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  1. #1
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    "I had the same pace and vigour at Mohammad Hasnain's age" : Waqar Younis

    Waqar said he sees himself in Hasnain.

    “Yes, I had the same pace and vigour at this age. He is very talented, and has pace, bounce and the determination. I have told him not to lose his pace, which is his strong point.

    “What I have noticed is that apart from Shoaib Akhtar, all other pacers lost their pace after starting at 140-150kph, so Hasnain needs to take note of that,” said Waqar.

    Waqar hopes Hasnain works hard to get his action smoother.

    “He is a bit rough in his action and I had that same problem and once that is sorted, he will not have to put a lot of effort. I mean his run-up is a bit laborious, but once he manages it, he will be more effective.

    “I wish him the best of luck.”
    Last edited by MenInG; 13th March 2019 at 18:37.


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  2. #2
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    Waqar is spot on, the key is not to lose that raw pace which he already has.

  3. #3
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    Why doesn't Waqar himself elaborate on why these bowlers are losing pace? And who is he to talk, he lost pace far too early in his career while Steyn has been clocking 145 km/hr plus his whole career

  4. #4
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    There should be no question about waqar younis credentials as a bowling coach .He is pretty much spot on about husnain

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Savak View Post
    Why doesn't Waqar himself elaborate on why these bowlers are losing pace? And who is he to talk, he lost pace far too early in his career while Steyn has been clocking 145 km/hr plus his whole career
    Don't understand your grudge against Waqar. Now basically you are questioning Waqar's credentials as bowler too.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by natkhat-shahzada View Post
    Don't understand your grudge against Waqar. Now basically you are questioning Waqar's credentials as bowler too.
    Not as a bowler but he should be the last one to lecture someone on losing pace given that it happened to him early on in his career compared to others

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Savak View Post
    Why doesn't Waqar himself elaborate on why these bowlers are losing pace? And who is he to talk, he lost pace far too early in his career while Steyn has been clocking 145 km/hr plus his whole career
    Many people think, with good reason, that Waqar is a few years older than his stated age so him losing pace late in his career isn't that unexpected.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gabbar Singh View Post
    Many people think, with good reason, that Waqar is a few years older than his stated age so him losing pace late in his career isn't that unexpected.
    Also, Waqar suffered an almost career ending back injury in early 90s.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Savak View Post
    Not as a bowler but he should be the last one to lecture someone on losing pace given that it happened to him early on in his career compared to others
    Injuries were the main reason. Bishop and him got back injuries but Waqar still made a comeback from that. Looked what happened with other bowlers who suffered injuries and how their career went after come backs.

    Plus, Waqar was still a fast bowler after his 1st injury. He had the pace till 1995 atleast. I think it was after 1997/98 that he lost his real pace but then he was still operating in early 140s if I am not wrong & was successful.

    And Waqar might be raising the concerns because of his own experience. He mentioned Shoaib didn't decrease his speed but he didn't play consistently and got down in middle of some series.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Savak View Post
    Why doesn't Waqar himself elaborate on why these bowlers are losing pace? And who is he to talk, he lost pace far too early in his career while Steyn has been clocking 145 km/hr plus his whole career
    It’s a miracle that Waqar was bowling bro begin with after his back to back career threatening injuries in early 1990s

  11. #11
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    Craziest thing is Husnain was not even the one that was being talked about the most, it was Nasim Shah who was supposed to be the new fast bowling prodigy of Pakistan. Will be exciting watching both of these bowl next year in the PSL.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by WhenSultansBowled View Post
    Also, Waqar suffered an almost career ending back injury in early 90s.
    Exactly. Yet he was bowling fast after that injury. It was the 2nd back injury that forced him to reduce the pace. He and Bishop had the career ending back injury at same time. Both missed 1992 World Cup for that reason. Waqar still managed to make a good come back after that 1st injury.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Savak View Post
    Why doesn't Waqar himself elaborate on why these bowlers are losing pace? And who is he to talk, he lost pace far too early in his career while Steyn has been clocking 145 km/hr plus his whole career
    Waqar had a very serious stress fracture in his back just before the 92 WC and he lost close to 5mph on average because of it. I would go as far as to say that he was never the same bowler again.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Slog View Post
    It’s a miracle that Waqar was bowling bro begin with after his back to back career threatening injuries in early 1990s
    Waqar before the injury was a freak of nature.

  15. #15
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    Lol, Waqar's pace is over rated. Even before the back injury before the 1992 WC, he was never consistently the 150 km/hr plus merchant he was propagated to be. Sure maybe that effort ball could be 150 km/hr plus but he was on average 140-145 km/hr.

  16. #16
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    And the reasons for Waqar losing pace was playing each and every useless Jamodi ODI, test match, every match of every county season from 1990 to 1997.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Savak View Post
    And the reasons for Waqar losing pace was playing each and every useless Jamodi ODI, test match, every match of every county season from 1990 to 1997.
    With each post you just show your cricketing knowledge... from backing Shinwari to expecting bowlers to clock over 150 every ball.


    Fun fact even express pacers like Lee and Akhtar usually hung around the 145kph mark with the ability to crank it up to 150+ once or twice in a spell.


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  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Savak View Post
    Why doesn't Waqar himself elaborate on why these bowlers are losing pace? And who is he to talk, he lost pace far too early in his career while Steyn has been clocking 145 km/hr plus his whole career
    Waqar's back gave out.

    He was extremely hard-working but you can only go as far as your body allows. Similar to Mohammad Zahid.


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  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by kingusama92 View Post
    Waqar's back gave out.

    He was extremely hard-working but you can only go as far as your body allows. Similar to Mohammad Zahid.
    To be honest it was poor work load management, he could have preserved his peak for longer had he not burnt himself out playing each and every useless Jamodi ODI, Test match, County Season.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Syed1 View Post
    With each post you just show your cricketing knowledge... from backing Shinwari to expecting bowlers to clock over 150 every ball.


    Fun fact even express pacers like Lee and Akhtar usually hung around the 145kph mark with the ability to crank it up to 150+ once or twice in a spell.
    Akhtar and Lee on average would operate at 145-148 km/hr and crank it up at 153-155 km/hr. Waqar was not even close, would average 140-145 km/hr and then reach 150 km/hr with the old ball in his prime. You dont even see him hurrying the batsmen on the back foot or front foot from 1989-1992.

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Savak View Post
    To be honest it was poor work load management, he could have preserved his peak for longer had he not burnt himself out playing each and every useless Jamodi ODI, Test match, County Season.
    At that stage of his career he hadnt played that much, he had one full county season and part county season in 1990. He was bowling too quick for his body to sustain

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Savak View Post
    Not as a bowler but he should be the last one to lecture someone on losing pace given that it happened to him early on in his career compared to others
    Please let us know if you know someone in your mohallah better qualified to lecture a rookie fast bowler.

  23. #23
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    @Savak grudge against Waqar is disturbing. Did he run your cat over?

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Savak View Post
    Akhtar and Lee on average would operate at 145-148 km/hr and crank it up at 153-155 km/hr. Waqar was not even close, would average 140-145 km/hr and then reach 150 km/hr with the old ball in his prime. You dont even see him hurrying the batsmen on the back foot or front foot from 1989-1992.
    Of course, you have more knowledge than the ones who actually faced him, oh wise one.

  25. #25
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    I would want Hasnain to bowl around 145-155ks and avg 30 with the ball in tests and ODIs than him to bowl 137-145k and avg 23, it's along time Pak now that men in green has unearthed genuine pacer.

  26. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Savak View Post
    Lol, Waqar's pace is over rated. Even before the back injury before the 1992 WC, he was never consistently the 150 km/hr plus merchant he was propagated to be. Sure maybe that effort ball could be 150 km/hr plus but he was on average 140-145 km/hr.
    Overated?? erm did you ever watch him either live or on TV when he first broke onto the scene? probably not..I saw his first test match against India and he was fast..raw but fast..then his series against teh kiwis where he had increased his pace. He was seriously quick. I would say just shy of 150km/h..

    but it was the late late movement at high speed that really got everyone..and it wasnt obvious at first...but as he got stronger that late movement was deadly..better than anyone in the current modern game..there isnt anyone who can do that currently..

  27. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by the Great Khan View Post
    Overated?? erm did you ever watch him either live or on TV when he first broke onto the scene? probably not..I saw his first test match against India and he was fast..raw but fast..then his series against teh kiwis where he had increased his pace. He was seriously quick. I would say just shy of 150km/h..

    but it was the late late movement at high speed that really got everyone..and it wasnt obvious at first...but as he got stronger that late movement was deadly..better than anyone in the current modern game..there isnt anyone who can do that currently..
    I would say that no bowler in history can match prime waqar deadly bowling, it's another case whether he was aided by bottle caps or not but no one has ever bowled like him yet.

  28. #28
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    by the way when waqar first came onto the scene I see his pace the same as akhters in that calcutta test..they were about the same..but waqar bowled a more fuller length and didnt hit the deck like Lee or akhter..he was full and would move that ball like a boomerang..

  29. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Savak View Post
    Lol, Waqar's pace is over rated. Even before the back injury before the 1992 WC, he was never consistently the 150 km/hr plus merchant he was propagated to be. Sure maybe that effort ball could be 150 km/hr plus but he was on average 140-145 km/hr.
    You're obviously a Waqar hater, and holds very deep grudges.

    Which you can't let go of.

  30. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by the Great Khan View Post
    Overated?? erm did you ever watch him either live or on TV when he first broke onto the scene? probably not..I saw his first test match against India and he was fast..raw but fast..then his series against teh kiwis where he had increased his pace. He was seriously quick. I would say just shy of 150km/h..

    but it was the late late movement at high speed that really got everyone..and it wasnt obvious at first...but as he got stronger that late movement was deadly..better than anyone in the current modern game..there isnt anyone who can do that currently..
    I remember he hurt 1 Kiwi batsman, forgot the batsman's name, it was scary, batsmen were genuinely scared of his bowling

  31. #31
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    Certainly bowling some waqar like reverse swingers today. Best he has bowled so far


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  32. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hawkeye View Post
    You're obviously a Waqar hater, and holds very deep grudges.

    Which you can't let go of.
    Waqar was 145-150kph but I dont think he ever was Shoaib Akhtar/Tait/Lee level express

    His big swing made him look faster than he was a bit like Dale steyn


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  33. #33
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    Let’s just let him develop and not put him under too much pressure. I think he needs to play more first class cricket to improve. Don’t want him to play too many T20s at the moment.

  34. #34
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    The sad thing is that batsmen now days aren't afraid of pace may be due to T20s or extra protective gears or just the mind set so now it's highly unlikely that we are gonna see batsmen jumping ducking swaying or doing just plain stupid stuff even against 155ks

  35. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by hur rizvi View Post
    Waqar was 145-150kph but I dont think he ever was Shoaib Akhtar/Tait/Lee level express

    His big swing made him look faster than he was a bit like Dale steyn
    Waqar at his pomp was consistently close to 150 I would say and quite possible his fastest would have touched over 155, but thats like the bar anyway. Tait, Shoaib, Lee, Bond, etc we’re also in that range. You just have to watch Waqar at his pomp.. it was his pace as well as swing. He was a speed demon..

  36. #36
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    I don't think Waqar has bowled anything over 153k at max he was Tymil Mills pace but those late swinging Yorkers would be enough even for the best of the best, if you have noticed Waqar bouncers or short pitch stuff even in his prime wasn't that effective and he used that to surprise the batsmen and set him up for a boomerang Yorker rather than going Lockie Fergusan way of getting them top edged it

  37. #37
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    @Savak's grudge against Waqar is disturbing


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  38. #38
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    Naseem Shah will be the best bowler in pakistan within 1 year, he bowls on average close to 145kph but also has the ability to swing both ways and with good control.

    The future is bright with Hassan Ali, M Hasnain, Shaheen Afridi and Naseem Shah.

    M Musa and Haris Rauf are good backup options but need a lot of work on their bowling with more first class experience they should come good as backup options.

  39. #39
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    Lol at the Waqar grudge and hating comments. Waqar was not consistently as Express at Lee and Shoaib. I wonder if he would have enjoyed the same success had he been playing in the present era where Batsmen are more well versed on how to deal with reverse swing.

  40. #40
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    I don’t compare players from different eras .. but Waqar was a giant of his time and a legend of cricket history. His stats speak for themselves but more than his stats, you have to watch his bowling.. and tell me you don’t get entertained or get goosebumps.. the dude was pure fire!


  41. #41
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    Waqar was lightening quick between 1989 and 1991..
    Fortunate to have seen bowl live during that period both for Surrey and Pakistan...
    He was freakishly quick and batsmen would fear facing him...

    Savak, please don’t try and alter history..

  42. #42
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    The problem is the amount of cricket these days and the dollars of T20 leagues.

    We see young pacers clocking over 145kph at the start of their career and then they start reducing their pace and conserving their energy to ensure they can play in T20 leagues and bowling fast and for their country becomes an afterthought.



  43. #43
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    Speaking of Waqar though, I saw him live in 1991 at Sharjah at a tri-series between Pakistan, India and West Indies.

    Even on those dead wickets he was remarkably fast and quicker than even the likes of Ian Bishop in that series.

    The guy was a freak of a bowler, a legend, an all-time great.



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    Waqar like many of his generation had a backwards mindset. There was no concept of sports science, recovery periods or rotation policy, so he bowled himself into the ground and didn't look after his body.

    By the late 1990s and early 2000s he reinvented himself as a traditional line and length seamer.

  45. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by IMMY69 View Post
    Waqar was lightening quick between 1989 and 1991..
    Fortunate to have seen bowl live during that period both for Surrey and Pakistan...
    He was freakishly quick and batsmen would fear facing him...

    Savak, please don’t try and alter history..
    Speed guns or just hype and talk.

  46. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by Saj View Post
    Speaking of Waqar though, I saw him live in 1991 at Sharjah at a tri-series between Pakistan, India and West Indies.

    Even on those dead wickets he was remarkably fast and quicker than even the likes of Ian Bishop in that series.

    The guy was a freak of a bowler, a legend, an all-time great.
    PCB needs to look after its pacers just like the way the Australians and South African's do. We are fortunate to have alternative pace options. A method needs to be devised to ensure that the pacers don't play each and every game, get rest but whenever they play for Pakistan, they run in and bowl at 90 mph plus at all times.

    Bowling and sticking to 78-82 mph for 65% of the times in test matches helps no one.

  47. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by Saj View Post
    The problem is the amount of cricket these days and the dollars of T20 leagues.

    We see young pacers clocking over 145kph at the start of their career and then they start reducing their pace and conserving their energy to ensure they can play in T20 leagues and bowling fast and for their country becomes an afterthought.
    Can you give some examples?

  48. #48
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    Some players need to be distinguished.

    Sachin and Waqar the “cricketers” can be viewed different from Sachin and Waqar the “men”.

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    I cant wait to see him bowl in tests

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    Quote Originally Posted by Stewie View Post
    Waqar at his pomp was consistently close to 150 I would say and quite possible his fastest would have touched over 155, but thats like the bar anyway. Tait, Shoaib, Lee, Bond, etc we’re also in that range. You just have to watch Waqar at his pomp.. it was his pace as well as swing. He was a speed demon..
    I know Waqar was quick but Lee/TAit and Akhtar had more pace. Waqar had huge banana inswingers though which would make his 145-150kph tougher to face than Lee/Tait and Akhtar's lack of that quality albeit faster at 150-155 kph


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    I remember Waqar was clocked on the speed gun at 150 kph in 1992/93 but that was after stress fracture. He had already lost a bit of pace by then.

  52. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by gazza619 View Post
    I cant wait to see him bowl in tests
    Doubt he has the stamina for Tests right now.

    Action also a bit hard on the body.

  53. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by Savak View Post
    Speed guns or just hype and talk.
    Hype and talk?
    How about facing him and Wasim in 1992
    and playing against a few other top bowlers of that era...

  54. #54
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    Waqar'ed is the term i remember hearing from the commentaitors and seeing in the news papers sports sections

  55. #55
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    May 2014
    Venue
    Lahore, Pakistan
    Runs
    5,033
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    906 Post(s)
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    13 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by Savak View Post
    To be honest it was poor work load management, he could have preserved his peak for longer had he not burnt himself out playing each and every useless Jamodi ODI, Test match, County Season.
    @Savak, I love you, bro but please stop saying Jamodi ODI again and again.

    JAMODI is an acronym for Just Another Meaningless One Day International. You know that, of course (I hope!), yet your insistence in saying Just Another Meaningless One day international one day international again and again is really bothering me.

    I'm sorry for going completely off track but somebody had to take one for the team.

  56. #56
    Debut
    Feb 2019
    Runs
    125
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    4 Post(s)
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    Quote Originally Posted by Savak View Post
    Not as a bowler but he should be the last one to lecture someone on losing pace given that it happened to him early on in his career compared to others
    Waqar had a stress fracture of the back early in his career, an injury most athlete don't recover from. Prior to that injury he was the most devastating bowler in the history of cricket.

    He lost pace because he had to adjust his action and didn't bend his back as much due to fear of re-injuring his back.

    Lastly Pakistani player are all at least 5 years older then their real age. So when Waqar was toiling in his early to mid thirties he was actually in his late thirties if not early forties

  57. #57
    Debut
    May 2016
    Runs
    9,842
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    468 Post(s)
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    @Savak Waqar clocked 153ks against SA on a random ball after his back injury. It was after his second back injury in 94, his pace dropped to 140s, then slowly declining from thereon.

    However, you are right about the reasons for his injuries. He played in way too many useless county and practice games. He recently admitted that this was probably the reason for his injuries. They had no idea about rest and taking care of their bodies back then, especially for express pacers.


    A skilled hawk conceals its talons.


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