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Abdullah719
7th August 2019, 20:07
The National Security Committee (NSC) on Wednesday decided to downgrade Pakistan's diplomatic relations with India and suspend bilateral trade with New Delhi.

The top security body’s meeting presided over by Prime Minister Imran Khan was held to review the situation in the wake of India's shock decision to scrap the special status for occupied Kashmir.

The meeting also decided to review Pakistan-India bilateral arrangements, take the matter to the United Nations and observe the upcoming Independence Day on August 14 in solidarity with Kashmiris.

"PM directed that all diplomatic channels be activated to expose brutal Indian racist regime, design and human rights violations," a statement issued after the meeting said.

More to follow.

https://www.dawn.com/news/1498609/pakistan-to-downgrade-diplomatic-ties-suspend-bilateral-trade-with-india-nsc-meeting

mmkextreme_1
7th August 2019, 20:14
Close the airspace as well.

Syed1
7th August 2019, 20:15
Heard the airspace is being closed as well.

Kashmirilion
7th August 2019, 20:33
https://twitter.com/AzharLaghariPTI/status/1159094499345350656


Can someone embed this tweet please.

Reports are unverified at the moment

Varun
7th August 2019, 20:33
Heard the airspace is being closed as well.

Negative. Not happening as of now.

Kashmirilion
7th August 2019, 20:41
https://mobile.twitter.com/pid_gov/status/1159095239249973248

It's official

JaDed
7th August 2019, 20:43
Among those nothing hurts India except closing off airspace which has no confirmation as of yet.

slipcatch
7th August 2019, 20:43
Among those nothing hurts India except closing off airspace which has no confirmation as of yet.

Pakistan did all that to hurt India?

mmkextreme_1
7th August 2019, 20:45
https://mobile.twitter.com/pid_gov/status/1159095239249973248

It's official

Don't think they are calling back the ambassador. It's not in the official tweet either.

It says they are downgrading diplomatic relations.

Varun
7th August 2019, 20:51
Among those nothing hurts India except closing off airspace which has no confirmation as of yet.

The problem with closing airspace is that Pakistan will have to do it to all carriers irrespective, and this costs them PKR 3.2 billion monthly based on this year's experience.

Plus no connections at all to the far east - BKK, SIN, KUL etc.

If they were on stronger economic footing with no ties with SE Asia, they could have considered it long term.

Pakpak
7th August 2019, 20:56
The problem with closing airspace is that Pakistan will have to do it to all carriers irrespective, and this costs them PKR 3.2 billion monthly based on this year's experience.

Plus no connections at all to the far east - BKK, SIN, KUL etc.

If they were on stronger economic footing with no ties with SE Asia, they could have considered it long term.

I don't think PIA has many, if any, flights going to East Asia so only banning Indian Airlines would only hurt India.

Varun
7th August 2019, 21:00
I don't think PIA has many, if any, flights going to East Asia so only banning Indian Airlines would only hurt India.

Between Feb and July, Thai, Singapore Airlines, Malindo, Malaysia Airlines etc. also couldn't fly into Pakistan.

I doubt all of them have resumed flights even now.

Pakpak
7th August 2019, 21:10
Between Feb and July, Thai, Singapore Airlines, Malindo, Malaysia Airlines etc. also couldn't fly into Pakistan.

I doubt all of them have resumed flights even now.

True, but I don't think their volume of flights into Pakistan is significant anyway. 90% of our flights come from the Arab states, China and now some Western states.

Mamoon
7th August 2019, 21:31
The problem with closing airspace is that Pakistan will have to do it to all carriers irrespective, and this costs them PKR 3.2 billion monthly based on this year's experience.

Plus no connections at all to the far east - BKK, SIN, KUL etc.

If they were on stronger economic footing with no ties with SE Asia, they could have considered it long term.

We have too much spare cash. That is why our PM goes from country to country and institution to institution begging for money.

3.2 billion is a very small price to pay for our machoism. This is going to send shivers down Modi’s spine and we can expect a reversal of Article 370 anytime soon.

msaaim89
7th August 2019, 21:36
Between Feb and July, Thai, Singapore Airlines, Malindo, Malaysia Airlines etc. also couldn't fly into Pakistan.

I doubt all of them have resumed flights even now.

Right now, overlfying airlines include:
Biman
Sadia
GoAir (Indian)
China South
Air Blue
PIA
Lufthansa
Qatar
Air Arabia
Gulf Air
Singapore
Silk Way West
Serene Air
Cathay Pacific
DHL
Emirates
Air India (Indian)

msaaim89
7th August 2019, 21:37
We have too much spare cash. That is why our PM goes from country to country and institution to institution begging for money.

3.2 billion is a very small price to pay for our machoism. This is going to send shivers down Modi’s spine and we can expect a reversal of Article 370 anytime soon.

Pakistan is in a very difficult situation after PMLN and PPP looted the nation for decades.

Varun
7th August 2019, 21:39
Right now, overlfying airlines include:
Biman
Sadia
GoAir (Indian)
China South
Air Blue
PIA
Lufthansa
Qatar
Air Arabia
Gulf Air
Singapore
Silk Way West
Serene Air
Cathay Pacific
DHL
Emirates
Air India (Indian)

Add:

IndiGo
SpiceJet
Turkish
British Airways
United (set to resume DEL and BOM-EWR in Sep)
Delta (set to commence BOM-JFK in Dec)
Malaysian
Thai

And a host of cargo operators.

AdamM97
7th August 2019, 21:42
Pakistan is in a very difficult situation after PMLN and PPP looted the nation for decades.

But... but.... what about Pakistan Army??

msaaim89
7th August 2019, 21:44
Add:

IndiGo
SpiceJet
Turkish
British Airways
United (set to resume DEL and BOM-EWR in Sep)
Delta (set to commence BOM-JFK in Dec)
Malaysian
Thai

And a host of cargo operators.

My bad, wasn't clear. I meant airlines that actually had aircraft in Pakistan airspace at the time of the post.

Gabbar Singh
7th August 2019, 21:48
At least Pakistan has done something rather then just talk about doing something.

But why not go further? If India is such a “brutal and racist” entity why have diplomatic relations at all?

Sachin136
7th August 2019, 21:49
Looks like Amit Shah and Modi don't have any choice but to reverse their decision after this move by Pakistan. Good work by Imran, put his money where his mouth is.

Cpt. Rishwat
7th August 2019, 21:50
Among those nothing hurts India except closing off airspace which has no confirmation as of yet.

Do any of those actions hurt Pakistan? Bilateral relations are already more or less non-existent so Pakistan probably has little to lose.

anand99
7th August 2019, 21:52
All said and done, on Imran's watch indians have pulled off probably a historic change of status quo in Kashmir issue. That is his legacy now

Pakpak
7th August 2019, 21:52
At least Pakistan has done something rather then just talk about doing something.

But why not go further? If India is such a “brutal and racist” entity why have diplomatic relations at all?

Because at some point we'd have to resume relations so it'd look less of a defeat. India won't overturn this decision so at some point this issue will have to be accepted as it is. Be it 10 years or 100 years from now.

Cpt. Rishwat
7th August 2019, 21:55
All said and done, on Imran's watch indians have pulled off probably a historic change of status quo in Kashmir issue. That is his legacy now

Imran has already gone on record as saying all Pakistan's efforts towards peaceful relations were ignored or rebuffed by Indian circles, it is entirely BJP legacy in India. I don't know why you are being ashamed of it, why not own it like your Hindutva govt will?

JaDed
7th August 2019, 21:57
Do any of those actions hurt Pakistan? Bilateral relations are already more or less non-existent so Pakistan probably has little to lose.

Why would actions that Pakistan take hurt Pakistan?
Also, If whole point if to show resentment against the decision, the point could be forwarded through Twitter as well.

My assumption is this is to show people of Pakistan that GOP is breaking off relationship with India and to world media that there is issue in South Asia.

anand99
7th August 2019, 22:03
Imran has already gone on record as saying all Pakistan's efforts towards peaceful relations were ignored or rebuffed by Indian circles, it is entirely BJP legacy in India. I don't know why you are being ashamed of it, why not own it like your Hindutva govt will?

I don't think you got what I said.

Cpt. Rishwat
7th August 2019, 22:07
I don't think you got what I said.

I think I did.

Cpt. Rishwat
7th August 2019, 22:08
Why would actions that Pakistan take hurt Pakistan?
Also, If whole point if to show resentment against the decision, the point could be forwarded through Twitter as well.

My assumption is this is to show people of Pakistan that GOP is breaking off relationship with India and to world media that there is issue in South Asia.

Point being bilateral trade is meaningless anyway when one party isn't interested.

JaDed
7th August 2019, 22:11
Point being bilateral trade is meaningless anyway when one party isn't interested.

Well India did send Jindal businessman but then Pak ousted PML :P

Pete Rose
7th August 2019, 22:22
All said and done, on Imran's watch indians have pulled off probably a historic change of status quo in Kashmir issue. That is his legacy now

On his watch India is shunned out of Afghanistan and our eastern border is headed to more predictable security. Legacy is a strong word to use 48 hours later.

szundercover
7th August 2019, 22:26
Close the airspace as well.These steps should have taken the day they had scrapped the article but thankfully sense prevailed.

WebGuru
8th August 2019, 03:12
They turned down our talks offer a dozen time in last 12-13 months and Rajdeep thinks there is still any chance of talks after this move by India.
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">The Pakistan move to expel Indian high com, the very able diplomat Ajay Bisaria, is short sighted and foolish. How does Pakistan intend to seek dialogue with India when you won’t even allow a proper diplomatic presence in your country? Hopefully, better sense will prevail.</p>&mdash; Rajdeep Sardesai (@sardesairajdeep) <a href="https://twitter.com/sardesairajdeep/status/1159145712837435392?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">August 7, 2019</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

WebGuru
8th August 2019, 03:12
Close the airspace as well.These steps should have taken the day they had scrapped the article but thankfully sense prevailed.

Saw ANI reporting that Pakistan partially closed airspace.

Nostalgic
8th August 2019, 03:23
This downgraded status means the High Commissioner leaves, but the diplomatic mission remains, with the Chargé d'affaires at the helm. Should’ve just gone the whole hog and cut off diplomatic relations.

Varun
8th August 2019, 04:04
Saw ANI reporting that Pakistan partially closed airspace.

Not for a single minute today.

Pakistan knew this was going to happen since June, at a time when the airspace was shut. If anything, they then proceeded to open all airways to Indian traffic in the weeks to come.

They need the money.

WebGuru
8th August 2019, 04:08
Not for a single minute today.

Pakistan knew this was going to happen since June, at a time when the airspace was shut. If anything, they then proceeded to open all airways to Indian traffic in the weeks to come.

They need the money.

Saw this a few hours ago
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">After downgrading diplomatic ties with India, Pak partially closes airspace<br><br>Read <a href="https://twitter.com/ANI?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@ANI</a> Story | <a href="https://t.co/1uW4r8TlkP">https://t.co/1uW4r8TlkP</a> <a href="https://t.co/WlKNg6lR2s">pic.twitter.com/WlKNg6lR2s</a></p>&mdash; ANI Digital (@ani_digital) <a href="https://twitter.com/ani_digital/status/1159181293495705601?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">August 7, 2019</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Flights from Afghanistan have been instructed to take alternative routes by Pakistan Civil Aviation Authority (PCAA). <a href="https://t.co/Hhz4yoygF0">https://t.co/Hhz4yoygF0</a></p>&mdash; ANI (@ANI) <a href="https://twitter.com/ANI/status/1159169308112691200?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">August 7, 2019</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

Varun
8th August 2019, 04:09
Saw this a few hours ago

Just an altitude and heading instruction. Not a NOTAM, and certainly not the shutting down of airspace.

rhony
8th August 2019, 04:10
On his watch India is shunned out of Afghanistan and our eastern border is headed to more predictable security. Legacy is a strong word to use 48 hours later.

Shunned for now. It's a political game between Americans and Indians to facilitate a quick departure from Afg for the Americans. They need Pak's assistance. India has ties and interests in Afg. They will return at a later date. Right now Kashmir is more important than Afg.

Varun
8th August 2019, 04:12
Take AI's departure bank out of DEL for example. Everything is piercing through Pakistan as we type.

https://i.imgur.com/3knJWWY.png

Mian
8th August 2019, 04:15
Shunned for now. It's a political game between Americans and Indians to facilitate a quick departure from Afg for the Americans. They need Pak's assistance. India has ties and interests in Afg. They will return at a later date. Right now Kashmir is more important than Afg.

Taliban are going to rule Afghanistan after American exit so let's see how those contacts of India work for them. Afghan Taliban will also help us to clear those Indian proxies called TTP sitting in Afghanistan right now they will be sandwiched between Pakistani forces and Taliban Govt. We will also be able to focus more on eastern border Pakistan is also the gainer from this deal now just America.

mgtow
8th August 2019, 04:16
Good call by Imran Khan. It is must. Response to Kashmir in the light events of officially isolation and illegally invasion in IOK is necessary and must be persistent.

No way Nawaz Sharif would have done that and that is coming from former pro-PMLN. Imran Khan is necessary step as the face of Pakistan and its army following pro-Pakistan foreign policy.

WebGuru
8th August 2019, 04:17
Just an altitude and heading instruction. Not a NOTAM, and certainly not the shutting down of airspace.


Take AI's departure bank out of DEL for example. Everything is piercing through Pakistan as we type.

https://i.imgur.com/3knJWWY.png

oh ok we will have a clear picture in next few days i guess

rhony
8th August 2019, 04:20
Taliban are going to rule Afghanistan after American exit so let's see how those contacts of India work for them. Afghan Taliban will also help us to clear those Indian proxies called TTP sitting in Afghanistan right now they will be sandwiched between Pakistani forces and Taliban Govt. We will also be able to focus more on eastern border Pakistan is also the gainer from this deal now just America.

Everybody will need money to develop and govern. India will be a player. Pakistan will gain from the aid they might receive once USA leaves successfully.

Mian
8th August 2019, 04:26
Everybody will need money to develop and govern. India will be a player. Pakistan will gain from the aid they might receive once USA leaves successfully.

Arab money will start coming into Afghanistan again just like 80s and 90s because Taliban are pro Arab and are always willing to provide men power for their wars. Taliban never had any good relations with India specially not after hijacking an indian plane or after seeing India investing for decades in anti Taliban Govts of Afghanistan. Pakistan is not that that much interested in aid money our biggest asset in long term is going to be Taliban Govt in Afghanistan there is a reason we only agreed to get the on table once USA made sure India is not going to sit on that table.

Vegitto1
8th August 2019, 04:30
Lol - this is the official position. Wait till our army activates it sleeper cells - I shudder to think what will happen in India when Mujahideens are given licence to do as they please

rhony
8th August 2019, 04:32
Arab money will start coming into Afghanistan again just like 80s and 90s because Taliban are pro Arab and are always willing to provide men power for their wars. Taliban never had any good relations with India specially not after hijacking an indian plane or after seeing India investing for decades in anti Taliban Govts of Afghanistan. Pakistan is not that that much interested in aid money our biggest asset in long term is going to be Taliban Govt in Afghanistan there is a reason we only agreed to get the on table once USA made sure India is not going to sit on that table.

USA also made sure there's no ruccus after India took the Kashmir decision. Taliban at the border might look all hunky dory for now but the major source of income for those illeterates is heroine smuggling. Taliban as a neighbor will ensure the presence of similar people around FATA for decades. Pakistan doesn't want that headache. But there is no other way at this point. As far as relations between Taliban and India go, national interests will always take precedence. There are no permanant friends or enemies. The "butcher" of Gujarat as many of you call Modi got the highest civilian award from the Wahabbis in the land of Mecca. As I said, once dust settles down, there will be new sets of allies and national interests.

rhony
8th August 2019, 04:33
Lol - this is the official position. Wait till our army activates it sleeper cells - I shudder to think what will happen in India when Mujahideens are given licence to do as they please

Even if Pakistan doesn't activate the sleeping tigers, India will make up a few to keep the narrative of Pakistan interfering in it's 'internal' matters. That story will keep going on

Azzurri
8th August 2019, 04:35
Even if Pakistan doesn't activate the sleeping tigers, India will make up a few to keep the narrative of Pakistan interfering in it's 'internal' matters. That story will keep going on

Keep dreaming. You have Internationlized Kashmir insurgency. You won’t be able to blame Pakistan any longer. It’s your internal issue Afterall

Mian
8th August 2019, 04:36
USA also made sure there's no ruccus after India took the Kashmir decision. Taliban at the border might look all hunky dory for now but the major source of income for those illeterates is heroine smuggling. Taliban as a neighbor will ensure the presence of similar people around FATA for decades. Pakistan doesn't want that headache. But there is no other way at this point. As far as relations between Taliban and India go, national interests will always take precedence. There are no permanant friends or enemies. The "butcher" of Gujarat as many of you call Modi got the highest civilian award from the Wahabbis in the land of Mecca. As I said, once dust settles down, there will be new sets of allies and national interests.

Even the most anti Pakistan govts of Afghanistan had to bend knees time and time again because of the Afghan geography it's a landlocked country and their quickest access to trade and shipment is through Pakistan well as you said lets see when the dust settles interesting times ahead.

Vegitto1
8th August 2019, 04:37
Even if Pakistan doesn't activate the sleeping tigers, India will make up a few to keep the narrative of Pakistan interfering in it's 'internal' matters. That story will keep going on

Suits us fine :)

We will keep saying that India has no right over IOK as we cannot have them complete control over the water - the source being in IOK. That is the reality of it.

It will only truly escalate if your cow loving hinduwhatever government restricts our water supply. Then we will make sure India exists only in history books.

Mian
8th August 2019, 04:39
Even if Pakistan doesn't activate the sleeping tigers, India will make up a few to keep the narrative of Pakistan interfering in it's 'internal' matters. That story will keep going on

Not going to work if Pakistan enter the desperation mode the world will be more interested into stopping two mad nations from using nukes instead of thinking about buying or selling narratives because they don't work when nations enter in war. If the peace period is over those narratives become useless

bala977
8th August 2019, 04:49
Lol - this is the official position. Wait till our army activates it sleeper cells - I shudder to think what will happen in India when Mujahideens are given licence to do as they please

TBH, this is glorifying terrorism. Can't believe I am hearing this in the forum! Admins - note.

rhony
8th August 2019, 04:49
Keep dreaming. You have Internationlized Kashmir insurgency. You won’t be able to blame Pakistan any longer. It’s your internal issue Afterall
India by integrating Kashmir has made it an internal issue. They will blame Pakistan for every terrorist caught or killed. The noise will be because it's an internal issue. Any failure to pacify Kashmiris will be equated with external interference.

rhony
8th August 2019, 04:52
Not going to work if Pakistan enter the desperation mode the world will be more interested into stopping two mad nations from using nukes instead of thinking about buying or selling narratives because they don't work when nations enter in war. If the peace period is over those narratives become useless

The world doesn't care because there are bigger problems. US, China are dealing with trade wars, UK is dealing with Brexit. Any adventure by Pakistan will lead to sanctions that Pakistan can't sustain. War isn't sustainable. The only time when there is a threat of a nuclear war is if India attacks Pakistan in a full scale war. That ain't happening.

Azzurri
8th August 2019, 04:53
India by integrating Kashmir has made it an internal issue. They will blame Pakistan for every terrorist caught or killed. The noise will be because it's an internal issue. Any failure to pacify Kashmiris will be equated with external interference.

Exactly and the militants will be Kashmiris so as per your claims Indian citizens attacking their own army enraged by forcing new laws on them without their consent. I don’t see Pakistan anywhere in this discussion. Your crying won’t make much difference because everyone knows what exactly is going on. Just wait and wait

Azzurri
8th August 2019, 04:55
The world doesn't care because there are bigger problems. US, China are dealing with trade wars, UK is dealing with Brexit. Any adventure by Pakistan will lead to sanctions that Pakistan can't sustain. War isn't sustainable. The only time when there is a threat of a nuclear war is if India attacks Pakistan in a full scale war. That ain't happening.


It does matter when nuclear war is involved. A nuclear war will Effect the whole region. Take a break from your blind nationalistic bakhatism and go and check what kind of damage a nuclear weapon causes.

rhony
8th August 2019, 04:55
Suits us fine :)

We will keep saying that India has no right over IOK as we cannot have them complete control over the water - the source being in IOK. That is the reality of it.

It will only truly escalate if your cow loving hinduwhatever government restricts our water supply. Then we will make sure India exists only in history books.

Keep saying to yourselves? No one's listening. But yes, India waging water wars will be inhumane and stupidity. If the goal is to be an international power, India should refrain from petty things like these unless there is already a full scale war. They will build dams on their share of waters though.

Azzurri
8th August 2019, 04:56
TBH, this is glorifying terrorism. Can't believe I am hearing this in the forum! Admins - note.

Oh my little crybaby. Your terrorist state and army is already enough to take note for all of us

Pakistanian
8th August 2019, 04:57
India has lost A LOT MORE money than Pakistan from a closed airspace yet Indians here are trying to spin this as a loss for Pakistan but it's really because it's worse for them than Pakistan.

https://www.indiatoday.in/india/story/air-india-pakistan-airspace-closure-civil-aviation-minister-hardeep-puri-1566688-2019-07-11

India lost over $50 million because of the airspace closure

Azzurri
8th August 2019, 04:57
Keep saying to yourselves? No one's listening. But yes, India waging water wars will be inhumane and stupidity. If the goal is to be an international power, India should refrain from petty things like these unless there is already a full scale war. They will build dams on their share of waters though.

Your so called supa pawa �� Like i said just wait and watch your government have started their downfall by themselves.

rhony
8th August 2019, 04:58
It does matter when nuclear war is involved. A nuclear war will Effect the whole region. Take a break from your blind nationalistic bakhatism and go and check what kind of damage a nuclear weapon causes.

Precisely why there won't be a nuclear war. The same reason why there is no need for anybody to worry about Pakistan getting desperate.

Azzurri
8th August 2019, 04:59
India has lost A LOT MORE money than Pakistan from a closed airspace yet Indians here are trying to spin this as a loss for Pakistan but it's really because it's worse for them than Pakistan.

https://www.indiatoday.in/india/story/air-india-pakistan-airspace-closure-civil-aviation-minister-hardeep-puri-1566688-2019-07-11

India lost over $50 million because of the airspace closure


These guys are all propaganda. And they are freaking so many. One after the other someone comes out of their hole and start spreading their propaganda everywhere

Azzurri
8th August 2019, 05:00
Precisely why there won't be a nuclear war. The same reason why there is no need for anybody to worry about Pakistan getting desperate.


That’s what you think. Or perhaps that’s what your government hopes. Desperate times desperate measures. When things start to get out of hands no one can control.

rhony
8th August 2019, 05:01
Your so called supa pawa �� Like i said just wait and watch your government have started their downfall by themselves.

Where am I going? I'm waiting right here to see things unfold. If you are a well wisher of Kashmiris, let's all hope that they come to their senses and start taking advantage of new status. Get prosperous and develop as a whole. Dont hope for people to die there. That would be hyspocrisy.

rhony
8th August 2019, 05:02
That’s what you think. Or perhaps that’s what your government hopes. Desperate times desperate measures. When things start to get out of hands no one can control.

You keep swinging like a belly dancer. U ask me to check the consequences of a nuclear war and say it's serious. U also say I should hope it doesn't happen. Relax. US and Soviets avoided nuclear war. This is nothing.

Azzurri
8th August 2019, 05:06
Where am I going? I'm waiting right here to see things unfold. If you are a well wisher of Kashmiris, let's all hope that they come to their senses and start taking advantage of new status. Get prosperous and develop as a whole. Dont hope for people to die there. That would be hyspocrisy.

It better let’s hope you and your fanatic hinduvtas start using some common sense before posting same rubbish over and over again. You guys consider Imposing your decisions on someone a norm.

Azzurri
8th August 2019, 05:06
You keep swinging like a belly dancer. U ask me to check the consequences of a nuclear war and say it's serious. U also say I should hope it doesn't happen. Relax. US and Soviets avoided nuclear war. This is nothing.


Learn to read!!

rhony
8th August 2019, 05:10
It better let’s hope you and your fanatic hinduvtas start using some common sense before posting same rubbish over and over again. You guys consider Imposing your decisions on someone a norm.

A bit rich from a nuclear war monger calling others fanatics. Kashmir ain't Palestine. There are no prospects for Palestinians. So stop day dreaming. People there will make a right choice in due time. Once a few pelters are booked for sedition charges, yes, now India can do that as part of the new law, people will realize it's not worth it. India just embraced Kashmir in its entirety and is offering prospects. Sane minds will prevail. Radical minds will perish.

Pete Rose
8th August 2019, 05:17
Shunned for now. It's a political game between Americans and Indians to facilitate a quick departure from Afg for the Americans. They need Pak's assistance. India has ties and interests in Afg. They will return at a later date. Right now Kashmir is more important than Afg.

Right. Like I said to the poster, legacy is a strong word while history is still being written

Vegitto1
8th August 2019, 09:08
TBH, this is glorifying terrorism. Can't believe I am hearing this in the forum! Admins - note.

Not really - Mujahideens are freedom fighters fighting for a cause.

Terrorism is what your army does in Kashmir, please learn to differentiate.

MenInG
8th August 2019, 15:01
A day after Pakistan decided to downgrade diplomatic ties with India, the latter's Ministry of External Affairs through a statement asked Islamabad to review its decision so that "normal channels for diplomatic communications are preserved".

On Wednesday, the National Security Committee (NSC) decided to downgrade diplomatic ties with India and suspend bilateral trade, among other steps, in response to New Delhi’s move to annex occupied Kashmir.

The country's top national security body, which met for the second time in three days, also directed the armed forces to remain vigilant. The committee had last met on Sunday, a day before India announced revocation of Article 370, which gave occupied Kashmir an autonomous status, and legislated to bifurcate the Valley into Ladakh and Jammu and Kashmir.

"The intention behind these measures is obviously to present an alarming picture to the world of our bilateral ties. The reasons cited by Pakistan are not supported by facts on the ground," India alleged in the statement issued on Thursday, adding it regrets the decision taken by Pakistan to downgrade ties.

"The recent developments pertaining to Article 370 are entirely the internal affair of India. The constitution of India was, is and will always be a sovereign matter," added the statement.

Pakistan, however, has maintained that the steps taken by India are in violation of international law as well as United Nation resolutions.

Prime Minister Imran Khan, in his address during the joint session of parliament, said India had violated its own constitution, own Supreme Court, the UN and Geneva conventions by revoking the special status of Kashmir.

The Pakistan Army had also rejected Indian actions regarding Kashmir, saying: "Pakistan never recognised the sham Indian efforts to legalise its occupation of Jammu & Kashmir through article 370 or 35-A decades ago."

Voices within India, including opposition and the media, have lambasted the Bharatiya Janata Party (BJP) for the "unconstitutional" move.

'Unacceptable to people of Kashmir'
Foreign Office spokesperson Dr Mohammad Faisal, during his weekly briefing on Thursday, said that the government of India has been told to withdraw its high commissioner. "India has also been informed that Pakistan will not be sending its high commissioner designate to India," he said.

"Pakistan has strongly condemned and rejected the announcements made by the Indian government regarding the Indian occupied Jammu and Kashmir, which is an internationally recognised disputed territory.

"No unilateral step by the Indian government can change this internationally accepted disputed area as enshrined in the United Nations Security Council resolution nor will this ever be acceptable to the people of Jammu and Kashmir and of Pakistan," added Dr Faisal.

Fear of genocide, ethnic cleansing
A day earlier, as the NSC announced its decision to downgrade ties with India, lawmakers in a joint session of parliament denounced the action on Kashmir by Indian Prime Minister Narendra Modi.

Foreign Minister Shah Mahmood Qureshi said he feared “genocide and ethnic cleansing” by India in Kashmir.

“God willing, one day Kashmir will become Pakistan,” he said.

The lawmakers later unanimously approved a resolution condemning the action, saying that as a disputed territory, no change in its status could be made by New Delhi under UN resolutions on Kashmir. It also asked India to reverse the changes, lift an indefinite curfew and release all detainees in occupied Kashmir.

Indian authorities have clamped a complete shutdown on occupied Kashmir as the Hindu-led nationalist government in New Delhi scrapped the region’s statehood and special status, including the right to its own constitution — a move slammed by Pakistan.

The changes include lifting a ban on property purchases by nonresidents of Kashmir, opening the way for Indians outside the territory to invest and settle there. The Muslim population worries that such measures would change Kashmir’s demography, culture and way of life.

The Indian government has shut off most communications, including internet, cellphone and landline networks, with occupied Kashmir. Thousands of additional troops were sent to the already heavily militarised region out of fear the government’s steps could spark unrest. Insurgent groups have been fighting for Kashmir’s independence from India or its merger with Pakistan since 1989.

https://www.dawn.com/news/1498781/india-asks-pakistan-to-reconsider-downgrading-of-diplomatic-ties-says-article-370-an-internal-matter

msaaim89
8th August 2019, 15:06
*SNIP*

https://www.dawn.com/news/1498781/india-asks-pakistan-to-reconsider-downgrading-of-diplomatic-ties-says-article-370-an-internal-matter

Pakistan should refuse. In fact, Pakistan should end all relations completely.

cricketjoshila
8th August 2019, 16:21
Modi has done this brilliantly.

He is making pakistan take all the steps that he wanted to.

High commisioners recalled.

Trade suspended.

Border closed.

Samjhauta express suspended.

While Modi did all what he wanted to do inside a Indian administered territory.

Gabbar Singh
8th August 2019, 16:30
Modi has done this brilliantly.

He is making pakistan take all the steps that he wanted to.

High commisioners recalled.

Trade suspended.

Border closed.

Samjhauta express suspended.

While Modi did all what he wanted to do inside a Indian administered territory.

IWT will be next on the long term agenda of Modi/Shah/Doval.

cricketjoshila
8th August 2019, 17:17
IWT will be next on the long term agenda of Modi/Shah/Doval.

It may be. May not be. IWT should only be suspended as the last measure.

Ram Shekhar
8th August 2019, 17:35
Modi has done this brilliantly.

He is making pakistan take all the steps that he wanted to.

High commisioners recalled.

Trade suspended.

Border closed.

Samjhauta express suspended.

While Modi did all what he wanted to do inside a Indian administered territory.

Really? Is that why India is now begging Pakistan to reconsider their position?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3VVdF0OJF_U

the Great Khan
8th August 2019, 17:37
Not really - Mujahideens are freedom fighters fighting for a cause.

Terrorism is what your army does in Kashmir, please learn to differentiate.

they cant its too hard for them..

cricketjoshila
8th August 2019, 19:48
Not really - Mujahideens are freedom fighters fighting for a cause.

Terrorism is what your army does in Kashmir, please learn to differentiate.

These freedom fighters of yours are globally banned terrorists.

Usman Chadda
8th August 2019, 20:16
IWT will be next on the long term agenda of Modi/Shah/Doval.
You are kidding, right? That will effectively be the flashpoint for a nuclear war.

cricketjoshila
8th August 2019, 20:18
Is that what they say in the brainwashing RSS camps?

Poor you. Is that what they teach you in your country?

cricketjoshila
8th August 2019, 20:19
You are kidding, right? That will effectively be the flashpoint for a nuclear war.

No it wont be. It will end pakistani interference in Kashmir.

Pakistan will either accept status quo or the world will make it accept it.

Hitman
8th August 2019, 20:19
Not really - Mujahideens are freedom fighters fighting for a cause.

Terrorism is what your army does in Kashmir, please learn to differentiate.

So UN and globally banned terror groups are actually mujahideens fighting for a cause?

PakPremi
8th August 2019, 20:21
Lol. Thats how you do diplomacy. Show people that even though pakistan wants to stop relations, India is willing to keep it normal.

Tumhari samajh se bahar hai ye.

Lol at begging.

So you admitting that India is not really interested in peace with Pakistan, and actually wants to continue with violence in Kashmir without any diplomatic hurdles ?

Ram Shekhar
8th August 2019, 20:23
Poor you. Is that what they teach you in your country?

I know it because it happens in my country.

cricketjoshila
8th August 2019, 20:25
I know it because it happens in my country.

So you are brainwashed in your country. Good.

cricketjoshila
8th August 2019, 20:27
So you admitting that India is not really interested in peace with Pakistan, and actually wants to continue with violence in Kashmir without any diplomatic hurdles ?

Peace? If Pakistan wanted peace they wouldnot be supporting a violent terrorist movement in India.

Ram Shekhar
8th August 2019, 20:27
So you are brainwashed in your country. Good.

Doesn't make sense but please don't derail the thread. It doesn't change the fact that India is crawling back to Pakistan after the latter suspended bilateral trade. The closure of airspace in addition to the above will impact India for sure.

cricketjoshila
8th August 2019, 20:34
Doesn't make sense but please don't derail the thread. It doesn't change the fact that India is crawling back to Pakistan after the latter suspended bilateral trade. The closure of airspace in addition to the above will impact India for sure.

Lolfer. The total Indo pak trade is $2bn. Its a very miniscule percentage of India's total trade that is close to $750bn.

Economically pakistan cant do much to India, no matter how much you try to portray it.

Hitman
8th August 2019, 20:34
Peace? If Pakistan wanted peace they wouldnot be supporting a violent terrorist movement in India.

Or start Kargil.

Ram Shekhar
8th August 2019, 20:37
Lolfer. The total Indo pak trade is $2bn. Its a very miniscule percentage of India's total trade that is close to $750bn.

Economically pakistan cant do much to India, no matter how much you try to portray it.

You're too cocky for your own good. It's not as if India is some kind of a first world country. Per capita GDP of India is still comparable to the so called poor Pakistan. Not to mention Pakistanis are much happier than us as suggested by a recent survey.

cricketjoshila
8th August 2019, 20:52
You're too cocky for your own good. It's not as if India is some kind of a first world country. Per capita GDP of India is still comparable to the so called poor Pakistan. Not to mention Pakistanis are much happier than us as suggested by a recent survey.

How is per capita gdp comparable?

In PPP terms

Indias per capita gdp is $7874
Pakistans is $5680

A difference of more than 2000 usd.

Do you know that 1INR is equal to 2PKR.

Cpt. Rishwat
8th August 2019, 21:07
These freedom fighters of yours are globally banned terrorists.

Depends on what mood Donald Trump is in. If he thinks India is a threat to USA commerce he might well decide those terrorists are freedom fighters again, like they were in the righteous fight against the Soviet Union.

The good news for you is that under Modi, Indian economy will probably tank so Trump won't really see them as a threat to American world influence.

cricketjoshila
8th August 2019, 21:10
Depends on what mood Donald Trump is in. If he thinks India is a threat to USA commerce he might well decide those terrorists are freedom fighters again, like they were in the righteous fight against the Soviet Union.

The good news for you is that under Modi, Indian economy will probably tank so Trump won't really see them as a threat to American world influence.

Thing is these are UN designated terrorists.

Cpt. Rishwat
8th August 2019, 21:14
Thing is these are UN designated terrorists.

US President sneezes and the UN reaches for a tissue. Go watch Rambo III.

mmkextreme_1
8th August 2019, 21:18
These freedom fighters of yours are globally banned terrorists.

So now all of a sudden you (BJP government) care about what the world thinks?

You guys don't seem to care when it comes to Kashmir.

Stop picking and choosing.

MRSN
8th August 2019, 22:05
All said and done, on Imran's watch indians have pulled off probably a historic change of status quo in Kashmir issue. That is his legacy now

only time will tell. Hitler was considered legend after his actions against jews but look at history. Rome didn't fall in one day.

Usman Chadda
8th August 2019, 22:07
No it wont be. It will end pakistani interference in Kashmir.

Pakistan will either accept status quo or the world will make it accept it.
Any change in status quo of the IWT will lead to severe repurcussions for Pakistan. I hope you know why.

Silly to even discuss it, as India will be tempting fate if they even consider it.

cricketjoshila
8th August 2019, 22:18
US President sneezes and the UN reaches for a tissue. Go watch Rambo III.

And all those years when pakistan was a US ally and India was considered to be close to Ussr what happened?

cricketjoshila
8th August 2019, 22:21
Any change in status quo of the IWT will lead to severe repurcussions for Pakistan. I hope you know why.

Silly to even discuss it, as India will be tempting fate if they even consider it.

So if Pakistan will want to avoid those repurrcussions and maintain status quo, it will also not try to change the status quo in any Indian territory.

Or you think India will sit and watch while Pakistan will do whatever it wants?

Vegitto1
8th August 2019, 22:44
So UN and globally banned terror groups are actually mujahideens fighting for a cause?

The same UN and global countries whose resolution on kashmir India ignores? Stop picking and choosing.

UN is nothing but a tool for the West to exert control over the rest of the world, especially the Muslim countries. Majority of the West is either athiest or anti-Islam. That makes it friends with India (common enemy being Islam).

It goes without saying that India's actual masters would declare the Mujahideens terrorists.

jadaja
8th August 2019, 22:56
The same UN and global countries whose resolution on kashmir India ignores? Stop picking and choosing.

UN is nothing but a tool for the West to exert control over the rest of the world, especially the Muslim countries. Majority of the West is either athiest or anti-Islam. That makes it friends with India (common enemy being Islam).

It goes without saying that India's actual masters would declare the Mujahideens terrorists.

Why do you think they are against Islam.

xbronze
8th August 2019, 23:17
IWT will be next on the long term agenda of Modi/Shah/Doval.


It may be. May not be. IWT should only be suspended as the last measure.

After the Pulwama attack was traced back to Pakistan based 'non state actors' by the Indian agencies, MSD (Modi Shah Doval) narrowed their retaliatory options down to three:

1. Air Force raid into Pakistan territory to hit training academy of 'non state actors'
2. Revoke article 379 - Integrate J&K into India
3. Abrogate Indus Water Treaty

Modi gave a green signal to options 1&2 above. Close communication with the Trump administration (especially between the two NSAs, Doval and John Bolton) was established and maintained. Bolton has been a huge pillar of support for the Modi Government and obtained a blank cheque from Trump for all retaliatory efforts by India to neutralize/penalize attacks by Pakistan based 'non state actors'.

The abrogation of the Indus Water Treaty was de-prioritized by Modi only because of logistical reasons. Massive infrastructure projects needed to be completed first on the Indian side before waters flowing into Pakistan could be re-routed.

Further it was decided that while options 1&2 would best be served hot (with a 'big bang' event followed by 'breaking news'), the abrogation of Indus Water Treaty would be best served cold (not as one big bang event, but as a long drawn gradual 'drying up of river waters' attributable to natural causes/global warming etc., un-accompanied by any TV 'Breaking news').

When IWT is discarded, all ongoing Indo-Pak bilateral water monitoring arrangements would likely be delayed/cancelled/disallowed by India under the cloak of 'not logistically feasible to arrange under the prevalent hostile Indo-Pak geo-political situation'.

[Ironically, Pakistan's unilateral decision yesterday to end diplomatic relations with India including recalling High Commissioners, offers precisely the setting India needs to quietly discard IWT and disallow Indo-Pak IWT monitors].

Cpt. Rishwat
8th August 2019, 23:19
And all those years when pakistan was a US ally and India was considered to be close to Ussr what happened?

Pakistan remained a US ally and india remained close to USSR.

Usman Chadda
9th August 2019, 00:36
So if Pakistan will want to avoid those repurrcussions and maintain status quo, it will also not try to change the status quo in any Indian territory.

Or you think India will sit and watch while Pakistan will do whatever it wants?
The post I replied to stated India doing something about IWT.

Where did I say anything about Pakistan interfering with Indian territory?

cricketjoshila
9th August 2019, 02:28
The post I replied to stated India doing something about IWT.

Where did I say anything about Pakistan interfering with Indian territory?

India will only do something if Pakistan does something in the Indian territory.

Usman Chadda
9th August 2019, 04:32
India will only do something if Pakistan does something in the Indian territory.
This is not what the original post from Gabbar Singh implied.

Kabhi toh chup kar jaaya kar :inti

Extra_Cover
9th August 2019, 05:10
After the Pulwama attack was traced back to Pakistan based 'non state actors' by the Indian agencies, MSD (Modi Shah Doval) narrowed their retaliatory options down to three:

1. Air Force raid into Pakistan territory to hit training academy of 'non state actors'
2. Revoke article 379 - Integrate J&K into India
3. Abrogate Indus Water Treaty

Modi gave a green signal to options 1&2 above. Close communication with the Trump administration (especially between the two NSAs, Doval and John Bolton) was established and maintained. Bolton has been a huge pillar of support for the Modi Government and obtained a blank cheque from Trump for all retaliatory efforts by India to neutralize/penalize attacks by Pakistan based 'non state actors'.

The abrogation of the Indus Water Treaty was de-prioritized by Modi only because of logistical reasons. Massive infrastructure projects needed to be completed first on the Indian side before waters flowing into Pakistan could be re-routed.

Further it was decided that while options 1&2 would best be served hot (with a 'big bang' event followed by 'breaking news'), the abrogation of Indus Water Treaty would be best served cold (not as one big bang event, but as a long drawn gradual 'drying up of river waters' attributable to natural causes/global warming etc., un-accompanied by any TV 'Breaking news').

When IWT is discarded, all ongoing Indo-Pak bilateral water monitoring arrangements would likely be delayed/cancelled/disallowed by India under the cloak of 'not logistically feasible to arrange under the prevalent hostile Indo-Pak geo-political situation'.

[Ironically, Pakistan's unilateral decision yesterday to end diplomatic relations with India including recalling High Commissioners, offers precisely the setting India needs to quietly discard IWT and disallow Indo-Pak IWT monitors].

The bolded part, is this internationally proven and validated by any international court or is it Indian claim?

pillionrider
13th August 2019, 11:18
The customary exchange of sweets between the BSF and the Pakistan Rangers along the International Border did not take place on Monday on the occasion of Eid al-Adha, officials said.

The unilateral downgrading of diplomatic ties by Pakistan in the wake of the Modi government’s decision to revoke provisions of Article 370 from Jammu and Kashmir, is being seen as the reason.

They said the Pakistani side refused to attend the ceremony after the Border Security Force (BSF) sent across official communication to exchange sweets and greetings along the IB running through Jammu and Kashmir, Punjab, Rajasthan and Gujarat.

“The customary event did not take place at any location along the India-Pakistan border on the occasion of Eid al-Adha on Monday,” a senior official said.

The two forces that are deployed along over 3,000 kms of the border, exchange sweets on major festivals such as Eid, Holi, Diwali and their respective national days.

However, a similar exchange of sweets between BSF personnel and their Bangladeshi counterparts, Border Guards Bangladesh (BGB), took place at designated locations along the 4,096-km frontier shared by the two countries.

Senior commanders of the two forces exchanged best wishes and presented sweets to each other as part of the existing friendly protocol along the Bangladesh border, the official said.

Source: The Hindu newspaper