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  1. #81
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nikhil_cric View Post
    Yuvi just being bitter. Way too much attention to this guy for the past decade for doing absolutely nothing. I dont agree that those spinners were better than the ones we have. Harbhajan bowled unbelievably in that 2001 series . Speed , accuracy and revs. He had it all. He lost it subsequently and had to rely on the odd chucked doosra . Kumble was not that good either and I'm a huge jumbo fan. Our bowlers have gotten better and the spin playing abilities of batsmen the world over have gotten better. This is just rose-tinted nostalgia by a has-been. Nothing more.
    This guy won you a world cup. Show some respect.

  2. #82
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    If you search magic deliveries in the career of Indian spinners, Ashwin would feature the most in that list. Especially that carrom ball dismissal is a sight to behold. Amazing bowler.

  3. #83
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thunderbolt14 View Post
    This guy won you a world cup. Show some respect.
    This guy also singlehandedly lost us the World T20 in 2014 when he didnt deserve to be there and has the audacity come up with comments like this. He was a great match winner on his day but that doesn't mean he is excused forever.


    'There's a lady who's sure all that glitters is gold'

  4. #84
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nikhil_cric View Post
    This guy also singlehandedly lost us the World T20 in 2014 when he didnt deserve to be there and has the audacity come up with comments like this. He was a great match winner on his day but that doesn't mean he is excused forever.
    True.

    Isn't this logic wonderful though he won us a WC so we should take whatever comes out of his mouth!

  5. #85
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    Don't think we need to disrespect Yuvi, never seen a greater ball striker than him and was instrumental in winning a world cup for us while playing with cancer in his lungs (actually two if you include the 2007 WT20).

    I'll just disagree with his opinion, particularly reg Bhajji. Ashwin outbowled Bhajji in all the tests they played together.

  6. #86
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    Quote Originally Posted by MP2011 View Post
    True.

    Isn't this logic wonderful though he won us a WC so we should take whatever comes out of his mouth!
    But some of these guys do the same whenever Gambhir opens his mouth. They try to defend his statements and remind everyone that he won 2 world cups for India.

  7. #87
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    Quote Originally Posted by MP2011 View Post
    True.

    Isn't this logic wonderful though he won us a WC so we should take whatever comes out of his mouth!
    Yeah I never understood that logic.


    'There's a lady who's sure all that glitters is gold'

  8. #88
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    Don't know about Harbhajan, but Kumble was a beast. Ashwin is in no way a lesser bowler than Harbhajan.
    Harbhajan's bowling declined after 2007. By 2011, Mishra and Ojha were looking more threatening than him.

    Ashwin has actually improved after turning 30 something opposite of Harbhajan.

  9. #89
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    20 plus wickets in a series Ashwin 8 times, Bhajji 3 times, Kumble 9 times. Bhajji apart from that one magical series never played a telling role in a series like Ashwin did.

  10. #90
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    Quote Originally Posted by jnaveen1980 View Post
    20 plus wickets in a series Ashwin 8 times, Bhajji 3 times, Kumble 9 times. Bhajji apart from that one magical series never played a telling role in a series like Ashwin did.
    How many 20+ wickets in a series in SENA for each of three?

    Not saying anything, just asking for stats.

  11. #91
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    Don't think Yuvraj is adding anything insightful here. We all know Kumble and Harbajaan would have been deadly on such pitches.

  12. #92
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    If Joe root can take 5 wickets next to nothing then most spinners could on this pitch

  13. #93
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ab Fan View Post
    How many 20+ wickets in a series in SENA for each of three?

    Not saying anything, just asking for stats.
    Problem is they got to at on far worse pitches than this.

  14. #94
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    So Ashwins 100 irohits 100 n this era is better than 100s from yuvi era.

  15. #95
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    Man I have lost alot of respect for Indian fans. You can still call out the Pitch and BCCI whilst supporting India.

    The pitch was an absolute disgrace. It's almost a guarantee that if Pakistan produced such an awful pitch, those same fans defending the pitch would be frothing at the mouth.

    Such hypocrisy and willful blindness. I think it fits aptly with the name of stadium

  16. #96
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    Quote Originally Posted by observer1 View Post
    Man I have lost alot of respect for Indian fans. You can still call out the Pitch and BCCI whilst supporting India.

    The pitch was an absolute disgrace. It's almost a guarantee that if Pakistan produced such an awful pitch, those same fans defending the pitch would be frothing at the mouth.

    Such hypocrisy and willful blindness. I think it fits aptly with the name of stadium
    Show me one ball that make you this statement. When the batsman misses a straight ball that absolutely does nothing just because it skids off faster has nothing to do with pitch. SG pink ball can be even more helpful for spinners.

  17. #97
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    Quote Originally Posted by observer1 View Post
    Man I have lost alot of respect for Indian fans. You can still call out the Pitch and BCCI whilst supporting India.

    The pitch was an absolute disgrace. It's almost a guarantee that if Pakistan produced such an awful pitch, those same fans defending the pitch would be frothing at the mouth.

    Such hypocrisy and willful blindness. I think it fits aptly with the name of stadium
    Think you are conflating politics with cricket and assuming fans are defending the status quo.

    Indian fans are willing to call their players as crap instead of blaming the pitch.

    I couldn't be more prouder of our fans.

    It also consistently aligns with our belief that we dont complain about the pitch no matter what.

    Not a single fan complained when SA gave us an actual dangerous pitch in Joberg.

    No one is really happy with Motera pitch but win or lose, this wasnt an unplayable pitch. Sg Pink ball made it harder due to skiddy nature but thats about it.

    Its telling that people like Nasser, Atherton, Pietersen and boycott have blamed the players as opposed to the pitch.

    English fans did too.

    Its telling that the biggest criticism of the pitch didn't come from westerners but other asians.

    One day other asian fans will understand why Indians are doing what they are doing and break free from the imaginary shackles.

    There was a point in time when runs in asia were literally devalued (they will call it flat pitches) but today its not the case.

    Cricketing perceptions are on a self correcting course and within a decade, we will see balance being restored.

  18. #98
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    Quote Originally Posted by sensible-indian-fan View Post
    Think you are conflating politics with cricket and assuming fans are defending the status quo.

    Indian fans are willing to call their players as crap instead of blaming the pitch.

    I couldn't be more prouder of our fans.

    It also consistently aligns with our belief that we dont complain about the pitch no matter what.

    Not a single fan complained when SA gave us an actual dangerous pitch in Joberg.

    No one is really happy with Motera pitch but win or lose, this wasnt an unplayable pitch. Sg Pink ball made it harder due to skiddy nature but thats about it.

    Its telling that people like Nasser, Atherton, Pietersen and boycott have blamed the players as opposed to the pitch.

    English fans did too.

    Its telling that the biggest criticism of the pitch didn't come from westerners but other asians.

    One day other asian fans will understand why Indians are doing what they are doing and break free from the imaginary shackles.

    There was a point in time when runs in asia were literally devalued (they will call it flat pitches) but today its not the case.

    Cricketing perceptions are on a self correcting course and within a decade, we will see balance being restored.
    Good post ! They go great lengths to undervalue the performance. I don't think we are ever going to convince them. Because there is arch rivalry bias will not allow them to be convinced. English fans and Indian fans are mostly on the same page here lol Two countries that actually play the series. Even biased guy like Hussain. Let them enjoy We can just keep them engaged until they are bored.

  19. #99
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    Quote Originally Posted by street cricketer View Post
    Don't think we need to disrespect Yuvi, never seen a greater ball striker than him and was instrumental in winning a world cup for us while playing with cancer in his lungs (actually two if you include the 2007 WT20).

    I'll just disagree with his opinion, particularly reg Bhajji. Ashwin outbowled Bhajji in all the tests they played together.
    Nobody is doing that. I immensely respect what Yuvraj has done for our LoI cricket. Perhaps our most impactful LoI bat ever!

    However he also needs to respect what Ashwin has done for us during last decade. Just because Bhajji and Kumble were his contemporaries, he need not disrespect current players.

    Tweets like this one only suggests that he is being biased and not being objective.

  20. #100
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bhaag Viru Bhaag View Post
    But some of these guys do the same whenever Gambhir opens his mouth. They try to defend his statements and remind everyone that he won 2 world cups for India.
    Which is equally wrong! As a person though, Yuvraj is miles ahead of Gambhir.


  21. #101
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    Quote Originally Posted by sensible-indian-fan View Post
    Think you are conflating politics with cricket and assuming fans are defending the status quo.

    Indian fans are willing to call their players as crap instead of blaming the pitch.

    I couldn't be more prouder of our fans.

    It also consistently aligns with our belief that we dont complain about the pitch no matter what.

    Not a single fan complained when SA gave us an actual dangerous pitch in Joberg.

    No one is really happy with Motera pitch but win or lose, this wasnt an unplayable pitch. Sg Pink ball made it harder due to skiddy nature but thats about it.

    Its telling that people like Nasser, Atherton, Pietersen and boycott have blamed the players as opposed to the pitch.

    English fans did too.

    Its telling that the biggest criticism of the pitch didn't come from westerners but other asians.

    One day other asian fans will understand why Indians are doing what they are doing and break free from the imaginary shackles.

    There was a point in time when runs in asia were literally devalued (they will call it flat pitches) but today its not the case.

    Cricketing perceptions are on a self correcting course and within a decade, we will see balance being restored.
    This. Well said.

    No way in hell this pitch warranted a 2-day test. That tells more about technical inadequacies of inept batsmen (DN tests, pink ball as well) rather than the pitch itself.

  22. #102
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    Gambhir still rates Harbhajan a better off- spinner than Ashwin. He said it in the Cricinfo discussion.

  23. #103
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ab Fan View Post
    Gambhir still rates Harbhajan a better off- spinner than Ashwin. He said it in the Cricinfo discussion.
    This tells about his cricketing intelligence, nothing else. His mental abilities are known to everyone.

  24. #104
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ab Fan View Post
    Gambhir still rates Harbhajan a better off- spinner than Ashwin. He said it in the Cricinfo discussion.
    Ganbhir is Stupid.
    He has his obvious biases towards certain players.


    Virat, ABD, KP and Sir Viv.
    RCB Forever.#ನಮ್ಮRCB

  25. #105
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    Quote Originally Posted by MP2011 View Post
    This tells about his cricketing intelligence, nothing else. His mental abilities are known to everyone.
    His cricketing intelligence was good when he played the game. You can't captain your IPL team to two IPL trophies and his game awareness was good too.

    But after retiring, he has become a toxic and heavily biased cricket analyst.

  26. #106
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ab Fan View Post
    Gambhir still rates Harbhajan a better off- spinner than Ashwin. He said it in the Cricinfo discussion.
    Ashwin is better than Harbhajan.

  27. #107
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    Ashwin is the best Indian spinner ever and impact wise probably our biggest match winner ever along with Sehwag, period.

  28. #108
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hasan123 View Post
    Ashwin is better than Harbhajan.
    Ashwin is miles better even though he has got the easiest wickets among all three- Kumble, Harbhajan and him.

  29. #109
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hyperion66 View Post
    Ashwin is the best Indian spinner ever and impact wise probably our biggest match winner ever along with Sehwag, period.
    I wonder why Kumble is not an ATG spinner. He averaged 38 in Australia against GOAT Australian side and he did better than Warne in India and Australia. Obviously, not as good as Warne because of performance in other countries but still brilliant in Aus and SA.

    Also, at home he averages 21 in 1990s.

  30. #110
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ab Fan View Post
    I wonder why Kumble is not an ATG spinner. He averaged 38 in Australia against GOAT Australian side and he did better than Warne in India and Australia. Obviously, not as good as Warne because of performance in other countries but still brilliant in Aus and SA.

    Also, at home he averages 21 in 1990s.
    He is an Indian ATG for me. A champion player with tremendous grit and fighting spirit, great team man, a highly educated and intelligent cricketer and a fantastic ambassador of the game. His records speaks for itself.

  31. #111
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nikhil_cric View Post
    This guy also singlehandedly lost us the World T20 in 2014 when he didnt deserve to be there and has the audacity come up with comments like this. He was a great match winner on his day but that doesn't mean he is excused forever.
    Couldn’t come good in one World Cup but won you another two. I’m sorry for your loss.

  32. #112
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    Quote Originally Posted by MP2011 View Post
    True.

    Isn't this logic wonderful though he won us a WC so we should take whatever comes out of his mouth!
    Has nothing to do with what Yuvraj said. “Way too much attention to this guy for the past decade for doing absolutely nothing” hearing an Indian says this breaks my heart as Yuvi is one of my favorite players.

  33. #113
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    Quote Originally Posted by aliasad1998 View Post
    Kumble and Harbajhan were both not as good as Ashwin in my opinion
    That is a very difficult argument, but I guess Ashwin has also done well down under hence takes the lead.

  34. #114
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    Totally agree with Yuvi paaji, because I feel no joy in watching games on such third rate pitches, where any mediocre spinner could have also taken bucketful of wickets. Had Ashwin not played this game then Washington Sunder would have ended up with similar spells in 2 innings. Or for that matter Kuldeep Yadav. Only people who are obsessed of stats can enjoy such games.

  35. #115
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    Not a single wicket fell due to excessive spin or bounce

    Most were due to missing straight ball.Pink ball travels faster off pitch


    The only disability in life is a bad attitude. -Scott Hamilton

  36. #116
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    One thing people just dosen't want to acknowledge is the role of DRS and how it has made spin playing so much difficult in a spinning track. Back in the day, batsmen got benefit of doubts on most appeal as umpires rarely gave batsmen out on the front foot. Take for example the Stokes dismissal in 2nd innings of the ahmedabad test. An Umpire from a past era would never have given it out. It was only after the introduction of Hawkeye that Umpires started giving bolder lbw decision in the early 2000s and after the introduction of DRS, everything changed.
    To stay in the topic, Kumble would've been great in the current era but Harbhajan wouldn't have as he was a blatant chucker.

  37. #117
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thunderbolt14 View Post
    Couldn’t come good in one World Cup but won you another two. I’m sorry for your loss.
    Lol. Right.


    'There's a lady who's sure all that glitters is gold'

  38. #118
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    Fair reply by Ashwin. I wonder who the pom journalist was?



    John 3:16

  39. #119
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thomaskutty View Post
    Fair reply by Ashwin. I wonder who the pom journalist was?

    If Root picks 5 for 8 then surely these is something wrong with the surface Mr Ashwin.

    The last test match was not a good test match and that was due to a poor surface, so Ashwin needs to stop getting offended by a logical question.

  40. #120
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ab Fan View Post
    I wonder why Kumble is not an ATG spinner. He averaged 38 in Australia against GOAT Australian side and he did better than Warne in India and Australia. Obviously, not as good as Warne because of performance in other countries but still brilliant in Aus and SA.

    Also, at home he averages 21 in 1990s.
    As i said bowlers are made by captains. Kumble was always considered a strike force home and abroad. Dhoni changed the script with ridiculous overseas strategies with bowlers.

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    Quote Originally Posted by gazza619 View Post
    If Root picks 5 for 8 then surely these is something wrong with the surface Mr Ashwin.
    Poor analysis from you. Root picked up the wickets of tailenders, not the top order and all the 5 wickets were due to batsmen playing poor shots except Washington's wicket.


    John 3:16

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    Quote Originally Posted by Thomaskutty View Post
    Poor analysis from you. Root picked up the wickets of tailenders, not the top order and all the 5 wickets were due to batsmen playing poor shots except Washington's wicket.
    Did you just watch the wicket highlights or the entire spell? Or may be both of us were watching different games because Root was inducing snakes on the pitch.

  43. #123
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    Quote Originally Posted by gazza619 View Post
    Or may be both of us were watching different games because Root was inducing snakes on the pitch.
    Snakes .. really ? I saw Rohit and Gill race to 49/0 against Root in the 2nd innings .. proper batsmen played Root well.


    John 3:16

  44. #124
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    Quote Originally Posted by gazza619 View Post
    Did you just watch the wicket highlights or the entire spell? Or may be both of us were watching different games because Root was inducing snakes on the pitch.
    Ghee whiz why couldn't Root do the same in the 2nd innings. or the 2 innings at Chennai in the Second test where Ashwin outscored him.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Thomaskutty View Post
    Snakes .. really ? I saw Rohit and Gill race to 49/0 against Root in the 2nd innings .. proper batsmen played Root well.
    So clearly you didnt watch the first innings and are giving judgement based on the 2nd innings.

    There is a different mindset for players when you are chasing 49 runs and you should know that.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jnaveen1980 View Post
    Ghee whiz why couldn't Root do the same in the 2nd innings. or the 2 innings at Chennai in the Second test where Ashwin outscored him.
    Because India was chasing only 49 runs.

    Even England would chased 49 runs with 10 wickets in hand.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Thomaskutty View Post
    Fair reply by Ashwin. I wonder who the pom journalist was?

    Brilliant from Ashwin. Sick of the complaints about the pitch now.

  48. #128
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    Quote Originally Posted by gazza619 View Post
    There is a different mindset for players when you are chasing 49 runs and you should know that.
    Good .. so you agree it's about the mindset and that a proper mindset is what England was lacking in their 1st and 3rd innings. It's all about training your mind to play without pressure, be it day 1 or day 5. Thank you for making my point.


    John 3:16

  49. #129
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    Quote Originally Posted by jnaveen1980 View Post
    As i said bowlers are made by captains. Kumble was always considered a strike force home and abroad. Dhoni changed the script with ridiculous overseas strategies with bowlers.
    Dhoni took India to no.1 test ranking also and won them a series in NZ and drew in SA. He lost plenty because they were going through transition.

    Anyways, this is not the point here. I don't understand why Kumble is not an ATG, that has nothing to do with MSD?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Thomaskutty View Post
    Fair reply by Ashwin. I wonder who the pom journalist was?

    Wow he needs to calm down. Not a good look
    To have such a meltdown

  51. #131
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thomaskutty View Post
    Fair reply by Ashwin. I wonder who the pom journalist was?

    He looks disturbed. He needs to calm down. There is certain amount of arrogance in some Indian players which definitely comes from the Board they are playing for.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ab Fan View Post
    Dhoni took India to no.1 test ranking also and won them a series in NZ and drew in SA. He lost plenty because they were going through transition.

    Anyways, this is not the point here. I don't understand why Kumble is not an ATG, that has nothing to do with MSD?
    He is an ATG. So is Ashwin. With his batting he is probably one of the top MVP INdia ever produced. He almost won a test against Windies with bat singlehandedly. His strategical error in the last over turned it into a draw.

  53. #133
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    Quote Originally Posted by gazza619 View Post
    Because India was chasing only 49 runs.

    Even England would chased 49 runs with 10 wickets in hand.

    So when you chase 49 suddenly pitch become better? You basically agree with what we have been saying. Mindset of English batsmen was pre-programmed. Trying to sweept, reverse sweep. I have never seen a test side reverse sweeping so much in a Test match (that too early in the innings) like i saw in this series. England was not carrying ATGs with them. Root is their only solid batsman. Everyone else is a rookie. They were exposed.

  54. #134
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    Quote Originally Posted by jnaveen1980 View Post
    So when you chase 49 suddenly pitch become better? You basically agree with what we have been saying. Mindset of English batsmen was pre-programmed. Trying to sweept, reverse sweep. I have never seen a test side reverse sweeping so much in a Test match (that too early in the innings) like i saw in this series. England was not carrying ATGs with them. Root is their only solid batsman. Everyone else is a rookie. They were exposed.
    What stopped Indian batsman from scoring 350 on this pitch then? I think our batsman would have shut everyone up had they scored at least 350 in the first inning. Most of the critics are using India's first inning and Root's 5fer as an example to criticise this pitch. Either our players spin playing abilities have decreased or this was a poor pitch to bat on. Last few deliveries before we hit a winning run were keeping low. It was a poor pitch.

  55. #135
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bhaag Viru Bhaag View Post
    He looks disturbed. He needs to calm down. There is certain amount of arrogance in some Indian players which definitely comes from the Board they are playing for.
    From what I've seen of his youtube channel, that's how he normally talks .. in a hurried manner with rushed English. The arrogance bit is correct if you're refering to Kohli, not Ashwin .. the latter does not come across as the type who springboards off the BCCI.


    John 3:16

  56. #136
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thomaskutty View Post
    From what I've seen of his youtube channel, that's how he normally talks .. in a hurried manner with rushed English. The arrogance bit is correct if you're refering to Kohli, not Ashwin .. the latter does not come across as the type who springboards off the BCCI.
    I know Ashwin is a bit different from Kohli. About Ashwin I was talking about this particular video only. I like him as a bowler though. And as I said plenty of times here I want to see him as a captain of India one day.

  57. #137
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    Quote Originally Posted by ethan hunt View Post
    I remember the 2005 series in India and afridi winning the match with the ball on the 5th day.
    I ways thought that someone like an afridi would have had a genuinely good test career if he played in India.
    Afridi should have continued in Test as a second spinner at number 8 who could tonk a ball. He should have seen himself as a bowling all-rounder, instead of a genuine all rounder.

  58. #138
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    Quote Originally Posted by princeuk View Post
    If Joe root can take 5 wickets next to nothing then most spinners could on this pitch
    There are spinners and then there are slow bowlers. On bad turning wickets any slow bowler can roll their arm and get wickets, good spinners are the ones who are able to beat the batsmen in air, and loop.

  59. #139
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    I don't see his message like the Indians do here....

    You can replace Harbi and Kumble with Root and Swann or even Lyon and Maxwell...

    If you do that then you see what he's actually trying to say.
    In which case Ashein would end up with say 1200 wickets if played day in and say out in wickets like these.

    Besides all this, the man has an opinion and even if he thinks Harbi and Kumble are better bowlers then so what?

    The root problem is that the Indians here are so insecure. They'll defend their wicket / team / government no matter what.

  60. #140
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    Quote Originally Posted by jnaveen1980 View Post
    So when you chase 49 suddenly pitch become better? You basically agree with what we have been saying. Mindset of English batsmen was pre-programmed. Trying to sweept, reverse sweep. I have never seen a test side reverse sweeping so much in a Test match (that too early in the innings) like i saw in this series. England was not carrying ATGs with them. Root is their only solid batsman. Everyone else is a rookie. They were exposed.
    The point i was really trying to make was that this was a poor pitch. I couldnt care less who won the game. I know batsmen need to up their game but still test matches need better pitches.

  61. #141
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    Quote Originally Posted by gazza619 View Post
    The point i was really trying to make was that this was a poor pitch. I couldnt care less who won the game. I know batsmen need to up their game but still test matches need better pitches.
    If Bangladesh had been bowled out cheaply you wouldn't be saying this. Because it is considered a poor team. Because you have a preconceived opinion England has enough players to counter the alien conditions. Root is a class player despite his failures. Even he didn't blame the pitch. He merely blamed the pink ball that hurried through after pitching.

  62. #142
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thomaskutty View Post
    Fair reply by Ashwin. I wonder who the pom journalist was?

    Perfectly reasonable reply from Ashwin.

  63. #143
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    Quote Originally Posted by jnaveen1980 View Post
    If Bangladesh had been bowled out cheaply you wouldn't be saying this. Because it is considered a poor team. Because you have a preconceived opinion England has enough players to counter the alien conditions. Root is a class player despite his failures. Even he didn't blame the pitch. He merely blamed the pink ball that hurried through after pitching.
    You are forgetting that India also collapsed cheaply in the 1st innings.

    India’s 2nd innings does not count as even Afghanistan would have chased 49 runs with 10 wickets in hand on no matter what pitch.

  64. #144
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    Well said by Ashwin! Who defines a good surface? Is it written somewhere that a pitch has to seam on first 2 days? Aren't spinners part of cricket? Is it a sin to have a pitch which supports spinners from day 1 once in a while at least?

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    Quote Originally Posted by gazza619 View Post
    You are forgetting that India also collapsed cheaply in the 1st innings.

    India’s 2nd innings does not count as even Afghanistan would have chased 49 runs with 10 wickets in hand on no matter what pitch.
    woulda coulda


    The only disability in life is a bad attitude. -Scott Hamilton

  66. #146
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    Name:  EvS31_7UUAEStkO.jpg
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    Last edited by Last Monetarist; 28th February 2021 at 18:20.


    The only disability in life is a bad attitude. -Scott Hamilton

  67. #147
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    Quote Originally Posted by gazza619 View Post
    You are forgetting that India also collapsed cheaply in the 1st innings.

    India’s 2nd innings does not count as even Afghanistan would have chased 49 runs with 10 wickets in hand on no matter what pitch.
    India is not the same great team against spin anymore. They are as susceptible against spin just like visitors. If you look at the 2nd and 3rd test, only Rohit stood out. Ashwin a 100, Pant a 50. Okeefe ran through this Indian side. Even overseas India struggled against the likes of Moeen Ali.

  68. #148
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    Quote Originally Posted by gazza619 View Post
    You are forgetting that India also collapsed cheaply in the 1st innings.

    India’s 2nd innings does not count as even Afghanistan would have chased 49 runs with 10 wickets in hand on no matter what pitch.
    Another aspect is the pink SG ball which is completely alien even to Indian batsmen. Indian domestic cricket used pink kookaburra which hardly turned. So this was an unknown proposition for all. Pink SG on a dry wicket.

  69. #149
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    The pitch was turning not denying that. But what aggravated the situation was the pink ball. If landed on the seam it spun, but when it landed on the sides, the extra plastic coating made it skid fast. This was the reason for the straight ball becoming dangerous. The effects of both type of deliveries played on the batsman's mind. Spin playing prowess of both sides are just awful. I remember Sachin and Laxman playing beautifully in that infamous Mumbai test 2004.

    India are better of the two in playing spin. England won the toss and still lost.

  70. #150
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    'All the moaning and groaning has got to stop': Viv Richards says India have pushed England out of 'comfort zone'

    Former West Indies captain Viv Richards has weighed in on the debate surrounding the pitch on which the third Test match between India and England was played, saying people around the world have got to stop cribbing about the nature of the surface. Richards pointed out that playing in India have always been about tackling spin and that had England done their homework ahead of the tour – they would have been better prepared about playing on such tracks.

    The Ahmedabad pitch has come under a lot of fire, especially how England were all out for 112 and 81 in the two innings as India wrapped up a 10-wicket win inside two days. While there are those who believe the surface was not ideal for Test cricket, there are also cricketers who believe this is all part and parcel of the game. Richards belongs to the latter.

    "I've been asked questions recently about the Test match that was played in India… the second and third Test match against England. And I am a little confused about the question really because there seems to be a lot of moaning and groaning about the wicket that they were playing on. I just felt that the ones who are moaning, in my opinion, should realise that there are times that you're going to get a seaming track, a ball that is basically jumping off a good length and everyone thinks that's a problem for batters. There are times batters sometimes cope with that," Richards said in a video posted on his Facebook page.

    "But now you've seen the other side, and this is why I think it was given the name Test match cricket, because of the test of the mind and will and everything else that goes with it when you're competing. And the complaints have been that the wicket is spinning too much and all that sorts of stuff. This is another side of the coin guys. People seem to forget that if you're going to India, you should expect that. You are going to spin land. You should basically prepare yourself to know what you're going to encounter."

    Richards explained that most of the hoopla surrounding the pitch is due to India pushing England out of their 'comfort zone' after the visitors piled the runs in the first Test in Chennai and defeated the hosts by 227 runs. The former West Indies captain even said that India should not budge and in fact, use a similar surface even for the fourth Test starting Thursday, insisting that it is up to England to find a way to deal with it.

    "Rather than the moaning and groaning, especially just recently how quickly that Test match was over. It gives England an opportunity and a chance to assess things, to believe that for some reason the wicket that they're going to encounter in the fourth Test is going to be the same. If I was India or I had anything to do with the preparations of the wicket, I would bring in very much the same," Richards added.

    "Ever since that first Test match, England were in their comfort zone. They have now been taken out of their comfort zone at present and they have got to find ways and means to cope with what they are going to encounter. Spin in all part of the game, this is what a Test match brings. The Indian pacers have been brilliant over the past few years in terms of substance, the wicket-taking ability and stuff like that. But now that you're in India, you are going to encounter things and have got to find a way. You're going to get dirty. There is nothing in the rule book that says I’ve got to score my runs in pretty, classical ways.

    "I just believe all the moaning and groaning has got to stop and just not see the classical side of things in terms of Indian armoury. And from where I'm sitting, it's good to see."

    https://www.hindustantimes.com/crick...563442367.html

  71. #151
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    @Slog what is Viv's stake in India vs England.
    What he says is correct, India is a Spinners land, and you should expect spinning tracks.
    England went ahead with 3 seamers.
    Spin is just another type of skill, equivalent to Seam and Swing, which test's batsmen.

  72. #152
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    Ashwin is a much better bowler than Harbhajan ever was, regardless of pitch. Yuvraj is becoming a nutjob like his dad it seems.

  73. #153
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    One source says the 4th test pitch will be a road cos this stadium has a lot at stake and doesn't want any demerit points.

    Another news source says it will be a turner as India don't want to take any risks.

    Let's prepare a decent 300-400 pitch and have a good game.

    Not cos others are moaning but cos 2 day tests aren't too much fun (especially since we are not scoring much on them).

    So my hope is we don't see a rank turner or a dead patta for the 4th test.

    If I have to choose between those 2 only, I will choose a rank turner anyday and twice on Sunday.

    But I would personally prefer a more balanced track.

    And hopefully we prepare super hard for the WTC test.

    Imagine the world's reaction when we lift the WTC championship beating NZ in Lord's.

    The team's gotta work super hard for it but it's possible.

    Just 2 more tests. Let's go.


    Truth is treason in an empire of lies.

  74. #154
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    Quote Originally Posted by sensible-indian-fan View Post
    One source says the 4th test pitch will be a road cos this stadium has a lot at stake and doesn't want any demerit points.

    Another news source says it will be a turner as India don't want to take any risks.

    Let's prepare a decent 300-400 pitch and have a good game.

    Not cos others are moaning but cos 2 day tests aren't too much fun (especially since we are not scoring much on them).

    So my hope is we don't see a rank turner or a dead patta for the 4th test.

    If I have to choose between those 2 only, I will choose a rank turner anyday and twice on Sunday.

    But I would personally prefer a more balanced track.

    And hopefully we prepare super hard for the WTC test.

    Imagine the world's reaction when we lift the WTC championship beating NZ in Lord's.

    The team's gotta work super hard for it but it's possible.

    Just 2 more tests. Let's go.
    The last of the two remaining tests has to be earned first and then playing, winning etc ...


    "If this happens I will swim across the Charles River! In winter!" -- OZGOD on NZ batting 6 sessions

  75. #155
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    Quote Originally Posted by Buffet View Post
    The last of the two remaining tests has to be earned first and then playing, winning etc ...
    Of course.

    Never underestimate anyone.

  76. #156
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    Quote Originally Posted by WengerOut View Post
    The pitch was turning not denying that. But what aggravated the situation was the pink ball. If landed on the seam it spun, but when it landed on the sides, the extra plastic coating made it skid fast. This was the reason for the straight ball becoming dangerous. The effects of both type of deliveries played on the batsman's mind. Spin playing prowess of both sides are just awful. I remember Sachin and Laxman playing beautifully in that infamous Mumbai test 2004.

    India are better of the two in playing spin. England won the toss and still lost.
    It takes getting used to. The first time I played a leather tape ball ( on one side ) I couldn't touch even a single ball. It was quite a challenge even to touch it. I was always late. Found an easy solution. Not to play tapped ball at all


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