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  1. #1
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    Most Test centuries by Non Asian in Asia (Graph)

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    Eat, Sleep, Back The Team....Repeat!

  2. #2
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    Cook is a fantastic player but second to Warner. Match-winners over match-savers.

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by ChachaCricket View Post
    Cook is a fantastic player but second to Warner. Match-winners over match-savers.
    Warner was bullied in India to no end.

    Cook has done well everywhere.

  4. #4
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    Where is Ricky Ponting in this list?

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by freelance_cricketer View Post
    Warner was bullied in India to no end.

    Cook has done well everywhere.
    Warner hasn't played in India since his transformation.

  6. #6
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    *

    ..nd Viv Richards?

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by ChachaCricket View Post
    Warner hasn't played in India since his transformation.
    He won't do well. He kept getting bowled by Kumar on the last tour, didn't even make it to Ashwin and the spin attack.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Varun View Post
    He won't do well. He kept getting bowled by Kumar on the last tour, didn't even make it to Ashwin and the spin attack.
    He did well against Yasir and Babar. India is a tougher tour because of the SG ball but I expect him to score.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by ChachaCricket View Post
    He did well against Yasir and Babar. India is a tougher tour because of the SG ball but I expect him to score.
    He has to prove so in the next tour then. In the meantime, don't count your chickens before they hatch and say that he's transformed after pounding a few runs on Australian drop-ins.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Varun View Post
    He has to prove so in the next tour then. In the meantime, don't count your chickens before they hatch and say that he's transformed after pounding a few runs on Australian drop-ins.
    543 runs in South Africa in 3 matches, 400+ in England's Ashes, 238 in UAE in 2 matches.

    Don't speak on things you know nothing about.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by ChachaCricket View Post
    Warner hasn't played in India since his transformation.
    He played India in Australia after transformation.

    Averaged 30 in Australia in our last tour in 2014/2015 in the games Ashwin played.

    On COMPLETE PATTAS.

    3 games. 6 innings. 3 to Ashwin. 2 times to Yadav. 1 to Ishant.

    http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/eng...g;view=innings

    Would have been DESTROYED in India.

    Cook wins in Asia. By a mile.
    Last edited by sensible-indian-fan; 15th October 2015 at 16:37.


    I am not one of you. I never was. I am not one of them either.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by sensible-indian-fan View Post
    He played India in Australia after transformation.

    Averaged 30 in Australia in our last tour in 2014/2015 in the games Ashwin played.

    On COMPLETE PATTAS.

    3 games.

    Would have been CLOBBERED in India.

    3 to Ashwin. 2 times to Yadav. 1 to Ishant.

    Cook wins in Asia. By a mile.
    His transformation started after the 2013 Ashes tour. He toured India as a raw opener.

    I wasn't comparing them in Asia only but their overall impact. And I clarified why I prefer Warner.

  13. #13
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    Happy for Cook.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by freelance_cricketer View Post
    Where is Ricky Ponting in this list?
    Quote Originally Posted by freelance_cricketer View Post
    *

    ..nd Viv Richards?
    Ricky = 5
    Sir Viv = 4


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  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by ChachaCricket View Post
    His transformation started after the 2013 Ashes tour. He toured India as a raw opener.

    I wasn't comparing them in Asia only but their overall impact. And I clarified why I prefer Warner.
    Yes but those are stats in Australia after his 2013 transformation.

    Against spin...he has that Watson like effect. Looks a million bucks but gets out.

    Got your main point from your first post itself.


    I am not one of you. I never was. I am not one of them either.

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by sensible-indian-fan View Post
    Yes but those are stats in Australia after his 2013 transformation.

    Against spin...he has that Watson like effect. Looks a million bucks but gets out.

    Got your main point from your first post itself.
    I'm not gonna judge based on stats in Australia. If he fails in India, I'll be the first to admit it.

  17. #17
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    Second to Warner , someone who lacks the fundamental skill and fight of a Test batsman - battling it out for long periods of time, his inability to occupy the crease was a big problem for Australia in the Ashes.

    No opener of the last 10 years is even comparable to Cookie Monster, except for Smith who is obviously better at this point, but the former has the time on his side to overtake him.

    Warner can compete if he conquers England in England and India in India like Cookie Monster, so far the highlight of his career is runs in South Africa over three Tests.

    He has failed in India, England and even on the dry and sticky wickets of the Caribbean. He did well in the UAE but based on one innings only.

    To put them in same sentence as of today is frankly a joke.

    I think both represent too extremes - Warner is the most overrated non-Pakistani cricketer on PakPassion, while Cookie Monster is definitely the most underrated.

  18. #18
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    cook is very underrated. he is way better than warner.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by ChachaCricket View Post
    I'm not gonna judge based on stats in Australia. If he fails in India, I'll be the first to admit it.
    Bhai let it go. There's a difference of class between Cook n him. Former has done well everywhere. Stop getting impressed by a few brisk knocks.


    At the end of a stressful, depressing day, a dose of cricket is what can cheer us up.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hawkeye View Post
    Bhai let it go. There's a difference of class between Cook n him. Former has done well everywhere. Stop getting impressed by a few brisk knocks.
    Lol Few brisk knocks? hahaha 12 hundreds(8 of them in wins), 19 fifties(10 in wins) in 43 matches.

    Dude's a match winner. Cook never win matches like him and similarly he can't save matches like Cook.

    Like I said I prefer match-winners over match-savers. I can't help it if some people are aroused by tuktuk, it's their personal choice.

  21. #21
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    It will be interesting to see hundreds per test innings played in Asia for the top 5 hundred getters in addition to the total centuries.

  22. #22
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    My vote for Allan Border

    During Border's period Pakistan & india have had their best bowling attacks & the contributions from home umpires were also there so if to look at stats he might not be the best but in quality he was the best.

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by ChachaCricket View Post
    Cook is a fantastic player but second to Warner. Match-winners over match-savers.
    Warner is a good shot-player on flat decks but is exposed against the swinging, seaming or turning ball.

    Cook has a problem against quick stuff outside off-stump when the ball is moving but he is a very good player of spin.

    I would argue that matches are not won by Warner anyway, because he does not really go on far past 100. You want a big innings.
    Last edited by Robert; 16th October 2015 at 05:20.

  24. #24
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    Kallis couldn't score a hundred in SL v Murali.

  25. #25
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    Warner is pretty much the Aussie version of Sehwag. Will win you matches on flat beds because he dominates opposition bowling from the beginning. I don't think he's comparable to Cook yet but having an explosive opener even in tests has its merits. Graeme Smith still better than either of them


    'There's a lady who's sure all that glitters is gold'

  26. #26
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    I think Amla has an amazing record overseas from around 2009.

  27. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robert View Post
    Warner is a good shot-player on flat decks but is exposed against the swinging, seaming or turning ball.

    Cook has a problem against quick stuff outside off-stump when the ball is moving but he is a very good player of spin.

    I would argue that matches are not won by Warner anyway, because he does not really go on far past 100. You want a big innings.
    Yes Warner can't play swing, seam or turn but miraculously scored 400+ runs in the Ashes. 6-7 of his dismissals were Warner getting himself out against Moeen or playing that stupid flick shot trying to run it down to fine leg. About 2-3 were due to swing and seam lol.

    Can't play turn but somehow scored a ton against Yasir and Babar. He's yet to face India since tightening up his defense.

    I would argue when Warner scores a ton there is no way back for the opposition to come back into the game and they play to draw the game from day 1. You know why I would argue that? Because I watched most of his tons and that's exactly what happened.

  28. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by ChachaCricket View Post
    Yes Warner can't play swing, seam or turn but miraculously scored 400+ runs in the Ashes. 6-7 of his dismissals were Warner getting himself out against Moeen or playing that stupid flick shot trying to run it down to fine leg. About 2-3 were due to swing and seam lol.

    Can't play turn but somehow scored a ton against Yasir and Babar. He's yet to face India since tightening up his defense.

    I would argue when Warner scores a ton there is no way back for the opposition to come back into the game and they play to draw the game from day 1. You know why I would argue that? Because I watched most of his tons and that's exactly what happened.
    Hes been a bit exposed with his weakness to a shortish ball at his rib cage though to be honest. Fire one in there every so often and it won't take long for him to send one flying sky high.

  29. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sam1 View Post
    Hes been a bit exposed with his weakness to a shortish ball at his rib cage though to be honest. Fire one in there every so often and it won't take long for him to send one flying sky high.
    Try bowling there in Australia and he'd pull you for six. It was more an instinctive problem in England.

    England put two fielders back at fine leg and square of the wicket to take the aerial shot away which was a good ploy. He was pulling that ball quite easily for singles and naturally being such an aggressive player instinct would take over and he'd be caught inbetween running it down. Only one of his dismissals was actually getting bounced out, against Finn IIRC.

    If Warner has a problem, it's temperament. But considering where he started, he's improved massively and being such a hard worker I don't see why he wouldn't improve further.
    Last edited by ChachaCricket; 16th October 2015 at 06:31.

  30. #30
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    Cook has performed everywhere.he has a near bradmanseque record in asia.it is criminal to rate him anything less than modern great.

  31. #31
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    Amla will give Cook a run for his money in Asia. He will feast on these Indian bowlers in Tests.


    "You come at the King. You best not miss."

  32. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by freelance_cricketer View Post
    Where is Ricky Ponting in this list?
    Ponting was a flop player in Asia. He avgs. 23 in India. If say Sachin avgd. in mid 20s in Aust, people would have given him a lot of flak but surprised no one brings Ponting's credentials in Asia. This is the reason I always rate Ponting a notch below Sachin/Lara and put him on par with Dravid/Kallis.

    Also check this funny irony, Sehwag avgs 40 in Aust but he is a FTB. Ponting avgs 23 in India but he is an ATG

    Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk

  33. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Indian_Supporter View Post
    Ponting was a flop player in Asia. He avgs. 23 in India. If say Sachin avgd. in mid 20s in Aust, people would have given him a lot of flak but surprised no one brings Ponting's credentials in Asia. This is the reason I always rate Ponting a notch below Sachin/Lara and put him on par with Dravid/Kallis.

    Also check this funny irony, Sehwag avgs 40 in Aust but he is a FTB. Ponting avgs 23 in India but he is an ATG

    Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk
    Sehwag failed in SA,NZ and Eng. Averages in his 20's there.

    Yes Ponting was bad in India, but he had other strengths that SRT/Lara didnt. I would rate him ahead of Dravid.

  34. #34
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    Warner's best innings by balls count is 197 IIRC. But Cook is going to bat for 197 overs it seems.


    Nothing

  35. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Indian_Supporter View Post
    Ponting was a flop player in Asia. He avgs. 23 in India. If say Sachin avgd. in mid 20s in Aust, people would have given him a lot of flak but surprised no one brings Ponting's credentials in Asia. This is the reason I always rate Ponting a notch below Sachin/Lara and put him on par with Dravid/Kallis.

    Also check this funny irony, Sehwag avgs 40 in Aust but he is a FTB. Ponting avgs 23 in India but he is an ATG

    Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk
    Unfortunately for you, Asia is not equal to India.

    Ponting has done very well in Bangladesh, Pakistan, UAE and Sri Lanka. His overall Asian average is 42.

    And cricket is over stats, anyone who knows cricket can see Ponting was a very very good player of spin.

    His last ODI kock in Asia, the quarter final innings vs India was played on a hell of a spinning track and he probably played the innings of the world cup scoring a hundred.

  36. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by ChachaCricket View Post
    Cook is a fantastic player but second to Warner. Match-winners over match-savers.
    Over 60% of Cook's Test centuries have come in matches that England have won.

    Sounds like a match-winner to me.

  37. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by James View Post
    Over 60% of Cook's Test centuries have come in matches that England have won.

    Sounds like a match-winner to me.
    14 out of 28 including this one. 15 out of 44 50s.

  38. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by ChachaCricket View Post
    Yes Warner can't play swing, seam or turn but miraculously scored 400+ runs in the Ashes. 6-7 of his dismissals were Warner getting himself out against Moeen or playing that stupid flick shot trying to run it down to fine leg. About 2-3 were due to swing and seam lol.
    400 runs in five tests is a good return bu three of those matches were on Aussie-style flatties offering no seam and turn, in warm days without much humidity to assist swing. So the FTB tag stands.

    Plus, no long innings which were significant in forcing wins.

    Cook on the other hand plays innings which result in wins and defensive shutouts too.

  39. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robert View Post
    400 runs in five tests is a good return bu three of those matches were on Aussie-style flatties offering no seam and turn, in warm days without much humidity to assist swing. So the FTB tag stands.

    Plus, no long innings which were significant in forcing wins.

    Cook on the other hand plays innings which result in wins and defensive shutouts too.
    His 85 in the 5th test was against a potent opening spell where the ball swung wildly beating the bat countless times. It was a wonderful display of excellent technique from Warner and Rogers. The 100+ opening stand laid the platform for Smith to score his 100 whom otherwise would've been back in the pavilion had Warner or Rogers been dismissed cheaply. Australia would've bundled for 250 again and England would've won 4-1.

    I watched all 5 matches, the only flat pitch was Lords. It seamed in every other match. And I've never seen the Dukes ball swing so wildly throughout a series in the last 10 years. I don't know what Ashes you were watching.

    Warner outscored Cook in his own backyard so if the former is an FTB then what does that make Cook? Lol. And that's game ladies and gentlemen.

  40. #40
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    Not sure how this became warner vs cook, both have their place in test cricket as far as i can see but they really are too different to be comparable, from an aussie pov i would kill to have cook when going to asia i can say that for sure, you simply need somebody in the top 3 who can bat 3+ sessions if you are going to stay alive in a series in asia and we just don't have that.

    The games you don't lose in asia are as vital as the ones you win.

  41. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by trogger View Post
    Not sure how this became warner vs cook, both have their place in test cricket as far as i can see but they really are too different to be comparable, from an aussie pov i would kill to have cook when going to asia i can say that for sure, you simply need somebody in the top 3 who can bat 3+ sessions if you are going to stay alive in a series in asia and we just don't have that.

    The games you don't lose in asia are as vital as the ones you win.
    Bancroft did well in the recent Indian tour. He'd be an ideal partner for Warner. Australia should fast track him, no point wasting time on TTFs.

  42. #42
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    Most centuries by an overseas player in India now.

    The records keep on coming for Cook. What an incredible Test opener.

  43. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mamoon View Post
    Most centuries by an overseas player in India now.

    The records keep on coming for Cook. What an incredible Test opener.
    Yes he's incredible. However, the easy pitches he's mostly got has helped the cause.

    In the UAE too, where he scored a double was a lifeless pitch. Anyways, not taking credit away from his ability to play spin, which is one of the better ones in the world right now.


    At the end of a stressful, depressing day, a dose of cricket is what can cheer us up.

  44. #44
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    One of the great players of the modern era.

  45. #45
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    Cook is not the ideal opener. He's great against spin but mediocre against pace and someone like that shouldn't be opening the batting outside the subcontinent.


    لَا إِلٰهَ إِلَّا الله مُحَمَّدٌ رَسُولُ الله

  46. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by James View Post
    One of the great players of the modern era.
    Agreed. Love to see Cook haters served humble pies time after time. People were so angry with him leading up to our English tour because of the comments he made on Amir that he'd have to deal with crowd reactions, which was right.

    You'd see folks saying "hope Amir demolishes him" and other things. But that series was the most fluent I've seen him play in a while.

    Same thing here.

    On the path to greatness.

  47. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bilal7 View Post
    Cook is not the ideal opener. He's great against spin but mediocre against pace and someone like that shouldn't be opening the batting outside the subcontinent.
    Lmao what?

    Is this guy for real? Did you type this out with a straight face?

  48. #48
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    Cook's pretty much the ideal test opener. And his style of cautious batting is perfect for Asian conditions.

  49. #49
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    Champion opener. Can still remember waking up to watch his debut.

    Should finish his career with close to 40 centuries at least. In this era he's one of the cricketers I respect the most. Went through a difficult period as captain where the critiscm he was getting was a joke, also in 2010 he survived a lean patch and got that century for vs us and never looked back.

    A strong chracter and a good human being. Should finish his career as an atg opener.

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    Hope he can carry on for the next 5 years and get 15K test runs.

    Deserves it.

  51. #51
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    One of the best non Asian opener for Asian conditions.

  52. #52
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    Cook > SRT in Tests.


    At the end of a stressful, depressing day, a dose of cricket is what can cheer us up.

  53. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bilal7 View Post
    Cook is not the ideal opener. He's great against spin but mediocre against pace and someone like that shouldn't be opening the batting outside the subcontinent.
    Look at his record and stats, then decide if he's not an ideal opener.



  54. #54
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    Most Test runs by a non-Asian batsman in Asia - Alastair Cook 2492

    Most Test 100s by a non-Asian batsman in Asia - Alastair Cook 9



  55. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hawkeye View Post
    Yes he's incredible. However, the easy pitches he's mostly got has helped the cause.

    In the UAE too, where he scored a double was a lifeless pitch. Anyways, not taking credit away from his ability to play spin, which is one of the better ones in the world right now.
    Even most Asian batsmen struggle for consistency on rank turners. Unblemished records are rare to find.

  56. #56
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    He's an ATG Test opener, well ahead of other openers of his time. Warner cannot be compared with him who is a walking wicket unless the pitches are roads.

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    Easily the best opener of our times. What a champion player.

    Always been a fan of him. #ATG


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  58. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by Slog View Post
    Lmao what?

    Is this guy for real? Did you type this out with a straight face?
    Bilal may have exaggerated it like he always does.

    But Cook is actually vulnerable against quality pacers just around the off stump. I know it's a clichéd statement for any batsman, but he actually pokes his bat out a lot outside off against quality pacers.

  59. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by street cricketer View Post
    Bilal may have exaggerated it like he always does.

    But Cook is actually vulnerable against quality pacers just around the off stump. I know it's a clichéd statement for any batsman, but he actually pokes his bat out a lot outside off against quality pacers.
    Who do you rate more in Tests? Cook / SRT?


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  60. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hawkeye View Post
    Who do you rate more in Tests? Cook / SRT?
    Lol not even a comparison.

    I rate Amla better than Cook.

  61. #61
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    10,000+ runs, 30 centuries and won his team series in India and Australia with his batting, while leading them to a series win as captain in South Africa.

    All of this before the age of 32. What a career he has had, and he still has plenty of years left.

  62. #62
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    A simply outstanding record in Asia from Alastair Cook, one of their best ever players of spin.

  63. #63
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    ,

    I decided to see if Cook's played more games than others on the list. Here are the stats of batsmen relative to number of games played in Asia, and minus minnows. Ponting comes out looking the worse.

    Cook

    Number of innings in Asia minus minnows: 39
    Average: 57
    Number of tons: 7
    Innings per ton: 5.5

    Viv

    Number of innings in Asia minus minnows: 38
    Average: 44
    Number of tons: 4
    Innings per ton: 9.5

    Border

    Number of innings in Asia minus minnows: 39
    Average: 54
    Number of tons: 6
    Innings per ton: 6.5

    Amla

    Number of innings in Asia minus minnows: 35
    Average: 54
    Number of tons: 7
    Innings per ton: 5


    Kallis

    Number of innings in Asia minus minnows: 41
    Average: 57
    Number of tons: 8
    Innings per ton: 5.1

    Lara

    Number of innings in Asia minus minnows: 26
    Average: 58.8
    Number of tons: 5
    Innings per ton: 5.2


    Ponting

    Number of innings in Asia minus minnows: 45
    Average: 39
    Number of tons: 4
    Innings per ton: 11.25


    I expect Cook to hit one or two more tons by the time this latest series is over.

  64. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by Anchorman View Post
    Amla will give Cook a run for his money in Asia. He will feast on these Indian bowlers in Tests.
    Quote Originally Posted by PB69 View Post
    I think Amla has an amazing record overseas from around 2009.
    AB too need a mention here

    AB avg's 54 with around 1750 runs in asia n amla avg's 52 with 1800

    Last series they both batted in one of the toughest indian wicket ever,thats slightly dropped their reputation though

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    Quote Originally Posted by Slog View Post
    Lmao what?

    Is this guy for real? Did you type this out with a straight face?
    He averages in the low 30s in New Zealand and South Africa and his failures against genuine pace are well documented. Has been inconsistent against swing and seam as well.


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    Quote Originally Posted by TestMatch View Post
    I decided to see if Cook's played more games than others on the list. Here are the stats of batsmen relative to number of games played in Asia, and minus minnows. Ponting comes out looking the worse.

    Cook

    Number of innings in Asia minus minnows: 39
    Average: 57
    Number of tons: 7
    Innings per ton: 5.5

    Viv

    Number of innings in Asia minus minnows: 38
    Average: 44
    Number of tons: 4
    Innings per ton: 9.5

    Border

    Number of innings in Asia minus minnows: 39
    Average: 54
    Number of tons: 6
    Innings per ton: 6.5

    Amla

    Number of innings in Asia minus minnows: 35
    Average: 54
    Number of tons: 7
    Innings per ton: 5


    Kallis

    Number of innings in Asia minus minnows: 41
    Average: 57
    Number of tons: 8
    Innings per ton: 5.1

    Lara

    Number of innings in Asia minus minnows: 26
    Average: 58.8
    Number of tons: 5
    Innings per ton: 5.2


    Ponting

    Number of innings in Asia minus minnows: 45
    Average: 39
    Number of tons: 4
    Innings per ton: 11.25


    I expect Cook to hit one or two more tons by the time this latest series is over.
    Quote Originally Posted by Mamoon View Post
    10,000+ runs, 30 centuries and won his team series in India and Australia with his batting, while leading them to a series win as captain in South Africa.

    All of this before the age of 32. What a career he has had, and he still has plenty of years left.
    Quote Originally Posted by Saj View Post
    Look at his record and stats, then decide if he's not an ideal opener.
    Quote Originally Posted by Suleiman View Post
    Agreed. Love to see Cook haters served humble pies time after time. People were so angry with him leading up to our English tour because of the comments he made on Amir that he'd have to deal with crowd reactions, which was right.

    You'd see folks saying "hope Amir demolishes him" and other things. But that series was the most fluent I've seen him play in a while.

    Same thing here.

    On the path to greatness.
    IMO Cook is overrated - not as an opener but as a batsman in general.

    His stats are good but not great by any means - esp his average of 47.12 which is even below KP's test average.

    Now I understand that cricket is not played on Excel but when his contemporaries have played just as many good knocks and some, in fact, even better - it is hard to argue Cook's case for being an ATG.

    Not in Sachin, Lara, Ponting, Kallis or Sanga's category for sure. His less than stellar ODI record also pushes him down a notch.

    Certainly a modern day great opener but not ATG imo. Many of his records are now based on longevity...

  67. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by msb314 View Post
    IMO Cook is overrated - not as an opener but as a batsman in general.

    His stats are good but not great by any means - esp his average of 47.12 which is even below KP's test average.

    Now I understand that cricket is not played on Excel but when his contemporaries have played just as many good knocks and some, in fact, even better - it is hard to argue Cook's case for being an ATG.

    Not in Sachin, Lara, Ponting, Kallis or Sanga's category for sure. His less than stellar ODI record also pushes him down a notch.

    Certainly a modern day great opener but not ATG imo. Many of his records are now based on longevity...
    Not many people rate him as an ATG, so you can't say he is overrated.

    An average of 47 is excellent for an opener, especially considering that he opens in England and has excellent stats all over the world.

  68. #68
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    He is a very good opener, easily the best since 2010. The comparison with Warner is ridiculous. Warner is nowhere near Cook at the moment. This said, Cook is not perfect either but he is still the best at the moment.

  69. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mamoon View Post
    Second to Warner , someone who lacks the fundamental skill and fight of a Test batsman - battling it out for long periods of time, his inability to occupy the crease was a big problem for Australia in the Ashes.

    No opener of the last 10 years is even comparable to Cookie Monster, except for Smith who is obviously better at this point, but the former has the time on his side to overtake him.

    Warner can compete if he conquers England in England and India in India like Cookie Monster, so far the highlight of his career is runs in South Africa over three Tests.

    He has failed in India, England and even on the dry and sticky wickets of the Caribbean. He did well in the UAE but based on one innings only.

    To put them in same sentence as of today is frankly a joke.

    I think both represent too extremes - Warner is the most overrated non-Pakistani cricketer on PakPassion, while Cookie Monster is definitely the most underrated.
    Taking a page from your book here.

    Since most of the fans from Asia care about ODI World Cup more than test cricket, therefore, Warner is rated higher than Cook because he was a part of 2015 World Cup winning team. On the other hand Cook's legacy is getting dropped right before the World Cup because he was not good enough to be on the team.

  70. #70
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    In Asia it's a no-contest, Cook by far over Warner.

    Outside of Asia I would pick Warner everywhere.


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  71. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by The_Odd_One View Post
    Taking a page from your book here.

    Since most of the fans from Asia care about ODI World Cup more than test cricket, therefore, Warner is rated higher than Cook because he was a part of 2015 World Cup winning team. On the other hand Cook's legacy is getting dropped right before the World Cup because he was not good enough to be on the team.
    Your post is wrong on many accounts because you have misunderstood.

    The poster to whom I replied called Warner a better Test opener than Cook, which I'd absolute nonsense.

    Across all formats, yes Warner is much better because Cook is only a Test player.

    In terms of legacies, even though Cook is a Test player only, he's well ahead of Warner at this point because he's an ATG Test opener while Warner hasn't achieved much yet.

    Even in Australia's World Cup triumph, Warner didn't have much of an impact except one innings vs a minnow.

    The Cook vs Warner debate is not the same as McGrath/Wasim vs Donald for instance, so it's not a leaf from my book.

    World Cup glory or success in Limited Overs doesn't transform from a decent player into a legend, but if you have two ATG players and one of them didn't do much in World Cups while the other help his team win, the latter is the one who is remembered most.

    Right now, Warner is a good player but not even an Australian great, while Cook is a modern day great.

    Comparing these two is like comparing Donald to Lee. While Lee played a role in helping his team to World Cup glory, he is still well below Donald, because the latter is an ATG while the former isn't.

  72. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pantani View Post
    In Asia it's a no-contest, Cook by far over Warner.

    Outside of Asia I would pick Warner everywhere.
    I would pick Warner only a proper flat track with pace and bounce. If there is some spin, swing or seam, he's useless.

    He's the biggest flat track bully in the world, but that's not necessarily a bad thing. It makes him the most dangerous match-winner on flat wickets and we get a lot of them. In some ways, he's like a poor man's Sehwag.

    Cook's attritional style is a bit of a hindrance on flat wickets, but he's a classical opener who just bats and bats for days.

  73. #73
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    His stats are good but not great by any means - esp his average of 47.12 which is even below KP's test average.
    But 47 is great for an opener. A couple more good years and he will rival Gavaskar.

  74. #74
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    What an amazing cricketer, Cook, deserves the status that he has achieved. Definitely a legend of the game and is only 32, unbelievable cricketer.

  75. #75
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    @msb314

    Average of 47 for an opener is as good as a 50+ average for a middle-order batsman. Compare the number of 50+ averaging openers in history to the number of 50+ averaging middle-order batsmen and you will get your answer.

    On top of that, he plays more than half of his Tests in England which is the toughest place to open, which is why his away average is actually higher than his home average.

    He is not overrated at all; he is a master batsman who is one of the best Test openers of all time, and perhaps the fittest cricketer too. He has played 130+ Tests in 10 years and is never injured and still manages to bat for longer periods than anyone else and has the best powers of concentration.

    Yes not playing much Limited Overs cricket has helped, but playing 130+ Tests in 10 years is no mean feat. His record in SA and NZ is poor, but everyone is allowed a bogey venue/team or two. He would definitely have had a 50+ career average if he was a number 3 or number 4, but he can still get there if he has a really big year again.

  76. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mamoon View Post
    @msb314

    Average of 47 for an opener is as good as a 50+ average for a middle-order batsman. Compare the number of 50+ averaging openers in history to the number of 50+ averaging middle-order batsmen and you will get your answer.

    On top of that, he plays more than half of his Tests in England which is the toughest place to open, which is why his away average is actually higher than his home average.

    He is not overrated at all; he is a master batsman who is one of the best Test openers of all time, and perhaps the fittest cricketer too. He has played 130+ Tests in 10 years and is never injured and still manages to bat for longer periods than anyone else and has the best powers of concentration.

    Yes not playing much Limited Overs cricket has helped, but playing 130+ Tests in 10 years is no mean feat. His record in SA and NZ is poor, but everyone is allowed a bogey venue/team or two. He would definitely have had a 50+ career average if he was a number 3 or number 4, but he can still get there if he has a really big year again.
    He doesn't play T20s and rarely plays ODIs. His fitness is excellent but his workload is low compared to others who play all 3 formats.

  77. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by ChachaCricket View Post
    His 85 in the 5th test was against a potent opening spell where the ball swung wildly beating the bat countless times. It was a wonderful display of excellent technique from Warner and Rogers. The 100+ opening stand laid the platform for Smith to score his 100 whom otherwise would've been back in the pavilion had Warner or Rogers been dismissed cheaply. Australia would've bundled for 250 again and England would've won 4-1.

    I watched all 5 matches, the only flat pitch was Lords. It seamed in every other match. And I've never seen the Dukes ball swing so wildly throughout a series in the last 10 years. I don't know what Ashes you were watching.

    Warner outscored Cook in his own backyard so if the former is an FTB then what does that make Cook? Lol. And that's game ladies and gentlemen.
    @Cheif Destroyer

    One year on and nothing has changed, looks like it is game, set and match the other way round. He was a disaster in Sri Lanka and has failed in the ongoing Test on the greenish pitch. He simply cannot score big unless it is a proper flat track.

    Also failed in NZ earlier this year (right after destroying them at home) where he was repeatedly found chasing wide deliveries with glued feet.

    Time to reconsider your opinion Chacha.

  78. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sachin136 View Post
    He doesn't play T20s and rarely plays ODIs. His fitness is excellent but his workload is low compared to others who play all 3 formats.

    Yes I have accounted for that already. However, 130+ Tests in 10 years is still incredible, especially when he has also faced the most number of deliveries in this time period by a massive margin. Of course it has a direct relationship with the number of matches he has played, but it says a lot about his fitness levels.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mamoon View Post
    I would pick Warner only a proper flat track with pace and bounce. If there is some spin, swing or seam, he's useless.

    He's the biggest flat track bully in the world, but that's not necessarily a bad thing. It makes him the most dangerous match-winner on flat wickets and we get a lot of them. In some ways, he's like a poor man's Sehwag.

    Cook's attritional style is a bit of a hindrance on flat wickets, but he's a classical opener who just bats and bats for days.
    That's generally what you get in Australia, and I think you're being unkind to Warner, he has played top knocks on grassy wickets before, like Hobart 2011. Also he has dominated in South Africa.

    Basically Cook wins in the northern hemisphere and Warner in the southern hemisphere.


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    how many ATGs exactly do people think there are in cricket these days? it seems people are calling every other guy a potential ATG. the title ATG needs to be reserved for the top 1-2% of the game, not everybody who averages 50+.

    cook is an ATG tho.

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