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  1. #1
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    India's number 1 Test ranking - Is it deserved now?

    India have been number 1 for 23 months now and no one apart from Australia(74 months) has had a longer reign at the top since the Mace was introduced. After losing 4-1 to England though the stay at the top looks shaky. Do you think India deserves to be number 1 still? Discuss .


    'There's a lady who's sure all that glitters is gold'

  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nikhil_cric View Post
    India have been number 1 for 23 months now and no one apart from Australia(74 months) has had a longer reign at the top since the Mace was introduced. After losing 4-1 to England though the stay at the top looks shaky. Do you think India deserves to be number 1 still? Discuss .
    13 TEST At home it is most by any country in single year at home


    Just saying.....
    Last edited by saeed5646; 11th September 2018 at 17:32.

  3. #3
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    India is the most ruthless team in home conditions and against weaker teams. Indian posters should be extremely disappointed with the results in SA and England. Both opponents were not even that strong and India still went into the final test with series lost.

  4. #4
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    There is nothing called deserving or undeserving #1 or #2,#3 etc., even in T20Is

    We won, we reached #1. If other teams win, they'll reach #1.

  5. #5
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    I remember when Pakistan was at number 1 for a brief period, our achievement was being downplayed by Indians and psuedo-Indians that the ranking has been achieved by just playing at home (read as UAE) and a solitary drawn series in the England. Now when the shoe is on the other foot the Indians and psuedo-Indians are falling over each other trying to come up with new logic as to how India's ranking is well earned and well deserved.


    #Hum apko container deingaye dharnay ke liyay

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by saeed5646 View Post
    13 TEST At home it is most by any country in single year at home


    Just saying.....
    India has been ranked number 1 since 2016, except for 2 months after the washed out test against WI.

    Since 2016 India have played 17 home games. SA have played 18. England have played 21.

    Since 2016 India have played 15 away games, the highest in the world. 8 of those games were in SENA i.e 53% of away games.


    India's number 1 ranking has lasted well over 2 years - even after 2 SENA tours and a total of 4 away tours. No other team has had more than 4 away tours and no team has had more than 2 SENA tours in the last 2 years.

    So unlike the perception that permeates through PP, India's ranking is not based on home seasons.
    Last edited by the_outsider; 11th September 2018 at 17:47.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Syed1 View Post
    I remember when Pakistan was at number 1 for a brief period, our achievement was being downplayed by Indians and psuedo-Indians that the ranking has been achieved by just playing at home (read as UAE) and a solitary drawn series in the England. Now when the shoe is on the other foot the Indians and psuedo-Indians are falling over each other trying to come up with new logic as to how India's ranking is well earned and well deserved.
    And Pakistan winning even a single test in England and SA would have been a miracle as per our resident experts.

  8. #8
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    Yes. They are not worse than other away from home, but they are by far the best team in home conditions. No team deserves the number one ranking more.

  9. #9
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    This series is competitive. It might be an excuse, but imagine kohli winning all the tosses and I think the scoreline would say atleast 3-2 in favour of India. I am not saying this team is perfect, but I believe this is the #1 team and will be there for some time

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by the_outsider View Post
    India has been ranked number 1 since 2016, except for 2 months after the washed out test against WI.

    Since 2016 India have played 17 home games. SA have played 18. England have played 21.

    Since 2016 India have played 15 away games, the highest in the world. 8 of those games were in SENA i.e 53% of away games.


    India's number 1 ranking has lasted well over 2 years - even after 2 SENA tours and a total of 4 away tours. No other team has had more than 4 away tours and no team has had more than 2 SENA tours in the last 2 years.

    So unlike the perception that permeates through PP, India's ranking is not based on home seasons.
    Correction. Less than 1 month.

  11. #11
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    It is what it is.

    Its a level playing field and no one should doubt the technical aspects of ranking.

    But, every series should be looked in isolation. In this series, England were clearly the better side.


    For the latest updates on Cricket, follow @PakPassion on Twitter

  12. #12
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    Rankings only make sense if teams play each other in a similar amount of games home and away like in football. Until then, rankings don't matter much

  13. #13
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    By the looks of it our number 1 ranking will depend on the Australia tour. If Australia win by a big margin, India will go down in the rankings. Only other possibility is if WI beat us 2-0 at home and ENG beat SL 3-0 away in which case England will go upto #1.

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    I'll ask a simple question -if not us who is better than us?

    We can annihilate anyone in home conditions and at least compete away as well as also winning in SL which other teams dont manage.Its not great ,but being marginally better than others on this aspect.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mamoon View Post
    Yes. They are not worse than other away from home, but they are by far the best team in home conditions. No team deserves the number one ranking more.
    Highlight of the summer 4 -- 1

  16. #16
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    We are the best among the worst. Hence No.1 Team.

    Also, we are not getting Whitewashed like before when touring Aus, Eng, SA. We are managing to pull the odd wins and we demolish touring teams at home.

    Deserved No.1. But not comparable to the great Aussies or SA teams of the past.

  17. #17
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    Yes they deserve it. If they start losing home games/series then there status as the number 1 team should be questioned.

  18. #18
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    This is a question to all the so called experts on here, how many number one ranked sides, who have been ranked number one for a considerable period, lets say more than a year, have lost 6-2 to their toughest opposition? How many have lost by a hundred or more runs on 3 of those occasions and by an innings on another occasion?

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hasan123 View Post
    Yes they deserve it. If they start losing home games/series then there status as the number 1 team should be questioned.
    Ah yes, that makes sense. For a team to be ranked number one in test cricket, the finest aspect of our beloved sport, teams must only win at home.

    Thank you for clearing that up.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by barah_admi View Post
    Ah yes, that makes sense. For a team to be ranked number one in test cricket, the finest aspect of our beloved sport, teams must only win at home.

    Thank you for clearing that up.
    Well it certainly isn't losing 3 out of the last 7 home matches like some other teams I know of.

    Oh I see you meant to say that teams must only win in England. Results everywhere else don't count. I get it now.
    Last edited by the_outsider; 11th September 2018 at 21:29.

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by the_outsider View Post
    Well it certainly isn't losing 3 out of the last 7 home matches like some other teams I know of.

    Oh I see you mean that test match victories only matter when they come in England. I get it now.
    I never said that, but one of your kind has just said winning test series at home is enough to be ranked as number one. It is stupid and you know it. Plus no one is claiming Pakistan is number one.

    Yet the so called number one side have been humiliated in England against a subpar English side with a teenager, a guy who hadnt played test cricket for years, a guy making a come back and a guy on trial.

    But keep patting yourself on the back

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by barah_admi View Post
    I never said that, but one of your kind has just said winning test series at home is enough to be ranked as number one. It is stupid and you know it. Plus no one is claiming Pakistan is number one.

    Yet the so called number one side have been humiliated in England against a subpar English side with a teenager, a guy who hadnt played test cricket for years, a guy making a come back and a guy on trial.

    But keep patting yourself on the back
    Agree that only winning at home is not enough. But India also wins away. Not many. But then no other team is winning away either. And India wins much more at home than any other team. So that all adds up to a sizable difference.

  23. #23
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    At last an Indian has realised the fact that India isn't worthy enough for being the no 1 test team. As a matter of fact, I have been saying it for quite some time.

    Also, don't forget the fact that they haven't been thrashed by an inform England team, rather they have been beaten to submission by a depleted no 5 th rank team where the main job of the batting was done by the tail enders.

    Then add England's pathetic slip catching, horrible selection and off the field incidents(like Stokes not been able to concentrate on his cricket due to his on going case). This will just further illustrate the point that this series was there for the taking for any decent team and for a no 1 team It should've been a walk in the park( I mean for a real no 1 team, not the fake one that's currently holding the position)
    Last edited by RainMan_; 11th September 2018 at 22:38.

  24. #24
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    It is as deserved as it was when they landed here. Never forget how hapless England looks in the subcontinent

  25. #25
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    India doesn't deserve #1 the way they have performed in last 2 series. 2-6 is horrible.

  26. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by barah_admi View Post
    This is a question to all the so called experts on here, how many number one ranked sides, who have been ranked number one for a considerable period, lets say more than a year, have lost 6-2 to their toughest opposition? How many have lost by a hundred or more runs on 3 of those occasions and by an innings on another occasion?
    Is India Competing against past no 1 teams in ranking.... India is no 1 because they are better than all other test playing nations

    What logic people are using to prove that they dont deserve no 1 ranking.. By comparing with past no 1* teams... Wow

    So if all PPers think India dont deserve no 1 ranking then currently who deserve it more than india.... SA, AUS, ENG or Pakistan?

  27. #27
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    India does deserve the number 1 ranking in the world but do not deserve the best team in the world tag. Those are two separate things. There is in fact no team currently who can be called the best in the world. The only teams who had combined both the accolades were Australia and West Indies.

  28. #28
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    There is no great team out there. So, it is india. I felt Australia looked like a no.1 team with Smith, Warner and their bowlers(S.C.H.L). But they were disappointment in SA where Australia always win. So, no team good enough to win overseas. SA with de Villiers loss and Amla/Steyn past it will go to a resurgence period.

    So, yes, India are the no.1 ranked team and also the best team in the world going around. India between 2007-2011 was a superior team though. Those guys knew how to win matches overseas.

  29. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by saeed5646 View Post
    13 TEST At home it is most by any country in single year at home


    Just saying.....
    We play a lot of test cricket - home or away. By the end of 9 tests, Kohli had back issues and Ashwin had athletic pubalgia. Our team looked jaded and were less effective against Australia. I'd like to see England, SA, Australia or PAK play 13 years in a season and see how many they manage not to lose.

  30. #30
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    Sometimes I don't get if people purposely try to troll or they are just dense.

    India wins more at home and loses less away compared to other teams so they are number 1 at the moment.

    Don't like it?

    Then find a team that wins more at home and wins away as well and it will automatically replace India at the top.

    This is so stupid that even a 3 year old should be able to understand that India got to the top because the other teams sucked worse.

    But I suppose India sitting at the top is very salty for Pakistani fans, so instead of asking our team to outplay India in performances, they are questioning if a team that sits on the top is deserving of number one ranking.

    Then who is?

    We can't have a status quo and stop the rankings at number 2.

    Lets play it out for everyone.

    Who should be at top after seeing wins, losses and draws over the last 2 years for every team?

    But no one will have answers.

    Just India don't deserve it.

    This just seems like the petulant child who keeps complaining he wants candy even when the candy is stale and rotten.


    And I get so high.. And I just can't feel it....

  31. #31
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    India is the #1 team in the world and the best team currenly but that does not make it a great teat there is mediocrity all around and India is best among a poor bunch.

  32. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nikhil_cric View Post
    Do you think India deserves to be number 1 still? Discuss .
    Very simple question: Which other current International team do you consider as good as or better than the current Indian team?

    If you can't name a current International team that is better than India, then it follows that India deserves the #1 ranking.

  33. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dr_Bassim View Post
    Sometimes I don't get if people purposely try to troll or they are just dense.

    India wins more at home and loses less away compared to other teams so they are number 1 at the moment.

    Don't like it?

    Then find a team that wins more at home and wins away as well and it will automatically replace India at the top.

    This is so stupid that even a 3 year old should be able to understand that India got to the top because the other teams sucked worse.

    But I suppose India sitting at the top is very salty for Pakistani fans, so instead of asking our team to outplay India in performances, they are questioning if a team that sits on the top is deserving of number one ranking.

    Then who is?

    We can't have a status quo and stop the rankings at number 2.

    Lets play it out for everyone.

    Who should be at top after seeing wins, losses and draws over the last 2 years for every team?

    But no one will have answers.

    Just India don't deserve it.

    This just seems like the petulant child who keeps complaining he wants candy even when the candy is stale and rotten.
    Indian team is receiving well deserved criticism. First of all, India was a better ranked team than both SA and England. Yet, both series were over by second tests. Second, their home wins have again come against lower ranked teams on doctored pitches where the likes of Ashwin become Bradman of bowling and Pujara becomes Rahul Dravid.

    India’s #1 ranking is solely based on home dominance. Can’t recall when was the last time they won or even drew a series in Australia, England, SA, or NZ. People are right to question this ranking.

  34. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Peshwa View Post
    Is India Competing against past no 1 teams in ranking.... India is no 1 because they are better than all other test playing nations

    What logic people are using to prove that they dont deserve no 1 ranking.. By comparing with past no 1* teams... Wow


    So if all PPers think India dont deserve no 1 ranking then currently who deserve it more than india.... SA, AUS, ENG or Pakistan?
    This.

    Can't believe something so simple needed to be spoonfed to the likes of @RainMan_ @barah_admi @Syed1 and @Slim

  35. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by The_Odd_One View Post
    Indian team is receiving well deserved criticism. First of all, India was a better ranked team than both SA and England. Yet, both series were over by second tests. Second, their home wins have again come against lower ranked teams on doctored pitches where the likes of Ashwin become Bradman of bowling and Pujara becomes Rahul Dravid.

    India’s #1 ranking is solely based on home dominance. Can’t recall when was the last time they won or even drew a series in Australia, England, SA, or NZ. People are right to question this ranking.
    Alright...tell me which team DOMINATED home and away in the last two or three years, that you think should be No.1 in tests. The answer is none. There are no world class test teams out there ATM all thanks to t20 circus ..sorry leagues. Every team is dominant at home and suck away. And we are no.1 because we suck lesser. Hope you got it.

  36. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stalin View Post
    Alright...tell me which team DOMINATED home and away in the last two or three years, that you think should be No.1 in tests. The answer is none. There are no world class test teams out there ATM all thanks to t20 circus ..sorry leagues. Every team is dominant at home and suck away. And we are no.1 because we suck lesser. Hope you got it.
    SA managed to beat Australia in Australia. England beat SA in SA. Australia drew their series in Bangladesh. India have only won at home and lost every time they played in alien conditions.

    Winning at home is not the same as winning away from home which are cherished more. England beating India in India was a bigger accomplishment then beating them in England which is a standard procedure.

  37. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by The_Odd_One View Post
    SA managed to beat Australia in Australia. England beat SA in SA. Australia drew their series in Bangladesh. India have only won at home and lost every time they played in alien conditions.

    Winning at home is not the same as winning away from home which are cherished more. England beating India in India was a bigger accomplishment then beating them in England which is a standard procedure.
    Make a table.

    Isolated wins don't mean much.

    I am sure if you make a table of last 2 years performances, you would be surprised that India sucked less than other teams.

    Sure, you can criticize India for a disastrous England tour.

    But that is not the topic of this thread.

    The topic is "India's number 1 ranking, is it deserved now?"

    There are other threads to bash India for losing to England.


    And I get so high.. And I just can't feel it....

  38. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dr_Bassim View Post
    Make a table.

    Isolated wins don't mean much.

    I am sure if you make a table of last 2 years performances, you would be surprised that India sucked less than other teams.

    Sure, you can criticize India for a disastrous England tour.

    But that is not the topic of this thread.

    The topic is "India's number 1 ranking, is it deserved now?"

    There are other threads to bash India for losing to England.
    The question for me is not if India deserves the number 1 ranking but if the number 1 ranking really means anything.

  39. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by The_Odd_One View Post
    The question for me is not if India deserves the number 1 ranking but if the number 1 ranking really means anything.
    Yes, it does.

    It simply means over a period of 2 years one team has performed better than 9 other test teams in relative terms.

    It's like Rafael Nadal is ranked number 1 in ATP rankings and has only won the French Open this season.

    But over a period of 1 year, he has performed better than Federer or Djokovic by reaching two other SF and one QF of the 4 mandatory Grand Slams.

    You might object and say Federer is a better player or Djokovic is a better player.

    However, rankings just say what happened.

    Disagreement is personal.

    Rankings factual.


    And I get so high.. And I just can't feel it....

  40. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by The_Odd_One View Post
    The question for me is not if India deserves the number 1 ranking but if the number 1 ranking really means anything.
    You keep thinking deeply on that while we keep the test mace. I have no problem with that.

    Just like everybody thinks Pakistan's CT win was a fluke. But at the end of the day, they have the trophy.

  41. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mamoon View Post
    Yes. They are not worse than other away from home, but they are by far the best team in home conditions. No team deserves the number one ranking more.
    Not on the forum much anymore, but it’s nice to see some things never change.

  42. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by austerlitz View Post
    I'll ask a simple question -if not us who is better than us?

    We can annihilate anyone in home conditions and at least compete away as well as also winning in SL which other teams dont manage.Its not great ,but being marginally better than others on this aspect.
    Where have you competed? Won on a dead rubber in SA and just one test all be it a live test in England lets wait and see for Aus series. I don't have a problem with India being number 1 in rankings but rankings doesn't matter much in tests as they cant possible reflect the current situation alone. For starters when home or away matter so much the rankings don't make any allowance for that at all and then tours are not equal in number of matches etc.

    The only time the rankings reflected a true number one was when that great AUSside was number 1 and that was only because they were so great they just kept on winning everywhere that flaws in the rankings didn't matter they left no doubt. Since then the flaws in the ranking system has been exposed.

  43. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by the_outsider View Post
    You keep thinking deeply on that while we keep the test mace. I have no problem with that.

    Just like everybody thinks Pakistan's CT win was a fluke. But at the end of the day, they have the trophy.
    Who thinks CT win was a fluke? It was what it was everybody had to win a certain amount of games to win the tournament and the only team to do it was Pak. Now I keep saying the current ranking system is not accurate for tests because if we believed the ranking system we would have said that India would be favorites to beat both SA and ENG but we all knew it was the opposite because India was playing away at those locations. When the great AUS side was number 1 nobody cared about the ranking because even with the flaws that AUS side was so good that it didnt expose the flaws actually nobody cared to look at the ranking it was so obvious they were favorites where ever they went. And then that SA side which managed to play very well away from home and not lost the series away from home for few years. But now we have India who have exposed the flaws in the system by losing to SA and England and were not even favorites to win it despite being number 1 which made no sense. In an ideal word if the ranking system says you are number 1 then nobody should have any doubts that team should starts favorites to win everywhere in the world.
    Last edited by Pakhs; 12th September 2018 at 08:59.

  44. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pakhs View Post
    Who thinks CT win was a fluke? It was what it was everybody had to win a certain amount of games to win the tournament and the only team to do it was Pak. Now I keep saying the current ranking system is not accurate for tests because if we believed the ranking system we would have said that India would be favorites to beat both SA and ENG but we all knew it was the opposite because India was playing away at those locations. When the great AUS side was number 1 nobody cared about the ranking because even with the flaws that AUS side was so good that it didnt expose the flaws actually nobody cared to look at the ranking it was so obvious they were favorites where ever they went. And then that SA side which managed to play very well away from home and not lost the series away from home for few years. But now we have India who have exposed the flaws in the system by losing to SA and England and were not even favorites to win it despite being number 1 which made no sense. In an ideal word if the ranking system says you are number 1 then nobody should have any doubts that team should starts favorites to win everywhere in the world.
    Stupid logic to think number 1 ranked team will win every away tour.

    By that logic, Australia who did not win in India in 2001, 2008 and 2013 (they were ranked number 1 for all 3 series) is also a fake number 1 side.

    Try convincing people of that.

  45. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by The_Odd_One View Post
    SA managed to beat Australia in Australia. England beat SA in SA. Australia drew their series in Bangladesh. India have only won at home and lost every time they played in alien conditions.

    Winning at home is not the same as winning away from home which are cherished more. England beating India in India was a bigger accomplishment then beating them in England which is a standard procedure.
    Those two then also lost to Sri Lanka and drew away to a team as bad as Bangladesh

  46. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by Peshwa View Post
    Is India Competing against past no 1 teams in ranking.... India is no 1 because they are better than all other test playing nations

    What logic people are using to prove that they dont deserve no 1 ranking.. By comparing with past no 1* teams... Wow

    So if all PPers think India dont deserve no 1 ranking then currently who deserve it more than india.... SA, AUS, ENG or Pakistan?
    What makes them better than the teams you claim? They have won at home and lost away, which is what Eng, SA and Aus have largely done also. They are at most on par. A number one team should win away too. It is plain stupid to think like you do.

    Also, when you quote me, answer the question I asked or don't quote that particular post.

  47. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by the_outsider View Post
    Agree that only winning at home is not enough. But India also wins away. Not many. But then no other team is winning away either. And India wins much more at home than any other team. So that all adds up to a sizable difference.
    They don't win MUCH more at home than any other side. England havent lost a series at home since 2014. Australia have only lost to SA and SA to England and Aus in recent times.

    India are at best on par with those sides. Plus England's win in SA is far more impressive than anything India have done away.

  48. #48
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    Yes we are rubbish overseas but deservingly no.1 because others are even worse. Please improve and snatch no.1 spot from us dont complain.

  49. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pakhs View Post
    Where have you competed? Won on a dead rubber in SA and just one test all be it a live test in England lets wait and see for Aus series. I don't have a problem with India being number 1 in rankings but rankings doesn't matter much in tests as they cant possible reflect the current situation alone. For starters when home or away matter so much the rankings don't make any allowance for that at all and then tours are not equal in number of matches etc.

    The only time the rankings reflected a true number one was when that great AUSside was number 1 and that was only because they were so great they just kept on winning everywhere that flaws in the rankings didn't matter they left no doubt. Since then the flaws in the ranking system has been exposed.
    South africa first test was touch and go as well.
    England 2 tests were close.We weren't whitewashed for fun 4-0 like england in india and 3-0 like SA,without even bothering the opoosition in the least.
    Agreed on australia.

  50. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by the_outsider View Post
    Stupid logic to think number 1 ranked team will win every away tour.

    By that logic, Australia who did not win in India in 2001, 2008 and 2013 (they were ranked number 1 for all 3 series) is also a fake number 1 side.

    Try convincing people of that.
    Only 2001 can be classed as a failure of that side, 2008 was the end and 2013 was similar situation to India now. So that great side won pretty much everything everywhere other than one tour which is fine.

    The logic is not stupid its how it should be, to say we should say a team can be ranked number 1 but not even favorites to win on atleast 3 tours is crazy logic. its like saying i am best player in the world but actually this and this and this.

    But its not India's fault in anyway my point is rankings should be tweaked to give the clear number 1 without doubt. I am not taking anything away from India I must make that point.

  51. #51
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    To me nobody deserves the no 1 ranking but somebody has to get it, India is as good or bad as the 4th, 5th ranked.

    When you are inviting top ranked teams in 2017 like Aus, Eng and SA one after another and there were some beautiful spitting cobra wickets created in that Indian season.

    So when you are whitewashing top teams within a span of few months in 4-5 match series then surely you are gonna get some great ranking points. They were so much that India is still enjoying them till now.
    Last edited by Titan24; 12th September 2018 at 11:12.

  52. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by austerlitz View Post
    South africa first test was touch and go as well.
    England 2 tests were close.We weren't whitewashed for fun 4-0 like england in india and 3-0 like SA,without even bothering the opoosition in the least.
    Agreed on australia.
    India have competed yes but even a number 2 or number 3 sides should be able to compete too. But the point is the were not even favorites to win despite being ranked number 1 shows the flaws in the system.

    Again not India's fault in anyway they are number 1 according to the mathematical formula/algorithm. We are just discussing in a discussion thread and I think the ranking system in cricket should account for different conditions specially in tests matches where condition vary so much. Plus home and away matches should be equal in number in say 2 year or 4 year cycle. for example India played 4 test matches at home against SA but only 3 away thats surely unfair on SA.

  53. #53
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    Its not that others are worse in overseas conditions, its just that no other team was lucky enough to get 4-5 match series consecutively against top sides since a number of years. India got it in their last home season.

    If I am wrong anybody can feel free to share the fixtures of other teams at home and which team got 3 consecutive series with 4-5 matches in each against top sides at home. These rankings are artificial.

    Any current test team lik SA, Eng, NZ etc will also get the number one ranking if they are given such gifts.
    Last edited by Titan24; 12th September 2018 at 11:19.

  54. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by barah_admi View Post
    Ah yes, that makes sense. For a team to be ranked number one in test cricket, the finest aspect of our beloved sport, teams must only win at home.

    Thank you for clearing that up.

    Other teams aren't much better away from home than India. Also not all teams are as dominate as India at home. India's ranking is mostly based on home dominance.

    Do you have a better method for the ICC rankings?

  55. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by Titan24 View Post
    To me nobody deserves the no 1 ranking but somebody has to get it, India is as good or bad as the 4th, 5th ranked.

    When you are inviting top ranked teams in 2017 like Aus, Eng and SA one after another and there were some beautiful spitting cobra wickets created in that Indian season.

    So when you are whitewashing top teams within a span of few months in 4-5 match series then surely you are gonna get some great ranking points. They were so much that India is still enjoying them till now.
    Dude you have no idea about what you're saying. You're perception is so incredibly biased.

    SA, Eng, etc have played plenty of home games recently.

    Since 2016 India has played 17 home tests and 15 away tests.

    England have played 21 home games in that period and SA have played 18 home games.

    India has played 8 games in SENA which is the highest for any Asian team in the last 2 years.

    And they are still ranked number 1.

    And as far as pitches go, check the number of overs bowled in those matches. You'll understand. Almost every match went into day 5. That doesn't happen unless the pitches are flat.
    Last edited by the_outsider; 12th September 2018 at 11:37.

  56. #56
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    I have seen such a huge debate & complicated analysis about this No.1 Test team that India holds here in PP. I don't think anywhere else this is even discussed! For heaven sake it is just a goddamn arbitrary ranking system (Just like Tennis individual ranking or FIFA team ranking which doesn't guarantee you any particular grand slam or trophy! You have to qualify for that & win it by competing with teams/players!) I don't know who in PP will lose what property if India is awarded No.1 rank.

    You scream and tell India doesn't deserve No.1 rank for all the reasons (overseas defeats, not able to dominate like WI/Australia, etc), but at the same time nobody are saying which else team deserves it on what basis? They will bring the WI/Australian past teams! Shall we bring all those retired players now to compete with current Indian team? If you are so severe about this, why don't you complain ICC and file a petition to close this fake ranking system? Even if you award 4 points for overseas wins and award just 1 point for home wins (as someone suggested), still you may see India on top finally (maybe with some lesser points!) Also someone recently said that India play more matches (both home & away), and hence they get more wins (Can't he just understand that if you increase the matches, then you are going to also lose more matches overseas?) The number of matches is dependent on economic benefits (with the understanding between both the boards involved) and it has nothing to do with win/loss! (Why a third party should bother this?) Do you want to kill Test Cricket just for the hatred towards Indian team? How foolish is this! If we needed more wins then we would have organized more matches with WI/Sri/Ban/Afghan and not in England where we lose so much! As simple as that!

    There are some reasons for the kind of domination past WI & Australian team had! India, Srilanka were not formidable sides then! South Africa came into picture in 90s. Cricket was not too commercial! Also ODI/T20 were not so fierce then, which meant the gap in quality between teams was bigger (teams did not understand the strengths & weaknesses of each other much) hence stronger teams tended to dominate the lesser teams! Also teams (especially Asian) did not knew much that they can develop a home advantage (pitches, bowling style, etc) to attack visiting teams!

    Mark my words in future you will never see such dominance (WI/Australia style) anytime by any team, because of all the commercialization, competition, social media, TV analysis, resources, facilities, etc. All you will see is fierce competition wherein some teams can be marginally better than the other, that's it! That's why you are seeing such variations in team ranking within span of months (see in ODI, T20, etc. Teams struggle to hold to a position for some time!)

    Hence whether you like it or not ICC will continue this point system & ranking. Please don't take it so seriously and keep calling India as No.1 (I don't think India is termed as No.1 so much in any other place apart from PP just to criticize them, but in the event you are unnecessarily glorifying the so-called No.1 rank!) In the same terms we can say that no team apart from Australia deserved world cup from 1992 onward (lets also include 1983) because they were really not "DOMINANT" as you say, mostly they were lucky & things just fell in their place!

    If you continue this, there is danger that country-based competition will die and people will be more interested in club-cricket to become friends! (Some countries like WI are not at all interested in serious cricket anymore!)

  57. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by The_Odd_One View Post
    SA managed to beat Australia in Australia. England beat SA in SA. Australia drew their series in Bangladesh. India have only won at home and lost every time they played in alien conditions.

    Winning at home is not the same as winning away from home which are cherished more. England beating India in India was a bigger accomplishment then beating them in England which is a standard procedure.
    SA winning in Australia is not really a news. Similar conditions, similar strengths and weaknesses. It's like India / Pakistan winning in Sri Lanka. How many test series did England or Australia or South Africa won in SC in the recent years. If you go by that rule India did much better overseas than how these teams performed in India. It's a simple math.

  58. #58
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    Yes, India is better overall compared to other teams and they rightly deserve the #1 ranking. If I have to make a guess, they will continue to do so for atleast 4-5 years.

  59. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mamoon View Post
    Yes. They are not worse than other away from home, but they are by far the best team in home conditions. No team deserves the number one ranking more.
    This stats of India is also misleading, as misleading as UAE Pakistan's fortress. India and Pakistan does not playing each other, means never throughly tested in home conditions...Imagine if AUS and SA never play against each other, who else can ever beat them at home, they will go decades after decades without loosing series, and not many competitive series, test cricket will die out, because most teams does not know how to play bounce or have bowlers who can bowl on bounce...

    Pakistan and India are best spin playing and producing nations, if they never play against each other, its hard to know how go they are? - Cricket specially test cricket in not one dimensional sports, that can be measured by ranking or playing in one particular condition, well that is the beauty of it. More than ranking, what matter in test Cricket is how much you win on the road, specially the bumping one


    If you want to do things that are certain to succeed, you are doing very obvious thing - E Musk

  60. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by Titan24 View Post
    Its not that others are worse in overseas conditions, its just that no other team was lucky enough to get 4-5 match series consecutively against top sides since a number of years. India got it in their last home season.

    If I am wrong anybody can feel free to share the fixtures of other teams at home and which team got 3 consecutive series with 4-5 matches in each against top sides at home. These rankings are artificial.

    Any current test team lik SA, Eng, NZ etc will also get the number one ranking if they are given such gifts.
    Nope.Fact is Australia lost in south africa,lost in england,whitewashed in sri lanka,dropped a test in bangladesh,lost in India.At home too they lost to south africa.

    South africa lost to england at home.Whitewashed away to Sri lanka and India.

    Pakistan only drew overseas in england,and lose everywhere else.Whitewashed at home by sri lanka.

    England same story.

    Fact is in last 20 years we have only lost 2 home series.
    One 2004 to legendary aussie side in a heavily contested series.And another to england in 2012-13 in another contested series when our team was in transition after retirement of legends.
    Even australia has lost 3 series at home despite half of it falling in their golden age .

  61. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by The_Odd_One View Post
    SA managed to beat Australia in Australia. England beat SA in SA. Australia drew their series in Bangladesh. India have only won at home and lost every time they played in alien conditions.

    Winning at home is not the same as winning away from home which are cherished more. England beating India in India was a bigger accomplishment then beating them in England which is a standard procedure.
    I see you've mentioned the term " alien" in here. How is Australia "alien" to south Africa ? It's like saying Sri Lanka is alien to India because its NOT India. And are you counting on Australia's drawn series in Bangladesh as an achievement?
    BOY I need xanax :-)

  62. #62
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    Yes deserved #1. At the moment they seem unbeatable at home. Their away form is dodgy but they have improved their away rating by whitewashing SL and beating WI too, so on the whole they deserve it.

  63. #63
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    Thing is that in conditions that favor them, Indian team plays ruthless cricket and win matches. In conditions that don't favor them, they really struggle. So technically they might be no:1 team but they can never attain the aura of a no:1 team, like Australia of 2000s, if they keep losing series after series against eng/SA/NZ. It's like andho me kaana raja at the moment.

  64. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hasan123 View Post
    Other teams aren't much better away from home than India. Also not all teams are as dominate as India at home. India's ranking is mostly based on home dominance.

    Do you have a better method for the ICC rankings?

    Yes, the test championship, the sooner that starts, the better...although once again, India are playing the spoiled brat.

  65. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by The_Odd_One View Post
    The question for me is not if India deserves the number 1 ranking but if the number 1 ranking really means anything.
    Well you won't get to decide who plays in the ICC Test Championship Final in 2021, so I think the rankings probably mean something because only the 1 and 2 ranked team will play the final.

  66. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by barah_admi View Post
    Yes, the test championship, the sooner that starts, the better...although once again, India are playing the spoiled brat.
    Test Championship will hopefully help test cricket and with the fixtures being more fair. We will get a clearer picture of who the number 1 team is.

  67. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hasan123 View Post
    Test Championship will hopefully help test cricket and with the fixtures being more fair. We will get a clearer picture of who the number 1 team is.
    Yes we will but once again, India refuse to play Pakistan.

  68. #68
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    Rankings are relative and yes they deserve it.

    But sorry the Indian fans show phattu and low standards. When you are no 1 team with 19 points above the no 2 team you should aim for high. I see Indian fans happy despite losing 4-1 just because they showed fight on 5th day of last test.

    Reminds me of phattu and loser mentality of Pakistani fans when they were happy on our quarter final omission in 2015 wc (qualifying for top 8 in a sport where only 8 teams take it seriously, such low standards).


    Sarfi as captain'll lead us to glory.Babar'll be our best odi bat & Haris'll be world class in tests

  69. #69
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    Pakistan can beat India in India as they have many times in the past.


    Pakistani batsmen - An endangered species?

  70. #70
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    There is no point discussing the same thing over and over again. The ranking system may be flawed, but it's the same for every team. So if a team achieves a top ranking, whether in Tests or LOIs, they thoroughly deserve it and no one should doubt or challenge the ranking. It's only done by Ind and Pak fans due to their traditional rivalry, I don't see the fans of other teams questioning the rankings. We should accept the way the things are.

  71. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by fawad_wellwisher View Post
    Pakistan can beat India in India as they have many times in the past.
    Not in test cricket. Even with your great players, India had an upper hand on Pakistan in test matches since 2000s both in India and Pakistan. Now with Misbah and YK retired, India can beat Pak in test cricket anywhere globally. In LOIs yes, Pak is a better team

  72. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by fawad_wellwisher View Post
    Pakistan can beat India in India as they have many times in the past.
    If I'm not wrong the last time Pakistan won a test match in India was 1998/99. That was also the last time Pakistan had any ATGs in their team.

    Since then Pak and Ind have played 3 test series - 2 in Pak and 1 in India.

    India won 1 series in Pak (2004) and also won their home series (2007). In between Pak won at home (2006).

    Today, Pakistan has no chance of beating India in India. And I will gladly bet on India beating Pak in UAE.

  73. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by the_outsider View Post
    If I'm not wrong the last time Pakistan won a test match in India was 1998/99. That was also the last time Pakistan had any ATGs in their team.

    Since then Pak and Ind have played 3 test series - 2 in Pak and 1 in India.

    India won 1 series in Pak (2004) and also won their home series (2007). In between Pak won at home (2006).

    Today, Pakistan has no chance of beating India in India. And I will gladly bet on India beating Pak in UAE.
    They won a test in Bangalore 2005. They haven't won a series here since 87 though.

  74. #74
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    No. 1 is meaningless unless you play ALL test playing nations home and away, otherwise you have an unfair advantage over other nations. These games and potential loses are not taken into account, whereas they are for other nations.

    Most Pak fans would agree that they would not accept India currently as No 1. until they beat Pakistan, just as Australia and West Indies, South Africa have done in the past, even India in the 2000's.

  75. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nikhil_cric View Post
    They won a test in Bangalore 2005. They haven't won a series here since 87 though.
    Thanks for the correction, mate.

    I imagined I might have goofed something up there since I was just going by memory and didn't have the stats in front of me.

  76. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by King Khan View Post
    No. 1 is meaningless unless you play ALL test playing nations home and away, otherwise you have an unfair advantage over other nations. These games and potential loses are not taken into account, whereas they are for other nations.

    Most Pak fans would agree that they would not accept India currently as No 1. until they beat Pakistan, just as Australia and West Indies, South Africa have done in the past, even India in the 2000's.
    Unfortunately for you, Pakistan fans are the only ones who think like that. Other teams and nations don't care. The ICC doesn't care. So you'll just have to live with the fact that India is the number 1 ranked team in the world, for now.

  77. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by the_outsider View Post
    If I'm not wrong the last time Pakistan won a test match in India was 1998/99. That was also the last time Pakistan had any ATGs in their team.

    Since then Pak and Ind have played 3 test series - 2 in Pak and 1 in India.

    India won 1 series in Pak (2004) and also won their home series (2007). In between Pak won at home (2006).

    Today, Pakistan has no chance of beating India in India. And I will gladly bet on India beating Pak in UAE.
    I remember here on PP saying based on Pakistan's performance in England where they were able to tie the series that India will humiliate England in the just concluded series but in fact the opposite happened.

    You cannot discount this Pakistan team. It will find a way to win even though the Indian team looks stronger on paper.


    Pakistani batsmen - An endangered species?

  78. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by fawad_wellwisher View Post
    I remember here on PP saying based on Pakistan's performance in England where they were able to tie the series that India will humiliate England in the just concluded series but in fact the opposite happened.

    You cannot discount this Pakistan team. It will find a way to win even though the Indian team looks stronger on paper.
    I never said anything like that about the England tour just because Pakistan has done well there.

    But you are confusing "India in SENA" with "India at home". Those are two very different challenges. India has lost only 1 test match at home in the last 5+ years. I don't see the current Pakistan team winning in India, sorry.


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