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  1. #161
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    The only people who pay any heed to Arundhati Roy are anti-Indian individuals and anti-Indian media like The Guardian.

  2. #162
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tusker View Post
    Thats a contradictory statement ... if the extremists are soo violent and oppressive ... this (Building Temple) would have been accomplished a long long time ago ... especially as it does not involve killing anyone. So how is it that they have not managed to build a simple thing as a Temple which is considered to be one the most sacred places of worship for Hindu's ?




    How is this possible in this day and age with the Indian Military in control of the region ? And dont forget the extremists who you claim to be all over India. How is it that there is hardly any response to the Kashmiri Pandit episode from RSS and the other supposedly extremist militant outfits?

    BTW can you atleast have the moral conscience to admit that there is nothing remotely close to the ethnic cleansing of Kashmiri Pandits done by any Hindu right wing organization.

    Samjauta Express - Please answer without dodging the question about the Godhra Train torching by residents . That that too in middle of Gujarat. Yet they live there to this day . If this had happened in Pakistan ....

    So tell me how that is possible if India is such an extremist country.

    Anyhow check this out:

    https://www.indiatvnews.com/news/ind...vidence-387479



    I never claimed that. However if you are stupid enough to go around burning down trains , fighting tooth and nail against building Ram temple, indulge in ethnic cleansing ( and the list goes on an on) .... then Muslims as a community cant be expected to be treated royally by the majority.

    And please note that 99% of of all communal tensions in India involve Muslims. How is it that Hindus don't have any serious issues with other minorities ?
    The contradiction is only in your head. It is your government that is responsible for building the temple not the Muslim's. Anyway it has nothing to do with Muslim's not being oppressed in your country so stop trying to divert the topic as usual.

    What are you trying to say with "How is this possible in this day and age with the Indian Military in control of the region "? Are Muslim people stopping the RSS from responding? They can do so if they want, the point here is that Hindu internal problems does not mean Muslim's in your country are not suffering. Pointing to Hindu internal problems to prove Muslim's are not being oppressed is absurd.

    Why don't you condemn the Indian genocidal army before asking for sympathy for the Pundit's? Kashmiris even with the Pundit's are still majority Muslim, remember that. You saying that the Pundit's were killed or forced to migrate by their coreligionists?

    Why are you dragging Pak in to the Gujarat riots? You are the ones who is unable to justify why Pakistanis in India were burnt alive by Hindu fascists much more 26/11. First punish the murderers of the Samjhauta Express before expecting any sympathy from Pak. We have nothing to to with the Gujarat riots at all that is your internal matter. You are obviously confused with Muslim's and Pakistanis as being the same which is not true.

    Every minority community in India is oppressed, the Hindu's extremists have a problem with people from all religions since Modi became PM. I am not checkin' out anything, there are millions of stories on the web! Pakistanis are not stopping you from building Ram Temple, if your own Muslim's are then don't blame us for that coz we are not their guardians. I am merely pointing out that they are oppressed in your country.


    PP's own self proclaimed sharpshooter and defender of Islam and Pakistan.

  3. #163
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tusker View Post
    Please post these incidents ... start with anything remotely close to say the Pandit ethnic cleansing from Kashmir. Lets see who is more extreme.
    Why don't your visit NDTV.com yourself?. I don't see any Hindu's bring killed in the valley. Not saying that Pundit cleansing was a good thing but they have paid the price for their coreligionists killing the majority community in the valley.


    PP's own self proclaimed sharpshooter and defender of Islam and Pakistan.

  4. #164
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    Quote Originally Posted by Itachi View Post
    Www787 and you, both are claiming that it is happening everyday.

    What I am asking here is, can you provide a small list with specific mention of the time frame and the place?
    One would have thought that it's common knowledge Kashmiris in IoK are being killed. Didn't think giving a date and time would be necessary.


    PP's own self proclaimed sharpshooter and defender of Islam and Pakistan.

  5. #165
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    Quote Originally Posted by PakLFC View Post
    The contradiction is only in your head. It is your government that is responsible for building the temple not the Muslim's. Anyway it has nothing to do with Muslim's not being oppressed in your country so stop trying to divert the topic as usual.

    What are you trying to say with "How is this possible in this day and age with the Indian Military in control of the region "? Are Muslim people stopping the RSS from responding? They can do so if they want, the point here is that Hindu internal problems does not mean Muslim's in your country are not suffering. Pointing to Hindu internal problems to prove Muslim's are not being oppressed is absurd.

    Why don't you condemn the Indian genocidal army before asking for sympathy for the Pundit's? Kashmiris even with the Pundit's are still majority Muslim, remember that. You saying that the Pundit's were killed or forced to migrate by their coreligionists?

    Why are you dragging Pak in to the Gujarat riots? You are the ones who is unable to justify why Pakistanis in India were burnt alive by Hindu fascists much more 26/11. First punish the murderers of the Samjhauta Express before expecting any sympathy from Pak. We have nothing to to with the Gujarat riots at all that is your internal matter. You are obviously confused with Muslim's and Pakistanis as being the same which is not true.

    Every minority community in India is oppressed, the Hindu's extremists have a problem with people from all religions since Modi became PM. I am not checkin' out anything, there are millions of stories on the web! Pakistanis are not stopping you from building Ram Temple, if your own Muslim's are then don't blame us for that coz we are not their guardians. I am merely pointing out that they are oppressed in your country.
    You don't get it do you ? The point is very very simple .... if India is run by Militant extremist organizations ( Like you and others here alluded to) ... simple things like building a temple would have been accomplished a long long time ago no matter how strong the Muslim opposition. That is how things work in Pakistan NOT India. This is the difference between how Pakistan treats minorities as opposed to India. Issues like Godhra, Babri , Kashmir are a stark reminder of how much clout and freedom they have to do whatever they please.

    Do you understand or should I break that down further ?

    And nowhere did I accused Pakistan for Godhra riots.


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  6. #166
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tusker View Post
    You don't get it do you ? The point is very very simple .... if India is run by Militant extremist organizations ( Like you and others here alluded to) ... simple things like building a temple would have been accomplished a long long time ago no matter how strong the Muslim opposition. That is how things work in Pakistan NOT India. This is the difference between how Pakistan treats minorities as opposed to India. Issues like Godhra, Babri , Kashmir are a stark reminder of how much clout and freedom they have to do whatever they please.

    Do you understand or should I break that down further ?

    And nowhere did I accused Pakistan for Godhra riots.
    I get it good and well bud! Let me make it clear that I am no defender of Indian Muslim's neither is it Pak's problem. Tell me when us Pakistanis have no problem in accepting we have a long way too go in respecting our minority community then why won't you do the same? Every day there is some minority issue going on in your country yet you seem to think India is a heaven for non Hindu's? What world do people like you live in? Not every BJP goon is a minority hater then there is the question of political correctness as well. The BJP is fully aware that if the temple is built by force it could lead to civil war in the country as well. How things work in India can be seen when Babri was demolished and the Golden Temple was desecrated, right?? Indian hypocrisy never ceases to amaze me. What? Godhra and Babri means Muslim freedom in India, are you serious? Yeah you'll need to break down something else now so how about the nearest Church? I did not say you accused Pak of the Gujarat riots but if you are not gonna do anything about the Samjhauta Express then don't lecture us on 26/11. Difference is in the former incident Pakistanis were killed by Hindu thugs in India.


    PP's own self proclaimed sharpshooter and defender of Islam and Pakistan.

  7. #167
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    Quote Originally Posted by PakLFC View Post
    I get it good and well bud! Let me make it clear that I am no defender of Indian Muslim's neither is it Pak's problem. Tell me when us Pakistanis have no problem in accepting we have a long way too go in respecting our minority community then why won't you do the same? Every day there is some minority issue going on in your country yet you seem to think India is a heaven for non Hindu's? What world do people like you live in? Not every BJP goon is a minority hater then there is the question of political correctness as well. The BJP is fully aware that if the temple is built by force it could lead to civil war in the country as well. How things work in India can be seen when Babri was demolished and the Golden Temple was desecrated, right?? Indian hypocrisy never ceases to amaze me. What? Godhra and Babri means Muslim freedom in India, are you serious? Yeah you'll need to break down something else now so how about the nearest Church? I did not say you accused Pak of the Gujarat riots but if you are not gonna do anything about the Samjhauta Express then don't lecture us on 26/11. Difference is in the former incident Pakistanis were killed by Hindu thugs in India.
    Hindus are also not safe in india. Either all are safe or no one is safe. India has 2nd largest number of mosques in india. Pakistan dnt have. A muslim country where minoritu is seeking citizenship of india can never ever never even talk about secularism or think about teaching india tolerance. It seems like some carnivorous is teaching omnivorous to be herbivorous.it doesnt even look funny.
    Whoever want to teach india make sure about themselves first that they dnt are 10x times worst than india.

  8. #168
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    Quote Originally Posted by PakLFC View Post
    One would have thought that it's common knowledge Kashmiris in IoK are being killed. Didn't think giving a date and time would be necessary.
    I think it will be hard to believe for you but before 1980s, Kashmir was a peaceful place. But when there's terrorism going on, there occurs collateral damage.

    I am from north east state which are as troubled as Kashmir. And we have went through similar chapter as Kashmir for decades where we lost people.

    But, blaming the system doesn't help.

    I asked you, to give examples atrocities happening across India which is on day to day basis.

    Except Kashmir, you couldn't come up with other substance and which is understandable because in when a state is facing terrorism issues, there will be conflicts which could be manipulated to fit ones agenda.

  9. #169
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    Quote Originally Posted by PakLFC View Post
    I get it good and well bud! Let me make it clear that I am no defender of Indian Muslim's neither is it Pak's problem. Tell me when us Pakistanis have no problem in accepting we have a long way too go in respecting our minority community then why won't you do the same? Every day there is some minority issue going on in your country yet you seem to think India is a heaven for non Hindu's? What world do people like you live in? Not every BJP goon is a minority hater then there is the question of political correctness as well. The BJP is fully aware that if the temple is built by force it could lead to civil war in the country as well. How things work in India can be seen when Babri was demolished and the Golden Temple was desecrated, right?? Indian hypocrisy never ceases to amaze me. What? Godhra and Babri means Muslim freedom in India, are you serious? Yeah you'll need to break down something else now so how about the nearest Church? I did not say you accused Pak of the Gujarat riots but if you are not gonna do anything about the Samjhauta Express then don't lecture us on 26/11. Difference is in the former incident Pakistanis were killed by Hindu thugs in India.
    Bingo !! now why don't you tell us how India finds itself in this position ? Quite a paradox isn't it? Considering your original basis that Minorities have been subjugated in India and that it is run by Hindu extremists. The only logical answer is the un-fettered Muslim pandering that is ongoing for decades to such an extent that people now fear another partition is bound to happen in our lifetimes. So contrary to your assertion that Muslims are subjugated and treated like filth they are pretty well placed to make their presence felt. This cannot happen if the majority and the Govt. are right-wing hardline extremists.

    The Samjhauta Express case is in the hands of the courts.


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  10. #170
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    Quote Originally Posted by PakLFC View Post
    NDTV reports incidents almost every day. Some days back there was some Christian issue as welll.
    The only issue with Christians is their conversion groups. Personally I don't care as I find all religions as pointless as each other and if someone breaks out of the caste system by changing their religion, good for them.

    Can't recall a single riot involving Christians and if there any of them complaining it could only be about not being able to eat beef in some states or if they're up to some golmaal vis a vis some conversion scam they're not able to pull money from.

    Other than that, Christian groups have contributed immensely to healthcare and education and have always been Indians first before anything else.

    So not sure what you've been reading.

  11. #171
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tusker View Post
    no he did mention Ethnic cleansing. It's right there on the first Paragraph



    But not surprising to see that response coming from you ... just analyze the stupidity of it all ... someone making up utterly false claims of "ethnic cleansing" thereby attracting the wrath of his own community.

    What kind of logic is taught to you guys in schools ? Pathetic. To say the least.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tusker View Post
    BBC Article: https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-india-35923237

    Perhaps the BBC is also pandering to the indians ?
    I would have thought the fact that the "ethnic cleansing" is put in quotation marks would give some clue that it's not accepted as a true reflection of what went on. But we can agree that there was a backlash against some Hindus during the turmoil of the Kashmir valley dispute, and tellingly the Muslims of the area said they regretted it and wanted them to come back. Many Hindus also stayed it seems which seems unlikely if it was a case of ethnic cleansing. In any case, regardless of what version of history you want to believe, you can't justify what is going on today by keep referring back to the `1990s.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Cpt. Rishwat View Post
    I would have thought the fact that the "ethnic cleansing" is put in quotation marks would give some clue that it's not accepted as a true reflection of what went on.
    Anything in quotes are the actual words spoken by Abdullah just as is the case with the last paragraph on that article (unless you think he did not say those words either in which you might as well say the entire article is a fabrication and that no such speech was made by Abdullah) :

    He called for a more secular approach and an end to extremism. “If extremism grows, there will be no peace. This book should serve as an eye-opener to the pain and the agony of the Pandits who had to leave homes and move to distant places and face difficult situations. It is every man's desire to die and be laid to rest in their own homeland,”


    But we can agree that there was a backlash against some Hindus during the turmoil of the Kashmir valley dispute, and tellingly the Muslims of the area said they regretted it and wanted them to come back.
    back lashes dont result in 100s of thousands of people upping and leaving their homeland overnight.

    Many Hindus also stayed it seems which seems unlikely if it was a case of ethnic cleansing. In any case, regardless of what version of history you want to believe, you can't justify what is going on today by keep referring back to the `1990s.
    The numbers of Hindu's that stayed back is soo small that it does not mean anything. The less said the better about their conditions.

    What do you mean which version of history ? There is only one version - the one told by cold hard numbers. The point here is to shine the light on the crooks who have the cheek to propagate a narrative that is diametrically opposite to reality. Let me know if you want me to go further into the topic of the "World according to Muslims" .


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    Quote Originally Posted by Tusker View Post
    Anything in quotes are the actual words spoken by Abdullah just as is the case with the last paragraph on that article (unless you think he did not say those words either in which you might as well say the entire article is a fabrication and that no such speech was made by Abdullah) :

    He called for a more secular approach and an end to extremism. “If extremism grows, there will be no peace. This book should serve as an eye-opener to the pain and the agony of the Pandits who had to leave homes and move to distant places and face difficult situations. It is every man's desire to die and be laid to rest in their own homeland,”




    back lashes dont result in 100s of thousands of people upping and leaving their homeland overnight.



    The numbers of Hindu's that stayed back is soo small that it does not mean anything. The less said the better about their conditions.

    What do you mean which version of history ? There is only one version - the one told by cold hard numbers. The point here is to shine the light on the crooks who have the cheek to propagate a narrative that is diametrically opposite to reality. Let me know if you want me to go further into the topic of the "World according to Muslims" .
    By all means you can go further into the topic of the "World according to Muslims", but I suggest you start another thread so it doesn't look like you are trying to divert from what Roy is saying here. Even the Pandits in Kashmir is really just whataboutism at it's worst. Maybe you should do another thread on that if you want to discuss a topic from the 1990's, unless you feel that what happened then gives Hindus an open licence to persecute minorities as retribution.


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    Quote Originally Posted by akki View Post
    Hindus are also not safe in india. Either all are safe or no one is safe. India has 2nd largest number of mosques in india. Pakistan dnt have. A muslim country where minoritu is seeking citizenship of india can never ever never even talk about secularism or think about teaching india tolerance. It seems like some carnivorous is teaching omnivorous to be herbivorous.it doesnt even look funny.
    Whoever want to teach india make sure about themselves first that they dnt are 10x times worst than india.
    So what if India has many Masjid's? That does not prove that Muslim's are safe moreover keep in mind your massive population as well. "A muslim country where minoritu is seeking citizenship of india can never ever never even talk about secularism or think about teaching india tolerance." What does this mean in English or is Modi your English teacher?? Pak does not claim or want secularism, what is this mince about majority in Pak wanting to be Indian? Rather majority of Indian's would crawl on their knee's to work in the Muslim Gulf or America in particular. You will also have to elaborate further on "Whoever want to teach india make sure about themselves first that they dnt are 10x times worst than india." drivel.
    Last edited by PakLFC; 13th June 2018 at 23:14.


    PP's own self proclaimed sharpshooter and defender of Islam and Pakistan.

  15. #175
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    Quote Originally Posted by Itachi View Post
    I think it will be hard to believe for you but before 1980s, Kashmir was a peaceful place. But when there's terrorism going on, there occurs collateral damage.

    I am from north east state which are as troubled as Kashmir. And we have went through similar chapter as Kashmir for decades where we lost people.

    But, blaming the system doesn't help.

    I asked you, to give examples atrocities happening across India which is on day to day basis.

    Except Kashmir, you couldn't come up with other substance and which is understandable because in when a state is facing terrorism issues, there will be conflicts which could be manipulated to fit ones agenda.
    I know Kashmir was once peaceful before the people vented their anger towards the occupiers. Exactly, so in a war of any sorts there will be casualties on both sides. You look upon the freedom fighters as terrorists where as they feel the same way towards your military.Why should I worry about your oother states where trouble is brewing? You must know about the red corridor, naxalites and the Khalistan movement. I don't check your news stories everyday coz I am not obsessed with India. The whole world knows that India has the highest number of separatist movements.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Separa...ments_of_India
    https://simple.wikipedia.org/wiki/Se...ments_of_India


    PP's own self proclaimed sharpshooter and defender of Islam and Pakistan.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tusker View Post
    Bingo !! now why don't you tell us how India finds itself in this position ? Quite a paradox isn't it? Considering your original basis that Minorities have been subjugated in India and that it is run by Hindu extremists. The only logical answer is the un-fettered Muslim pandering that is ongoing for decades to such an extent that people now fear another partition is bound to happen in our lifetimes. So contrary to your assertion that Muslims are subjugated and treated like filth they are pretty well placed to make their presence felt. This cannot happen if the majority and the Govt. are right-wing hardline extremists.

    The Samjhauta Express case is in the hands of the courts.
    What you talking about?? From one subject you swiftly move to another one with digesting any information or thinking what you are on about? There is no paradox at all boy! The truth is there for all to see clearly. So if the BJP does not build the Mandir fearing a reaction then that is there problem, right?? Now you will say something stupid like "200 million Muslim's are threatening the Mandir from being built" I stand by my views that minorities in India are always under threat, not only Muslim's but Sikhs and Christians as well. You seem unable to understand a simple point that 200 million people may be able to do a lot of damage yet it does not mean they are feeling safe and secure. Oh okay! We are thinking about 26/11 as well and will let you know accordingly! Even right wing Hindu nutcases have to be politically correct.


    PP's own self proclaimed sharpshooter and defender of Islam and Pakistan.

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    Quote Originally Posted by pillionrider View Post
    The only issue with Christians is their conversion groups. Personally I don't care as I find all religions as pointless as each other and if someone breaks out of the caste system by changing their religion, good for them.

    Can't recall a single riot involving Christians and if there any of them complaining it could only be about not being able to eat beef in some states or if they're up to some golmaal vis a vis some conversion scam they're not able to pull money from.

    Other than that, Christian groups have contributed immensely to healthcare and education and have always been Indians first before anything else.

    So not sure what you've been reading.
    They Christian population of India is far less then the Muslim's. Secondly, India full well understands that to remain on good terms with the most powerful west it can not be seen as being anti-Christian. This does not apply to Muslim's who are already bombarded by the west and at an all time low. Christian''s of today do not have any specific eating habits which is why they can not be targeted by those hell bent on changing others eating habits. I don't want to provide video's of Christians being beaten up in India unless you insist.


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  18. #178
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    Quote Originally Posted by PakLFC View Post
    What you talking about?? From one subject you swiftly move to another one with digesting any information or thinking what you are on about? There is no paradox at all boy! The truth is there for all to see clearly. So if the BJP does not build the Mandir fearing a reaction then that is there problem, right??
    And how exactly is a supposedly subjugated helpless minority able to achieve that ?
    Subjugated and oppressed communities by definition aren't capable of civil war.
    Last edited by Tusker; 16th June 2018 at 16:05.


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  19. #179
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tusker View Post
    And how exactly is a supposedly subjugated helpless minority able to achieve that ?
    Subjugated and oppressed communities by definition aren't capable of civil war.
    What? So subjugated communicates can't make war is that what you are saying? Rather the opposite is true that oppressed people who have nothing to lose are more dangerous then anything or anyone else. Oh yes they are fully capable of creating complete mayhem. We see that in IoK every day! Now don't tell me they are not subjugated. I believe you were the poster who wanted evidence that oppression of minorities is a daily way of life in India.



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  20. #180
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    Quote Originally Posted by PakLFC View Post
    What? So subjugated communicates can't make war is that what you are saying? Rather the opposite is true that oppressed people who have nothing to lose are more dangerous then anything or anyone else. Oh yes they are fully capable of creating complete mayhem. We see that in IoK every day! Now don't tell me they are not subjugated.
    So since there are no such things happening in Pakistan therefore Hindus and Christians are not subjugated then in Pakistan?

    I believe you were the poster who wanted evidence that oppression of minorities is a daily way of life in India.

    If you believe this happens every day in India then you must also similarly believe that blacks are persecuted on a daily basis in America .

    A country that has a disproportionate no.of Sikhs in its armed forces in top positions, numerous non-hindus who were Presidents and top ministers is being questioned by a Pakistani poster a country that does not allow non-Muslims to get anywhere near such top positions. Heck di you even allow them in Military as soldiers? Laughable.

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