Akram: England should apologise (Cricinfo)

[sy]

Wasim Akram says England should apologise for accusing his team of cheating in 1992 when they used reverse swing. Akram and Waqar Younis used it to devastating effect in that series, and England employed the same art to similar effect all summer against Australia; Simon Jones and Andrew Flintoff were particularly adept at using it.

"England owe us an apology in a big way," Akram told AFP. "When we did the reverse swing against England in 1992, they were [the] great moaners and groaners of the world, [and] they termed it as cheating. And now when they achieved an Ashes win through reverse swing, it's an art," Akram said.

Akram, Pakistan's best left-arm seamer, and his pace partner Waqar Younis shattered England with a devastating display of reverse-swing bowling during Pakistan's tour of England in 1992 (http://stats.cricinfo.com/guru?sdb=compare;playerid=1775;class=testplayer;fi lter=basic;team=0;opposition=ENG;notopposition=0;s eason=1992;homeaway=0;continent=0;country=ENG;notc ountry=0;groundid=0;startdefault=1985-01-25;start=1985-01-25;enddefault=2002-01-11;end=2002-01-11;tourneyid=0;finals=0;daynight=0;toss=0;schedule dovers=0;scheduleddays=0;innings=0;result=0;follow on=0;seriesresult=0;captain=0;keeper=0;dnp=0;recen t=;runslow=;runshigh=;batposition=0;dismissal=0;bo wposition=0;ballslow=;ballshigh=;bpof=0;overslow=; overshigh=;conclow=;conchigh=;wicketslow=;wicketsh igh=;dismissalslow=;dismissalshigh=;caughtlow=;cau ghthigh=;caughttype=0;stumpedlow=;stumpedhigh=;vie wtype=com_compare;csearch=younis;cplayerid=1935;co mparetype=aro_series;compare=1;.cgifields=comparet ype), helping Pakistan to a 2-1 win.

England's tabloid press accused the pair, who took 41 wickets between them, of cheating and ball tampering. But England used the same technique to dismantle the much-touted Australian batting, and dethrone Australia as Ashes champions after a hard-fought 2-1 series which ended Monday.

"Now English bowlers know it, it's the art of reverse swing. Still, I am happy that they have finally realised the importance of reverse swing," Akram said yesterday.

Akram, who has taken 414 Test and a world record of 502 one-day wickets in his career, said Pakistani bowlers should be given credit for the reverse swing.

"This art has spread only because of Pakistani bowlers," he said. "Imran Khan taught me how to reverse swing the ball, I told Younis and we mastered it."

He said English all-rounder Andrew Flintoff learnt a lot from him while they both played county cricket for Lancashire in the late 1990s.

"He learnt how to hide the shine and he did that during the Ashes. Had I not told him, he would have learnt it anyway, but I am glad that he has learnt well. They have mastered the art of reverse swing and [the] Australians had no clue as to how to cope with the reverse swing," Akram said.

© Cricinfo

http://content-uk.cricinfo.com/england/content/story/219349.html

[MIG]

hear hear Akram !

But I think asking England to apologise is asking a little too much !

[Nauman]

Technically they should that loud mouth Botham specially, he is bragging all over saying this English side wont be dethroned for a long time, Flintoff is the best cricketer in the world etc etc someone should pull his leg and bring him back on the ground.

[zaf1986]

Technically they should that loud mouth Botham specially, he is bragging all over saying this English side wont be dethroned for a long time, Flintoff is the best cricketer in the world etc etc someone should pull his leg and bring him back on the ground.
Well, we would be the same if we had just beaten Australia in a Test series...

[the Great Khan]

lol..thats the problem with england..eventually its like someones evil eye hits em...dont worry they will come down to earth sooner or later as unlike aussie their bench strength is poor and they dont have an attacking spinner...also their batting may not be as invincible as it is being made out...inshallah we'll see!!

[Nauman]

Well, we would be the same if we had just beaten Australia in a Test series...

Well go beat Australia in Australia then we will talk, beating a team becomes 10 times easier when it is in your own backyard.

[zaf1986]

Well go beat Australia in Australia then we will talk, beating a team becomes 10 times easier when it is in your own backyard.
When was the last time Pakistan beat Australia in a Test series anywhere? Since when did we have the bragging rights anyway? We couldn't even beat a WI team that is being thrashed by everyone...

[zaf1986]

This isnt even about Pakistan zaf, we are talking about Botham, reverse swing, Australia and England.
i dont like botham and he goes over the top that is given, he does it all the time even when england beat WI :))) but the point is england have actually got something to be bragging about because they have beat the no. 1 team...

When they get a flogging in Pakistan, then we will talk. Patience, my dear, patience. :D

[floatingslip]

I'll never forget Boycott's comments during that 1992 series - he basically said all this ball tampering talk was rubbish and that if you give Waqar and Wasim a tomato they will reverse that as well. Was absolutely brilliant.

[HAFRIDI]

finally someone speaks up!!!! i salute u akram!

[AT1]

:19: :14: :14: well done for stepping up!!

[Solid Snake]

Englands behaviour has been APPALLING to say the least, it has been quite disgusting, everytime reverse-swing was mentioned, not ONCE were wasim and waqar mentioned or to that matter pakistan, they completley avoided the history section of it, and botham, the guy has no right to even say RS that sick hypocrite. Pakistan should not be even asking for an apology, they deserve more and some damn acknowledgement!! I hope we reverse it like hell when they come to pak INSHALLAH!

IF that does happen though, i bet it will be called ball tampering all over again :P, damn hypocrites, it ll serve 'em right :16: !

[Monsee]

I'll never forget Boycott's comments during that 1992 series - he basically said all this ball tampering talk was rubbish and that if you give Waqar and Wasim a tomato they will reverse that as well. Was absolutely brilliant.


Orange my friend, not the tomato...are U sure you were not thinking of Dan Quayle rather than Boycott, when you said 'Tomato':D

[Mercenary]

it was an orange not a tomato floating slip

[nedian21]

they wud have taken English wkts with a tomato even;-)

[Imran_The Man!]

Yes! GO Wasim GO! Who da man ? Wasim da Man ! Good to hear someone speak out so clearly.:14:

(btw I'm pretty sure Boycs said the 2 W's were so good "... they could bowl our lot out with oranges!" And Bumble said at the time , you could give Wasim a kino and he could make it reverse swing.

As "Sinjin" (NOT Surjit) used to say to the "Coopers" on Goodness Gracious Me : " That's fruity old boy!" :D

[Amjid Javed]

Orange my friend, not the tomato...are U sure you were not thinking of Dan Quayle rather than Boycott, when you said 'Tomato':D

who cares orange, apple, tomato, plum, peach... wasim and waqar cud have bowled england out with a golf ball or even a football... :14:

[Imran_The Man!]

who cares orange, apple, tomato, plum, peach... wasim and waqar cud have bowled england out with a golf ball or even a football... :14:

Quite right AJ :19:

[Somali Pirate]

oh God this issue has been done to death.Enough already!

[anwarkhan1610]

zaf1986, as I recall, Pakistan beat Australia somewhere in the mid-90s in Pakistan, I remember Pakistan beating Australia on the basis of a last wicket stand with Inzamam at the crease.

As for Wasim and Waqar, they should both be apologising to the nation, apart from Wasim's role in match-fixing, they both were stupid enough to teach Gough, Simon Jones and Flintoff how to RS. It seems that they had no sense at all. What kind of a bunch of idiots would teach the nation who insulted their achievements the secrets of how to do what they did ?

IT SEEMS THE ONLY PEOPLE THEY DIDN'T TEACH HOW TO RS ARE THE PAKISTAN BOWLERS.

It's obvious that the ***** knew it wasn't cheating and just had sour grapes over the 92 world cup. In addition, they put the two Ws on the defensive by calling it cheating, they then showed everyone how to do it to get away from the allegations of cheating. Had I been in charge of the team, I would have told the ECB to F.OFF and cancelled the tour after the allegations started, I then would have sued the papers concerned.

[Edit by Mods: This is inappropriate stuff for this board - Easy with the language and your anecdotes pls]

On the subject of England's performance on the issue of RS, I think they were better than the two Ws. They had FAR more control, tactical nous, greater bounce and bowled consistently quick, something Wasim in particular refused to do, thinking he could bowl his county-standard trundlers to top-class batsman and take them out. In fact, he barely had a bunny his whole career, that is poor for a top-class fast bowler.

[Imran_The Man!]

zaf1986, as I recall, Pakistan beat Australia somewhere in the mid-90s in Pakistan, I remember Pakistan beating Australia on the basis of a last wicket stand with Inzamam at the crease.

As for Wasim and Waqar, they should both be apologising to the nation, apart from Wasim's role in match-fixing, they both were stupid enough to teach Gough, Simon Jones and Flintoff how to RS. It seems that they had no sense at all. What kind of a bunch of idiots would teach the nation who insulted their achievements the secrets of how to do what they did ?

IT SEEMS THE ONLY PEOPLE THEY DIDN'T TEACH HOW TO RS ARE THE PAKISTAN BOWLERS.

It's obvious that the ***** knew it wasn't cheating and just had sour grapes over the 92 world cup. In addition, they put the two Ws on the defensive by calling it cheating, they then showed everyone how to do it to get away from the allegations of cheating. Had I been in charge of the team, I would have told the ECB to F.OFF and cancelled the tour after the allegations started, I then would have sued the papers concerned.

Botham is a low-life who is hated even by Nasser Hussain, he says one thing one minute in a meeting and then says something else in public. This muppet shaved off Boycott's pubes while on tour, chucked his bed out of a window, shagged some carnival quen in the Windies and claimed he hadn't taken drugs and then said he had.

On the subject of England's performance on the issue of RS, I think they were better than the two Ws. They had FAR more control, tactical nous, greater bounce and bowled consistently quick, something Wasim in particular refused to do, thinking he could bowl his county-standard trundlers to top-class batsman and take them out. In fact, he barely had a bunny his whole career, that is poor for a top-class fast bowler.

Dude, you are talking so much rubbish there, regarding the two W's (and believe me, I'm not Waqar's biggest fan, speaking of him as a person, not a bowler). I won't even bother to argue with you, I can see would be wasting my breath.

bw, what colour is the sky on your planet ?

[Saj]

Al I can say is that anwar khan't have seen too much of Wasim and Waqar in their prime.

Well said Wasim Akram. When the 2 W's were perfecting the art of reverse swing it was called cheating, then when Gough did it, it suddenly became reverse swing.

The commentators, the cameramen and the press were the ringleaders in this witchunt against the Pak bowlers. The commentators including Benaud were constantly dropping inuendos in their commentary about how the old ball suddenly began to reverse. The cameramen were instructed by the broadcasters to zoom in wherever possible when the Pak fielders were shining the ball, yet when England were in the field the cameras did not zoom in on them.

The press, especially as I recall the Daily Mirror were very hostile towards Wasim and Waqar and were constantly publishing accusations against them. Rather than just accepting they were beaten by a better team containing 2 of the all time great bowlers, they instead tried to make excuses for their own team's incompetence.

I have the whole of the 90s series' when Pak toured England twice on video - it really is awesome viewing.

[zushy_786]

MIG i know old age is catching up with you :P BUT i think Nauman has already dealt with that thing

It's still good though that Mig gave him a piece of his mind :P.....Thanks Migsy :)

[MIG]

Sorry guys ! - have now cleaned up this thread so that we can talk some sense !

Message to Captain of ICF Losers Cricket Club ( ICFLCC): Stop sending your goons accross the border matey - its getting boring !

[Monsee]

Originally Posted by Geordie Ahmed
MIG i know old age is catching up with you :P BUT i think Nauman has already dealt with that thin






I didn't even say anything Miggy Granpa:D

[MIG]

Jeetay Raho Beta!

[Monsee]

Jeetay Raho Beta!


Dada Abbu don't forget me on your will:P

[Aurangzeb]

i agree it was kind of stupid for wasim and waqar to teach these players how to rs...i think even miandad mentioned once that these two should stop sharing trade secrets with everyone else...wasim does it more so than waqar...someone should calm him down...he wants to be a mentor to everybody...

[MIG]

I think its OK - what I find troubling is that our guys cant learn or apply this knowledge more than others - why is that ?

[TaZ]

Saj
PLEASE PLEASE can we get to somehow see your pak -eng 90s tours!?????? Its been ages and would be awesome to relive that magic

[Easa]

loook, pakistan bowlers ie: mohammad sami, akhtar, are arrogant and probably dont even want to lear reverse swing at the moment they can only swing it in/

[MWH]

Interesting how BBC Sport hasn't put this comment by Wasim on their website yet. I don't think its a case of them not having heard it as usually they are pretty quick to pick up comments by Wasim and other leading players, especially when it concerns a high-profile series against England.

Looks like they want to avoid the subject, ahead of the upcoming tour.

Incidentally, BBC were the broadcasters of the Pak tour to Eng in 92, when the tv cameras seemed to be on a mission to find some sort of evidence of wrong-doing by the Pak fielders.

[Hussain]

just wait till the England comes to Pakistan this winter

we ll give them a taste of their own waste

[Hash]

all of the English media are ignoring this statement by Wasim.

Other than BBC, ceefax usually report this sort of stuff quite quickly. For example they reported on the fast bowlers camp and on Woolmer's comments that 'Pakistan are relishing the England challenge'. But for some reason they have COMPLETELY ignored this

[Imran_The Man!]

Interesting how BBC Sport hasn't put this comment by Wasim on their website yet. I don't think its a case of them not having heard it as usually they are pretty quick to pick up comments by Wasim and other leading players, especially when it concerns a high-profile series against England.

Looks like they want to avoid the subject, ahead of the upcoming tour.

Incidentally, BBC were the broadcasters of the Pak tour to Eng in 92, when the tv cameras seemed to be on a mission to find some sort of evidence of wrong-doing by the Pak fielders.


And now Cricinfo has already removed the story from it's front page as well. I think you're right, I think they want to keep things nicey-nicey b4 the tour , which is understandable.

Well, it's been said now, and out in the open at least, so well done again Wasim.

[Fessal]

About time someone like Wasim spoke up and made a noise. Credit for England winning the Ashes but there are obvious reasons why some of us 'hate' the poms media and old farts like Bootha and Lamb.
Anyway I did send the ECB, England Cricket Team, Sky, BBC, Cricinfo etc an email highlighting this and did demand an apology. Non of them apart from the ECB replied, but only one line or so saying thankyou for your view and your email has been noted :12:

Anyway.. I hope any of Wasim, Waqar, Sohail, Imran and Sarfraz etc are commentating for sky during the winter series and next year so they could bring this up and have a go at Bootha and that tw@t Willis etc.

[Monsee]

Anyway I did send the ECB, England Cricket Team, Sky, BBC, Cricinfo etc an email highlighting this and did demand an apology. Non of them apart from the ECB replied, but only one line or so saying thankyou for your view and your email has been noted :12:


HaHaHa, I was just about to suggest that course of action to you...pretty soon you will have your email address on the blocked list of all English Cricket related media outlets

They might even try to get a restraining order against you from the court:))) :))

[Fessal]

:))) haha..well at least they let my emails get on air regarding other teams and players like courtney walsh one.;-)

The thing is if I met Bootha ever I would slap him one and have a scrap with him.:12:

[Fessal]

HaHaHa, I was just about to suggest that course of action to you...pretty soon you will have your email address on the blocked list of all English Cricket related media outlets

They might even try to get a restraining order against you from the court:))) :))

Bootha might try getting a restraining order. The hypocrisy and cheek of the man who now says Pak is a gr8 country and sent his mother in law with him in 2000 tour,. He'll be going again with sky and we all know its for money only.

BTW wasim akram once saidin 1987 that the word bootham is like a swear in Pak but seems was and us paks are forgiving quickly..but i will never forget.

[Monsee]

Bootha might try getting a restraining order. The hypocrisy and cheek of the man who now says Pak is a gr8 country and sent his mother in law with him in 2000 tour,. He'll be going again with sky and we all know its for money only.

BTW wasim akram once saidin 1987 that the word bootham is like a swear in Pak but seems was and us paks are forgiving quickly..but i will never forget.



Same here...he has changed his views when it was for his own good i.e. his commentary assignment that brought him money by touring Pakistan

He is a Hypocrite of the highest order and a racist...Imran Khan gave him such a spanking, on and off the field, that he will never forget the name Khan:D

[Kashif]

I would like to know Bob's view on the whole 1992 episode.

[zaf1986]

Imran Khan gave him such a spanking, on and off the field, that he will never forget the name Khan
Yep, he can only resort to low level insults in biography....mota pagal :P

[Somali Pirate]

It seems miggy has cleaned up the thread.Warning to MIG...bro it won't be the last time we see the clowns from ICF.


So funny that dajjal fellow.He just got registered and went after akram from post 1.Even in the irshad thread he was cussing wasim.

Some loser who had the gall to come here and thrash the great man's achievements which the fool will never accomplish in his sorry sad life time.


The thing that made me smile the most was when he said i made up that 35% of wasim wickets were tail enders wheras the rest were top order and middle order batsmen.He then said wasim' mom performance was of no use in aus coz the series was over.When in fact it was the first test.And the biggest lie of all.Wasim was never no1 in world rankings in his career.:))

What a performance.

[dan hudson]

Which particular part of England does he think should be apologising?

Asking the whole of 'England' to do so is perhaps a tad unnecessary.

[Saj]

Thanks MIG for cleaning up the thread. In future can I just ask you guys to ignore such fools and let the mods deal with it - thanks.

Botham has a reason for not liking Asians too much, well lets just say its a "family issue". My parents dont live too far from Botham and I'm not prepared to comment on it any further.

As for those of you mentioning getting the 90s videos onto a pc, well I have them all on video but wouldnt know how to put them onto a pc.

[Saj]

:) lol Dan.


nice to see you on PP again mate.

I think Wasim is referring to the part of England known as the "gutter press".

[dan hudson]

Hi Saj: I hope all is well with PP.

Ah, the beloved gutter press. Would that be the same bunch who after the 1st Ashes Test denounced this England side as a spineless bunch of losers and then proclaimed them as worldbeaters after they won the 2nd Test?

Nothing's sacred with them, especially opposing sportsmen who are doing rather well again our national sides...

[Saj]

all is well in PP land thanks Dan.

Yes thats the same gutter press that we are talking about. The very same individuals who take great pleasure in criticising some of British sports finest.

[dan hudson]

Is it too easy to just say: ignore them?

[Team Slayer]

welcome back Dan! congrats on the Ashes win :)

[Mercenary]

Which particular part of England does he think should be apologising?

Asking the whole of 'England' to do so is perhaps a tad unnecessary.

Nothing on a grand scale. I think it will suffice if Tony Blair and the Queen fly over to Islamabad and apologize to the entire 1992 and 1996 Pakistan squads, giving each of them a written apology to keep in a frame on their walls!

And a Duchy each for Wasim and Waqar.

[MIG]

I will tell you who I do want see apologise to the Ws... the Radio 5 cricket commentary with some oldie English fast bowler who kept on making these really stupid remarks about "how in our days, a bowler couldnt reverse swing the ball but the Paks are doing this now - I wonder what they know ( nod nod wink wink ) that we didnt know in those days" type comments !

Each of one of those people need to be strung up an at Mereweather tower ( Karachi !) and left to think about their comments !

[Imran_The Man!]

Spot on Miggy, reserve a few spaces on the tower for Booha, The Stewarts, and members of the gutter press as well. :D

Doesn't matter if they don't admit it, they made such a fuss about it in '92, majority of people will remember it, and NOW, the more they talk about RS, even the thickest popele will realise how Pak was getting them out.

They've embarassed themselves and been "hoisted by their own petard" :19:

( Doesn't mean the culprits should'nt be questioned about it at every opportunity, like when one of our PP bros emailed in when Courtney Walsh was commentating during this years WI, and was put on the spot about 3rd test of the 2000 tour. :14: )

[Long_Live_Pakistan]

orginally posted by anwarkhan1610

On the subject of England's performance on the issue of RS, I think they were better than the two Ws. They had FAR more control, tactical nous, greater bounce and bowled consistently quick, something Wasim in particular refused to do, thinking he could bowl his county-standard trundlers to top-class batsman and take them out. In fact, he barely had a bunny his whole career, that is poor for a top-class fast bowler.[/QUOTE]

without even reading hte next responce to your comments...hatts off to you
have u been smoking crack recently?????????
***..........that is really really something special to read.....
wake up....
everyone is entitled for thier opinion.....but that is really too much...tooo mcuh....

and yes....tat cabbie,,i think said it all to Toni.....when we do it is cheating, when you do it, it is RS.....

and i wonder if in the pak tour, SJ and AF dont find any RS, and it wud become a cheating again, from skill n art....
:13:

[Fessal]

I just want mainly bootha and lamb to apologise in public and some other gutter press people and the likes of mark nicholas and bob willis.

People like Boycott, atherton, gower and all can take a bow.

[TaZ]

Saj
PLEASE PLEASE can we get to somehow see your pak -eng 90s tours!?????? Its been ages and would be awesome to relive that magic

[Hash]

I have 1992 test series and 1996 test series on video.

I have ABSOLUTELY NO IDEA how to put it on here and don't even think about trying to explain it because I wont have a clue.

Ian Botham, Alan Lamb, The Daily Mirror......anyone who accused Pakistan of cheating should get down on their hands and knees and beg for forgiveness.