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  1. #1
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    "Wahab Riaz has not won us a game in two years" : Mickey Arthur

    LAHORE: Pacer Wahab Riaz has become the latest casualty of coach Mickey Arthur’s drive towards a high-performance culture within the Pakistan squad. So low has Wahab’s stock fallen that he was not even part of the 25 probables recently chosen for a training camp, from which a squad will be chosen to tour Ireland and England this summer. Arthur was moved to question Wahab’s training “work ethic” in justifying the decision, as well as providing the scathing assessment that he had not “won us a game in two years”. Pakistan’s selection panel, headed by Inzamamul Haq, has chosen five fast bowlers – Mohammad Amir, Muhammad Abbas, Hasan Ali, Mir Hamza and Rahat Ali – for the camp. The all-rounder Faheem Ashraf is also available and the 17-year-old left-arm sensation Shaheen Shah Afridi is in the pool as a developmental pick. Sixteen will be chosen from the 25 in the final squad.

    “He has not won us a game in two years,” Arthur said. “I expect players that have been around for a long time to be winning us games and setting standards. Otherwise we will invest in younger players who have long futures. We have good youngsters around. Dropping Wahab is a big decision but we have chosen a squad according to the time of year, country and conditions. The guys need to push themselves and get out of their comfort zones.” Wahab did undergo a fitness test, where he registered a score of 17.4, which qualifies as a passing mark. But Arthur wanted him to touch 19 – an unofficial benchmark set for a fast bowler. He was outdone by the newcomer Afridi, who scored 18. “I cannot fault Wahab when he has a ball in his hand but his work ethic around training is something needs to be looked at,” Arthur said. “I am changing the culture in this Pakistan environment and I am not interested in players doing just the bare minimum. I want players winning us games of cricket and pushing themselves to be the best they can be. This is a high-performance environment, not a environment where mediocrity is accepted. Unless you are winning games consistently, you are under pressure for your position.”

    At 32, and already out of favour from the white-ball squads, the omission leaves Wahab’s international future very much up in the air. Although he debuted for Pakistan in 2008, it is only since the summer of 2014 when – returning under the tenure of Waqar Younis – Wahab became a fixture in the side. Waqar was understandably keen on the threat of his pace and a slingy action good for reverse. Since then he has built a career of memorable spells, rather than a memorable career itself. Lead among those is the World Cup 2015 spell in Adelaide, but there was an immense nineteen-over spell in the afternoon heat of Dubai against England, that set up a win; there were key interventions on the Test tour to England in 2016; and in his last Test, against Sri Lanka in Dubai, he blitzed through the top order and nearly turned around a Test that had no business being turned around. Often forgotten is that he was Pakistan’s highest wicket-taker on the disastrous Test tour of Australia in 2016-17.

    In between there have been plenty of frustrations – ineffective performances, an unchecked no-ball problem, and good-but-wicketless spells. And there were the problems with his run-up in Dubai last year, where he pulled up from delivering five times in a row, the apoplectic reactions of Arthur in the dressing room only adding to the theatre. With white ball in hand he has faded sharply. He last played an ODI nearly a year ago against India in the Champions Trophy – his figures that day read 8.4-0-87-0 – and his last T20I came in April last year against West Indies; he returned figures of 4-0-44-1.

    Since the start of 2016, however, he is Pakistan’s second-highest wicket-taking fast bowler in Tests and, by some metrics, the most effective. And in the recently concluded Pakistan Super League, Wahab was the joint top wicket-taker with Faheem, with a better economy rate (6.90) than Faheem’s (7.75).

    https://dailytimes.com.pk/227470/mic...-big-decision/



    I like the precedent Mickey is setting in the team but I still think he's a great test bowler. Should've kept him in the mix of 25.
    Last edited by Abdullah719; 13th April 2018 at 02:17.

  2. #2
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    Arthurs sounds more like selector than a coach. He should just stick to coaching.

  3. #3
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    Great for team morale this guys statements always end up being...


    #MPGA

  4. #4
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    He is probably right but harsh comments nonetheless.


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  5. #5
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    And how many tests has Amir won?

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xoib View Post
    And how many tests has Amir won?
    You need to reread this part

    “I expect players that have been around for a long time to be winning us games and setting standards. Otherwise we will invest in younger players who have long futures...."
    Amir came back to cricket in 2016 and won us a Global Trophy final in 2017 not to mention his crucial wickets (of Mathews included) in the QF of the CT17. Also Amir is 26 while Wahab is 32, a difference of 6 YEARS!!
    Last edited by ahmedwaqas92; 13th April 2018 at 02:29.

  7. #7
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    This is the most interesting part of the entire narration:

    I want players winning us games of cricket and pushing themselves to be the best they can be. This is a high-performance environment, not a environment where mediocrity is accepted. Unless you are winning games consistently, you are under pressure for your position.”
    This clearly means that Sarfraz should also be in line on the chopping board if he stops performing on the field and it would be a much quicker visit to the gallows since his fitness is basically nothing whatsoever! This is the attitude that I wanted in the team for a long long time. No one is safe from being discarded - You're a CT winning captain?? Well, you and all your 'seniors' can take a hike if you don't perform and win games!! Period

  8. #8
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    @dauntless your phaast bowler!


    In cricket, my superhero is Sachin Tendulkar. He has always been my hero.
    -Virat Kohli

  9. #9
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    Micky is right. The ship has sailed for Wahab. The part about him having a poor work ethic is equally disturbing.


    Pakistani batsmen - An endangered species?

  10. #10
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    I think Mickeys comments are a bit harsh. Despite me being one of Wahabs critics. In comparison, to the other fast bowlers for Pakistan that get a free ride, he has performed well in conditions like the UAE and even Australia. It is limited overs, where Mickeys comments could have been justified.

  11. #11
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    Starting to like Mickey even more lately he is slowly getting rid of all the ttf's which is only good for our cricket and also he's being blunt honest about it which is great. I don't care if people think he's using harsh words spare a thought for us fans who have to watch these medicore players keep getting selected without any performances and then running teir mouth as soon as they are dropped.

  12. #12
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    I'm surprised about the work ethic thing. I kinda assumed that since he almost always bowls his tail off (despite the super inconsistent performances and run-leaking tendencies) that he would also train his tail off as well. Whelp.. guess not

  13. #13
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    Amir has? Sarfaraz has? Babar Azam has?

    Why is this hypocrite just singling out Wahab?


    Loyalty is a very expensive gift, don't expect it from cheap people.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Abdul View Post
    Amir has? Sarfaraz has? Babar Azam has?

    Why is this hypocrite just singling out Wahab?
    Maybe because they have a brain unlike wahab?

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by ahmedwaqas92 View Post
    You need to reread this part



    Amir came back to cricket in 2016 and won us a Global Trophy final in 2017 not to mention his crucial wickets (of Mathews included) in the QF of the CT17. Also Amir is 26 while Wahab is 32, a difference of 6 YEARS!!
    There’s a difference between tests and ODIs. And if Mickey is citing work ethic as a key factor, then a young fast bowler operating at his 70% in tests to elongate his T20/ODI career should be a bigger issue than a 32 year old giving his all on day 4 in Abu Dhabi.

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by BreadPakoda View Post
    There’s a difference between tests and ODIs. And if Mickey is citing work ethic as a key factor, then a young fast bowler operating at his 70% in tests to elongate his T20/ODI career should be a bigger issue than a 32 year old giving his all on day 4 in Abu Dhabi.
    Then Amir would automatically be delegated in that particular format to just a backup bowler to the first three priority picks in the team in the longer format - That's how it works! The difference in both their cases is that Amir is available & competent enough to hold his own in all three formats which is why he makes it into the 25 probables. Wahab, having a seriously dodgy work ethic (as mentioned by Arthur) will just be hogging a spot & will only good enough for 1 format + he's 32 so let's not pretend to gloss over the fact that he's 6 YEARS youger than the person he's in contention with.

    Wahab doesn't compete with Abbas and Hassan because both have different roles in the test team and he can't take their roles because of the dynamic of how we will field a test XI come this English summer. He only competes with Amir and unfortunately Amir wins every single time due to the factors that I mentioned above. Also Amir can do (to a limited extent) of how Wahab bowls generally but Wahab cannot even replicated (not even remotely) to what Amir can do when he get's into his groove!

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Abdul View Post
    Amir has? Sarfaraz has? Babar Azam has?

    Why is this hypocrite just singling out Wahab?
    Amir: CT vs India
    Sarfraz: CT vs Sri Lanka and has captained superbly, something Wahab does not do.
    Babar: Got man of the match just the other day.

    Though I agree, these are harsh comments.


    Hai yeh Josh-e-Junoon, hai yeh apna yaqeen, ke jo tum mein hai dum, woh kisi mein nahin!

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by ahmedwaqas92 View Post
    You need to reread this part



    Amir came back to cricket in 2016 and won us a Global Trophy final in 2017 not to mention his crucial wickets (of Mathews included) in the QF of the CT17. Also Amir is 26 while Wahab is 32, a difference of 6 YEARS!!
    I believe this is a test squad where Wahab has outbowled Amir comfrortably in last 2years. Amir is not even fully committed to test cricket as can be seen from his statements I don’t know why the bias was against Wahab I feel it’s just age issue.

  19. #19
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    I for one agree with Mickey here.

    Wahab needed a kick in the backside, how many games has he cost us? The guy is inconsistent as inconsistent can be. I mean he has a no-ball issue that he is just not willing to work on, batsmen eyes usually light up at the thought of seeing him ball. More than likely with the conditions we will encounter in England, early summer, don't really think his style of bowling is needed.

    If Wahab could have work on his technical issue earlier on in his career, I feel that he could have been a great for Pakistan (the issue is bringing the ball back into the right-hander).

    Pakistan needs a strong character like Mickey Arthur around, I must say, me as a fan, I love it! Keep going!
    Last edited by hadi123; 13th April 2018 at 10:43.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Abdullah719 View Post
    He is probably right but harsh comments nonetheless.
    What I do not understand is if the "unofficial" passing mark for a fast bowler on the fitness test was 19 - why are Hassan and Shaheen in the squad if they only scored 18??

    If Wahab failed - then so did the others...

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by msb314 View Post
    What I do not understand is if the "unofficial" passing mark for a fast bowler on the fitness test was 19 - why are Hassan and Shaheen in the squad if they only scored 18??

    If Wahab failed - then so did the others...
    I don't know what their scores were in earlier tests

    Assuming they were lower, maybe he sees an improvement in them? While at the same time Wahab has got worse?

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by msb314 View Post
    What I do not understand is if the "unofficial" passing mark for a fast bowler on the fitness test was 19 - why are Hassan and Shaheen in the squad if they only scored 18??

    If Wahab failed - then so did the others...
    One is a decade younger than Wahab while the other just featured in a U19 tournament 6 months ago - they have time and the necessary age leverage to improve if put under a pro environment for the majority of their careers!

    Wahab, unfortunately, is 32 and someone who's got a patchy record and a habit of mentally disintegrating when put under the pump in situations across the span of his career! Couple that with his dodgy work ethic and you have someone who doesn't necessarily fit into the plans going forward - plain and simple!

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by ahmedwaqas92 View Post
    One is a decade younger than Wahab while the other just featured in a U19 tournament 6 months ago - they have time and the necessary age leverage to improve if put under a pro environment for the majority of their careers!

    Wahab, unfortunately, is 32 and someone who's got a patchy record and a habit of mentally disintegrating when put under the pump in situations across the span of his career! Couple that with his dodgy work ethic and you have someone who doesn't necessarily fit into the plans going forward - plain and simple!
    Everything of what you say is true but still doesn't change the fact that Hassan and Shaheen don't meet the benchmark of fitness for fast bowlers according to Mickey....

  24. #24
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    Some of the people who are complaining about Mickey's comments are probably the same people who were complaining about players like Wahab and Hafeez not being dropped. With a culture like Pakistan it is necessary to be a bit harsh and blunt, otherwise you end up creating players like Umar Akmal. We have been carrying these so called "experienced" players for so long now but what have they done for Pakistan? What is the use of such experience when you get smashed for 100+ runs in an odi and when you can't even get into double digits in NZ. People saying Wahab didn't deserved to be dropped from tests don't understand what Mickey is trying to do. Yes he was a bit harsh but that's the only way to deal with these Pakistani cricketers.

  25. #25
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    Making strong public statements when e same message could have been sent in a more respectful way, or even in private, creating a controversy where none needed to exist......seems like Mickey Arthur is fast becoming a Pakistani personality himself.

  26. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Abdul View Post
    Amir has? Sarfaraz has? Babar Azam has?

    Why is this hypocrite just singling out Wahab?
    Amir performed well in CT17 final. Was Man of the series against NZ in T20s. Took a sixfer against WI in test.

    Babar scored tons against WI and won us those matches and was outstanding in T20s against NZ.

    Sarfaraz played a captain’s knock against SRL in CT 17 and was pretty good in NZ T20s as well.

    While Wahab is really good when the bowl is reversing but he hasnt won us a match ever If I remember correctly. I dont mind him playing in T20 internationals and tests but what about guys like Mir Hamza and other upcoming youngsters who have been performing for years.

  27. #27
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    Good stuff from Mickey. Question is, why doesn't he do the same for Hafeez and Malik?

  28. #28
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    Some people say that whats the criteria, why that player wasnt selected.

    Now when Mickey is making it clear what he expects out of Wahab everybody is criticising him.

    I guess its a pretty good message for everybody in the team and out of the team.

    For Wahab it is simple if ge gets selected again he needs to win matches for the team atleast when its required to remain in the team.

  29. #29
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    I think Mickey has identified this culture within the Pakistan team. The guy has been in and out of this team for 2 years. He knows the ingoings of the squad more than us. He really has identified the trouble makers of the squad, and how they always manage to get in, making the team level on mediocrity rather than moving up. They use whatever background support they have to good effect.

    Wahab Riaz has been a better bowler in tests for Pakistan than Mohammad Amir. However I can't help but sympathize with Mickey, that there is a lobby going on against him, that is bullying him into take players into the squad or something along those lines. Specially this 'model town crew'. Shehzad, Akmals, Wahab, Hafeez. They all are piling the pressure on him through background channels.

    Can't help but feel this is the case. I don't mind Mickey Arthur's statements, there is no doubt he has the performance on his side to back up his claims, one bad tour can lead to curtains of his coaching stint. Honestly I like the guy, he has transformed the side into a modern cricketing unit, we are a far cry from the side in champions trophy... or before that. He has stamp of authority on his squad, like Imran did which is actually making the difference for the first time in 7-8 years.

    The vultures are flying over him though. One bad performance can make all these names come back and same old same old once again.

  30. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rayyman View Post
    Good stuff from Mickey. Question is, why doesn't he do the same for Hafeez and Malik?
    Hafeez performed pretty well in CT 17 final and has been decent with the bat in ODIs. But he is also under radar as he has been dropped from the last two T20 series. So he better get his bowling action and act right to reamain in the team.

    While Malik has been exceptional in last 2,3 years in ODIs as well as T20s, he has finished some cruical chases. But in ICC tournuments definitely more is expecting from him.

  31. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Abdul View Post
    Amir has? Sarfaraz has? Babar Azam has?

    Why is this hypocrite just singling out Wahab?

    Perhaps age is a factor? Each one you mentioned is a lot younger than Wahab and Wahab at this point in his career should be winning us games single handedly. At least a few far in-between would do.

  32. #32
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    Wahab is that sort of guy that once he gets into one squad he automatically starts getting into other formats too... Goood PR I suppose... If he is a leech like Mickey thinks he is, he better keep out. Same goes for Shehzad and the Akmals.

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    Considering Pak will play AUS, NZ in UAE this year, these are poor choice of words from Arthur. He tends to go extremes in praise or critisicm.

  34. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by emm-tee View Post
    Perhaps age is a factor? Each one you mentioned is a lot younger than Wahab and Wahab at this point in his career should be winning us games single handedly. At least a few far in-between would do.
    Sarfraz is only 2 years younger than Wahab.


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  35. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by waleed88 View Post
    I think Mickey has identified this culture within the Pakistan team. The guy has been in and out of this team for 2 years. He knows the ingoings of the squad more than us. He really has identified the trouble makers of the squad, and how they always manage to get in, making the team level on mediocrity rather than moving up. They use whatever background support they have to good effect.

    Wahab Riaz has been a better bowler in tests for Pakistan than Mohammad Amir. However I can't help but sympathize with Mickey, that there is a lobby going on against him, that is bullying him into take players into the squad or something along those lines. Specially this 'model town crew'. Shehzad, Akmals, Wahab, Hafeez. They all are piling the pressure on him through background channels.

    Can't help but feel this is the case. I don't mind Mickey Arthur's statements, there is no doubt he has the performance on his side to back up his claims, one bad tour can lead to curtains of his coaching stint. Honestly I like the guy, he has transformed the side into a modern cricketing unit, we are a far cry from the side in champions trophy... or before that. He has stamp of authority on his squad, like Imran did which is actually making the difference for the first time in 7-8 years.

    The vultures are flying over him though. One bad performance can make all these names come back and same old same old once again.
    Agree with you on the background pressure from the model town crew. Fortunes really have turned ever since we have given chances to the new guys who push each other and give 110% day in and day out.

    Love seeing this new passion on and off the field! The team dynamics have changed. Compare this to a pre CT era.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Titan24 View Post
    Hafeez performed pretty well in CT 17 final and has been decent with the bat in ODIs. But he is also under radar as he has been dropped from the last two T20 series. So he better get his bowling action and act right to reamain in the team.

    While Malik has been exceptional in last 2,3 years in ODIs as well as T20s, he has finished some cruical chases. But in ICC tournuments definitely more is expecting from him.
    Can't have both Malik and Hafeez in the same ODI team.

  37. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rayyman View Post
    Can't have both Malik and Hafeez in the same ODI team.
    Yes I would love to have Hussain Talat in place of Hafeez in ODIs and good thing is Mickey Likes Talat as thats the reason he is in test probables as well.

    I was just saying that Hafeez still have done a thing or two regularly in ODIs while Wahab hasnt done much other than may be in UAE aginst Eng in one tes match where he bolwed well but still not enough to get the MOM.

  38. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by rhony View Post
    Considering Pak will play AUS, NZ in UAE this year, these are poor choice of words from Arthur. He tends to go extremes in praise or critisicm.
    These are words are to make Wahab go that extra mile. He isnt saying he will never be selected just telling why he has been dropped so now whenever if ever he comes back he needs to put in extra effort in winning matches rather than just generating pace.

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    I don't remember the last time Wahab Riaz won us a game, forget 2 years lol. I do, however, remember the numerous games he has cost us.

  40. #40
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    For all those saying these are harsh comments, please give me a break... its not like arthur woke up and walked to the podium in his jammies throwing a rant. He is calling it like it is, and would be professional enough to have spoken to the lads as well before hand. You think he would not have had a convo with viki about this at all. I would rather he be even harsher than that if it means we get the dead weight out of the squad. Its just a wake up call for viki to show up or stay home... Arthur did not say this is it... its up to viki if he wants to play for Pak again or not ... if yes, work ur tails off mate ...

  41. #41
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    Well done Mickey..Umar and Kamran Akmal taken care of..now Wahab hopefully Ahmed Shehzad is next!!

  42. #42
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    The observations are sound, not sure about the need to say them out loud for a wider audience

  43. #43
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    Good job mickey

  44. #44
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    Great stuff from Mickey. He is putting things out there and really emphasising the new culture he wants to see in the Pakistan team. I hope they extend his contract beyond 2019 as this methodology needs time to embed. So much so that any new players coming in know that this is the culture of the team. Wahab was always lazy and unable to learn new tricks to keep himself relevant. His constant wilting under the pressure of a few fours was depressing. A mentally weak player who should have achieved so much more. Glad they are discarding him..sad but glad.

  45. #45
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    I think he went a bit over the top, but this is the kind of brutal honesty we have needed for a long time


    "Last time Uganda toured Canada, half their team ran away to start a new life" - cricfan967

  46. #46
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    “I cannot fault Wahab when he has a ball in his hand but his work ethic around training is something needs to be looked at,” Arthur said. “I am changing the culture in this Pakistan environment and I am not interested in players doing just the bare minimum. I want players winning us games of cricket and pushing themselves to be the best they can be. This is a high-performance environment, not a environment where mediocrity is accepted. Unless you are winning games consistently, you are under pressure for your position.”
    Forget the next World Cup, give this man a contract until the 2023 World Cup. He is single handedly cleaning Pakistan's cricket culture in a way I've never seen.

    Brilliant comments, cannot believe posters are complaining about it. You guys for years here wanted someone to take a blowtorch to the underperforming senior players ! Arthur is not going to give free rides to anyone and long may it continue.

  47. #47
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    Do i agree with Mickey's points? - yes
    Do i think he should've said this publicly instead of just saying it to Wahab?- no

  48. #48
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    Harsh but fair. Needs to be consistent if he doesnt want to look like an idiot.

  49. #49
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    I dont think MA should be talking about players like that in public. I havent heard any other coach from any other country speak like that about current players - not right imo.


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  50. #50
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    Brutal but a much needed self assessment for the player. But could have kept it private within the team. I wonder how he rates mohd aamir at the moment. Probably he needs something of this sort to get a kick up the backside

  51. #51
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    Honestly from Mickey. He is changing the mentality of Pakistan cricket. Wahab has been poor at international level for a while now. So he deserved to be dropped.

  52. #52
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    Excellent interview and am glad he is being open with everyone.
    After all, our players have a habit of running to the press, either directly or indirectly, and getting their alleged mistreatment out to the public.

  53. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by MenInG View Post
    I dont think MA should be talking about players like that in public. I havent heard any other coach from any other country speak like that about current players - not right imo.
    No but you've heard Butt & Akmal (any one of brothers) go public with their views on MA & the coaching staff.

    I think openness is the best policy. It eliminates any ambiguity. He's layed down the law and now players have to obide by them or take it on the chin. They are after all grown up men who get paid well to represent their country.

  54. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by Markhor View Post
    Forget the next World Cup, give this man a contract until the 2023 World Cup. He is single handedly cleaning Pakistan's cricket culture in a way I've never seen.

    Brilliant comments, cannot believe posters are complaining about it. You guys for years here wanted someone to take a blowtorch to the underperforming senior players ! Arthur is not going to give free rides to anyone and long may it continue.
    Absolutely this! Finally, after decades of being tortured by Pakistan's continued love affair with TTF's, we finally have a coach who is closing the door on them one after another. Love it, way to go Mickey!

  55. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by MenInG View Post
    I dont think MA should be talking about players like that in public. I havent heard any other coach from any other country speak like that about current players - not right imo.
    Bingo!!! It will demoralize the player. One thing Wahab can't be blamed for is the effort. He runs in hard every time and bowls as fast as he can. It's his skills that need tune up. The comments about workout ethic etc should have been personally disclosed to Wahab which Mickey probably did. That should have been the end of it. It's not like there is another tearaway pacer waiting in the wings. He is needed in UAE.

  56. #56
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    Mickey is transparent. What you see is what you get. Loved the bit where he said Wahab needs to improve his work ethic..and train harder. Pretty obvious these guys don't put in much effort in training...there's a reason why Hasan has left all our pacers behind and isn't hungover on one spell that couldn't even win the game.

  57. #57
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    Micky spoke his mind, may be a bit loudly. Also, I think he was irritated to answer repeated questions on Wahab (like why not, how good, what's in future, who is better ....).

    Cricket is an obsolete game in modern era with colonial days thought process (it's not because Test match runs for 5 days, rather this game needs 5 days for a proper show, by it's trait a slow game), which still is carrying that 100+ years old tradition. Accountability without authority is meaningless - cricket is only major game which is still carrying show pieces like Selection Panel/Chief Selector, who doesn't report to Head Coach/Manager.

    If Inzi was to report Arthur, by now PAK team's official average age would have come down to 25-26 level.

  58. #58
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    Harsh comment and probably unreasonable to say in media .Mickey should stop this habit of publicly saying negative about players .

  59. #59
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    They might be unreasonable comments to make publicly but if he had not than the Wahab lobby would have pushed stronger for his inclusion. Pakistan cricket works in ways that are not comprehensible to other boards.


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    I 100% agree with what Arthur has said.Cannot tolerate mediocrity.Hafeez should be next on the chopping block.

    However,he should not have said this in public or if he had to do so he should have been a bit softer.

  61. #61
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    Harsh but true. Wahab constantly leaks runs.

  62. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pete Rose View Post
    The observations are sound, not sure about the need to say them out loud for a wider audience
    I would not fault him entirely. Pakistani media and fans cannot read between the lines. Same question for raised about Akmal, he made it clear with his fitness and fielding, he cannot be in the team...On Hafeez, he was clear too, without bowling there is no scope...Media is keep pushing for Sohail Khan, who is 36 years old, with poor fitness

    I can see a strong comment against Sarfraz, if he does not improve. I like his attitude towards seniors, that's how things should be, specially in shorter format. He had vision of Pakistani playing the modern LOI game, the power game, seniors are biggest hurdle, he is marching towards that vision...

    In Test, he wanted allrounders as fifth bowler, which Misbah never focused on. Faheem, Shadab, Talat are developed for those roles. Overseas test, allrounder is much, to have leverage, Misbah's 11 lost 6 tests in a row for a reason.


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  63. #63
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    According to cricinfo he has averaged 32 since January 2016 and 85% of his wickets have been top order batsmen.

    I was also some one who thought that Wahab should be dropped but after seeing this I’m not sure that this was the right decision.

    Yes I know an average of 32 isn’t amazing but it’s good considering how well some of our leading bowlers have bowled in tests in the last couple of years.

  64. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by AssassinatedDevil View Post
    Do i agree with Mickey's points? - yes
    Do i think he should've said this publicly instead of just saying it to Wahab?- no
    Quote Originally Posted by MenInG View Post
    I dont think MA should be talking about players like that in public. I havent heard any other coach from any other country speak like that about current players - not right imo.
    Quote Originally Posted by rhony View Post
    Bingo!!! It will demoralize the player. One thing Wahab can't be blamed for is the effort. He runs in hard every time and bowls as fast as he can. It's his skills that need tune up. The comments about workout ethic etc should have been personally disclosed to Wahab which Mickey probably did. That should have been the end of it. It's not like there is another tearaway pacer waiting in the wings. He is needed in UAE.
    Wahab is a grown man who can handle some honest criticism. His work ethic should be faulted after years of wayward and expensive bowling (most notably the Trent Bridge 444 ODI) and the no-ball issues. He has also failed to reach the fitness benchmark Arthur has set for his pacers as mentioned in the article, being outperformed by young Shaheen Shah. He has made it clear either you reach the fitness standards or you're out.

    For eight years posters here have demanded our coaches and captains publicly hold the senior players accountable. Now Mickey Arthur has done that and yet we're still complaining ?

    He has been deservedly dropped for the England series as last time he toured, he averaged 36 with the ball at 4 runs per over ! There may be a case as you say to retain him for UAE series or Australia tours but in early season in England - you need accurate seamers who can bowl a disciplined line and length, which Wahab fails to consistently do.

  65. #65
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    Strong comments but based on how Wahab has fared uptil 2017 too little too late for him. He has had the worst economic rate even for odis.

    Arthur is on the right path and I support him. Senior players have been the worst performing players but kept their place due to a weak board and nepotistic culture. A tough public statement also is a message for others like Malik that they have raise their game and no one is bigger than the team.

  66. #66
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    Then why do you keep on selecting him?

    Fast bowlers who only take 1 five Wickets haul like every 3 years should not be in the team, simple. If you can't find any better Pacers than go for spin or even a batsman who can bowl a few overs, or just play Mohammed Rizwan (extra WK).

  67. #67
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    Pakistan cricket doesn't like the truth or facts.

    Sooner or later Mickey will upset someone and pay the consequences.



  68. #68
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    It's rare (possibly unprofessional) to see a coach single out a player like that but can't say he's wrong.

  69. #69
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    Classless comments. I can see why he was chucked out by other teams now. You don't bash your own players in the media like this. Creates a negative environment. Players lose and gain form. Some players simply aren't good enough. This is what happens in sport. It takes a lot of hard work and determination to get to the international stage. Mickey could have said something like Riaz's performance hasn't been up to the mark recently. Riaz doesn't deserve a spot in the team, but there's a way of saying it.

    Mickey strikes me as someone who does very little, and happy to blame others/thing when things go wrong. It's the selectors who have identified these younger talents not him, and he took an age to play them. Not playing 2 spinners cost us that SL series, and he did the same mistake twice in a row. Brainless, and yet has the audacity of blaming Riaz.

    This isn't honesty at all, this is exaggeration and rudeness. This blaming mentality and not working together well as a team has plagued Pakistani cricket for decades, and Arthur's just adding to it. Frankly I expected someone more professional in his manners to be Pakistan coach, someone who inspires their players to do better, not one who looks for excuses when they lose.

    No surprise Mickey's record as a coach is damn poor. Just living off the Champions Trophy win.

  70. #70
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    Such candid and direct words are necessary so that the fans and the players know what the expectation and the requirements are.

    He was open and honest about Umar Akmal's fate, the expectations from Hafeez and the same is the case here. Which is great since no one can whine about being singled out and being a victim of a personal agenda.

    I prefer being direct and risking hurting someone's "feelings" over beating around the bush and playing unnecessary mind games.

  71. #71
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    I agree with establishing high performance culture but the standards need to be applied uniformly then and not just towards few players.

    Amir averages 37 in 16 tests since his return, why isn't he dropped to be consistent?

    And what has Rahat Ali done to warrant a call up? Where is Sadaf Hussain the perennial FC legend?

    Fawad was finally called up but we still have to see if he will be selected. But what else does Sadaf needs to do to be selected?

    Amir, Wahab and Rahat don't warrant selection in tests ... Abbas has made a mark early on, Hasan made an impact on debut, that leaves Mir Hamza next in line but really Sadaf should have been called up in place of Rahat.

    Hopefully this is the last series for Amir in tests, if he doesn't perform he needs to be dropped as well. He wants to play LOIs anyway which would be better for our LOI revival that is more important going forward as test cricket is a dying format anyway.

    Also the only reason Shan Masood is not in the squad because he is injured, again what merit does he have to be even considered for selection?

    If you are going to establish a high performance culture at least be consistent and give chances to deserving new comers rather then TTFs.

  72. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by Markhor View Post
    Wahab is a grown man who can handle some honest criticism. His work ethic should be faulted after years of wayward and expensive bowling (most notably the Trent Bridge 444 ODI) and the no-ball issues. He has also failed to reach the fitness benchmark Arthur has set for his pacers as mentioned in the article, being outperformed by young Shaheen Shah. He has made it clear either you reach the fitness standards or you're out.

    For eight years posters here have demanded our coaches and captains publicly hold the senior players accountable. Now Mickey Arthur has done that and yet we're still complaining ?

    He has been deservedly dropped for the England series as last time he toured, he averaged 36 with the ball at 4 runs per over ! There may be a case as you say to retain him for UAE series or Australia tours but in early season in England - you need accurate seamers who can bowl a disciplined line and length, which Wahab fails to consistently do.
    Surprised about Wahab lacking fitness. If anything he is probably the fittest of all our pacers given that he bowls at 88 mph plus spell after spell and races in and on a good day can even touch 95 mph.

    If anyone fitness is suspect and form is dreadful, it is Amir. Pakistan do not need him in T-20's and for him to go missing in all test matches and ODIs. If anything this public criticism should have been aimed at Amir.

  73. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by ads101 View Post
    Classless comments. I can see why he was chucked out by other teams now. You don't bash your own players in the media like this. Creates a negative environment. Players lose and gain form. Some players simply aren't good enough. This is what happens in sport. It takes a lot of hard work and determination to get to the international stage. Mickey could have said something like Riaz's performance hasn't been up to the mark recently. Riaz doesn't deserve a spot in the team, but there's a way of saying it.

    Mickey strikes me as someone who does very little, and happy to blame others/thing when things go wrong. It's the selectors who have identified these younger talents not him, and he took an age to play them. Not playing 2 spinners cost us that SL series, and he did the same mistake twice in a row. Brainless, and yet has the audacity of blaming Riaz.

    This isn't honesty at all, this is exaggeration and rudeness. This blaming mentality and not working together well as a team has plagued Pakistani cricket for decades, and Arthur's just adding to it. Frankly I expected someone more professional in his manners to be Pakistan coach, someone who inspires their players to do better, not one who looks for excuses when they lose.

    No surprise Mickey's record as a coach is damn poor. Just living off the Champions Trophy win.
    Didn't Wahab Riaz take 4 wickets in the second innings of the Sri Lanka test in 2017? He looked more menacing and threatening than Toothless Amir. Why is Amir getting the golden boy treatment for no reason.

    Wahab was Pakistan's best bowler in the Australia series, he played a crucial role in Pakistan's win in the 4th test against England. He took 5 wickets against the WI in Sharjah while Amir looked toothless.

    This outburst looks bizzare and frankly speaking it doesn't appear that Mickey is being partial here. He is known to be soft on his favorites i.e. Imad Wasim.

  74. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by j_kazmi View Post
    According to cricinfo he has averaged 32 since January 2016 and 85% of his wickets have been top order batsmen.

    I was also some one who thought that Wahab should be dropped but after seeing this I’m not sure that this was the right decision.

    Yes I know an average of 32 isn’t amazing but it’s good considering how well some of our leading bowlers have bowled in tests in the last couple of years.
    These are not extremely bad stats for a bowler who plays most of his wickets on flat lifeless pitches.

  75. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by ahmedwaqas92 View Post
    You need to reread this part



    Amir came back to cricket in 2016 and won us a Global Trophy final in 2017 not to mention his crucial wickets (of Mathews included) in the QF of the CT17. Also Amir is 26 while Wahab is 32, a difference of 6 YEARS!!
    We are discussing tests not LOIs ... Amir has been mediocre, avg. of 37 in 16 tests !!

  76. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by boomboom6 View Post
    We are discussing tests not LOIs ... Amir has been mediocre, avg. of 37 in 16 tests !!
    Even just by watching, Amir has looked more toothless than Wahab in test matches and he resorts to 127-132 km/hr lifeless stuff in tough conditions. Wahab atleast races in for Pakistan irrespective of the conditions.

    Amir even had the gall to complain about his work load and to demand that he be rested from test matches. Wahab has never asked to be rested in comparison and he has been playing non stop cricket for the last 5 years. I cannot comprehend how on earth did Mickey come to the conclusion that Wahab training and fitness is questionable.

  77. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by Savak View Post
    Even just by watching, Amir has looked more toothless than Wahab in test matches and he resorts to 127-132 km/hr lifeless stuff in tough conditions. Wahab atleast races in for Pakistan irrespective of the conditions.

    Amir even had the gall to complain about his work load and to demand that he be rested from test matches. Wahab has never asked to be rested in comparison and he has been playing non stop cricket for the last 5 years. I cannot comprehend how on earth did Mickey come to the conclusion that Wahab training and fitness is questionable.
    Agreed based on merit, Wahab should be in the squad in place of Amir. I can see a need for Wahab in tests as the sole pace bowler ... if anything he doesn't merit selection in LOIs anymore as we have found better options. But for tests, our pace attack is far from a finished product and indeed Riaz has bowled more game changing spells then Amir has last 2 years.

    Amir has looked toothless for sure. My position is that this high performance culture needs to be applied uniformly.

    Personally speaking I care more about LOIs but it is harsh to see Wahab be dropped when he was better then Amir vs SL in UAE while Amir is still in the team.

  78. #78
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    Typical finger pointing is going on at others.

    There might be other players who haven't been world class but at moment the coach is unhappy with Wahab Riaz. Who is a 30+ years old senior which is a big factor when considering his place in the team.

    We would have to wait and see if the standard is applied to other players too if they keep on failing to impress. With Wahab out of the team guys like Amir are the "seniors" and have to deal with the extra responsibility.

  79. #79
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    Not in ODIs or T20, but in tests Wahab has been our go to guy for some times.The fittest and the fastest fast bowler in Pakistan, but Micky is seeing him through Inzi's eyes who wants to bring in the laziest of them all, Rahat in.

  80. #80
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    Mickey Arthur is by far the greatest coach Pakistan has ever had, this is the type of mindset we need as a team to be moving forward and getting ranked in the top 3 for all formats of the game. Our fielding has improved drastically, we have been producing world-class young players, we won an ICC trophy, we got the Test mace under Misbah and we are the number 1 ranked T20 side in the world.

    We have not had someone who would be ruthless and honest about our downsides which would often mean that we're carrying a baggage of mediocrity. He has brought about a new age where we put more emphasis on healthy meal plans, working out and having a positive attitude alongside with ambition and drive. Gone are the days where we have lethargic individuals who would rely on their backstreet talent and not getting with the times.

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