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  1. #1
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    "I was struggling in Tests but Mickey Arthur really supported me" : Babar Azam

    A well dressed Babar Azam addressing the media today, ahead of the side's departure to New Zealand


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    "I have always had pressure on me from the time I started playing for Pakistan, and its only after the series against the West Indies that I got a bit more confidence; You always have to face new challenges and now I have one more to face upto which is the responsibility of Test captaincy; I will try and enjoy it, and apply what I have learnt in the white-ball format to Tests as well; I learnt a lot under Sarfaraz Bhai's captaincy and he taught me a lot; Same happened with Azhar Bhai where I learnt a lot from him too; I will ask them for their advice but in the end, I will do what I understand to be right"

    "I like playing under pressure as it brings a lot of enjoyment to me but give my 100 percent for the side"

    "Our team is very young; All the players respect each other and are genuinely happy when the other players perform well"

    "New Zealand have a good team but we are also doing well, we performed well against England recently where we lost one series and drew the other one; Batsmen did well there as did the bowlers; So we had Naseem and Shaheen who bowled very well in England and Azhar Ali who also performed wel; So the main thing in New Zealand is for us to have a good combination and to back players to give them confidence"

    "Look at my example, I was struggling in Tests but I had support from the team management; Here I would like to mention Mickey Arthur who really supported me who said that more we support (Babar) and more we play him, the better he will become and so the improvement came into me after a year"

    "No opponent can be taken easy but if we do a head-to-head comparison with NZ, our team is also very good; We have no pressure but we do have confidence that we will do well"

    "The PCB have given me a lot of confidence and said to me to not worry about short term results, said to me that you are in our long terms plans; They have told me to play freely and there is no pressure from the PCB about results - they have given me the freedom to captain and play as well as I can"

    "It can never be the case that all players will always perform well, some do well and others dont do that well; The main thing is to back players as you cannot have the case that Babar Azam will perform well everyday - some days he wont perform well! But then another day Azhar Ali will do that, or Asad Shafiq will do that, or Haris Sohail may do that; The main thing is to back someone who is not performing well; Our goal and mindset is to win everywhere we go to play"


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  2. #2
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    "I like playing under pressure as it brings a lot of enjoyment to me but give my 100 percent for the side"

    An absolute baller!

    The right mentality which Pakistan needs.

  3. #3
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    Babar Azam the model!

    (Pictures courtesy of the PCB)









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    We have no chance against New Zealand especially in the Test series. As long as Babar does well individually, it is good for Pakistan.

    Also, it seems that he forgot that Shafiq is not the in squad. He was probably speaking generally, but it is a bit funny to see him talk about a player who just got axed.

  5. #5
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    Very confident interview, body language wise. Real improvement over his body language even one and a half year ago. Heís really taking to captaincy well, I feel. Also seems PCB has guaranteed him captaincy for at least 2-3 years.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by MenInG View Post
    Babar Azam the model!

    (Pictures courtesy of the PCB)







    Classy gent!

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thunderbolt14 View Post
    Very confident interview, body language wise. Real improvement over his body language even one and a half year ago. He’s really taking to captaincy well, I feel. Also seems PCB has guaranteed him captaincy for at least 2-3 years.
    Nothing is guaranteed in Pakistan cricket. One or 2 bad series and the knives will be out for Babar etc


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    Babar has improved alot in terms of his body language and communication skills. Majid bhatti (the journalist) said recently that pcb has hired someone to groom Babar Azam. I think we are seeing the results now. Whatever happens, pcb must back him and remain invested in him.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by MenInG View Post
    Nothing is guaranteed in Pakistan cricket. One or 2 bad series and the knives will be out for Babar etc
    I donít know if itís just me, Bobbyís statement suggested that the PCB are trying to handle him delicately with a long rope to avoid bearing on his performances, and thatís what heís been told directly by them. Surely they will be smart about this... but then again.

    Hereís hoping for the best.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thunderbolt14 View Post
    Very confident interview, body language wise. Real improvement over his body language even one and a half year ago. Heís really taking to captaincy well, I feel. Also seems PCB has guaranteed him captaincy for at least 2-3 years.
    In this era, Pakistani captains only get sacked when they stop performing individually. Misbah lasted as ODI captain until his retirement in spite of the poor performances of the side.

    Sarfraz was sacked not because of the teamís performance but because he couldnít justify his own place in the team.

    Azharís sacking was an exceptional case because PCB had an easy alternative in Babar.

    He should be able to captain for as long as Misbah if not longer.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mamoon View Post
    In this era, Pakistani captains only get sacked when they stop performing individually. Misbah lasted as ODI captain until his retirement in spite of the poor performances of the side.

    Sarfraz was sacked not because of the teamís performance but because he couldnít justify his own place in the team.

    Azharís sacking was an exceptional case because PCB had an easy alternative in Babar.

    He should be able to captain for as long as Misbah if not longer.
    Agreed - and regarding Azhar, had he churned out two more 50ís on the England tour, he would still be captain.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Thunderbolt14 View Post
    Agreed - and regarding Azhar, had he churned out two more 50ís on the England tour, he would still be captain.
    As much as i wanted pakistan to win the first test. Had they won it azhar would still have been captain and he place in the side would have been guarantedd for 2 to 3 more years. But now if he preforms poorly in the nz series it could be his last.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MHN1293 View Post
    As much as i wanted pakistan to win the first test. Had they won it azhar would still have been captain and he place in the side would have been guarantedd for 2 to 3 more years. But now if he preforms poorly in the nz series it could be his last.
    Would that be the worst thing? First test series victory in England since... forever.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mamoon View Post
    We have no chance against New Zealand especially in the Test series. As long as Babar does well individually, it is good for Pakistan.

    Also, it seems that he forgot that Shafiq is not the in squad. He was probably speaking generally, but it is a bit funny to see him talk about a player who just got axed.
    Also, it seems that he forgot that Shafiq is not the in squad.

    Correct this sentense . oh i just did what you are doing in this form for long period of time

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    Mickey Arthur's biggest legacy apart from CT17 is his development and mentoring of Babar Azam. He was our best coach since Bob Woolmer.

  16. #16
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    Looking sharp there Babar

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    Babar has forgotten he dropped asad lol. Good interview i just hope he focuses on building a winning team, and doesnt let his emotion take over when deciding the team.

    Dont need a friendship 11

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Markhor View Post
    Mickey Arthur's biggest legacy apart from CT17 is his development and mentoring of Babar Azam. He was our best coach since Bob Woolmer.
    Considering the fact that he failed to develop and mentor every other batsman, it is fair to say that he got lucky that he had Babar than the other way around.

    Babar was tipped for international stardom when was 13 years old. People who followed Pakistan cricket closely at the time heard of him even before they heard of Umar Akmal, and he made his debut in 2009.

    Mickey found himself at the right place at the right time and ran away with the credit for Babarís success.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mamoon View Post
    Considering the fact that he failed to develop and mentor every other batsman, it is fair to say that he got lucky that he had Babar than the other way around.

    Babar was tipped for international stardom when was 13 years old. People who followed Pakistan cricket closely at the time heard of him even before they heard of Umar Akmal, and he made his debut in 2009.

    Mickey found himself at the right place at the right time and ran away with the credit for Babar’s success.
    True in a way, but you know any other coach woulda dropped Babar after his first few failures in tests.

    Agreed?

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mamoon View Post
    Considering the fact that he failed to develop and mentor every other batsman, it is fair to say that he got lucky that he had Babar than the other way around.

    Babar was tipped for international stardom when was 13 years old. People who followed Pakistan cricket closely at the time heard of him even before they heard of Umar Akmal, and he made his debut in 2009.

    Mickey found himself at the right place at the right time and ran away with the credit for Babarís success.
    But would Waqar Younis as coach have been able to develop Babar?


  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bullet Drive View Post
    True in a way, but you know any other coach woulda dropped Babar after his first few failures in tests.

    Agreed?
    Not necessarily. He was doing very well in ODI cricket and it would have saved his place.

    When Umar was dropped in Tests, he had already startled to struggle in ODI cricket.

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sher Khan View Post
    But would Waqar Younis as coach have been able to develop Babar?
    I would say yes because I believe that Babar developed himself with very little, if any, input from Mickey.

  23. #23
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    Now before I am inevitably told that I donít know more than Babar about the impact Mickey had on him, let me say the following.

    It is typical Pakistani mentality to be grateful to senior players and coaches all the time.

    Babar is not only thankful to Mickey but he claims to have learned a lot from Sarfraz and Azhar? What can a player like Babar learn from those two mediocrities? Nothing.

    They need to learn from Babar instead.

    You look at Shane Warne and he never rated Waughís captaincy and Buchananís coaching in spite of all the brilliant performances under their setup.

    That is because he knew his capabilities as a bowler and he didnít need any coach or captain to tell him what to do.

    Kohli produced some of his best batting under Kumble but he never rated him and got him sacked.

    This Pakistani culture of always showing gratitude to mediocre seniors and coaches is what breeds insecurity and lack of self-confidence among the players who are primed to believe that they are incapable of performing without the guidance of seniors and coaches.

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mamoon View Post
    Now before I am inevitably told that I don’t know more than Babar about the impact Mickey had on him, let me say the following.

    It is typical Pakistani mentality to be grateful to senior players and coaches all the time.

    Babar is not only thankful to Mickey but he claims to have learned a lot from Sarfraz and Azhar? What can a player like Babar learn from those two mediocrities? Nothing.

    They need to learn from Babar instead.

    You look at Shane Warne and he never rated Waugh’s captaincy and Buchanan’s coaching in spite of all the brilliant performances under their setup.

    That is because he knew his capabilities as a bowler and he didn’t need any coach or captain to tell him what to do.

    Kohli produced some of his best batting under Kumble but he never rated him and got him sacked.

    This Pakistani culture of always showing gratitude to mediocre seniors and coaches is what breeds insecurity and lack of self-confidence among the players who are primed to believe that they are incapable of performing without the guidance of seniors and coaches.
    This is true. And whilst it's true, Mickey really did well Babar.

  25. #25
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    Wish we had three more quality players like Babar azam. We will be a decent team.

  26. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by MenInG View Post
    Nothing is guaranteed in Pakistan cricket. One or 2 bad series and the knives will be out for Babar etc
    I think he will get a longer rope than others, for sure. Only reason it could be taken from him is if his batting form dps dramatically. But a series loss to NZ will not strip him of the role.

  27. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by shah_1 View Post
    Wish we had three more quality players like Babar azam. We will be a decent team.
    We already have one more - SSA.


    Babar and SSA are the shining stars of Pakistan Cricket. Hopefully, Haider comes to fore.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Shams123 View Post
    Babar has improved alot in terms of his body language and communication skills. Majid bhatti (the journalist) said recently that pcb has hired someone to groom Babar Azam. I think we are seeing the results now. Whatever happens, pcb must back him and remain invested in him.
    Fantastic, if this is true. PCB has been working like a modern organization since Sethi era, lovely to see that.

  29. #29
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    Mickey and Inzamam deserve their due credit. Had it been Misbah/Waqar, Babar would have been shilling in domestics thrown out of the side based on test performances. Who remembers Misbah kicking Babar out of his PSL team?

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    This is actually a good reveal video for the captain. Baby steps in



    Azaadi. InshAllah.

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    Coaches can give all the advice they want but ultimately its up to the player to take it on board and run with it. Mickey did his job by encouraging the talented young player and Babar has taken it and run with it to become one of the best in the World. Babar shows the hunger that young Ind and Australian players show and that is great mindset.

  32. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Slim View Post
    Mickey and Inzamam deserve their due credit. Had it been Misbah/Waqar, Babar would have been shilling in domestics thrown out of the side based on test performances. Who remembers Misbah kicking Babar out of his PSL team?
    Exactly lol. Misbah dropped him after 2 games.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mamoon View Post
    Now before I am inevitably told that I donít know more than Babar about the impact Mickey had on him, let me say the following.

    It is typical Pakistani mentality to be grateful to senior players and coaches all the time.

    Babar is not only thankful to Mickey but he claims to have learned a lot from Sarfraz and Azhar? What can a player like Babar learn from those two mediocrities? Nothing.

    They need to learn from Babar instead.

    You look at Shane Warne and he never rated Waughís captaincy and Buchananís coaching in spite of all the brilliant performances under their setup.

    That is because he knew his capabilities as a bowler and he didnít need any coach or captain to tell him what to do.

    Kohli produced some of his best batting under Kumble but he never rated him and got him sacked.

    This Pakistani culture of always showing gratitude to mediocre seniors and coaches is what breeds insecurity and lack of self-confidence among the players who are primed to believe that they are incapable of performing without the guidance of seniors and coaches.
    If Arthur wasnít the coach, Babar still would have been batting at 5, if not 6 to win it larke Lenge style. If you browse my posts about 4-5 years back, when he was batting at 5-6, I did write that Babar needs a coach whoíll back him to bat at 3; as thatís his natural position. Arthur has improved every PAK batsman considerably - but not everyoneís celling is same and players had their own issues - Umar had attitude problems, Haris fitness issues, Asad & Azhar were too old to be fixed. But, apart from Babar, Imam has improved considerably, this is Fakhar you are watching after two years under Arthur and Shan also has improved lot.

    I have always said this (that) PAK side was despite having Arthur, not because of Arthur - something you are watching post Arthur under Misbah. Arthur was a relative failure because he was too stubborn, didnít trying to amalgamate with the cricket philosophy of PAK/Asian teams rather tried to import his philosophy from SAF and impose it into PAK cricket - hence invested lot behind Shadab, Faheem .... and not Gohar. But, he is a fantastic technical coach - one of the best in world when it comes to groom young players, particularly batsmen. His biggest contribution to PAK cricket was that he saved Babar Azam from Basit Alis. Like Babar, Sami Aslam or Ahmed Shahzad were also young prodigy in PAK cricket, probably Umar as well - they didnít develop for their own problem. Arthur had been SAF academy director for long and some of his graduates were Graeme Smith, AdV, Hashim Amla, Neil Mackenzie, even Jacques Kallis & Dale Styen ...

    May not be as head coach for a spin dominant team, but Arthur will be my first pick as director of BCB high performance centre. Fantastic coach, stuck in a wrong job and he has some personal problems - you donít get sacked (or unceremonious exit) from all three of you high profile jobs, after starting with a bang with each of them. He tried to change himself in his last job but it was too late - I am sure heíll do well in Srilanka; may not be in Test because they are missing a Herath, but Arthurís Srilanka probably will qualify for WC automatically ahead of BD, PAK & WIN.

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    Thank you, Mickey.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Slim View Post
    We already have one more - SSA.


    Babar and SSA are the shining stars of Pakistan Cricket. Hopefully, Haider comes to fore.
    Sorry to say but Shaheen is not in the same league as Babar.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mamoon View Post
    Considering the fact that he failed to develop and mentor every other batsman, it is fair to say that he got lucky that he had Babar than the other way around.

    Babar was tipped for international stardom when was 13 years old. People who followed Pakistan cricket closely at the time heard of him even before they heard of Umar Akmal, and he made his debut in 2009.

    Mickey found himself at the right place at the right time and ran away with the credit for Babar’s success.
    Same was the case with sami aslam. If i am not wrong aslam was the highest run scorer in u19 cricket. Now we all know where sami aslam is.
    Well if a person himself is saying mickey Arthur was big support for him. If babar is giving credit to him than how you can say this.

  37. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by shah_1 View Post
    Sorry to say but Shaheen is not in the same league as Babar.
    What league is shaheen interns of bowling sense

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    With or without Arthur babar would be were he is now

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    Quote Originally Posted by shamaan View Post
    What league is shaheen interns of bowling sense
    Excluding AdV, Kohli, Smith, Will & Root - Babar is the stand-out batsman of his generation - might end up in the ranks of Javed, Inzi for PAK and other greats of his time.

    Shaheen is just one name among Archer, Rabada, Bumrah, Ngidi, Cummins - nothing conclusive yet. He has to go long, long, long way to be in the stature of where Babar stands now. Age is in his side - but that could be negative as well for young PAK cricketers, who often regress after 2-3 years .... Babar already has passed that stage, Shaheen hasn't yet - just started to walk on the path, let him complete that journey first.

    And no, without Arthur Babar won't have been the batsman he is now - very good may be among PAK batsmen.

  40. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by MMHS View Post
    Excluding AdV, Kohli, Smith, Will & Root - Babar is the stand-out batsman of his generation - might end up in the ranks of Javed, Inzi for PAK and other greats of his time.

    Shaheen is just one name among Archer, Rabada, Bumrah, Ngidi, Cummins - nothing conclusive yet. He has to go long, long, long way to be in the stature of where Babar stands now. Age is in his side - but that could be negative as well for young PAK cricketers, who often regress after 2-3 years .... Babar already has passed that stage, Shaheen hasn't yet - just started to walk on the path, let him complete that journey first.

    And no, without Arthur Babar won't have been the batsman he is now - very good may be among PAK batsmen.
    I think hes above root and williamson in all format player.

    I think at this stage in limited overs hes at the same level as archer but the rest are above archer and shaheen.but I think shaheen has all the attributes to be on par with the names you mentioned even above that level.

    I disagree I think even without Arthur he would have been were he is

  41. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by shamaan View Post
    I think hes above root and williamson in all format player.

    I think at this stage in limited overs hes at the same level as archer but the rest are above archer and shaheen.but I think shaheen has all the attributes to be on par with the names you mentioned even above that level.

    I disagree I think even without Arthur he would have been were he is
    Smith, Kohli, Root and Kane are all much better Test players than he is.

    I think Kohli is the only one who is comfortably better than Babar as a limited overs cricketer however. Babar plays for Pakistan for crying out loud, he doesn’t have the world class players these other big names have to support them and their team’s cause.

  42. #42
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    Hope some day these new boys will grow out of this culture of too much thankful to "seniors" and management. Sarfraz and Azhar should not be his mentors, Babar should learn from people like Kohli and Willamson .

    Also, management should be thankful to Babar not the vice versa.

    Historically , he should try to become the next IK or Mushtaq Mohammad , not like losers and defensive captains like Misbah and Azhar.

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    Even though it seems like he will say textbook sayings for a Pakistani cricketer, Babar is going to be a very good captain. Cannot believe Pakistan fans are against having a world class player as captain.

  44. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hasan123 View Post
    Even though it seems like he will say textbook sayings for a Pakistani cricketer, Babar is going to be a very good captain. Cannot believe Pakistan fans are against having a world class player as captain.
    How are Australia any worse having Tim Paine as captain with Steve Smith, David Warner, Nathan Lyon, Pat Cummins, Mitchel Starc, Josh Hazlewood and Marnus Labushange in their starting XI?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rana View Post
    Smith, Kohli, Root and Kane are all much better Test players than he is.

    I think Kohli is the only one who is comfortably better than Babar as a limited overs cricketer however. Babar plays for Pakistan for crying out loud, he doesn’t have the world class players these other big names have to support them and their team’s cause.
    Hence why I said all format.
    I think babar is kohli level in limited overs only difference is match winning knocks.i think in a couple years we may have some emerging cricketers who can be very very good.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rana View Post
    How are Australia any worse having Tim Paine as captain with Steve Smith, David Warner, Nathan Lyon, Pat Cummins, Mitchel Starc, Josh Hazlewood and Marnus Labushange in their starting XI?
    Tim Paine is a temporary solution until they can get another longer term solution. I would make Smith captain but there is 0 chance of that happening.

    I think Marnus Labuschange will take over eventually. Australia won't make a fast bowler captain.

  47. #47
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    When is the series starting

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    Quote Originally Posted by shamaan View Post
    I think hes above root and williamson in all format player.

    I think at this stage in limited overs hes at the same level as archer but the rest are above archer and shaheen.but I think shaheen has all the attributes to be on par with the names you mentioned even above that level.

    I disagree I think even without Arthur he would have been were he is
    How is Babar better than Williamson?

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    Quote Originally Posted by MenInG View Post
    A well dressed Babar Azam addressing the media today, ahead of the side's departure to New Zealand


    Name:  12738e5b-710f-4cc0-9f53-926b8c8ea4b6.jpg
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    "I have always had pressure on me from the time I started playing for Pakistan, and its only after the series against the West Indies that I got a bit more confidence; You always have to face new challenges and now I have one more to face upto which is the responsibility of Test captaincy; I will try and enjoy it, and apply what I have learnt in the white-ball format to Tests as well; I learnt a lot under Sarfaraz Bhai's captaincy and he taught me a lot; Same happened with Azhar Bhai where I learnt a lot from him too; I will ask them for their advice but in the end, I will do what I understand to be right"

    "I like playing under pressure as it brings a lot of enjoyment to me but give my 100 percent for the side"

    "Our team is very young; All the players respect each other and are genuinely happy when the other players perform well"

    "New Zealand have a good team but we are also doing well, we performed well against England recently where we lost one series and drew the other one; Batsmen did well there as did the bowlers; So we had Naseem and Shaheen who bowled very well in England and Azhar Ali who also performed wel; So the main thing in New Zealand is for us to have a good combination and to back players to give them confidence"

    "Look at my example, I was struggling in Tests but I had support from the team management; Here I would like to mention Mickey Arthur who really supported me who said that more we support (Babar) and more we play him, the better he will become and so the improvement came into me after a year"

    "No opponent can be taken easy but if we do a head-to-head comparison with NZ, our team is also very good; We have no pressure but we do have confidence that we will do well"

    "The PCB have given me a lot of confidence and said to me to not worry about short term results, said to me that you are in our long terms plans; They have told me to play freely and there is no pressure from the PCB about results - they have given me the freedom to captain and play as well as I can"

    "It can never be the case that all players will always perform well, some do well and others dont do that well; The main thing is to back players as you cannot have the case that Babar Azam will perform well everyday - some days he wont perform well! But then another day Azhar Ali will do that, or Asad Shafiq will do that, or Haris Sohail may do that; The main thing is to back someone who is not performing well; Our goal and mindset is to win everywhere we go to play"

    The most noteworthy comment was what Babar said about Mickey Arthur. Funny how different is his opnion about Mickey compared to his cousins the Akmals.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Markhor View Post
    Mickey Arthur's biggest legacy apart from CT17 is his development and mentoring of Babar Azam. He was our best coach since Bob Woolmer.
    Babar was tipped to go the very top since he was 13 and he dominated every age group there is. Babar Azam would have reached the top regardless of who was coach. His success isnít Arthurís legacy. If 2-3 other batsmen had developed in his time perhaps you would have had a case.

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    Quote Originally Posted by shamaan View Post
    I think hes above root and williamson in all format player.

    I think at this stage in limited overs hes at the same level as archer but the rest are above archer and shaheen.but I think shaheen has all the attributes to be on par with the names you mentioned even above that level.

    I disagree I think even without Arthur he would have been were he is
    No, he is not above Root or Will now - might cross later but not now.

    He is consistent Test player for only last couple of years. Both Root & Will are massively underrated here in PP, because no one is to back them - Smith is so ahead (And PAK has some grand show in Australia) that it's not even comparable while Indians will rub it for Kohli .... so open field is Root & Williamson. And, Root is underrated even more in ODI/T20 which is a surprise - PP thinks he is not a good fit for PSL because he is not that good a T20 player .... hence not picked by IPL........

    Last year, in similar time I wrote here that Babar has 11 Tests in next 1 year - 2 each against AUS, NZ, BD & SRL and three against ENG - he has to score around 1000 runs and at least 4 hundreds including couple of big ones to establish his mark as an elite player .... his highest so far is 144 against BD, that too without Shakib - I hope he'll be able to amend some part of it in NZ trip - otherwise cute 40-50-60-70 doesn't make you top quality Test player. I have read here many things about Root's failure to convert - 17 hundreds & like 50 fifties. PP should be consistent in that regard for everyone. But yes, the way Babar is playing, another 3-4 years, he can definite land into that elite class - right now, he is a fantastic player in making and in great form. That can happen to many players in form - couple of years back Pujara went to a level where Babar still haven't reached ...... and no one did say that Pujara as Test player is batter than Root or Will, even then. MoYo in one year scored close to 2000 Test runs - it does happen when a batsman is in roll, but there'll be inevitable down slide - this where the greats are differentiated from very good.

    Shaheen indeed can match or exceed the others - but I'll wait for that. By your own admission, Shaheen can't be compared with Babar - read your posts carefully, you'll realize why. Potential wise we can say Pooran can be better than Gilchrist, so there is no limit.

    Babar won't have been remotely close to the batsman he is now without Arthur, but we can agree to disagree on that. For a clue, I can say that T20 batting rating is a bit misleading ...... but Babar was always better than not to be benched and later traded for two failures in the mighty PSL - you can sum-up the rest. Batting is a process oriented skill - needs lots of technical adjustments and guidance, it's not something few are born with, it's a learned, purified trait .... that doesn't mean you attach 6 top coaches and Fakhar Zaman will become David Warner - that credit will always be with Babar, but don't underestimate Arthur's impact on his career ..... and I liked Babar's honest admission of that.

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    Quote Originally Posted by JaDed View Post
    How is Babar better than Williamson?
    In tests Williamson is way ahead.

    In t20s 32 at 125 SR
    In odis 48 and 82

    In t20 babar 51 at 130
    In odis 56 at 88

    Both his strike rate and average is better than williamson how can you say he isnt better than Williamson?

  53. #53
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    The only player who looks world class in our team

  54. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by MMHS View Post
    No, he is not above Root or Will now - might cross later but not now.

    He is consistent Test player for only last couple of years. Both Root & Will are massively underrated here in PP, because no one is to back them - Smith is so ahead (And PAK has some grand show in Australia) that it's not even comparable while Indians will rub it for Kohli .... so open field is Root & Williamson. And, Root is underrated even more in ODI/T20 which is a surprise - PP thinks he is not a good fit for PSL because he is not that good a T20 player .... hence not picked by IPL........

    Last year, in similar time I wrote here that Babar has 11 Tests in next 1 year - 2 each against AUS, NZ, BD & SRL and three against ENG - he has to score around 1000 runs and at least 4 hundreds including couple of big ones to establish his mark as an elite player .... his highest so far is 144 against BD, that too without Shakib - I hope he'll be able to amend some part of it in NZ trip - otherwise cute 40-50-60-70 doesn't make you top quality Test player. I have read here many things about Root's failure to convert - 17 hundreds & like 50 fifties. PP should be consistent in that regard for everyone. But yes, the way Babar is playing, another 3-4 years, he can definite land into that elite class - right now, he is a fantastic player in making and in great form. That can happen to many players in form - couple of years back Pujara went to a level where Babar still haven't reached ...... and no one did say that Pujara as Test player is batter than Root or Will, even then. MoYo in one year scored close to 2000 Test runs - it does happen when a batsman is in roll, but there'll be inevitable down slide - this where the greats are differentiated from very good.

    Shaheen indeed can match or exceed the others - but I'll wait for that. By your own admission, Shaheen can't be compared with Babar - read your posts carefully, you'll realize why. Potential wise we can say Pooran can be better than Gilchrist, so there is no limit.

    Babar won't have been remotely close to the batsman he is now without Arthur, but we can agree to disagree on that. For a clue, I can say that T20 batting rating is a bit misleading ...... but Babar was always better than not to be benched and later traded for two failures in the mighty PSL - you can sum-up the rest. Batting is a process oriented skill - needs lots of technical adjustments and guidance, it's not something few are born with, it's a learned, purified trait .... that doesn't mean you attach 6 top coaches and Fakhar Zaman will become David Warner - that credit will always be with Babar, but don't underestimate Arthur's impact on his career ..... and I liked Babar's honest admission of that.
    That's why I clearly said all format player in tests they both well ahead but in all three formats babar is ahead.the stats you brought up are based on tests.

    So why didnt authur have an impact on the rest of the players maybe he did have an impact for argument sake but you cant say wont be remotely close to the Bateman he is without arthur

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    He's an excellent player but he is still work in progress.

    A lot of the cricket he has played has been against some weak teams, although yes he has performed against big teams too but not on a consistent basis as yet.

    A few big series in South Africa, Australia and New Zealand will definitely make his reputation grow even further.



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    Quote Originally Posted by shamaan View Post
    That's why I clearly said all format player in tests they both well ahead but in all three formats babar is ahead.the stats you brought up are based on tests.

    So why didnt authur have an impact on the rest of the players maybe he did have an impact for argument sake but you cant say wont be remotely close to the Bateman he is without arthur
    Not even all format considered.

    Since PP has the satisfaction of outsmarting me regarding Babar's timing over Tamim, I guess there is an understanding that I am posting against Babar suddenly these days. Actually what happened is that the innings in mighty PSL final has got into PP's head, hence Babar is becoming untouchable here.

    If I say that Babar stats are massively inflated in LO cricket because of considerable minnow bashing and the state of PAK cricket which allows him to play lots, lots of compromised opponents .... I think PP'll remind my analysis which they read "Tamim is a better batsman than Babar". Babar LO stats are comparable to Amla, though Hashim started 12-13 years earlier and played ODI when it was remotely balanced game - and he has been constantly downplayed here in PP for his "Impact less" runs .... though he never made his career basing hapless ZIM or WIN.

    As I said, he is a world class player and one of the best in making, only PAK player that I actually have a keen interest to look for - but don't over do it that people start to wait for his failure to bump threads.

    Batting is a perfectionist job - the definition of "remotely close" in batting is different than just numbers. I believe you can understand the difference between missing World record by 1 minute in 10,000 meter and by one second in 100 metre. Without Arthur still Babar's stats won't have got a hit by more than 10-12, may be 15% max - that would have taken his same stats like 40 average in Test, 48 in ODI and 45 in T20 ..... that's not even remotely close of where his now.
    Last edited by MMHS; 21st November 2020 at 00:27.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mamoon View Post
    We have no chance against New Zealand especially in the Test series. As long as Babar does well individually, it is good for Pakistan.

    Also, it seems that he forgot that Shafiq is not the in squad. He was probably speaking generally, but it is a bit funny to see him talk about a player who just got axed.
    New Zealand is hard to beat in home conditions Pakistan will put up a good fight.

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    Pak players arriving in Lahore before departure









    For the latest updates on Cricket, follow @PakPassion on Twitter

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    Quote Originally Posted by Slog View Post
    Babar was tipped to go the very top since he was 13 and he dominated every age group there is. Babar Azam would have reached the top regardless of who was coach. His success isnít Arthurís legacy. If 2-3 other batsmen had developed in his time perhaps you would have had a case.
    @Markhor use to be best mates with Mickey, Babar may well have been a Mickey favourite

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    Babar would have reached the world level I think but knowing the nature of a volatile beast that is Pakistaj cricket, it couldn't hurt to have an influential supporter who happenened to be white, meaning less prone to the usual asian politics or being consumed by petty grudges, in other words more civil. I don't think it is too unusual for the better players to end up listening to their coaches etc you can't blame Mickey for not turning the Akmals into legends, he made noticeable improvements to the ODI batting unit though when it was stuck in the 90s before he joined

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    Note Babar wearing a PakPassion.net shirt in 2009


    For the latest updates on Cricket, follow @PakPassion on Twitter

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    I am not sure would Mickey or any other coach wouldn't have backed and filled confidence in Babar given the fact that Babar always used to perform in ODI and T20 before he cemented his tests team place,

    IMO especially in a team like Pak which doesn't produce that many top batsmen, any normal coach would have backed Babar and given him more chances to a player like Babar who was already showing signs in LOI that he is a player to invest and backed to be a top batsmen for PAK in coming years in all formats

  63. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by Markhor View Post
    Mickey Arthur's biggest legacy apart from CT17 is his development and mentoring of Babar Azam. He was our best coach since Bob Woolmer.
    He trained babar azam through mahela and sanga in karachi kings

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mamoon View Post
    Considering the fact that he failed to develop and mentor every other batsman, it is fair to say that he got lucky that he had Babar than the other way around.

    Babar was tipped for international stardom when was 13 years old. People who followed Pakistan cricket closely at the time heard of him even before they heard of Umar Akmal, and he made his debut in 2009.

    Mickey found himself at the right place at the right time and ran away with the credit for Babar’s success.
    Haris visibly improved a lot under Mickey as well. Haris upping the ante in the last 10 overs before 2018 was non existant. Compare that to the knocks he played in WC19, he became extremely good at building an inning. He hit his only 2 centuries under MA as well and was given a relatively good space in Test XI.
    Waqar had shifted babar down the order. Hafeez was the incumbent no.3 in LOIs but I heard he was pretty hard to convince to start batting at no.4 and give no.3 to Babar.

  65. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by MMHS View Post
    Not even all format considered.

    Since PP has the satisfaction of outsmarting me regarding Babar's timing over Tamim, I guess there is an understanding that I am posting against Babar suddenly these days. Actually what happened is that the innings in mighty PSL final has got into PP's head, hence Babar is becoming untouchable here.

    If I say that Babar stats are massively inflated in LO cricket because of considerable minnow bashing and the state of PAK cricket which allows him to play lots, lots of compromised opponents .... I think PP'll remind my analysis which they read "Tamim is a better batsman than Babar". Babar LO stats are comparable to Amla, though Hashim started 12-13 years earlier and played ODI when it was remotely balanced game - and he has been constantly downplayed here in PP for his "Impact less" runs .... though he never made his career basing hapless ZIM or WIN.

    As I said, he is a world class player and one of the best in making, only PAK player that I actually have a keen interest to look for - but don't over do it that people start to wait for his failure to bump threads.

    Batting is a perfectionist job - the definition of "remotely close" in batting is different than just numbers. I believe you can understand the difference between missing World record by 1 minute in 10,000 meter and by one second in 100 metre. Without Arthur still Babar's stats won't have got a hit by more than 10-12, may be 15% max - that would have taken his same stats like 40 average in Test, 48 in ODI and 45 in T20 ..... that's not even remotely close of where his now.
    I think it got it peoples ahead before that final....
    Inflated like Williamson isnt averaging over 100 against afganistan 75 against Zimbabwe.root averages.so why hasnt he developed any other players.we all know babar is a respectful guy he will give credit to arthur


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