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  1. #1
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    Rahaf al-Qunun: Saudi teen refugee arrives in Canada [Update Post #24]

    Thailand's immigration police chief says a Saudi woman who fled her family at the weekend will be given temporary entry to the country.

    Thai immigration officials had tried to return Rahaf Mohammed al-Qunun, 18, to Kuwait, where her family is.

    She refused to board a flight to Kuwait City on Monday, and barricaded herself into her hotel room at Bangkok airport.

    The teenager said she believed her family would kill her if she went back because she had renounced Islam.

    The Thai authorities said her status would be assessed by the UN refugee agency.

    "My brothers and family and the Saudi embassy will be waiting for me in Kuwait," she told Reuters.

    "My life is in danger. My family threatens to kill me for the most trivial things."

    Rights groups including Human Rights Watch have expressed grave concerns for Ms Mohammed al-Qunun, who arrived at Bangkok's international airport on a flight from Kuwait. She had travelled to Thailand for a connecting flight to Australia, where she hoped to seek asylum.

    Thailand's chief of immigration police Surachate Hakparn said on Monday afternoon local time that the country would "protect her as best we can".

    "She is now under the sovereignty of Thailand, no-one and no embassy can force her to go anywhere," he said. "We will talk to her and do whatever she requests.

    "Since she escaped trouble to seek our help... we will not send anyone to their death."

    An injunction filed by Thai lawyers in Bangkok criminal court to stop the deportation was dismissed earlier on Monday.

    Thailand is not a signatory to the UN Refugee Convention, and provides no legal protection to asylum-seekers - although there are more than 100,000 refugees in the country.

    How did the stand-off start?

    Ms Mohammed al-Qunun says that when she arrived in Bangkok on Saturday, her passport was seized by a Saudi diplomat who met her coming off the flight.

    On Sunday, Thailand said she was being deported because she did not meet the requirements for a Thai visa.

    However, Ms Mohammed al-Qunun insists she has a visa for Australia, and never wanted to stay in Thailand.

    The Saudi embassy in Bangkok said Saudi Arabia did not have the authority to hold her at the airport, and said she was stopped by Thai authorities for "violating the law".

    Phil Robertson, deputy Asia director for Human Rights Watch, told the BBC: "It seems that the Thai government is manufacturing a story that she tried to apply for a visa and it was denied... in fact, she had an onward ticket to go to Australia, she didn't want to enter Thailand in the first place."

    He argued that the Thai authorities had clearly co-operated with Saudi Arabia, as Saudi officials were able to meet the plane when it arrived.

    How was the world alerted?

    Ms Mohammed al-Qunun started attracting attention with her social media posts over the weekend. She has also given a friend access to her Twitter account, calling it a contingency in case anything should happen to her.

    "I shared my story and my pictures on social media and my father is so angry because I did this... I can't study and work in my country, so I want to be free and study and work as I want," she said.

    Women in Saudi Arabia are subject to male guardianship laws, which mean they need a male relative's permission to work, travel, marry, open a bank account, or even leave prison.

    Ms Mohammed al-Qunun wrote on Twitter that she had decided to share her name and details because she had "nothing to lose" now.

    She has asked for asylum from governments around the world.

    A photo appeared of her in her room as officials reportedly stood outside, waiting to put her on a flight back to Kuwait.

    Why are there fears for her welfare?

    Ms Mohammed al-Qunun told the BBC that she had renounced Islam, and feared her family would kill her if she was sent back to Saudi Arabia.

    Freedom of religion is not legally protected in the Islamic kingdom, and people who convert to another religion from Islam risk being charged with apostasy - or abandoning their religious beliefs.

    The crime is legally punishable by death - although courts have not carried out a death sentence in recent years.

    Alternatively, Ms Mohammed al-Qunun could be charged with terrorism. Saudi Arabia's counter-terrorism law and a series of related decrees are used to criminalise a wide range of acts, including insulting the country's reputation, harming public order, and "calling for atheist thought in any form".

    An adult woman who does not heed her guardian can also be arrested on charges of "disobedience". If a woman is detained for any reason, the police will not release her unless her guardian comes to pick her up, even if she faces no criminal charges.

    Ms Mohammed al-Qunun's case echoes that of another Saudi woman who was in transit to Australia in April 2017.

    Dina Ali Lasloom, 24, was en route from Kuwait via the Philippines but was taken back to Saudi Arabia from Manila airport by her family.

    She used a Canadian tourist's phone to send a message, a video of which was posted to Twitter, saying her family would kill her.

    Her fate on arriving back in Saudi Arabia remains unknown.

    https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-46777848

  2. #2
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    Don't know when will Saudi enter the 20th century already.

  3. #3
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    She should be sent to the saudi embassy, the safest place these days.

  4. #4
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    Move to Australia. They will give her asylum for sure.

  5. #5
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    Followed this story develop on social media yesterday.

    1. What a brave and spirited young lady she is and;
    2. This was twitter at its best as the story, and offers of help, spread throughout the world really quickly. Without this she’d already be back in Saudi Arabia or Kuwait.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by troodon View Post
    Move to Australia. They will give her asylum for sure.
    Not necessarily. Australia was criticised a few years ago for having one of the toughest asylum policies in the world, and we are talking pre-Trump days. Didn't they hold all applicants on an island offshore to stop them getting in without stringent assessment?


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  7. #7
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    Thailand is so screwed. You don't wanna get into the wrong books of his highness Prince MBS.


    Tazimi Sirdar

  8. #8
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    Very similar to the Princess Latifa story. Unfortunately that time India bowed to the pressure from the UAE and sent the poor girl back home.

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/n...tifa-thvqjsjxt

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gabbar Singh View Post
    Very similar to the Princess Latifa story. Unfortunately that time India bowed to the pressure from the UAE and sent the poor girl back home.

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/n...tifa-thvqjsjxt
    Didn't know thanks for the news, @BJP supporters this is for you guys.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by JaDed View Post
    Didn't know thanks for the news, @BJP supporters this is for you guys.
    Watch how bhakto ki toliya evade this like plague.


    Tazimi Sirdar

  11. #11
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    Let her live in Saudi by renouncing Islam. Now that will definitely improve the image of Saudi's. These ladies think Saudi's oppressive culture is Islam.


    PP's own self proclaimed sharpshooter and defender of Islam and Pakistan.

  12. #12
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    Her Aussie visitor visa has been cancelled. Let's hope it is reinstated but with Dutton in charge of immigration I doubt it.

    If she wants to renounce Islam it is her choice be it if she is confusing Saudi version as Islam but very easy to look on and comment as a male when you are not held to the same levels of adhering to Islam (I say this as a muslim)

  13. #13
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    Thailand and Saudis have one of the longer diplomatic disputes in recent times.

    Its not a bad choice, I would have thought only Iran, Turkey and Canada would have been safer places for her

    Every single western country would happily have turned her in to please the Saudis

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gabbar Singh View Post
    Very similar to the Princess Latifa story. Unfortunately that time India bowed to the pressure from the UAE and sent the poor girl back home.

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/n...tifa-thvqjsjxt
    india used latifa to get christian michel extradited as a quid pro quo. this is basic knowledge.

  15. #15
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    Rahaf al-Qunun: Saudi teen granted asylum in Canada

    A Saudi woman who fled her family and became stranded at Bangkok's main airport is flying to Canada after being granted asylum status.
    Rahaf Mohammed al-Qunun, 18, had been trying to reach Australia via Bangkok, but was initially told to return to Kuwait, where her family were waiting.
    She refused to fly back and barricaded herself into her airport hotel room, attracting international attention.

    She said she had renounced Islam, which is punishable by death in Saudi Arabia.
    The UN's refugee agency has said it considers her to be a legitimate refugee.

    Refugee status is normally granted by governments, but the UNHCR can grant it where states are "unable or unwilling to do so", according to its website.

    Canadian Prime Minister Justin Trudeau told reporters: "Canada has been unequivocal that we will always stand up for human rights and women's rights around the world. When the UN made a request of us that we grant Ms al-Qunun asylum, we accepted."

    Canada has previously angered Saudi Arabia after calling for the release of detained women's rights activists in the country - prompting Riyadh to expel Canada's ambassador and freeze all new trade.

    The UNHCR has welcomed Canada's decision to resettle Ms Qunun.
    The UN High Commissioner for Refugees, Filippo Grandi, said: "[Her] plight has captured the world's attention over the past few days, providing a glimpse into the precarious situation of millions of refugees worldwide.

    "Refugee protection today is often under threat and cannot always be assured, but in this instance international refugee law and overriding values of humanity have prevailed."

    What happened to Rahaf Mohammed al-Qunun?
    She was on a trip to Kuwait with her family, when she fled on a flight to Bangkok.

    She said she intended to take a connecting flight to Australia - and had an Australian visa - but that her passport was seized by a Saudi diplomat when he met her coming off the flight at Suvarnabhumi airport, leaving her stranded.

    A Saudi envoy in Bangkok denied any official Saudi involvement in Ms Qunun's detention.

    Thai officials initially described her case as a "family problem" and said she would be repatriated back to Kuwait the next day.

    However, Ms Qunun sent a series of tweets pleading for help from her airport hotel room, and her case was picked up by Human Rights Watch and journalists.

    A number of countries, including Australia, have considered her case for asylum.
    'Threats to her life'

    Analysis by Jonathan Head, BBC south east Asia correspondent

    After days of speculation that she would move to Australia, Rahaf al-Qunun found herself on a flight in the opposite direction, to Canada. She was seen briefly, being escorted to the departure gate by UN officials.

    As her plane took off Police General Surachate Hakparn, the immigration chief whose change of heart on Monday allowed her temporary asylum in Thailand, told journalists she had left the country cheerful and grateful to those who looked after her here.

    Her father and brother, he said, who had come on what turned out to be a futile visit to try to persuade her to return to Saudi Arabia with them, would be leaving Thailand shortly after her.

    It is only two days since the Australian government announced that it had been approached to take Ms Qunun, and that it would treat her request sympathetically. The UN usually approaches only one country at a time to seek asylum.
    It is not clear why the Australian option fell through, and the UN switched to Canada. It might be that Australia's tough line towards refugees, and the insistence of its Home Affairs Minister Peter Dutton that she would get no special treatment, threatened to slow down the processing of her application.
    The UN was concerned about her safety, following online threats to her life, and Canada may have been able to process her resettlement more quickly.

    Why did she flee?

    Renunciation of Islam is punishable by death in Saudi Arabia.

    Under Saudi Arabia's "male guardianship system", a Saudi woman is required to obtain a male relative's approval to apply for a passport, travel outside the country, study abroad on a government scholarship, get married, leave prison, or even exit a shelter for abuse victims.

    Ms Qunun told the BBC: "I shared my story and my pictures on social media and my father is so angry because I did this... I can't study and work in my country, so I want to be free and study and work as I want."

    She also said she was afraid her family would kill her.

    Separately, she told AFP she had suffered physical and psychological abuse from her family, including being locked in her room for six months for cutting her hair.

    A spokesperson for her family told the BBC that they did not wish to comment and all they cared about was the young woman's safety.

    On Friday, Ms Qunun wrote on Twitter that she had "some good news and some bad news", before deleting her account. Her friends said she had received death threats online.

    Has anything like this happened before?

    Yes. Ms Qunun's case echoes that of another Saudi woman who was in transit to Australia in April 2017.

    Dina Ali Lasloom, 24, was en route from Kuwait via the Philippines but was taken back to Saudi Arabia from Manila airport by her family.

    She used a Canadian tourist's phone to send a message, a video of which was posted to Twitter, saying her family would kill her. Her fate on arriving back in Saudi Arabia remains unknown.
    'Rahaf is an inspiration'

    'Sara', a Saudi woman, spoke to BBC OS on the World Service on Wednesday

    Rahaf is an inspiration. But she's not the first one who did this and definitely not the last one.
    What we are going through is awful. We think about this every day because us women here do not know what it feels like to go out. We don't know what freedom tastes like.

    Dad keeps my passport with him all the time, we go to hotels and he puts it next to him when he sleeps.
    Unfortunately it's not a revolution. Every girl that is tweeting about this, it's either that she has already escaped or she's using a fake account like me. Some people tweeted me or DMed me to tell me to use my real account, for me to be brave.

    We do not want the guardianship any more. I want to go out of the house and drink coffee from Starbucks. I don't have to take my whole family. This is just way too harsh on us.
    Living this life is exhausting.

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-46844431

  16. #16
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    As usual the drama queen Trudeau comes in to rescue.

    Looks like Canada is the dumping ground for the world refugee problem.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gabbar Singh View Post
    Very similar to the Princess Latifa story. Unfortunately that time India bowed to the pressure from the UAE and sent the poor girl back home.

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/n...tifa-thvqjsjxt
    Did not know this. Shame on the Indian government!

  18. #18
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    Good on Trudeau. Her life expectancy would be very low if she goes back to Saudi going by her allegations.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by LongHorn View Post
    Thailand and Saudis have one of the longer diplomatic disputes in recent times.

    Its not a bad choice, I would have thought only Iran, Turkey and Canada would have been safer places for her

    Every single western country would happily have turned her in to please the Saudis
    Yes, Iran with its love for apostates.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gabbar Singh View Post
    Very similar to the Princess Latifa story. Unfortunately that time India bowed to the pressure from the UAE and sent the poor girl back home.

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/n...tifa-thvqjsjxt
    India is not a dumping ground for refugees. There is a reason India didnot sign the UN refugees convention.

    India did what was legal. She had entered India illegally with no Visa. She was deported to her home country.Thats the law.
    Last edited by cricketjoshila; 13th January 2019 at 08:31.

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by JaDed View Post
    Didn't know thanks for the news, @BJP supporters this is for you guys.
    If you enter a country illegally with no visa, what happens to you? Arent you deported back to your own country?

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by cricketjoshila View Post
    If you enter a country illegally with no visa, what happens to you? Arent you deported back to your own country?
    I'm sure Canada would had been happy to accept her..

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Salma_T View Post
    Her Aussie visitor visa has been cancelled. Let's hope it is reinstated but with Dutton in charge of immigration I doubt it.

    If she wants to renounce Islam it is her choice be it if she is confusing Saudi version as Islam but very easy to look on and comment as a male when you are not held to the same levels of adhering to Islam (I say this as a muslim)
    ]
    How many versions of Islam is there and how do you know who belongs to which version.

  24. #24
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    Rahaf al-Qunun: Saudi teen refugee arrives in Canada

    A Saudi teenager who fled her family alleging abuse and got stranded at a Bangkok airport has arrived in Canada after being granted asylum there.

    Rahaf Mohammed al-Qunun, 18, had been trying to reach Australia via Bangkok but was initially told to return to Kuwait, where her family were waiting.

    She refused to fly back and barricaded herself into her airport hotel room, attracting international attention.

    She also said she had renounced Islam, punishable by death in Saudi Arabia.

    Canada's Foreign Affairs Minister Chrystia Freeland introduced the teenager as "a very brave new Canadian" but said that Ms al-Qunun was tired from her ordeal and long journey and would not be making any public statement on Saturday.

    "She is a very brave young woman who has been through a lot... and she is now going to go to her new home," the minister added.

    Canadian Prime Minister Justin Trudeau earlier told reporters that his country had granted a request from the United Nations High Commissioner for Refugees to grant asylum.

    "Canada has been unequivocal that we will always stand up for human rights and women's rights around the world," he said.

    https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-46851723


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  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Salma_T View Post
    Her Aussie visitor visa has been cancelled. Let's hope it is reinstated but with Dutton in charge of immigration I doubt it.

    If she wants to renounce Islam it is her choice be it if she is confusing Saudi version as Islam but very easy to look on and comment as a male when you are not held to the same levels of adhering to Islam (I say this as a muslim)
    You are spreading fake news, she was granted a visa by Australia and it was never cancelled.

    She was granted this visa with Dutton in charge so that is more fake news you are spreading.

    I hate it when ignorant people spread lies for no reason.

  26. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by JaDed View Post
    I'm sure Canada would had been happy to accept her..
    Only because she's a royal, and therefore a celebrity. Otherwise there are millions of other women who may feel oppressed across the globe, is Canada going to invite them all to take up residence?

    Sorry but I agree wholeheartedly with joshila bhai on this one, India has upheld a principled stand, and on this matter I will applaud them.


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  27. #27
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    Great. Justin is gone in next elections.

  28. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cpt. Rishwat View Post
    Only because she's a royal, and therefore a celebrity. Otherwise there are millions of other women who may feel oppressed across the globe, is Canada going to invite them all to take up residence?

    Sorry but I agree wholeheartedly with joshila bhai on this one, India has upheld a principled stand, and on this matter I will applaud them.
    Don't think this one is a royal but Canada still accepted her.. I think you are underestimating the extent of Trudeau's liberal bias ,I feel he is extreme liberal ,he will end up creating someone much more extreme than Harper at this rate..but yet I think Canada would had accepted her.

    BJP did a mistake because they like to take a moral high stand on stuff.


    In cricket, my superhero is Sachin Tendulkar. He has always been my hero.
    -Virat Kohli

  29. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by JaDed View Post
    I'm sure Canada would had been happy to accept her..
    Canada is a signatory to the UN Refugees convention, India is not.

  30. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by JaDed View Post
    Don't think this one is a royal but Canada still accepted her.. I think you are underestimating the extent of Trudeau's liberal bias ,I feel he is extreme liberal ,he will end up creating someone much more extreme than Harper at this rate..but yet I think Canada would had accepted her.

    BJP did a mistake because they like to take a moral high stand on stuff.
    I note you didn't answer the critical question which was, if Canada is willing to give this girl refugee status on account of her celebrity, would they be prepared to offer permanent residency for the millions of other oppressed women of the world? If not, why not? What is special about this girl?


    I for one welcome our new In____ overlords - Kent Brockman

  31. #31
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    One more thing, I am not sure if this girl is royalty, but she is from a very wealthy family, and from images of her, you can see she is in decent health. In fact she was on a family trip to Kuwait when she ran away. I can think of many oppressed women in the subcontinent and Africa who would love to be able to take trips abroad and perhaps do a runner, but most of them would never be given the chance. In India they might even be killed before they were born for having the misfortune of not being born a male. Is Canada going to provide an open visa for all of them?


    I for one welcome our new In____ overlords - Kent Brockman

  32. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cpt. Rishwat View Post
    I note you didn't answer the critical question which was, if Canada is willing to give this girl refugee status on account of her celebrity, would they be prepared to offer permanent residency for the millions of other oppressed women of the world? If not, why not? What is special about this girl?
    Oh I didn't understand, probably not as the oppressed ones but the refugees for sure, also tbf to them they have given a lot of them asylum -Punjabi ,Lankan Tamil and now even Syrian ones, as well made an apology for some ship they rejected 100 years ago.


    In cricket, my superhero is Sachin Tendulkar. He has always been my hero.
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  33. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by JaDed View Post
    Oh I didn't understand, probably not as the oppressed ones but the refugees for sure, also tbf to them they have given a lot of them asylum -Punjabi ,Lankan Tamil and now even Syrian ones, as well made an apology for some ship they rejected 100 years ago.
    If this daughter of a wealthy Saudi can be given refugee status, because she wanted to be a lesbian or an atheist, what is to stop millions of other women in third world countries doing the same? If anything, I would say the only reason that this girl was even in a position to claim refugee status was because she was from a wealthy background and her father is an important official, thus she had access to travel, twitter and all means of luxury.

    The sad truth is, there are far more oppressed and suffering women in the third world who have no access to the dream of life in Canada who if anything are more deserving. Canada can't accommodate all of them so cases like this one are window dressing only.


    I for one welcome our new In____ overlords - Kent Brockman

  34. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cpt. Rishwat View Post
    The sad truth is, there are far more oppressed and suffering women in the third world who have no access to the dream of life in Canada who if anything are more deserving. Canada can't accommodate all of them so cases like this one are window dressing only.
    Quoted for truth. This is why I never indulge in philanthropy. Because what about the far more deserving others and also don't want to use charity as a facade to my true nature, which enjoys others misery.

  35. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by CricketCartoons View Post
    Quoted for truth. This is why I never indulge in philanthropy. Because what about the far more deserving others and also don't want to use charity as a facade to my true nature, which enjoys others misery.
    Could be that you are denying you indulge in philanthropy while doing it secretly, which is often described as the true form of charity as it is done for it's own sake rather than for self-glorification, like Mother Theresa. She cared for the faceless and voiceless masses, and though she never sought aggrandisement for her efforts, like Gandhi and Edhi, her works shone a light on the world.


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    So people, if you happen to vacation in Kuwait, Thailand, or any other country, you can post a video saying that you are being abused by your family. This will directly get you an asylum status in Canada.

    Imagine the message this thing sends. Absolutely pathetic. Canada's Freeland just want to score some point, doesn't realize this would backfire.

  37. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cpt. Rishwat View Post
    Only because she's a royal, and therefore a celebrity. Otherwise there are millions of other women who may feel oppressed across the globe, is Canada going to invite them all to take up residence?

    Sorry but I agree wholeheartedly with joshila bhai on this one, India has upheld a principled stand, and on this matter I will applaud them.
    She is not an economic immigrant. She is an Apostate and her life will be in danger if she goes back to Saudi Arabia.

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    Quote Originally Posted by troodon View Post
    She is not an economic immigrant. She is an Apostate and her life will be in danger if she goes back to Saudi Arabia.
    She has now publicly called on other women in her situation of oppression to follow her path. Should western nations be expected to follow Canada's lead and accommodate all of them if that should happen?


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    Lets not mske a hero out of her already! I want to know first why she believes her life was in danger?


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    Quote Originally Posted by Stewie View Post
    Lets not mske a hero out of her already! I want to know first why she believes her life was in danger?
    She claimed she no longer believed in god and was an atheist and did this on social media. This is a crime punishable by death in Saudi Arabia as I'm sure you know.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freedo...y_and_apostasy

    That's quite a good reason for her to believe her life was in danger and the UN refugee agency in Thailand, and Canadian government agree with her.


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    Canada going agter brownie points, Typical Trudeau

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    Quote Originally Posted by Adijazz1706 View Post
    Canada going agter brownie points, Typical Trudeau
    Trudeau and the pathetic Foreign Minister Chrstina Freeland. She is the sole reason why things went south with Saudi back in September. She needs to learn that Canada needs to mind its own business and not indulge in other country's internal issues.

    From what I hear, things are really bad for those Musliims who are going for Umrah and for Hajj. There is no Saudi consulate anymore and for Canadians, its not a free visa upon arrival. So there is a big question mark on how a pilgrim may enter the kingdom.

  43. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cpt. Rishwat View Post
    She has now publicly called on other women in her situation of oppression to follow her path. Should western nations be expected to follow Canada's lead and accommodate all of them if that should happen?
    Its up to the West to decide whether they all deserve the refugee status. In this case, Miss Rahaf is not some broke lazy bum who wants a free ride in the West.

    Why cannot Apostates follow the path of other economic migrants from North and Subsaharan Africa? At least they do not demand their way of life and riot in the streets.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ahmedzee View Post
    Trudeau and the pathetic Foreign Minister Chrstina Freeland. She is the sole reason why things went south with Saudi back in September. She needs to learn that Canada needs to mind its own business and not indulge in other country's internal issues.

    From what I hear, things are really bad for those Musliims who are going for Umrah and for Hajj. There is no Saudi consulate anymore and for Canadians, its not a free visa upon arrival. So there is a big question mark on how a pilgrim may enter the kingdom.
    Problem is most western nations wont be bullied by Saudi. Esp big rich nations like Canada. What canada did regarding those activists was undiplomatic,but Saudi response was over the top. Canada ofcourse wont cede its place. It doesnt really need to care about Saudis.

    Muslim population at 3% wont really dictate the foreign policy.

    If a conservative comes to power instead of Trudeau, it still wont change the foreign policy vis a vis Saudis.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cpt. Rishwat View Post
    Not necessarily. Australia was criticised a few years ago for having one of the toughest asylum policies in the world, and we are talking pre-Trump days. Didn't they hold all applicants on an island offshore to stop them getting in without stringent assessment?
    Thats illegal immigrants who come by boat. Most of these are men whose past are unknown. You cant just let random people roam freely in your country without a proper and thorough assessment.

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    Quote Originally Posted by troodon View Post
    Its up to the West to decide whether they all deserve the refugee status. In this case, Miss Rahaf is not some broke lazy bum who wants a free ride in the West.

    Why cannot Apostates follow the path of other economic migrants from North and Subsaharan Africa? At least they do not demand their way of life and riot in the streets.
    It's all well and good to say apostates should be allowed asylum, but you can surely see that it can only be done on a token basis otherwise everyone who fancied life in the first world would be claiming to be apostates. Do you think that India should open the door to Bangladeshis who renounce Islam? They didn't want to take in Rohingyas who were fleeing from Burma, but maybe it's because they didn't have twitter accounts.


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    Quote Originally Posted by humzy View Post
    Thats illegal immigrants who come by boat. Most of these are men whose past are unknown. You cant just let random people roam freely in your country without a proper and thorough assessment.
    Well I agree with the Aussie stance anyway, assuming they are consistent. There has been press about Iranian refugees leaving perfectly good jobs in Iran to try their luck in Europe, all claiming that they can't live a life they want in Iran and they would rather die at sea in the risky attempts to escape. There are millions of impoverished people in the third world who don't have enough money for food, never mind paying thousands of dollars to immigrant smuggling gangs.


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  48. #48
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    Another story today of a Saudi girl beaten up by her dad
    When will this stop
    Reforms are obviously not enough

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    Quote Originally Posted by cricketjoshila View Post
    Problem is most western nations wont be bullied by Saudi. Esp big rich nations like Canada. What canada did regarding those activists was undiplomatic,but Saudi response was over the top. Canada ofcourse wont cede its place. It doesnt really need to care about Saudis.

    Muslim population at 3% wont really dictate the foreign policy.

    If a conservative comes to power instead of Trudeau, it still wont change the foreign policy vis a vis Saudis.
    I Agree, Saudi response was over the top too.
    I believe conservatives traditionally have a good working relationship with the Saudis. It is bound to happen eventually this year. More of that comes when asked if they want to go with Saudis or Iran in their mideast policy agenda. So I am expecting this sour relationship with Saudi coming to an end this year with the change in Canadian Govt.

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    by all accounts Trudeau and Liberals will lose the next federal elections in Oct. 2019 unless something drastic happens

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gabbar Singh View Post
    She claimed she no longer believed in god and was an atheist and did this on social media. This is a crime punishable by death in Saudi Arabia as I'm sure you know.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freedo...y_and_apostasy

    That's quite a good reason for her to believe her life was in danger and the UN refugee agency in Thailand, and Canadian government agree with her.
    Any proof of these claims? She sounds like a smart girl.. knowing fully well the consequences of making her belief public, why did she do that?

    Something else is going on here. Sounds like she just wanted out of there and made this excuse up..


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    Quote Originally Posted by Stewie View Post
    Any proof of these claims? She sounds like a smart girl.. knowing fully well the consequences of making her belief public, why did she do that?

    Something else is going on here. Sounds like she just wanted out of there and made this excuse up..
    It is odd that she would publicly announce that she has renounced Islam knowing that she is putting a death sentence upon herself. A smart person would keep that to themselves, why would you endanger your own life when there is no possible benefit.

    There is other actions she did that are confusing, none of this would have happened if she did not try to visit Thailand for three days and just boarded her connecting flight to Australia. Why would you try to make a tourist visit when as she claims she was fleeing for her life. On two occasions she has taken steps to increase risks for no reason.

    She had already successfully applied for a tourist visa for Australia. The trio had urged her to swiftly transfer through the airport in Bangkok so she could arrive in Australia and apply for asylum as quickly as possible.

    However, Ms Alqunun was keen to savour her first experience of freedom away from her family and country, even if just for a few days. So she tried to pass through the border and enter Thailand.

    She felt safe to do so because she believed there was no Saudi embassy in Bangkok, which is not the case.

    “We friends said ‘no, you cannot stay. It’s too dangerous’,” Shahad, a 19-year-old Saudi woman now based in Sweden after escaping her own family two years ago, told The Australian.

    “We bought her a ticket to Australia from Thailand but she didn’t listen to us.”

    When she handed over her passport, immigration officials eventually told she would be sent back to home as her father was “very angry”.

    Had Ms Alqunun got straight on to her next plane at Bangkok there was a chance she would not have even come to the attention of the Thai authorities.
    https://www.news.com.au/world/asia/m...35bf13fd705b1b

  53. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by srh View Post
    by all accounts Trudeau and Liberals will lose the next federal elections in Oct. 2019 unless something drastic happens
    really? I thought he was leading the polls.


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    Quote Originally Posted by ahmedzee View Post
    Trudeau and the pathetic Foreign Minister Chrstina Freeland. She is the sole reason why things went south with Saudi back in September. She needs to learn that Canada needs to mind its own business and not indulge in other country's internal issues.

    From what I hear, things are really bad for those Musliims who are going for Umrah and for Hajj. There is no Saudi consulate anymore and for Canadians, its not a free visa upon arrival. So there is a big question mark on how a pilgrim may enter the kingdom.
    I think as Muslims and pilgrims we should make the morally right decision of boycotting the state of Saudi Arabia, if the holy cities happen to be in enemy hands then there must be some Islamic ruling that makes Muslims exempt from visiting that country. Ideally Mecca and Medina should be independent city-states like the vatican and managed by a global muslim fund.


    "i'M sOrRy, i'M nOt sUpPosED tO teLl yoU tHiS"

  55. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gilly View Post
    It is odd that she would publicly announce that she has renounced Islam knowing that she is putting a death sentence upon herself. A smart person would keep that to themselves, why would you endanger your own life when there is no possible benefit.

    There is other actions she did that are confusing, none of this would have happened if she did not try to visit Thailand for three days and just boarded her connecting flight to Australia. Why would you try to make a tourist visit when as she claims she was fleeing for her life. On two occasions she has taken steps to increase risks for no reason.
    Glad i aint the only one who thinks this whole thing is fishy


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    Quote Originally Posted by Pakistanian View Post
    I think as Muslims and pilgrims we should make the morally right decision of boycotting the state of Saudi Arabia, if the holy cities happen to be in enemy hands then there must be some Islamic ruling that makes Muslims exempt from visiting that country. Ideally Mecca and Medina should be independent city-states like the vatican and managed by a global muslim fund.
    That would be the day...

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    Saudis alone are responsible for a lot of the ills plaguing muslim countries right now. To sustain their extremist wahhabi ways, they fund a lot of madrasas in sunni countries to promote their ideology so ordinaryjaahil citizens of those muslim countries have nothing but reverence for them.

    The truth is all muslims of the world should stand against the extremist tyrranical rule of saudis. The royal family has looted and raped the land of our Holy Prophet and are in bed with the West. When they run out of oil, the West will dump them like a bag of spoiled meat. The power and money they have can be used to spread prosperity and peace in the middle east but prosperity elsewhere will hit their bottom dollar, so why would they do it?


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    Quote Originally Posted by Cpt. Rishwat View Post
    Well I agree with the Aussie stance anyway, assuming they are consistent. There has been press about Iranian refugees leaving perfectly good jobs in Iran to try their luck in Europe, all claiming that they can't live a life they want in Iran and they would rather die at sea in the risky attempts to escape. There are millions of impoverished people in the third world who don't have enough money for food, never mind paying thousands of dollars to immigrant smuggling gangs.
    There has been an influx of Iranians illegal immigrants in Australia in the last few years too. Most of them seem like middle class people back home but they come here by boat risking their lives, throw their passports away and try their luck with a made up story of oppression.

  59. #59
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    Looks like more and more Saudis are going to be trying this method now to escape the country.


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    As expected, Nautanki will continue

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    Quote Originally Posted by Adijazz1706 View Post
    As expected, Nautanki will continue
    Why is it nautanki? Do they have a chance to do something similar in Saudi?


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    Quote Originally Posted by Gabbar Singh View Post
    Very similar to the Princess Latifa story. Unfortunately that time India bowed to the pressure from the UAE and sent the poor girl back home.

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/n...tifa-thvqjsjxt
    OMG never heard of this before. Poor girl!!

  63. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gabbar Singh View Post
    Looks like more and more Saudis are going to be trying this method now to escape the country.

    Why are Saudi women running away from the great Arabia lands? Leaving all the money and riches back home.

    Looks like Saudi women are valuing freedom of choice more than money.

    Recently saw a video on YouTube. There are thousands of closet atheists in Arabic lands who are scared to openly come out.

  64. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by Adijazz1706 View Post
    As expected, Nautanki will continue
    What choice do atheists have in Arabia or any Islamic country? Their lives are at risk there.

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    The two sisters mentioned a few posts up managed to successfully claim asylum.



    Another two sisters have tried a similar thing and have ended up in Georgia of all places.




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    ^ These women are running away from riches to gain freedom. Just shows money is not everything.

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    Quote Originally Posted by troodon View Post
    ^ These women are running away from riches to gain freedom. Just shows money is not everything.
    A lot more women run away from India and Pakistan to become economic migrants so don't knock financial importance.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Cpt. Rishwat View Post
    A lot more women run away from India and Pakistan to become economic migrants so don't knock financial importance.
    Men from Subcontinent runt to west for financial gain. You don't see women running away. May be in the past. Not now.

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    Quote Originally Posted by troodon View Post
    Men from Subcontinent runt to west for financial gain. You don't see women running away. May be in the past. Not now.
    Come off it. I've seen Indian women marrying old men twice their age to get British passport.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Cpt. Rishwat View Post
    Come off it. I've seen Indian women marrying old men twice their age to get British passport.
    These women are deliberately choosing freedom over financial stability, what you are describing doesn't really affect their freedom so much but gives them financial stability.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jagatk View Post
    These women are deliberately choosing freedom over financial stability, what you are describing doesn't really affect their freedom so much but gives them financial stability.
    Which proves my point, money has it's value just like freedom does. The Saudi girls will get both, they will be supported by both their new home and their stories will make them plenty of money. The subcontinent women will trading a compatible partner for a better lifestyle and financial stability. Everything's a trade off.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Cpt. Rishwat View Post
    Which proves my point, money has it's value just like freedom does. The Saudi girls will get both, they will be supported by both their new home and their stories will make them plenty of money. The subcontinent women will trading a compatible partner for a better lifestyle and financial stability. Everything's a trade off.
    Bro, you seemed to me to be a very rational poster before, but now you seem to have taken a more extreme turn. Am I right in thinking that you're angry that Rahaf got asylum? She obviously would have been in a world of trouble if she returned to Saudi as an apostate. And don't give me the whole 'she should have kept it secret', freedom is very important to people, and she deserves to live how she wants.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jagatk View Post
    These women are deliberately choosing freedom over financial stability, what you are describing doesn't really affect their freedom so much but gives them financial stability.
    If they are picking freedom over financial stability then why dont they run away to 3rd world countries? They might even get the asylum quicker there.

    Secondly, from a sociological point of view, in every society there are people like these who try to rebel against the general norms. Its not something unusual or unheard of. However it depends on how much coverage you want to give it. At such a stage, the society needs to ask itself whether the problem is widespread enough to make some changes. If it is not, then ask whether it will become widespread in future. Take anticipatory measures accordingly.

  74. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by Madplayer View Post
    If they are picking freedom over financial stability then why dont they run away to 3rd world countries? They might even get the asylum quicker there.

    Secondly, from a sociological point of view, in every society there are people like these who try to rebel against the general norms. Its not something unusual or unheard of. However it depends on how much coverage you want to give it. At such a stage, the society needs to ask itself whether the problem is widespread enough to make some changes. If it is not, then ask whether it will become widespread in future. Take anticipatory measures accordingly.
    For your first point, there is a lot more freedom in the West, generally.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tubs View Post
    Bro, you seemed to me to be a very rational poster before, but now you seem to have taken a more extreme turn. Am I right in thinking that you're angry that Rahaf got asylum? She obviously would have been in a world of trouble if she returned to Saudi as an apostate. And don't give me the whole 'she should have kept it secret', freedom is very important to people, and she deserves to live how she wants.
    Why would I be angry about someone I don't know from Adam? I was making some observations about this case to answer posts from others. If there is a particular point I made that you don't agree with you can just say so. None of what you say here is really relevant to the points I made.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Cpt. Rishwat View Post
    Why would I be angry about someone I don't know from Adam? I was making some observations about this case to answer posts from others. If there is a particular point I made that you don't agree with you can just say so. None of what you say here is really relevant to the points I made.
    Throughout this thread you just seemed to dislike that she received asylum in Canada. Living a restrictive life isn't a good existence, and we all know what happens to atheists in Saudi. I understand that she got lucky, and she is more privileged than most, but I just get a vibe that you really are against he getting asylum in Canada. I don't think you'd rather she go back to Saudi and be executed, so what would the alternative be? Keeping her atheism to herself?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tubs View Post
    Throughout this thread you just seemed to dislike that she received asylum in Canada. Living a restrictive life isn't a good existence, and we all know what happens to atheists in Saudi. I understand that she got lucky, and she is more privileged than most, but I just get a vibe that you really are against he getting asylum in Canada. I don't think you'd rather she go back to Saudi and be executed, so what would the alternative be? Keeping her atheism to herself?
    I think I said somewhere further up in the thread that if all the women in Saudi or any other Islamic countries started claiming they were atheists or lesbians and were therefore in danger of being persecuted, would Canada or Australia offer an open door policy to all? If it's a moral argument then they should. Taking in one, that too someone from a priveleged background, doesn't really mean anything other than a point scoring exercise on forums like this. Otherwise why are we even discussing it?


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    Quote Originally Posted by Cpt. Rishwat View Post
    I think I said somewhere further up in the thread that if all the women in Saudi or any other Islamic countries started claiming they were atheists or lesbians and were therefore in danger of being persecuted, would Canada or Australia offer an open door policy to all? If it's a moral argument then they should. Taking in one, that too someone from a priveleged background, doesn't really mean anything other than a point scoring exercise on forums like this. Otherwise why are we even discussing it?
    That's a different issue, the fact that you're saying it on a post about Rahaf just suggested to me that you'd rather her not have gotten asylum. Sorry if I misinterpreted.

  79. #79
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tubs View Post
    That's a different issue, the fact that you're saying it on a post about Rahaf just suggested to me that you'd rather her not have gotten asylum. Sorry if I misinterpreted.
    Don't know how it's a different issue, it's exactly the issue, whether I would be raging incandescently or dancing a Hawaiian hula...now that would be beside the issue.

    Actually now I think on it I was guilty of sexism in my previous post when I referred to women in Saudi only. Of course if 50% of the men in Arab countries also claimed to be atheists or homosexuals, they should also have a right (morally) to claim asylum in western countries if we follow that logic.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Tubs View Post
    For your first point, there is a lot more freedom in the West, generally.
    They can get the same freedoms in India or any third world Latin American country. Lets not beat around the bush. Just admit that they arent sacrificing financial stability for freedom. They take conscious, well planned decisions and pick the specific countries they want to go to.


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