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  1. #2161
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    Congrats England, commiserations to Pak supporters here. As a neutral I enjoyed these last 4 days, what a test match. Hope we see 2 more crackers, for the sake of interest in this series I hope Pakistan wins a thriller next.

  2. #2162
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    Dec 2005
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeetlodil View Post
    For England you need quality. Woakes is an all rounder because he is a test bowler who can bat. Pakistan needs a similar guy. I find the 5 batsmen approach good. It will force the 5 to take more responsibility.
    Woakes was averaging 5 in his last 11 tests. Some 'all-rounder'. Pakistani bowlers just completely switched off while bowling to him today, although full credit to him for taking toll on the filth served up to him.

  3. #2163
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    Jun 2019
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    It was a great test match. Both sides had their moments. I feel sad for Pakistan, they didn't play bad, just that one partnership between Buttler and Woakes took the game away from them.

  4. #2164
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    Had to log in after 10 years to say the same poison that was present then is present now. People being picked for reasons other than merit. It’s led to us picking mediocrity and seeing pathetic displays of cricket. For a country which boasts of its abundant talent its amazing to see how we end up with this lot.

    Azhar Ali showed that he is not fit to be in the team let alone as captain. He was absolutely clueless today on the pitch. He had no ideas, no plan and no system to work towards.

    In addition to this, our bowling is woeful. The nonsense spread by hard core fanatics of having young bowlers who swing the bowl both ways etc was brought to light and the fact this is perpetuated by ex cricketers or those within out boards show that we actually lack insight into the technical aspects of our young crickets which worries me deeply.

    How on earth can we have bowlers in this day and age who lack basic knowledge of how to hold a ball and swing the ball. They show no skill in their seam position or swing let alone reverse swing.

    The batting was abysmal. Still waiting for the ever elusive Fawad Alan to be given an opportunity but knowing Pakistan it would be considered blasphemous to play someone who has shown some skill or adeptness at First Class level.

    Until we get rid of the buffoons in the hierarchy and start with a new system that allows development from the bottom upwards we will always wallow in this failing pit of misery.

    It’s about time we re-structure our coaching to rely on technical coaching of the minutiae of all aspects of bowling, fielding and batting.
    An example would be to ensure every one of our pace bowlers has the ability to swing the bowl in an orthodox manner by holding the same upright and angling it towards first or leg slip. In this day an age you’d expect a slower bowl or a wobbly seam bowl also.

    What we’ve seen is purely the manifestation of poor foundations and papering over cracks which have come to haunt us.

    Azhar should be dropped. He provided no utility whatsoever for this team over the 4days. His failure to bowl Shadab shows he was clueless. At 5 down, we should’ve surrounded England and pressurised them into making rash shots. Yet he lost the plot and just let them run us around the park.

    I would drop him for Fawad but we definitely and desperately need a new leader who understands the nuances of the game.

  5. #2165
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    Mar 2019
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    Quote Originally Posted by Usman Chadda View Post
    Woakes was averaging 5 in his last 11 tests. Some 'all-rounder'. Pakistani bowlers just completely switched off while bowling to him today, although full credit to him for taking toll on the filth served up to him.
    You see. He is a bowler even if he does not bat. The more he bats he comes close to being an all rounder. He will make it to the team purely on his bowling. That is what test cricket requires. Make it to the team on one quality skill. If you can do the second well, you can be an all rounder. Now take this in Shadabs context.

  6. #2166
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    Shaheen is a garbage test bowler

  7. #2167
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    Oct 2004
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    Shane Warne

    "That was something special from England. It is not often that we see these special performances. Chasing a decent score in the last innings is always tough. What really impressed me with Jos Buttler was the way he went about it. He trusted himself and said 'I'm the man, I'm going to get this done. I'm going to be here' and he just played beautifully. I think that helped Chris Woakes go, he was struggling for form with the bat and came in and played extremely well."


    Nasser Hussain

    "The other lad, Jos Buttler, he is in that inner-circle, in that think-tank. He's had three difficult days, he's dropped a couple of chances and do to all that and all the pressures of being on the field for virtually every moment, to go out and at the situation they were win and play like he did - that will be a very popular partnership from Buttler and Woakes."

    "It was incredible Test match cricket. Most wins life a dressing room and you're thrilled in there but there are certain wins that the dressing room will absolutely love and that was one for England because of who was involved in that win. Chris Woakes is probably the most popular man in that dressing room, probably the most under-valued cricketer by England really.

    "He always does it, he always goes under the radar and he is always the one who is left out because the superstars in that side - the 500-wicket boys, the nearly 600-wicket boy - but he is always there for England. He said on interview last night that he could do with a few more runs and he certainly delivered today!"


    For the latest updates on Cricket, follow @PakPassion on Twitter

  8. #2168
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    Ben Stokes is captain clutch. Tough loss but when you have 2 full time batsmen who are walking wickets, the fact we came this close is impressive.

    I hope this is the last match for Shafiq and Azhar ever.

  9. #2169
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    Aug 2010
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    Quote Originally Posted by Infinitee786 View Post
    Had to log in after 10 years to say the same poison that was present then is present now. People being picked for reasons other than merit. It’s led to us picking mediocrity and seeing pathetic displays of cricket. For a country which boasts of its abundant talent its amazing to see how we end up with this lot.

    Azhar Ali showed that he is not fit to be in the team let alone as captain. He was absolutely clueless today on the pitch. He had no ideas, no plan and no system to work towards.

    In addition to this, our bowling is woeful. The nonsense spread by hard core fanatics of having young bowlers who swing the bowl both ways etc was brought to light and the fact this is perpetuated by ex cricketers or those within out boards show that we actually lack insight into the technical aspects of our young crickets which worries me deeply.

    How on earth can we have bowlers in this day and age who lack basic knowledge of how to hold a ball and swing the ball. They show no skill in their seam position or swing let alone reverse swing.

    The batting was abysmal. Still waiting for the ever elusive Fawad Alan to be given an opportunity but knowing Pakistan it would be considered blasphemous to play someone who has shown some skill or adeptness at First Class level.

    Until we get rid of the buffoons in the hierarchy and start with a new system that allows development from the bottom upwards we will always wallow in this failing pit of misery.

    It’s about time we re-structure our coaching to rely on technical coaching of the minutiae of all aspects of bowling, fielding and batting.
    An example would be to ensure every one of our pace bowlers has the ability to swing the bowl in an orthodox manner by holding the same upright and angling it towards first or leg slip. In this day an age you’d expect a slower bowl or a wobbly seam bowl also.

    What we’ve seen is purely the manifestation of poor foundations and papering over cracks which have come to haunt us.

    Azhar should be dropped. He provided no utility whatsoever for this team over the 4days. His failure to bowl Shadab shows he was clueless. At 5 down, we should’ve surrounded England and pressurised them into making rash shots. Yet he lost the plot and just let them run us around the park.

    I would drop him for Fawad but we definitely and desperately need a new leader who understands the nuances of the game.
    Brilliant post, sadly little has changed in your 10 years of exile.

    Our team selections reek of favouritism. Azhar Ali should've retired after the England tour of 2018 when it was becoming clear his reflexes and hand-eye coordination could no longer compensate for his technical weaknesses. If he's unwilling to make that decision, our selectors should've made it for him.

    Yet this new, more "professional" PCB appoint him Test skipper despite being a failure as ODI captain !

    There is literally no basis for Asad Shafiq being given a run of 75 Tests over 10 years without ever being dropped. There are batsmen in 4 day cricket who've averaged higher and who've scored more FC centuries than him. You mentioned one of them - but his technique is not aesthetically pleasing enough. These jahils would never have selected Steve Smith or Shiv Chanderpaul by that logic.

    The worst part though is hiring a coach who's never coached (Misbah) and rehiring a multiple times failed coach (Waqar).

  10. #2170
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    Sad how Fawad will be brought at the age of 35 and if he fails it will be “I told you so”, when he is well passed his prime.

  11. #2171
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    A famous come-from-behind win for England, a gut-wrenching defeat for Pakistan. Just think of the situations they've been in where the game looked as good as done. A first-innings lead of 100-plus yesterday, then having England reeling at 117/5 in the chase today. But they've lacked that killer blow. A wretched third innings performance kept England in the game, before the heroic stand between the under-fire Jos Buttler and Chris Woakes pulled off the unlikely
    In all honesty Pakistan played much better then most anticipated.
    A cracking series in offer

  12. #2172
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    Excellent test match between 2 very evenly matched teams

  13. #2173
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    A lot of frustrated folks out there including me for the team selection - is that new? We can only play with what we have and even then we did pretty well. Pak lost the plot when Buttler and Woakes took the charge to them. As Holding obliviously pointed out the lack of strategy against Woakes - constantly feeding the ball in his zone instead of bowling closer to him.

    Oh well, It is Pak cricket - you never know what they bring in to the next episode. Planning is not something we are used to of. This is how us Pakistanis do - Go Pak and entertain us!!!.


    Best of The Best : Tendulkar - Wasim - Gilchrist

  14. #2174
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    Our batting again let us down in the second innings. Another 50 runs and we would have won the match. Take nothing away from England, well played.


    PP's own self proclaimed sharpshooter and defender of Islam and Pakistan.

  15. #2175
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    Playing Shadab was a blunder. No point playing him if he can't be trusted to bowl more. Playing Fahim would have been a better move, this would have given sufficient rest to all the pacers and allowed them to operate with full energy in all the spells

  16. #2176
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    From what I saw , pakistan pacers in their second third spells looked short of a gallop, you can understand that with playing no competitive cricket for a while, Joe root did mention this at the toss that the competitive games against Windies will give us a edge.

  17. #2177
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    Drop Shadab, and play Faheem next match. I know he's not liked but there's not much choice unless you go with Sohail Khan.

  18. #2178
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    Quote Originally Posted by shaz619 View Post
    Yasir took 40% of the wickets for his team, as a Eng fan I feared him the most and also Abbas with a new dukes ball in his hand. However, I feel the leggie could have been used a bit more positively, Woakes and Butler were too good for Pakistan who will be hurting due to the poor 2nd innings Batting
    As a England fan I'm still not convinced, our main bowlers are both aged , no decent spinner , archer finding his feet, a very shaky top order , let's be honest we've been let off the hook by a side whose bowlers looked short of a gallop towards the end because of not playing for a while.

  19. #2179
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    You can’t blame our bowlers, the captain was woeful, and absolutely no encouragement to them when this game were going wrong!

  20. #2180
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    The captain made tactical errors.He didn't use the right bowlers at the right time.Pakistan hardly bowled any bouncers.Woakes was give room to hit.He should have been cramped.Pakistan needs to look at each batsman's strengths and weaknesses.There is so much technology available.Stil this was a competitive match.Shaheen and Nadeem are young and inexperienced they will get better.


  21. #2181
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    criminal that woakes, known for his weakness against short pitched bowling, was not peppered with bouncers. Ok we have inexperienced fast bowlers but the captain and coaches should've conveyed this message to them.

  22. #2182
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    I don’t think this is to be blamed on team selection. We snatched defeat from the jaws of victory. The same players everyone is piling on now are the ones that set the foundation for the win. We lacked the killer instinct at the end. At the point where we had our foot on their throat, instead of pushing down we just held still. That comes from two things, lack of captaincy fortitude and an inexperienced bowling attack still learning. 3 of the players are under-23 with very few tests under their belt. Abbas is only a few tests ahead of them. They played their hearts out.

    It is clear, Azhar is not the answer at captaincy, and both him and Shafiq are done as batsmen. Fawad needs to come in for Shafiq in the next test. I would rather take his 20 odd score and see what he has to offer over someone who is clearly done. Also after this series, I want to see Azhar relieved of his captaincy duties. Hand them over to Babar or Shan. If we’re gonna lose due to captaincy I would rather lose with a young captain learning and potentially getting better rather then someone at the end of their career.

  23. #2183
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    Quote Originally Posted by Infinitee786 View Post
    Had to log in after 10 years to say the same poison that was present then is present now. People being picked for reasons other than merit. It’s led to us picking mediocrity and seeing pathetic displays of cricket. For a country which boasts of its abundant talent its amazing to see how we end up with this lot.

    Azhar Ali showed that he is not fit to be in the team let alone as captain. He was absolutely clueless today on the pitch. He had no ideas, no plan and no system to work towards.

    In addition to this, our bowling is woeful. The nonsense spread by hard core fanatics of having young bowlers who swing the bowl both ways etc was brought to light and the fact this is perpetuated by ex cricketers or those within out boards show that we actually lack insight into the technical aspects of our young crickets which worries me deeply.

    How on earth can we have bowlers in this day and age who lack basic knowledge of how to hold a ball and swing the ball. They show no skill in their seam position or swing let alone reverse swing.

    The batting was abysmal. Still waiting for the ever elusive Fawad Alan to be given an opportunity but knowing Pakistan it would be considered blasphemous to play someone who has shown some skill or adeptness at First Class level.

    Until we get rid of the buffoons in the hierarchy and start with a new system that allows development from the bottom upwards we will always wallow in this failing pit of misery.

    It’s about time we re-structure our coaching to rely on technical coaching of the minutiae of all aspects of bowling, fielding and batting.
    An example would be to ensure every one of our pace bowlers has the ability to swing the bowl in an orthodox manner by holding the same upright and angling it towards first or leg slip. In this day an age you’d expect a slower bowl or a wobbly seam bowl also.

    What we’ve seen is purely the manifestation of poor foundations and papering over cracks which have come to haunt us.

    Azhar should be dropped. He provided no utility whatsoever for this team over the 4days. His failure to bowl Shadab shows he was clueless. At 5 down, we should’ve surrounded England and pressurised them into making rash shots. Yet he lost the plot and just let them run us around the park.

    I would drop him for Fawad but we definitely and desperately need a new leader who understands the nuances of the game.
    Unfortunately, if the current generation of fans want to continue to watch this team, then there is no choice but to accept and embrace mediocrity.

  24. #2184
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kroll View Post
    Unfortunately, if the current generation of fans want to continue to watch this team, then there is no choice but to accept and embrace mediocrity.
    Do you not think your being abit unfair, England at home are very strong, recently battered India 4-1, Australia drew last year 2-2 and celebrated as if they've won series 5-0

  25. #2185
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    Congratulations to England on the win. Pakistan competed well and could have won this game despite the mediocre batting performance in the second innings. 169 was just not good enough. The conditions were good for batting and they should have got at least 300. 400+/- run-chase would have resulted in a totally different ball game altogether. Even in the first innings one man (Shan) scored almost 50% of the runs. Nevertheless chasing 277 for victory, at 117/5 England appeared to be in big trouble or the game was 50-50 (at best) but Buttler and Woakes batted really well to rescue England.

    Above said, Pakistan exceeded my expectations in this test. Batting looks thin on paper and I thought even bowling attack was relatively inexperienced in English conditions. Babar Azam is the only quality batsman in this team. The rest including Azhar and Asad are just not consistent enough with the bat. Both Abid Ali and Asad Shafiq disappointed in this match. Tail is too long imo after Shadab. I know Yasir Shah can bat a bit but the rest cannot be relied upon to make even 20 runs collectively! Perhaps Fawad Alam should be given another chance. I know he is getting on a bit (and probably deserved an extended test run before) but you do need one or two players like him in your line-up who have the ability to stick around or occupy the crease for long periods. Him being left-handed might be an added advantage against the English seamers.

  26. #2186
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    Quote Originally Posted by Manunited18 View Post
    Do you not think your being abit unfair, England at home are very strong, recently battered India 4-1, Australia drew last year 2-2 and celebrated as if they've won series 5-0
    Its the grander scheme of things. The result is only a reflection of the mediocrity that prevails in Pak cricket. The appointment of Misbah when he has no credentials.

    The appointment of Azhar as Test captain when he can no longer bat, the continuing selections of mediocre seniors and on and on.

  27. #2187
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    Quote Originally Posted by Manunited18 View Post
    As a England fan I'm still not convinced, our main bowlers are both aged , no decent spinner , archer finding his feet, a very shaky top order , let's be honest we've been let off the hook by a side whose bowlers looked short of a gallop towards the end because of not playing for a while.
    Fair, but it is hard to replace Cook at the top; we need to give these boys time. Lets be frank, Bess is not Test standard, Mo is arguably the best spinner in the country and I struggle to see why Bess is picked with Leach in the squad. Anderson and Broad still have a bit of gass left in the tank, for Anderson we have a solid replacement in home conditions in Woakes, Archer will get better with experience and the likes of Root and Stokes will hold the side together. It is a new England and era for them no doubt about that, but hopefully we find the right balance and develop that Chemistry. Then there's foakes to and decision to take gloves of Butler, I think he can still play as a specialist batsman down the order but they seem to like giving him a long rope and I suppose they can keep their options open that way, the selections have been dynamic for better or worse and I like how the pacers are being rotated, this way both vets and young uns will get a go and work together to produce optimum results


    Ah, so this is what it feels like

  28. #2188
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    From 117/5, even if you presume a number of things were about to go wrong for Pakistan you'd still favour them; this is why I feel Woakes and Butler deserve more credit then anything imo it just shows both performed exceedingly well in the circumstances, but I suppose it is a bitter pill for Pak to swallow because of that and they have been in a number of close encounters haven't they without being able to finish off the game as tourists

  29. #2189
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    I hate you....never watching pakistan again late at night. I am so angry.
    anyways well played England. Pakistan may be lacking match practice. Not trying to make excuses for the pathetic bowling display but it could be a real factor in this case.

  30. #2190
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    Quote Originally Posted by MMHS View Post
    I am a firm believer that DRS should be kept with umpires only - on field umpires to take the call and if he is not sure, he can check it with 3rd umpire. And, if there is a blunder by on-field umpires, 3rd umpire can review before the next ball and suggest the main umpires. After that, if still anyone is unlucky, it’s part of the game. DRS should never be with the players.
    If you give that power to the umpires, then we are again back to making all sorts of bias accusations. If the umpires do not review, the fans will ask why?

  31. #2191
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    Quote Originally Posted by tyron_woodley View Post
    I hate you....never watching pakistan again late at night. I am so angry.
    anyways well played England. Pakistan may be lacking match practice. Not trying to make excuses for the pathetic bowling display but it could be a real factor in this case.
    I wouldn’t blame the bowlers for what the batters couldn’t do. We need to drop the deadwood and fast.

  32. #2192
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    Quote Originally Posted by tyron_woodley View Post
    I hate you....never watching pakistan again late at night. I am so angry.
    anyways well played England. Pakistan may be lacking match practice. Not trying to make excuses for the pathetic bowling display but it could be a real factor in this case.
    Finding ways to make excuses for the loss and yet still managing to say you hate Pakistan Cricket.

    Love/Hate relationship, seen it many times before.

  33. #2193
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    very weak batting line up including the sr players

  34. #2194
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    Quote Originally Posted by LegendAli View Post
    Finding ways to make excuses for the loss and yet still managing to say you hate Pakistan Cricket.

    Love/Hate relationship, seen it many times before.
    I wasn't serious lol. I will probably still watch but not too late because it drains me the next day. In australia it starts at 9 unfortunately. I watched till freaking 2 am yesterday. Never doing that again.

  35. #2195
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shoaibbtt View Post
    I wouldn’t blame the bowlers for what the batters couldn’t do. We need to drop the deadwood and fast.
    c'mon 277 was a par score. I don't understand how they let this one slip. I understand batting was poor in the second innings but the lead was more than enough to defend.

  36. #2196
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    Quote Originally Posted by Napa View Post
    If you give that power to the umpires, then we are again back to making all sorts of bias accusations. If the umpires do not review, the fans will ask why?
    Umpires will be from 3rd county - still there could be question raised, but this is the possible best case.

  37. #2197
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mamoon View Post
    Just call him 12 years old and he will look even more impressive.
    At max he may be 19 years old. Show me better and faster bowlers at that age across the world?

  38. #2198
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    Very saddening loss indeed.

    Spent days looking forward to the match up and daily checking the score only for our team to pretty much choke on us towards the end of the game and showcase their inferiority.

    You start to question why you put so much heart into it all to begin with.

  39. #2199
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    Quote Originally Posted by shaz619 View Post
    Fair, but it is hard to replace Cook at the top; we need to give these boys time. Lets be frank, Bess is not Test standard, Mo is arguably the best spinner in the country and I struggle to see why Bess is picked with Leach in the squad. Anderson and Broad still have a bit of gass left in the tank, for Anderson we have a solid replacement in home conditions in Woakes, Archer will get better with experience and the likes of Root and Stokes will hold the side together. It is a new England and era for them no doubt about that, but hopefully we find the right balance and develop that Chemistry. Then there's foakes to and decision to take gloves of Butler, I think he can still play as a specialist batsman down the order but they seem to like giving him a long rope and I suppose they can keep their options open that way, the selections have been dynamic for better or worse and I like how the pacers are being rotated, this way both vets and young uns will get a go and work together to produce optimum results
    England's main goal is to build a side which will go to Australia to regain the urn, the issues I mentioned will not be rectified, the bowling will be weak for Australian conditions, any of Bess, Ali, leach will be pants dow under, and as for life after broad the drop off in quality is scary, remember woakes outside England is not effective. The openers look vulnerable to quality bowling, hameed could rectify that, root himself is not the same since hes been made captain and the 3 spot is again really vulnerable.

  40. #2200
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    Pakistan bowling great Wasim Akram was critical of Azhar Ali's captaincy, saying he "missed a trick", as they fell to defeat defending 277 in the first #raisethebat Test against England.

    England clinched a memorable three-wicket win at Emirates Old Trafford, led by a brilliant 139-run stand between Jos Buttler (75) and Chris Woakes (84no) which took the game away from the visitors.

    Buttler's place in the England side has been called into questioned after wicketkeeping errors in this Test and having only one Test ton to his name, in 2018, while Woakes averaged just 5.22 with the bat in his previous six Tests.

    "It will hurt," Wasim said on Pakistan's defeat. "It will hurt the Pakistan team and the cricket lovers in Pakistan.

    "Winning and losing is part of cricket, but I think our captain missed a trick quite a few times in this game, as far as his leadership is concerned.

    "When Woakes came in, there were no bouncers, no short deliveries, they let him settle down and runs were coming easy.

    "Once the partnership got going, nothing happened - the turn didn't happen, swing didn't happen - and Buttler and Woakes just took the game away."

    Sky Sports' Nasser Hussain also questioned Pakistan's bowling tactics and why England weren't subjected to the usual array of bouncers and yorkers from their quick bowlers.

    "They must have video footage of Woakes," Hussain said. "Woakes got hit on the head [in the first innings] and has been a bit wafty with the short ball and they didn't go at him at all.

    Man of the match Chris Woakes speaks about how he has been working on his batting which helped England win the first Test
    "Naseem [Shah] bowled only 13 overs and, if you're going to save him, save him for some chin music.

    "When we played against Pakistan - albeit greats like Wasim and Waqar - on a pitch like that, they would take it out of the equation if it went flat.

    "Then, when you were fending it off, it would be at your toes, at the base of the stumps.

    "Maybe the coach is trying to get this discipline into the bowlers, dry up the runs, but there has to be a period with Pakistan cricket where they go, 'you know what we're good at, we're good at going at you'."

    Wasim was asked off the back of Hussain's comments whether Pakistan's pursuit of discipline from their pace attack was a reasonable excuse, but he wasn't having it.

    "I hope not," answered Wasim. "Pakistan cricket is all about flair, unpredictability and attacking cricket.

    "We're not county bowlers who are just going to come and bowl line and length all day long.

    "We've got a 17-year-old [Naseem], who bowls 90mph, a 20-year-old [Shaheen Afridi], who is around 88mph, and they should be bowling a lot more overs - 18-20 overs each innings, no matter the situation."

    Jos Buttler spoke in the Player Zone after England clinched a memorable three-wicket win on day four at Emirates Old Trafford
    As for Pakistan captain Azhar, speaking at the post-match presentation, he chose to credit the brilliance of Buttler and Woakes, rather than question his team's efforts, comparing it to Ben Stokes' famous match-winning knock at Headingley last year.

    "Credit to England, especially Buttler and Woakes," said Azhar. "When we were sitting in a very comfortable position, they took the game on and the pitch started to do nothing when they were playing.

    "They changed the momentum of the game and unfortunately we couldn't reply to whatever they threw at us.

    "It's tough when someone plays like that to keep the field up or keep the boundaries dry, but sometimes you have to give credit to the opposition and it was one of the best match-winning innings' of recent past.

    "Stokes played one against Australia and this one is not far behind because the situation was tough for the batting side."

    https://www.skysports.com/cricket/ne...ys-wasim-akram


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  41. #2201
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    Quote Originally Posted by tyron_woodley View Post
    c'mon 277 was a par score. I don't understand how they let this one slip. I understand batting was poor in the second innings but the lead was more than enough to defend.
    Azer alis captaincy was really poor, also the young and inexperienced seamers lacked a gallop in their third spells which is clearly understandable having not played any competitive cricket for a while

  42. #2202
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    Quote Originally Posted by tyron_woodley View Post
    I hate you....never watching pakistan again late at night. I am so angry.
    anyways well played England. Pakistan may be lacking match practice. Not trying to make excuses for the pathetic bowling display but it could be a real factor in this case.
    Remember the Indian attack is very experienced and aged

  43. #2203
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    Quote Originally Posted by MenInG View Post
    Pakistan bowling great Wasim Akram was critical of Azhar Ali's captaincy, saying he "missed a trick", as they fell to defeat defending 277 in the first #raisethebat Test against England.

    England clinched a memorable three-wicket win at Emirates Old Trafford, led by a brilliant 139-run stand between Jos Buttler (75) and Chris Woakes (84no) which took the game away from the visitors.

    Buttler's place in the England side has been called into questioned after wicketkeeping errors in this Test and having only one Test ton to his name, in 2018, while Woakes averaged just 5.22 with the bat in his previous six Tests.

    "It will hurt," Wasim said on Pakistan's defeat. "It will hurt the Pakistan team and the cricket lovers in Pakistan.

    "Winning and losing is part of cricket, but I think our captain missed a trick quite a few times in this game, as far as his leadership is concerned.

    "When Woakes came in, there were no bouncers, no short deliveries, they let him settle down and runs were coming easy.

    "Once the partnership got going, nothing happened - the turn didn't happen, swing didn't happen - and Buttler and Woakes just took the game away."

    Sky Sports' Nasser Hussain also questioned Pakistan's bowling tactics and why England weren't subjected to the usual array of bouncers and yorkers from their quick bowlers.

    "They must have video footage of Woakes," Hussain said. "Woakes got hit on the head [in the first innings] and has been a bit wafty with the short ball and they didn't go at him at all.

    Man of the match Chris Woakes speaks about how he has been working on his batting which helped England win the first Test
    "Naseem [Shah] bowled only 13 overs and, if you're going to save him, save him for some chin music.

    "When we played against Pakistan - albeit greats like Wasim and Waqar - on a pitch like that, they would take it out of the equation if it went flat.

    "Then, when you were fending it off, it would be at your toes, at the base of the stumps.

    "Maybe the coach is trying to get this discipline into the bowlers, dry up the runs, but there has to be a period with Pakistan cricket where they go, 'you know what we're good at, we're good at going at you'."

    Wasim was asked off the back of Hussain's comments whether Pakistan's pursuit of discipline from their pace attack was a reasonable excuse, but he wasn't having it.

    "I hope not," answered Wasim. "Pakistan cricket is all about flair, unpredictability and attacking cricket.

    "We're not county bowlers who are just going to come and bowl line and length all day long.

    "We've got a 17-year-old [Naseem], who bowls 90mph, a 20-year-old [Shaheen Afridi], who is around 88mph, and they should be bowling a lot more overs - 18-20 overs each innings, no matter the situation."

    Jos Buttler spoke in the Player Zone after England clinched a memorable three-wicket win on day four at Emirates Old Trafford
    As for Pakistan captain Azhar, speaking at the post-match presentation, he chose to credit the brilliance of Buttler and Woakes, rather than question his team's efforts, comparing it to Ben Stokes' famous match-winning knock at Headingley last year.

    "Credit to England, especially Buttler and Woakes," said Azhar. "When we were sitting in a very comfortable position, they took the game on and the pitch started to do nothing when they were playing.

    "They changed the momentum of the game and unfortunately we couldn't reply to whatever they threw at us.

    "It's tough when someone plays like that to keep the field up or keep the boundaries dry, but sometimes you have to give credit to the opposition and it was one of the best match-winning innings' of recent past.

    "Stokes played one against Australia and this one is not far behind because the situation was tough for the batting side."

    https://www.skysports.com/cricket/ne...ys-wasim-akram
    Got to agree with hussain, woakes and the England lower order of late have not fancied the chin music at all, these tactics of azer ali and the bowlers were baffling to say the least

  44. #2204
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  45. #2205
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  46. #2206
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    Quote Originally Posted by Forward Defensive Push View Post
    At max he may be 19 years old. Show me better and faster bowlers at that age across the world?
    He is 19-20, because Pakistan called him a 16 year old in 2016. It means that he is roughly the same age as Shaheen, who is a significantly better bowler.

    So people who are acting as if Naseem is the second coming of Steyn or Waqar don’t even have to look beyond their own side.

    Furthermore, someone like Naseem wouldn’t even get into a good team at the moment. The likes of India, England, Australia, New Zealand and South Africa wouldn’t even consider him for selection at this point, but Pakistani fans think he is our spearhead and Naseem is already talking about “fear” in batsmen’s eyes.

    There is nothing special about him apart from the fact that PCB have forced his hype by lowering his age. We saw Indian and West Indies U-19 pacers bowling heavy balls only recently.

    Yes Naseem can hit 90 mph, but he is not the only bowler in his age group who can do that. The problem is that Pakistani fans are in a league of their own when it comes to getting hyper and doing bhangra over very little.

    We really need to calm down and make peace with what we truly are - a very mediocre cricket nation that produces very mediocre cricketers barring 1-2 exceptions every now and then, and Naseem is not one of those exceptions.

  47. #2207
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    Quote Originally Posted by Manunited18 View Post
    England's main goal is to build a side which will go to Australia to regain the urn, the issues I mentioned will not be rectified, the bowling will be weak for Australian conditions, any of Bess, Ali, leach will be pants dow under, and as for life after broad the drop off in quality is scary, remember woakes outside England is not effective. The openers look vulnerable to quality bowling, hameed could rectify that, root himself is not the same since hes been made captain and the 3 spot is again really vulnerable.
    Perhaps but they need to have aims which are a lot more lofty then that such as beating India and Pakistan at home as well, for Australia we just need a top order batsman or two who can pull and cut really well, am not too concerned on the bowling front, Archer and Wood will enjoy conditions, there are prospects like Mahmood in the lions squad to, Woakes provided the option with new ball and then experience from Anderson/Broad we can use during rotation policy. While Stokes and Root hold the team together, I would bring back Mo and look to strengthen the top order which is the biggest weakness

  48. #2208
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    Quote Originally Posted by MenInG View Post
    Pakistan bowling great Wasim Akram was critical of Azhar Ali's captaincy, saying he "missed a trick", as they fell to defeat defending 277 in the first #raisethebat Test against England.

    England clinched a memorable three-wicket win at Emirates Old Trafford, led by a brilliant 139-run stand between Jos Buttler (75) and Chris Woakes (84no) which took the game away from the visitors.

    Buttler's place in the England side has been called into questioned after wicketkeeping errors in this Test and having only one Test ton to his name, in 2018, while Woakes averaged just 5.22 with the bat in his previous six Tests.

    "It will hurt," Wasim said on Pakistan's defeat. "It will hurt the Pakistan team and the cricket lovers in Pakistan.

    "Winning and losing is part of cricket, but I think our captain missed a trick quite a few times in this game, as far as his leadership is concerned.

    "When Woakes came in, there were no bouncers, no short deliveries, they let him settle down and runs were coming easy.

    "Once the partnership got going, nothing happened - the turn didn't happen, swing didn't happen - and Buttler and Woakes just took the game away."

    Sky Sports' Nasser Hussain also questioned Pakistan's bowling tactics and why England weren't subjected to the usual array of bouncers and yorkers from their quick bowlers.

    "They must have video footage of Woakes," Hussain said. "Woakes got hit on the head [in the first innings] and has been a bit wafty with the short ball and they didn't go at him at all.

    Man of the match Chris Woakes speaks about how he has been working on his batting which helped England win the first Test
    "Naseem [Shah] bowled only 13 overs and, if you're going to save him, save him for some chin music.

    "When we played against Pakistan - albeit greats like Wasim and Waqar - on a pitch like that, they would take it out of the equation if it went flat.

    "Then, when you were fending it off, it would be at your toes, at the base of the stumps.

    "Maybe the coach is trying to get this discipline into the bowlers, dry up the runs, but there has to be a period with Pakistan cricket where they go, 'you know what we're good at, we're good at going at you'."

    Wasim was asked off the back of Hussain's comments whether Pakistan's pursuit of discipline from their pace attack was a reasonable excuse, but he wasn't having it.

    "I hope not," answered Wasim. "Pakistan cricket is all about flair, unpredictability and attacking cricket.

    "We're not county bowlers who are just going to come and bowl line and length all day long.

    "We've got a 17-year-old [Naseem], who bowls 90mph, a 20-year-old [Shaheen Afridi], who is around 88mph, and they should be bowling a lot more overs - 18-20 overs each innings, no matter the situation."

    Jos Buttler spoke in the Player Zone after England clinched a memorable three-wicket win on day four at Emirates Old Trafford
    As for Pakistan captain Azhar, speaking at the post-match presentation, he chose to credit the brilliance of Buttler and Woakes, rather than question his team's efforts, comparing it to Ben Stokes' famous match-winning knock at Headingley last year.

    "Credit to England, especially Buttler and Woakes," said Azhar. "When we were sitting in a very comfortable position, they took the game on and the pitch started to do nothing when they were playing.

    "They changed the momentum of the game and unfortunately we couldn't reply to whatever they threw at us.

    "It's tough when someone plays like that to keep the field up or keep the boundaries dry, but sometimes you have to give credit to the opposition and it was one of the best match-winning innings' of recent past.

    "Stokes played one against Australia and this one is not far behind because the situation was tough for the batting side."

    https://www.skysports.com/cricket/ne...ys-wasim-akram
    I dont understand the bit of pitch is doing nothing. Then how did pope and stokes got out. There was definitely more on offer for bowlers in this pitch and it is quite difficult for the batsman to bat if they are pushed on the back foot with pressure applied. They let them go free with fielders outside and not close enough to question their technique and skill level on a turning pitch with uneven bounce.

  49. #2209
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mamoon View Post
    He is 19-20, because Pakistan called him a 16 year old in 2016. It means that he is roughly the same age as Shaheen, who is a significantly better bowler.

    So people who are acting as if Naseem is the second coming of Steyn or Waqar don’t even have to look beyond their own side.

    Furthermore, someone like Naseem wouldn’t even get into a good team at the moment. The likes of India, England, Australia, New Zealand and South Africa wouldn’t even consider him for selection at this point, but Pakistani fans think he is our spearhead and Naseem is already talking about “fear” in batsmen’s eyes.

    There is nothing special about him apart from the fact that PCB have forced his hype by lowering his age. We saw Indian and West Indies U-19 pacers bowling heavy balls only recently.

    Yes Naseem can hit 90 mph, but he is not the only bowler in his age group who can do that. The problem is that Pakistani fans are in a league of their own when it comes to getting hyper and doing bhangra over very little.

    We really need to calm down and make peace with what we truly are - a very mediocre cricket nation that produces very mediocre cricketers barring 1-2 exceptions every now and then, and Naseem is not one of those exceptions.
    Totally agree with you here. Naseem is not the world beater , he definitely need more FC games to gain experience. Lesson should be learnt from the Aus tour where they thrust in youngsters (Naseem and Musa) and sticking with him im still ok with that. But Ehsan adil and Sameen gul were apparently doing well in domestics FC but chances are given to musa naseem and haris rauf instead.
    Last edited by ask_analyse_act; 9th August 2020 at 16:40.

  50. #2210
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    The bowling group for pakistan performed well when you have to consider they've had no test cricket for 6 months, yesterday they looked short of a gallop towards the end

  51. #2211
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    Quote Originally Posted by shaz619 View Post
    From 117/5, even if you presume a number of things were about to go wrong for Pakistan you'd still favour them; this is why I feel Woakes and Butler deserve more credit then anything imo it just shows both performed exceedingly well in the circumstances, but I suppose it is a bitter pill for Pak to swallow because of that and they have been in a number of close encounters haven't they without being able to finish off the game as tourists

    I dont understand you. I thought you were a Pakistan fan. But now England are having a good patch you are an England fan. When Pakistan won the CT you were a full Pakistan fan.

  52. #2212
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    Pakistan’s defeat at Old Trafford falls on dismal, dithering captaincy from Azhar Ali

    By the time Azhar came out of his slumber and realised that attack was the best form of defence, it was all too late for the tourists

    By Saj Sadiq





    For nearly 68 years the Pakistan cricket team has had an uncanny ability to win matches from near impossible situations and lose matches when victory was almost within sight.

    Following the Pakistani cricket team is not for the faint-hearted, and of late there seems to have been more bad days than good ones.

    From the tourists’ perspective, the Old Trafford defeat against England will be viewed as one of those matches that got away.

    After bowling England out for 219, Pakistan were in firm control of a match that had gone almost perfectly for them.

    They batted first after winning the toss, scored a respectable 326, built a first innings lead of 107 and hour by hour, session by session, it was all going according to plan.

    But when first innings centurion Shan Masood got out for a duck in the second innings playing a lazy leg-side glance, there was a sense of déjà vu, a feeling that Pakistan could still make a complete mess of a match that was firmly in their grasp. Batsmen came and went in a frenetic second innings. There was a lack of application, no direction or plan when they batted second-time around. But, despite the chaos, Pakistan still conjured up a healthy lead of 276.

    Pakistan would have known that in the fourth innings Joe Root and Ben Stokes were the key batsmen and at 106 for 4 with both back in the pavilion, the match seemed to be all but over. When Ollie Pope was out with the score at 117 for 5, the thought crossed collective minds: surely even Pakistan couldn’t mess this up? But that is exactly what they managed to do.

    Azhar Ali is an inexperienced captain at the highest level and that inexperience came to the fore.



    Azhar and his troops sat back instead of hammering home their advantage. The skipper started to wait for things to happen, when previously he and his bowlers had been proactive. Perhaps he thought the match was in the bag and sooner or later Woakes or Buttler would make a mistake – a tactic that came back to haunt him.

    With each run, the energy from Pakistan’s bowlers and fielders seemed to evaporate. They went from an attacking mindset to a defensive one when Woakes and Buttler launched a counter-attack.

    Pakistan’s skipper seemed confused and unsure of what to do and to whom to throw the ball.

    Shoulders started to droop and a match that Pakistan had largely dominated was slipping away. Yasir Shah kept plugging away, but the pace bowlers looked tired and their lack of international cricket in recent times was painfully evident.

    By the time Azhar had come out of his slumber and realised that attack was the best form of defence, it was all too late and Pakistan had thrown away a fantastic opportunity to go one-nil up in the three-match series.

    Where did it go wrong for Pakistan? Complacency seemed to creep in once Pope was out, the captain settled into a defensive mindset when Woakes and Buttler were batting, but above all the senior Pakistani batsmen – especially Asad Shafiq and Azhar who contributed only 54 runs in the match – have to take a long, hard look at themselves.

    The first Test loss at Old Trafford was Pakistan’s seventh consecutive Test defeat away from UAE and Pakistan.

    As expected, the defeat has not gone down well back home and given his poor form with the bat and lacklustre captaincy, the knives are already out for Azhar.

    England are unlikely to present Pakistan with as many opportunities in Southampton and the rest of the series could be an uncomfortable ride for Azhar and his team-mates.

    https://inews.co.uk/sport/cricket/pa...es-tour-575096
    Last edited by Abdullah719; 10th August 2020 at 16:40.


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  53. #2213
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    Pakistan lost this more than England winning this, there were multiple opportunities to take the game away from England. When we were a hundred or so runs ahead of them after the first innings we had an opportunity to bat them out of the game but we didnt. Still then we had an opportunity to win when we had them 5 wickets down.

    Its a combination fo lack of match practice (England have had a full series against the Windies) poor captaincy along with poor batting, you cannot blame the bowlers for this defeat.


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