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  1. #1
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    Counties seek to guard against IPL

    Yorkshire director of cricket Martyn Moxon was left bemoaning an "impossible position" after confirming David Willey had signed for the Chennai Super Kings in the Indian Premier League just days before the start of the English County Championship season.

    Willey, a big-hitting batsman and left-arm seam bowler who has taken the new ball for England in limited overs cricket and has played a key role with the Perth Scorchers in the BBL, received his call-up after an injury to India's Kedar Jadhav.

    Willey, the son of former England batsman Peter Willey, has joined Yorkshire and England teammate Liam Plunkett, selected by the Delhi Daredevils in place of South Africa paceman Kagiso Rabada last weekend, as a late call-up to the lucrative Twenty20 franchise event.

    But the absence of Willey and Plunkett has disrupted Yorkshire's plans ahead of the start of their campaign in the Championship, English domestic cricket's first-class four-day competition, against title-holders Essex on Friday.

    Yorkshire leg-spinner Adil Rashid and Nottinghamshire batsman Alex Hales, both England internationals, had already signed limited-overs only contracts with their counties this season.

    Now Plunkett and Willey's decisions are bound to heighten fears that the standard of the Championship, the proving ground for Test players, is being compromised and Moxon said it was time for the England and Wales Cricket Board (ECB) to "future-proof" the competition.

    "We find ourselves in an impossible situation with these late replacement requests," Moxon told Yorkshire's website on Monday.

    "At the moment, we are potentially looking at a situation where if we deny a player an opportunity, we will be left with someone who is not completely focused on playing for Yorkshire. This would be counter-productive.

    "There are now 12 English players in this year’s IPL, so the issue goes further than just here at Headingley (Yorkshire's headquarters in the northern English city of Leeds)."

    The former Yorkshire and England opening batsman added: "I will be chairing a meeting with other directors of cricket (Tuesday) at Edgbaston to discuss the future of the game.

    "With the number of domestic T20 contracts available worldwide, it is important that we future-proof the County Championship.

    "I will be calling for the introduction of a cut-off date, after which players will not be allowed to go to the IPL. Hopefully this can gain national approval and be supported by the ECB."

    Meanwhile, India allrounder Axar Patel is to join Durham for the final six County Championship fixtures of the upcoming season.

    The 24-year-old left-arm spinner, who has made 38 ODI appearances and played in 11 T20 internationals, will arrive at Chester-le-Street in August.

    "Durham County Cricket Club is delighted to announce that Indian star Axar Patel will join the club for the final six County Championship fixtures of the 2018 season," said a club statement.

    "The international spinner has enjoyed success in first-class cricket for state side Gujarat and is a key part of India's T20I and ODI squads, as well as the King's XI Punjab's IPL side."

    Patel has taken 79 first-class wickets and has also scored an unbeaten century.

    https://www.cricket.com.au/news/davi...xon/2018-04-10
    Last edited by hadi123; 10th April 2018 at 10:27.

  2. #2
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    Will IPL be affected by players being prevented from playing? County championship quality has gone down after many english players going to India for IPL.

  3. #3
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    For first few seasons IPL refused to allow English players due to the attitude of ECB and Counties. Ultimately the players forced the counties and ECB.

    Yorkshire can refuse to release Willey. Why are they not doing so?

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by cricketjoshila View Post
    Yorkshire can refuse to release Willey. Why are they not doing so?
    Or they should offload him before the next county season. Bet they won't do that and are happy to be part of the sorry mess long term.

  5. #5
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    There needs to be a system worked out for sure; the current one is pretty unsustainable. I think a call up deadline would probably go a long way to solving things for players that are contracted to the county team. In this case with the season starting tomorrow, a team has lost their main all-rounder out of nowhere. It's an unrecoverable loss pretty much. We need to sustain the first-class structures in countries as they give a permanency to test cricket that will otherwise be lost.

  6. #6
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    Some 12 or 13 English players are playing in IPL now. Just a few years back, we hardly had any of them! Professional cricketers now have a choice and are exercising their rights. Soon there will be Lankan league in August and CPL version 2.0 in Aug-September further impacting County teams.

  7. #7
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    This is just the free market at work. Choices puts the power with the players. And most of them are making it clear where their choices are.

    Coming up with a cut off date will only put a band aid to the current situation. What happens when IPL expands from 8 to 10 or 12 teams. Which it will. Then the league goes on longer. Do they move the cut off date?

  8. #8
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    Why is county cricket so sacred?

    When international players were being snapped up to play in England, there was no problem. Upset the old order, and suddenly they throw their toys out of the pram.

  9. #9
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    I mean forget even first class competitions - county cricket has contributed to the exodus of several players from South African cricket full stop. Full internationals giving up their careers to play a first class competition! No outrage then!

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zahid87 View Post
    I mean forget even first class competitions - county cricket has contributed to the exodus of several players from South African cricket full stop. Full internationals giving up their careers to play a first class competition! No outrage then!
    Came here to type that.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by JaDed View Post
    Came here to type that.
    More proof of IPL being acknowledged as the highest quality league...

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by cricketindiafan View Post
    Some 12 or 13 English players are playing in IPL now. Just a few years back, we hardly had any of them! Professional cricketers now have a choice and are exercising their rights. Soon there will be Lankan league in August and CPL version 2.0 in Aug-September further impacting County teams.
    No chance of any English players going off to the CPL or Sri Lankan league. The CPLs been running for years now anyway.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zahid87 View Post
    Why is county cricket so sacred?

    When international players were being snapped up to play in England, there was no problem. Upset the old order, and suddenly they throw their toys out of the pram.
    County cricket never stopped players from playing in their own local first class tournaments.

    Quote Originally Posted by Zahid87 View Post
    I mean forget even first class competitions - county cricket has contributed to the exodus of several players from South African cricket full stop. Full internationals giving up their careers to play a first class competition! No outrage then!
    Thee ECB have done all they can in order to prevent it from happening.

  14. #14
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    money rules man, most men anyway and ipl makes the most money so why would cricketers not choose it? i used to love test cricket too but the dwindling love for test cricket shows that people don't have the time

  15. #15
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    They are going to play IPL. Counties need to get use to it.

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zahid87 View Post
    I mean forget even first class competitions - county cricket has contributed to the exodus of several players from South African cricket full stop. Full internationals giving up their careers to play a first class competition! No outrage then!
    For example?

  17. #17
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    I hope cricketers worldover will take the advice seriously and do the honourable thing, viz playing in PSL for free.

  18. #18
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    County and test cricket's death makes me happy. No more 5 day farce to make us cricket fans look like idiots

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robert View Post
    For example?
    i guess he meant the players from south africa recently gone with kolpak deal.
    but he is forgetting something its because of racial quotas that they are forced to look somewhere else .

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by The cricket enthusiast View Post
    i guess he meant the players from south africa recently gone with kolpak deal.
    but he is forgetting something its because of racial quotas that they are forced to look somewhere else .
    So no SA internationals have given up their international careers to play CC.

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robert View Post
    So no SA internationals have given up their international careers to play CC.
    Kyle Abbot? Rilee Rossouw?

    Morne Morkel...just retired from internationals to sign a 2 year county deal?

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robert View Post
    So no SA internationals have given up their international careers to play CC.
    Kyle Abbott, Roussow, Alviro Peterson. While Zimbabwean for a few years Taylor and Jarvis.

    The ECB and the county system actively seeks out players from other countries to try and bring them in as future recruits - Archer, Jordan, Robson etc come to mind.

    Hard to feel sympathy to the IPL doing the same.


    Quote Originally Posted by Saqs on Steve Smith
    And who taught him to bat? Chris Martin? Is he the Australian equivalent of ....wait, I'm struggling to think of another useless player of his calibre.

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by cricketjoshila View Post
    For first few seasons IPL refused to allow English players due to the attitude of ECB and Counties. Ultimately the players forced the counties and ECB.

    Yorkshire can refuse to release Willey. Why are they not doing so?
    That is not true it was ECB that not permit their players to participate.

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zahid87 View Post
    Kyle Abbot? Rilee Rossouw?

    Morne Morkel...just retired from internationals to sign a 2 year county deal?
    So they get offered jobs.

    This just means that they close their international careers and extend their playing careers by dropping down a level where long experience is more useful than waning physical ability.

    You might as well say that CCCs force ex-England players to stop playing for England. They just stop getting picked by England.

  25. #25
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    I think the only measure they can take is to ban players form joining as replacements because Curran, Willey and Plunkett has all joined last minute. The auction happens a couple months earlier so county teams have time to adjust plans but these last minute call ups are problematic. It just shows the draw of the IPL and franchise cricket and the death of FC/ County Cricket.

  26. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zahid87 View Post
    I mean forget even first class competitions - county cricket has contributed to the exodus of several players from South African cricket full stop. Full internationals giving up their careers to play a first class competition! No outrage then!
    County's cricket folks are biggest hypocrites !

  27. #27
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    Pretty rich coming from county cricket who regularly poach other countries players. Mr Moxon it is free world every player is entitled to make his money.

    When Counties and England poach player it is okay but other countries use player for couple of months then it is a crime.

  28. #28
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    I think with the support of the cricket boards and the money involved in IPL, it will be difficult for the counties to stop their players from participating in IPL.

  29. #29
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    I think the CA feel that their players playing in other leagues that their players are getting out of hand and the whole ball tampering saga, was this picked up by playing with others from other countries.

  30. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by princeuk View Post
    I think the CA feel that their players playing in other leagues that their players are getting out of hand and the whole ball tampering saga, was this picked up by playing with others from other countries.
    Totally agree with u. Every cricket board needs to establish some sort of control over the movement if its player.

  31. #31
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    Counties and ECB have no right to complain about IPL or any other T20 league.They have been leeching playing from other countries for decades.

    IPL is still paying 10 of players salaries to the boards.Is Big Bash doing the same??

  32. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robert View Post
    So they get offered jobs.

    This just means that they close their international careers and extend their playing careers by dropping down a level where long experience is more useful than waning physical ability.

    You might as well say that CCCs force ex-England players to stop playing for England. They just stop getting picked by England.
    Not sure what you are trying to get at here. Yes, they get offered jobs. But I would argue that those players, with maybe the exception of Morkel, were not on the wane.

    Convict raised the example of Brendan Taylor from Zimbabwe. He was at the peak of his career. He left for the counties.

    And with a broader brush, you can see that there have been several players who have been encouraged by the ECB to take advantage of the existing rules and qualify to play for England. For Jofra Archer - he is Bajan full stop. Born and bred.

    What motivation does he have to play for England, other than to earn more money than he would through playing for the West Indies.

    You can be blind and defend the ECB...but there is no harm in admitting that there are faults there. Jofra Archer and Chris Jordan should represent the West Indies. Eoin Morgan should play for Ireland.

  33. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robert View Post
    So they get offered jobs.

    This just means that they close their international careers and extend their playing careers by dropping down a level where long experience is more useful than waning physical ability.

    You might as well say that CCCs force ex-England players to stop playing for England. They just stop getting picked by England.
    No what it means is, players like Abbot and Morkel find more security and money in playing county cricket over their national team. Nothing wrong there but when counties and England start start moaning and whining about IPL it gets irritating.

    How Abbot is free to do what he feels is best for himself , so are other players who are choosing IPL over county cricket .

  34. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by RainMan_ View Post
    How can u be so sure about that?

    Everybody wants to keep the exclusivity of their product. How do u know that in future CA or ECB won't follow the path of BCCI and restrict theirs players from playing xyz leagues? Not saying it will happen immediately, but u can't just shrug off the possibility of it happening in future.
    Simple reason money. Most Indian players earn big money playing ipl and for india. The money ipl pays cannot be matched by any league in the world, why would anyone agree to not participate in a league that pays you more for 3 months than you make playing whole year.

    ECB weren't exactly hot for the ipl but players seem to have convinced them to back down.

  35. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by RainMan_ View Post
    How can u be so sure about that?

    Everybody wants to keep the exclusivity of their product. How do u know that in future CA or ECB won't follow the path of BCCI and restrict theirs players from playing xyz leagues? Not saying it will happen immediately, but u can't just shrug off the possibility of it happening in future.
    Do you think SA wanted to lose Abbot or Riley, no they want to keep them.County cricket is offering more money which they could not match hence they have lost them.

    If tomorrow some other league offers more money than IPL these players will stop coming to IPL.There is nothing wrong with it either.

  36. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by jadaja View Post
    Do you think SA wanted to lose Abbot or Riley, no they want to keep them.County cricket is offering more money which they could not match hence they have lost them.

    If tomorrow some other league offers more money than IPL these players will stop coming to IPL.There is nothing wrong with it either.
    Wrong. Abbot retired from international cricket because he had very little chance of getting selected in the national team due to southafrica's stupid quota system. Southafrican team can't afford to have more than one white bowler in the team. It's quite obvious that Abbot would never be able to make it to the playing 11 ahead of styen. This why he retired and signed the kolpak deal.

    He didn't retire just for money. Yes, money was one of the reasons but the main reason of his early retirement was his very slim chance to play for Southafrica again.


    Hardly any international player will decide to play in a t20 league ahead of his national team. Yes, there will be some greedy idiot players who will prefer t20 league above national team, but their number is few and far between.

  37. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by jagatk View Post
    Simple reason money. Most Indian players earn big money playing ipl and for india. The money ipl pays cannot be matched by any league in the world, why would anyone agree to not participate in a league that pays you more for 3 months than you make playing whole year.

    ECB weren't exactly hot for the ipl but players seem to have convinced them to back down.
    Because the respective boards will bann their players from playing in IPL. Boards will simply say that if any player plays in IPL he will no longer be eligible to play for the national team. It's as simple as that. Nobody in their right mind will select IPL ahead of his national team.

  38. #38
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    If India can restrict its players from playing other t20 leagues, others can do the same. *** for tat.

  39. #39
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    Read an interesting article about this on cricinfo the other day - http://www.espncricinfo.com/story/_/id/23099506

    Interesting to read here that Strauss and ECB are actively encouraging players to join IPL including minimizing fixtures during the IPL window. This is a losing battle that the counties are fighting.

  40. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by RainMan_ View Post
    Wrong. Abbot retired from international cricket because he had very little chance of getting selected in the national team due to southafrica's stupid quota system. Southafrican team can't afford to have more than one white bowler in the team. It's quite obvious that Abbot would never be able to make it to the playing 11 ahead of styen. This why he retired and signed the kolpak deal.

    He didn't retire just for money. Yes, money was one of the reasons but the main reason of his early retirement was his very slim chance to play for Southafrica again.


    Hardly any international player will decide to play in a t20 league ahead of his national team. Yes, there will be some greedy idiot players who will prefer t20 league above national team, but their number is few and far between.
    How will he earn money and contract from CSA if he does not play, he wanted more security, you can spin it anyway you want it is about money.

    If CSA offers three times the money which any county is offering do you think Abbot will worry about playing time, he won't blink an eye to stay put.


    Every established international player will think about money only first , it is the youngsters who think about establishing themselves again nothing wrong with it.They know their time will come in IPL once they do well in international cricket.

  41. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by RainMan_ View Post
    Because the respective boards will bann their players from playing in IPL. Boards will simply say that if any player plays in IPL he will no longer be eligible to play for the national team. It's as simple as that. Nobody in their right mind will select IPL ahead of his national team.
    Quote Originally Posted by dildilpak View Post
    Read an interesting article about this on cricinfo the other day - http://www.espncricinfo.com/story/_/id/23099506

    Interesting to read here that Strauss and ECB are actively encouraging players to join IPL including minimizing fixtures during the IPL window. This is a losing battle that the counties are fighting.
    Interestingly contrasting views. I guess the second one is reality, as it is already happening. While the first I think is wishful thinking.

  42. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by dildilpak View Post
    Read an interesting article about this on cricinfo the other day - http://www.espncricinfo.com/story/_/id/23099506

    Interesting to read here that Strauss and ECB are actively encouraging players to join IPL including minimizing fixtures during the IPL window. This is a losing battle that the counties are fighting.
    Problem is that the ECB's interests, the players' interest and the counties' interests don't always work in the same direction. Even if the ECB is happy with a player gaining experience in the IPL, it still weakens a county team, and reduces interest in its domestic games.

    I know that the ECB gets 20% of each England players' IPL money - not sure if they eat it all up, or do they give it to the players' county team. They should be doing the latter, but if I had to guess, they would be eating it all.

    On top of that, they also cut players' salaries for every day they play in the IPL instead of county. If anything, the counties need to be complaining about the ECB, not the IPL.

    By the way, when a foreign player is signed up for county cricket, does the ECB pay 20% or any percent back to the players' home board? I don't think so.....

  43. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by RainMan_ View Post
    If India can restrict its players from playing other t20 leagues, others can do the same. *** for tat.
    nobody is stopping them from doing it.. and nobody has been able to do it.. I don't know why NZ, Aus and SA will bother to stop their players from playing in IPL. first of two of those countries don't even have local T20 leagues and they will be happy that their players are playing somewhere making money for themselves, to the board all the while rubbing shoulders with the best in the business in that format. ALl that while it is a off season for them back home..

    IPL has picked the right time of the year as it has more or less natural window with most of the countries not playing too much during this time of the year. It makes no business sense for the boards to restrict their players.. Worst case scenario if some boards insists to do that, then they will find players refusing their central contract.. There are already players in Eng refusing FC contracts and sticking to LOIs. What will stop them from taking it to the next step and potentially make 5x as much money for the same or less work.

    India restricts their players in playing other T20 leagues as it is in their best interests and they can get away with it. Pak lets its players play in every league in existence (apart from IPL) as they that is in their best interests. I am sure all other boards are taking care of their best interests. It has been 10 years FGS.. so they have had enough time to know what is in their best interests..

    My prediction is that over a period of time (possibly within a decade) most boards will settle down to allowing their centrally contracted players to participate in no more than two T20 leagues. Most grade A players will chose their own league and IPL/BBL/English league. Those who don't get into these primary leagues will chose their home league + whatever league pays the best among the rest.. There will be some fading superstars who will not be signing contracts and will be mercenaries ready to play everywhere.. Most brand conscious leagues will avoid such mercenaries once their leagues settles down...

  44. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by OoparCut View Post
    Problem is that the ECB's interests, the players' interest and the counties' interests don't always work in the same direction. Even if the ECB is happy with a player gaining experience in the IPL, it still weakens a county team, and reduces interest in its domestic games.

    I know that the ECB gets 20% of each England players' IPL money - not sure if they eat it all up, or do they give it to the players' county team. They should be doing the latter, but if I had to guess, they would be eating it all.

    On top of that, they also cut players' salaries for every day they play in the IPL instead of county. If anything, the counties need to be complaining about the ECB, not the IPL.

    By the way, when a foreign player is signed up for county cricket, does the ECB pay 20% or any percent back to the players' home board? I don't think so.....
    I don't think any other league or board does it.. It is a good practice and should be made mandatory. After all the home board has invested in their players

  45. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by OoparCut View Post
    Problem is that the ECB's interests, the players' interest and the counties' interests don't always work in the same direction. Even if the ECB is happy with a player gaining experience in the IPL, it still weakens a county team, and reduces interest in its domestic games.

    I know that the ECB gets 20% of each England players' IPL money - not sure if they eat it all up, or do they give it to the players' county team. They should be doing the latter, but if I had to guess, they would be eating it all.
    I think it depends on if they're centrally contracted or not. Centrally contracted players are paid purely by the ECB and not their county so I'd assume not in their case.

    Quote Originally Posted by OoparCut View Post
    On top of that, they also cut players' salaries for every day they play in the IPL instead of county. If anything, the counties need to be complaining about the ECB, not the IPL.
    The ECB are paying the players to play county cricket, think it's understandable that they then cut their pay proportionally if that's not what the player in question is doing.

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    Its not just the money alone at play here - county cricket has to now deal with the fact that that test cricket is now a dying breed and as principle feeders for test cricket, they won’t have the same relevance as before. For them its also a loss of face that an ‘upstart’ league their own board despised earlier is upstaging them. For county cricket to be still relevant in the coming years, the whole county system itself would need a revamp.

  47. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by USofA View Post
    Interestingly contrasting views. I guess the second one is reality, as it is already happening. While the first I think is wishful thinking.
    Isolating BCCI in ICC voting was once a wishful thinking but its not anymore.

    U can keep ignoring the reality but that won't change the fact that countries will soon take necessary steps to safeguard their respective t20 leagues from the aggression of BCCI.

    The days of bcci r numbered. Soon the special two months window that IPL enjoys will be abolished. That simple little steps alone will take bcci down to its knees.

  48. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by RainMan_ View Post
    Isolating BCCI in ICC voting was once a wishful thinking but its not anymore.

    U can keep ignoring the reality but that won't change the fact that countries will soon take necessary steps to safeguard their respective t20 leagues from the aggression of BCCI.

    The days of bcci r numbered. Soon the special two months window that IPL enjoys will be abolished. That simple little steps alone will take bcci down to its knees.
    The IPL window will start from 2019 FTP. So its not even started. 11 years of IPL are gone.

    Please send letters to boards with your ideas. Let them bring bcci to its knees.

  49. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by cricketjoshila View Post
    The IPL window will start from 2019 FTP. So its not even started. 11 years of IPL are gone.

    Please send letters to boards with your ideas. Let them bring bcci to its knees.
    I won't have to write letters. They will soon realise it by themselves.

    Actually the process has already started. As Revers3swing pointed out, there's a strong possibility that ECB will SOON take actions to restrict its players from taking part in IPL in order to keep the exclusivity of EPL.

    Let EPL start first and u'll see what follows next.

  50. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by RainMan_ View Post
    I won't have to write letters. They will soon realise it by themselves.

    Actually the process has already started. As Revers3swing pointed out, there's a strong possibility that ECB will SOON take actions to restrict its players from taking part in IPL in order to keep the exclusivity of EPL.

    Let EPL start first and u'll see what follows next.
    Unfortunately for you reverse swing doesnot run ECB.

  51. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by RainMan_ View Post
    Isolating BCCI in ICC voting was once a wishful thinking but its not anymore.

    U can keep ignoring the reality but that won't change the fact that countries will soon take necessary steps to safeguard their respective t20 leagues from the aggression of BCCI.

    The days of bcci r numbered. Soon the special two months window that IPL enjoys will be abolished. That simple little steps alone will take bcci down to its knees.
    Quote Originally Posted by RainMan_ View Post
    I won't have to write letters. They will soon realise it by themselves.

    Actually the process has already started. As Revers3swing pointed out, there's a strong possibility that ECB will SOON take actions to restrict its players from taking part in IPL in order to keep the exclusivity of EPL.

    Let EPL start first and u'll see what follows next.
    These are just possibilities not the reality. Something that might happen in 2-3 years down the road. That is a lot of time. We all know that things can change.

    We will know only when/if it actually happens. I am not saying it will or will not happen. But all this is hypothetical/speculation. So we have to wait. Until then the reality is different.

  52. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by cricketjoshila View Post
    The IPL window will start from 2019 FTP. So its not even started. 11 years of IPL are gone.

    Please send letters to boards with your ideas. Let them bring bcci to its knees.
    You are right. The official window for IPL has not even started. It was just put in place.

    How many years is the new FTP for?

  53. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by USofA View Post
    You are right. The official window for IPL has not even started. It was just put in place.

    How many years is the new FTP for?
    5 years . Till 2023.

    It has given IPL extra 2 weeks. May be we will see team expansion.

  54. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by cricketjoshila View Post
    5 years . Till 2023.

    It has given IPL extra 2 weeks. May be we will see team expansion.
    So IPL has a guaranteed window till 2023, with room for expansion and thus extra games. Then there is nothing to talk about on the whole IPL window topic. Case closed. Can be reopened in 2023.

  55. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by RainMan_ View Post
    Because the respective boards will bann their players from playing in IPL. Boards will simply say that if any player plays in IPL he will no longer be eligible to play for the national team. It's as simple as that. Nobody in their right mind will select IPL ahead of his national team.
    For Australian and English players that is a possibility but what about others, for an abd or rabada or boult, they make more money from 1 season in IPL than they would playing 2-3 years for their country and if CA and ECB ever try banning players BCCI will basically add a not signing for any other t-20 team clause and this basically will kill off the BBL and whatever T-20 ECB create. Money vs Patriotism, money wins most of the time.

  56. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by HitWicket View Post

    The ECB are paying the players to play county cricket, think it's understandable that they then cut their pay proportionally if that's not what the player in question is doing.
    But they are already getting 20% of the player's IPL contract. Why cut their salaries on top of that? Imagine your employer sending you to a different company to get paid training, while getting profits from it, and then turning around and cutting your salary. In fact, companies actually pay for their employees to get training. Even if you think of the IPL gigs as 'consulting' and not training, the fact that ECB is getting a fat commission, means that its move to cut player salaries is shameless and arguably illegal.

  57. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by jagatk View Post
    For Australian and English players that is a possibility but what about others, for an abd or rabada or boult, they make more money from 1 season in IPL than they would playing 2-3 years for their country and if CA and ECB ever try banning players BCCI will basically add a not signing for any other t-20 team clause and this basically will kill off the BBL and whatever T-20 ECB create. Money vs Patriotism, money wins most of the time.
    The other boards should be careful not to push BCCI into a corner. Imagine if the IPL started offering exclusive contracts to top players, which legally require them to prioritize IPL over their other commitments. Think back to the Australian contract dispute between players and the board - where the Aussie board tried to strong-arm the players by refusing to pay salaries until the players agreed to terms. What if the IPL had stepped in while the players were uncontracted, and signed up the likes of Starc, Warner etc to "exclusive" contracts?

    Of course the BCCI is not going to do such things, because its in their interest to maintain positive relations with the ICC and other boards. But push the 800 pound gorilla hard enough...

  58. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by OoparCut View Post
    The other boards should be careful not to push BCCI into a corner. Imagine if the IPL started offering exclusive contracts to top players, which legally require them to prioritize IPL over their other commitments. Think back to the Australian contract dispute between players and the board - where the Aussie board tried to strong-arm the players by refusing to pay salaries until the players agreed to terms. What if the IPL had stepped in while the players were uncontracted, and signed up the likes of Starc, Warner etc to "exclusive" contracts?

    Of course the BCCI is not going to do such things, because its in their interest to maintain positive relations with the ICC and other boards. But push the 800 pound gorilla hard enough...
    Only 3-4 leagues will survive bcci ecb ca already have billion dollar contracts. Rest of the boards cant match it.

    Ipl will start from march last week to May last week from 2020. Ecb league will run in july august i believe and Bbl in dec to feb.

    India aus sa nz will have home season starting oct to feb.Eng home season from june to sep. So at the most one more league will get enough space to have decent foreigners. The board which will have most money will win it.

  59. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by cricketjoshila View Post
    Only 3-4 leagues will survive bcci ecb ca already have billion dollar contracts. Rest of the boards cant match it.

    Ipl will start from march last week to May last week from 2020. Ecb league will run in july august i believe and Bbl in dec to feb.

    India aus sa nz will have home season starting oct to feb.Eng home season from june to sep. So at the most one more league will get enough space to have decent foreigners. The board which will have most money will win it.
    If the current trends keep going, then the next time around the boards need to 'vote' on FTP commitments, how many countries will vote to keep so many international bilateral games on the schedule? These games will keep getting fewer in number, and teams that don't have their own leagues with top quality players, will not be able to develop their own players.

  60. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by OoparCut View Post
    But they are already getting 20% of the player's IPL contract. Why cut their salaries on top of that? Imagine your employer sending you to a different company to get paid training, while getting profits from it, and then turning around and cutting your salary. In fact, companies actually pay for their employees to get training. Even if you think of the IPL gigs as 'consulting' and not training, the fact that ECB is getting a fat commission, means that its move to cut player salaries is shameless and arguably illegal.
    The English players actually pay their counties from their pocket when they play IPL. Strauss had to reimburse the county because Sam Billings received so little from IPL that he was losing money a couple of years ago. Strauss and ECB want their best white ball players to participate in IPL.

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    Quote Originally Posted by OoparCut View Post
    If the current trends keep going, then the next time around the boards need to 'vote' on FTP commitments, how many countries will vote to keep so many international bilateral games on the schedule? These games will keep getting fewer in number, and teams that don't have their own leagues with top quality players, will not be able to develop their own players.
    There is no voting I think. Infact individual boards are free to choose their FTPs.

  62. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by rhony View Post
    There is no voting I think. Infact individual boards are free to choose their FTPs.
    Wrong.

  63. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by OoparCut View Post
    Wrong.
    He is right. There is no voting. Unless there is something exceptional like IPL window.

  64. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by rhony View Post
    Strauss and ECB want their best white ball players to participate in IPL.


    That's what I said, ECB interests don't always line up with the counties. ECB has some major re-structuring to do with county cricket, and they are trying. But there is rampant politics and favoritism. A cricinfo reporter who wrote about this is getting sued. For among other things, using a picture of an ECB executive with a tie reflecting county colors - he's accused of using a picture libelously!! Its basically strong-arm tactics.

  65. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by cricketjoshila View Post
    He is right. There is no voting. Unless there is something exceptional like IPL window.
    All countries just voted to commit themselves to a test championship, didn't they? They also voted on the outine of a basic structure of bilateral tours.

  66. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by OoparCut View Post
    All countries just voted to commit themselves to a test championship, didn't they? They also voted on the outine of a basic structure of bilateral tours.
    Test championship and its structure is a exceptional item as it didnot exist earlier.

  67. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by OoparCut View Post
    But they are already getting 20% of the player's IPL contract. Why cut their salaries on top of that? Imagine your employer sending you to a different company to get paid training, while getting profits from it, and then turning around and cutting your salary. In fact, companies actually pay for their employees to get training. Even if you think of the IPL gigs as 'consulting' and not training, the fact that ECB is getting a fat commission, means that its move to cut player salaries is shameless and arguably illegal.
    The BCCI are paying the foreign boards to make their players available (and reduce fixtures in the period) . It's not the equivalent of paid training in a standard workplace, the ECB aren't sending the players there and if that were the case they would treat is as if it were such as when they recognised the benefits someone likes Billings (who will never play test cricket) would get and reimbursed him given he was set to make a loss in his income by joining the IPL. In the end the players are being paid to county cricket and are not doing that therefore it wouldn't make much sense to be paying them for it.

    Quote Originally Posted by OoparCut View Post
    A cricinfo reporter who wrote about this is getting sued. For among other things, using a picture of an ECB executive with a tie reflecting county colors - he's accused of using a picture libelously!! Its basically strong-arm tactics.
    It would be incredibly naive to assume that in the entire 8 page non-public legal document the pinnacle of the legal challenge was the colour of his tie in the photo. I'd imagine the larger issue was with the accusations of verbal intimidation by Graves in order to maintain his position whilst using direct quotes without any kind of reference or source.

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    How did I miss this thread? It's pure gold!

    Someone needs to remind them that Brittania doesn't rule the world any more and that the "good old days" got over about 70 years ago.

    Get used to BCCI telling you what to do, and you'll do it.

    As someone noted in the thread, ECB tried to block the English players from prioritizing IPL when it started. Over the year, the market forced its hand and see how many England players are playing in IPL now.

    Deal with it, boys! IPL is the only game in town, everything else must wait. And the window will keep expanding.
    Last edited by UN talkz; 17th April 2018 at 12:18.

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    Quote Originally Posted by HitWicket View Post
    The BCCI are paying the foreign boards to make their players available (and reduce fixtures in the period) . It's not the equivalent of paid training in a standard workplace, the ECB aren't sending the players there and if that were the case they would treat is as if it were such as when they recognised the benefits someone likes Billings (who will never play test cricket) would get and reimbursed him given he was set to make a loss in his income by joining the IPL. In the end the players are being paid to county cricket and are not doing that therefore it wouldn't make much sense to be paying them for it.



    It would be incredibly naive to assume that in the entire 8 page non-public legal document the pinnacle of the legal challenge was the colour of his tie in the photo. I'd imagine the larger issue was with the accusations of verbal intimidation by Graves in order to maintain his position whilst using direct quotes without any kind of reference or source.
    Looks like Alec Stewart also feels that the ECB are screwing the counties and players with the IPL

    Surrey director of cricket Alec Stewart has called on the England and Wales Cricket Board to redistribute money it has received from the BCCI for the participation of English players in the Indian Premier League. This year, the ECB receive the equivalent of 20 percent of a player's IPL contract. Yet, despite the presence of 12 English players in the 2018 tournament, none of that money has been passed onto the counties.



    "We have discovered that the ECB have been receiving 10% of the overall contract a player gets from IPL for a number of years and this year it is 20%," said Stewart. "Should the ECB be keeping that? Or should that money come back to the county, who are the ones who miss out? It should come back to the county."



    Counties have long argued that the "compensation" for releasing a player for the IPL should be better. At present, this on Central Contracts are deducted only 1/365th of their annual retainer for each day they are on IPL duty, which goes back to the ECB. For other players, clubs receive a one percent return of the county salary for every day of 21 days, before that comes down to 0.7 percent from then on. However, this is a drop in the bucket compared to the payments received by the ECB.

    "At the moment, the players take the hit," says Stewart. "But if we get the 20 percent compensation coming from the IPL then I would argue the player should only be paying a daily rate, 1/365th, rather than the one percent. I think that would be fair.

    "Obviously if they are not with us they wouldn't expect to be paid by us so paying back a day rate makes sense, as long as we are getting the full 20% compensation that the IPL pay the ECB. Then everyone is looked after: as counties, we have lost a top player, but there is a sum of money that can be reinvested and the player is not being hit by one percent. If there is a fair amount of money that is going from the IPL to the ECB in compensation, then why does that not end up back at the counties? Of course it should."
    Last edited by hadi123; 17th April 2018 at 18:32.

  70. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by OoparCut View Post
    Looks like Alec Stewart also feels that the ECB are screwing the counties and players with the IPL
    The 20% is compensation from the BCCI to the ECB for giving the NOC and avoiding scheduling games during that period hence why the likes of Stokes, Woakes and Ali won't get the 20% compensation.

    If a player is centrally contracted the county don't pay them a penny and have no contract with them hence giving them compensation for not having that player does not make much sense.

    If a player is not centrally contracted then the county receives their compensation in the form of reducing the players salary that they themselves pay. Ultimately if the county wanted to they could refuse them the right to play in the IPL but chances are that wouldn't go down well with the player.
    Last edited by hadi123; 17th April 2018 at 18:33.

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    Alec Stewart has hit the nail on the head here, are they ECB players or IPL players? Who gets to dictate what should happen?

    And why are IPL contacting the players directly rather than negotiating with ECB first, It seems rather sneaky and underhand....dangle the carrot in front of the player first and let them fight it out with ECB who will feel compelled to let them go, its not very professional on IPL's part is it.

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    Shoe on the other foot now. These counties have stolen so many players from SA and Windies through the Kolpak deal. Thats how the free market works

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    Quote Originally Posted by princeuk View Post
    Alec Stewart has hit the nail on the head here, are they ECB players or IPL players? Who gets to dictate what should happen?

    And why are IPL contacting the players directly rather than negotiating with ECB first, It seems rather sneaky and underhand....dangle the carrot in front of the player first and let them fight it out with ECB who will feel compelled to let them go, its not very professional on IPL's part is it.
    As others pointed out, it is the same tactic that the counties use by dangling the carrot (Kolpack) with the player directly and blind-siding the affected country completely. The counties misused the Kolpack rules for too long, not too many would sympathize if they are on the receiving end now.

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    What I find interesting is how IPL apologists are getting worried. They do not seem to understand that ECB will make it clear - your country or your franchise.

    The year is not far off, 2020.

  75. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by princeuk View Post
    Alec Stewart has hit the nail on the head here, are they ECB players or IPL players? Who gets to dictate what should happen?

    And why are IPL contacting the players directly rather than negotiating with ECB first, It seems rather sneaky and underhand....dangle the carrot in front of the player first and let them fight it out with ECB who will feel compelled to let them go, its not very professional on IPL's part is it.
    Lol. All players require ECB's NOC to play the IPL or to even put their names in the auction. ECB can try and not issue the NOCs.


    ECB gets 20% of what a player gets. If ecb isnt giving it to the counties its ecb's issue.

  76. #76
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    IPL haters do not understand ECB is encouraging players to play tge IPL. Just because posters on PP hate IPL, ECB wont ban IPL.

  77. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by cricketjoshila View Post
    IPL haters do not understand ECB is encouraging players to play tge IPL. Just because posters on PP hate IPL, ECB wont ban IPL.
    ECB would love to ban IPL, but they have accepted the reality that they can't. Even if the new fangled English league does get started and does well, which is by no means guaranteed. Look at SA's attempts to start their league.

  78. #78
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    I said it here first- The new English League will fail,

    - The new SA league ( if it ever happens) will fail,

    - The new Lankan league will fail.

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    Quote Originally Posted by cricketjoshila View Post
    Lol. All players require ECB's NOC to play the IPL or to even put their names in the auction. ECB can try and not issue the NOCs.


    ECB gets 20% of what a player gets. If ecb isnt giving it to the counties its ecb's issue.
    The players are paying the counties a daily rate for the number of days they miss the county games to play IPL too.

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    Quote Originally Posted by cricketjoshila View Post
    IPL haters do not understand ECB is encouraging players to play tge IPL. Just because posters on PP hate IPL, ECB wont ban IPL.
    It is dificult for people to understand how an IPL contract is coveted among players. Australian players regularly miss their own Big Bash (most times because they dont have a window) but play IPL. Same with SA and Eng. There is a reason why there is an unofficial window for IPL


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