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  1. #1
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    Is Rohit Sharma an ODI ATG?

    A failure in test but ODI reveals a different story. 5000+ runs, 17 hundreds and Averages 56 as an opener. He also has got 3 scores of 200+ and in total 5 scores of 150+.

    Overall, an average of 46 at a Strike Rate of 87. Do you think he is an ATG in ODI and where will you rank among greatest Indian ODI players of all-time?

  2. #2
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    An Indian great in ODIs, but not an ATG material irrespective of what stats say.

    Among the Indian batsmen, I would say, in order:-

    Tendulkar
    Kohli
    Dhoni
    Ganguly
    Yuvraj
    Sehwag
    Dhawan

    These names are ahead.

  3. #3
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    Overrated player. Dhawan is much better.

  4. #4
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    Nope, he might get there in future but his stats have far too many holes. His median is very low compared to mean (means inconsistency). Also his stats in SEN isn't very good.

  5. #5
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    He has made a massive impact on the ODI game, so I dont think it is out of question if he finishes his career well.

  6. #6
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    Serviceable opener.

  7. #7
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    If he can continuously keep it up for another 2-3 years, we can have some sort of discussion about it.

    At the moment, he is insanely talented, so its not above him to keep going and carve a niche as an ODI ATG as he ends his career.


    And I get so high.. And I just can't feel it....

  8. #8
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    A couple of more years of this and a good show in WC19 would certainly put him in the league of ODI ATGs.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joseph Gomes View Post
    Nope, he might get there in future but his stats have far too many holes. His median is very low compared to mean (means inconsistency). Also his stats in SEN isn't very good.
    Can you show me the data for this? Because I think that what you are saying is wrong.

  10. #10
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    Not yet but surely has chance to end as odi atg till he retires.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joseph Gomes View Post
    Nope, he might get there in future but his stats have far too many holes. His median is very low compared to mean (means inconsistency). Also his stats in SEN isn't very good.
    He has exceptional stats in England, while NZ numbers too aren't bad.

    South Africa is the only country where he looks clueless.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by the_outsider View Post
    Can you show me the data for this? Because I think that what you are saying is wrong.
    Avg in Eng - 44
    Avg in NZ - 35
    Avg in SAF- 28

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joseph Gomes View Post
    Avg in Eng - 44
    Avg in NZ - 35
    Avg in SAF- 28

    You are reading the wrong column there. He averages 57.25 in Eng, and 38.3 in NZ.

    http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/eng...s;type=batting

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by BlackShadow View Post
    You are reading the wrong column there. He averages 57.25 in Eng, and 38.3 in NZ.

    http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/eng...s;type=batting
    Seems like I did a mistake there. Not sure why he is so bad in SAF.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joseph Gomes View Post
    Seems like I did a mistake there. Not sure why he is so bad in SAF.
    Think it has something to do with England and NZ having the flattest pitches in the world whereas in South Africa you can still get good rewards if you bowl the right areas.

    Disclaimer : This is not a criticism of Rohit.


    And I get so high.. And I just can't feel it....

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by the_outsider View Post
    Can you show me the data for this? Because I think that what you are saying is wrong.
    Mean vs median difference would make sense only if compared to other great batsmen. Otherwise for most top cricketers median will always be less than mean, as good cricketers when they cross 15-20 end up scoring 50s. I am sure @joseph_gomes didn't check it for other batsmen. Would like to see median vs mean difference for Lara, I am sure it would be one of the highest.

    Btw I am not contesting whether or not RG is ATG as I am kinda indifferent to it.
    Last edited by happydavy; 25th September 2018 at 16:48.

  17. #17
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    Not yet but if he has 4-5 good years he will be one.

    Tendulkar has 18k runs. Anyone with a claim on ATG status must at least score half the runs at least.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joseph Gomes View Post
    Seems like I did a mistake there. Not sure why he is so bad in SAF.
    Sharma ji has actually inflated his stats by bashing Bangladesh in England twice and his one hundred in SA came this year on an absolute flat SC type of pitch with no bounce at all. His 91 of 119 balls vs Pak in CT 2017 wasn't all that good because he was tuk-tuking for a good part of that match, which is why Yuvraj with a score of 53 of 31 balls was the one who eventually got the M.O.M and not Rohit.

    Pitches are mostly flat these days but still there are some games where you will find conditions a bit testing for batsmen and Rohit has failed on those conditions most of the times.

    He is a country great in ODIs due to the fact that he can really go to sixth gear but for ATG, the benchmark is higher. Smashing Ban, SL and third string Aus attack is not enough for ATG level.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ab Fan View Post
    Sharma ji has actually inflated his stats by bashing Bangladesh in England twice and his one hundred in SA came this year on an absolute flat SC type of pitch with no bounce at all. His 91 of 119 balls vs Pak in CT 2017 wasn't all that good because he was tuk-tuking for a good part of that match, which is why Yuvraj with a score of 53 of 31 balls was the one who eventually got the M.O.M and not Rohit.

    Pitches are mostly flat these days but still there are some games where you will find conditions a bit testing for batsmen and Rohit has failed on those conditions most of the times.

    He is a country great in ODIs due to the fact that he can really go to sixth gear but for ATG, the benchmark is higher. Smashing Ban, SL and third string Aus attack is not enough for ATG level.
    Rohit Sharma's trouble against the moving ball in ODIs has been grossly overstated, probably due to his red ball game clouding the judgement of the observer.

    Even back in the early days, I remember him scoring a fantastic 50 on a green mamba pitch against SA in the 07WC against the likes of Pollock and Ntini.

    In the CB series in 2008 he was great again. This was when he was 20-21 years old, btw.

    And it is completely false to say that he only does well in flat pitches with no bounce and seam. One look at his record in Australia and NZ will show that. He scored a 171* at Perth, of all places. 'Nuf said.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joseph Gomes View Post
    Avg in Eng - 44
    Avg in NZ - 35
    Avg in SAF- 28
    Like @BlackShadow said this are wrong figures.

    But even so, you're still showing me mean figures. I thought your argument was about median. Do you have those numbers?

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by the_outsider View Post
    Rohit Sharma's trouble against the moving ball in ODIs has been grossly overstated, probably due to his red ball game clouding the judgement of the observer.

    Even back in the early days, I remember him scoring a fantastic 50 on a green mamba pitch against SA in the 07WC against the likes of Pollock and Ntini.

    In the CB series in 2008 he was great again. This was when he was 20-21 years old, btw.

    And it is completely false to say that he only does well in flat pitches with no bounce and seam. One look at his record in Australia and NZ will show that. He scored a 171* at Perth, of all places. 'Nuf said.
    I have followed his career and I only care of my own judgement. That 171 was against a mediocre Australian attack on a patta where he scored that many runs facing 163 balls. It was one of those matches where Sharma ji started so slowly that it eventually costed his team 20-25 runs. If he had paced his inning better, India would have got 20-25 runs more and as a result, they won't have lost that match.

    In some way or other, he was one of the reasons why India lost that match. So, a very good inning but not a great one.

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ab Fan View Post
    I have followed his career and I only care of my own judgement. That 171 was against a mediocre Australian attack on a patta where he scored that many runs facing 163 balls. It was one of those matches where Sharma ji started so slowly that it eventually costed his team 20-25 runs. If he had paced his inning better, India would have got 20-25 runs more and as a result, they won't have lost that match.

    In some way or other, he was one of the reasons why India lost that match. So, a very good inning but not a great one.
    Sorry man but that makes no sense.

    The next highest score was 91 by Kohli at a SR of 90. No other batsman even scored 20. And the bolwing lineup was not bad. Only Starc was missing. Hazlewood, Paris, etc were all playing.

    And AUS won that game in the 50th over. We lost that game because of our bowlers. It's crazy to blame the defeat on the batsman who scored 60% of the team's runs.

  23. #23
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    Impactful knocks at the WC and another 2/3 years of consistency should be enough for him to earn ATG ODI status.

  24. #24
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    A good world cup and a good series in SA should get him there. Averaging 55 as an opener is insanely good.

  25. #25
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    People respect Bradman in Test , so Rohit is the bradman of ODI

    Mic Drop

  26. #26
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    He needs a World cup and couple of years more of consistency. He is close to ATG.

  27. #27
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    He is right up there now.

    Batting average 48+

    22 ODI centuries

    Clutch player!

    One of the most dangerous batsmen ever.

  28. #28
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    fighting all alone in this match. What a player! If he gets in, he is very dangerous.

  29. #29
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    Definitely an ODI ATG. His record as an opener has been phenomenal in last 5 years or so.

  30. #30
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    100%. One good WC and he will be a tier 1 ATG and will be among top 6 ODI batsman of all time as well.

    Viv
    Tendulkar
    Kohli
    ABD
    Ponting
    Rohit
    Dhoni

  31. #31
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    Yes.


    Quote Originally Posted by Convict View Post
    Don't worry bro. Your other thread allows for rain. Maybe it will save you?

  32. #32
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    ATG stat padder.


    A skilled hawk conceals its talons.

  33. #33
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    There is nothing called ODI ATG....you become great by only performing well in test cricket. Having said that, Sharma along with Dhawan are the best white ball openers in the world.

  34. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chief Destroyer View Post
    ATG stat padder.
    He has performed many times under pressure and in difficult conditions.

  35. #35
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    Indian ATG ODI batsman for sure. But not ATG world level.
    ATG level is Kohli, Sachin, Viv Richards, Ponting etc.
    Don't compare stats because this era is so much more batting friendly.

  36. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by Minnowbasher View Post
    Indian ATG ODI batsman for sure. But not ATG world level.
    ATG level is Kohli, Sachin, Viv Richards, Ponting etc.
    Don't compare stats because this era is so much more batting friendly.
    How much more? Rohit averages around 11 points more than Sachin as a opener (59 vs 48). Surely that's enough to offset the difference in batting conditions?

  37. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Minnowbasher View Post
    Indian ATG ODI batsman for sure. But not ATG world level.
    ATG level is Kohli, Sachin, Viv Richards, Ponting etc.
    Don't compare stats because this era is so much more batting friendly.
    You don't need to compare stats to older players. You need to compare stats to peer. Nobody comes close to Rohit as opener in ODIs. He is in a completely different league to other openers currently.

  38. #38
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    Arguably he is. He is very destructive once on song.

  39. #39
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    He could finish as one. Great player. Improved massively in last few years

  40. #40
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    I think he will finish as an ODI great. When in form, he's literally unstoppable.

  41. #41
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    Almost there I will say. Brilliant peak, 2013-2018, i.e, 6 years now.

  42. #42
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    Indian ODI XI all-time: -

    Sachin
    Rohit
    Kohli
    Ganguly/Azharuddin
    Yuvraj
    Dhoni(C/wkt)
    Kapil
    Kumble
    Kuldeep
    Zaheer
    Bumrah

  43. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ab Fan View Post
    Indian ODI XI all-time: -

    Sachin
    Rohit
    Kohli
    Ganguly/Azharuddin
    Yuvraj
    Dhoni(C/wkt)
    Kapil
    Kumble
    Kuldeep
    Zaheer
    Bumrah
    Kuldeep in an all time eleven? You serious!

  44. #44
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    Rohit has gone through one of the greatest peaks ever. The guy is superhuman. Wonder when he will decline.

  45. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by TM Riddle View Post
    Kuldeep in an all time eleven? You serious!
    He averages 20 in ODIs.

  46. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ab Fan View Post
    He averages 20 in ODIs.
    I think his point is that Kuldeep has barely played enough ODI's to be considered for an all time XI, especially for a nation with such rich cricketing history!

  47. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by hadi123 View Post
    I think his point is that Kuldeep has barely played enough ODI's to be considered for an all time XI, especially for a nation with such rich cricketing history!
    We never had a high quality ODI spinner. The best we have put up are Kumble and Harbhajan. Kuldeep has got 4-fers in England and South Africa.

  48. #48
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    Needs to survive over number 1 from Amir first, like I keep seeing it happen all the time before we raise his credentials as a potential/ODI ATG.

  49. #49
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    He's a complete ODI player. There's not many better hitters when set. Can absolutely destroy any bowler once he gets his eye in

  50. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ab Fan View Post
    We never had a high quality ODI spinner. The best we have put up are Kumble and Harbhajan. Kuldeep has got 4-fers in England and South Africa.
    Has to do with novelty factor. Eng played him well after a few games. He's good but not ATG yet

  51. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by rhony View Post
    Has to do with novelty factor. Eng played him well after a few games. He's good but not ATG yet
    England played him well in final ODI but still its a long process. He has had a dream start and hasn't been exposed by anyone. Doing well for India and certainly this bowling has strengthened by the addition of Bumrah and Kuldeep only.


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