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  1. #1
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    Are too many people using mental health as an excuse for behaviour?

    Mental health issues are genuine and serious, which I am not denying. I feel the governments needs to do more to help those in need.

    But we see people gunning down dozens of people. I hear of people who have treated others very badly, either through abuse, betrayal or physical violence blaming their mental health issues for their behaviour.

    Has anyone had any experiences of people justifying their behaviour because of mental health?

    There are numerous mental health conditions but does this mean the person loses the ability to choose right from wrong?


    Lions don't lose sleep over the opinions of Sheep

  2. #2
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    I think there are a lot of instances where mental health is being used as a scapegoat to sugarcoat deep rooted causes for a specific act of violence, unfortunately this tends to belittle those who have genuine mental health problems and struggle on a daily. And it's almost as if implying those who suffer from it should be locked up because they are likely to do something stupid, mental health itself has been demonized by the media to an extent and almost created a stereotype out of it but it's looked upon as a valid justification at the same time, but when someone makes such a claim it needs to be investigated because it could be a hate crime or an act of violence towards another for example due to jealousy.

    I've not seen people use mental health problems to justify their actions but I've seen folk use black magic as an excuse lol

    And I can't speak for other cases but personally I'd agree with you that one can't exactly become out of touch with what's right or wrong. The stereotypes are insulting because those who have genuine problems often resort to self harm and in the UK especially, where such a condition is taboo among men, suicide rates have been higher then ever since 2001 in the UK and Ireland, suicide remains the leading cause of death for men between 20 and 34 in England and Wales, representing 24% of all deaths in 2013, and for men aged 35-49, at 13% of deaths, it's at record levels in UK universities, in 2015 alone 134 students killed themselves and a growing number who report mental health problems tend to commit suicide.

    It's something really serious but these people are not given adequate help or are looked down upon, the rubbish in the media doesn't help either because their definition of a mental issue is too one dimensional.
    Last edited by shaz619; 6th November 2017 at 22:47.


    Ah, so this is what it feels like

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by shaz619 View Post
    I think there are a lot of instances where mental health is being used as a scapegoat to sugarcoat deep rooted causes for a specific act of violence, unfortunately this tends to belittle those who have genuine mental health problems and struggle on a daily. And it's almost as if implying those who suffer from it should be locked up because they are likely to do something stupid, mental health itself has been demonized by the media to an extent and almost created a stereotype out of it but it's looked upon as a valid justification at the same time, but when someone makes such a claim it needs to be investigated because it could be a hate crime or an act of violence towards another for example due to jealousy.

    I've not seen people use mental health problems to justify their actions but I've seen folk use black magic as an excuse lol

    And I can't speak for other cases but personally I'd agree with you that one can't exactly become out of touch with what's right or wrong. The stereotypes are insulting because those who have genuine problems often resort to self harm and in the UK especially, where such a condition is taboo among men, suicide rates have been higher then ever since 2001 in the UK and Ireland, suicide remains the leading cause of death for men between 20 and 34 in England and Wales, representing 24% of all deaths in 2013, and for men aged 35-49, at 13% of deaths, it's at record levels in UK universities, in 2015 alone 134 students killed themselves and a growing number who report mental health problems tend to commit suicide.

    It's something really serious but these people are not given adequate help or are looked down upon, the rubbish in the media doesn't help either because their definition of a mental issue is too one dimensional.
    Very interesting Shaz. I agree knowing the difference between right or wrong cannot be taken away due to mental health but perhaps bad decisions can be made but to repeat those bad decisions time and again has to be someones own responsilbity.

    Can I ask, in your opinion why do you think there is a growing issue with mental health or do you feel it's always been there? I know students have a lot more pressure these days and also there is a rise in domestic abuse which has caused many women to suffer from this horrible illness.


    Lions don't lose sleep over the opinions of Sheep

  4. #4
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    These are first world problems in our part of the world mental illness is laughed at..

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by big_gamer007 View Post
    These are first world problems in our part of the world mental illness is laughed at..
    Absolutely !

    Our cinema always portrays caricatures of mental health issues. People in hospitals, screaming behind bars, always aggressive and worst of all the "shock treatment" stereotype.

    You have no idea what damage it does to ordinary people with actual mental wellness issues, and it prevents them from coming forward with those.

  6. #6
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    "You've swapped good and evil for behaviourism, Agent Starling".

    Mental health issues are a component in the behaviour of some offenders in the UK. Depending on the type of offence and diagnosis, the offender will go to a secure psychiatric hospital or be treated in prison.

    But I would argue that the Prison Service is picking up the lack for failures of coverage and appropriate treatment by our mental health services.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by KingKhanWC View Post
    Very interesting Shaz. I agree knowing the difference between right or wrong cannot be taken away due to mental health but perhaps bad decisions can be made but to repeat those bad decisions time and again has to be someones own responsilbity.

    Can I ask, in your opinion why do you think there is a growing issue with mental health or do you feel it's always been there? I know students have a lot more pressure these days and also there is a rise in domestic abuse which has caused many women to suffer from this horrible illness.
    I meant like bad decisions as in murder or physical harm towards others, more often then not the sufferers are a big risk to themselves then others. But yeah, everyday bad decisions can be common.

    In the inner city it's mostly to do with poverty, homelessness, broken family's, unemployment and toxic relationships which can be inspired by an escalating poor living condition or situation. It has always existed but it's worse then ever and reflective of our country's austerity politics. And those from such a background would find themselves under even more pressure during university study because it becomes a matter of life and death rather then just another exam, many folk have family's who are depending on them. Even someone like Pac use to contemplate suicide at many points in his life, he remained grounded because he knew there would be no one else to take care of his mother; it gives you another picture given the nature of his life growing up in the US.

    Beyond the inner city it could be inspired by relationships which are short lived, we live in a world now which is extremely cynical, shallow and superficial. The mental or physical abuse can push people to a really dark place, people are just so nasty to each other. Someone like a Tyson Fury has been abused due to his gypsy background, it was very hurtful stuff on social media and when you give something your all e.g big win over Wlad but still get belittled it really affects you negatively, in Tysons case it led him to drug abuse, other times a big accomplishment which is praised can create a void which is made whole by bad decisions.

    The current superficial climate also emphasises anxieties, insecurities and depression as well amongst all individuals. Each case is unqiue so hard to pin point one reason because there are so many factors that can lead to poor mental health.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by KingKhanWC View Post

    Can I ask, in your opinion why do you think there is a growing issue with mental health or do you feel it's always been there? I know students have a lot more pressure these days and also there is a rise in domestic abuse which has caused many women to suffer from this horrible illness.
    Suicide rates are going up among poor whites in the USA, bringing about a measurable reduction in life expectancy - a result of poor job prospects, lowering wages, lack of free mental health care, and therefore people turning to self-medication with illegal drugs and/or alcohol, resulting in exacerbation of mental health issues.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by shaz619 View Post
    I think there are a lot of instances where mental health is being used as a scapegoat to sugarcoat deep rooted causes for a specific act of violence, unfortunately this tends to belittle those who have genuine mental health problems and struggle on a daily. And it's almost as if implying those who suffer from it should be locked up because they are likely to do something stupid, mental health itself has been demonized by the media to an extent and almost created a stereotype out of it but it's looked upon as a valid justification at the same time, but when someone makes such a claim it needs to be investigated because it could be a hate crime or an act of violence towards another for example due to jealousy.

    I've not seen people use mental health problems to justify their actions but I've seen folk use black magic as an excuse lol

    And I can't speak for other cases but personally I'd agree with you that one can't exactly become out of touch with what's right or wrong. The stereotypes are insulting because those who have genuine problems often resort to self harm and in the UK especially, where such a condition is taboo among men, suicide rates have been higher then ever since 2001 in the UK and Ireland, suicide remains the leading cause of death for men between 20 and 34 in England and Wales, representing 24% of all deaths in 2013, and for men aged 35-49, at 13% of deaths, it's at record levels in UK universities, in 2015 alone 134 students killed themselves and a growing number who report mental health problems tend to commit suicide.

    It's something really serious but these people are not given adequate help or are looked down upon, the rubbish in the media doesn't help either because their definition of a mental issue is too one dimensional.
    I think this is the main problem for me. I wonder what part sensationalist media has played in triggering some of the more violent episodes in recent history from unstable people? You can't sugar coat everything, and people ultimately have to assume some responsibility for their actions, but it's too easy to blame a sinister motive behind some acts of terrorism, and blow off others as mental health issues. In reality, both are probably more alike than we'd like to admit.


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  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cpt. Rishwat View Post
    I think this is the main problem for me. I wonder what part sensationalist media has played in triggering some of the more violent episodes in recent history from unstable people? You can't sugar coat everything, and people ultimately have to assume some responsibility for their actions, but it's too easy to blame a sinister motive behind some acts of terrorism, and blow off others as mental health issues. In reality, both are probably more alike than we'd like to admit.
    When I say the media doesn't help, I refer to their one dimensional take on mental health which belittles the suffering of the majority; their label implies all of the mental health folk must be terrorists. Any of us could be victims of clinical depression, anxiety disorder, bi-polar disorder or schizophrenia for example, I've already stated some of the reasons which could be influential but that does not exactly mean such individuals now are all capable of terrorism, so I don't agree that the two are more alike but am not ruling out that they can be intertwined at times, but generally I see those whom are responsible for senseless acts of violence as sinister more then anything else and deserve no sympathy.

    If mental health itself was the big motivation then the majority of sufferers would be indulging in acts of terrorism, more often then not one who does experience a mental health problem should be able to tell the difference between right and wrong when it comes to other human beings, the biggest risk they present is to themselves which is why self-harm is a common consequence of their pain and in growing circumstances suicide unfortunately.
    Last edited by shaz619; 7th November 2017 at 14:46.


    Ah, so this is what it feels like

  11. #11
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    miss the old times where these terms didn't exists. Today's society is getting softer every decade

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by shaz619 View Post
    I think there are a lot of instances where mental health is being used as a scapegoat to sugarcoat deep rooted causes for a specific act of violence, unfortunately this tends to belittle those who have genuine mental health problems and struggle on a daily. And it's almost as if implying those who suffer from it should be locked up because they are likely to do something stupid, mental health itself has been demonized by the media to an extent and almost created a stereotype out of it but it's looked upon as a valid justification at the same time, but when someone makes such a claim it needs to be investigated because it could be a hate crime or an act of violence towards another for example due to jealousy.

    I've not seen people use mental health problems to justify their actions but I've seen folk use black magic as an excuse lol

    And I can't speak for other cases but personally I'd agree with you that one can't exactly become out of touch with what's right or wrong. The stereotypes are insulting because those who have genuine problems often resort to self harm and in the UK especially, where such a condition is taboo among men, suicide rates have been higher then ever since 2001 in the UK and Ireland, suicide remains the leading cause of death for men between 20 and 34 in England and Wales, representing 24% of all deaths in 2013, and for men aged 35-49, at 13% of deaths, it's at record levels in UK universities, in 2015 alone 134 students killed themselves and a growing number who report mental health problems tend to commit suicide.

    It's something really serious but these people are not given adequate help or are looked down upon, the rubbish in the media doesn't help either because their definition of a mental issue is too one dimensional.
    Well said.

    President Trump and the Republican Party in the US are saying lax gun laws is not the main reason behind these mass shootings but mental health problems.

    Okay, how about President Trump and the GOP put more funding into mental health care in the US then ? No, instead these hypocrites want to gut Obamacare and slash Medicaid - which is the largest source of funding for mental health treatment in the US.

    Earlier this year, Republicans in Congress and Trump reversed a rule to make it more difficult for individuals with a severe mental illness to purchase a gun ! Their punitive healthcare bills including the most recent proposal (Graham-Cassidy) would've seen many lose their access to mental health care.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Markhor View Post
    Well said.

    President Trump and the Republican Party in the US are saying lax gun laws is not the main reason behind these mass shootings but mental health problems.

    Okay, how about President Trump and the GOP put more funding into mental health care in the US then ? No, instead these hypocrites want to gut Obamacare and slash Medicaid - which is the largest source of funding for mental health treatment in the US.

    Earlier this year, Republicans in Congress and Trump reversed a rule to make it more difficult for individuals with a severe mental illness to purchase a gun ! Their punitive healthcare bills including the most recent proposal (Graham-Cassidy) would've seen many lose their access to mental health care.
    Reading such posts about the US makes me more grateful as a Brit, we could certainly do a better job on the mental health front but imagine if our firearms policy was extremely relaxed! I genuinely would be worried for all my family and friends.

    In the end, that's what American's voted for; but am shocked that people even on this forum still defend that clown despite his hypocritical transgressions.


    Ah, so this is what it feels like

  14. #14
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    The thing with mental illness is there aren't any specific tests to diagnose them. You can't order a blood test or an MRI and diagnose someone. It is very easy to fake symptoms and get away with it. People use it for their own sick motives. If I am not wrong Jeffrey Dahmer tried to use mental illness as a scape. He was convicted for cannibalism and necrophilia. Interesting thing is although cannibalism and necrophilia are mental illnesses but he was found to be mentally sane.

  15. #15
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    Only about three to five percent of violent acts in the US are committed by individuals who have been diagnosed with a mental illness, and the percentage of crimes they commit with a gun "are lower than the national average for persons not diagnosed with mental illness," according to findings published in the American Journal of Psychiatry in 2015.
    http://www.aljazeera.com/news/2017/1...162521074.html

    Pretty much confirms the nonsense in the media.


    Lions don't lose sleep over the opinions of Sheep

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raja Sab View Post
    miss the old times where these terms didn't exists. Today's society is getting softer every decade
    Do you view someone who has a mental health problem as soft?

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by SandyB View Post
    Absolutely !

    Our cinema always portrays caricatures of mental health issues. People in hospitals, screaming behind bars, always aggressive and worst of all the "shock treatment" stereotype.

    You have no idea what damage it does to ordinary people with actual mental wellness issues, and it prevents them from coming forward with those.
    Quote Originally Posted by James View Post
    Do you view someone who has a mental health problem as soft?

    People in Pakistan don't understand this. Even I didn't till it hit my family, the one who used to laugh off such things. Now all I see is most of them sitting inside their rooms disconnected from everyone else and the life cycle.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by KingKhanWC View Post
    http://www.aljazeera.com/news/2017/1...162521074.html

    Pretty much confirms the nonsense in the media.
    Hadn't seen those numbers before but it supports my earlier post as well, people need to become more educated with regards to mental health itself and not go by stereotypes created in the media. And it's not about it being easy to point all the root causes of a heinous crime on sinister motives; it's just true for majority of the time


    Ah, so this is what it feels like

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