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MIG
26th May 2008, 17:10
An eye opening article about the Benazir and Zardari in the Times

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/asia/article3932406.ece





......

A few weeks earlier, according to a widely reported story, an incident took place the truth of which is now difficult to establish. In view of their worsening relations, Murtaza is said to have rung Zardari and invited him for a chat at the Bhutto headquarters, 70 Clifton. It was agreed he should come without bodyguards, in order that the two might meet privately and try to settle their differences. Zardari agreed. But as the two men were walking through the garden, Murtaza’s guards suddenly appeared and grabbed Zardari. Murtaza took out a cut-throat razor, and after slowly sharpening it, personally shaved off half of Zardari’s moustache. Then he threw him out the house. A furious Zardari, who had presumably feared much worse than a shave, was compelled to remove the other half of his moustache once he got home.

Whether there is any truth to this story – and Murtaza’s family strongly deny there is – the two brothers-in-law had become irreconcilable by the end of the summer of 1996, and few believed the rivalry was likely to end peacefully. Both men had reputations for being trigger-happy. Murtaza’s bodyguards were notoriously rough, and Murtaza was alleged to have sentenced to death several former associates, including his future biographer, Raja Anwar, author of an unflattering portrait, The Terrorist Prince. Zardari’s reputation was, if anything, worse.

Around the time of the alleged moustache shaving, when Benazir’s mother, the Begum Bhutto, suggested that Murtaza be made the chief minister of Sindh, Benazir and Zardari’s response was to remove the Begum as chairperson of the PPP. Zardari was also said to have leant on Abdullah Shah, the man who held the chief ministership the Begum had wanted Murtaza to be given, and asked him to get his Karachi police to harass Murtaza and obstruct his election campaign. There were also hints of worse to come. So insistent had these rumours become that at 3pm earlier that afternoon, Murtaza had given a press conference saying he had learnt that an assassination attempt on him was being planned, and he named some of Shah’s police officers he claimed were involved in the plot. Several of the officers were among those now waiting, guns cocked, outside his house.

According to witnesses, when the leading car drew up at the roadblock, there was a single shot from the police, followed by two more shots, one of which hit the foremost of Murtaza’s armed bodyguards. Sizing up the situation immediately, and guessing that the police wanted to provoke his guards into retaliating, Murtaza immediately got out of his car and urged his men to hold their fire. Even as he stood there with his hands raised above his head, urging calm, the police opened fire on the whole party with automatic weapons. The firing went on for nearly 10 minutes.

In the silence that followed, as the wounded men lay bleeding on the ground, the police circled the bodies with pistols, administering the coup de grâce to several of the prostrate figures with assassin’s shots to the back of the neck. One of Murtaza’s aides, Ashiq Ali Jatoi, the Sindh president of Murtaza’s faction of the PPP, was standing up cradling a broken arm and begging to be taken to hospital when he was shot at point-blank range in the back of the head. It was all over in quarter of an hour, leaving seven men either dead or dying. The remaining more lightly wounded men were left to bleed on the road for nearly an hour before being taken for treatment.

Two hundred yards down the road, inside the compound of 70 Clifton, the house where Benazir Bhutto had spent her childhood, was Murtaza’s wife Ghinwa, his daughter, the 12-year-old Fatima, and the couple’s young son, Zulfikar, then aged six. When the first shot rang out, Fatima was in Zulfikar’s bedroom, helping put him to bed. She immediately ran with him into his windowless dressing room, and threw him onto the floor, protecting him by covering his body with her own. When the firing had stopped, Ghinwa had tried to leave the house, but the police told her to stay inside as there had been a robbery nearby. After another 45 minutes, an increasingly worried Fatima called the prime minister’s house and asked to speak to her aunt. Benazir’s husband, Asif Ali Zardari, took her call. Fatima recalls the following conversation:

Fatima: “I wish to speak to my aunt, please.”

Zardari: “It’s not possible.”

Fatima: “Why?” [At this point, Fatima says, she heard loud, stagy-sounding wailing.]

Zardari: “She’s hysterical, can’t you hear?”

Fatima: “Why?”

Zardari: “Don’t you know? Your father’s been shot.”

Fatima and Ghinwa immediately left the house and demanded to be taken to see Murtaza. By now there were no bodies in the street. It had all been cleaned up: there was no blood, no glass or any sign of violence at all. Each of the seven wounded had been taken to a different location, though none were taken to emergency units of any of the Karachi hospitals.

“They had taken my father to the Mideast, a dispensary,” says Fatima. “It wasn’t an emergency facility and had no surgeons or any facilities for treating a wounded man. We climbed the stairs, and there was my father lying hooked up to a drip. He was covered in blood and unconscious. You could see he had been shot several times. One of those shots was from point-blank range, at the back of his jaw, and it had blown away part of his face. I kissed him and moved aside. Then my mother sat with him, speaking to him, holding his hand. He never recovered consciousness. We lost him just after midnight.”

The two bereaved women went straight to a police station to register a report, but the police refused to take it down. Benazir Bhutto was then the prime minister, and one might have expected the assassins would have faced the most extreme measures of the state for killing the prime minister’s brother. Instead, it was the witnesses and survivors who were arrested. They were kept incommunicado and intimidated. Two died soon afterwards in police custody.

In due course the police who were part of the operation were all promoted, except one, Haq Nawaz Sial, who was instead found shot, having “committed suicide”; his wife says she saw a gunman running away from the scene of the alleged self-shooting. This Fatima interprets as another killing by those behind the operation, who feared that the man would talk. “I rang my aunt several times to ask why none of those who did the shooting had been arrested,” says Fatima. “She just said, ‘Fati, you don’t understand how this works.’ There were never any criminal proceedings. Benazir claimed in the West to be the queen of democracy, but at that time there were so many like us who had lost family to premeditated police killings. We were just one among thousands. Nobody got justice.”

Benazir always protested her innocence over the death of Murtaza, and claimed that the killing was an attempt to frame her by the army’s intelligence services: “Kill a Bhutto to get a Bhutto,” as she used to put it. But the failure to properly investigate the murder, along with the highly suspicious circumstances of the ambush, all led Fatima and Ghinwa to conclude that Benazir and her husband had to be directly connected to the killings: “If she didn’t sign the death warrant, then who else had the power to cover it up?” asks Fatima. She wrote to Benazir, accusing her of, at best, failing to protect her father. It was the last direct contact between the two Bhutto women. “What does it all point to?” Fatima asks. “I would love to believe in the innocence of my aunt, but why else did she so obviously obstruct the investigation?”

Murtaza was, after all, clearly a direct threat to Benazir’s future, and she gained the most from the murder. For this reason her complicity was widely suspected well beyond the immediate family: when Benazir and Zardari attempted to attend Murtaza’s funeral, their car was stoned by villagers who believed them responsible.

The judiciary took the same view, and the tribunal set up to investigate the killing concluded that the assassination could not have taken place “without approval from the highest level of government”. There was no shoot-out, as the police had claimed; the police had suffered no injuries; it was clearly a premeditated ambush. The tribunal concluded that Benazir’s administration was “probably complicit” in the assassination. Six weeks later, when Benazir fell from power, partly as a result of public outrage at the killings, Zardari was arrested and charged with Murtaza’s murder.
..............

filosofee
26th May 2008, 17:42
Reads like one of those TV Pak dramas. Shocking and in the end Benazir suffered likewise.

MIG
26th May 2008, 23:46
What a disfunctional family ! Murtaza seems as much of a gunda as Zardari - the differnce being that one of them lies in a grave and the other struts around as the kingmaker in Pakistan !

filosofee
26th May 2008, 23:47
What a disfunctional family ! Murtaza seems as much of a gunda as Zardari - the differnce being that one of them lies in a grave and the other struts around as the kingmaker in Pakistan !

Feel Zardari's end will be unsightly, it won't be peaceful.

MIG
26th May 2008, 23:51
If you read the full article - Fatima Bhutto comes out as the ANTI- Bilawal type figure - could she be the hope in the next gen that will lead Pakistan or is she as corrupt as the rest of them ?

filosofee
26th May 2008, 23:55
If you read the full article - Fatima Bhutto comes out as the ANTI- Bilawal type figure - could she be the hope in the next gen that will lead Pakistan or is she as corrupt as the rest of them ?


MIG, I am sure she is fine. And politics does not corrupt all, consider Imran Khan.

Wazeeri
27th May 2008, 01:24
atima Bhutto comes out as the ANTI- Bilawal type figure - could she be the hope in the next gen that will lead Pakistan or is she as corrupt as the rest of them ?

MIG

Why should she be even considered? I don't think any of the Bhuttos have ever done anything for Pakistan to be considered as our future leaders. The sooner we get rid of this corrupt family the better.

Having read most of her articles she doesn't come across as the brightest star in the sky. Just another Bhutto feeding of the charisma and more importantly death of Zulifkar Ali Bhutto.

Zeenix
27th May 2008, 11:52
All unsubstantiated garbage. I don't understand why people are so quick to put the blame on Politicians and forget the role that our agencies play. He was the last person that the Agencies wanted in the govt.

Ghinwa Bhutto tried to play the Widow Card on the behest of Agencies in a bid to damage BB popularity in Sindh, failed miserably.

Zeenix
27th May 2008, 12:03
If you read the full article - Fatima Bhutto comes out as the ANTI- Bilawal type figure - could she be the hope in the next gen that will lead Pakistan or is she as corrupt as the rest of them ?

It doesn't cost much to hire a column writer does it..

MIG
27th May 2008, 12:16
Times is a pretty good source of information - whether we choose to believe it or not is up to us.

As for blaming the intelligence agencies - do you not feel that the PMs brother being gunned down a few meters from her house seems a little strange?

Zeenix
27th May 2008, 12:24
Times is a pretty good source of information - whether we choose to believe it or not is up to us.

As for blaming the intelligence agencies - do you not feel that the PMs brother being gunned down a few meters from her house seems a little strange?

No if you Know our agencies, it wouldn't be surprising even if he was gunned in the PM house..

Sheikh
27th May 2008, 14:53
If you read the full article - Fatima Bhutto comes out as the ANTI- Bilawal type figure - could she be the hope in the next gen that will lead Pakistan or is she as corrupt as the rest of them ?
She ain't corrupt, actually quite an insightful, down to earth woman. She was in the same school as my ex and they were pretty good friends. Has her priorities right.

Vegitto1
27th May 2008, 19:11
It would be naive to think that Benazir did not want her brother dead. I mean if you are arguing that she did not do it, then can you please explain how the most powerful figure in Pakistan could not bring to trial, those who murdered her brother?

W63L35
27th May 2008, 21:30
I sorry, but very few people would stage a drama over the dead body of her husband or her father.

she asks a legit question......

Fatima asks. “I would love to believe in the innocence of my aunt, but why else did she so obviously obstruct the investigation?”

If you are the prime minister, then why would you NOT turn the country upside down to find the murderers of of your own brother?

Zeenix
28th May 2008, 10:36
I sorry, but very few people would stage a drama over the dead body of her husband or her father.

she asks a legit question......


If you are the prime minister, then why would you NOT turn the country upside down to find the murderers of of your own brother?

You haven't seen the world enough then.

Between Murtaza was also the only living brother of BB... His death was a big blow for BB too.

Probably the worst ever decision that BB made was to succumb to the pressure of the establishment(read Military and its agencies) in 88. Had she resisted it, our democratic history would have been different.

It was a pity that the daughter of a person who refused to bow to the establishment and in the process lost in his life in a Judicial murder, bowed to the same establishment pressure.

She repented it all her life..

Hasan
28th May 2008, 13:51
MIG, I am sure she is fine. And politics does not corrupt all, consider Imran Khan.

Imran is a man with a very immoral and debased character as he has tried to deny the existence of his own illegitimate child to ensure his political career is not impacted.

Here is an interesting clip where he struggles to counter the claim that he is running away from the fact that the world knows that he has an illegitimate child.

http://video.google.co.uk/videosearch?q=Imran+Khan+Seeta+White+daughter+deba te&hl=en&sitesearch=#

Imran is in the same boat as the rest of the immoral and debased politicians of Pakistan, be they MQM, PPP, ML.

Zeenix
28th May 2008, 14:08
Imran is a man with a very immoral and debased character as he has tried to deny the existence of his own illegitimate child to ensure his political career is not impacted.

Here is an interesting clip where he struggles to counter the claim that he is running away from the fact that the world knows that he has an illegitimate child.

http://video.google.co.uk/videosearch?q=Imran+Khan+Seeta+White+daughter+deba te&hl=en&sitesearch=#

Imran is in the same boat as the rest of the immoral and debased politicians of Pakistan, be they MQM, PPP, ML.

Strong words, i won't say that, though the people supporting him will be in for a shock once (if he ever manages to) he comes to power. As in cricket, its easy to comment from the sidelines. That is offcourse totally different from being in the middle.

desidudecool
29th May 2008, 09:16
all these Bhuttos are ******** no wonder most of them have been killed.Murtaza was a horrible man much like his father and his evil witch sister not to mention..no doubt Zaradari had him killed..what did he expect after humiliating and insulting him like that.He was actually picked up from the airport by his guards who beat him up and then shaved his head and moustache.

Zeenix
29th May 2008, 19:07
all these Bhuttos are ******** no wonder most of them have been killed.Murtaza was a horrible man much like his father and his evil witch sister not to mention..no doubt Zaradari had him killed..what did he expect after humiliating and insulting him like that.He was actually picked up from the airport by his guards who beat him up and then shaved his head and moustache.
A Rubish post, unsubstantiated and filled with garbage.

W63L35
29th May 2008, 19:38
Between Murtaza was also the only living brother of BB... His death was a big blow for BB too.

How?



Probably the worst ever decision that BB made was to succumb to the pressure of the establishment(read Military and its agencies) in 88.

Why Murtaza was a threat to agencies - when BB was in power? But is not the 1st time, all the social ills have been conveniently blamed on agencies.
I bet a lot of people would blame agencies for these murders also!
http://www.pakpassion.net/ppforum/showthread.php?t=51275



Had she resisted it, our democratic history would have been different.

Worse or better and why?



She repented it all her life..
Unless you personally knew her, can you tell how how she repented it?

Zeenix
29th May 2008, 21:28
How?

I stated the reason didn't i. He was the only living brother.



Why Murtaza was a threat to agencies - when BB was in power? But is not the 1st time, all the social ills have been conveniently blamed on agencies.
I bet a lot of people would blame agencies for these murders also!
http://www.pakpassion.net/ppforum/showthread.php?t=51275

Is this the same case .. http://www.dailytimes.com.pk/default.asp?page=2008\03\25\story_25-3-2008_pg1_8


Worse or better and why?

The Keyword is repent..


Unless you personally knew her, can you tell how how she repented it?

Its an open secret. Ask any People Party worker and he'd tell you. I may not be personally knowing her, but i personally know people who knew her personally.

Wazeeri
29th May 2008, 22:31
Imran is a man with a very immoral and debased character as he has tried to deny the existence of his own illegitimate child to ensure his political career is not impacted.

Here is an interesting clip where he struggles to counter the claim that he is running away from the fact that the world knows that he has an illegitimate child.

That is definitely worst than having rapist as your cronies and protecting them from the hands of justice.

See Musharaf's role in the Arbab Rahim and his brother in laws public duel.

Wazeeri
29th May 2008, 22:38
Blaming the agencies is just cheap and a very easy option as everyone falls for the conspiracy theories of an all powerful secret agency behind everything.

My father was a very high official in intelligence when Nusrat Bhutto threatened to slap him. He had to bite his lip and walk away.

Agency staff no matter how high they are, are always at the mercy of whoever is in power. To think that they can get away with killing a "beloved" brother of the PM is unthinkable.

The only 2 establishments powerful enough to kill a high profile individual are the army and the government. One of them ie BB had a clear motive the other's motive is debatable.

Zechariah
29th May 2008, 22:38
Imran is a man with a very immoral and debased character as he has tried to deny the existence of his own illegitimate child to ensure his political career is not impacted.

Here is an interesting clip where he struggles to counter the claim that he is running away from the fact that the world knows that he has an illegitimate child.

http://video.google.co.uk/videosearch?q=Imran+Khan+Seeta+White+daughter+deba te&hl=en&sitesearch=#

Imran is in the same boat as the rest of the immoral and debased politicians of Pakistan, be they MQM, PPP, ML.

That was his past, and not everyone is an angel anyway..

Imran is still the un-corrupt out there. His only problem is that he flip flops a lot.

W63L35
29th May 2008, 23:15
Is this the same case .. http://www.dailytimes.com.pk/default.asp?page=2008\03\25\story_25-3-2008_pg1_8


He might have been acquitted for political reasons..... but he (non of us) won't escape the biggest court at the end!

I had a chance to meet with Nadeem/Nizam's family briefly since I posted the article and they did confirm that he did receive death threats from Zardari's people asking him not to take decision against him (Zardari) in the case.

Zeenix
29th May 2008, 23:19
Blaming the agencies is just cheap and a very easy option as everyone falls for the conspiracy theories of an all powerful secret agency behind everything.

My father was a very high official in intelligence when Nusrat Bhutto threatened to slap him. He had to bite his lip and walk away.

Agency staff no matter how high they are, are always at the mercy of whoever is in power. To think that they can get away with killing a "beloved" brother of the PM is unthinkable.

The only 2 establishments powerful enough to kill a high profile individual are the army and the government. One of them ie BB had a clear motive the other's motive is debatable.

I know a thing or two about the agencies too, their role can be positive and at times negative. Unfortunately our policies are short sighted hence most of the time we are left to lament our mistakes. Murtaza didn't had an illustrious past for all the wrong reasons. He has strong links with agencies of other countries. It wasn't inconceivable that he could ascend to a position where the agencies would have real problems eliminating him. So they nipped him in the bud. The Act being Good or Bad is beside the point. Had BB problems with Murtaza she wouldn't have allowed him to come back in the first place. It was in her govt that he was allowed back.

Zeenix
29th May 2008, 23:22
He might have been acquitted for political reasons..... but he (non of us) won't escape the biggest court at the end!

I had a chance to meet with Nadeem/Nizam's family briefly since I posted the article and they did confirm that he did receive death threats from Zardari's people asking him not to take decision against him (Zardari) in the case.

What kind of logic is this. When Zardari is put into jail its because he had committed the crime but when he is acquitted, its for political reasons.

And regarding justice in the hereafter then lets not be the judges here then..

W63L35
29th May 2008, 23:25
I know a thing or two about the agencies too, their role can be positive and at times negative. Unfortunately our policies are short sighted hence most of the time we are left to lament our mistakes. Murtaza didn't had an illustrious past for all the wrong reasons. He has strong links with agencies of other countries. It wasn't inconceivable that he could ascend to a position where the agencies would have real problems eliminating him. So they nipped him in the bud.

...at the same time promoting Zardari and dropping ALL the cases against him.....who has similar not-so-illustrious past? :20:

...if the reason given by you is true then agencies nip every politician in the bud! I wonder what was so different/special about him - beside being political threat to BB!

W63L35
29th May 2008, 23:31
What kind of logic is this. When Zardari is put into jail its because he had committed the crime but when he is acquitted, its for political reasons.

why was he not acquitted earlier - if the reason were not political?


And regarding justice in the hereafter then lets not be the judges here then..

No, I am not judging him. I KNOW, Zaradari had a hand in Nadeem/Nizam killing. Least I could do is call "zalim"..... a "Zalim"!

Here is a Hadith from this link about oppressors (zalims);
http://www.islamweb.net/ver2/engblue/article.php?lang=E&id=142451

One should prevent the oppressor physically if possible, and this responsibility is greater with respect to the rulers and those in authority. If one cannot stop the oppressor physically, then he should do it verbally.

Wazeeri
29th May 2008, 23:33
What kind of logic is this. When Zardari is put into jail its because he had committed the crime but when he is acquitted, its for political reasons.

Ofcourse we should completely ignore that the NRO happened and ofcourse the fact that Musharraf's government and the new governmen REFUSED to help the swiss in their investigation.

He is the only major Pakistani politician to be charged and found guilty in a foreign court.

Zeenix
29th May 2008, 23:55
...at the same time promoting Zardari and dropping ALL the cases against him.....who has similar not-so-illustrious past? :20:

...if the reason given by you is true then agencies nip every politician in the bud! I wonder what was so different/special about him - beside being political threat to BB!

Come on yaar, you gotta be kidding. There is no comparison between corruption and a terrorist. Don't really know why you are drawing the parallels here. There is no comparison.

Wazeeri: that decision was overturned by a court of the same country.

Between i am not trying to prove that Zardari is an angel. No he isn't. But in a country where corruption is the norm rather then the exception, Zardari spend many years in prison on unsubstantiated charges. The topic wasn't Zardari's corruption, it was his and BB's alleged involvement in the murder of Murtaza Bhutto.

Wazeeri
3rd June 2008, 00:15
Wazeeri: that decision was overturned by a court of the same country.


Not quite


A Swiss investigating magistrate has amassed enough evidence, including the purchase of a diamond necklace, to indict Pakistan's former Prime Minister, Benazir Bhutto and husband on money-laundering charges tied to contracts with two Geneva-based companies. The magistrate, Daniel Devaud, decided not to bring the charges against Ms. Bhutto in Switzerland, but rather to ask Pakistani authorities to indict her. The Geneva magistrate has been conducting a wide-ranging inquiry seeking to account for more than $13.7 million frozen by Swiss authorities in 2006.

The money was allegedly stashed in Swiss banks.[6] The public proceedings were required to be dropped against Bhutto due to her death; however, the proceedings are still continuing against Zardari as of late December 2007.[7]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/south_asia/7326142.stm

Wazeeri
3rd June 2008, 00:17
Zardari spend many years in prison on unsubstantiated charges.

Not completely unsubstantiated were they?
If it wasn't for Zardari faking sickness or his lawyers not turning up or BB's deals behind the scenes with Mughal-e-azam. Some of the cases may just have come to their conclusion before the NRO