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  1. #81
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pete Rose View Post
    Issues start at the top four. We have imam and hafeez in our top 4
    Issues start with the fact that Fakhar and Babar have resoundingly bombed in the past few ODI games. Soon as they start performing, we'll be back to chest-thumping.

  2. #82
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    Yes it’s horrible!
    Sure we’re pathetic...

    BUT can we at least wait for the series to be over before the various starting threads upon threads on how bad we are, whose at fault and this playercor that player must be dropped....

  3. #83
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    Quote Originally Posted by Usman Chadda View Post
    Issues start with the fact that Fakhar and Babar have resoundingly bombed in the past few ODI games. Soon as they start performing, we'll be back to chest-thumping.
    Fakhar has only played 24 ODIs so far. So Fakhar and Babar haven't ever (so far in their short careers) consistently scored against top teams. Perhaps this is their form.

  4. #84
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    If it goes for 20+ then it's cause of concern. NZ in NZ is tough. India is normally very good. So I won't read too much into those 5-7 games.


    "If this happens I will swim across the Charles River! In winter!" -- OZGOD on NZ batting 6 sessions

  5. #85
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    Quote Originally Posted by Usman Chadda View Post
    Issues start with the fact that Fakhar and Babar have resoundingly bombed in the past few ODI games. Soon as they start performing, we'll be back to chest-thumping.
    that would require us to not play the non-minnows

  6. #86
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    Quote Originally Posted by Buffet View Post
    If it goes for 20+ then it's cause of concern. NZ in NZ is tough. India is normally very good. So I won't read too much into those 5-7 games.
    surely you are aware that our record against non-minnows is a multi-year issue.

  7. #87
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sachin136 View Post
    Fakhar has only played 24 ODIs so far. So Fakhar and Babar haven't ever (so far in their short careers) consistently scored against top teams. Perhaps this is their form.
    Fakhar had a decent start to his career, scoring against top teams. Babar just scored heavily against this same NZ side in T20s a few days back. These two bat in the top order, and occupy two of the most important positions in the batting order. Their failures has a direct correlation with Pakistan getting hammered so far.

  8. #88
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    Quote Originally Posted by Usman Chadda View Post
    These bring back Umar Akmal posts are cringe-worthy and reeks of agenda based posting. How about bring in someone like Saud Shakeel, who has performed better than UA in List A cricket?
    good point; I really dont want to see Umar Akmal in the team again; but I also dont want to see Hafeez in the team

  9. #89
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    I think it's time we stick to what we do best and that's minnow bashing. Lets organise a 7 ODI series against Nepal so we can boost our player's stats and more importantly not lose any more ranking points.

  10. #90
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    Quote Originally Posted by Markhor View Post
    What do we expect when we persist with a top six that must be amongst the worst in the world. Let's go through them one by one - against non-minnows in 2018:

    Fakhar averages 26@74
    Imam averages 26@69
    Babar averages 9.77@52
    Malik averages 28@65
    Hafeez averages 24@80
    Sarfraz averages 25@76

    Not a single average above 35 or SR 85 and above. And we're expecting this top six to take us through to the semi-finals of the World Cup next year ?

    It's time to take a look at our best domestic one day batsmen and start afresh before Steyn, Rabada and Ngidi's averages are boosted this winter in South Africa.
    damn Babar

  11. #91
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    Quote Originally Posted by srh View Post
    good point; I really dont want to see Umar Akmal in the team again; but I also dont want to see Hafeez in the team
    Hafeez (in good form) is the closest to a dynamic international batsman we have at the moment. I can't believe I just wrote that, but that's the state of Pakistan cricket at the moment

  12. #92
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    Quote Originally Posted by leg-side-flick View Post
    If you think about it, Pak had roughly the same team and were winning last year including champions trophy, but two things are exposing this shoddy batting line up

    1) Fakhar Zaman is not scoring

    2) Hasan Ali is not taking wickets and that's making them
    chase par scores instead of sub par ones that they are used to
    Spot on

  13. #93
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    Bring back Sharjeel please we really need him back...

  14. #94
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    Quote Originally Posted by leg-side-flick View Post
    If you think about it, Pak had roughly the same team and were winning last year including champions trophy, but two things are exposing this shoddy batting line up

    1) Fakhar Zaman is not scoring

    2) Hasan Ali is not taking wickets and that's making them
    chase par scores instead of sub par ones that they are used to
    Fakhar is the one who was carrying this team and hiding its deficiencies. Now he has come back to earth and we are realizing how bad the team really is.

  15. #95
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    Champions Trophy was one helluva fluke.

    IIRC somebody wished that they would take a Champions Trophy victory over India in the final in exchange for losing every ODI series.


  16. #96
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    Quote Originally Posted by Buffet View Post
    If it goes for 20+ then it's cause of concern. NZ in NZ is tough. India is normally very good. So I won't read too much into those 5-7 games.
    We're getting embarrassed on our home ground.

  17. #97
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pete Rose View Post
    surely you are aware that our record against non-minnows is a multi-year issue.
    I am aware of that, but I was talking about this streak of 8-9 games. If you get 5-6 games in UAE and lose then it will be troublesome.


    "If this happens I will swim across the Charles River! In winter!" -- OZGOD on NZ batting 6 sessions

  18. #98
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ilan Bluestone View Post
    We're getting embarrassed on our home ground.
    I don't recall Aus playing ODI in UAE. Some one can correct me. So you are only talking about 2-3 games in Asia cup and then one game here. Not very good performance, but still just 3-4 games. If it continues for another 4-5 games then it will really poor.

    I am not discounting poor performance, but simply commenting on this streak.


    "If this happens I will swim across the Charles River! In winter!" -- OZGOD on NZ batting 6 sessions

  19. #99
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    They'll win the next one and shut you all up.


    Hai yeh Josh-e-Junoon, hai yeh apna yaqeen, ke jo tum mein hai dum, woh kisi mein nahin!

  20. #100
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    Quote Originally Posted by Square Drive View Post
    They'll win the next one and shut you all up.
    How does winning one game in one year shuts everyone up?

  21. #101
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    At least we won the ICC trophy.

  22. #102
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    Look our batting is lacking in everything. Fakhar and Babar have been exposed. Everyone else would not get into the top 5 sides batting line ups.

    We can change 3 or 4 in the top 6 but to be honest I doubt we have anyone decent. Our only hope is Fakhar and Babar. Fakhar is seriously struggling mentally and Babar goes missing when we need him.

    Try this.

    Fakhar
    Asif Ali
    Babar
    Sarf
    Malik
    Hafeez
    Faheem
    Imad
    Shadab
    Shaheen
    Junaid.

    Asif seems good v pace. Imam unfortunately will never score fast enough for this era.

  23. #103
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    Quote Originally Posted by Buffet View Post
    I am aware of that, but I was talking about this streak of 8-9 games. If you get 5-6 games in UAE and lose then it will be troublesome.
    You are also aware that we have been clean swept and lost series to England, Australia, South Africa in the UAE

  24. #104
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hawkeye View Post
    How does winning one game in one year shuts everyone up?
    Because then your thread title won't hold true.
    Last edited by giri26; 8th November 2018 at 01:33.


    Hai yeh Josh-e-Junoon, hai yeh apna yaqeen, ke jo tum mein hai dum, woh kisi mein nahin!

  25. #105
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    Considering how much the top order keeps struggling, I think maybe they should try this:

    Fakhar
    Imam
    Babar
    Haris
    Malik
    Hafeez
    Sarfraz
    Shadab
    Hasan
    Afridi
    Junaid

    It weakens the bowling a bit as you only have 4 specialist bowlers but some combination of Hafeez/Malik/Haris/Fakhar can surely provide you with the remaining 10 overs.

    Haris is the perfect middle order batsmen to have as he can play pace and spin and hopefully with him and Babar, the middle order can last long enough to have Malik/Hafeez come later in the game where they can play their shots. Problem right now is Hafeez/Malik keep getting put into situations where they are required to build/hold the innings and they've proven over their careers that they are not suited for that. I don't quite get why Haris hasn't been given more a shot, he was even the best Pakistani batsmen in those woeful matches in New Zealand.

  26. #106
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pete Rose View Post
    You are also aware that we have been clean swept and lost series to England, Australia, South Africa in the UAE
    That was a different team though. I was just talking about current team.


    "If this happens I will swim across the Charles River! In winter!" -- OZGOD on NZ batting 6 sessions

  27. #107
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    Pakistan have had a horror year in ODIs in 2018. They lost 5-0 to NZ to start the year, Lost both their games against India in Asia Cup. Lost an important game against Bangladesh in the same tournament. Now have lost the first ODI against NZ. That makes it 9 losses this year against team who are competent in this format.

  28. #108
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    I have said this before and I say this again, Pakistan is playing ODI with bit and pieces players , barring Babar and Imam, the technique is horrible to say the least. You cant win ODI with pretty 20'ssssssss players like Hafeez . Fakhar does not have a technique and will fail miserably against any half decent bowling attack specially when is required to play long. Y


    Yesterday is the past.Tomorrow is the future.Today is a gift.That's why it's called the "present"

  29. #109
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    The big problem I see is overreliance on Fakhar at top which is Taking a Toll on his Batting.I suggest trying Asif as Opener and introducing haris in middle.Also Hasan needs to be dropped

  30. #110
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    You guys need to get some perspective, if you look at the overall batting average of Pakistan's batsmen against all teams you guys are ok, not great but ok so don't know why all the negativity.

  31. #111
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    Need experience at the top. Batsman like Kamran etc.

  32. #112
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    Pakistan are a confidence side.

    They will beat the pathetic Australian ODI side and go on a run.

  33. #113
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    This 9-0 streak puts Azharís captaincy into perspective.

    He too won series against weak teams, but his fate was sealed when we played 15 ODIs against England and Australia in less than 12 months.

    Today, Sarfrazís 9-0 hardly looks any different. Furthermore, it also dispels the myth that Pakistan won the Champions Trophy because of his captaincy. He was simply at the right place at the right time.

    If it was down to his captaincy that allowed us to smash India and England, why hasnít he been able to turn at least 2-3 out of these 9 in his teamís favor?

    All this talk of Pakistan being an improved team today compared to 2015 and how Sarfraz is transforming our mentality etc. has blown into a million pieces.

    It was Sarfrazís great fortune that he got the captaincy after Azhar. If he was appointed as captain in 2015, he would have been sacked after the Australian series in 2017 and Malik or Hafeez would have led the team today.

  34. #114
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mamoon View Post
    This 9-0 streak puts Azhar’s captaincy into perspective.

    He too won series against weak teams, but his fate was sealed when we played 15 ODIs against England and Australia in less than 12 months.

    Today, Sarfraz’s 9-0 hardly looks any different. Furthermore, it also dispels the myth that Pakistan won the Champions Trophy because of his captaincy. He was simply at the right place at the right time.

    If it was down to his captaincy that allowed us to smash India and England, why hasn’t he been able to turn at least 2-3 out of these 9 in his team’s favor?

    All this talk of Pakistan being an improved team today compared to 2015 and how Sarfraz is transforming our mentality etc. has blown into a million pieces.

    It was Sarfraz’s great fortune that he got the captaincy after Azhar. If he was appointed as captain in 2015, he would have been sacked after the Australian series in 2017 and Malik or Hafeez would have led the team today.
    Nevertheless, i think Sarfraz hasn't done too badly. His team has been very dominating in T20s. I think if you make someone else the captain this team would not have been able to win 11 consecutive series. Even though he inherited a very poor ODI team he was still able to win an ICC tournament. You can call it fluke, luck or whatever you want. It doesn't really matter. The fact is he did win the tournament. So his reign hasn't been complete failure in ODIs. In tests he managed to draw a series, with an inexperienced side, in England where the much more experienced India were hammered. So in T20s he has been excellent. In ODI and Test he has been a mixed bag so far.

    If he does go on to lose ODI and/or the test series against NZ and SA then i think he is done. Although i'm not too sure who would replace him.

  35. #115
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    Fakhar and babar are good player,if they are backed till world cup they will surely give their best in world cup
    Imam hafeez malik sarfaraz and imad can play around them
    In england fahim can play in place of imad

  36. #116
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    Quote Originally Posted by Suleiman View Post
    Need experience at the top. Batsman like Kamran etc.
    Khuda ka khauf kar yaar


    #Hum apko container deingaye dharnay ke liyay

  37. #117
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mamoon View Post
    This 9-0 streak puts Azharís captaincy into perspective.

    He too won series against weak teams, but his fate was sealed when we played 15 ODIs against England and Australia in less than 12 months.

    Today, Sarfrazís 9-0 hardly looks any different. Furthermore, it also dispels the myth that Pakistan won the Champions Trophy because of his captaincy. He was simply at the right place at the right time.

    If it was down to his captaincy that allowed us to smash India and England, why hasnít he been able to turn at least 2-3 out of these 9 in his teamís favor?

    All this talk of Pakistan being an improved team today compared to 2015 and how Sarfraz is transforming our mentality etc. has blown into a million pieces.

    It was Sarfrazís great fortune that he got the captaincy after Azhar. If he was appointed as captain in 2015, he would have been sacked after the Australian series in 2017 and Malik or Hafeez would have led the team today.
    Don't know about sarfraz contribution but this Pakistan is team is far better than 2015 team...

  38. #118
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    No doubt we have an issue with 50 over cricket that has not been sorted for few years now. The solution for now would be to play top 6 pure batsmen who cant bowl at all so they only concentrate on scoring. And then play Hafeez etc 7/8.

  39. #119
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    Quote Originally Posted by GLORY OF '92 View Post
    Look our batting is lacking in everything. Fakhar and Babar have been exposed. Everyone else would not get into the top 5 sides batting line ups.

    We can change 3 or 4 in the top 6 but to be honest I doubt we have anyone decent. Our only hope is Fakhar and Babar. Fakhar is seriously struggling mentally and Babar goes missing when we need him.

    Try this.

    Fakhar
    Asif Ali
    Babar
    Sarf
    Malik
    Hafeez
    Faheem
    Imad
    Shadab
    Shaheen
    Junaid.

    Asif seems good v pace. Imam unfortunately will never score fast enough for this era.
    where is Sharjeel?

  40. #120
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    what a pretentious thread title

    both streaks are very real. Pakistan are a phenomenally strong T20 team, but really struggling in ODIs

  41. #121
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    Our ODI struggles are decade and half old.

    That said, I am optimist for our chances in the World cup. No need to slit wrists.

    Our ODI bowling can win us a tourney in England.

  42. #122
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pakhs View Post
    No doubt we have an issue with 50 over cricket that has not been sorted for few years now. The solution for now would be to play top 6 pure batsmen who cant bowl at all so they only concentrate on scoring. And then play Hafeez etc 7/8.
    So you're relying on 10 overs from Hafeez in every match? That's not going to end well.

  43. #123
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    I really dont understand why people are claiming the problem is with bits n pieces players. Here is our batting line up:

    Imam
    Fakhar
    Babar
    Hafeez
    Sarfaraz
    Malik

    You cant claim any if these are bits and pieces players.. they are all genuine batsmen. Yes they may not be world class but then again tell me which world class batting options do we have on the sidelines?

    Yeah if we go lower down the order, you can claim this problem exists but in ODIs that we have lost, our top order, which are all genuine batsmen is what capitulates.

    If top order cant score, you dont deserve to win... Period!

    So you need more consistency from them and the test will sort itself out. But yes indonagree that two spots can be handled a bit better. You can only play one out of imad, shadab, faheem, etc..


    Kut khani hai to aa jao idher, khushbo laga ke!

  44. #124
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    The problem is our top order.

    Have said it a few months back as well: We are CC Babar and Fakhar team. When one of them does not score we do not even reach 230 let alone 300.

    The way we select our team we will never score anything above 220 against good bowling attacks unless Babar, Fakhar have their special day.

    Gone are the days when our bowlers could defend even 200 on Asian tracks. The reason we do not save ODI games anymore like we used to.
    Last edited by Prince of Pakistan; 8th November 2018 at 23:28.


    "You aren't a failure if you fail, you are a failure if you don't get up to try again" - Imran Khan.

  45. #125
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    Hahahahaha.

    A "REAL" streak which is only being mentioned on PP; in the meantime, 11-0 is the talk of the town across the cricketing world, but of course that can't be real.

    Amazing.


    Hai yeh Josh-e-Junoon, hai yeh apna yaqeen, ke jo tum mein hai dum, woh kisi mein nahin!

  46. #126
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    Quote Originally Posted by Darkrai View Post
    Nevertheless, i think Sarfraz hasn't done too badly. His team has been very dominating in T20s. I think if you make someone else the captain this team would not have been able to win 11 consecutive series. Even though he inherited a very poor ODI team he was still able to win an ICC tournament. You can call it fluke, luck or whatever you want. It doesn't really matter. The fact is he did win the tournament. So his reign hasn't been complete failure in ODIs. In tests he managed to draw a series, with an inexperienced side, in England where the much more experienced India were hammered. So in T20s he has been excellent. In ODI and Test he has been a mixed bag so far.

    If he does go on to lose ODI and/or the test series against NZ and SA then i think he is done. Although i'm not too sure who would replace him.
    Some very good points made here.


    Hai yeh Josh-e-Junoon, hai yeh apna yaqeen, ke jo tum mein hai dum, woh kisi mein nahin!

  47. #127
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    Quote Originally Posted by the_outsider View Post
    So you're relying on 10 overs from Hafeez in every match? That's not going to end well.
    No I am not but Hafeez is not such a bad bowler I have never seen him having the worst figures out of the total bowlers bowled in a match. But they need to play only two proper fast bowlers then two all-rounders and shadab. the rest must be pure batmen. What I dont like is hafeez at 3 compare to say kholi for India. Now we know Pakistan dont have a Kholi but why play an all-rounder in a specialist batting position.

  48. #128
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    This team is pathetic and does not matter when and where do you play and send them to bat.they are bound to fail.

  49. #129
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    Quote Originally Posted by DRsohail View Post
    This team is pathetic and does not matter when and where do you play and send them to bat.they are bound to fail.
    Well well well.

    A few weeks ago you were criticizing the posts criticizing this team!

    Seen the light now I guess?

  50. #130
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hawkeye View Post
    Well well well.

    A few weeks ago you were criticizing the posts criticizing this team!

    Seen the light now I guess?
    Yes when we stop this recycling of TTF we can surely move forward but unfortunatley they have gone back to Hafiz,Imad etc.

  51. #131
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    Streak over. Time to win the series. But this batting line up on flat pitches/chasing big scores is a worry long term.

  52. #132
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    Quote Originally Posted by Prince of Pakistan View Post
    The problem is our top order.

    Have said it a few months back as well: We are CC Babar and Fakhar team. When one of them does not score we do not even reach 230 let alone 300.

    The way we select our team we will never score anything above 220 against good bowling attacks unless Babar, Fakhar have their special day.

    Gone are the days when our bowlers could defend even 200 on Asian tracks. The reason we do not save ODI games anymore like we used to.
    Told you so.

    It's all about Fakhar, Babar. Nothing else matters.


    "You aren't a failure if you fail, you are a failure if you don't get up to try again" - Imran Khan.

  53. #133
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    Quote Originally Posted by Prince of Pakistan View Post
    Told you so.

    It's all about Fakhar, Babar. Nothing else matters.
    They are also the reason we are consistent in T20's.


    "You aren't a failure if you fail, you are a failure if you don't get up to try again" - Imran Khan.

  54. #134
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    Quote Originally Posted by Prince of Pakistan View Post
    Told you so.

    It's all about Fakhar, Babar. Nothing else matters.
    Well since Fakhar and Babar are in the top two, they are entrusted to do the bulk of the scoring. You can't expect a middle-order with Malik and Hafeez to dig you out of nightmarish situations match after match. Pakistan fans have been spoiled with the middle-order of Inzi and MoYo, who played out of their skins to resurrect our innings time and again after nonsense starts.

    Top three does the bulk of the scoring in modern day ODI cricket. India would be a mid-table ranked team right now if they depended on their middle-order for wins.

  55. #135
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    Law of Averages at work here. We were eventually bound to win against a quality team - you cannot maintain a 100% record either way.

    Unfortunately our people are confusing it with something more than a one-off event. Rest assured, we will be back to our losing ways very soon because that is the true capability of this team.

    At best, we can hope to win 2/3 games out of 10 against the top half teams.

  56. #136
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    I am sure even India has had many such streaks when 5 out 9 matches were played in SENA

  57. #137
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mamoon View Post
    Law of Averages at work here. We were eventually bound to win against a quality team - you cannot maintain a 100% record either way.

    Unfortunately our people are confusing it with something more than a one-off event. Rest assured, we will be back to our losing ways very soon because that is the true capability of this team.

    At best, we can hope to win 2/3 games out of 10 against the top half teams.
    World Cup is 9 matches...last two are Afghanistan and Bangladesh.

    Iíve maintained that we have to beat WI, SL, Afg and Ban and two of the other 5 to get through the group phase...my support will be there for 4 crunch World Cup games

  58. #138
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wasim_Waqar View Post
    World Cup is 9 matches...last two are Afghanistan and Bangladesh.

    I’ve maintained that we have to beat WI, SL, Afg and Ban and two of the other 5 to get through the group phase...my support will be there for 4 crunch World Cup games
    Every team has to do the same thing....

    BTW who are your probable semi finalist

  59. #139
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    Quote Originally Posted by Usman Chadda View Post
    Well since Fakhar and Babar are in the top two, they are entrusted to do the bulk of the scoring. You can't expect a middle-order with Malik and Hafeez to dig you out of nightmarish situations match after match. Pakistan fans have been spoiled with the middle-order of Inzi and MoYo, who played out of their skins to resurrect our innings time and again after nonsense starts.

    Top three does the bulk of the scoring in modern day ODI cricket. India would be a mid-table ranked team right now if they depended on their middle-order for wins.
    That's the problem. The middle order has been supportive but has not won matches in the last 18 months. Guys like Hafeez, Malik and Sarfraz usually falter after a poor start.

    We are too dependent on Babar, Fakhar which is not a good sign. It also means that we need to try some other batsmen in the middle order in the coming months. Someone more reliable to solidify our batting.


    "You aren't a failure if you fail, you are a failure if you don't get up to try again" - Imran Khan.

  60. #140
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    Streak will be considered as over if we win this and the SA ODI series.

    Until then.

    False hope.


  61. #141
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    Quote Originally Posted by Darkrai View Post
    At least we won the ICC trophy.
    Fast forward 2050, the same comments and chest pumping will continue

    And even the broadcasters will be playing the same highlights

  62. #142
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    Quote Originally Posted by Haripotter View Post
    Fast forward 2050, the same comments and chest pumping will continue

    And even the broadcasters will be playing the same highlights
    Pak has won 3 ICC TROPHIES. Lost the WC FINAL / WT20 FINAL. Played several sem finals in ICC events.

    Just for your info.

  63. #143
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mamoon View Post
    Law of Averages at work here. We were eventually bound to win against a quality team - you cannot maintain a 100% record either way.

    Unfortunately our people are confusing it with something more than a one-off event. Rest assured, we will be back to our losing ways very soon because that is the true capability of this team.

    At best, we can hope to win 2/3 games out of 10 against the top half teams.
    Did you actually watch the game or just releasing your frustration here? NZ batsmen struggled against some really good bowling. 2nd innings their bowlers had 0 impact. In fact i think their pacers all went close to 6 an over.

    Had PAK not bowled rubbish in the last 5 overs and if the fluke hattrick would not have happened PAK would leading 2 nil.

  64. #144
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    Guys how's that streak looking right around now?

  65. #145
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    Quote Originally Posted by Syed1 View Post
    Guys how's that streak looking right around now?
    Law of averages.


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