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  1. #1
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    Albert Einsten the racist - his newly published diaries reveal

    Einstein's travel diaries reveal 'shocking' xenophobia

    Private journals kept by the scientist and humanitarian icon show prejudiced attitudes towards the people he met while travelling in Asia

    The publication of Albert Einstein’s private diaries detailing his tour of Asia in the 1920s reveals the theoretical physicist and humanitarian icon’s racist attitudes to the people he met on his travels, particularly the Chinese.
    Further passages in the diaries, which are thought to have been written for Einstein’s stepdaughters in Berlin while he and his wife were travelling in Asia, Spain and Palestine, and as an aide memoire, see him writing of the Chinese that “even those reduced to working like horses never give the impression of conscious suffering. A peculiar herd-like nation [ … ] often more like automatons than people.” He later adds, in Rosenkranz’s words, “a healthy dose of extreme misogyny” to his xenophobia with the observation: “I noticed how little difference there is between men and women; I don’t understand what kind of fatal attraction Chinese women possess which enthrals the corresponding men to such an extent that they are incapable of defending themselves against the formidable blessing of offspring”.
    In Colombo in Ceylon, Einstein writes of how the locals “live in great filth and considerable stench at ground level” adding that they “do little, and need little. The simple economic cycle of life.” .
    “Einstein’s diary entries on the biological origin of the alleged intellectual inferiority of the Japanese, Chinese, and Indians are definitely not understated and can be viewed as racist – in these instances, other peoples are portrayed as being biologically inferior, a clear hallmark of racism. The disquieting comment that the Chinese may ‘supplant all other races’ is also most revealing in this regard,” writes Rosenkranz.

    “Here, Einstein perceives a foreign ‘race’ as a threat, which … is one of the characteristics of a racist ideology. Yet the remark that must strike the modern reader as most offensive is his feigning not to understand how Chinese men can find their women sufficiently attractive to have offspring with them. In light of these instances, we must conclude that Einstein did make quite a few racist and dehumanising comments in the diary, some of which were extremely unpleasant.”
    https://www.theguardian.com/books/20...ing-xenophobia

    Rosenkranz told the Guardian that although views like Einstein’s were prevalent at the time, they were not universal. “That’s usually the reaction I get – ‘we have to understand, he was of the zeitgeist, part of the time’ – but I think I tried here and there to give a broader context. There were other views out there, more tolerant views,” he said.
    In other words, any excuse of the type "well that was the norm in those days" is not valid.


    “In individuals, insanity is rare; but in groups, parties, nations and epochs, it is the rule”

  2. #2
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    Many people still do not like Asian women and hold the exact same view as Einstein.

    You read the internet articles and comments section, everything is racist. Blacks on whites, whites on blacks, Asians, Indians...

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    But his works benefited all races. Period.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by troodon View Post
    Many people still do not like Asian women and hold the exact same view as Einstein.

    You read the internet articles and comments section, everything is racist. Blacks on whites, whites on blacks, Asians, Indians...
    Yellow fever is a thing in western countries. In fact according to data, marriage between white men and east Asian women is extremely common and the most prevalent interracial marriage.


    "Be the best version of yourself"

  5. #5
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    He admired Ravindranath Tagore and Vedanta philosophy though.


    Tazimi Sirdar

  6. #6
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    Maybe he had a bad time on his travels this particular year.

    He was opposed to the Jewish state because of how the inhabitants would then be treated. I dont think he was racist in nature.


    Lions don't lose sleep over the opinions of Sheep

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by KingKhanWC View Post
    Maybe he had a bad time on his travels this particular year.

    He was opposed to the Jewish state because of how the inhabitants would then be treated. I dont think he was racist in nature.
    True, I don't blame his writings especially when it came to his travels in India

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by TM Riddle View Post
    He admired Ravindranath Tagore and Vedanta philosophy though.
    I don't think he had the knowledge of Vedanta as physicists like Heisenberg and esp. Schrödinger.

    What he liked in Vedanta was the pantheism he also admired in a fellow Jew, Spinoza, and his youthful fav. philosopher is the most Indophile of all Europeans : Schopenhauer.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by shaz619 View Post
    True, I don't blame his writings especially when it came to his travels in India
    The sample is so small from October 1922 to March 1923, less than 6 months. When returning from travels it's easy to generalise, I have done it myself a few times after returning from certain nations but this doesn't mean I'm racist. Exactly imagine a man of superiour intelligence and understanding of the world, universe, laws of physics having to witness humans acting in ways which are primal, it's must be confusing and frustrating esp if he was subjected to some unfriendly treatment.


    Lions don't lose sleep over the opinions of Sheep

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by enkidu_ View Post
    I don't think he had the knowledge of Vedanta as physicists like Heisenberg and esp. Schrödinger.

    What he liked in Vedanta was the pantheism he also admired in a fellow Jew, Spinoza, and his youthful fav. philosopher is the most Indophile of all Europeans : Schopenhauer.
    In your view was he a racist?


    Lions don't lose sleep over the opinions of Sheep

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by KingKhanWC View Post
    In your view was he a racist?
    Yes.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by enkidu_ View Post
    Yes.
    Because of these revelations, his diary account of Chinese, Indians etc or are you aware of other details?


    Lions don't lose sleep over the opinions of Sheep

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by KingKhanWC View Post
    Because of these revelations, his diary account of Chinese, Indians etc or are you aware of other details?
    Nope. In the works by/about him I came across there's his cosmetic rhetoric "humanism", but never went into such diaries and details. Their publication will be interesting.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by enkidu_ View Post
    Nope. In the works by/about him I came across there's his cosmetic rhetoric "humanism", but never went into such diaries and details. Their publication will be interesting.
    Fair enough, thanks.


    Lions don't lose sleep over the opinions of Sheep

  15. #15
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    Einstein has been built into a "humanitarian icon" by the liberal establishment that wants a share of his glory.

    Of course the liberal media suppresses facts about his life, such as his dominating nature and extra-marital affairs (including his wife's sister):

    https://www.ibtimes.co.uk/albert-ein...etters-1478644

    Einstein was a great man. It is just that he was also belonged to the real world, rather than a world of delusional liberal politically correct fantasies.

    At the very least Einstein owes a lot to India for his science, his second most important work after relativity was Bose-Einstein Statistics, which was a translation of Bose's work.

    Einstein's name, like Newton's and Galileo's will live forever.

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    In terms of Chinese being a herd like nation and not showing their suffering his views still stand imo

  17. #17
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    "...Einstein’s diary entries on the biological origin of the alleged intellectual inferiority of the Japanese, Chinese, and Indians are definitely not understated and can be viewed as racist – in these instances, other peoples are portrayed as being biologically inferior, a clear hallmark of racism."
    It's laughable to read posters defending his racism just because he was a brilliant scientist. Being a racist and also a genius are not mutually exclusive traits.


    “In individuals, insanity is rare; but in groups, parties, nations and epochs, it is the rule”

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yossarian View Post
    It's laughable to read posters defending his racism just because he was a brilliant scientist. Being a racist and also a genius are not mutually exclusive traits.
    Maybe you lost respect for him. but my respect for him remains untarnished. anyway racist shaming is the new pastime of bored liberals who are now digging from old diaries to make themselves feel righteous.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by CricketCartoons View Post
    Maybe you lost respect for him. but my respect for him remains untarnished. anyway racist shaming is the new pastime of bored liberals who are now digging from old diaries to make themselves feel righteous.
    I respect the fact that he was a genius, a brilliant scientist. I do not respect the fact that he thought people like me (and you), and our forefathers, ie those from the Indian sub-Continent (along with China and Japan) are/were biologically inferior. But if you still respect that aspect of him, then fair enough, who am I to argue with how your views are in that regard.


    “In individuals, insanity is rare; but in groups, parties, nations and epochs, it is the rule”

  20. #20
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    Racism is as old as the evolution of humans into different species. One can go as far back as Aristotle and find “racism” in his teachings.

    However, people became aware of racism much, much later. As the world developed, globalization happened had people from different nationalities and races started to compete for resources, they realized that giving preference to a group of people based on their appearance was wrong.

    It was until the 19th century that racism because an issue that people cared about. I would ignore the notion that Islam ended racism in the 7th century, because it would spiral the discussion into a different realm.

    Hence, the outlook of racism in Einstein’s time was not the same as it is today, and we cannot judge him from the same lens. He was a genius, but he was still shaped by the society and environment that he grew up in.

    If Einstein was around today, it is unlikely that he would have held the same “orientalist” views, and even if he did, he would not write about it in his diary (or Tweet about it), since people today are actively looking for opportunities to accuse others of being racist.

    On a more controversial note, perhaps people like Einstein are allowed to be somewhat racist? After all, he was superior to other humans and was probably naturally predisposed to thinking that most humans were inferior to him.

    This begs the question - are most geniuses racist, and have the majority of the high achievers in history exhibited racist tendencies?

    I think it would make a fantastic research topic.

  21. #21
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    All these aristocratic type Brits are racists at heart! Winston Churchill was another one painted as a saint but hater of coloured people.


    PP's own self proclaimed sharpshooter and defender of Islam and Pakistan.

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by PakLFC View Post
    All these aristocratic type Brits are racists at heart! Winston Churchill was another one painted as a saint but hater of coloured people.
    Einstein was German.

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by James View Post
    Einstein was German.
    He was a Jew, so his ideas are even more surpising considering how Jews were themselves seen in German society (a bit like another migrant group from the East, basically, the Romanis.)

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yossarian View Post
    It's laughable to read posters defending his racism just because he was a brilliant scientist. Being a racist and also a genius are not mutually exclusive traits.
    In later life he advocated for Civil Rights. A person's views can change over a lifetime.

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    SJWs

    Didn't even bother to read the article.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mamoon View Post
    Racism is as old as the evolution of humans into different species. One can go as far back as Aristotle and find “racism” in his teachings.

    However, people became aware of racism much, much later. As the world developed, globalization happened had people from different nationalities and races started to compete for resources, they realized that giving preference to a group of people based on their appearance was wrong.

    It was until the 19th century that racism because an issue that people cared about. I would ignore the notion that Islam ended racism in the 7th century, because it would spiral the discussion into a different realm.

    Hence, the outlook of racism in Einstein’s time was not the same as it is today, and we cannot judge him from the same lens. He was a genius, but he was still shaped by the society and environment that he grew up in.

    If Einstein was around today, it is unlikely that he would have held the same “orientalist” views, and even if he did, he would not write about it in his diary (or Tweet about it), since people today are actively looking for opportunities to accuse others of being racist.

    On a more controversial note, perhaps people like Einstein are allowed to be somewhat racist? After all, he was superior to other humans and was probably naturally predisposed to thinking that most humans were inferior to him.

    This begs the question - are most geniuses racist, and have the majority of the high achievers in history exhibited racist tendencies?

    I think it would make a fantastic research topic.
    Is there any evidence to suggest the geniuses exhibited racist tendencies? You would need more than the example of Einstein to make it a worthwhile research.


    I for one welcome our new In____ overlords - Kent Brockman

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cpt. Rishwat View Post
    Is there any evidence to suggest the geniuses exhibited racist tendencies? You would need more than the example of Einstein to make it a worthwhile research.
    That is why I think it would make for a great research topic. It remains to be seen if Einstein was the only genius to exhibit racism. I hope not.

  28. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robert View Post
    In later life he advocated for Civil Rights. A person's views can change over a lifetime.
    Are racism and advocacy of civil rights mutual exclusive? I don't think so.

  29. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robert View Post
    In later life he advocated for Civil Rights. A person's views can change over a lifetime.
    Civil Rights for everybody, regardless of race, colour or creed? Or Civil Rights only for those not being seen by him as being 'biologically inferior'? Those who are more familiar with his work in this regard could perhaps answer.


    “In individuals, insanity is rare; but in groups, parties, nations and epochs, it is the rule”

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mamoon View Post
    That is why I think it would make for a great research topic. It remains to be seen if Einstein was the only genius to exhibit racism. I hope not.
    I am intrigued, why would you hope that more geniuses displayed traits of racism? Is racism a view you feel holds merit? If so, could you give us your reasons for this view?


    I for one welcome our new In____ overlords - Kent Brockman

  31. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cpt. Rishwat View Post
    I am intrigued, why would you hope that more geniuses displayed traits of racism? Is racism a view you feel holds merit? If so, could you give us your reasons for this view?
    I believe his earlier post already gives an idea as to his views on the topic.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mamoon View Post
    On a more controversial note, perhaps people like Einstein are allowed to be somewhat racist? After all, he was superior to other humans and was probably naturally predisposed to thinking that most humans were inferior to him..
    Who defines what makes an individual 'superior' to others? Everyone has different abilities. Doesn't mean they're a 'superior' or an 'inferior' individual to someone who's a brilliant mathematician and physicist. I'm sure even Einsten was cr*p at many things compared to others. For example, how was he at running the 100 metres compared with Jesse Owens?


    “In individuals, insanity is rare; but in groups, parties, nations and epochs, it is the rule”

  32. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yossarian View Post
    I believe his earlier post already gives an idea as to his views on the topic.

    Who defines what makes an individual 'superior' to others? Everyone has different abilities. Doesn't mean they're a 'superior' or an 'inferior' individual to someone who's a brilliant mathematician and physicist. I'm sure even Einsten was cr*p at many things compared to others. For example, how was he at running the 100 metres compared with Jesse Owens?
    That is a really good point. I suppose it comes down to mental intellect vs physical gifts, and which set of abilities would provide more good to a greater number of people in the long run. Has intellectuals and scientists done more for the world or athletes or artists?

    Or perhaps high achievers in all fields that require natural talent and ability should be allowed to think of themselves as superior to other humans?

  33. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cpt. Rishwat View Post
    I am intrigued, why would you hope that more geniuses displayed traits of racism? Is racism a view you feel holds merit? If so, could you give us your reasons for this view?
    Perhaps an exception could be made for geniuses and high-achievers. Narcissism often goes hand in hand with achievement, and it can lead to racism as well.

  34. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mamoon View Post
    That is a really good point. I suppose it comes down to mental intellect vs physical gifts, and which set of abilities would provide more good to a greater number of people in the long run. Has intellectuals and scientists done more for the world or athletes or artists?

    Or perhaps high achievers in all fields that require natural talent and ability should be allowed to think of themselves as superior to other humans?
    You say 'mental intellect vs physical gifts'. Who defines level of 'mental intellect'? For example, a friend of mine relocated from the UK to the USA. Before he went to the States he was informed that since his children did not have a U.S. history of year-by-year high educational grades (due to coming from the UK school system) one way of getting his children into the 'gifted stream' in the county school system was if they had high IQ levels.

    So before leaving the UK he had his children's IQ assessed by a recognised professional. Upon arriving in the US he discovered that the IQ assessment needed to be performed by a psychologist on the county's school board's list. And guess what? The IQ scores were significantly lower! And the reason? They assessments were tailored for children living/growing up in the USA, being familiar with 'American' english spelling & grammar (as opposed to 'English' english), being familiar with American history, geography ...etc.

    So did their IQ or 'mental intellect' change in the few hours the plane took to hop over the Atlantic?


    “In individuals, insanity is rare; but in groups, parties, nations and epochs, it is the rule”

  35. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mamoon View Post
    Perhaps an exception could be made for geniuses and high-achievers. Narcissism often goes hand in hand with achievement, and it can lead to racism as well.
    I believe that, generally speaking, high achievers (in whatever field) thinking of themselves as being somehow superior to others is not racism, but simply being conceited, egotistical, and big-headed.


    “In individuals, insanity is rare; but in groups, parties, nations and epochs, it is the rule”

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    Quote Originally Posted by Yossarian View Post
    You say 'mental intellect vs physical gifts'. Who defines level of 'mental intellect'? For example, a friend of mine relocated from the UK to the USA. Before he went to the States he was informed that since his children did not have a U.S. history of year-by-year high educational grades (due to coming from the UK school system) one way of getting his children into the 'gifted stream' in the county school system was if they had high IQ levels.

    So before leaving the UK he had his children's IQ assessed by a recognised professional. Upon arriving in the US he discovered that the IQ assessment needed to be performed by a psychologist on the county's school board's list. And guess what? The IQ scores were significantly lower! And the reason? They assessments were tailored for children living/growing up in the USA, being familiar with 'American' english spelling & grammar (as opposed to 'English' english), being familiar with American history, geography ...etc.

    So did their IQ or 'mental intellect' change in the few hours the plane took to hop over the Atlantic?
    That is very interesting, jibing with the work of an American lady who does workshops on systemic racism and who claims that the tests are rigged.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Yossarian View Post
    I believe that, generally speaking, high achievers (in whatever field) thinking of themselves as being somehow superior to others is not racism, but simply being conceited, egotistical, and big-headed.
    Yes, that is what was confusing me, I didn't see where the racial aspect comes into it. I don't know if Mamoon is really thinking along the lines of the work of Charles Murray, The Bell Curve, but just doesn't want to say it openly, hence why he's using geniuses as a way of saying it in a roundabout way.


    I for one welcome our new In____ overlords - Kent Brockman

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    Quote Originally Posted by James View Post
    Einstein was German.
    Yeah! We know German's have never been racists!


    PP's own self proclaimed sharpshooter and defender of Islam and Pakistan.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Yossarian View Post
    I believe that, generally speaking, high achievers (in whatever field) thinking of themselves as being somehow superior to others is not racism, but simply being conceited, egotistical, and big-headed.
    Its not just high achiever, look at entire human race Vs 5M others, we are extremist racist about them, we don't care what they are or what they need, if they are not part of our food chain, we destroy them. We always plan and think about ourselves or our needs, if in the process something good comes out, we get higher moral or spiritual satisfaction, that itself is a selfish act...When we say saving the planet, its also a selfish slogan, we want to save it for our consumption. Planet does not need to be saved, its our selfish need, we are highly demanding species, like a royal blood, who needs lot of resources to keep the leg up the rest of the commoner

    There is always an element of superiority complex with respect to any special skill you have, genius have an extra ordinary intelligence. If you look at any genius of history, prophets, God (although its a fictional character), but he is the most arrogant of us all, reason for his arrogance is that "I am better than you at everything", tribalism is fundamental social construct of Human beings, this was a survival mechanism. That ideology is racist at the fundamental level

    Plus genius are generally good at very special traits. Many of them does not focus on social issues and politics of the time, they pick whatever is popular or common at that time. That's why many scientists had hard time with giving up religion in past, even though that blocked their scientific development. This happens to both Newton and Einstein. Newton wasted most of his life decoding Bible. Einstein could not keep terms with irrationality of Quantum world, for him nature at fundamental level cannot be that Chaotic. Maybe he picked up tribalism from whatever was common at that time...


    If you want to do things that are certain to succeed, you are doing very obvious thing - E Musk

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    I believe all human beings are born racist. It is just one of those things that we have to unlearn in our lifetime.

    But im surprised he holds such views about Chinese women. I find East Asian women comfortably the most attractive

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    Maybe he didn't have a look at his own wife or other jewish people for that matter before passing such remarks about Chinese people

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nikhil_cric View Post
    I believe all human beings are born racist. It is just one of those things that we have to unlearn in our lifetime.

    But im surprised he holds such views about Chinese women. I find East Asian women comfortably the most attractive
    I don't believe human beings are born racist at all, it's just a reflection of your society and ingrained ideas which get passed down. There is racial curiosity, that is only natural, same as you would be curious about someone who had black hair in a society of blondes. The thing about Chinese women is also just ingrained behaviour, back then people would have thought they looked weird, now it's become a fetish in America, maybe due to the wars they took part in Korea and Vietnam.


    I for one welcome our new In____ overlords - Kent Brockman

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    Quote Originally Posted by PakLFC View Post
    Yeah! We know German's have never been racists!
    I just said that he was German. I have no idea about his racism or lack of. I was replying to a post that seemed to suggest he was a British aristocrat, which made no sense really.

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    Quote Originally Posted by James View Post
    I just said that he was German. I have no idea about his racism or lack of. I was replying to a post that seemed to suggest he was a British aristocrat, which made no sense really.
    Yeah I get you. Phillip the so called Prince is another racist always making Indian jokes. I am not at all implying that common Brits are racists but the high clergy and aristocrats are.


    PP's own self proclaimed sharpshooter and defender of Islam and Pakistan.


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