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xigaho
14th February 2008, 22:40
I wasnt sure if this had to be in the learning lessons. Thread. So mods can merge it there if they feel it belongs there.

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That apart, my first question is the meaning/pronunciation in English please of the following

شکست دے دی ہے

My take at it: sh-k-s-t shaksat.
So what is the meaning. I think it was used in the following sense "has been defeated".

xigaho
14th February 2008, 22:56
from the previous post, the script in a bigger font


شکست

Another question is the pronunciation of the alphabet "ain" in its medial usage.

For example, lets use
شعیب ملک

Now how do you pronounce "shoaib" malik

My take - sh-a-ay-b.

Some questions:

-Where does the "o" come in the pronunciation of shoaib.
-And regarding the "ain" so does it give a small "a".
-Why couldnt we have used the aliph instead of the "ain"?

Thanks

TAK
14th February 2008, 23:19
شکست دے دی ہے



this means "has defeated"

shikast day dee hai

12thMan
15th February 2008, 02:46
For example, lets use
شعیب ملک
-Where does the "o" come in the pronunciation of shoaib.
It might be properly written as
شُعیپ
the birdy or paish might be giving the o sound

xigaho
15th February 2008, 07:46
@thanks tak, so there's a missing zer below the sheen right?
-now suppose if you are writing an exam, then would missing the vowel signs be incorrect spelling or is it alowed?


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@12thMan, that would make the pronunciation a bit closer, but with the pesh, wouldnt it resemble to sh-u-ai-b.

I mean it would give a short u sound such as in kutta (dog). Where's the o?

To give the o sound, shouldnt there be a vaw, i.e


شویب

It seems over the years, the above has been distorted to
شعیب

with the vaw becoming the ain. :13:

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-Another question, what is the difference between the alif and the ain
For example, the spelling of tajjub could be written both with an alif and the ain?

- the normal spelling with the "ain"
تعجب

t-a-jub

-now what would be the pronunciation with an aliph instead of "ain"
تاجب

t-a-jub


Are the pronunciations the same for the above two variations of tajjub









just testing vowel signs
شوعیب ًَُِ ٍ ئ ٰ ّ ،

12thMan
15th February 2008, 08:14
@12thMan, that would make the pronunciation a bit closer, but with the pesh, wouldnt it resemble to sh-u-ai-b.

I mean it would give a short u sound such as in kutta (dog). Where's the o?shuaib will probably sound like shoe and shoaib like show. But one thing is that when it comes to names people spell it certain ways. Like Younis Khan spells his name Yunus or Yunis or something like that. And like some say English is a funny language. They cannot deal with some of the sounds of Urdu and they spell certain things in a strange way themselves like phenomenan (why not start with f). Well I have a bigger problem reading French as the sounds are way different than what they write in English alphabets

the rest of the post with Urdu in it I will look later as it is too late here to read Urdu

12thMan
16th February 2008, 01:53
...-Another question, what is the difference between the alif and the ain
For example, the spelling of tajjub could be written both with an alif and the ain?

- the normal spelling with the "ain"
تعجب

t-a-jub

-now what would be the pronunciation with an aliph instead of "ain"
تاجب

t-a-jub

Are the pronunciations the same for the above two variations of tajjub...
The ain sounds comes more from the throat so yes there is a difference. Many people may not say it properly and don't stress certain sounds. It is like the big hay (the one that is drawn like a jeem) and choti hay.