Wisden Cricket Monthly

Sohail Speaks Yasir's Blog Fazeer's Focus

User Tag List

View Poll Results: Should Pakistan use the proposed tour of England (2020) as leverage for a future visit by England?

Voters
15. You may not vote on this poll
  • Yes, Pakistan should ask for favour back

    4 26.67%
  • No, now is not the right time to ask for such a commitment

    8 53.33%
  • Negotiate behind the scenes

    3 20.00%
Results 1 to 26 of 26
  1. #1
    Debut
    Oct 2004
    Runs
    130,721
    Mentioned
    2545 Post(s)
    Tagged
    21 Thread(s)

    Should Pakistan use the proposed tour of England (2020) as leverage for a future visit by England?

    Wasim Khan says there is no connection but surely a case can be made as Atherton had suggested? Pakistan helping England in time of need so why cant England send in their team in the future?


    For the latest updates on Cricket, follow @PakPassion on Twitter

  2. #2
    Debut
    Jan 2011
    Venue
    Shaheen Bagh, Delhi
    Runs
    52,708
    Mentioned
    437 Post(s)
    Tagged
    3 Thread(s)
    No they should not.

    This is a great humanitarian gesture from PCB and we all respect them for showing purity of heart at this tough time for the whole world.

    Asking for anything return will spoil this gesture from being considered one for humanity.

  3. #3
    Debut
    Oct 2004
    Runs
    130,721
    Mentioned
    2545 Post(s)
    Tagged
    21 Thread(s)
    Please vote on poll.


    For the latest updates on Cricket, follow @PakPassion on Twitter

  4. #4
    Debut
    Oct 2009
    Venue
    England
    Runs
    5,836
    Mentioned
    9 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Tempting given Eng women played in Malaysia recently even though WI and BD women had successfully toured the country. Despite Wasim Khan's links with the ECB he couldn't convince them to tour.

  5. #5
    Debut
    Jan 2020
    Venue
    California, Lahore
    Runs
    3,415
    Mentioned
    1149 Post(s)
    Tagged
    2 Thread(s)
    Neither of the options on the poll are correct. There’s a third thing — don’t ask for it publicly, hint at it during negotiations but keep the focus on the humanitarian olive branch.

    That is what Wasim Khan is doing. And he’s doing it very well. Posters here won’t be happy until he announces it in a press conference but that will jeopardize the relationship.

    So the answer to the poll is, both. And neither. @MenInG maybe you can add a third option to the poll “Negotiate behind the scenes but not too aggressively”
    Last edited by Thunderbolt14; 22nd May 2020 at 20:41.

  6. #6
    Debut
    Apr 2013
    Venue
    Karachi
    Runs
    42,277
    Mentioned
    2233 Post(s)
    Tagged
    4 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by Thunderbolt14 View Post
    Neither of the options on the poll are correct. There’s a third thing — don’t ask for it publicly, hint at it during negotiations but keep the focus on the humanitarian olive branch.

    That is what Wasim Khan is doing. And he’s doing it very well. Posters here won’t be happy until he announces it in a press conference but that will jeopardize the relationship.

    So the answer to the poll is, both. And neither. @MenInG maybe you can add a third option to the poll “Negotiate behind the scenes but not too aggressively”
    Option added.


    Follow PakPassion on Twitter, Facebook and Instagram!

  7. #7
    Debut
    Mar 2016
    Venue
    Sheffield
    Runs
    32,417
    Mentioned
    441 Post(s)
    Tagged
    1 Thread(s)
    I don't see PCB having the savvy to use the fact they are travelling to England to force England to play in Pakistan. I also don't see them acting in this manner.

    We shouldn't blackmail teams in to travelling into Pakistan. If you want to come, that is great. If not, we can't do much about it and we have to respect that country's decision.

  8. #8
    Debut
    Jan 2013
    Runs
    14,704
    Mentioned
    2301 Post(s)
    Tagged
    10 Thread(s)
    Yeah, because the 2012-13 ODI tour to India (which ruined preparation for a Test series in South Africa) worked SOOOO well at getting the BCCI to make a reciprocal tour to Pakistan or even the UAE.

    So this isn’t a tried and tested failure of a strategy!

  9. #9
    Debut
    Jan 2020
    Venue
    California, Lahore
    Runs
    3,415
    Mentioned
    1149 Post(s)
    Tagged
    2 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by Abdullah719 View Post
    Option added.

  10. #10
    Debut
    Jan 2020
    Venue
    California, Lahore
    Runs
    3,415
    Mentioned
    1149 Post(s)
    Tagged
    2 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by Junaids View Post
    Yeah, because the 2012-13 ODI tour to India (which ruined preparation for a Test series in South Africa) worked SOOOO well at getting the BCCI to make a reciprocal tour to Pakistan or even the UAE.

    So this isn’t a tried and tested failure of a strategy!
    How much you wanna bet? I’ll tag you on the thread when Wasim Khan announces an England tour for 2022

  11. #11
    Debut
    Jan 2009
    Runs
    14,672
    Mentioned
    17 Post(s)
    Tagged
    2 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by Junaids View Post
    Yeah, because the 2012-13 ODI tour to India (which ruined preparation for a Test series in South Africa) worked SOOOO well at getting the BCCI to make a reciprocal tour to Pakistan or even the UAE.

    So this isn’t a tried and tested failure of a strategy!
    The ecb arent bcci The pcb are more ethical and trustworthy than the bcci will ever be

  12. #12
    Debut
    Jan 2013
    Runs
    14,704
    Mentioned
    2301 Post(s)
    Tagged
    10 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by Zaz View Post
    The ecb arent bcci The pcb are more ethical and trustworthy than the bcci will ever be
    I suggest you watch the movie documentary “Death of a Gentleman” and specifically the parts featuring the former pet salesman Giles Clarke, who has dominated the ECB for a decade.

    I wouldn’t lend him so much as a tic tac without a formal contractual undertaking from this odious man.

    So no, if the ECB allows such a man to occupy high office, I’m not sure that I would use the words Trustworthy or Ethical to describe it.

    My words for the ECB after its Big Three conduct would be:

    Irresponsible
    Self-serving
    Unprincipled
    Disloyal
    Beneath contempt.
    Last edited by Junaids; 23rd May 2020 at 07:23.

  13. #13
    Debut
    Jun 2013
    Runs
    1,108
    Mentioned
    10 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by freelance_cricketer View Post
    No they should not.

    This is a great humanitarian gesture from PCB and we all respect them for showing purity of heart at this tough time for the whole world.

    Asking for anything return will spoil this gesture from being considered one for humanity.
    Why not both? The fact is that if Pakistan continue to play useless home games against SL while the bigger teams avoid touring then that equals millions of lost revenue on top of the amount they have already lost out on.

    Pakistan can ill afford not to play this the smart way. If they can snag England into touring then no other team will have any excuse to say no.

    From the humanitarian aspect yes it is a great gesture, and it will also benefit the PCB to have greater income from which they can build the futures of their budding cricketers at home.

  14. #14
    Debut
    Nov 2007
    Runs
    28,671
    Mentioned
    981 Post(s)
    Tagged
    4 Thread(s)
    England will tour Pakistan when the Foreign Office risk assessment says it is safe for the touring party.

  15. #15
    Debut
    Jul 2018
    Runs
    1,880
    Mentioned
    34 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    ECB is just as bad as the BCCI. If they had as much unabated power as the BCCI they would be bully others just the same. As @Junaids mentioned the doc. The Death of a Gentlemen paints a telling picture of how the bigwigs who run these Big 3 boards operate. One is just as self-serving and contemptuous as the next.

    The reason ECB are always so keen to have Pakistan touring is because most of all, it benefits them. England has a massive Pakistani diaspora and Pakistan are generally competitive in those conditions, both of which = £££ in ticket sales and broadcasting money.

  16. #16
    Debut
    Jul 2018
    Runs
    1,880
    Mentioned
    34 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Now that Coronavirus has swept the planet the ECB will be prioritizing revenue-driving games even more since they won't be making money off those ticket sales.

  17. #17
    Debut
    Dec 2015
    Runs
    4,361
    Mentioned
    116 Post(s)
    Tagged
    2 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by RedwoodOriginal View Post
    Now that Coronavirus has swept the planet the ECB will be prioritizing revenue-driving games even more since they won't be making money off those ticket sales.
    Ticket sales are insured.

  18. #18
    Debut
    Oct 2004
    Runs
    130,721
    Mentioned
    2545 Post(s)
    Tagged
    21 Thread(s)
    Whether its said or not, there will be some leverage in-built in this tour - now whether ECB take that into account in their decision later is a bit of an honour type thing - to be seen.


    For the latest updates on Cricket, follow @PakPassion on Twitter

  19. #19
    Debut
    Apr 2015
    Runs
    4,369
    Mentioned
    43 Post(s)
    Tagged
    4 Thread(s)
    Naturally ECB are lining up a tour to Pakistan, the groundwork has been laid. This tour will only cement that sentiment, no need to seek leverage. Should have done that during the big 3 meetings years back.

  20. #20
    Debut
    Sep 2012
    Runs
    86,587
    Mentioned
    6597 Post(s)
    Tagged
    38 Thread(s)
    We are not doing any ‘ahsaan’ on England by agreeing to tour - let’s not try to give it that angle. We are not volunteering; we are only committing the FTP. We were scheduled to tour this summer anyway.

    Touring England is a big deal and Pakistan is not in a position to say no as long as ECB takes protective measures which they obviously will.

    Covid will not vanish overnight. This wave will stay with us for at least 2 years, and people will have to live with it and try to adjust their lifestyle. Lockdown is no longer a solution and it is important to resume sports.

    People who are suggesting that this tour should not happen or there should be no sporting events are living on cloud cuckoo land where they would wake up one day and the world would be Covid free, or perhaps a vaccine will be developed and the entire global population will be vaccinated and that would be it.

    No, none of that is going to happen. As I said, we have to learn to live with and adjust our lifestyle accordingly. Take basic/necessary precautionary measures and move on with your lives.


  21. #21
    Debut
    Feb 2006
    Runs
    35,124
    Mentioned
    424 Post(s)
    Tagged
    5 Thread(s)
    Imagine if the situation was in reverse where the ECB were obligated under the FTP to tour Pakistan, Pakistan had significant Covid 19 deaths and the PCB were under significant pressure to recover $200-300 million from the broadcasters, would the ECB have helped the PCB out?

  22. #22
    Debut
    Sep 2012
    Runs
    86,587
    Mentioned
    6597 Post(s)
    Tagged
    38 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by Savak View Post
    Imagine if the situation was in reverse where the ECB were obligated under the FTP to tour Pakistan, Pakistan had significant Covid 19 deaths and the PCB were under significant pressure to recover $200-300 million from the broadcasters, would the ECB have helped the PCB out?
    The UK have significant deaths because of their demographics, not because the virus in UK is different to the one in Pakistan.

    The Pakistani players will not be under greater risk of catching the virus than they are now, unless they have complete confined themselves in their homes which I don’t think is the case. It is simply not possible.

    ECB is not PCB - it is a responsible and competent board that will leave no stone unturned to ensure that the safety of the players is of paramount importance.

    If it was the other way around, perhaps the ECB would not have opted to tour unless they were heading to Australia of India, simply because a tour of Pakistan is less important.

    On the other hand, a tour of England is very significant to Pakistan. We need this.

    If we want to feel important and decide to play hard ball by attempting to arm-twist ECB into touring Pakistan because we are doing them favors by honoring the FTP, it will only be our loss in the long run. The PCB is not in a position to act tough or entitled.

    Thankfully Wasim Khan seems to be operating sensibly and taking smart decisions for once.

  23. #23
    Debut
    Jan 2014
    Venue
    Deen Over Dunya
    Runs
    2,050
    Mentioned
    48 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Nothing wrong with the PCB mentioning it to the ECB, but in my opinion this is not an issue you can coerce or compell teams into doing. There is no alternative either than doing the hard work (which PCB has apparently done so far) in ensuring that PSL, small tours, bigger tours vs SL/BD goes through without a hitch. If the groundwork is done properly, teams like England and Australia will probably tour eventually. You also have to remember that white countries may not care if Bangladesh or Sri Lanka tour safely 100 times.

  24. #24
    Debut
    Oct 2009
    Venue
    England
    Runs
    5,836
    Mentioned
    9 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by Savak View Post
    Imagine if the situation was in reverse where the ECB were obligated under the FTP to tour Pakistan, Pakistan had significant Covid 19 deaths and the PCB were under significant pressure to recover $200-300 million from the broadcasters, would the ECB have helped the PCB out?
    Can't compare. Most Pakistan players have been to England several times.
    Several leading English cricketers like Stokes, Root, Buttler, Wood, Archer, Bairstow, Broad etc would have never ever stepped foot in Pakistan.
    At least Pakistan players would be visiting a country they are familiar spending plenty of time in.
    Same won't be the case if England go to Pakistan.
    So there is a big distinction here.

  25. #25
    Debut
    Apr 2013
    Venue
    Karachi
    Runs
    42,277
    Mentioned
    2233 Post(s)
    Tagged
    4 Thread(s)
    The PCB chairman clarified that Pakistan are going to play in England without any pre-conditions with the ECB (England & Wales Cricket Board) to ensure the England visit here on reciprocal basis. “I’ll make it clear once and for all we in the PCB have not set any pre-conditions whatever in agreeing to play in England. On the contrary we are helping the ECB in restarting international cricket after this very long break because of the Covid-19 pandemic,” Mani stressed.

    “The media can say and write whatever they want but from our perspective PCB is not forcing the ECB to send their team to Pakistan as conditions for this summer’s series. These are critical times at every sphere of life and we are just helping ECB in resumption of top international cricket. The West Indies are already there and we’ll also do the same in a bio-secure atmosphere necessitated by global spreading of Covid-19. England are due to tour Pakistan in 2021-22 as per the ICC Future Tours Programme and as far we understand that series is on.”

    https://www.dawn.com/news/1564207


    Follow PakPassion on Twitter, Facebook and Instagram!

  26. #26
    Debut
    Jan 2020
    Runs
    3
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    There’s no harm in mentioning possible future tours to Pak but they shouldn’t use leverage or force because that just sets a bad example and shows desperation. Also COVID-19 cases in Pakistan will make it really difficult to hold a home series in the near future because PCB can’t ensure the players ‘safety’ in a bio secure bubble like the ECB. Bad luck for PCB especially when PSL and Ban/SL tours to Pak were so successful recently.


Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •