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  1. #1
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    Muslims fear backlash of India’s coronavirus fury

    Tucked into the narrow lanes of New Delhi’s Nizamuddin slum is the global headquarters of the Tablighi Jamaat, an influential Islamic missionary movement. Last month, thousands of volunteer preachers from across India converged on the site, known as the Markaz, to eat, pray and discuss their work.

    When they returned home, the Muslim missionaries were not merely filled with greater zeal. Indian health officials said many were infected with coronavirus, which they spread to families and communities across India — from mountainous Kashmir to the Andaman Islands to Tamil Nadu.

    Some 370 of India’s 2,000 confirmed coronavirus cases have been linked to that March meeting in the slums.

    This week, New Delhi police sealed the Markaz and ferried hundreds of Tablighi Jamaat loyalists sheltering in the group’s huge dormitories and residents of the neighbourhood to hospitals and quarantine facilities. Across India, authorities have raced to trace other participants, some 1,800 of whom are now in quarantine.

    BJP supporters are still thinking of consolidating their support base around the idea of the Muslim as the threatening other

    But the discovery that a Muslim gathering has fuelled India’s coronavirus crisis has sparked outrage among the country’s Hindu majority. Communal tensions are once again on the rise just weeks after the deadliest sectarian riots in decades claimed more than 50 lives in the Indian capital.

    “It feels very scary and will add to the demonisation of Muslims. It is as if the entire responsibility of this will be put on every Muslim,” said Nazia Erum, author of Mothering a Muslim, a book about religious prejudice at elite Delhi schools.

    As India’s economy has slowed in recent years, Narendra Modi’s ruling Bharatiya Janata Party has adopted more strident sectarian rhetoric, repeatedly depicting India’s Muslim minority as an insidious internal threat.

    The fallout from the Tablighi Jamaat gathering, which was held despite a local government order banning religious gatherings of more than 200 people, has reinforced that narrative.

    “It does seem like the fodder that people were seeking to continue making Muslims somehow accountable, even for something like the coronavirus,” said Ali Khan Mahmudabad, a political science professor at Ashoka University.

    “BJP supporters are still thinking of consolidating their support base around the idea of the Muslim as the threatening other.”

    Across Asia, religious groups have played an outsized role in spreading coronavirus with many spiritual leaders ignoring diktats to curb large-scale gatherings.

    In South Korea, more than half the country’s 10,000 cases stem from mass gatherings held by a quasi-Christian sect in February. Subsequent Korean clusters have been traced to gatherings at smaller churches.

    Two of the largest coronavirus outbreaks in Singapore are also linked to churches.

    In India’s northern state of Punjab, the coronavirus death of a Sikh preacher, who had attended several large religious functions, has led to the quarantining of thousands of people with whom he — and his 19 infected family members — had been in contact.

    But it is the large-scale meetings of the Tablighi Jamaat, a Sunni organisation that preaches a simplified, dogmatic version of Islam, that have emerged as a super-spreader in several countries.

    Malaysian officials said nearly two-thirds of the country’s cases were linked to a four-day Tablighi Jamaat gathering of 16,000 people at the Sri Petaling Mosque in Kuala Lumpur at the end of February.

    In Indonesia, thousands of people travelled to South Sulawesi province for a mass Tablighi Jamaat meeting, which was only called off at the last minute after pressure from local authorities.

    Tablighi Jamaat preachers, who had attended a gathering of 150,000 people outside Lahore last month, are believed to have helped spread of the virus across Pakistan.

    But it is in India that the role played by Tablighi Jamaat is causing the most concern. Rightwing television channels have called the meeting “criminal” and the participants “suspects”. Hashtags such as #CoronaJihad and #TablighiVirus have trended on social media.

    “These are dangerous people: these lockdown cheats — they have compromised us all,” television anchor Arnab Goswami fulminated on one of India’s most watched news channels. “We were just winning when they did everything to defeat us.”

    As India heads into its second week of a three-week lockdown that is causing particular hardship to the poor, analysts warned the BJP could stoke anti-Muslim sentiment to deflect public anger from the government’s failings in managing the crisis.

    “The big fight after the end of the era of Covid is going to be around who did what and how culpable they were,” said Prof Mahmudabad. “Rather than seeing the pandemic as a moment to be used to seek national unity, there is a continuity of showing Muslims as more culpable and more to blame.”

    https://www.ft.com/content/33017d73-...2-9c621b067ce9


    For the latest updates on Cricket, follow @PakPassion on Twitter

  2. #2
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    If anybody is to be blamed for this it's those Pangolin munching Chinese and their equally dim government.

  3. #3
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    This is not a good sign at all.

    Hopefully sanity will prevail.


    Bangladeshi Fan

  4. #4
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    Thanks to Indian media for communalizing an issue like this. This is why Indian media is the worst on this planet.

  5. #5
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    The usual suspects, who are eternal victims. There were people who purposefully did not follow governments orders of social distancing, and I hope they get jailed. It will be a mistake to let such people to scot-free just to maintain "communal harmony".

  6. #6
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    No point communalising the issue, however, the people involved in the gathering after Delhi government order of lockdown should be punished as per law (regardless of religion).

  7. #7
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    FT has zero stake in this matter. So they can take their victim propoganda article and shove it.

    These tableegh idiots has endangered the lives of muslims and non muslims both. On top of that they are attacking, abusing police and health care workers and refusing to cooperate.

    Muslims organization across the board except a few have unequivocally condemned this and here is FT trying to play the victim card.

  8. #8
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    IMO, it is not wrong to have that meeting from march 13 to march 15th. They intentionally didn't spread virus. They got together for noble cause & unfortunately it happened.

    But throwing stones at doctors, spitting on doctors , not cooperating with officials by throwing stones at police is definitely wrong but only few ppl condemn these things in India ! If these ppl don't cooperate with officials it's their families that going to suffer due to this virus !

    If you point out such things one is called sanghi, bhanghi, RSS agent etc, by others this is the problem in India.

  9. #9
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    My only question is what is communalising an issue? Before this Markaz incident, I have seen many posts mocking hindus regarding gaumutra. I have seen tweets where people have problem that Doordarshan decided to retelecast Ramayan serial. Some journalists even said Ramayan lead to Babri Masjid demolition.

    Were all the above dont fall under communalization?

    So before Markaz incident - mock gaumutra, ramayan etc. But suddenly when apni galti pakdi gayi...stop communalizing the incident? Lol.

    If you dont cooperate and stone pelt at police, obviously there will be an anger.

  10. #10
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    Wow can't believe people are still trying to justify the actions of those jamaatis.

    Number of cases and deaths in my state (many others states too) have doubled in the last 24 hours because of the recklessness of these idiots. And they are still trying to play victim and pull out the minority card after most of them refusing to get tested, pelting stones and spitting and coughing deliberately on the medical staff...

    And when the police does what it has to do , the pseudo secular/liberal gang will cry a river on SM and give bhashans on secularism. Bunch of idiots !

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by cricketjoshila View Post
    FT has zero stake in this matter. So they can take their victim propoganda article and shove it.

    These tableegh idiots has endangered the lives of muslims and non muslims both. On top of that they are attacking, abusing police and health care workers and refusing to cooperate.

    Muslims organization across the board except a few have unequivocally condemned this and here is FT trying to play the victim card.
    Agreed with every word you said, however, problem is in real life people use these incidents and spread hatred towards entire community.

    Earlier it wasn't as widespread because there was no social media and generally face to face people act normally, but now hiding behind a computer screen people spread way too much hatred.

    Everyone involved in this meeting should be sentenced as per law, the organisers need to be punished severely.

  12. #12
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    Nobody is trying to justify the action of Jamaatis.

    Arrest all those morons and charge them. In fact, it SHOULD be done.

    But hopefully, this isn't turned into a Us vs Them issue, which if we go by history, will eventually happen.

    The small segment of Muslims who are apologists for Jamaatis, deserve to be mocked.

    But innocents who have been against them shouldn't have to face the brunt of this.

    ----

    In fact, the govt SHOULD have arrested all those who defied orders before itself.

    1. They started lockdowns late.

    2. They let protests and religious gatherings take place till Mar 22. No point complaining about it in social media when you can take action.


    I am not one of you. I never was. I am not one of them either.

  13. #13
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    Jamaat ki galti ya saazish?
    Jamaat ka hathiyaar hai corona?
    Tableeghi jamaat decode
    Jamaat ka jihaad

    Now please tell me what kind of headlines are these?

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by sensible-indian-fan View Post
    Nobody is trying to justify the action of Jamaatis.

    Arrest all those morons and charge them. In fact, it SHOULD be done.

    But hopefully, this isn't turned into a Us vs Them issue, which if we go by history, will eventually happen.

    The small segment of Muslims who are apologists for Jamaatis, deserve to be mocked.

    But innocents who have been against them shouldn't have to face the brunt of this.

    ----

    In fact, the govt SHOULD have arrested all those who defied orders before itself.

    1. They started lockdowns late.

    2. They let protests and religious gatherings take place till Mar 22. No point complaining about it in social media when you can take action.
    +1

    Indian media is trying hard to make this into hindu vs muslims. Shameless and C grade media.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bhaag Viru Bhaag View Post
    Jamaat ki galti ya saazish?
    Jamaat ka hathiyaar hai corona?
    Tableeghi jamaat decode
    Jamaat ka jihaad

    Now please tell me what kind of headlines are these?
    Saw a new headline
    Jamaat ka Pakistan connection

  16. #16
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    It is not a Hindu Muslim thing. These guys have acted as a threat to the entire society. Now we can’t even brush this off as ignorance and as an accident as the behavior they displayed post gathering has been deplorable.

    I don’t see why we need to bring in equivalencies and justify 2 wrongs. These people (speaking of this specific group) are like pests and should be treated as such.

    I don’t see any of them as honest tax paying citizens who have a job, run a business or have a profession. In fact these types that live on dole or live in counties where their contribution is zilch in fact there is a downside of extremism
    and poor behavior need to be handled as they become security threats and risks.

    Before people think I am speaking about all Muslims, use some sense, you will know what I am talking about, instead the modern education Muslim should speak out about these things insetad of getting defensive which doesn’t help anyone

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bhaag Viru Bhaag View Post
    Thanks to Indian media for communalizing an issue like this. This is why Indian media is the worst on this planet.
    Oh right so Indian media is the bad guy here but when they talk ill and negative about PM Modi, they are good,


    "You want Philly, Philly ? " Nicholas Edward Foles

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bhaag Viru Bhaag View Post
    +1

    Indian media is trying hard to make this into hindu vs muslims. Shameless and C grade media.
    Can you please show proof where national media trying to make Hindu vs Muslims?
    Please name all channels.
    Indian national media is secular and against to Hindu, they always hide the facts an exaggerate things when it comes to Hindu.

  19. #19
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    I was told Indian Muslims are Indians first and Muslims second. If that was the case, this shouldn't have been an issue to begin with.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bhaag Viru Bhaag View Post
    Saw a new headline
    Jamaat ka Pakistan connection
    funnily enough or ironically, the whole tableegh jamaat movement started from mewaat India and the global HQ is in nizamuddin

    indian media stole the opportunity of pakistan media grabbing that headline hehe


    عبدي أنت تريد ، وأنا أريد ، ولا يكون إلا ما أريد ، فإن سلمت لي فيما تريد كفيتك ما تريد

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Local.Dada View Post
    Firstly why wasn’t there enough responsibility to cancel it this year? Even holiest of shrines of all religions including for Muslims have been officially closed for the moment.

    Fine they still got together. What is the point of pelting stones at cops, doctors or running away. Why can’t they cooperate? Don’t they know that they can cause harm to their fellow Muslims as well even if let’s say they don’t care about any one else.

    This is not an exception to the rule here though but still people need to call our their ways.
    agreed on the bold, but that is what the OP article is opining / suggesting, that they fear a backlash, blaming, lynching, hence the denial of testing

    no sane person would want to deny the test and medical treatment. It is basic survival instinct be it a muslim or any religious creed. A person only does so, when the fear is bigger than their own lives. in this case the lynching etc of families, blaming making scapegoats etc

    Either you say that muslims are savages / insane with no survival instincts or we accept the problem of fear of backlash and address that. Cant eat your cake and have it too my friend


    عبدي أنت تريد ، وأنا أريد ، ولا يكون إلا ما أريد ، فإن سلمت لي فيما تريد كفيتك ما تريد

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by kamz View Post
    agreed on the bold, but that is what the OP article is opining / suggesting, that they fear a backlash, blaming, lynching, hence the denial of testing

    no sane person would want to deny the test and medical treatment. It is basic survival instinct be it a muslim or any religious creed. A person only does so, when the fear is bigger than their own lives. in this case the lynching etc of families, blaming making scapegoats etc

    Either you say that muslims are savages / insane with no survival instincts or we accept the problem of fear of backlash and address that. Cant eat your cake and have it too my friend
    Are you saying a group of people who didn’t listen to the PM’s address on lockdown and gathered in a pretty popular area in the capital of India are now suddenly scared and terrified of lynching? Especially at a time when the only other option is to suffer and die from this horrible pandemic?

    Seems too convinent of an argument. Anyways the government was able to trace back a lot of them because they were just ignorant folk who came for a religious purpose and went back. Not an excuse but still it was ignorance and not malice. However can you deny that there are a group of troublemakers who spit at cops, pelt stones etc.

    Again I ask you, why are you getting defensive here, am I saying these folk represent entire Islam?

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by big_gamer007 View Post
    No point communalising the issue, however, the people involved in the gathering after Delhi government order of lockdown should be punished as per law (regardless of religion).
    Agree. I have been equally critical of Tableeghi types in Pakistan and Bangladesh, it is criminally negligent for these religious groups to be holding mass congregations in the current atmosphere.

    obviously that is not an excuse for Hindutva mobs to indulge in hate fuelled violence, but as the country is currently in lockdown, difficult to see how they could do that anyway.


    I for one welcome our new In____ overlords - Kent Brockman

  24. #24
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    If the TJs are not obeying the laws lock them up. But stop trying to turn into Hindu Muslim thing. They didn't spread it deliberately and the provocative narrative has Ind immense damage.

  25. #25
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    1,306 foreign Tablighi Jamaat workers in India identified so far, spread over 16 states/UTs. 1,051 quarantined and 21 tested positive for COVID-19 as on April 1. 7,688 local Tablighi workers and their contacts traced as on Apr 1, of which 171 tested positive & 12 are dead

  26. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mesozoic View Post
    Wow can't believe people are still trying to justify the actions of those jamaatis.

    Number of cases and deaths in my state (many others states too) have doubled in the last 24 hours because of the recklessness of these idiots. And they are still trying to play victim and pull out the minority card after most of them refusing to get tested, pelting stones and spitting and coughing deliberately on the medical staff...

    And when the police does what it has to do , the pseudo secular/liberal gang will cry a river on SM and give bhashans on secularism. Bunch of idiots !
    I don't think anyone is defending them. People are speaking against blaming all Muslims for what one group did. Just follow any Indian news channel or even Social Media and you would think this was a coordinated effort by all Muslims rather than a reckless action of a group of people.

    Just look at this thread, you have @King_Kohli posting tweets from known bigots to blame every Indian Muslims. Do you think that is justified?

  27. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bhaag Viru Bhaag View Post
    Saw a new headline
    Jamaat ka Pakistan connection
    well, the Irony is that Tableeghi Jamaat Markaz in Deo Band is the biggest one in the SC ...... only fools will connect this with Pakistan ..... KSA has funded the Tableeghi Jamaat / Deo Band .... they have influence all over the world ..... Dr.Zakir naik was one of them .... guess who comes to support him .... Arabs and Malaysians ..... I request to the Indian media and RSS goons, dont try your luck with them .... you are already in deep hole becoz of modi ji ....

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Darul_Uloom_Deoband

    Indian media is Playing with Fire .....


    The Griffins ....

  28. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Poutine View Post
    I don't think anyone is defending them. People are speaking against blaming all Muslims for what one group did. Just follow any Indian news channel or even Social Media and you would think this was a coordinated effort by all Muslims rather than a reckless action of a group of people.

    Just look at this thread, you have @King_Kohli posting tweets from known bigots to blame every Indian Muslims. Do you think that is justified?
    Does questioning some Muslims equate to all Muslims? The error is with your thinking. Step being so defense and even, after the said incident, they have hidden and still not co-operating. There is human trafficking, fraud.

    So the onus is for Muslims, its leaders to use common sense and avoid infecting others, including their own family.

  29. #29
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    Stop posting rightwing rubbish on this thread.

    Some of you are very close to bans.

    Right sensible arguments.


    For the latest updates on Cricket, follow @PakPassion on Twitter

  30. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by someone21 View Post
    Does questioning some Muslims equate to all Muslims? The error is with your thinking. Step being so defense and even, after the said incident, they have hidden and still not co-operating. There is human trafficking, fraud.

    So the onus is for Muslims, its leaders to use common sense and avoid infecting others, including their own family.
    I think I and others on this thread said that the action of those Muslims was reckless and wrong. No one is defending them, from what I understand what they did is wrong from Islam's point of view as well.

    But you have to be complicit or naïve to think that some groups aren't using this opportunity to blame all Muslims. Just on this thread, we had a poster posting tweets from bigots like Tarek Fateh/Robert Spencer to imply that Muslims are going to deliberately infect others. Sections of India media is calling this "Corona Jihad", what do you think their intentions are?

  31. #31
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    One more example of when faith over takes Akal.

  32. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by someone21 View Post
    Does questioning some Muslims equate to all Muslims? The error is with your thinking. Step being so defense and even, after the said incident, they have hidden and still not co-operating. There is human trafficking, fraud.

    So the onus is for Muslims, its leaders to use common sense and avoid infecting others, including their own family.
    Exactly that's what I am keep saying, whoever may be we cant back them. Doent matter even if Hindu's do I will react same.
    Any how I am leaving this thread , @Ronaldo7 literally pulling me

    I have received enough warnings, don't want to get ban

  33. #33
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    India is worst country for minorities in South Asia right now.

  34. #34
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    Lol. Some people think thst if Indian govt bans Tableeghi Jamaat, Arabs or Malaysians can stop it. Lol. They will be able to do jack.

    India doesn't live on dole outs of Arabs.

    Malaysians hardly matter.

  35. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by cricketjoshila View Post
    Lol. Some people think thst if Indian govt bans Tableeghi Jamaat, Arabs or Malaysians can stop it. Lol. They will be able to do jack.

    India doesn't live on dole outs of Arabs.

    Malaysians hardly matter.
    You're not that important mate.
    No one cares if you ban it.

    It was an Indian Muslim creation itself

  36. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by cricketjoshila View Post
    Lol. Some people think thst if Indian govt bans Tableeghi Jamaat, Arabs or Malaysians can stop it. Lol. They will be able to do jack.

    India doesn't live on dole outs of Arabs.

    Malaysians hardly matter.
    Do you think it make any difference to any Muslim outside of India if you ban it? At most people will feel sorry for Indian Muslims who would be put through restrictions because of what a single group of people did.

  37. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ronaldo7 View Post
    You're not that important mate.
    No one cares if you ban it.

    It was an Indian Muslim creation itself
    It was created in British India.

    You dont decide India's importance. Pakistani PM kept whining about India and Kashmir, hardly anyone did anything. Tells you who is important who is not.

  38. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Poutine View Post
    Do you think it make any difference to any Muslim outside of India if you ban it? At most people will feel sorry for Indian Muslims who would be put through restrictions because of what a single group of people did.
    I dont care about what non Indians think. They are not a stake holder in this.

    What restrictions? Are muslims being stopped from following islam?

    That single group of people called Tableeghi jamaat the organization should be banned.

  39. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cpt. Rishwat View Post
    If these guys are posting videos or random individuals blowing their nose in a tissue and pretending it's some sort of Islamist conspiracy to infect the Indian population on a Pakistani site, then God only knows what they are posting on the Indian ones.

    They are making a mockery of this place.
    Don't know about Indian forums but most Indians on twitter are convinced that Coronavirus is a Muslim conspiracy to harm India. It's sad that those nonsensical views have now seeped into this forum.

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    I believe it's the other way around.

    Some Muslims getting offended when someone is criticizing the actions of that group of TJ.

    Those Muslims need to realize that it wasnt criticism against islam or Muslims or even for the whole TJ movement. It was against that group only. By involving yourself into it in the name of religion, you have communalised it and NOT the other way around.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Poutine View Post
    Do you think it make any difference to any Muslim outside of India if you ban it? At most people will feel sorry for Indian Muslims who would be put through restrictions because of what a single group of people did.
    You are going on in circles. No one is blaming Islam or entire Muslims. People are calling out on this rabid behavior. Forget the ignorance but the post-jamaat behavior of a few.

    Instead of being defensive what’s the ego on just acknowledging this and moving on?

    In fact showing equivalences and trying to be defensive even by intelligent and educated folK like you gives rise to more generalizations and issues.

  42. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by cricketjoshila View Post
    It was created in British India.

    You dont decide India's importance. Pakistani PM kept whining about India and Kashmir, hardly anyone did anything. Tells you who is important who is not.
    Ok Supa Powa 2020

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    Quote Originally Posted by cricketjoshila View Post
    I dont care about what non Indians think. They are not a stake holder in this.

    What restrictions? Are muslims being stopped from following islam?

    That single group of people called Tableeghi jamaat the organization should be banned.
    Then why are you on a forum filled with non-Indians, lol that makes no sense. Why waste time with people whose opinion you do not care about?

    Anyways you are making it seem like all of Tableeghi Jammat was there, it would make more sense to take actions against the individuals involved rather than put a blanket ban on a major religious organization.

  44. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by King_Kohli View Post
    Can you please show proof where national media trying to make Hindu vs Muslims?
    Please name all channels.
    Indian national media is secular and against to Hindu, they always hide the facts an exaggerate things when it comes to Hindu.
    The headlines I posted above were from News Nation. You can surf through other channels and see for it yourself. And I am loling at Indian national media is secular.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Ronaldo7 View Post
    Ok Supa Powa 2020


    Great comeback.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Poutine View Post
    Don't know about Indian forums but most Indians on twitter are convinced that Coronavirus is a Muslim conspiracy to harm India. It's sad that those nonsensical views have now seeped into this forum.
    Like they were smart enough to do a conspiracy 😁

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    Quote Originally Posted by Itachi View Post
    I believe it's the other way around.

    Some Muslims getting offended when someone is criticizing the actions of that group of TJ.

    Those Muslims need to realize that it wasnt criticism against islam or Muslims or even for the whole TJ movement. It was against that group only. By involving yourself into it in the name of religion, you have communalised it and NOT the other way around.
    This is blatantly untrue. Just read up the thread, the TJ were definitely criticised, certainly you can check my first post. I will draw the line when your countrymen start posting twitter videos of people blowing their noses into a tissue and claiming it's a bio terror attack conspiracy.


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  48. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by Poutine View Post
    Then why are you on a forum filled with non-Indians, lol that makes no sense. Why waste time with people whose opinion you do not care about?

    Anyways you are making it seem like all of Tableeghi Jammat was there, it would make more sense to take actions against the individuals involved rather than put a blanket ban on a major religious organization.
    When Indian govt takes an action, it will not think what xyz will think. Its actions are for its own territory.

    The international HQ of Tableeghi jamaat is that Nizamuddin markaz. So yes it should be banned in India.

  49. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by Romali_rotti View Post
    Oh right so Indian media is the bad guy here but when they talk ill and negative about PM Modi, they are good,
    Indian media talking ill about Modi doesn't happen that often anyway. For me they will always remain a gutter media. I know this gutter media is the only source of news for NRI's like you and I understand how it helps your patriotism but it is what it is. My opinion on Indian channels won't change.

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    Quote Originally Posted by cricketjoshila View Post
    When Indian govt takes an action, it will not think what xyz will think. Its actions are for its own territory.

    The international HQ of Tableeghi jamaat is that Nizamuddin markaz. So yes it should be banned in India.
    Fair enough. Now I am assuming, you also want this Temple in West Bengal banned?

    https://www.thehindu.com/news/cities...le31237211.ece

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    Quote Originally Posted by cricketjoshila View Post
    When Indian govt takes an action, it will not think what xyz will think. Its actions are for its own territory.

    The international HQ of Tableeghi jamaat is that Nizamuddin markaz. So yes it should be banned in India.
    Forever or temporarily during the outbreak?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Local.Dada View Post
    You are going on in circles. No one is blaming Islam or entire Muslims. People are calling out on this rabid behavior. Forget the ignorance but the post-jamaat behavior of a few.

    Instead of being defensive what’s the ego on just acknowledging this and moving on?

    In fact showing equivalences and trying to be defensive even by intelligent and educated folK like you gives rise to more generalizations and issues.
    I can't keep repeating myself. I said it several times what the people of TJ did was idiotic and wrong. I just have a issue with people making it seem like it was a deliberate to spread the virus.

    Anyways I am sure you are not blaming all Muslims but why do think Indian Media/Social media is all over the TJ news but has been mostly quiet about the West Bengal temple that held a mass prayer.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Poutine View Post
    Fair enough. Now I am assuming, you also want this Temple in West Bengal banned?

    https://www.thehindu.com/news/cities...le31237211.ece
    No Sanghi is talking about this.
    I wonder why

  54. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bigboii View Post
    Forever or temporarily during the outbreak?
    Until they are fully investigated and also why have they violated visa laws of India by allowing foreigners on tourist visa to come there.

    They are in violation of multiple laws.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ronaldo7 View Post
    No Sanghi is talking about this.
    I wonder why
    The sanghis are calling this "fake news"

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    Quote Originally Posted by Poutine View Post
    Fair enough. Now I am assuming, you also want this Temple in West Bengal banned?

    https://www.thehindu.com/news/cities...le31237211.ece
    They violated law clearly, government need to identify all. If any spreading happen because of these incidents they should punish.

    No one is above law

  57. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by cricketjoshila View Post
    Until they are fully investigated and also why have they violated visa laws of India by allowing foreigners on tourist visa to come there.

    They are in violation of multiple laws.
    What about the temple that held the mass prayer? Should their ban be temporary or permanent?

  58. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by King_Kohli View Post
    They violated law clearly, government need to identify all. If any spreading happen because of these incidents they should punish.

    No one is above law
    Sure but I wonder why the people in the temple were told to go home while the TJ people were rounded up and detained?

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    Quote Originally Posted by cricketjoshila View Post
    Until they are fully investigated and also why have they violated visa laws of India by allowing foreigners on tourist visa to come there.

    They are in violation of multiple laws.
    They go everywhere with tourist visa what's your problem with it? I don't think that should be a big deal tbh
    Other than that yes something should be done and did they ignore the lockdown

  60. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by Poutine View Post
    Fair enough. Now I am assuming, you also want this Temple in West Bengal banned?

    https://www.thehindu.com/news/cities...le31237211.ece
    As you see the temple in the picture is locked. And devotees assembled outside it.

    From the link you posted.

    Long queues of devotees were seen outside temples across the State.

    Large gatherings were seen outside many temples in Beliaghata and Maniktala area in the eastern metropolis.

    The gates of many temples were closed and devotees were asked to stand in queue maintaining safe distance from each other, a senior officer of the city police said.

    So temples are closed.

    If people are gathering outside it. They must be punished as per law. No two ways about it.

  61. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bigboii View Post
    They go everywhere with tourist visa what's your problem with it? I don't think that should be a big deal tbh
    Other than that yes something should be done and did they ignore the lockdown
    Foreigners cannot take part in preaching/missionary activities on a tourist visa. Thats the law.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Poutine View Post
    Don't know about Indian forums but most Indians on twitter are convinced that Coronavirus is a Muslim conspiracy to harm India. It's sad that those nonsensical views have now seeped into this forum.
    No, most Indians are not convinced about this rubbish theory, there might be a few saying so after these irresponsible Tableegi psychos have almost spread Corona to entire country....

    Just imagine how Pakistani people would have reacted, if a few Hindus congregated in a temple in Karachi and then proceeded to spread it to the whole country, and in the process spitting and throwing stones at the very doctors who tried to save them.

    Most likely a few nutjobs would have said it's a Hindu conspiracy etc

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    Muslim COVID-19 Victim Denied Burial, Cremated in Mumbai

    The local police and a politician then tried to intervene and urged the trustees to allow the burial, but the latter did not budge, the family member said.

    Mumbai: A 65-year-old Muslim man from suburban Malad here, who died of coronavirus infection, was cremated after the trustees of a cemetery denied permission to bury his body there, his family members alleged on Thursday.

    The incident took place on Wednesday.

    The patient, a resident of Collector Compound in Malwani, died at a civic-run hospital in Jogeshwari East early on Wednesday.

    One of the family members of the deceased alleged that when his body was taken to Malad Malwadni Kabrastan, its trustees denied burial "as he was coronavirus positive".

    "This was despite the local civic authorities giving permission for the burial at 4 am," he said.

    The local police and a politician then tried to intervene and urged the trustees to allow the burial, but the latter did not budge, the family member said.

    Thereafter, some social workers intervened and requested a nearby Hindu crematorium to cremate the body. As they agreed to do so, the man was finally cremated at 10 am.

    Talking to PTI, Maharashtra minister and Malwani MLA, Aslam Shaikh, said, "As per the government guidelines, Muslim COVID-19 victims should be buried at a cemetery, which is closest to the place where the patient died."

    "But in this case, the family of the deceased took his body directly to Malad Malwani Kabrastan without informing anyone, including trustees of the cemetery, and then demanded his burial, he said.

    "Strict action should be taken against the civic staffs, who brought the body to the cemetery despite knowing the guidelines," he said, adding that a day before this incident, another coronavirus victim had been buried at that cemetery.

    The son of the deceased said, "After my father was declared dead at the hospital no one came to help me. I kept sitting beside the body outside the hospital for more than three hours."

    "We wanted to bury his body at the Malad-Malwani Kabrastan. But when we reached there, the trustees of the cemetery refused to allow the burial saying he was a COVID-19 patient," he said.

    "After the intervention by the police and other authorities, the body was cremated at a nearby Hindu shamshan bhoomi (crematorium)," he added.

    Local Samajwadi Party corporator Rukhsana Siddique said, "When the civic staffers know that as per the circular, a COVID-19 victim should be buried at a nearby cemetery, then why died they took the body to Malad (West) although he died at a hospital in Jogeshwari (East)?"

    The corporator, however, expressed shock over the denial of burial of the body at the cemetery.

    https://www.news18.com/amp/news/indi...mpression=true

    Sickening
    Last edited by Abdullah719; 2nd April 2020 at 21:09.

  64. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by Poutine View Post
    What about the temple that held the mass prayer? Should their ban be temporary or permanent?
    Read it again. Temples are closed. People gathered outside it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ronaldo7 View Post
    No Sanghi is talking about this.
    I wonder why
    Quote Originally Posted by Ronaldo7 View Post
    The sanghis are calling this "fake news"
    I dont think the premise of your debate is correct. You are defending islamophobia by accusing anyone and everyone Sanghi. And then when you are given a reply back in similar tone, you are whinning infront of mods. Arent you seeing an irony there?

    How difficult it is to put forward your views politely?

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    Quote Originally Posted by cricketjoshila View Post
    As you see the temple in the picture is locked. And devotees assembled outside it.

    From the link you posted.

    Long queues of devotees were seen outside temples across the State.

    Large gatherings were seen outside many temples in Beliaghata and Maniktala area in the eastern metropolis.

    The gates of many temples were closed and devotees were asked to stand in queue maintaining safe distance from each other, a senior officer of the city police said.

    So temples are closed.

    If people are gathering outside it. They must be punished as per law. No two ways about it.
    That's the weird thing they weren't. This is a line from the article:
    Police, in several districts, asked devotees to return to home immediately after offering pujas and instructed them to avoid gatherings and strictly follow social distancing norms, a senior officer said.
    People were allowed to finish their prayers and simply go home. Correct me if I wrong but weren't the TJ people detained and quarantined?

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    Quote Originally Posted by cricketjoshila View Post
    Foreigners cannot take part in preaching/missionary activities on a tourist visa. Thats the law.
    That's an unenforceable and a stupid law and there is no country in the world which has this law I am sure how can you stop someone from preaching anything (are there separate visas for missionaries?) and why should you isn't that free speech?

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    Muslims being singled out. 300 Sikhs were evacuated from Gurudwara in Delhi, Hindus lining up to visit temples and nothing in media.

  69. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by Poutine View Post
    That's the weird thing they weren't. This is a line from the article:


    People were allowed to finish their prayers and simply go home. Correct me if I wrong but weren't the TJ people detained and quarantined?
    The TJ people were first warned by police on 23rd March to stop the congregation. They video recorded it and has been released on media sites.

    They refused to let anyone be tested or quarantined or stopped the gathering.

    The NSA had to get involved and knowing that after the NSA is involved they will not get any kind of political support and consequences will be grave, did they allow police and HCWs to come and intervene and complete the testing and quarantine procedure.

    On top of that they had violated visa laws by allowing foreigners and hiding them.

    They have also attacked policemen HCWs.

  70. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by leg-side-flick View Post
    No, most Indians are not convinced about this rubbish theory, there might be a few saying so after these irresponsible Tableegi psychos have almost spread Corona to entire country....

    Just imagine how Pakistani people would have reacted, if a few Hindus congregated in a temple in Karachi and then proceeded to spread it to the whole country, and in the process spitting and throwing stones at the very doctors who tried to save them.

    Most likely a few nutjobs would have said it's a Hindu conspiracy etc
    Hopefully you are right but going by Social Media a large number of people seem convinced that this is some sort of conspiracy. I mean even in this forum we have a poster who is using Tik Tok as a source to prove that Muslims are out to infect people on purpose.

  71. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bigboii View Post
    That's an unenforceable and a stupid law and there is no country in the world which has this law I am sure how can you stop someone from preaching anything (are there separate visas for missionaries?) and why should you isn't that free speech?
    Yes separate visas for missonaries.

    The organizers have to enforce the law. If you are inviting and keeping foreigners, you should see if they have proper visas.

  72. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by Poutine View Post
    Hopefully you are right but going by Social Media a large number of people seem convinced that this is some sort of conspiracy. I mean even in this forum we have a poster who is using Tik Tok as a source to prove that Muslims are out to infect people on purpose.
    Tbf

    Some muslims did post objectionable videos on tik tok. Asking people to violate the laws.

  73. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by cricketjoshila View Post
    Tbf

    Some muslims did post objectionable videos on tik tok. Asking people to violate the laws.
    Tik Tok is filled with idiots from all round the world. I am sure I can find videos from other groups of people saying and doing stupid things. The problem is when people take action of a few and try to paint it as some sort of coordinated conspiracy.

  74. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by Poutine View Post
    Hopefully you are right but going by Social Media a large number of people seem convinced that this is some sort of conspiracy. I mean even in this forum we have a poster who is using Tik Tok as a source to prove that Muslims are out to infect people on purpose.
    Offcourse some people will believe and propgate such theories... Don't people in Pakistan believe in conspiracies and put on social media...

    Read the second part of my post, you will get the answer

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    Quote Originally Posted by Poutine View Post
    I think I and others on this thread said that the action of those Muslims was reckless and wrong. No one is defending them, from what I understand what they did is wrong from Islam's point of view as well.

    But you have to be complicit or naïve to think that some groups aren't using this opportunity to blame all Muslims. Just on this thread, we had a poster posting tweets from bigots like Tarek Fateh/Robert Spencer to imply that Muslims are going to deliberately infect others. Sections of India media is calling this "Corona Jihad", what do you think their intentions are?
    Sections of Indian Muslims are celebrating and calling it Corona Justice. So is it an eye for an eye?

    There are wrongs and idiots everywhere. The point is why when it comes to questioning and criticizing some actions of Muslims, suddenly it becomes religion matter.

  76. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by Poutine View Post
    That's the weird thing they weren't. This is a line from the article:


    People were allowed to finish their prayers and simply go home. Correct me if I wrong but weren't the TJ people detained and quarantined?
    It will be better if you dont rely on one source only and actually check the videos of meetings and other documents which are widely shared by various journalists.

    You are defending it without even knowing the details.

  77. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by Poutine View Post
    Hopefully you are right but going by Social Media a large number of people seem convinced that this is some sort of conspiracy. I mean even in this forum we have a poster who is using Tik Tok as a source to prove that Muslims are out to infect people on purpose.
    At this point of time, jokingly or seriously, its upon you what you want to express and then ready for the heat.

    The national disaster management act has already been invoked which means it will get very messy if you dont comply with the laws now.

    Things which could have gotten ignored at other times, right now, will bring serious consequences.

  78. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by Poutine View Post
    Tik Tok is filled with idiots from all round the world. I am sure I can find videos from other groups of people saying and doing stupid things. The problem is when people take action of a few and try to paint it as some sort of coordinated conspiracy.
    Exactly. Idiots post many things on social media.

  79. #79
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    Quote Originally Posted by Poutine View Post
    Fair enough. Now I am assuming, you also want this Temple in West Bengal banned?

    https://www.thehindu.com/news/cities...le31237211.ece
    Lol no Indian media all out cry on this for obvious reasons. Just how there was no cry over recent big BJP gathering for some parliamentary voting after they implemented curfew.

    India has turned into a total drama nation under Modi. Their hate has been firing back on them hence you see the decline in their economy and sharply increasing social unrest. The tolerant drama they keep portraying under BJP keeps getting exposed in the international media. These goon Bhakts and Sanghis are filled with hatred and want to avenge thousand year of ruling by Muslim Moghuls over their ancestors.

    It's just going to hurt them in the long run. No country can ever prosper with hate and division, especially a third world country which already has massive poverty, corruption and daily living struggle for the masses.

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    Just to post the details before this results into another mud slinging contest. The burial was refused by the Muslim trustees of the burial space as the man had died in a different area of the city. The mans son then transported him across the city, breaking the law. The trustees in this case refused to budge to the sons and local politicians pleadings. A Hindu crematorium nearby allowed the man to be cremated. The feud in this case was between the Muslim trustee and the mans relatives. The Hindu crematorium only came in when the local Muslim politicians requested it.


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