How can the PCB restore its credibility re: security?

[OZGOD]

OK, time for blaming/fingerpointing is now past. Let's talk solutions to move Pakistan cricket forward. Let's pretend that we actually do have the power to make changes.

So far we know the following:

FACTS

an attack by at least 14 gunmen, armed with automatic weapons, grenades and at least one rocket launcher, took place on the SL cricket team and on the umpires 200m outside Gaddafi Statium, at the Liberty roundabout
presidential style security was promised
in keeping with this, a detailed security plan was agreed upon (http://www.pakpassion.net/ppforum/showthread.php?t=69824) and signed off by Interior Ministry and PCB
all cricket-related "targets" (e.g. SL players, umpires, referees) survived - some were injured (Ahsan Raza worst injured with gunshot to the back)
6 police died in the attack along with at least 2 civilians
SL bus driver drove the SL players to safety to the stadium where they were airlifted out by a military helicopter
umpires' van driver was shot dead and was eventually driven to the stadium by police after remaining stationary in the roundabout for an unspecified time
gunmen escaped and are currently at large


So those are the facts. I've left out anything that is hearsay or cannot be proven.

The consequence of the facts above is that the likelihood of foreign tours to Pakistan in the near future are slim - main cause being stated as "a lack of confidence in security".

So how do we move forward from this? You are Ijaz Butt. Actually, let's modify it a bit - Ijaz Butt has been relieved of his duties, and Zardari has appointed YOU to head the PCB. Your primary responsibility is to restore your organisation's credibility with respect to providing quality security to visiting teams, to encourage them to tour Pakistan again. So right now you don't have a good or bad rep with your peers internationally - they are willing to look at your work on its merits.

You need to re-instill confidence in your country's ability to effectively protect visiting teams and provide them (and your cricket-watching citizens) with an atmosphere of safety and security. There are certain things under your control as PCB chief, but others that you will have to rely on others (government, etc) to help you provide. You need to coordinate all this to ultimately present a plan to visiting teams and national cricket boards. You need to sell them on 2 things: 1) the quality of your plan; and 2) confidence that you will be able to execute your plan effectively when tested with any number of scenarios.

In any case, visiting teams and national cricket boards are looking to YOU as the point person responsible. They don't care if you dropped the ball, or the government dropped the ball, or the Punjab police force dropped the ball - they deal with YOU, as the PCB chief. You have to make it happen. You need to provide them with confidence as they will make their judgment based on what YOU say.

What would you do and how would you do this? Examples could be:

- where would you hold matches
- who would provide security
- what type of plan would you provide
- etc

Remember, NO fingerpointing - let's be constructive now. It's easy to criticise - but hard to come up with solutions that might work. Let's give it a go.

[IronMan2009]

Time. That is the only answer rightnow.

[OZGOD]

Time. That is the only answer rightnow.

So a year from now if you change nothing teams will come. That will be the solution?

[IronMan2009]

So a year from now if you change nothing teams will come. That will be the solution?
With in one year even if you change everything no one will come. As long as the scars are there people will refuse to come even if you give "presidential security". Only time can heal the scars nothing else. Already Crowe has said "he will never tour Pakistan". On the surface it is not big deal whether Crowe comes or not. But it will get others thinking as well.

But the time it takes to heal the scar depends on how PCB behaves. So far not good.

[pace007]

i have to agree with IronMan - nothing but time will help. more than likely a long time
and when the time comes and a team has decided to come - the PCB better make sure they do EVERYTHING right or those old wounds will be re-opened, even from minor issues. people will be looking for reasons not to tour for a long long time

[Crusader]

Unfortunately the matter is no more in the hands of PCB chief, it has gone beyond that - that is the govt. The best solution is to catch those terrorists and prosecute them, hang them do whatever necessary, that's the only way that it will instill some trust among other cricket playing nations. If you let them roam freely, no solution will be lasting. So far we don't know a **** about who carried those attacks and it seems that matter is slowly going to die a natural death. I hope not!

[MIG]

Brilliant thead Ozgod - something constructive at last.

Pakistan has a problem at the moment. We are in the middle of a war against terror and the situation is not in our control.

Terrorists are able to strike where they want - used to be the case that Cricket was sacred - not any more.

What can the PCB do in this case?

I dont think its their responsibility.

They are charged with running cricketing affairs of the country - security is the responsbility of the state.

In the recent attack, its the Govt that should take the blame and come up with recommendations and measures to fix the situation.

PCB must not be burdened with something that they do not understand or have any expertise in.

[Savak]

This is the governments responsibility. Its time they properly invested in the security forces i.e. professionalizing their training and uses them for the right purposes instead of the prosecuting opponents. Second whenever they have to guard a VVIP or any internation dignitary, VVIP you cannot have normal police man as guards, you have to have highly trained commandos who are fully trained for any kind of combat.

As far as other solutions are concerned. This is the most difficult part. The government has to find the right balance b/w justified use of force against those who challenge the writ/authority of the government and peaceful negotiations. The government has to have the support of the common man i.e. a government that serves the interests of the masses and solves their daily issues like food, water, shelter and providing good governance.

As far as other exogenous solutions are concerned, one can only hope and pray that Obama has the sense to find a peaceful way out of Afghanistan, the vibes i get and feel i dont think he will go ahead with his plan for a massive surge in Afghanistan as many commanders on the ground especially General Patraues based on his experience in Iraq's once troubled Sunni Triangle has told him the importance of dividing your opponents, snatching the moderate elements from the extremists and a balanced approach b/w force and peaceful negotiations. Once the Americans leave Afghanistan, it will be a positive step and a step towards rehabilitation.

Finally most importantly. The Pakistani team especially for the last 2 years after the 2007 WC is no longer regarded as the same exciting team as it was in the past. Blame it on poor captaincy, lack of exciting talent, lack of cricket as they say out of sight, out of mind, inability of the super stars like Akhtar, Afridi to properly shine and play consistently, the defectee's to the ICL e.t.c. If we can get our team to play some exciting cricket for a consistent period, get it to move in the right direction and select the best possible strongest guys that maximize our chances of victories it will help in the team's marketability. Improving domestic pitches is another crucial step.

After that we can only pray for things to fall in place.

[Big Harvey]

OK, if I was Ijaz Butt, I would be saying things along the following lines:

Firstly, I want to convey my board and my country's sincerest apologies to all our guests who were caught up in this terrible atrocity.

Now is not the time to be even thinking about future tours to Pakistan.

We have to be realistic and accept that for some time to come no visiting team is going to want to come to here. That means we have to work with other boards to examine the option of hosting our home matches at neutral venues. Before we can even begin to start thinking about hosting future tours in Pakistan, we have to await the outcomes of the various enquiries into the terrible events in Lahore, and examine any recommendations.

I do not want to comment on Chris Broad's allegations regarding any alleged shortcomings relating to the security provided for the ICC officials. This is all subject to an enquiry, and I don't want to pre-empt its findings. Chris and his colleagues (including Ashan Raza, who is critically ill in hospital), have been through a terrible ordeal and the enquiry taking place into what happened will involve examining evidence given by them and that of everyone else present or involved in the planning, in order to build up a clear picture of what happened. I have been assured that no stone will be left unturned. Once that's been done, lessons can hopefully be learned with regard to how security can be improved once Pakistan is ready to host touring teams again. I have no way of saying when that will be.

It must not be forgotton that eight people have lost their lives and others have been hospitalised while going about their everyday work. We owe it to them and their families to find out how this was allowed to happen, and to rectify any shortcomings in our future security arrangements to prevent anything like this ever happening again.

[jaspa888]

What can the PCB do in this case?

I dont think its their responsibility.

They are charged with running cricketing affairs of the country - security is the responsbility of the state.

In the recent attack, its the Govt that should take the blame and come up with recommendations and measures to fix the situation.

PCB must not be burdened with something that they do not understand or have any expertise in.

I agree with that sentiment. After the publicity surrounding 'presidential security assurances', no-one will believe a word PCB or Pak Govt say on security arrangements.

I appreciate the honest and constructive sentiments of OZGOD in starting this thread. The only way I can see a way out of this mess is for anyone associated with this mess to resign immediately so we can start afresh, including those culpable persons in the PCB, intelligence services, Lahore police and Pak Government.

Ideas to guarantee security in future would include:

- Touring team responsible for all security arrangements for their team while in Pak, with all associated costs bourne by PCB.

- Offer the use of independent security experts from neutral countries, with all associated costs bourne by PCB.

- Hotels built inside cricketing stadia compounds to ensure transit journeys kept to a minimum. (Karachi has adopted a similar approach for foreign business visitors to the city where Ramada hotel is actually within the Airport - fly in, have your meeting, fly out).

- Offer for foreign team's Board to hold Zardari as hostage in their country for the duration of the tour. Zardari gets a testicle cut off for each security incident that then takes place. We can't lose... :13: :)))

[jaspa888]

This is the governments responsibility. Its time they properly invested in the security forces i.e. professionalizing their training and uses them for the right purposes instead of the prosecuting opponents. Second whenever they have to guard a VVIP or any internation dignitary, VVIP you cannot have normal police man as guards, you have to have highly trained commandos who are fully trained for any kind of combat.

No-one will believe a word our Government says after the assurances SL team were given.

The only way to gain that trust - and even this will take years to achieve - is to take security out of the hands of Pakistan.

Look at the American President. When he tours abroad, one non-negotiable factor is that he is guarded by his own US Secret Service and they have the final say in all security matters, even over the host country's own forces.

Unfortunately, we will need to bear these same igninomies for the forseeable future as we have lost that trust.

[IronMan2009]

The only way to gain that trust - and even this will take years to achieve - is to take security out of the hands of Pakistan.
.

It is not a viable option as it is impossible send 100s of commandos alongwith players by touring team. Onus is on the host country. That is not going to change.

[jaspa888]

It is not a viable option as it is impossible send 100s of commandos alongwith players by touring team. Onus is on the host country. That is not going to change.

Then no country will tour either.

Trust has to be earned, even if it at an exhorbitant financial cost to the PCB.

PS. You do not need hundreds of commando - just a few dozen specialist, experienced, competent people who know what they are doing. You shouldnt mix up quantity with quality.

[OZGOD]

I have my own ideas by the way - but I'm hoping to see some ideas before I outline my "grand plan" (in case my "grand plan" is wrong). :D

[OZGOD]

The key words here are "confidence" and "credibility"? If you restore both of those (however long it takes) you go a LONG way towards getting tours started again.

[Gujar]

Great thread OZGOD, i really enjoy reading your posts.

[MIG]

The key words here are "confidence" and "credibility"? If you restore both of those (however long it takes) you go a LONG way towards getting tours started again.

Who will listen to us? Do we need to put out a promotional video showing our security forces protecting various fictitious teams or will a wad of money do?

[OZGOD]

Who will listen to us? Do we need to put out a promotional video showing our security forces protecting various fictitious teams or will a wad of money do?

This is where we get our creative juices flowing mate. After all, sporting teams still play Iraq (currently in neutral venues) and they go to Israel despite all the unrest and conflict there - we can get them to come to Pakistan if we get our thinking caps on. :D

[OZGOD]

Great thread OZGOD, i really enjoy reading your posts.

Well, I hope more people contribute to it then. Any idea is better than no idea.

[Oxy]

Some people are giving to much credit to the 'power' of the PCB in security matters.

This HAS to be Governemnt-led. The likes of Ijaz Butt are mere 'chamchay 'mouth-pieces for the Zardari.

Do people have confidence in their Govt? No they dont.

Do they feel they have a 'credible' Govt? No they dont.

Now - where are we going to get security from, that an opposition tour security expert like Reg Dickason is going to have any faith in?

Time - its ONLY a healer, if major changes are made a Govt level re: taking cricket seriously in Pakistan, in EVERY SINGLE ASPECT of the game 'root & branch' as they say

I have NO faith in this Govt doing that

[jaspa888]

Some people are giving to much credit to the 'power' of the PCB in security matters.

This HAS to be Governemnt-led. The likes of Ijaz Butt are mere 'chamchay 'mouth-pieces for the Zardari.

Do people have confidence in their Govt? No they dont.

Do they feel they have a 'credible' Govt? No they dont.

Now - where are we going to get security from, that an opposition tour security expert like Reg Dickason is going to have any faith in?

Time - its ONLY a healer, if major changes are made a Govt level re: taking cricket seriously in Pakistan, in EVERY SINGLE ASPECT of the game 'root & branch' as they say

I have NO faith in this Govt doing that

Incompetence and bureaucracy has always hindered Pakistan's progress and reputation in getting public services up to to international standards.

But the sheer intensity of the adverse publicity from this atrocity, far fiercer in its damage to Pakistan's reputation than BB's assasination, means the usual solution to repair the damage (strategic resignation and demotions, soundbites to improve in the future, etc) will not wash this time.

Outsourcing our security is the only way to regain our trust - and even that will take a long time.

[usman_ash14]

Here is my take on it, not sure if possible but i'll post it anyway.

Every country has two types of security, police and military.
Most of us here would have more confidence in our Kayani led military assuring us safety then our Zardari led police.
Now, I don't know if it's possible but our military should be providing security to international teams.

[Hash]

In short:

It can't.

[Plasma]

In short:

It can't.
You're suppose to be the positive one yaar.

[Ali888]

brilliant ! Make this guy head of the PCB if he is prepared to accept the pay cut... I agree with that sentiment. After the publicity surrounding 'presidential security assurances', no-one will believe a word PCB or Pak Govt say on security arrangements.

I appreciate the honest and constructive sentiments of OZGOD in starting this thread. The only way I can see a way out of this mess is for anyone associated with this mess to resign immediately so we can start afresh, including those culpable persons in the PCB, intelligence services, Lahore police and Pak Government.

Ideas to guarantee security in future would include:

- Touring team responsible for all security arrangements for their team while in Pak, with all associated costs bourne by PCB.

- Offer the use of independent security experts from neutral countries, with all associated costs bourne by PCB.

- Hotels built inside cricketing stadia compounds to ensure transit journeys kept to a minimum. (Karachi has adopted a similar approach for foreign business visitors to the city where Ramada hotel is actually within the Airport - fly in, have your meeting, fly out).

- Offer for foreign team's Board to hold Zardari as hostage in their country for the duration of the tour. Zardari gets a testicle cut off for each security incident that then takes place. We can't lose... :13: :)))

[MIG]

Why not hold the cricket game in a military base, surrounded by tanks and F-16s doing low level fly bys? Surely that will guarantee safety? But hold on, what if the terrorists fire a scud rocket into the field ? No problem patriot missile batteries outside and inside the ground with players wearing bullet proof vests and kevlar helmets....

Do you see where I am going with this?

There is no fool proof security!

[Fish]

Right now Pakistan should look at ways of providing extra security at venues that will host test matches, start putting things into place that will provide peace of mind for visiting teams. Security cameras at all entry/exit points, scanning equipment for weapons for all entry/exit points. Whatever steps are nessecary to provide extremely tight security.

Visiting teams to have an entire hotel that has a buffer zone securely partitioned off and patrolled by expertly trained anti terrorist commandos. This would include visiting team coordinators having complete access to all security plans, procedures and ability to pull out of tour if not satisfied.

Transportation to the grounds would be by helicopter from hotel to arena as would transport from airport to hotel.

Security personell would brief visiting team each and every morning outlining the days activities and security preperations and plans for that day.

I dont know if that would convince teams to tour but it would show that Pakistan is determined to provide the best available security.

[the Great Khan]

look they can provide the security..thats not the problem..the problem is will they? in lahore the sort of security you normally get wasnt there..why? thats the question..

Pakistan is fully capable of providing the right sort of security..extra bits that will be needed are:

1) implement ICC security reccommendations with regards to the stadia security. they have not been implemented yet.

2) get independant security consultants to verify and sign off on the security reqs.

3) get FICA on board.we have plenty of time now.

4) implement a full enquiry with the ICC and western boards( CA,ECB) help. Ask them what they want and implement it.

5) the only way to gain credibility is to put your hands up and ask for help! especially from CA and the ECB..

[MIG]

Right now Pakistan should look at ways of providing extra security at venues that will host test matches, start putting things into place that will provide peace of mind for visiting teams. Security cameras at all entry/exit points, scanning equipment for weapons for all entry/exit points. Whatever steps are nessecary to provide extremely tight security.

Visiting teams to have an entire hotel that has a buffer zone securely partitioned off and patrolled by expertly trained anti terrorist commandos. This would include visiting team coordinators having complete access to all security plans, procedures and ability to pull out of tour if not satisfied.

Transportation to the grounds would be by helicopter from hotel to arena as would transport from airport to hotel.

Security personell would brief visiting team each and every morning outlining the days activities and security preperations and plans for that day.

I dont know if that would convince teams to tour but it would show that Pakistan is determined to provide the best available security.

Would you want to tour a country where teams are transported by choppers to the ground - where the hotel is situated in a baghdad like green zone? Tell you what, if that doesnt scare teams - nothing will!

I believe that the only way to do this for the Govt of this country to improve the security situation. Once it can be shown to the world that we havent had a terrorist incident for the past x days/months, then all you say above will make more sense.

[Da Best]

First of all, the ammount of security should be beefed up in every aspect of the game, considerbly. Second, we should try to move our home games into England and U.A.E, mainly these places, diversity should be there, so we should be going to other places.

We should get a hold on our domestic cricket, timing, realsing of the dates, pitches, media coverage, game coverage have all have got a factor to play to make a succesful domestic cricket. Right now, nobody will come to play in Pakistan, so up the domestic cricket.

Finally and the most important thing, Pakistan should play more competitive cricket for a consistant period and play more exicting cricket which the fans will want to watch.

[jaspa888]

I believe that the only way to do this for the Govt of this country to improve the security situation. Once it can be shown to the world that we havent had a terrorist incident for the past x days/months, then all you say above will make more sense.

Good post.

But changing people's perceptions is very difficult, and impossible if the same jokers (with different voices) are in charge.

Croatia was a no-go zone ten years ago, but look at how the country has responded to and bloomed with a change in leadership. It is a a tourist destination again, and 'feels' very safe - just 15 years after a brutal civil war.

The problem with Pakistan is that no-one will trust their assurances. Even a change in Government will find it difficult to change that perception. Corruption runs too deep in the country to ensure that there will be no security leaks.

[OZGOD]

I dont know if that would convince teams to tour but it would show that Pakistan is determined to provide the best available security.


This was kind of what I was getting at. Of course it's impossible to guarantee security, but it's about showing that commitment, which will help to restore confidence. Why did people continue to visit New York after 9/11? That kind of stuff.

[Crusader]

As I said earlier, no security is good enough unless the govt sets its house in order. I understand that it is a very complex scenario but steps must be taken in the right direction. The only concern is whether the civil govt has adequate backing from the military establishment which has a long history of coups.

According to a recent report published in LA times it seems that the militants has a tacit backing from military who view them as strategic assets.

http://www.latimes.com/news/custom/topofthetimes/topstories/la-na-us-terrorism9-2009mar09,0,5705082.story

So when the situation is so complex is Pakistan, what can the PCB chief do? I feel sorry for the common men who are in a tug of war between govt., military , terrorists and may be US war on terror in Afganistan.

[shaun3]

I have to echo what so many have said before in this thread. This is not in the PCB's hands.

The govt is responsible for providing civil stability, and when we got saddled with the world's war on terrorism, this became a tough job for any administration, let alone the current highly incompetent one.

If we are in a position where we have to guarantee fool-proof security, then the battle is already lost. Aus/SA/Ind canceled their tours despite these guarantees, and at a time and when sports was not yet a target.

Time may make it better, but time may also make it worse. God forbid Pak may even become more unstable in the future. To make it better, the underlying problems (Taleban/militancy/civil unrest) must be addressed by the govt.

In the meantime, the PCB can help things by not antagonizing those who have suffered because of PCB incompetence.

[the Great Khan]

As I said earlier, no security is good enough unless the govt sets its house in order. I understand that it is a very complex scenario but steps must be taken in the right direction. The only concern is whether the civil govt has adequate backing from the military establishment which has a long history of coups.

According to a recent report published in LA times it seems that the militants has a tacit backing from military who view them as strategic assets.

http://www.latimes.com/news/custom/topofthetimes/topstories/la-na-us-terrorism9-2009mar09,0,5705082.story

So when the situation is so complex is Pakistan, what can the PCB chief do? I feel sorry for the common men who are in a tug of war between govt., military , terrorists and may be US war on terror in Afganistan.


I wouldnt believe anything coming out of the american press as it is out of date as soon as it gets to print. Alot of the things you read in the latimes and nytimes are psyop hit pieces that do not reflect the reality on the ground. For example we have just heard that the "militants" have been defeated in Bajaur and 5 out of 7 tribal districts are under the control of the govt. That essentially measn that the TTP has been effectively defeated in pakistan. Instead what are the western press reporting? that the taliban control half of Pakistan!!

As for this issue about the PA controlling militant groups. The groups that have contacts with the PA are the groups who fought in the afghan war. their contacts have remained and the CIA is well aware of this. They are were all supported by the CIA at one point or another . The kashmir groups are the same. Some are supported some are not. One thing is certain there are many groups that are not and are heavily infiltrated by agents and double agents. The TTP was effectively a mercenary force setup by afghanistan ,India,US,etc.

Dont believe anything from teh western press. The best place to get your news about Pakistan is from our tv channels, the army, our own press both urdu and english and eyewitness accounts from the areas affected. You will find that the majority of western stuff is a cut and paste analysis based on our own media.!

[OZGOD]

So a year from now if you change nothing teams will come. That will be the solution?

So it's been a year and a half now. Is Pakistan and the PCB any closer to providing a solution that will give visiting teams confidence to tour Pakistan? That's the END GOAL that I'm sure we all want (I know I do).

What has changed between March 2009 and now to give visiting teams confidence that they will be able to tour Pakistan safely?

What has the PCB implemented in the 18 months since the attacks on the SL team?

What is the outcome of the inquiry? Have they found the perpetrators?

What have they changed in terms of process? Security? Venue?

What will they tell other national boards when the time comes to discuss playing in Pakistan again?

Or are they planning to play their home games in Abu Dhabi for the next 5 years?

What has Ijaz Butt and his group at the PCB done to work towards getting Pakistan to host home games again?

Has Ijaz Butt or whoever else is in charge been able to tell the families of the policemen who died, who killed them? What did they die for?

We talked above about the PCB needing to regain "trust" and "credibility". Has either of these been regained in the last 18 months?

[MIG]

Nothing has changed OG.

Ijaz Butt has destroyed whatever goodwill we had with England and possibly rest of the ICC members.

We have hit rockbottom - only thing that can be worse now is us being chucked out of the ICC but thankfully, cooler heads have prevailed.

As for the deceased Policemen - they join the ranks of thousands of others who have and continue to die wondering why !

Given the fun and less hassle they have in UAE (Dubai/Abu Dhabi) - I wouldnt be surprised if the PCB is sitting comfortably about the home series question

[Down2Earth]

I would create a mini cricket city in some remote location, close to any international airport and have a cricket stadium there with hotels for the team players and restaurants. civilians that wish to enter would obviously have to go through thorough security checks. Could have cricket cities like this in islamabad lahore and karachi

[Proud To Be A Pakistani]

I would create a mini cricket city in some remote location, close to any international airport and have a cricket stadium there with hotels for the team players and restaurants. civilians that wish to enter would obviously have to go through thorough security checks. Could have cricket cities like this in islamabad lahore and karachi

Cricket city not bad idea :p but if its isolated location ppl wont come .. but pakistani will crowd come anywhere .. but I don't see that happening .. PCB couldn't even build any new ground for years .. so can't see that happening that get intl standards grounds :p

[SOSami]

Very airy-fairy answer, but they need to believe it's possible.

I don't think they do, which is disappointing because the situation is manageable.

[the Great Khan]

no one would come to a cricket city and it would be too expensive..the best thing to do is the following:

1)firstly map out a proper strategy with giles clarke that will lead to the resumption of cricket in pakistan.

2) get funding for a revamp of three cricket centres: Gaddhafi, karachi, multan

3) the revamp will include onsite helicopter pads, five star dormitories, onsite practice facilities for international players, gymn, catering, communications, entertainment.

4) increase the level of security around the grounds on match days..if it means less spectators then so be it..initially this will have to be done..

5) setup a security force that is solely dedicated to the protection of sports personalities within the country..use ex army, police people to do so with input from current personell..

6) setup a mechanism where security in the country is montiored by the ICC on a periodical basis and findings reported.

7) get input from the other boards...

ultimatley I dont think we will see cricket in paksitan until after the elections in 2012 or at the latest after 2014 when the americans withdraw from afghanistan!

[farazaidi]

Unfortunately, PCB hasnt put a foot forward ever since that attack 20 months ago. Instead took a few steps back by sabotaging our relations with ECB and ICC. Way to go Mr.Buttox :ibutt

[pinger]

So it's been a year and a half now. Is Pakistan and the PCB any closer to providing a solution that will give visiting teams confidence to tour Pakistan? That's the END GOAL that I'm sure we all want (I know I do).

What has changed between March 2009 and now to give visiting teams confidence that they will be able to tour Pakistan safely?

What has the PCB implemented in the 18 months since the attacks on the SL team?

What is the outcome of the inquiry? Have they found the perpetrators?

What have they changed in terms of process? Security? Venue?

What will they tell other national boards when the time comes to discuss playing in Pakistan again?

Or are they planning to play their home games in Abu Dhabi for the next 5 years?

What has Ijaz Butt and his group at the PCB done to work towards getting Pakistan to host home games again?

Has Ijaz Butt or whoever else is in charge been able to tell the families of the policemen who died, who killed them? What did they die for?

We talked above about the PCB needing to regain "trust" and "credibility". Has either of these been regained in the last 18 months?

I have worked in international security assessment and close quarter protection, and there is no way to provide that in Pakistan to a group of players playing in public arenas.

The simple fact is that when people are prepared to be human bombs all rules go out the window. There is no way to completely isolate the players.

It is unfortunate, but reality. It was the same opinion 15 years ago when we gave our reports to our business, and it is worse now.

[GOAT]

Honest opinion? Change in government is the only way this can happen. As of now, Zardari has no interest in doing any good for anyone in Pakistan but himself. I've never been a huge fan of democracy in Pakistan -- far too easily corruptible. The security situation in Pakistan relies heavily on what happens in Afghanistan, so in a sense all cards are in the armies hands. Now, with the inevitable withdrawal of international forces getting closer and closer, the situation only gets better for Pakistan.

If the Afghan war is resolved (and by this I mean international forces leave and Karzai gets booted out), then the situation in Pakistan will improve. While attacks are down this year so far, they have the propensity to pick up at any time. I don't see teams like Australia and South Africa touring Pakistan until maybe 20 years down the road, they've always had their reservations.

I support the idea of a 'Cricket City', kind of like an athletes village in the Olympics. But for that to be successful the PCB would have to be an independent and competent organization -- it is not. You would also require security and protection from the military, which at the moment has bigger worries. Still it's an idea that deserves to be implemented in some way.

For now the best thing Pakistan can do is to play matches abroad, UAE and England are the only places that work to be honest.

What no one really talks about though, is if Pakistan cricket is outside of the country for such a long time, will the public fall out of love with it ?

[WhiteDudeFromTrinidad]

i would buy a couple of second-hand military armoured personal carriers and hire some private mercenaries

that would be very radical and expensive but it would show serious intent that the PCB are doing everything that they possibly can to ensure the safety of touring teams

and such a move would also embarrass the Pak govt. into helping out with additional security / costs imo

[insaaniyat]

This is where we get our creative juices flowing mate. After all, sporting teams still play Iraq (currently in neutral venues) and they go to Israel despite all the unrest and conflict there - we can get them to come to Pakistan if we get our thinking caps on. :D

Excellent point.

[insaftak]

I am not expecting any cricket in Pakistan until war stops in afghanistan.

[jeetu]

This problem is there for decade. Its got worse with time.
Pakistan must find a country that is desperate enough to play international cricket and atleast get the ball rolling.

[OZGOD]

>>>>>BUMP

Bumping up in light of the latest fiasco to involve a team touring Pakistan - the yes they're coming/no they're not/no they're REALLY not Bangladesh side who have, in their defence, been told by their highest court not to tour Pakistan. It shouldn't have gotten to the point where a couple of punters can delay a bilateral series (even if it's only 2 games and pure token). But again the reason is the same that it has been for the past 3 years: SECURITY. Or the perceived lack thereof.

We talked about this three years ago and some people put their tuppence on what they thought needed to be done. With the benefit of 3 years of hindsight, I am bumping the thread to see what you all think now:

1. has enough been done to improve security (or at least the perception of) in Pakistan for touring sides to consider coming? Has 3 years been enough time to make systemic changes in the security apparatus around visiting teams?

2. what more needs to be done to convince sides like Bangladesh, let alone sides like Australia and England, to tour? And the Bangladesh court decision sets a precedent - what needs to be done to convince FANS that Pakistan is safe to play in? After all the court decision illustrates that a couple of concerned citizens can influence the probability of a tour taking place.

My comments earlier (back in Nov 2010, a year and a half ago, also a year and a half from the date of the SL incident):

So it's been a year and a half now. Is Pakistan and the PCB any closer to providing a solution that will give visiting teams confidence to tour Pakistan? That's the END GOAL that I'm sure we all want (I know I do).

What has changed between March 2009 and now to give visiting teams confidence that they will be able to tour Pakistan safely?

What has the PCB implemented in the 36 months since the attacks on the SL team?

What is the outcome of the inquiry? Have they found the perpetrators?

What have they changed in terms of process? Security? Venue?

What will they tell other national boards when the time comes to discuss playing in Pakistan again?

Or are they planning to play their home games in Abu Dhabi for the next 5 years?

What has Ijaz Butt/Zaka Ashraf and his group at the PCB done to work towards getting Pakistan to host home games again?

Has Ijaz Butt/Zaka Ashraf/Zardari or whoever else is in charge been able to tell the families of the policemen who died, who killed them? What did they die for?

We talked above about the PCB needing to regain "trust" and "credibility". Has either of these been regained in the last 36 months?

Comments?

[chacha kashmiri]

1. has enough been done to improve security (or at least the perception of) in Pakistan for touring sides to consider coming? Has 3 years been enough time to make systemic changes in the security apparatus around visiting teams?

The security is fit enough for heads of states and foreign secretaries to come, so there shouldn't be a problem with cricket stars

2. what more needs to be done to convince sides like Bangladesh, let alone sides like Australia and England, to tour? And the Bangladesh court decision sets a precedent - what needs to be done to convince FANS that Pakistan is safe to play in? After all the court decision illustrates that a couple of concerned citizens can influence the probability of a tour taking place.


Australia has not toured pak for over ten years, for them to tour you would need to offer them hoors from paradise.
What needs to be done is for pakistan to offer some kind of cricket utopia where hotels are made of candy and sixes are greetd with cheque books




What has changed between March 2009 and now to give visiting teams confidence that they will be able to tour Pakistan safely?

Nato does not run through pakistan like it used to

What has the PCB implemented in the 36 months since the attacks on the SL team?

The pcb seems to be an easy target for match fixing and security dangers.
Where's the pressure on teams that tour sri lanka with their horrific human rights abuses


What is the outcome of the inquiry? Have they found the perpetrators?

Have they found who shot jfk yet?

[HaMmy FinE LeG StriKeR]

kicking americaoutta afghanistan, sorry this is cricket forum, but the answer cant be other than political

[ahsan17]

The terrorist attacks in the major cities are down significantly. Karachi hasn't had a major terrorist attack in probably a year. Islamabad hasn't had one probably in 2-3 years. Same for Rawalpindi. Lahore -- around year and a half. I think Multan and Faisalabad had one terrorist attack EVER (at least in the last 5 years) and those were a long time back. The number of smaller terrorist attacks in these cities would be very small as well.

The problem is perception. We still have terrorist attacks very frequently in remote tribal areas. The western media latches on to everyone of them. For those living outside Pakistan with little knowledge of ground reality, you get the idea that these things are happening all over Pakistan.

The other problem is trust -- even I can't guarantee that there won't be a terrorist attack on visiting team, even though there haven't been major terrorist attacks in the big cities in a while.

This all comes down to a political level. This problem won't be solved until US leaves Afghanistan, or at least winds down their presence significantly (i.e. to something around 30,000 soldiers). I don't see cricket returning to Pakistan until that happens. And that won't happen until late 2013 at the earliest.

I think we need to be patient and wait for this war to end or at least significantly wind down. Having Bangladesh tour will still not result in any other team touring.

[Ironcat]

The 2009 attacks wouldn't have transpired without the blessing of the SL terrorist elements. Those elements have since been rather controversially eliminated. We just had a bunch of English teams tour and play cricket in Pakistan.

Look, nobody in Pakistan really benefits from killing of players and sport officials. There has to be an external/a political motivation. (Kidnapping foreigners for ransom is a good business though, but mainly in the hands of those north western warlords.)

So, are we sure that we've cleaned up the guns in Lahore so they are now showing up in Sydney? No.

Can we guarantee that a Breivik wannabe isn't hiding somewhere in Pakistan? No.

But, is that what the international community wants Pakistan to prove? Absolutely, positively, yes.

[OZGOD]

So, are we sure that we've cleaned up the guns in Lahore so they are now showing up in Sydney? No.

Can we guarantee that a Breivik wannabe isn't hiding somewhere in Pakistan? No.

But, is that what the international community wants Pakistan to prove? Absolutely, positively, yes.

Yes, fairly or unfairly, the bar gets higher once things have happened once :(