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  1. #161
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    Shameless Indians have the cheek to still defending and justify the atrocities here.

  2. #162
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    Quote Originally Posted by Local.Dada View Post
    There is nothing subjective when it comes to a person or a group of people blowing up buildings or bombing innocent civilians or brainwashing young kids into picking up arms.

    Maybe I don’t think this is one of those situations to empathize or sympathize with anyone’s viewpoint
    Kashmiri militants don't operate the way al-Qaeda or IS members do. When was the last time militants from Kashmir were responsible for bombings of civilians in India?

    As far as brainwashing young kids into picking up arms is concerned: Have you even informed yourself when and what motivated the recently killed militant leader Riyaz Naikoo to pick up arms? Or do you prefer taking comfort in shutting off all your senses and blindly repeat the same old line?

    Naikoo taught at the school till 2010-11, often giving free tuitions to several students in his village.

    In 2010, Tufail Ahmad Mattoo was killed when a tear gas shell—fired by policemen to quell a protest against the fake encounter of three civilians in Machil—struck him as he played cricket in Srinagar's Gani memorial stadium.

    Mattoo's death triggered a fresh cycle of unrest; scores of youth were arrested by the police and Naikoo was one of them. When he was released from prison in 2012, something had changed inside the young maths teacher.

    That summer, Naikoo asked his father for Rs 7,000 to apply for admission in a post-graduate university in Bhopal. On 21 May 2012, Asadullah recalled, the family brought home a chicken for dinner and left for evening prayers.

    "Following the prayers I couldn't spot him," Asadullah said. "I thought he must have gone to meet his cousins but he didn't return."

    The family tried to call him, but his phone was switched off.

    On 6 June, the police told Asadullah his son had joined the Hizbul Mujahideen.
    https://www.huffingtonpost.in/2018/1...ef_a_23548311/

    It's considered treason in India to mention bitter facts like how Kashmiri youth who are arrested and then later released from Indian prisons are not the same anymore.

    How come Indian state can neither curb nor counter the militant propaganda, despite having superior propaganda capabilities and media resources?

    Besides, are those young men who strive to join their countries armed forces also brainwashed into picking up arms?

    As far as blowing up buildings is concerned:



    On today's encounter, Indian media is chest thumping about how 40KG of explosive material was used to blow up the building.










  3. #163
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    Quote Originally Posted by Local.Dada View Post
    As a British Citizen if you are cheerleading for someone identified as a terrorist or a terrorist group by your government either you think your government is wrong which obviously make them the bad guys for wrongly “accusing” someone or make you a “sympathizer”. I believe that was was the context.

    No formalities but you are welcome anyways
    But no one was cheerleading for someone identified by the British govt as a terrorist group, that is the point I am making. But feel free to provide a quote if I am wrong.


    I for one welcome our new In____ overlords - Kent Brockman

  4. #164
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sirris View Post
    Kashmiri militants don't operate the way al-Qaeda or IS members do. When was the last time militants from Kashmir were responsible for bombings of civilians in India?

    As far as brainwashing young kids into picking up arms is concerned: Have you even informed yourself when and what motivated the recently killed militant leader Riyaz Naikoo to pick up arms? Or do you prefer taking comfort in shutting off all your senses and blindly repeat the same old line?



    It's considered treason in India to mention bitter facts like how Kashmiri youth who are arrested and then later released from Indian prisons are not the same anymore.

    How come Indian state can neither curb nor counter the militant propaganda, despite having superior propaganda capabilities and media resources?

    Besides, are those young men who strive to join their countries armed forces also brainwashed into picking up arms?

    As far as blowing up buildings is concerned:




    Kashmiri militants don't operate the way al-Qaeda or IS members do. When was the last time militants from Kashmir were responsible for bombings of civilians in India?

    As far as brainwashing young kids into picking up arms is concerned: Have you even informed yourself when and what motivated the recently killed militant leader Riyaz Naikoo to pick up arms? Or do you prefer taking comfort in shutting off all your senses and blindly repeat the same old line?





    It's considered treason in India to mention bitter facts like how Kashmiri youth who are arrested and then later released from Indian prisons are not the same anymore.

    How come Indian state can neither curb nor counter the militant propaganda, despite having superior propaganda capabilities and media resources?

    Besides, are those young men who strive to join their countries armed forces also brainwashed into picking up arms?

    As far as blowing up buildings is concerned:


    On today's encounter, Indian media is chest thumping about how 40KG of explosive material was used to blow up the building.

    Ok let me ask you this, the other part of Kashmir which is called Azad Kashmir or as Indians call it Pak occupied Kashmir, they have been "Azad" for 70+ years now right? what exactly have they accomplished in this time frame? Have they produced any outstanding positive influencers like artists,athletes, scientists,economists,entrepreneurs? Don't give me the oh so and so has Kashmiri origin or ancestors but give me names of people who were born and raised and brought up all their lives in Azad Kashmir who went on to be great representatives of their "Azad Country"? Forget education and other credentials, were they at least able to take advantage of tourism in an area that is considered one of the most beautiful places on earth.

    Terrorist or Freedom fighter or whatever at least in the so called Indian occupied Kashmir there is an actual excuse of religious fundamentalists helping the cause, what is Azad Kashmir's excuse? I don't think RSS is causing any trouble in Azad Kashmir, if you heard anything let me know.

    Now coming to India's stance, India is a very diverse country, there are unique standalone traditions, languages and cultures sometimes within the same state. Hindus, Muslims and other religions live here, no one has ever asked for independence. Now don't tell me they are bound by religion because they are Hindu majority because by the same account East Bengalis couldn't co exist with Pakistan despite religion.

    So why do Kashmiris want to self-govern and always play the "islamic demographic" card? is it a independence movement or a religious crusade? If it is a religious crusade then a secular country like India is not going to let that happen as it is a violation of India's core secular values.

    Now coming to this so called Math teacher, My parents or my teachers/mentors have always told me to stand up for what is right but they never told me to throw stones on police or pick up arms and join a crusade. I am sure most of us on here have either got or given a similar advice to our kids. If I feel oppressed, I am not going to tell my child to pick up arms and throw stones, I am going to ask them to study, be good at whatever they do and positively influence the world, I have no problem generalizing by saying 99% of PP would say the same thing to their kids.

    Now this so called math teacher did not buy a gun for self defense, he joined a network, got trained to fight the state and what network am I talking about, aren't these the same jihadi networks that make most lists.

    Didn't Hafiz Saeed play an active role in Kashmir? why is he arrested even by the Pak government? window dressing by them or not, he is identified as an international terrorist and Pakistan has also acted on it, so not sure why you are defending these kind of people who are ruining the youth and young children. These are disgusting animals and should be treated as such.

    Last point, this is such a typical argument, what's the difference between an Army and a terrorist.

    Firstly an Army person is trying to defend his country. The concept of invading countries and looting them is long gone, Army is called "Defense" services because they are here to defend and protect the families and sovereignty. They are not brainwashed or neither do they go out of their way and kill civilians. Casualties happen in the line of fire and I am not justifying it but in such instances army is accountable, a terrorist is not accountable to his organization for the same. Army's aim is not genocide or elimination of a group. I am sure there are ugly incidents from soldiers on civilians but that person or group were acting out on their own and not because that was the policy of their leadership. I can go on and on but hopefully that should be enough for now.

  5. #165
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    Quote Originally Posted by Local.Dada View Post
    Ok let me ask you this, the other part of Kashmir which is called Azad Kashmir or as Indians call it Pak occupied Kashmir, they have been "Azad" for 70+ years now right? what exactly have they accomplished in this time frame? Have they produced any outstanding positive influencers like artists,athletes, scientists,economists,entrepreneurs? Don't give me the oh so and so has Kashmiri origin or ancestors but give me names of people who were born and raised and brought up all their lives in Azad Kashmir who went on to be great representatives of their "Azad Country"? Forget education and other credentials, were they at least able to take advantage of tourism in an area that is considered one of the most beautiful places on earth.

    Terrorist or Freedom fighter or whatever at least in the so called Indian occupied Kashmir there is an actual excuse of religious fundamentalists helping the cause, what is Azad Kashmir's excuse? I don't think RSS is causing any trouble in Azad Kashmir, if you heard anything let me know.

    Now coming to India's stance, India is a very diverse country, there are unique standalone traditions, languages and cultures sometimes within the same state. Hindus, Muslims and other religions live here, no one has ever asked for independence. Now don't tell me they are bound by religion because they are Hindu majority because by the same account East Bengalis couldn't co exist with Pakistan despite religion.

    So why do Kashmiris want to self-govern and always play the "islamic demographic" card? is it a independence movement or a religious crusade? If it is a religious crusade then a secular country like India is not going to let that happen as it is a violation of India's core secular values.

    Now coming to this so called Math teacher, My parents or my teachers/mentors have always told me to stand up for what is right but they never told me to throw stones on police or pick up arms and join a crusade. I am sure most of us on here have either got or given a similar advice to our kids. If I feel oppressed, I am not going to tell my child to pick up arms and throw stones, I am going to ask them to study, be good at whatever they do and positively influence the world, I have no problem generalizing by saying 99% of PP would say the same thing to their kids.

    Now this so called math teacher did not buy a gun for self defense, he joined a network, got trained to fight the state and what network am I talking about, aren't these the same jihadi networks that make most lists.

    Didn't Hafiz Saeed play an active role in Kashmir? why is he arrested even by the Pak government? window dressing by them or not, he is identified as an international terrorist and Pakistan has also acted on it, so not sure why you are defending these kind of people who are ruining the youth and young children. These are disgusting animals and should be treated as such.

    Last point, this is such a typical argument, what's the difference between an Army and a terrorist.

    Firstly an Army person is trying to defend his country. The concept of invading countries and looting them is long gone, Army is called "Defense" services because they are here to defend and protect the families and sovereignty. They are not brainwashed or neither do they go out of their way and kill civilians. Casualties happen in the line of fire and I am not justifying it but in such instances army is accountable, a terrorist is not accountable to his organization for the same. Army's aim is not genocide or elimination of a group. I am sure there are ugly incidents from soldiers on civilians but that person or group were acting out on their own and not because that was the policy of their leadership. I can go on and on but hopefully that should be enough for now.
    Oh come on. Cut the crap

    Isn’t this individual revered as a legendary freedom fighter in India (numerous other examples exist including the armed mutiny of 1857):
    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bhagat_Singh

    Also regardless of what is/isn’t happening in Azad Kashmir. Kashmiris on the whole have rejected to be part of India and that alone is a reason sufficient enough for Indian army to get lost.

    Kashmir belongs to the people of Kashmir. Many dont even have much religious, ethnical and linguistic affiliation with the India. So its upto them how they want to live their life.
    Last edited by The Viper; 7th May 2020 at 23:43.

  6. #166
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    This following tweet is by a guy who is from Kashmir and has been following militancy in Kashmir since past few years. It shows the harsh reality of the militancy and how Pakistani nation is being made into fools by the blind Army and ISI hero worshiping.

    Last edited by Sirris; 12th May 2020 at 03:30.

  7. #167
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sirris View Post
    This following tweet is by a guy who is from Kashmir and has been following militancy in Kashmir since past few years. It shows the harsh reality of the militancy and how Pakistani nation is being made into fools by the blind Army and ISI hero worshiping.

    What are you trying to say? The Indian military executed an innocent man? Your comment makes no sense.

  8. #168
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    Quote Originally Posted by Giannis View Post
    What are you trying to say? The Indian military executed an innocent man? Your comment makes no sense.
    The point is to highlight the state of militancy in Kashmir and expose those who are living in a bubble that these under-equipped and under-trained militants have any realistic chance of defeating the Indian forces. At best they are a nuisance.

    It's a justification for why I don't support the insurgency in Kashmir. The Pakistani state isn't willingly to properly support it and the locals who desire for independence and see militancy as the only solution need to realize this. Without a proper support by Pakistan they lack the means, the weapons and the know-how to defeat an army that is far better trained and equipped by them. The locals are only being used by the Pakistani state as a mean to bleed India for its own political policy.

    They need to look for other ways to get their demands met.

    If Indian state wasn't alienating them I'd have told them to give India a chance but after decades of alienation, vilifying and no proper attempts to build a bridge I am in no position to tell the Kashmiri population what they should and shouldn't love.

    As for innocence is concerned. In the eyes of the Indian state and Indians outside Kashmir even someone capturing the sad state of Kashmir through photos is guilty, therefore a debate over who is and isn't innocent would be highly subjective in this case.

  9. #169
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    Indian forces arrested two militants today.

    The weapons seized:


  10. #170
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    Quote Originally Posted by Local.Dada View Post
    Ok let me ask you this, the other part of Kashmir which is called Azad Kashmir or as Indians call it Pak occupied Kashmir, they have been "Azad" for 70+ years now right? what exactly have they accomplished in this time frame? Have they produced any outstanding positive influencers like artists,athletes, scientists,economists,entrepreneurs? Don't give me the oh so and so has Kashmiri origin or ancestors but give me names of people who were born and raised and brought up all their lives in Azad Kashmir who went on to be great representatives of their "Azad Country"? Forget education and other credentials, were they at least able to take advantage of tourism in an area that is considered one of the most beautiful places on earth.

    Terrorist or Freedom fighter or whatever at least in the so called Indian occupied Kashmir there is an actual excuse of religious fundamentalists helping the cause, what is Azad Kashmir's excuse? I don't think RSS is causing any trouble in Azad Kashmir, if you heard anything let me know.

    Now coming to India's stance, India is a very diverse country, there are unique standalone traditions, languages and cultures sometimes within the same state. Hindus, Muslims and other religions live here, no one has ever asked for independence. Now don't tell me they are bound by religion because they are Hindu majority because by the same account East Bengalis couldn't co exist with Pakistan despite religion.

    So why do Kashmiris want to self-govern and always play the "islamic demographic" card? is it a independence movement or a religious crusade? If it is a religious crusade then a secular country like India is not going to let that happen as it is a violation of India's core secular values.

    Now coming to this so called Math teacher, My parents or my teachers/mentors have always told me to stand up for what is right but they never told me to throw stones on police or pick up arms and join a crusade. I am sure most of us on here have either got or given a similar advice to our kids. If I feel oppressed, I am not going to tell my child to pick up arms and throw stones, I am going to ask them to study, be good at whatever they do and positively influence the world, I have no problem generalizing by saying 99% of PP would say the same thing to their kids.

    Now this so called math teacher did not buy a gun for self defense, he joined a network, got trained to fight the state and what network am I talking about, aren't these the same jihadi networks that make most lists.

    Didn't Hafiz Saeed play an active role in Kashmir? why is he arrested even by the Pak government? window dressing by them or not, he is identified as an international terrorist and Pakistan has also acted on it, so not sure why you are defending these kind of people who are ruining the youth and young children. These are disgusting animals and should be treated as such.

    Last point, this is such a typical argument, what's the difference between an Army and a terrorist.

    Firstly an Army person is trying to defend his country. The concept of invading countries and looting them is long gone, Army is called "Defense" services because they are here to defend and protect the families and sovereignty. They are not brainwashed or neither do they go out of their way and kill civilians. Casualties happen in the line of fire and I am not justifying it but in such instances army is accountable, a terrorist is not accountable to his organization for the same. Army's aim is not genocide or elimination of a group. I am sure there are ugly incidents from soldiers on civilians but that person or group were acting out on their own and not because that was the policy of their leadership. I can go on and on but hopefully that should be enough for now.
    Wow, so much privilege and nonsense in this post, i dont know where to start.

  11. #171
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    Another example of why I think that Pakistan should either openly support the Kashmiri resistance groups or don't even bother. The lack of weapons and militants fighting with old rusted weapons has been well documented for a while now. All thanks to the sealing of LOC in early 2000s.

    Overzealous blind patriots wont miss an oppertunity to start the chestthumping and credit ISI and the army, when the news of Indians soldiers killed in Kashmir reaches them but what they don't hear or pay little attention to are the daily militants killed by the Indian army, who often have nothing better to resist with than these kinds of weapons.

    Forget RPGs, IEDs, it's consided a luxury item if a militant in Kashmir posses a rusted AK-47. No matter how strong your faith and conviction is, you can't win a military fight with almost non-existent weapon.

    ISI Zindabad?
    Pak Fouj Zindabad?

  12. #172
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    At one side you have the locals with rusted guns, on the other side you have the heavily armoured and equipped Indian military:



    Can this really be considered 'locals fighting back' or would a more appropriate term be 'the locals resisting are sitting ducks'?

    I don't question the bravery and will of the locals.

    I question the commitment of their invisible supporters.

    When Americans can openly support and arm anti-Asad rebels, while Russia and Iran support and arm the pro-Assad forces, what is stopping us from openly supporting the Kashmiris?

    Either openly support or don't!

    No point in pretending to support, giving false hope to those sacrificing their future and emotionally blackmailing the whole nation by releasing a few songs every now and then.

  13. #173
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sirris View Post
    At one side you have the locals with rusted guns, on the other side you have the heavily armoured and equipped Indian military:



    Can this really be considered 'locals fighting back' or would a more appropriate term be 'the locals resisting are sitting ducks'?

    I don't question the bravery and will of the locals.

    I question the commitment of their invisible supporters.

    When Americans can openly support and arm anti-Asad rebels, while Russia and Iran support and arm the pro-Assad forces, what is stopping us from openly supporting the Kashmiris?

    Either openly support or don't!

    No point in pretending to support, giving false hope to those sacrificing their future and emotionally blackmailing the whole nation by releasing a few songs every now and then.
    Difference is Syria is not on America’s borders. Nor is Syria a nuclear weapons state. Nor is Syria one of the biggest economies in the world with a strong international relations lobby.

    You do well to highlight the hypocrisy of western nations that turn a blind eye to India. And trust me I would like to see nothing more than for the oppressed to be able to defend themselves with adequate equipment. But Pakistan has its hands tied.

    This did not use to be the case when you go back to Pakistan of the 60s-80s. India has overtaken us since then in terms of an international higher ground. If you want anyone to blame, it is those who destabilized Pakistan through their corrupt antics to keep themselves in power.

    Now, all we can do is quietly rebuild our politics, our economy, our international pedigree, and regain the moral high ground and positive propaganda. Until then, Pakistan cannot support the Kashmiris directly without risking more political and economic instability.

    Imran Khan is doing well to make this a morality case and making it more high profile by discussing it with world leaders. No one cared before this and they still don’t. But it’s a slow start in the right direction.

  14. #174
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    TRF threatens to kill 'Indians' who plan to settle down in Kashmir

    In a statement which was released through its channels on online messaging platforms, TRF--a front of the banned Pakistani terror outfit Lashkar-e-Taiba--"openly" declared that "any Indian who comes with the intention to settle in Kashmir will be treated as an agent of RSS and not as a civilian and will be dealt with appropriately".

    The TRF threat issued on its letterhead, comes weeks after the central government introduced a new domicile law for the union territory of Jammu and Kashmir. As per the new law, any person who has resided in J&K for a period of 15 years will be eligible for the domicile certificate. A student who has studied for seven years and passed Class 10 or Class 12 in the Union Territory of J&K can also apply for the domicile certificate.

    The law also offers domicile rights to all the displaced people due to militancy and are registered with the Relief and Rehabilitation Commissioner (Migrants) in J&K.

    On Monday, TRF in its statement alleged that the new domicile law was an RSS-BJP "plot to change the demography of Kashmir" "hatched whereby RSS fascists will be settled in Kashmir under the garb of civilian cover".

    The terror group said that though it observes the principles of Islam and does not harm "non-combatant/civilian of any race, religion or ethnicity under any circumstances" but "it will not be deceived by the machinations of RSS-BJP".

    Incidentally, Pakistan's Prime Minister Imran Khan has been persistently running a social media campaign against the ruling Bharatiya Janata Party and the Rashtriya Swayamsevak Sangh, using the same rhetoric.

    https://www.dtnext.in/News/National/...ttle-down-.vpf

  15. #175
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thunderbolt14 View Post
    Difference is Syria is not on America’s borders. Nor is Syria a nuclear weapons state. Nor is Syria one of the biggest economies in the world with a strong international relations lobby.

    You do well to highlight the hypocrisy of western nations that turn a blind eye to India. And trust me I would like to see nothing more than for the oppressed to be able to defend themselves with adequate equipment. But Pakistan has its hands tied.

    This did not use to be the case when you go back to Pakistan of the 60s-80s. India has overtaken us since then in terms of an international higher ground. If you want anyone to blame, it is those who destabilized Pakistan through their corrupt antics to keep themselves in power.

    Now, all we can do is quietly rebuild our politics, our economy, our international pedigree, and regain the moral high ground and positive propaganda. Until then, Pakistan cannot support the Kashmiris directly without risking more political and economic instability.

    Imran Khan is doing well to make this a morality case and making it more high profile by discussing it with world leaders. No one cared before this and they still don’t. But it’s a slow start in the right direction.
    Fine, if Pakistan can't support them openly on military basis then it should explicitly tell the Kashmiri youth that they are on their own as far as armed struggle is concerned and that they should lay down the weapons and look for a peaceful and political way out.

    "Covert" support, that isn't actually covert nor is it in any way adequate, is not fooling anybody and needs to stop.

    Make a decision and commit to it. If economic stability is our priority then we should go all in!

    Hizbul Mujahideen has been designated as a terrorist group by the European Union and the United States. Why are we finding it hard to distance ourselves from them when supporting them openly isn't an option?

    After Riaz Naikoo's Martyrdom Hizbul Mujahideen's leader Sayed Salahuddin paid tribute to him from Pakistan. This needs to stop!

    The moral support to militants need to stop!
    The songs released by Pakistani Army that promote militancy in Kashmir needs to stop!
    Crediting Pakistani military forces when local Kashmiri manage to inflict damage to Indian forces needs to stop!

    We are consistently being accused of supporting the Kashmiri militancy by India and India uses this claim to tarnish our image and credibility globally. If our leadership doesn't believe in supporting them then they should be doing their upmost best to show that we are innocent from any militant activity in the valley.

    Why shall only we think about our economic future, while turning a blind eye towards Kashmiri youth who are daily sacrificing their lives?

    Pakistani leaders need to stop playing with the emotions of the nation and the blood of the Kashmiri youth. Let them know that we don't back their armed struggle, back it up with action and let them rethink their decision.

    Yes to a great degree their will to resist and motivation for armed struggle is based on self-motivation but there is also a part where they see Pakistani state as its ally and the perceived support is a contributing factor in their decision to join the armed struggle.

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    I wonder if the Pakistani media would give even 2 minute to the daily militants being killed in Kashmir. Or, do we only care if these "militants" manage to inflict some damage on our "enemy". How can we expect the world to pay attention to their freedom struggle if we ourselves are highlighting the daily sacrifices.

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    Sarpanch shot dead by militants in Jammu and Kashmir's Anantnag

    A sarpanch was shot dead by militants in Jammu and Kashmir's Anantnag on Monday. The victim, Ajay Pandita Bharti, was the sarpanch of Lukbawan village in the Larkipora area. The 40-year-old village leader was a member of Congress party.

    As per the police statement, the crime took place at around 6 pm near the sarpanch's house. "Officers attending the terror crime spot learnt that Ajay Pandita was shot at by the terrorists near his house. The injured has received grievous gunshot injuries and was shifted to a nearby hospital for treatment where he succumbed to his injuries."

    The Anantnag police have registered a case regarding the incident under relevant sections of law. "Investigation is in progress and police continue to work to establish the full circumstances of this terror crime. Area has been cordoned off and a joint search by police and security forces in the area is going on to nab the terrorists," the police statement said.

    The incident has been condemned by several political leaders in Jammu and Kashmir, including Congress leader Rahul Gandhi. "My condolences to the family and friends of Ajay Pandita, who sacrificed his life for the democratic process in Kashmir. We stand with you in this time of grief. Violence will never win," Rahul Gandhi said.

    Former chief minister Omar Abdullah said that he was sorry to hear about the incident. "Very sorry to hear about the killing of sarpanch Ajay Pandita in Anantnag earlier this afternoon. I unequivocally condemn this terror attack on a grassroots political worker & pray that his soul rests in peace," Omar Abdullah tweeted.

    Iltija Mufti, former CM Mehbooba Mufti's daughter, also condemned the incident via her mother's social media account. "Terrible news.Condolences to the family. Shrinking political space in Kashmir has made political party workers all the more vulnerable. They are stuck between punitive actions of a vindictive government & militants on the other end," Iltija Mufti said on Mehbooba Mufti's Twitter account.

    Meanwhile, J&K BJP Chief Ravinder Raina and Sofi Yusuf also issued statements condemning the sarpanch's death. Sofi said, "The enemies of humanity don't belong to any religion they can't see peace and development and even in these times of pandemic they are doing these inhumane acts and are killing the local representatives who are on ground to serve the people during these tough times."

    He further said these kinds of acts will not weaken our morale of the people, "We are here for the development and betterment of our people. My heartfelt condolences and sympathies with bereaved family and prayers for the peace of the departed soul."
    Last edited by Mesozoic; 9th June 2020 at 15:41.

  19. #179
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    https://www.hindustantimes.com › ...


    Condolences to his family. Was the only Hindu sarpanch in Kashmir and they killed him off too.

    Won't be long before the forces find them and put them down and the usual suspects start harping on about the so called "human rights abuses".

  20. #180
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mesozoic View Post
    https://www.hindustantimes.com › ...


    Condolences to his family. Was the only Hindu sarpanch in Kashmir and they killed him off too.

    Won't be long before the forces find them and put them down and the usual suspects start harping on about the so called "human rights abuses".
    Lame try at giving this a religious angle. May be you should read your article first before getting too excited about posting it here?

    He was a member of the Congress party.

    This is what your BJP walas said :

    Meanwhile, J&K BJP Chief Ravinder Raina and Sofi Yusuf also issued statements condemning the sarpanch's death. Sofi said, "The enemies of humanity don't belong to any religion they can't see peace and development and even in these times of pandemic they are doing these inhumane acts and are killing the local representatives who are on ground to serve the people during these tough times."

    And this is what Iltija Mufti said

    Iltija Mufti, former CM Mehbooba Mufti's daughter, also condemned the incident via her mother's social media account. "Terrible news.Condolences to the family. Shrinking political space in Kashmir has made political party workers all the more vulnerable. They are stuck between punitive actions of a vindictive government & militants on the other end," Iltija Mufti said on Mehbooba Mufti's Twitter account.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bhaag Viru Bhaag View Post
    Lame try at giving this a religious angle. May be you should read your article first before getting too excited about posting it here?
    Oh lord the irony! You lot are the first ones to give a fake religious angle to killings on cattle theft but when it actually is, you say don't make it about religion. Hypocrisy ki bhi had hoti hai...

    He was a member of the Congress party.
    So? How does that matter?

    This is what your BJP walas said :

    Meanwhile, J&K BJP Chief Ravinder Raina and Sofi Yusuf also issued statements condemning the sarpanch's death. Sofi said, "The enemies of humanity don't belong to any religion they can't see peace and development and even in these times of pandemic they are doing these inhumane acts and are killing the local representatives who are on ground to serve the people during these tough times."

    And this is what Iltija Mufti said

    Iltija Mufti, former CM Mehbooba Mufti's daughter, also condemned the incident via her mother's social media account. "Terrible news.Condolences to the family. Shrinking political space in Kashmir has made political party workers all the more vulnerable. They are stuck between punitive actions of a vindictive government & militants on the other end," Iltija Mufti said on Mehbooba Mufti's Twitter account.
    How does any of this actually matter ? Of course they'll condemn it. What do expect them to say ? That what happened is fine and they're completely okay with it ? How clueless can you get ?

  22. #182
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mesozoic View Post
    https://www.hindustantimes.com › ...


    Condolences to his family. Was the only Hindu sarpanch in Kashmir and they killed him off too.

    Won't be long before the forces find them and put them down and the usual suspects start harping on about the so called "human rights abuses".



    FACTS

    Militants target sarpanch regardless of their religion, since they see them as cooperating with the Indian Army and supporting what they see as an "occupation".

    Muslim policemen, sarpanch and politicians have been targeted in the past and continue being targeted. However Indian outside Kashmir only come with their tears when a Hindu is targeted once in a while.

    Indian Army targets anyone they see cooperating with the militants in the slightest bit, regardless if the person has ever held a gun or not.

  23. #183
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    Quote Originally Posted by jeeteshssaxena View Post
    These guys deserve every bit of what they are getting, staunch islamists who don't believe in living with people of other religion. Pandit exodus and all these incidents prove it.


    Hindu Pandit Kashmiri man: "This has happened for the first time..."

    Hindu Pandit Kashmiri Women who for the first time has to face a loss:

    "Kill these Pakistanis...
    Get out of here...
    This is only for Hindus...
    This is only for Hindus...
    This land is only for Hindus...

    Here each one is a Pakistani...
    Tell all of them to get out."


    For the slow learners: Pakistani = Muslim Kashmiri

  24. #184
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    Official Statement by the Militants:



    "...don't drag this with religion."

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    @Sirris

    The killing may/may not be linked to religion. We may never know but that wasn't my point.

    The usual narrative that the so called "freedom fighters" or "rebels" fighting only against the "occupation forces" and never killing the Kashmiri civilians should be put to bed. These are terrorists and that's what they should be called. They want total control in the valley so that they can do what the IS are doing in Iraq/Syria.

    Why do you think Kashmir doesn't get as much coverage as Hong Kong or Palestine ?
    Last edited by Mesozoic; 9th June 2020 at 20:12.

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    Condolences to the sarpanch's family, one of the very few Kashmiri Pandit families that stayed back despite exodus and threats. Apparently he asked for security but was denied, maybe because of him being from Congress and J&K under centre. A ghastly crime no matter which side one sits in, hopefully justice is served. Many sarpanchs from all backgrounds have been killed in recent years, terrible for grassroots democracy.

  27. #187
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mesozoic View Post
    @Sirris

    The killing may/may not be linked to religion. We may never know but that wasn't my point.

    The usual narrative that the so called "freedom fighters" or "rebels" fighting only against the "occupation forces" and never killing the Kashmiri civilians should be put to bed. These are terrorists and that's what they should be called. They want total control in the valley so that they can do what the IS are doing in Iraq/Syria.

    Why do you think Kashmir doesn't get as much coverage as Hong Kong or Palestine ?
    I find it hard to enter in any discussion with you.

    You don't want to consider any statements the militants themselves make about their motives.

    Yet, you want me to believe you when you say:

    Quote Originally Posted by Mesozoic
    They want total control in the valley so that they can do what the IS are doing in Iraq/Syria.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mesozoic View Post
    Oh lord the irony! You lot are the first ones to give a fake religious angle to killings on cattle theft but when it actually is, you say don't make it about religion. Hypocrisy ki bhi had hoti hai...



    So? How does that matter?



    How does any of this actually matter ? Of course they'll condemn it. What do expect them to say ? That what happened is fine and they're completely okay with it ? How clueless can you get ?
    Thanks for proving me right. You were trying too hard to give it a religious angle but got caught pretty quickly.

    Once again read that article and please show us where it is written that he was killed because he was a hindu and being a political worker had nothing to do with it?

    I think it's pretty clear why you shared that article here. You would have a point if at least that article had mentioned that somewhere that he was killed because he was a hindu.

    And you will find plenty of articles mentioning atrocities on minorities in India and people here discuss based on those articles. They don't make stuff from their behinds just like you are doing here.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bhaag Viru Bhaag View Post
    Thanks for proving me right. You were trying too hard to give it a religious angle but got caught pretty quickly.

    Once again read that article and please show us where it is written that he was killed because he was a hindu and being a political worker had nothing to do with it?

    I think it's pretty clear why you shared that article here. You would have a point if at least that article had mentioned that somewhere that he was killed because he was a hindu.

    And you will find plenty of articles mentioning atrocities on minorities in India and people here discuss based on those articles. They don't make stuff from their behinds just like you are doing here.
    Got caught ? By who? Kashmir intel ? Just when I think you can't get more clueless, you prove me wrong.

    The plight of Hindu pandits in the valley is well documented. I don't want to dive into that again. Get your head out of your behinds and see how some some extremist Kashmiris are celebrating on the Pandit sarpanch's death on SM. You won't for obvious reasons.

  31. #191
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sirris View Post
    I find it hard to enter in any discussion with you.

    You don't want to consider any statements the militants themselves make about their motives.

    Yet, you want me to believe you when you say:
    It doesn't matter if you believe it or not.

    There are too many parallels between the IS and the Kashmiri terrorist organisations to ignore starting all the way from their ideology.

  32. #192
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mesozoic View Post
    It doesn't matter if you believe it or not.

    There are too many parallels between the IS and the Kashmiri terrorist organisations to ignore starting all the way from their ideology.
    The hindutva government of India haven't exactly tried to cut terrorism in Kashmir and to support more moderate movements
    Changing the laws and cutting off the Internet and creating curfews has only helped the rise of these IS terrorists


    "If you know the enemy and know yourself, you need not fear the result of a hundred battles"

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  34. #194
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    Quote Originally Posted by chacha kashmiri View Post
    The hindutva government of India haven't exactly tried to cut terrorism in Kashmir and to support more moderate movements
    Changing the laws and cutting off the Internet and creating curfews has only helped the rise of these IS terrorists
    Which IS terrorists in Kashmir?

    There are even reports where local militants fought and opposed IS sympathetic jihadists.

  35. #195
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sirris View Post
    Which IS terrorists in Kashmir?

    There are even reports where local militants fought and opposed IS sympathetic jihadists.
    Ghazi haider, zakir naikoo, zakir musa, burhan wani, sehrai etc


    "If you know the enemy and know yourself, you need not fear the result of a hundred battles"

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    Quote Originally Posted by chacha kashmiri View Post
    Ghazi haider, zakir naikoo, zakir musa, burhan wani, sehrai etc
    Who is Zakir Naikoo? Are you confusing him with Riyaz Naikoo? Riyaz Naikoo belonged to Hizbul Mujahideen a strong anti-IS group. He joined militancy long before IS even existed.

    Burhan Wani died in 2016 and was a Hizb leader. So anti-IS. He joined militants ranks before IS exited.

    Ghazi Haider is the current Hizb leader. Therefore anti-IS.

    Zakir Musa left Hizb and formed his own Group. His main motivation to leave the Hizb was its strong dependency on Pakistan. He had sympathies for AQ but is anti-IS. This could be seen as the closest group to global Jihadist in Kashmir. Even then there are no official allegiances.

    A rise in militancy is different that a rise in "IS terrorists".

    As I said previously, there are reports of existing militants group opposing the formation of IS sympathetic groups.

  37. #197
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    Riyaz Naikoo, Burhan Wani, Ghazi Haider and Zakir Musa. All these big names of the new age militancy in Kashmir came to rise due to unrests in year 2010. Long before BJP came to power. Long before Baghdadi declared his caliphate.

    It's said the unrest began after a boy was killed by a teargas shell.






  38. #198
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    This is why we should be skeptical and not blindly agree what everything our leaders put out.

    The official twitter handle of the Indian Army Chinar Corps, which is supposed to be based in Srinagar and is responsible for military operations in the Kashmir Valley, tried to portray a months old footage as evidence for Pakistani army violating LOC ceasefire today and Indian Army responding accordingly:



    After being called out they deleted their tweet of course. But it was already too late: http://archive.vn/2W8Np

    Note how this wasn't the usual act of Indian Media lying, but the official account of the Indian Army with the verified blue tick on twitter.

    These can only be exposed nowadays, thanks to the new age of the Internet. Our Grandparents had no choice but to believe the lies but we need to be smarter.

  39. #199
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sirris View Post
    Who is Zakir Naikoo? Are you confusing him with Riyaz Naikoo? Riyaz Naikoo belonged to Hizbul Mujahideen a strong anti-IS group. He joined militancy long before IS even existed.

    Burhan Wani died in 2016 and was a Hizb leader. So anti-IS. He joined militants ranks before IS exited.

    Ghazi Haider is the current Hizb leader. Therefore anti-IS.

    Zakir Musa left Hizb and formed his own Group. His main motivation to leave the Hizb was its strong dependency on Pakistan. He had sympathies for AQ but is anti-IS. This could be seen as the closest group to global Jihadist in Kashmir. Even then there are no official allegiances.

    A rise in militancy is different that a rise in "IS terrorists".

    As I said previously, there are reports of existing militants group opposing the formation of IS sympathetic groups.
    How about Junaid Sehri?
    And how do you compare gazi haider to maqbool bhatt or yasin malik


    "If you know the enemy and know yourself, you need not fear the result of a hundred battles"

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    saw a video on on youtube on a indian news channel called wion - they reported shelling between pak/ india on Wednesday 11/6-india solider died.

    https://www.hindustantimes.com/india...ZRqbYrmLK.html


    TGK 237.1 owner


  41. #201
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    Quote Originally Posted by chacha kashmiri View Post
    How about Junaid Sehri?
    And how do you compare gazi haider to maqbool bhatt or yasin malik
    I’m curious: are you a JKLF supporter? I don’t think we have too many here on this forum. It would be instructive discussing the Kashmir cause with you, in particular the intra-Kashmiri dimension.

  42. #202
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nostalgic View Post
    I’m curious: are you a JKLF supporter? I don’t think we have too many here on this forum. It would be instructive discussing the Kashmir cause with you, in particular the intra-Kashmiri dimension.
    Not personally
    Although I do have a book on Maqbool bhatt and also by arundhati Roy in my book library

    They are probably the only kashmiri group to also reach out to azad kashmir too


    "If you know the enemy and know yourself, you need not fear the result of a hundred battles"

  43. #203
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    Quote Originally Posted by chacha kashmiri View Post
    Not personally
    Although I do have a book on Maqbool bhatt and also by arundhati Roy in my book library

    They are probably the only kashmiri group to also reach out to azad kashmir too
    Thanks. I had friends and neighbors originally from AJK who attended university there, and JKLF did have a presence on campus, and they would commemorate Maqbool Bhat on his birth and death anniversaries. I’m unsure if JKLF has also made inroads into the general public off campus, how support for them has ebbed and flowed over the years, and how they reconcile Kashmiri identity in the backdrop of Valley-AJK relations, over which there appear to be several divergent viewpoints.

  44. #204
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nostalgic View Post
    Thanks. I had friends and neighbors originally from AJK who attended university there, and JKLF did have a presence on campus, and they would commemorate Maqbool Bhat on his birth and death anniversaries. I’m unsure if JKLF has also made inroads into the general public off campus, how support for them has ebbed and flowed over the years, and how they reconcile Kashmiri identity in the backdrop of Valley-AJK relations, over which there appear to be several divergent viewpoints.
    The emergence of pti in the valley seems to have directly led alot of youths away from kashmiri politics
    The hizb and the aq parties luckily seem to have strayed away from ajk
    The recent death of ajay pandits seems to have intensified bjp efforts in jammu


    "If you know the enemy and know yourself, you need not fear the result of a hundred battles"

  45. #205
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    Quote Originally Posted by chacha kashmiri View Post
    The emergence of pti in the valley seems to have directly led alot of youths away from kashmiri politics
    The hizb and the aq parties luckily seem to have strayed away from ajk
    The recent death of ajay pandits seems to have intensified bjp efforts in jammu
    PTI has emerged in the valley? Did you mean AJK?

  46. #206
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nostalgic View Post
    PTI has emerged in the valley? Did you mean AJK?
    There's an election next year I think


    "If you know the enemy and know yourself, you need not fear the result of a hundred battles"

  47. #207
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    Quote Originally Posted by chacha kashmiri View Post
    There's an election next year I think
    You said PTI had emerged in the valley. I was wondering if you really meant the valley, i.e. the Kashmir Valley in IOK, and not AJK.


    Silver-tongued seraphim circling the spire...
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  48. #208
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nostalgic View Post
    You said PTI had emerged in the valley. I was wondering if you really meant the valley, i.e. the Kashmir Valley in IOK, and not AJK.
    Sorry I meant mirpur, muzafrabad etc


    "If you know the enemy and know yourself, you need not fear the result of a hundred battles"

  49. #209
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    Quote Originally Posted by chacha kashmiri View Post
    Sorry I meant mirpur, muzafrabad etc
    Ah. AJK then. Got it. If there are elections next year, it would be worthwhile seeing how turnout fares compared to previous iterations.


    Silver-tongued seraphim circling the spire...
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  50. #210
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    Latest: Civilans in Pakistani adminstrated Kashmir died, due to shelling of Indian Army.



    Terror launchpads destroyed? Is that what Indian Media would say?

  51. #211
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    Omar Abdullah, famous Kashmiri politician known for his anti-militancy and pro-India stance, has deactivated his twitter account for some reasons.
    Last edited by Sirris; 17th June 2020 at 21:37.

  52. #212
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sirris View Post
    Omar Abdullah, famous Kashmiri politician known for his anti-militancy and pro-India stance, has deactivated his twitter account for some reasons.
    Nope, he’s still posting, it’s just restricted to his followers now instead of open. Many of the Kashmiris who “hate follow” him have quoted his last couple of tweets, one gushing psychopantic praise at the Humsaaya Mulk army, the other warning Kashmiris not to look towards China for deliverance. I imagine the Kashmiris gave him the flak he deserved, prompting him to close the account off for all but his followers.

  53. #213
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    @Sirris







    Silver-tongued seraphim circling the spire...
    Gather in the gallery in their best attire...

  54. #214
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nostalgic View Post
    @Sirris






    He has blocked people from commenting for a while now and it's well known.

    His account was indeed deactivated for a while. I checked it myself.

    Now that he is back, look at his numbers of followers, only around 600. When before it was 1million+.

  55. #215
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sirris View Post
    He has blocked people from commenting for a while now and it's well known.

    His account was indeed deactivated for a while. I checked it myself.

    Now that he is back, look at his numbers of followers, only around 600. When before it was 1million+.
    Intriguing. Did he suffer from a momentary acquisition of conscience before normal service was resumed?

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  57. #217
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  58. #218
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    Indian forces have killed eight fighters in Indian-administered Kashmir, including two who hid in a mosque, officials said, as New Delhi escalates operations against rebels in the disputed territory during a coronavirus lockdown.

    Police and army teams launched joint operations in the Shopian and Pampore areas of the federal territory on Thursday after they received intelligence about the presence of the rebels.

    Five were killed in Shopian and three in Pampore in the 24 hours until Friday morning, Indian army spokesman Colonel Rajesh Kalia said, adding that the operations were continuing.

    On Friday morning, security forces in Pampore used "tear-smoke shells" to force two fighters out of a mosque, where they had taken refuge, senior police officer Vijay Kumar said on Twitter, adding that the two were killed by forces while maintaining the sanctity of the religious place.

    There were no immediate independent accounts of the incident.

    The new fatalities following gun battles on Thursday and Friday took the death toll of Kashmir rebels to more than 100 this year, officials said.

    Indian security forces have killed more than two dozen fighters, including six top commanders, in the past two weeks as they battle a decades-old separatist uprising in Indian-administered Kashmir that has cost tens of thousands of mainly civilian lives since the 1980s.

    But anger in the Muslim-majority region intensified last year after New Delhi scrapped the partial autonomy of the former Jammu and Kashmir state, dividing it into two federally-controlled territories.

    The Himalayan region of Kashmir was divided between India and Pakistan since the two nations became independent and split in 1947.

    Both claim the region in its entirety, which has been the cause of two full-scale wars between the nuclear-armed South Asian neighbours.

    India accuses Pakistan of supporting the Kashmiri fighters, a charge Islamabad denies, calling them freedom fighters.

    In recent weeks, the two nations have exchanged heavy artillery fire along the Line of Control (LoC) - the highly-militarised de facto border dividing Kashmir.

    https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2020/...101112837.html


    For the latest updates on Cricket, follow @PakPassion on Twitter

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    Indian Army men killed by the militants this month: 0

    Is this fighting back?
    Are we truly supporting this fight?
    At one hand ISI is supposed to help Taliban defeat the USA and Nato in Afghanistan but on the other hand it can't properly support the eager Kashmiri locals against only India, our mortal enemy?

    I don't know how much of this is highlighted in the Pakistani Media.

    اگر وَقت ملے تو کوئی ان قربانیوں کو بھی سلام پیش کر دے
    Last edited by Sirris; 19th June 2020 at 18:58.

  60. #220
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    dont know if this is true - but if it is pakistan are being complete idiots -

    Pakistani spy drone shot down by BSF at Jammu and Kashmir's Kathua - transporting guns/ bullets:




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