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  1. #81
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    Pakistan cricket does not revolve around Sarfraz fans that keep finding illogical excuses to save his captaincy. The guy is leading Pakistan team not some Uganda XI. He can't enjoy free ride as a captain without performing and leading from the front. If he does not have the balls to lead this team then he should be sacked. We can't go through this torture for any longer. I would rather invest in some young player than continue with this ttf mediocrity.
    Last edited by Abdullah719; 13th October 2018 at 00:58.

  2. #82
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    @Bilal7 what are your thoughts now?

    Very interested.

  3. #83
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    Sarfraz needs to be booted out ASAP

  4. #84
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hasan123 View Post
    Sarfraz keeping is rubbish and has been for a while.
    Wouldn't even pick him for Pakistan A. I don't have any trust in the fitness scores that were published quite recently and I also think he's at least 35 because if you think about it a lot of batsmen actually peak 29-33 and I believe he was in this age bracket from 2014-2016. Once you're 35+ that's when it starts to go downhill.

    Fitness and age are the reasons why he's not performing not because he's some mediocre cricketer.

  5. #85
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    Quote Originally Posted by topspin View Post
    Wouldn't even pick him for Pakistan A. I don't have any trust in the fitness scores that were published quite recently and I also think he's at least 35 because if you think about it a lot of batsmen actually peak 29-33 and I believe he was in this age bracket from 2014-2016. Once you're 35+ that's when it starts to go downhill.

    Fitness and age are the reasons why he's not performing not because he's some mediocre cricketer.

    Yo yo test isn't proof of a player being fit. It's nothing to do with his age , he is just a rubbish player as simple as that.

  6. #86
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hawkeye View Post
    @Bilal7 what are your thoughts now?

    Very interested.
    What has changed? I don't agree with people saying that he is a rubbish keeper, that is a ridiculous assessment. He is a good keeper. His captaincy was pretty good in the last game but Khawaja and Paine denied Pakistan.

    It's good to see him batting at #7. That is where he belongs in all formats. Have six good batsmen above him and InshAllah, we'll get back to winning matches.

  7. #87
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hasan123 View Post
    Yo yo test isn't proof of a player being fit. It's nothing to do with his age , he is just a rubbish player as simple as that.
    Then what exactly does the Yo-Yo test measure?

  8. #88
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bilal7 View Post
    What has changed? I don't agree with people saying that he is a rubbish keeper, that is a ridiculous assessment. He is a good keeper. His captaincy was pretty good in the last game but Khawaja and Paine denied Pakistan.

    It's good to see him batting at #7. That is where he belongs in all formats. Have six good batsmen above him and InshAllah, we'll get back to winning matches.
    Did you even see the match- Sarfaraz missed two easy stumping chances, ran himself out stupidly & missed out referring a plumb lbw. Not to mention, that on the final day he laid out a defensive field till the last half hour & his bowler changes, field placements made no sense at all. Nothing about this screams even average captaincy. IMO - he has completely lost it as a batsman, wicket-keeper & more importantly, as a captain.

  9. #89
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bilal7 View Post
    Then what exactly does the Yo-Yo test measure?
    Your endurance. Passing a yoyo test doesn't mean you have great fitness. Also he has only passed the last one which was done, previously he was failing them so if you think it's a good barometer for fitness he has been failing until the last one anyway.

  10. #90
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bilal7 View Post
    What has changed? I don't agree with people saying that he is a rubbish keeper, that is a ridiculous assessment. He is a good keeper. His captaincy was pretty good in the last game but Khawaja and Paine denied Pakistan.

    It's good to see him batting at #7. That is where he belongs in all formats. Have six good batsmen above him and InshAllah, we'll get back to winning matches.
    Excellent response - worthy of a loyal fan.

    I have also noticed - Sarfraz is doing outstandingly in KPIs that are measured subjectively - keeping, leadership, motivation, team building, tactics ...

    Only needs a bit improvement in KPIs that come with numbers - runs, average, SR, 50/100, bye's conceded, dropped catches/missed stumping, W/L (against teams ranked 7 & above ....).

  11. #91
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    Of course he has to bat well. Gone are the days where you can get away with being a bad batsman as a keeper. I think captaining in all 3 formats is taking a toll on him, physically AND mentally. I also think that lack of alternatives as a keeper is saving him, but he really does need a big score sooner rather than later.

    I think in at least one of the formats he should give up captaincy, unfortunately there are not many alternatives as a captain either. I think if he was to give up captaincy in one format, most likely it would be Tests but I'm not sure who else it could be given to.

    But I can't see him as a player or a captain going anywhere in the near future due to lack of alternatives of both wicketkeepers AND captaincy candidates.

  12. #92
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    He is not a good captain. When the going gets tough he doesn't get behind his players but instead shouts and yells at them which makes Pakistan look like a backyard team not the one playing internationals.
    He should be relieved from the test and T20 captaincy and in ODIs he should only continue till the WC.

  13. #93
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    Quote Originally Posted by dildilpak View Post
    Did you even see the match- Sarfaraz missed two easy stumping chances, ran himself out stupidly & missed out referring a plumb lbw. Not to mention, that on the final day he laid out a defensive field till the last half hour & his bowler changes, field placements made no sense at all. Nothing about this screams even average captaincy. IMO - he has completely lost it as a batsman, wicket-keeper & more importantly, as a captain.
    Irrelevant. One match proves absolutely nothing. Sarfaraz has been our keeper for a few years now and has been very good overall.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hasan123 View Post
    Your endurance. Passing a yoyo test doesn't mean you have great fitness. Also he has only passed the last one which was done, previously he was failing them so if you think it's a good barometer for fitness he has been failing until the last one anyway.


    Endurance is the biggest indicator of fitness, if not the biggest. Stop worrying about whether Sarfaraz has abs or not and judge him on his results. The fact that he was failing them before and is now passing them means that he is improving which is a good thing and not something that you can criticize him for.

    Quote Originally Posted by MMHS View Post
    Excellent response - worthy of a loyal fan.

    I have also noticed - Sarfraz is doing outstandingly in KPIs that are measured subjectively - keeping, leadership, motivation, team building, tactics ...

    Only needs a bit improvement in KPIs that come with numbers - runs, average, SR, 50/100, bye's conceded, dropped catches/missed stumping, W/L (against teams ranked 7 & above ....).
    I am not a fan of Sarfaraz. Also, you attempt at humor is very cringe-worthy.


    لَا إِلٰهَ إِلَّا الله مُحَمَّدٌ رَسُولُ الله

  14. #94
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bilal7 View Post
    What has changed? I don't agree with people saying that he is a rubbish keeper, that is a ridiculous assessment. He is a good keeper. His captaincy was pretty good in the last game but Khawaja and Paine denied Pakistan.

    It's good to see him batting at #7. That is where he belongs in all formats. Have six good batsmen above him and InshAllah, we'll get back to winning matches.
    I'm really shocked. You're certainly better than this and at being objective..

    Even if we go back to the 80s and include a "pure" keeper who is a dud with the bat, ball, leadership, tactics..

    His keeping is not good enough either. At best equivalent to Umar Akmal. Many missed chances this Test.

  15. #95
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    Quote Originally Posted by MRSN View Post
    Pakistan cricket does not revolve around Sarfraz fans that keep finding illogical excuses to save his captaincy. The guy is leading Pakistan team not some Uganda XI. He can't enjoy free ride as a captain without performing and leading from the front. If he does not have the balls to lead this team then he should be sacked. We can't go through this torture for any longer. I would rather invest in some young player than continue with this ttf mediocrity.
    Bring back the Akmals.


    لَا إِلٰهَ إِلَّا الله مُحَمَّدٌ رَسُولُ الله

  16. #96
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hawkeye View Post
    I'm really shocked. You're certainly better than this and at being objective..

    Even if we go back to the 80s and include a "pure" keeper who is a dud with the bat, ball, leadership, tactics..

    His keeping is not good enough either. At best equivalent to Umar Akmal. Many missed chances this Test.
    I am being objective since I've never been a fan of Sarfaraz Ahmed's, especially the current Sarfaraz Ahmed that has forgotten how to hold a bat. However, people are blaming him for the failings of the specialist batsmen which is wrong. Then there are people like you who have been so blinded by his failings with the bat that they start calling him a "dud" captain and wicket-keeper (which is what Umar Akmal was). This guy helped win us a Champions Trophy, lest you forget, along with a test match in England.


    لَا إِلٰهَ إِلَّا الله مُحَمَّدٌ رَسُولُ الله

  17. #97
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    Pakistan is the only nation that allows such disgrace. Even a minnow nation would of removed the skipper if they’ve had the run sarfraz has had. I’d rather bring back kamran Akmal that’s how bad sarfraz and his belly is.

  18. #98
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bilal7 View Post
    I am being objective since I've never been a fan of Sarfaraz Ahmed's, especially the current Sarfaraz Ahmed that has forgotten how to hold a bat. However, people are blaming him for the failings of the specialist batsmen which is wrong. Then there are people like you who have been so blinded by his failings with the bat that they start calling him a "dud" captain and wicket-keeper (which is what Umar Akmal was). This guy helped win us a Champions Trophy, lest you forget, along with a test match in England.
    I was a huge fan of his.

    Saw the light an year ago. He's not a leader, not a good tactician, cannot hold the bat (barring that small purple patch).

    CT is history - more than a year of shocking leadership, batting, and wicket-keeping has no excuses.

  19. #99
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    He was never what some PP fans here yhought he was.. as a keeper he is better than kami, then again thats not a high bar. As a batsman, he is nowhere close to kami. He did hit a purple patch a while back and now we all believe he is that good.. but he isnt. There was a reason why for the first several games during the world cup, the think tank didnt try him as opener. They knew of his capacity as a batsman. He punched above his weight when he got the chance and solidified his spot.

    Years later, maybe age or a bit of bad fitness is catching up with him. He is no dhoni or gilchrist.

    The sad truth is, we may not have anyother options..


    Kut khani hai to aa jao idher, khushbo laga ke!

  20. #100
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stewie View Post
    He was never what some PP fans here yhought he was.. as a keeper he is better than kami, then again thats not a high bar. As a batsman, he is nowhere close to kami. He did hit a purple patch a while back and now we all believe he is that good.. but he isnt. There was a reason why for the first several games during the world cup, the think tank didnt try him as opener. They knew of his capacity as a batsman. He punched above his weight when he got the chance and solidified his spot.

    Years later, maybe age or a bit of bad fitness is catching up with him. He is no dhoni or gilchrist.

    The sad truth is, we may not have anyother options..
    Overall, he was never a better WK than Kamran. Kamran went to AUS in 2005 & Ian Chappell praised him to be the successor of Gilchrist as the best WK in world (SCG Test, Day 3), and IC hardly praises any non Aussie. Kamran was so good that he made PAK team as batsman as well & opened in ODI - in that 2-3 years patch, he was damn good with bat & gloves. May be, you can say that worse of Kamran is probably worse than Sarfraz’s worse; but his peak was way better than Sarfraz’s peak.

    But, he was just like his youngest bro - not serious about developing own game. He went to UK in 2006 series hiding injury and probably got married at same time which added few stones in no time - he had a horrible series in UK with gloves & never could reach his true potential. Otherwise, by volume this guy would have broken almost every PAK domestic & international records by now.

    Sarfraz was never a good keeper - at best a decent, workable one. You can check my post (probably in Rameez Raza comment thread), where I did mention that once he becomes regular in PAK team, his Keeping will go down from complacency as he is not a natural keeper - a workman like WK version of Azhar Ali, looks horrible when out of form. And, his work ethics is as poor as Kamran - I use a term for WKs - “Karman Akmal syndrome” - WK is the most cumbersome job in the game, and is a natural bunker gets the comfort of being invincible in team, Kamran Akmal (actually Akmal) syndromes can happen.

    If you look at Sarfraz’s batting, it’s not that he is in poor form for which, he is putting a series of single digit scores or ducks - rather he is constantly getting out after 39-40 minutes in middle, often to a poor shots, that indicates lack of ability more than anything else. Once Mark Waugh score 5 ducks & a single in SRL, but he wasn’t dropped; then Mark Taylor went like 17 innings (or Test) without a Test 50, before scoring 334* & 100+ against PAK at Rawalpindi - he wasn’t dropped or sacked as Captain either. Because class is permanent, form is temporary - for Sarfraz, what we are watching is his class, and PCB made him captain in 3 formats based on temporary form..... hence PTC is suffering.
    Last edited by MMHS; 14th October 2018 at 23:11.

  21. #101
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bilal7 View Post
    Irrelevant. One match proves absolutely nothing. Sarfaraz has been our keeper for a few years now and has been very good overall.





    Endurance is the biggest indicator of fitness, if not the biggest. Stop worrying about whether Sarfaraz has abs or not and judge him on his results. The fact that he was failing them before and is now passing them means that he is improving which is a good thing and not something that you can criticize him for.



    I am not a fan of Sarfaraz. Also, you attempt at humor is very cringe-worthy.
    So asking a professional sportsman to look like an athlete is too much to ask ?

  22. #102
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    Can't bat
    Can't keep
    Crap captaincy
    Clueless with DRS
    Appeals like he's about to give birth to a child

    Time to get rid of this joker.

  23. #103
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    One of the best threads on PakPassion. This just shows how bad things are for Pak fans.

  24. #104
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    When will this misery end for goodness sake.

  25. #105
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    Who cares about two ducks in game, specalist captain won the toss.

  26. #106
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    The most useless player in the team

  27. #107
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    Question for the OP: let's forget about batting well, does he even have to bat?

  28. #108
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    Great logic bro. Poor batting side as it is but carry a captain who scores ducks, drops catches and treats players as if they are kids and scolds them.

    Can see why Pakistan is highly ranked.

  29. #109
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    I guess he has been struggling with the bat for a while and a pair in this Test has really put a question mark over his effectiveness as a batter. He needs to improve and contribute more with the bat to even be in the side to lead the Test team considering the fragile nature of Pakistan's batting line up.

  30. #110
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    Until the end of WC we shouldn't think of discarding him, as we currently have no option but to tolerate him as the captain.

  31. #111
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    Quote Originally Posted by ali2220 View Post
    Until the end of WC we shouldn't think of discarding him, as we currently have no option but to tolerate him as the captain.
    Isn’t OP telling the same thing? No need to bat, keep or team’s result - he should be there only to toss the coin (captain the side)

  32. #112
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    Bowling specialist bowlers is good captaincy on this forum apparently. Performing in your own role isn't captaincy according to Sarfraz fans logic.

  33. #113
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    You guys can bump this thread a million times and it won't change anything. It is not about Sarfaraz; the keeper can be Rizwan or Adnan Akmal, but his primary role will still be to keep wickets and that is what he should and will be judged on.

  34. #114
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bilal7 View Post
    You guys can bump this thread a million times and it won't change anything. It is not about Sarfaraz; the keeper can be Rizwan or Adnan Akmal, but his primary role will still be to keep wickets and that is what he should and will be judged on.
    Posters are using his poor batting form to attach him, with following false allegations : he is unfit, keeping badly, or captaining badly. This shows there real agenda. If they just argued that due to his poor batting form he should not be selected then I would take them seriously, but making up stuff all of these posters including some very knowledgeable and respectable posters means they can be ignored.

  35. #115
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bilal7 View Post
    You guys can bump this thread a million times and it won't change anything. It is not about Sarfaraz; the keeper can be Rizwan or Adnan Akmal, but his primary role will still be to keep wickets and that is what he should and will be judged on.
    If Pakistan are to improve on their 7th ranking then grooming a WK batsmen that is up to world standard will surely be one of the areas that needs improvement. There is no point being stuck with a specialist WK, it's no longer the 80s or 90s and most of the cricket world have moved on.

    When you look at the current test rankings, every other country barring Australia and Sri Lanka (debatable) and including Bangladesh have WK that contribute a lot more with the bat while having adequate enough skills or more with their primary role.

    Australia and India at least had the courage to drop non performers like Wade, Nevill and Saha despite being good enough with the gloves.

    If Pakistan fall 2-0 behind this series, I would like to see Azhar take over the captaincy and Rizwan the gloves for the 3rd test.

  36. #116
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    I'd like to know what OP was thinking when he started this thread.

    Lord Sarfraz is the only captain in our history whose individual performances should not matter at all. The captains of the past never got his advantage of not worrying about performances.

  37. #117
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    Quote Originally Posted by PakPremi View Post
    Posters are using his poor batting form to attach him, with following false allegations : he is unfit, keeping badly, or captaining badly. This shows there real agenda. If they just argued that due to his poor batting form he should not be selected then I would take them seriously, but making up stuff all of these posters including some very knowledgeable and respectable posters means they can be ignored.
    Shoaib Malik got sacked after 2 Test series losses and individual bad form.

    YK got sacked after 2 series losses and individual bad form.

    Moyo got sacked after 2 series losses and bad form but Sarfraz should continue because wo apna hai. If great Test players like Moyo and YK were shown the door for their poor showing as a player than who the heck is Sarfraz infront of them?

  38. #118
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    I thought OP for all his trolling, was somewhat sensible. Sarfraz is not a test-level batter. I guess his screaming qualifies at test-level.


    2 possibilities exist: Either we are alone in the Universe or we are not. Both are terrifying.

  39. #119
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    Quote Originally Posted by aukhan View Post
    Shoaib Malik got sacked after 2 Test series losses and individual bad form.

    YK got sacked after 2 series losses and individual bad form.

    Moyo got sacked after 2 series losses and bad form but Sarfraz should continue because wo apna hai. If great Test players like Moyo and YK were shown the door for their poor showing as a player than who the heck is Sarfraz infront of them?
    If I got it correctly, OP feels that its not a wicket keeper’s job to make runs.

  40. #120
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    I'd like to know what OP was thinking when he started this thread.

    Lord Sarfraz is the only captain in our history whose individual performances should not matter at all. The captains of the past never got his advantage of not worrying about performances.


  41. #121
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    People need to realize that this is not about Sarfraz and his batting. The OP is shamelessly defending him because Inzamam has backed and endorsed his captaincy, and it is his moral duty to defend his honor.

    The day Inzamam criticizes Sarfraz would be the day his pathetic batting becomes a problem.

  42. #122
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bilal7 View Post
    You guys can bump this thread a million times and it won't change anything. It is not about Sarfaraz; the keeper can be Rizwan or Adnan Akmal, but his primary role will still be to keep wickets and that is what he should and will be judged on.
    People are not bumping this thread to ridicule you.

    The fact is you have your head buried so deep in the sand you refuse to even listen to logic.

    The title of the thread was *Sarfraz does not have to bat well to deserve his place in the team*.

    Fine.

    If in one moment of madness, we accept that he does NOT have to bat well to be in the team, we need to establish a bare minimum of what he has to do.

    Sarfraz may well smash 4 100's in the next 4 tests but if Pakistan continue to lose do we retain him for his batting and keeping?

    And if YES, then if Sarfraz gets 4 more ducks in next 4 innings and Pakistan lose do we still retain him?

    If the answer is yes to both questions, then why ask him to bat at all?

    Clearly in order to defend your illogical thread it has come down to whether he even scores 2 ducks, the thread has merit.

    Sarfraz does not have to bat well to deserve his place in the side.

    Yes sir.

    Sarfraz does NOT have to bat AT ALL to keep his place in the side.

    Well played sir.


    And I get so high.. And I just can't feel it....

  43. #123
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    Quote Originally Posted by aukhan View Post
    Shoaib Malik got sacked after 2 Test series losses and individual bad form.

    YK got sacked after 2 series losses and individual bad form.

    Moyo got sacked after 2 series losses and bad form but Sarfraz should continue because wo apna hai. If great Test players like Moyo and YK were shown the door for their poor showing as a player than who the heck is Sarfraz infront of them?
    Whose apna ?
    You can change captain but results will be the same till we get rid of some senior batsmen and induct talented new ones. There is nothing wrong with Sarfraz on field captaincy but if he is responsible for giving too long rope to likes of Asad then he needs to go. I have stated already that captaining three formats is impacting his batting tremendously and he must give up test captaincy.

  44. #124
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    Quote Originally Posted by PakPremi View Post
    Whose apna ?
    You can change captain but results will be the same till we get rid of some senior batsmen and induct talented new ones. There is nothing wrong with Sarfraz on field captaincy but if he is responsible for giving too long rope to likes of Asad then he needs to go. I have stated already that captaining three formats is impacting his batting tremendously and he must give up test captaincy.
    If the result stays the same than we will ask for the change in captaincy again. No need to continue with mediocrity if the result is not there. Why not make Babar captain of the current team if the result will not change, the losses will at least teach him something which will be good for our long term captaincy future.

  45. #125
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    Quote Originally Posted by PakPremi View Post
    Whose apna ?
    You can change captain but results will be the same till we get rid of some senior batsmen and induct talented new ones. There is nothing wrong with Sarfraz on field captaincy but if he is responsible for giving too long rope to likes of Asad then he needs to go. I have stated already that captaining three formats is impacting his batting tremendously and he must give up test captaincy.
    It's not just captaincy.

    He doesn't deserve a spot in Tests and ODIs.

  46. #126
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    Given the level of the OP's grasp of the game, this thread comes to no surprise.

    Like seriously you think Sarfraz is the next coming Mike Brearly or something? (if you even know who he is).

    According to OP's logic lets extend the frail tail from number 7 and settle with 6 batsmen. After all this he stay has the audacity to say Pakistan will win this 2-1.

  47. #127
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bilal7 View Post
    You guys can bump this thread a million times and it won't change anything. It is not about Sarfaraz; the keeper can be Rizwan or Adnan Akmal, but his primary role will still be to keep wickets and that is what he should and will be judged on.
    Fine, but in that case he should bat at 8 or 9 given his persistent failures with the bat as a number 7 in an already weak batting lineup. Now have fun trying to figure out how to strengthen the batting without severely weakening the already thin bowling attack (three pacers have bowled 80 out of 86 overs; it seems Yasir is playing as a specialist tailender!) by playing a specialist keeper/captain who barely contributes any runs.

  48. #128
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    As a Captain and Wicket Keeping batsman with UAE being our home what bare minimum I expect from any wicket keeping batsman in 2 years ?


    Average of 35.


    Where is Sarfraz standing atm ?


    Averages 24 with the bat in last 24 months.


    Well that is not acceptable.


    Sarfraz needs to make adjustments to his batting technique. This Crouch, unbalanced technique will not give him the batting consistency required for Int Cricket. After a terrific start post comeback when the opposition teams start working you out than you need to fight it out technically and work on ur weak links. This is required of international Cricketers.


    Inzamam and Mickey need to see that whether Rizwan has sort out his technical glitches both against pace and spin or not ? Yes He is amongst runs off late and it's good but careful assesment is needed.


    When players get dropped than the only criteria of comeback should not be performance in weak domestic system or against weak A teams but if there were technical issues than they need to be fixed aswell.


    Mujhay hai Hukm e Azaa-n

  49. #129
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    Some social media humor...


    Name:  WhatsApp Image 2018-12-28 at 14.25.57.jpg
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    For the latest updates on Cricket, follow @PakPassion on Twitter

  50. #130
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bilal7 View Post
    You guys can bump this thread a million times and it won't change anything. It is not about Sarfaraz; the keeper can be Rizwan or Adnan Akmal, but his primary role will still be to keep wickets and that is what he should and will be judged on.
    Then he needs to bat at #11.

    Let's see it happen.


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  51. #131
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    I used to read that PAK plays ODI in 80s & 90s mood. Here actually I get a suggestion that Test cricket should go back to 1880s & 1890s mood, when famous WKs like Pilling, Sherwin, Lyttelton, Blackham, Strudwick... used to play as specialist WK and bat even at 11.

  52. #132
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    Just wait and watch, Sarf is going to blow everyone away with his tactical genius and WK. Batting is not needed from him.


    "If this happens I will swim across the Charles River! In winter!" -- OZGOD on NZ batting 6 sessions

  53. #133
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mamoon View Post
    People need to realize that this is not about Sarfraz and his batting. The OP is shamelessly defending him because Inzamam has backed and endorsed his captaincy, and it is his moral duty to defend his honor.

    The day Inzamam criticizes Sarfraz would be the day his pathetic batting becomes a problem.
    I believe Mickey Arthur, Inzi and the PCB have done their best to support Sarfaraz and have given him sufficient time to put himself together and regain form. But it is clear he is completely out of his depth as a captain.

    Maybe Sarfaraz if allowed to play as a player alone might do much better without the added pressure of captaincy.

  54. #134
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    Ok sure, Sarfraz doesn't have to Bat, that's fine I'll take it, but man at least score 5+ odd runs every other inning, he can't even do that!

    OP, come on man.

  55. #135
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    FAF also doesn’t need to bat well to deserve place in this side


    New Era of Team Pakistan

  56. #136
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    Sarfraz alone is not responsible for our weak batting, but he needs to score to justify his place. He should seriously think about giving up captaincy if he wants to prolong his test career.

  57. #137
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    Quote Originally Posted by MenInG View Post
    Some social media humor...


    Name:  WhatsApp Image 2018-12-28 at 14.25.57.jpg
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    To be fair, that is Faf's wagon wheel too.


    2 possibilities exist: Either we are alone in the Universe or we are not. Both are terrifying.

  58. #138
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    Just do bhangra well on the pitch then, to deserve a place?

    This guy is embarrassing himself and the team.

  59. #139
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    Dont get why Sarfaraz cant change his technique a bit to tackle the extra bounce. Every professional batsman makes adjustment. Whats wrong with Sarfaraz!

  60. #140
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    Too much crouching from Sarfraz. At least try something different.

  61. #141
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    You're a decade to late with this statement. A specalist WK only is a waste of space in any team these days. Cricket evolved, requirement for team evolved aswell. Can't be asking the team to keep Safraz in the team solely on his keeping (even at that he is not that good). I don't know alot about PAK domestic cricket, but i do believe that the only reason this guy is in the team is because he is the captain. He is an average-below average player at best. Even the likes of Brandon Taylor will bat circles around him at his current form.

  62. #142
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    A weak batting line up like Pak can not have a specialist spinner let alone wicket keeper.

    Saifi is worse than Amir, Hasan these days.


    "You aren't a failure if you fail, you are a failure if you don't get up to try again" - Imran Khan.

  63. #143
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    Quote Originally Posted by jaf348 View Post
    If Pakistan are to improve on their 7th ranking then grooming a WK batsmen that is up to world standard will surely be one of the areas that needs improvement. There is no point being stuck with a specialist WK, it's no longer the 80s or 90s and most of the cricket world have moved on.

    When you look at the current test rankings, every other country barring Australia and Sri Lanka (debatable) and including Bangladesh have WK that contribute a lot more with the bat while having adequate enough skills or more with their primary role.

    Australia and India at least had the courage to drop non performers like Wade, Nevill and Saha despite being good enough with the gloves.

    If Pakistan fall 2-0 behind this series, I would like to see Azhar take over the captaincy and Rizwan the gloves for the 3rd test.
    I have not followed Paine's career closely but I reckon he hasn't done that much better than Sarfaraz with the bat. Before him, Australia had Wade and a bunch of others who were no Gilly with the bat. There is still a place for a proper wicket-keeper, who can bat a little, in the modern game. However, you need to have a solid batting lineup and that is the point of this thread.

    We can criticize Sarfaraz's batting all we like but what is that going to achieve? The guys who are picked for their batting are failing left and right and somehow, the bulk of the criticism is reserved for the guy who bats at #7. If Pakistan wants to climb the rankings, we need our batsmen to start scoring runs, our bowlers to start taking (more) wickets and for our wicket-keeper to keep wickets better than he already has.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dr_Bassim View Post
    People are not bumping this thread to ridicule you.

    The fact is you have your head buried so deep in the sand you refuse to even listen to logic.

    The title of the thread was *Sarfraz does not have to bat well to deserve his place in the team*.

    Fine.

    If in one moment of madness, we accept that he does NOT have to bat well to be in the team, we need to establish a bare minimum of what he has to do.

    Sarfraz may well smash 4 100's in the next 4 tests but if Pakistan continue to lose do we retain him for his batting and keeping?

    And if YES, then if Sarfraz gets 4 more ducks in next 4 innings and Pakistan lose do we still retain him?

    If the answer is yes to both questions, then why ask him to bat at all?

    Clearly in order to defend your illogical thread it has come down to whether he even scores 2 ducks, the thread has merit.

    Sarfraz does not have to bat well to deserve his place in the side.

    Yes sir.

    Sarfraz does NOT have to bat AT ALL to keep his place in the side.

    Well played sir.
    It is not about his batting at all. If he is keeping well and captaining well, he should play even if he keeps failing with the bat. So yes, he does not need to bat at all. However, the catch is that the top six have to ensure we don't lose more than five wickets.

    Quote Originally Posted by Muhammad10 View Post
    Fine, but in that case he should bat at 8 or 9 given his persistent failures with the bat as a number 7 in an already weak batting lineup. Now have fun trying to figure out how to strengthen the batting without severely weakening the already thin bowling attack (three pacers have bowled 80 out of 86 overs; it seems Yasir is playing as a specialist tailender!) by playing a specialist keeper/captain who barely contributes any runs.
    Bring Haris in and then it is up to the batsmen to score the runs. The bowlers and keeper have bigger things to worry about than bailing out the batsmen time after time.

    Quote Originally Posted by light View Post
    You're a decade to late with this statement. A specalist WK only is a waste of space in any team these days. Cricket evolved, requirement for team evolved aswell. Can't be asking the team to keep Safraz in the team solely on his keeping (even at that he is not that good). I don't know alot about PAK domestic cricket, but i do believe that the only reason this guy is in the team is because he is the captain. He is an average-below average player at best. Even the likes of Brandon Taylor will bat circles around him at his current form.
    We can get a 50-averaging keeper but if the batsmen do not do their job, we will not be winning any games. I don't care very much about Sarfaraz. Even if we replace him with someone else, my point will still stand. The batsmen need to be scoring runs, not numbers 7, 8, 9, 10 and 11. That is not a winning strategy.

  64. #144
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    I am not a Sarfaraz fan. If his keeping goes down the drain and the captaincy starts failing as well, we should drop him for sure. I simply do not agree with punishing him for not doing the batsmen' job for them.

  65. #145
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bilal7 View Post
    I have not followed Paine's career closely but I reckon he hasn't done that much better than Sarfaraz with the bat. Before him, Australia had Wade and a bunch of others who were no Gilly with the bat. There is still a place for a proper wicket-keeper, who can bat a little, in the modern game. However, you need to have a solid batting lineup and that is the point of this thread.

    We can criticize Sarfaraz's batting all we like but what is that going to achieve? The guys who are picked for their batting are failing left and right and somehow, the bulk of the criticism is reserved for the guy who bats at #7. If Pakistan wants to climb the rankings, we need our batsmen to start scoring runs, our bowlers to start taking (more) wickets and for our wicket-keeper to keep wickets better than he already has.
    Respectfully, I disagree with you. Cricket has evolved where nowadays with wicketkeepers 70% of their performance should be judged on their batting and 30% with the gloves. This is the exact reason and criteria why Australia and India have been chopping and changing their wicketkeepers these past few years. So long as their wicket keeping skills are not Kamran Akmal esque level of bad then that is adequate enough.

    When you look at Bairstow/Buttler/Foakes, Watling/Latham, de Kock, Pant, Dickwella and Mushfiqur all make it into their respective teams based on their batting alone. Pakistan are severely handicapping themselves by playing a specialist wicketkeeper when others have moved on. Based on current form with the bat, Rizwan has to be given a fair chance.

    Also, this is a thread about Sarfaraz. Other non-performers like Shafiq and Imam have been fairly criticised in other threads as well.

  66. #146
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    Quote Originally Posted by jaf348 View Post
    Respectfully, I disagree with you. Cricket has evolved where nowadays with wicketkeepers 70% of their performance should be judged on their batting and 30% with the gloves. This is the exact reason and criteria why Australia and India have been chopping and changing their wicketkeepers these past few years. So long as their wicket keeping skills are not Kamran Akmal esque level of bad then that is adequate enough.

    When you look at Bairstow/Buttler/Foakes, Watling/Latham, de Kock, Pant, Dickwella and Mushfiqur all make it into their respective teams based on their batting alone. Pakistan are severely handicapping themselves by playing a specialist wicketkeeper when others have moved on. Based on current form with the bat, Rizwan has to be given a fair chance.

    Also, this is a thread about Sarfaraz. Other non-performers like Shafiq and Imam have been fairly criticised in other threads as well.
    India dropped Karthik early this year after failing after 2 tests and are reaping the rewards now with Pant. Bairstow and Buttler were dropped when they were out of form with the bat. Only a team riddled with nepotism like Pakistan will tolerate such mediocrity from players like Sarfaraz and Shafiq for such a prolonged period of time. Pakistan deserve to be ranked 7th in tests.

  67. #147
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bilal7 View Post
    I am not a Sarfaraz fan. If his keeping goes down the drain and the captaincy starts failing as well, we should drop him for sure. I simply do not agree with punishing him for not doing the batsmen' job for them.
    You're now starting to talk some sense.

    But still reluctant to accept how wrong you are re. Sarfraz's batting.

    Wk must be able to bat. Must not be a dud. And in a team ranked 7th with an already fragile batting, wk must average above 40 as well.

    Sarfraz or any other keeper has to bat well to keep his place.

  68. #148
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    Can Sarfaraz Ahmed be more consistent and at his best form as an individual player alone?

    I personally feel that he will play at his best without the burden of captaincy. I remember the kind of player he was prior to the captaincy ie best strike rotator in the team and aggressive as a batsman, more calm in the field with no shouting at the fielders and more focused on his keeping, more fit as well.

    We have seen that barring the CT, he has never exhibited anything extraordinary in his captaincy. The PCB needs to put him out of his misery otherwise his career is going to be over in a heartbeat.

    I would do a Graeme Smith and take a bold move with Shan Masood. It's sad but there are just no other alternatives right now apart from him.

    With Masood you have an educated guy who can be the perfect statesman the team needs and the right face of Pakistan Cricket assuming he carries on his batting form which he has shown in domestic cricket and in the first test

  69. #149
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    Yes.

    He will.


    And I get so high.. And I just can't feel it....

  70. #150
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    I would drop him all together. Don’t think he’s good enough. He’s been throughly exposed in the last few months.

  71. #151
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    Quote Originally Posted by jaf348 View Post
    Respectfully, I disagree with you. Cricket has evolved where nowadays with wicketkeepers 70% of their performance should be judged on their batting and 30% with the gloves. This is the exact reason and criteria why Australia and India have been chopping and changing their wicketkeepers these past few years. So long as their wicket keeping skills are not Kamran Akmal esque level of bad then that is adequate enough.

    When you look at Bairstow/Buttler/Foakes, Watling/Latham, de Kock, Pant, Dickwella and Mushfiqur all make it into their respective teams based on their batting alone. Pakistan are severely handi themselves by playing a specialist wicketkeeper when others have moved on. Based on current form with the bat, Rizwan has to be given a fair chance.

    Also, this is a thread about Sarfaraz. Other non-performers like Shafiq and Imam have been fairly criticised in other threads as well.
    Pants not scoring many more than Karthik, and Australia keeper not scoring many either. Yes currently they are scoring more than Sarfraz, but remove his test captaincy and see his form return in batting. He never will be to the level of English keepers. We do not even have specialist batsmen in domestic to their level, let alone wicketkeepers.
    Last edited by PakPremi; 29th December 2018 at 14:32.

  72. #152
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bilal7 View Post
    Bring Haris in and then it is up to the batsmen to score the runs. The bowlers and keeper have bigger things to worry about than bailing out the batsmen time after time.
    If you are batting in the top 7, you have to contribute regularly with the bat. No team can afford a passenger in the top 7, least of all a team that has Asad Shafiq masquerading as a #5 batsman.

  73. #153
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    Quote Originally Posted by PakPremi View Post
    Pants not scoring many more than Karthik, and Australia keeper not scoring many either. Yes currently they are scoring more than Sarfraz, but remove his test captaincy and see his form return in batting. He never will be to the level of English keepers. We do not even have specialist batsmen in domestic to their level, let alone wicketkeepers.
    Australia are facing a dire crisis in talented batsmen but even I doubt even they would tolerate Paine's mediocrity for as long as Pakistan have persisted with Sarfaraz.

    Pant is averaging 38 this year while Karthik was dropped after averaging 5.25 over 4 innings in England, there is no comparison to be made between the two. Pant is also 10 years younger than Sarfaraz and will only improve with time and experience.

    The Sarfaraz of 2014-2015 used to have amazing footwork and danced around the pitch to the world class spinners like Herath and Lyon while nowadays his footwork is near non-existent. Do you think that is magically going to return just by removing his captaincy?

    Pakistan have Rizwan who has been in good form lately with the bat and deserves a chance.

  74. #154
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bilal7 View Post
    You guys can bump this thread a million times and it won't change anything. It is not about Sarfaraz; the keeper can be Rizwan or Adnan Akmal, but his primary role will still be to keep wickets and that is what he should and will be judged on.
    Disagree.

    A wicket-keeper needs to make runs and contribute with the bat.

    Sarfaraz bats at 7 in Tests and has to be making runs.



  75. #155
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    Quote Originally Posted by Saj View Post
    Disagree.

    A wicket-keeper needs to make runs and contribute with the bat.

    Sarfaraz bats at 7 in Tests and has to be making runs.
    If Sarfraz form does return then he will make runs but I believe he needs to be relieved of test captaincy to re-focus on batting.

  76. #156
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hawkeye View Post
    You're now starting to talk some sense.

    But still reluctant to accept how wrong you are re. Sarfraz's batting.

    Wk must be able to bat. Must not be a dud. And in a team ranked 7th with an already fragile batting, wk must average above 40 as well.

    Sarfraz or any other keeper has to bat well to keep his place.
    How many of our current specialist batsmen average over 40 with the bat? How about first ensuring that we have six of those before trying to find a keeper that averages 40?

    Quote Originally Posted by Muhammad10 View Post
    If you are batting in the top 7, you have to contribute regularly with the bat. No team can afford a passenger in the top 7, least of all a team that has Asad Shafiq masquerading as a #5 batsman.
    So then the main problem is Shafiq and not Sarfaraz?

  77. #157
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bilal7 View Post
    So then the main problem is Shafiq and not Sarfaraz?
    They are both a burden on our team. We don't have batsmen like Kohli in the side compensate for their failures.

  78. #158
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bilal7 View Post
    How many of our current specialist batsmen average over 40 with the bat? How about first ensuring that we have six of those before trying to find a keeper that averages 40?



    So then the main problem is Shafiq and not Sarfaraz?
    Both are not mutually exclusive.

    We have lowered our standards, just because we have duds like Shafiq who as specialist bats cannot even average above 40.

    Today's WKs are specialist batsmen as well, or at least someone who can average 35 or above. In most of the conditions.

    Sarf averages in 20s in the last 2 years.

    And has awful leadership.
    Last edited by Hawkeye; 30th December 2018 at 13:57.

  79. #159
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  80. #160
    Debut
    Feb 2018
    Runs
    2,390
    Mentioned
    37 Post(s)
    Tagged
    1 Thread(s)
    Dropped a sitter now. Captaincy is surely taking a toll on him


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