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  1. #321
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    Quote Originally Posted by shaz619 View Post
    This was my original post:


    Not sure what chances has anything to do with it, but minding your ignorance; my point stands, he didn't try and murder someone did he yet Stokes is getting the golden boy treatment. Pathetic really.
    Same strawman.

    Once again.... KP was pardoned at least twice for disruptive behaviour and reintegrated to the England side. It was only after upsetting his second skipper and second coach that he was finally given up on and dispensed with. So England were hardly "quick enough to decide whether or not to get rid of KP". Actually it took five years from his first transgression.

    England bent over backwards to keep him, really.

  2. #322
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    Quote Originally Posted by Convict View Post
    Nah.
    Stokes isn't fit to represent England in international sport until he actually serves a suspension. He is a violent thug.
    If the ECB want to condone that well it reflects incredibly poorly on the ECB.

    Nobody is complaining that its unfair that James Pattinson is missing and he is missing through injury while Stokes only missed games because he broke is hand belting the living daylights out of a guy who was backing away.
    Except he's been suspended for 2 Ashes tests and 2 ODIs so far?

  3. #323
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robert View Post
    Same strawman.

    Once again.... KP was pardoned at least twice for disruptive behaviour and reintegrated to the England side. It was only after upsetting his second skipper and second coach that he was finally given up on and dispensed with. So England were hardly "quick enough to decide whether or not to get rid of KP". Actually it took five years from his first transgression.

    England bent over backwards to keep him, really.
    Strawman from you repeatedly overlooking the original point regarding the fact that Stokes tried to kill someone and is getting the golden boy treatment yet KP is more evil and got what he deserved, that's disgusting to be honest and a very pro establishment mindset


    Ah, so this is what it feels like

  4. #324
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    I'm a KP fan who is barely over him being sacked by the mediocre likes of Strauss, but it's hard for me to stand up for KP when first he was texting opposition info about the team in and mocking his captain when SA toured. Then after his comeback, he was leaking info to the Oz dressing room.

    I wish he had been brought back after the double hundred against a university side, but he managed to hack off and alienate the likes of Cook who wanted him back after the SA affair before that.

    If I was captain Cook, and I had already put up with the SA affair before as a player, and still demanded that KP back after that, why the hell would I trust Kevin yet again?

    Stokes shouldn't be in cricket for a few years, but two wrong decisions don't add up to a correct one.
    Last edited by hadi123; 6th December 2017 at 19:57.

  5. #325
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    Quote Originally Posted by HitWicket View Post
    Except he's been suspended for 2 Ashes tests and 2 ODIs so far?
    Coincidentally the same matches he missed with a broken hand.


    Quote Originally Posted by Saqs on Steve Smith
    And who taught him to bat? Chris Martin? Is he the Australian equivalent of ....wait, I'm struggling to think of another useless player of his calibre.

  6. #326
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    Quote Originally Posted by Convict View Post
    Coincidentally the same matches he missed with a broken hand.
    He was back to training and bowling before the first ashes test.

  7. #327
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    Quote Originally Posted by HitWicket View Post
    He was back to training and bowling before the first ashes test.
    Training and bowling isn't match fit


    Quote Originally Posted by Saqs on Steve Smith
    And who taught him to bat? Chris Martin? Is he the Australian equivalent of ....wait, I'm struggling to think of another useless player of his calibre.

  8. #328
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    Quote Originally Posted by Convict View Post
    Training and bowling isn't match fit
    There's footage of him bowling at what appears to be full tilt (bear in mind it was his bowling hand that was injured) a couple of weeks before the the first test, he would have been available for the first test.

  9. #329
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    Quote Originally Posted by shaz619 View Post
    Strawman from you repeatedly overlooking the original point regarding the fact that Stokes tried to kill someone and is getting the golden boy treatment yet KP is more evil and got what he deserved, that's disgusting to be honest and a very pro establishment mindset
    You’re making an emotional argument, not following lines of logical debate so I’ll leave you to it.

  10. #330
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    Quote Originally Posted by Convict View Post
    Coincidentally the same matches he missed with a broken hand.
    So you are saying that if his hand wasn’t injured he would have played the first two tests?

  11. #331
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robert View Post
    So you are saying that if his hand wasn’t injured he would have played the first two tests?
    I'm saying that it isn't much of a punishment if you weren't going to be able to play anyway.


    Quote Originally Posted by Saqs on Steve Smith
    And who taught him to bat? Chris Martin? Is he the Australian equivalent of ....wait, I'm struggling to think of another useless player of his calibre.

  12. #332
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robert View Post
    You’re making an emotional argument, not following lines of logical debate so I’ll leave you to it.
    Speak for yourself, continue to sugar coat the actions of a guy that tried to kill someone because you deem it to be a minor crime compared to KP's transgressions due to your biases.


    Ah, so this is what it feels like

  13. #333
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    Quote Originally Posted by shaz619 View Post
    Speak for yourself, continue to sugar coat the actions of a guy that tried to kill someone because you deem it to be a minor crime compared to KP's transgressions due to your biases.
    Sugar coat? No but can I have a bit less hyperbole on that?

    If he tried to kill someone he would already have been charged with attempted murder.

  14. #334
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    Families of one-punch victims who tragically lost their lives have expressed anger and astonishment at England’s decision to pick all-rounder Ben Stokes for its upcoming one-day international tour of Australia.

    Stokes was arrested on suspicion of causing actual bodily harm during a wild street brawl in Bristol in September that saw a man receive a broken eye socket.

    The 26-year-old, who has been stood down from England’s Ashes tour until he learns if he will be charged over the incident, was named in England’s 16-man squad for the one-day series, a decision coach Trevor Bayliss acknowledged would create a “circus”.

    Matt Cronin, the father of Pat Cronin – a Melbourne teenager who died last year after being punched from behind at a bar – said that he was “astounded” when he heard of Stokes’ selection.

    “I understand more than anyone that there’s a legal process to follow but the evidence is there … there’s absolutely no excuse for what he did from what I’ve seen on the vision,” he told The New Daily.

    “I’m really disappointed in the decision. These are serious allegations and charges are pending – surely they would stand him down?

    “My comment to the English Cricket Board would be how disappointed I am at their lack of moral judgement. To even contemplate picking him … do they want to bring their business into disrepute?

    “By picking him, the English Cricket Board are essentially condoning his behaviour.

    “What are we saying as a society if he is allowed to play?

    “I’d be disgusted if an Australian was allowed to play in the same circumstances.”

    Cronin – director of the Pat Cronin Foundation, which hopes to end coward-punch attacks through awareness, education and research – said that Stokes was extremely fortunate not to be facing more serious charges.

    “He is so, so lucky that he didn’t kill the guy,” he said.

    “It only takes one punch to kill. It just makes me feel sick after what happened with Pat.

    “It doesn’t seem to be getting better – it’s time for action. It’s time for society to make a strong stance against these attacks.”

    Stokes has been playing domestic cricket for New Zealand’s Canterbury over the last week in a bid to finetune his game for the Australia tour.

    Paul Stanley also lost a son to mindless violence.

    At just 15, Matthew Stanley was killed by a single punch at an 18-year-old’s birthday party in suburban Brisbane.

    “My son Matt went to that birthday party with his mates and went to have fun … he didn’t go there to die,” Paul Stanley told The New Daily.

    “All the sorry’s will never bring him back.

    “No violence is acceptable in any way, shape or form.

    “He [Stokes] probably doesn’t realise how bloody lucky he is not to be facing a murder charge.”

    Paul Stanley, like Matt Cronin, has set up a foundation to educate young people about the dangers of violence.

    The Matthew Stanley Foundation sees Paul speak at more than 200 Queensland schools each year and he urged sporting administrators to be far more pro-active to combat violence – both on the field and off the field.

    “I really believe sporting administrators have got to take more responsibility on issues like this … these people aren’t sporting heroes – they are thugs,” he said.

    “We say ‘that’s not cricket’ in cricket [for unsporting acts] – well it’s certainly not cricket belting a guy.

    “Too often we see these sporting heroes, and I say that [heroes] in inverted commas, taking to the knuckle.

    “And soon they will be standing around shaking heads and saying ‘why didn’t we do something about it?’ when something major happens.”

    http://thenewdaily.com.au/sport/cric...tokes-england/

  15. #335
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    That article might help explain the feeling against Stokes playing in Australia- punching violence (usually alcohol associated) has been a really hot social topic the last few years. Those deaths & several others like them have been well publicised & there is a public move to say , "enough", with specific laws being created to allow tougher sentences for such assaults as a result of this public pressure. A deliberate attempt to move away from the 1970s, "seeing a fight at the pub on Friday is no big deal" attitude. Even before Ben Stokes, this was a hot issue in Australia lately.

  16. #336
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robert View Post
    Sugar coat? No but can I have a bit less hyperbole on that?

    If he tried to kill someone he would already have been charged with attempted murder.

    Many people have been killed by one punch, God forbid, if that had happened, would you have changed your stance?

  17. #337
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    England all-rounder Ben Stokes has finally found some form during his stint with Canterbury with a fluent 93 run knock in the Super Smash encounter against Otago in Christchurch on Thursday.

    Stokes, who came to bat at number four plundered six boundaries and seven maximums in his 47 ball knock and helped Canterbury post 217 for nine in the 20 overs which they defended with ease by 134 runs with the Durham all-rounder also snaring wicket in his outing with the ball.

    Earlier, 26-year-old was suspended by the England and Wales Cricket Board pending an outcome of a police investigation for his involvement in an incident in Bristol that saw him lose his Ashes spot.

    Stokes returned to competitive cricket after a hiatus of over two months for the New Zealand provincial side but managed only 2, 34 and 0 in the three List A games before he managed to strike form on Thursday's T20 encounter.

    He has been named in England's One-Day International squad that will compete in a five-match series against Australia but his participation will be based on the outcome of the case.

    http://www.cricketworld.com/ben-stok...Latest+News%29


    For the latest updates on Cricket, follow @PakPassion on Twitter

  18. #338
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    I wish he was coming in next drop tomorrow.

  19. #339
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robert View Post
    I wish he was coming in next drop tomorrow.
    I think (for next year) if we bring in Jennings for Vince, and Stokes for Woakes, with Moeen batting at 8, then we will be playing about the best XI we could put out at the moment.

  20. #340
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    Quote Originally Posted by James View Post
    I think (for next year) if we bring in Jennings for Vince, and Stokes for Woakes, with Moeen batting at 8, then we will be playing about the best XI we could put out at the moment.
    Why do people rate Jennings, that guy couldn’t buy a run all summer?

  21. #341
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robert View Post
    I wish he was coming in next drop tomorrow.
    Quote Originally Posted by James View Post
    I think (for next year) if we bring in Jennings for Vince, and Stokes for Woakes, with Moeen batting at 8, then we will be playing about the best XI we could put out at the moment.
    You get hot when I bring up possible hostilities towards KP based on reasons which are not objective but are all cool with the selection of a guy that tried to murder someone, being drunk is not a good excuse am afraid.


    Ah, so this is what it feels like

  22. #342
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    You posted "tried to murder" a second time. I advise that you should be more careful with your words on the Internet. Libel laws exit. If Stokes is charged then it will be GBH at worst.

  23. #343
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    Quote Originally Posted by Asif khan View Post
    Many people have been killed by one punch, God forbid, if that had happened, would you have changed your stance?
    No point talking about hypotheticals. My stance us based on whatever the CPS decides to charge him with, if anything.

  24. #344
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    Quote Originally Posted by James View Post
    I think (for next year) if we bring in Jennings for Vince, and Stokes for Woakes, with Moeen batting at 8, then we will be playing about the best XI we could put out at the moment.
    I would sooner have Hameed back.

  25. #345
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    Attempted murder then. As if GBH is meant to make me feel better, GBH sympathisers are funny; it's less of a issue then someone allegedly rustling a bunch of yes men.


    Ah, so this is what it feels like

  26. #346
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    Quote Originally Posted by shaz619 View Post
    You get hot when I bring up possible hostilities towards KP based on reasons which are not objective but are all cool with the selection of a guy that tried to murder someone, being drunk is not a good excuse am afraid.
    Tried to murder someone? Seems like an exaggeration.

  27. #347
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    Quote Originally Posted by babajee View Post
    Why do people rate Jennings, that guy couldn’t buy a run all summer?
    He’s better than Vince. Not saying I rate him particularly.

  28. #348
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    Quote Originally Posted by shaz619 View Post
    Attempted murder then. As if GBH is meant to make me feel better, GBH sympathisers are funny; it's less of a issue then someone allegedly rustling a bunch of yes men.
    Completely different charges, and as I have stated I don’t think Stokes will be charged anyway.

  29. #349
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robert View Post
    Completely different charges, and as I have stated I don’t think Stokes will be charged anyway.
    He should be and if he isn't then England need to punish him severely

  30. #350
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    Quote Originally Posted by shaz619 View Post
    He should be and if he isn't then England need to punish him severely
    I think the CPS will not charge him - he would not get a fair trial because the video material is in the public domain, and they are unlikely to get a conviction.

  31. #351
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    white privilege goes along way in the UK..

  32. #352
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robert View Post
    I think the CPS will not charge him - he would not get a fair trial because the video material is in the public domain, and they are unlikely to get a conviction.
    Robert, for just one moment let's not dwell on the legal aspect of the case. If he was working in any other profession and had a night out, got extremely drunk and got in to the same fight what would his employers do?
    Now add to this that he is in a high profile job where young kids look up to him, do you really think that a two match ban is sufficient?

    Finally, do you think the same principal would apply if he was some fringe player?

  33. #353
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    Quote Originally Posted by IMMY69 View Post
    Robert, for just one moment let's not dwell on the legal aspect of the case. If he was working in any other profession and had a night out, got extremely drunk and got in to the same fight what would his employers do?
    Now add to this that he is in a high profile job where young kids look up to him, do you really think that a two match ban is sufficient?

    Finally, do you think the same principal would apply if he was some fringe player?
    I wonder if he were a pakistani or a black player, would the same have happened??

  34. #354
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robert View Post
    I think the CPS will not charge him - he would not get a fair trial because the video material is in the public domain, and they are unlikely to get a conviction.
    You sound like his lawyer sugar coating his act of violence, never expected this from you.


    Ah, so this is what it feels like

  35. #355
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robert View Post
    No point talking about hypotheticals. My stance us based on whatever the CPS decides to charge him with, if anything.
    Nah every reason to talk hypotheticals. The fact the guy didn't die was pure luck. Stokes obviously didn't intend in anyway to kill him but all it takes is for head to hit concrete and you get a death.


    Quote Originally Posted by Saqs on Steve Smith
    And who taught him to bat? Chris Martin? Is he the Australian equivalent of ....wait, I'm struggling to think of another useless player of his calibre.

  36. #356
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    Quote Originally Posted by Convict View Post
    Nah every reason to talk hypotheticals. The fact the guy didn't die was pure luck. Stokes obviously didn't intend in anyway to kill him but all it takes is for head to hit concrete and you get a death.
    True but if that had happened Stokes would be facing a Manslaughter charge, not (maybe) GBH. The law does not deal in hypotheticals, only in what actually happened.

  37. #357
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    Robert, I don’t blame you for avoiding my question...

  38. #358
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robert View Post
    True but if that had happened Stokes would be facing a Manslaughter charge, not (maybe) GBH. The law does not deal in hypotheticals, only in what actually happened.
    Being serious about crimes and acknowledging the potential severity is how we as a society clamp down on thug punches.


    Quote Originally Posted by Saqs on Steve Smith
    And who taught him to bat? Chris Martin? Is he the Australian equivalent of ....wait, I'm struggling to think of another useless player of his calibre.

  39. #359
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    Quote Originally Posted by IMMY69 View Post
    Robert, I don’t blame you for avoiding my question...
    I do have to sleep, you know.

    It would largely depend on the type of employing organisation, and how useful he is to that organisation. And to the client group, as a lot of people will see his action as legitimate self-defence.

  40. #360
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    Quote Originally Posted by Convict View Post
    Being serious about crimes and acknowledging the potential severity is how we as a society clamp down on thug punches.
    Australian society is not British society, and certainly not the British criminal justice system. While health and safety law judgements are tending to a view in terms of the maximum potential harm caused not actual harm, the law relating to violence is not.

  41. #361
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    Quote Originally Posted by shaz619 View Post
    You sound like his lawyer sugar coating his act of violence, never expected this from you.
    You are viewing this through a moral lens, i through a practical legal one. Law is not morality.

  42. #362
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robert View Post
    Australian society is not British society, and certainly not the British criminal justice system. While health and safety law judgements are tending to a view in terms of the maximum potential harm caused not actual harm, the law relating to violence is not.
    Probably why Britain is a much more violent society than Australia nowdays despite a similar drinking culture.


    Quote Originally Posted by Saqs on Steve Smith
    And who taught him to bat? Chris Martin? Is he the Australian equivalent of ....wait, I'm struggling to think of another useless player of his calibre.

  43. #363
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    Quote Originally Posted by Convict View Post
    Probably why Britain is a much more violent society than Australia nowdays despite a similar drinking culture.
    Don’t bowl me these soft long-hops mate, you’ll get pulled for four. UK murder rate is 0.92 / 100,000: Australia’s is 0.98.
    Last edited by Robert; 16th December 2017 at 09:27.

  44. #364
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robert View Post
    You are viewing this through a moral lens, i through a practical legal one. Law is not morality.
    Maybe you should look at it through the lens of a human being unless Stokes is paying you to defend him on PP, hence I'd understand you sugar coating his act of violence.


    Ah, so this is what it feels like

  45. #365
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    Ben Stokes heading home for Christmas with no plans to return to New Zealand

    UNDER fire Englishman Ben Stokes’ chances of playing in the Ashes appear all but over with the all-rounder returning home for Christmas.

    Canterbury Cricket Club released a statement on Saturday thanking Stokes for his time and gave no indication he would return after Christmas.

    With the Boxing Day Test now out of the equation, it seems extremely unlikely he would fly back for the Sydney Test which begins on January 4.

    Canterbury said Stokes is leaving for family reasons.

    “He leaves with our gratitude for his time with us and for what he added to the squad during his time in Canterbury,” the statement read.

    Stokes is still awaiting the Crown Prosecution’s decision on whether or not he will be charged following a late night incident in Bristol in September.

    Stokes arrived in Christchurch, where he was born, before the Adelaide Test with the England and Wales Cricket Board’s approval. They allowed him to sign and play six matches for Canterbury in New Zealand’s domestic competition.

    But without any formal charge or acquittal, the ECB did not allow the 26-year-old to make the trip over to Australia when they needed him most.

    Now the Ashes are gone, Stokes’ most likely next match for England is the one-dayer at the MCG on January 14.

    He was named in the squad for the five-match 50 overs per side series but will only take his place if the legal matter is settled.

    Stokes played three one-dayers and three T20s for Canterbury in his three-week stint, making 179 runs at 29.8 and claiming just two wickets.

    “I have thoroughly enjoyed training and playing with Canterbury,” Stokes said.

    “Everyone here has gone out of their way to make me feel at home. It’s a wonderful club and I couldn’t have asked for any more from my time here.”

    The club also said Stokes would “find a welcome here should the opportunity arise for him to return.”

    Canterbury have seven more matches to play in New Zealand’s Super Smash and currently sit at the top of the table having won two matches and lost one.

    https://www.foxsports.com.au/cricket...15c-1513988945


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  46. #366
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    Canterbury Cricket can confirm that Ben Stokes will return to the UK today for family reasons. He leaves
    with our gratitude for his time with us and for what he added to the squad during his time in Canterbury.

    “Ben has been great around the club, the team and the staff. We can’t fault his attitude or his all-round
    contribution in his time with us and we are sorry that he couldn’t stay with us for longer but Ben knows
    that he will always find a welcome here should the opportunity arise for him to return” said Canterbury
    CEO, Jez Curwin.

    Ben was keen to thank the club for the opportunity afforded to him. “I have thoroughly enjoyed training
    and playing with Canterbury. Everyone here has gone out of their way to make me feel at home. It’s a
    wonderful club and I couldn’t have asked for any more from my time here” said Stokes.


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  47. #367
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    Quote Originally Posted by shaz619 View Post
    Maybe you should look at it through the lens of a human being unless Stokes is paying you to defend him on PP, hence I'd understand you sugar coating his act of violence.
    I sugar coat nothing. OK human being, look through this lens for a moment.

    You’re in a dark alley. You’re outnumbered by hostile men. One of them tries to bottle your mate. That puts him in mortal danger. You are in fear for your life and your mate’s life.

    What do you do?
    Last edited by Robert; 23rd December 2017 at 07:46.

  48. #368
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robert View Post
    I sugar coat nothing. OK human being, look through this lens for a moment.

    You’re in a dark alley. You’re outnumbered by hostile men. One of them tries to bottle your mate. That puts him in mortal danger. You are in fear for your life and your mate’s life.

    What do you do?
    Obviously I go after a different guy and belt him while he is backing away.


    Quote Originally Posted by Saqs on Steve Smith
    And who taught him to bat? Chris Martin? Is he the Australian equivalent of ....wait, I'm struggling to think of another useless player of his calibre.

  49. #369
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robert View Post
    I sugar coat nothing. OK human being, look through this lens for a moment.

    You’re in a dark alley. You’re outnumbered by hostile men. One of them tries to bottle your mate. That puts him in mortal danger. You are in fear for your life and your mate’s life.

    What do you do?
    That's the defence Stokes lawyer would have come up with so he gets away scott free when the situation may not have played out that way.

    But to answer your question I would run away and tell my mate to do the same, obviously I'd use pepper spray to buy us time. Much better option then being violent or doing something you regret later.

  50. #370
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    Quote Originally Posted by shaz619 View Post
    That's the defence Stokes lawyer would have come up with so he gets away scott free when the situation may not have played out that way.

    But to answer your question I would run away and tell my mate to do the same, obviously I'd use pepper spray to buy us time. Much better option then being violent or doing something you regret later.
    Then you would face jail for possession of an offensive weapon. If you were caught, of course.

    I would probably have tried to leg it when fight/flight kicked in, but Stokes is an alpha male so went the other way, stood his ground and used a show of force to drive his attackers off.

  51. #371
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robert View Post
    Then you would face jail for possession of an offensive weapon. If you were caught, of course.

    I would probably have tried to leg it when fight/flight kicked in, but Stokes is an alpha male so went the other way, stood his ground and used a show of force to drive his attackers off.
    I forgot to point out I'd be acting only in self defence if my life was seriously threatened, I wouldn't physically assault someone. When I use to go Boxing gym, Al Malcom Lennox's Lewis's first opponent taught me that you should always run for safety when the option presents itself especially when the person you're being confronted by has a weapon. This goes a long way especially for someone growing up in an inner city.

    Stokes on the other hand is a weak male who's initial response is to do something moronic, he wasn't even confronted by a real thug just some average bloke from the pub whom he beat the hell out of because he wanted to. Same guy makes video's mocking disabled people. Still, he will get supported and treated like royalty by fans and his employees; hypocrisy and ignorance.


    Ah, so this is what it feels like

  52. #372
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    Ben Stokes given permission by ECB to play in the Indian Premier League

    England all-rounder Ben Stokes has been given permission by the England and Wales Cricket Board to take part in the lucrative Indian Premier League.

    Stokes is currently unavailable for England selection after being arrested for his part in an incident outside a Bristol nightclub in September.

    The Durham player is still awaiting the results of a police investigation.

    Stokes, 26, was signed by Rising Pune Supergiants for £1.7m in last year's edition of the IPL.

    He has not been part of the Ashes Tests and although he was named in the ODI squad for the five-match series, he will not travel with the rest of the squad on 2 January with Dawid Malan added as cover.

    When the Crown Prosecution Service decides if Stokes is to be charged or not, the ECB board will meet to decide his immediate international availability.

    There was speculation the Durham man was going to join England for the Ashes series when he was pictured at Heathrow Airport following their defeat in the first Test.

    Instead, he was travelling to visit family in New Zealand, where he played six limited-overs matches for Canterbury.

    After Stokes was granted a 'no objection certificate' to play for Canterbury, ECB chief executive Tom Harrison conceded it would be "difficult" to prevent him playing in the IPL.

    Last year, Stokes went for a record fee and was named player of the tournament.

    In this year's auction, to be held at the end of January, teams have a salary cap that has risen by 20% as a result of a new £2.8bn broadcast deal.

    It raises the prospect of Stokes signing a lucrative IPL deal while he is still not permitted to play international cricket.

    The tournament begins on 4 April - a day after England's second and final Test in New Zealand ends.

    It runs to 31 May, by which time England will have played one of their home Tests against Pakistan and the domestic season will be well under way.

    http://www.bbc.com/sport/cricket/42533216


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  53. #373
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    He's selected in the England squad for the T20 tri-series against Australia and New Zealand, with the following caveat.

    Ben Stokes is included, though his involvement remains subject to any relevant legal or disciplinary developments in relation to the incident in Bristol in September. Should the ECB Board receive formal confirmation that Stokes has either been charged or that he will face no charges, they would convene within 48 hours to make a decision on his availability for the team at that stage.


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  54. #374
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    England cricketer Ben Stokes charged with affray in relation to an incident of disorder

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    Last edited by Abdullah719; 15th January 2018 at 14:26.


    "When You Have Eliminated The Impossible, Whatever Remains, However Improbable, Must Be The Truth!

  55. #375
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    Affray?

  56. #376
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    England cricketer Ben Stokes has been charged with affray over an incident outside a Bristol nightclub.

    The disturbance in September left a man with a fractured eye socket and police sent their findings to the Crown Prosecution Service (CPS) in November.

    Stokes missed the Ashes series, with the England and Wales Cricket Board (ECB) saying he would not be considered for England "until further notice".

    The 26-year-old has been charged along with two men from Bristol.

    A statement from the CPS said it received further material in late December.

    "Following a review of all the available evidence, the CPS has today authorised the police to charge three men with affray in connection with the incident," it said.

    "Ben Stokes, 26, Ryan Ali, 28, and Ryan Hale, 26, are all due to appear before Bristol Magistrates' Court on a date to be fixed in relation to this charge."

    Stokes played six domestic matches in New Zealand in December.

    He appeared in three one-day games and three T20s for Canterbury after being cleared to play by the ECB.

    The Durham all-rounder returned to the UK to spend Christmas with his family and has been given permission to take part in the Indian Premier League.

    Stokes was initially named in England's squad for the Ashes and, despite the ECB's reluctance to pick him while the CPS decided whether to charge him, was also included in the one-day squad for the five-match series against Australia.

    He was also named in the England Test squad to tour New Zealand in March, but any potential involvement remained subject to legal or disciplinary developments.

    More to follow
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/cricket/4...source=twitter


    "When You Have Eliminated The Impossible, Whatever Remains, However Improbable, Must Be The Truth!

  57. #377
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    Quote Originally Posted by Varun View Post
    Affray?
    via dictionary : an instance of group fighting in a public place that disturbs the peace.

    Basically a brawl/fracas.


    "When You Have Eliminated The Impossible, Whatever Remains, However Improbable, Must Be The Truth!

  58. #378
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    Messy state of affairs...

  59. #379
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    Interesting and unexpected. I did not think they had enough evidence to expect a reasonable chance of conviction. Affray is a common law sentence. It means someone applies force resulting in someone being terrified. It could be heard in the Magistrates Court, especially if he pleads Not Guilty.

    The Court cannot impose a suspended sentence. If he is convicted in the Magistrates Court he could face up to two years in jail, though as a first offence it would be less.

  60. #380
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    If guilty, will he only be charged with a fine+criminal record or can their be a jail sentencing with bail etc?


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  61. #381
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rana View Post
    If guilty, will he only be charged with a fine+criminal record or can their be a jail sentencing with bail etc?
    Technically it can come with up to a 6 month jail sentence but it's very unlikely.

  62. #382
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    Quote Originally Posted by HitWicket View Post
    Technically it can come with up to a 6 month jail sentence but it's very unlikely.
    Well the evidence would suggest he is guilty and he assaulted a person under the influence of alcohol. I think Ben Stoke's career is in serious trouble here, but Amir Asif etc have done jail time and are back playing cricket so it would be interesting to see how ECB handle this.


    "The Indian bowling attack is as devastating as the Teletubbies"- Sir Ian Botham

  63. #383
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    The issue isnt that Stokes is a citizen that has committed a crime, its more to do with him being a professional sportsman who is also an ambassador of England Cricket wherever he goes, and he violated his credentials seriously in that sense .


    "The Indian bowling attack is as devastating as the Teletubbies"- Sir Ian Botham

  64. #384
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    The only similar situation I can think of was Botham who pleaded guilty to possession of cannabis and then spoke about it to the Mail on Sunday. There was a front page story. The TCCB banned him for five tests for "bringing cricket into disrepute ".

  65. #385
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  66. #386
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  67. #387
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    So there are chances he might miss the WC19? If convicted, he might go to jail for 2 years ?

  68. #388
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    Quote Originally Posted by mkyawar View Post
    So there are chances he might miss the WC19? If convicted, he might go to jail for 2 years ?
    6 months maximum as long as it doesn't go higher than the magistrates court, but any jail term given what the charges are is pretty unlikely.

  69. #389
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    If found guilty or if he pleads guilty he will just get a fine and perhaps have to do some unpaid work, IMO. Got off lightly with an affray charge.

  70. #390
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    Don't think he'll be spending any time in jail. tbh. Think he'll be paying a hefty fine and they'll consider the 2 witnesses that stood up for Stokes.

    But I'm not in-the-know, and that's just my opinion.


    "When You Have Eliminated The Impossible, Whatever Remains, However Improbable, Must Be The Truth!

  71. #391
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    Suspended sentence for Affray is not an option under sentencing guidelines. If guilty he will have to do time. But he has declared his intent to clear his name.
    Last edited by Robert; 15th January 2018 at 16:09.

  72. #392
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    Honestly I dont see how he can get away from this one, though no way will he serve time IMO.

    End of the day no matter what defence he pleads, he's videod KO'ing a man backing away and then punching him several times in the face when he's down and knocked out.

    Doesnt matter what the guys were doing, absolutely no excusing that and as others have said, in another world he'd be up for manslaughter.


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  73. #393
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    Oh dear, affray is a serious charge. Don't condone what he's done but for his future sake, hope he can avoid conviction as criminal record will have ramifications for his livelihood.

  74. #394
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kroll View Post
    Oh dear, affray is a serious charge. Don't condone what he's done but for his future sake, hope he can avoid conviction as criminal record will have ramifications for his livelihood.
    https://www.cps.gov.uk/legal-guidanc...rging-standard

    "An offence under section 3 is triable either way. The maximum penalty on conviction on indictment is 3 years' imprisonment and/or a fine of unlimited amount. On summary conviction the maximum penalty is 6 months' imprisonment and/or a fine not exceeding level 5."


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  75. #395
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    By most accounts, it sounds like Stokes intends to rely on the defence of "self-defence or defence of others". But the video shows that his actions went well beyond self-defence. I do not see how else he can get away with it.

  76. #396
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    If it goes to a magistrate, he should get his lawyer to negotiate a non-custodial sentence with the judge and then plead guilty. Otherwise he is risking his career.

  77. #397
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robert View Post
    Interesting and unexpected. I did not think they had enough evidence to expect a reasonable chance of conviction. Affray is a common law sentence. It means someone applies force resulting in someone being terrified. It could be heard in the Magistrates Court, especially if he pleads Not Guilty.

    The Court cannot impose a suspended sentence. If he is convicted in the Magistrates Court he could face up to two years in jail, though as a first offence it would be less.
    As far as im aware magistrates can only give up to 12 months prison sentence. They can give him a suspended sentence and if he pleads not guilty the magistrates can them further the case to the Crown court.

    This charge means he did not real damage to the people he hit, must have been some weak punches. If they had bruises it would have been an ABH charge and if broken bones etc, GBH.

    He will get a big fine, maybe some community service.

    Got off lightly.


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  78. #398
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    Quote Originally Posted by KingKhanWC View Post
    As far as im aware magistrates can only give up to 12 months prison sentence. They can give him a suspended sentence and if he pleads not guilty the magistrates can them further the case to the Crown court.

    This charge means he did not real damage to the people he hit, must have been some weak punches. If they had bruises it would have been an ABH charge and if broken bones etc, GBH.

    He will get a big fine, maybe some community service.

    Got off lightly.
    I thought he fractured one guy eye socket in this fight? Wouldn't that make it gbh

  79. #399
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    Quote Originally Posted by finalfantasy7 View Post
    I thought he fractured one guy eye socket in this fight? Wouldn't that make it gbh
    Did he? If so he has been charged incorrectly. Yes the CPS can ignore this and choose charge but the victims lawyer could dispute this.

    If this was some homeless man with no friends, the law would come down on him like a ton of bricks. People have done jail time for much less but Stokes is famous, a cricketer and within the chambers of courts, there are people who sympathise with him.

    Amir hurts nobody, even the whole thing was a sting so nobody gained financially yet he has done time even at his age. Stokes goes around punching people in public but will get a fine. Imo the person who is a danger to the public should be sent down not for fraud where there is no danger to public. But thats the law of the UK, not as great as made out around the world.


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  80. #400
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    Quote Originally Posted by KingKhanWC View Post
    As far as im aware magistrates can only give up to 12 months prison sentence. They can give him a suspended sentence and if he pleads not guilty the magistrates can them further the case to the Crown court.
    Depends on the offence. A Magistrate can impose a two year custodial sentence for breach of the Health and Safety Act.

    Th only way this gets kicked up to Crown Court is if Stokes is found guilty and appeals against the decision.


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