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  1. #1
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    Naseem Shah - A failed experiment?

    Pakistan has gained a reputation for experimenting with bowlers at international level. First there was oddball Sohail Tanvir, then the Great Khali Mohammad Irfan and now inexperienced fast bowler Naseem Shah.

    One has to question the real reason behind his selection when you look at his performance in this series and his prior record.

    In this series, aside from bowling Circa ~ 90mph, Naseem has failed to capitalise on very bowler friendly tracks. Whilst achieving slight deviation, there has been no notable seam movement and/or swing in his arsenal.

    His prior 1sT class record is as follows:

    23 innings and 46 wickets - ave. 2 wkts/innings
    He has managed 2 x 4 fors and 3 x 5 fors. If we detract these 23 wickets he has only managed 23 wickets in 18 innings - just over 1 wicket per inning.

    It hardly screams out as the next big thing!

    Not to mention Azhar Ali’s banana swing ball swung more than Naseem Shah could imagine!

    The question is why is he even in the squad?

  2. #2
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    Overrated and overhyped. Needs to be sent back to domestic. We need a experienced bowler.

  3. #3
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    A 19-20 yr old averages under 30 in first year of test cricket and he is a failed experiment?
    He may not be the next big thing but to call him a failed experiment based on above stats is being stupid.

  4. #4
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    Sheheen and Naseem have been okish in the series I don't know why people though they would clwan up England givin both are still learning on the job and need time to develop.

  5. #5
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    If bringing in an inexperienced bowler at international level isn’t an experiment then what is it? A gamble? A punt?

    Also he is 17 which just adds to the ridiculousness of his inclusion ...

  6. #6
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    Has bowled well, not helped by the WK and slips standing too far back. He needs to use the more crease to get the batsman playing more around off stump.

  7. #7
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    He has the makings of a great bowler.
    His speed for his age is phenomenal.
    He has a nice upright seam.
    Definitely shows talent.

    He does however lack experience and needs a skilled coach to teach him to be able to swing the bowl both ways repeatedly. Although this has been claimed I have yet to see it.
    He needs quality first class cricket. I would advise him to come to English county cricket to learn his trade. Dead wickets in Pakistan won’t teach him much.

    I would persevere with him. In the next few years he will be a force to be reckoned with!

  8. #8
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    And yes Azhar Ali’s banana swing bowl has to be questioned in terms how a batsmen could bowl such a bowl yet our bowlers didn’t show much swing in the last day. I think lack of experience and understanding plays a part in our young bowlers

  9. #9
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    I agree he is definitely overhyped, but he has shown glimpses of what his explosive pace can achieve (think the explosive bounce from the Pope dismissal from 1st Test I think). Got a long way to go before I am fully convinced of his potential in Tests, but it's still too early to tell in my opinion.
    Last edited by Firebat; 20th August 2020 at 19:30.


    Arsenal all the way!! (and Pakistan, of course!)

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Infinitee786 View Post
    He has the makings of a great bowler.
    His speed for his age is phenomenal.
    He has a nice upright seam.
    Definitely shows talent.

    He does however lack experience and needs a skilled coach to teach him to be able to swing the bowl both ways repeatedly. Although this has been claimed I have yet to see it.
    He needs quality first class cricket. I would advise him to come to English county cricket to learn his trade. Dead wickets in Pakistan won’t teach him much.

    I would persevere with him. In the next few years he will be a force to be reckoned with!
    He is a straight bowler, nothing more, nothing less! Surely we have experienced talent to use - Abbas is a fine example of how experience counts

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bewal Express View Post
    Has bowled well, not helped by the WK and slips standing too far back. He needs to use the more crease to get the batsman playing more around off stump.
    Agreed on this point of making the batsman play I think his major issue in this series is his line is a bit too wide making it easy for batsman to leave the ball. His away shape is quite good best I have seen in a while of a Pakistani pacer but he is allowing the batsmen to leave him on line.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Firebat View Post
    I agree he is definitely overhyped, but he has shown glimpses of what his explosive pace can achieve (think the explosive bounce from the Pope dismissal from 1st Test I think). Got a long way to go before I am fully convinced of his potential in Tests, but it's still too early to tell in my opinion.
    Was that Naseem or was that the pitch doing the work? Old Trafford is notorious for odd bounce.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kenpachi View Post
    Was that Naseem or was that the pitch doing the work? Old Trafford is notorious for odd bounce.
    Now now if he bowls a good ball it's the pitch that does it. Did not see many bowls misbehave in the English first innings so can't put it on pitch misbehaving

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kenpachi View Post
    Was that Naseem or was that the pitch doing the work? Old Trafford is notorious for odd bounce.
    Yes which very high pace is more efficient at extracting. You can't chalk off a spinner's wicket because they bowled in the rough. Is that not "the pitch doing the work"?


    Arsenal all the way!! (and Pakistan, of course!)

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kenpachi View Post
    He is a straight bowler, nothing more, nothing less! Surely we have experienced talent to use - Abbas is a fine example of how experience counts
    He has been thrown in to the deep end and to be honest has fared quite well.
    The problem is every bowler allegedly swings it both ways which is nonsense and I think that’s what’s played into his hype. And by swing I mean orthodox swing and not reverse swing.

    I believe he is raw and there’s definitely something that we can work with. These things take time but I take your point.
    He needs to learn the craft at a lower level but I don’t mind him learning on the job neither.
    County cricket with test call ups would be great for him. One for the future

  16. #16
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    Also him playing alongside the likes of Abbas and other experience bowlers will only benefit his game. Hope they take him under their wing and teach him the tricks of the trade

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xoib View Post
    Agreed on this point of making the batsman play I think his major issue in this series is his line is a bit too wide making it easy for batsman to leave the ball. His away shape is quite good best I have seen in a while of a Pakistani pacer but he is allowing the batsmen to leave him on line.
    The reason is simple- if he bowls on the stumps, they clip him away for runs either 2 or 4. A good captain would have realised, put square leg back and let him attack the stumps.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kenpachi View Post
    His prior 1sT class record is as follows:

    23 innings and 46 wickets - ave. 2 wkts/innings
    You devalue your own argument with such arbitrary nitpicking.

    Check someone like Stuart Broad’s stats and you’ll see that he picks up less than 2 wickets per innings.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Firebat View Post
    Yes which very high pace is more efficient at extracting. You can't chalk off a spinner's wicket because they bowled in the rough. Is that not "the pitch doing the work"?
    Fair point, good wicket but still yet to hear a good reason for bringing him into the team.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Abdullah719 View Post
    You devalue your own argument with such arbitrary nitpicking.

    Check someone like Stuart Broad’s stats and you’ll see that he picks up less than 2 wickets per innings.
    Lol . Broad is proven.
    Naseem Shah is unproven.

    The other question was what was so good for him to be picked?


  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kenpachi View Post
    Lol . Broad is proven.
    Naseem Shah is unproven.

    The other question was what was so good for him to be picked?
    He is the fastest pacer in Pakistan for red ball cricket. Can move the ball at good pace and according to coaches and captain has the attitude for working hard and not to forget senior bowlers retired (Amir) or got injured (Hasan) all good reasons to bring him in and take a chance.

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kenpachi View Post
    He is a straight bowler, nothing more, nothing less! Surely we have experienced talent to use - Abbas is a fine example of how experience counts
    He was seaming the ball away in both tests. Not consistently but he definitely seamed it more than others. Mainly because he was hitting the pitch hard with upright seam.

    If he was a straight bowler he wouldn't be beating the bat that often. I don't know what makes you say he has failed. He had an excellent economy rate in both tests ~2.5 and bowled to his field. Can't remember too many bad balls from him. What I do want to see more of is yorkers and bouncers. I felt he didn't use them at all even though I know they're not that common in Test cricket anymore.
    Last edited by MenInG; 20th August 2020 at 19:45.

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    He is the next Waqar Younis in making.

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xoib View Post
    He is the fastest pacer in Pakistan for red ball cricket. Can move the ball at good pace and according to coaches and captain has the attitude for working hard and not to forget senior bowlers retired (Amir) or got injured (Hasan) all good reasons to bring him in and take a chance.
    Thanks xoib. Time will tell...

  25. #25
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    He is extremely talented

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    Is this based on last test where he only bowled 5 overs and not that many in the second test. Neither Afridi nor Naseem have been amongst the wickets much, but they hardly been thrashed by English batsmen either.
    Both are learning on job as Pak do not have any otheroptuons due ro retirement of Wahab and Amir from red ball, Hasin Ali not fully recovered, and Sohail K may break down in second inning.

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    He is not ready

    And his ceiling doesn’t look super high either

    The only novel thing about his is his ‘official’ age and if he was bowling the same way as a 22-24 year old he wouldn’t receive half the hype

  28. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hadi Rizvi View Post
    He was seaming the ball away in both tests. Not consistently but he definitely seamed it more than others. Mainly because he was hitting the pitch hard with upright seam.

    If he was a straight bowler he wouldn't be beating the bat that often. I don't know what makes you say he has failed. He had an excellent economy rate in both tests ~2.5 and bowled to his field. Can't remember too many bad balls from him. What I do want to see more of is yorkers and bouncers. I felt he didn't use them at all even though I know they're not that common in Test cricket anymore.
    Hadi...Abbas > Shaheen > Naseem.

    That is the order in which bowlers achieved deviation and / or swing.

    If he bowled bouncers, Yorkers, It would be fine. But it was the same delivery 99% of the time around 6th stump. Nothing exciting anyway
    Last edited by MenInG; 20th August 2020 at 19:45.

  29. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Slog View Post
    He is not ready

    And his ceiling doesn’t look super high either

    The only novel thing about his is his ‘official’ age and if he was bowling the same way as a 22-24 year old he wouldn’t receive half the hype
    Exactly. Mark Butcher believes he went to the Afridi age school 🤣

    Maybe he will come good, but I don’t think anyone should be sniffing around at international level until they are already there. How else do you create an environment of meritocracy?

  30. #30
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    He doesn't have too much skill right now, but not a failed experiment.

    Due to disappointing stock of pacers, fans will surely hype anything which looks reasonably good and has prospects.


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    So, failed experiment after 1 test? He bowled 5 overs in the second when the game was done.

    We sure know how to develop players. Using the same logic Shaheen is one test away from being done as well, and f he isn't already.

  32. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arsal_AK View Post
    So, failed experiment after 1 test? He bowled 5 overs in the second when the game was done.

    We sure know how to develop players. Using the same logic Shaheen is one test away from being done as well, and f he isn't already.
    Mate, you need to let them play 3-4 years in domestic cricket and let them learn the art of long format bowling there. Pick pacers in their mid 20s who have played 30-40 first class matches. It's ridiculous to throw in 17 year olds.

  33. #33
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    Not sure why we shouldnt hype our bowlers! If we dont, who will? The whole point is to given them confidence but only when we see the talent and we do see it.


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  34. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by MenInG View Post
    Not sure why we shouldnt hype our bowlers! If we dont, who will? The whole point is to given them confidence but only when we see the talent and we do see it.
    Nothing wrong with hyping players. This is an issue/question of selection and whether it is right to have him in the team

  35. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kenpachi View Post
    Nothing wrong with hyping players. This is an issue/question of selection and whether it is right to have him in the team
    I agree selection should not be based upon hype but careful analysis and in Naseem's case - maybe there is.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Ab Fan View Post
    He is the next Waqar Younis in making.
    or Mohammad Sami

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    He came on the back of solid domestic performances. Even Shaheen Afridi came on the back of solid domestic performances and he didn't set the world alite straight away, it took him a year or two before his bowling muscles and skills developed.

  38. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by MenInG View Post
    Not sure why we shouldnt hype our bowlers! If we dont, who will? .
    Nasser Hussein? Michael Holding?

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    No. Naseem is the best fast bowling prospect right now. He needs to keep working with Waqar to fine tune his run up and action. Would help if he had more experienced bowlers in tests to help take some pressure off. The issue is we have an inexperienced attack with Shaheen and Naseem. Both are great but don’t have enough experience to get wickets when needed or to find that extra effort within themselves when required.

  40. #40
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    By God, the kid has played only 6 tests and not even full ones. The glimpses of great talent is there but if you wont give a 17 year old time, who will you?

    i think he will be ideal on flat or seaming wickets more than swing.
    Last edited by Indiafan; 20th August 2020 at 20:11.


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    He is already the fastest pacer in Asia.He has skills. even in this series he has been quite unlucky in this series edges didn't carry to the fielders.He will come good with time.

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    I've said it before, Pakistan should play one of Shaheen and Naseem in Tests against the top 5 sides. It's crazy how we're already burdening them with the task of winning Tests in Australia and England when neither has played even a dozen matches !

    We need a more seasoned FC campaigner to partner Abbas with the new ball like Ehsan Adil, enabling Shaheen and Naseem to develop at their own pace.

    However Misbah doesn't seem to bother with many players in their twenties - it's a buddha or bacha selection policy.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Markhor View Post
    I've said it before, Pakistan should play one of Shaheen and Naseem in Tests against the top 5 sides. It's crazy how we're already burdening them with the task of winning Tests in Australia and England when neither has played even a dozen matches !

    We need a more seasoned FC campaigner to partner Abbas with the new ball like Ehsan Adil, enabling Shaheen and Naseem to develop at their own pace.

    However Misbah doesn't seem to bother with many players in their twenties - it's a buddha or bacha selection policy.
    Ehsan Adil is trash with the greatest of respect. Whatever happened to Mir Hamza?

    I hate to say it but I think based on form and experience Sohail Khan would’nt be a bad short term choice

    We def can’t afford both of Shaheen and Naseem at the same time and in terms of development and skill level, Shaheen is currently leagues ahead.

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    Quote Originally Posted by HappyWarsFan View Post
    Mate, you need to let them play 3-4 years in domestic cricket and let them learn the art of long format bowling there. Pick pacers in their mid 20s who have played 30-40 first class matches. It's ridiculous to throw in 17 year olds.
    That's a separate debate. The point is, in no way has been a failure. He has played four test as of yet and has a fifer and a hatrick already.

    Mid twenties is too late, early twenties should be good enough. As for Naseem has been thrown in n now, the worst we can do to him is kick him out when he is doing so well.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kenpachi View Post
    Hadi...Abbas > Shaheen > Naseem.

    That is the order in which bowlers achieved deviation and / or swing.

    If he bowled bouncers, Yorkers, It would be fine. But it was the same delivery 99% of the time around 6th stump. Nothing exciting anyway
    Holding, Warne, Ponting, Gilchrist, Slater, Atherton, Nasser, Vaughan, Bishop and so on. All these commentators saw something very special in both Shaheen and Naseem. Surely, they are onto something. Every single one of them finds Naseem exciting. ESPNCricinfo has a full article about potential future stars that includes Haris Rauf, Naseem Shah and Haider Ali. You gotta back your youngsters. You are giving too much value to our pathetic domestic system. I'd rather these guys learn on the job than in domestics where they will rot forever.

  46. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xoib View Post
    He is the fastest pacer in Pakistan for red ball cricket. Can move the ball at good pace and according to coaches and captain has the attitude for working hard and not to forget senior bowlers retired (Amir) or got injured (Hasan) all good reasons to bring him in and take a chance.
    This reply. If those two were available they’d be ahead of him on current ability (skilful bowlers) and we’d have a strong quintet of pace bowlers to pick from.


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    He is bowling wide of the crease and not close to the stumps as a result he is not getting the batsman to play......he needs to bowl closer to stumps ...and the slips and wk need to come up a bit....it's the only drawback of Rizwan. ....he can't arrange the slips properly..... May be fear of injury or something he is bowling wider need to come close to the wicket while delivering the bowl......... If u don't give chance to a promising guy at young age then who u will.....its good that pak has been giving them chance....even few years back the age at which players were given chances by Pak management was between 27 to 32..... Its ridiculous.......if u can't learn anything by playing international cricket ...u won't learn by playing domestic cricket........

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    Quote Originally Posted by Arsal_AK View Post
    That's a separate debate. The point is, in no way has been a failure. He has played four test as of yet and has a fifer and a hatrick already.

    Mid twenties is too late, early twenties should be good enough. As for Naseem has been thrown in n now, the worst we can do to him is kick him out when he is doing so well.
    Australia don’t generally select anyone under 24 so they have decent experience at domestic level. Definitely some wisdom behind this approach.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kenpachi View Post
    Australia don’t generally select anyone under 24 so they have decent experience at domestic level. Definitely some wisdom behind this approach.
    What is good for Australia is not necessarily good for others.....each cricket county has their own setup and system..

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    As I have said before, his hype is built on a lie. If PCB did not market him as some bowling version of Tendulkar who was Test class at 16, he would not be overhyped to this extent.

    He is nothing special at all, and unfortunately, he has bought into his own hype as well.

    He is not half as good as he and his fans think.

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    Oh my goodness gracious me.
    The guy still averages under 30 I believe. Take out the first game where he had his mum pass away and it's probably 25!!
    Unbelievable thread


    If you always do what you have always done, you will always get what you always got #improve

  52. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hadi Rizvi View Post
    Holding, Warne, Ponting, Gilchrist, Slater, Atherton, Nasser, Vaughan, Bishop and so on. All these commentators saw something very special in both Shaheen and Naseem. Surely, they are onto something. Every single one of them finds Naseem exciting. ESPNCricinfo has a full article about potential future stars that includes Haris Rauf, Naseem Shah and Haider Ali. You gotta back your youngsters. You are giving too much value to our pathetic domestic system. I'd rather these guys learn on the job than in domestics where they will rot forever.
    All of these names have been conned by PCB into thinking that he is 17. They don’t know that he is the same age as Shaheen who is a much better prospect.

    Naseem wouldn’t receive half the hype and adulation if PCB did not lie about his age.

    I wonder why they stopped at 16. They should have called him a 12 year old and people would have called him the biggest talent of all time.

  53. #53
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    Whenever PCB do such dramaybaazi it doesn’t end well. They sold Hassan Raza as a 14 year old in 1996 and he didn’t even last for 14 Tests.

  54. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mamoon View Post
    As I have said before, his hype is built on a lie. If PCB did not market him as some bowling version of Tendulkar who was Test class at 16, he would not be overhyped to this extent.

    He is nothing special at all, and unfortunately, he has bought into his own hype as well.

    He is not half as good as he and his fans think.
    Wrong again.

    He is extremely humble and hasn't bought into his own hype.

    The guy is 18-19, let him breathe guys. Give him some time.

  55. #55
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    Cant rate any bowler unless he takes atleast 150- 200 wickets.

  56. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by mmkextreme_1 View Post
    Wrong again.

    He is extremely humble and hasn't bought into his own hype.

    The guy is 18-19, let him breathe guys. Give him some time.
    Yeah I wish everyone is as humble as he is.

  57. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mamoon View Post
    Yeah I wish everyone is as humble as he is.
    Yes I do wish that was true.


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  58. #58
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    Boy can bowl. People expecting him to take 5 wickets per innings are bound to be disappointed. He’s taken some brutal dismissals

  59. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by naseem View Post
    He is bowling wide of the crease and not close to the stumps as a result he is not getting the batsman to play......he needs to bowl closer to stumps ...and the slips and wk need to come up a bit....it's the only drawback of Rizwan. ....he can't arrange the slips properly..... May be fear of injury or something he is bowling wider need to come close to the wicket while delivering the bowl......... If u don't give chance to a promising guy at young age then who u will.....its good that pak has been giving them chance....even few years back the age at which players were given chances by Pak management was between 27 to 32..... Its ridiculous.......if u can't learn anything by playing international cricket ...u won't learn by playing domestic cricket........
    You give the chance to those who already performing?

    And I think if you haven’t learnt at domestic level you will struggle at international level

  60. #60
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    Just some ignorant fools beating their drums in this thread, I am afraid.

  61. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rana View Post
    Boy can bowl. People expecting him to take 5 wickets per innings are bound to be disappointed. He’s taken some brutal dismissals
    He is here to stay - provided he is not injured- I Can see him getting better with every outing.


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  62. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rana View Post
    Boy can bowl. People expecting him to take 5 wickets per innings are bound to be disappointed. He’s taken some brutal dismissals
    Obv he can. However the problem is that the hype and potential is based on the assumption that he is 16-17. His actual age is closer to 20 or so atleast and if you look at him from the lens of that age then he is just another good prospect at a stage of development of whom you can find several at that age.

    If you take out this official age aspect, then Shaheen is streets ahead of him.

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    Been saying this from first day. He just bowls pace and one good ball and thats it.

    We lost the first test cause of him but no one said anything cause him being young.

    Once you are in pakistan team you need tot ake responsibility doesnt matter what your age is.

    Replace naseem with sohail khan or wahab riaz.

  64. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by Slog View Post
    Obv he can. However the problem is that the hype and potential is based on the assumption that he is 16-17. His actual age is closer to 20 or so atleast and if you look at him from the lens of that age then he is just another good prospect at a stage of development of whom you can find several at that age.

    If you take out this official age aspect, then Shaheen is streets ahead of him.
    England, Australia, South Africa and West Indies, teams that have a culture of producing legendary fast bowlers would be highly reluctant to give a 20 year old a Test debut. Even if Naseem is 19-20, the bowler is still a very good one. I look at the ability to consistently hit the same length, with the patience required and at the same intensity as the key marker. I believe Naseem has that. You must also remember that we have not seen what he’s about with the brand new ball instead of the semi new one.

    England had no reason to pick Anderson on away tours to the Sub-continent/UAE knowing that he is not the threat, but they knew that the guy is still their most reliable bowler who will go at 3 runs and take 3-4 wickets at the end of a long toiling spell. Naseem will have to be patient and he will become that bowler who takes wickets @25-27, which is all you need really to be a world class bowler.

  65. #65
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    Either pick 4 pace bowlers and have naseem as one of them. Or play an experience bowler and shift between shaheen and naseem.

    You cnat be having both naseem and shaheen playing.

  66. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mamoon View Post
    Yeah I wish everyone is as humble as he is.
    I've talked to him a few times and I can tell you that he is extremely humble. So instead of just sitting there assuming stuff and talking nonsense, why don't you provide some proof?

    You are just saying this to fit your narrative and that's it. Disgusting to be honest.

  67. #67
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    I do think that PCB have messed up in his character development by throwing him into the deep end a bit too early. Things like this often will lead the player to believe he is already the finished article or that he is far better than what he actually is. Especially with our Asian kids. Also, it sends out a wrong message to the ones who have been toiling for years in Domestics as if they are not valuable or they are hopeless.

    I think PCB know that Naseem will have a much shorter career than Naseem or Musa due to his body and injury issues, hence they are getting as much mileage out of him as they can.

  68. #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by Slog View Post
    Obv he can. However the problem is that the hype and potential is based on the assumption that he is 16-17. His actual age is closer to 20 or so atleast and if you look at him from the lens of that age then he is just another good prospect at a stage of development of whom you can find several at that age.

    If you take out this official age aspect, then Shaheen is streets ahead of him.
    Majority Pacers start at 22-23 and hit their strides at 24-25 and maintsin peak till 29-32. Naseem and Shaheen even at 20-21 are still couple of years ahead of the curve.

  69. #69
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    People are upset that he is hyped because he is 17 that's not true Naseem skill level is still excellent for 20 yr old talent.

  70. #70
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    Reading posts here, you would think the guy is 28 and has played for 8 years altleast.
    Have some patience for Lords sake!. He is 19 and still has a long way to go. Most people also forget he just got his action remodelled from front on to side on at the start of the year and is still adapting to it.

    If you expected him to enter the international circuit and just blow away teams, then thats your fault. He never made claims like these and any individual with some knowledge of cricket history would know such individuals are one in a generation. You cant expect everyone with some hype around them to start doing that.

    You can teach a genuine pace bowler to bowl swing and seam but you cant teach a medium pacer how to bowl fast. How many bowlers in world cricket do u see right now thar can bowl consistent 88-90 mph spells aged 19?.He is an asset alright but one that needs to develop a lot in the coming years and has a long way to go.

  71. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xoib View Post
    People are upset that he is hyped because he is 17 that's not true Naseem skill level is still excellent for 20 yr old talent.
    It’s not that he is hyped, it’s the fact that he doesn’t live up to the hype

  72. #72
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    I think it is a bit too early to call him a failed experiment. He should get more chances.

    Having said that, he could've done better. His height probably is a disadvantage for him.


    Bangladeshi Fan || [B]

  73. #73
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    Our fans overhype. Someone above said he is the next Waqar Younis and others have said he is a speical talent. He has a lot to prove before we start giving him these names.

    I think he can be a good bowler but I wouldn't class him as a speical talent. Just let him develop without over analysing his every movement.

  74. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kenpachi View Post
    It’s not that he is hyped, it’s the fact that he doesn’t live up to the hype
    Ok 6-7 games is not a good sample - makes no sense.


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  75. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grunge101 View Post
    If you expected him to enter the international circuit and just blow away teams, then thats your fault.
    What should we have expected? Him to come in and underperform?

  76. #76
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    Let’s make it clear - his inclusion in the team has essentially donned him one of the top 3 bowlers in our country.

    But he needs to learn, he is young, he has potential etc Just doesn’t cut it after you’ve put him in the top 3.

  77. #77
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    Lol. This is such a silly thread , It's going to backfire massively .

  78. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by ethan hunt View Post
    Lol. This is such a silly thread , It's going to backfire massively .
    If he comes good in a couple of years it proves the initial point that he is not good enough at the moment?

    His development at international level shouldn’t be at the cost of the teams success

  79. #79
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    It is the usual stuff with 99% of our players.

    (1) Overhyped before debut.

    (2) starts off on a high again some weak sides and the overhyping is reinforced.

    (3) fails to make an impact against the top sides.

    (4) his fans defend him and say that it is early to judge him, give him time, he is young, he will come good etc. etc.

    (5) after a while, the same fans realize that he is no good and move on to hype the next average player.

    We are a mediocre team for a reason. We produce mediocre players, and have very little capacity to produce top quality players.

    You will have a Babar Azam or perhaps a Shaheen Afridi every 10 years, but in between there will be a lot of overhyped dross who will be perfect to ensure that Pakistan sustain its mediocre standing.

    As I keep saying, there is a huge gap between the actual capability of Pakistan cricket team and the expectations of the fans.

    Our fans have the attitude and arrogance of a big team because they fail to realize that we are a small team now.

  80. #80
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mamoon View Post
    It is the usual stuff with 99% of our players.

    (1) Overhyped before debut.

    (2) starts off on a high again some weak sides and the overhyping is reinforced.

    (3) fails to make an impact against the top sides.

    (4) his fans defend him and say that it is early to judge him, give him time, he is young, he will come good etc. etc.

    (5) after a while, the same fans realize that he is no good and move on to hype the next average player.

    We are a mediocre team for a reason. We produce mediocre players, and have very little capacity to produce top quality players.

    You will have a Babar Azam or perhaps a Shaheen Afridi every 10 years, but in between there will be a lot of overhyped dross who will be perfect to ensure that Pakistan sustain its mediocre standing.

    As I keep saying, there is a huge gap between the actual capability of Pakistan cricket team and the expectations of the fans.

    Our fans have the attitude and arrogance of a big team because they fail to realize that we are a small team now.
    Remember the sohaib maqsood hype brigade?

    They even got the media to support him and pcb was being bashed right and left that the next best batsmen of pakistan being kept out because he is from multan and what not.

    The guy turned out to be a miserable joke in the end


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