you serious? :asif

Looney
26th May 2011, 10:54
The green turbans are Dawat-e-Islami and not TJ :)
whoever they are , all i know is that i have seen them doing some weird practices . there were some in my area , i stayed away from them .

Khabri420
26th May 2011, 11:14
whoever they are , all i know is that i have seen them doing some weird practices . there were some in my area , i stayed away from them .

Don't think the TJs do that. However, there are weirdos out there and you may be referring to this:

_uPP4Ok2ffs

NJamal
26th May 2011, 11:18
Better ban Americans to enter Pakistan, it will improve the situation dramatically.

Khabri420
26th May 2011, 11:18
I have my reservations about the Tableeghi Jamat which does not in anyway discount the good work that they have done, but I certainly don't seem them as a security threat. Simply put, everything in Pakistan is a reactive measure and this is no different.