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  1. #641
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    Hidden agendas by pillinger

    We are our brains by Swaab

    Necessary illusions by Chomsky

    Rubaiyat of Omar Khayyam

    Shikwa, Jawab-e-shikwa by Allama Iqbal

  2. #642
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    Rumi: Bridge to the Soul, Journeys into the Music and Silence of the Heart

  3. #643
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    Finished Freedom by Jonathan Franzen remarkable book ,I'm glad I'm going opposite in timeline in terms of reading his book, defn recommending it esp Freedom although if people are more into commercial stuff "Purity" is great too but Daniel Craig is already making a show on that so erm yeah.

    Started A Fine balance by Rohinton Mistry ,again reading it on recommendation from a friend and this books makes me so sad ,makes me realize how things have not changed(it speaks on 1975,partition),feel we in India are doing the same mistakes over and over again.

    Also trying to read The essentials Rumi on the side ,started well although there is a bit of religion in it,lets see how it develops.


    In cricket, my superhero is Sachin Tendulkar. He has always been my hero.
    -Virat Kohli

  4. #644
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    Have just started to read Norse Mythology, definitely worth the hype.

  5. #645
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    Ben Pimlott's biography of Harold Wilson is a weighty tome but a superb insight into the mind of one of the best post-war British PMs we've had.

    He goes into excruciating detail about Wilson's time at university and Labour's splits in the 1950s, but once you skip past that and start from Wilson's time as Labour leader, the book is worth investing time in.

  6. #646
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    'Nina is not OK' by Shappi Khorsandi about a young woman's battle with alcoholism. A real page turner. Moving, enlightening, funny and shocking.

  7. #647
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    Graphic Novel Spider-Man Blue


    Ah, so this is what it feels like

  8. #648
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    The Stranger - Albert Camus


    Tazimi Sirdar

  9. #649
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    In search of the castaways - Jules Verne

  10. #650
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    Quote Originally Posted by JaDed View Post
    Finished Freedom by Jonathan Franzen remarkable book ,I'm glad I'm going opposite in timeline in terms of reading his book, defn recommending it esp Freedom although if people are more into commercial stuff "Purity" is great too but Daniel Craig is already making a show on that so erm yeah.

    Started A Fine balance by Rohinton Mistry ,again reading it on recommendation from a friend and this books makes me so sad ,makes me realize how things have not changed(it speaks on 1975,partition),feel we in India are doing the same mistakes over and over again.

    Also trying to read The essentials Rumi on the side ,started well although there is a bit of religion in it,lets see how it develops.
    Just finished A Fine Balance, remarkable took me an year to finish it, great book,probably the best book by an Indian(now Canadian) author I have ever read in English.


    In cricket, my superhero is Sachin Tendulkar. He has always been my hero.
    -Virat Kohli

  11. #651
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    Going to Start Corrections by Jonathan Franzen soon,hopefully its as good as Freedom.


    In cricket, my superhero is Sachin Tendulkar. He has always been my hero.
    -Virat Kohli

  12. #652
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    Business Coursebook for AS and A Level

  13. #653
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arham_PakFan View Post
    Business Coursebook for AS and A Level
    @saadibaba anytime anyone talks about "business" books I can't help but remember the paragraph you wrote about your father.


    In cricket, my superhero is Sachin Tendulkar. He has always been my hero.
    -Virat Kohli

  14. #654
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    Quote Originally Posted by JaDed View Post
    @saadibaba anytime anyone talks about "business" books I can't help but remember the paragraph you wrote about your father.
    Yes, a cautionary tale for sure. But I think if you take a balanced approach, reading a few self help and business books is not a bad idea. My dad obviously got focused on only that and though he succeeded in his profession and business, he lost in life.


    √ɬĘ√Ę‚Äö¬¨√Ö‚ÄúI am not young enough to know everything.√ɬĘ√Ę‚Äö¬¨√ā¬Ě

    √ɬĘ√Ę‚Äö¬¨√Ę‚ā¨¬Ę Oscar Wilde

  15. #655
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    The 48 Laws of Power by Robert Greene. Currently reading The Strategy Paradox by Michael E. Raynor.

  16. #656
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    Quote Originally Posted by saadibaba View Post
    Yes, a cautionary tale for sure. But I think if you take a balanced approach, reading a few self help and business books is not a bad idea. My dad obviously got focused on only that and though he succeeded in his profession and business, he lost in life.
    I do get that, but a book store near my home as days passed started replacing fiction with self help and business books only to run out of business eventually, somehow I needed a reason to detest self help/business books and your writing gave me a genuine one.


    In cricket, my superhero is Sachin Tendulkar. He has always been my hero.
    -Virat Kohli

  17. #657
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    A book in potohari written by sir @Red Devil

  18. #658
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheHK16 View Post
    do you guys buy the books or find them on the internet
    Big fan of ebooks..download everything..Cant post links unfortunately ..don't want to get banned.

    The books I bought:

    1. JRD Tata - Letters
    2. Evolving with Subramanian Swamy
    3. Book by Kiran Bedi which I got for my wife on her birthday

    Rest (even cricket books) I download.

  19. #659
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    It's kind of a funny story.

    Good book about mental health.

  20. #660
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    Just finished Sapiens by Yuval Noah Harari, so picked up Homo Deus as my next book

    Also has got me interested in futurism, so naturaly it made me pick these books up for my reading list

    The Economic Singularity: Artifical Intelligence and The End of Capitalism By Calcum Chance

    The Zero Marginal Cost By Jeremy Rifkin

    How To Create a Mind By Ray Kurzweil

    Superintelligence By Nick Bostrum

    The Book of Santoshi: The Collected Writings of Bitcoin Creator Santoshi Nakamoto By Phil Champagne


    Our Final Invention: Artifical Intelligence and The End of the Human Era By James Barrat

    The Fourth Industrial Revolution By Klaus Schwab

    Life 3.0: Being Human In The Age of Artifical Intelligence By Max Tegmark

    The Future of Humanity: Terraforming Mars, Interstellar Travel, Immortality, and Our Destiny Beyond Earth By Michio Kaku

    Blockchain Revolution By Don Tapscott

    The Second Age By Erik Brynjolfsson

    To Be a Machine By Mark O'Connell


    If you want to destroy a country, just create enmity between its people and their army - Salahuddin

  21. #661
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    The Firm by John Grisham

  22. #662
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    Plassey to Partition - Shekhar Bandopadhyay


    Tazimi Sirdar

  23. #663
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    Mein Kampf.


    Gangster rap made me do it.

  24. #664
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    I’m reading Sven Beckert’s, Empire of Cotton. This is a fascinating account of the rise of global capitalism told through the prism of a single product - cotton - which for Beckert it was central to capitalist industrialisation.

    There are of course many explanations for the so called ‘great divergence’ when the ‘west’ surged ahead of the ‘rest’ in the nineteenth century, in terms of economic growth. Many of these explanations emphasise factors internal to European society, whether it is geography, culture, political and legal institutions, technological change or economic policy. Beckert, however, reminds us of early capitalism’s debts to imperialism and state-sponsored violence to secure land and labour. Indeed, Beckert places at the centre of capitalism’s global origins, violence and coercion in many different forms. Slavery, expropriation of land and colonialism were the pre-conditions for the ‘rise of the west’.

  25. #665
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    Quote Originally Posted by KB View Post
    Iím reading Sven Beckertís, Empire of Cotton. This is a fascinating account of the rise of global capitalism told through the prism of a single product - cotton - which for Beckert it was central to capitalist industrialisation.

    There are of course many explanations for the so called Ďgreat divergenceí when the Ďwestí surged ahead of the Ďrestí in the nineteenth century, in terms of economic growth. Many of these explanations emphasise factors internal to European society, whether it is geography, culture, political and legal institutions, technological change or economic policy. Beckert, however, reminds us of early capitalismís debts to imperialism and state-sponsored violence to secure land and labour. Indeed, Beckert places at the centre of capitalismís global origins, violence and coercion in many different forms. Slavery, expropriation of land and colonialism were the pre-conditions for the Ďrise of the westí.
    Hey KB you seem like the only genuine history buff here. Can you recommend a few books on Modern Indian History from Pakistani historians' standpoint/perspective ?
    Basically from the fall of Mughal empire after Aurangzeb till the partition.
    Would greatly appreciate it.
    Thanks.


    Tazimi Sirdar

  26. #666
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    Anybody got any recommendations for cricket-related books? Particularly, biographies?

  27. #667
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    Quote Originally Posted by ManFan View Post
    Anybody got any recommendations for cricket-related books? Particularly, biographies?
    Idols by Sunil Gavaskar. It's not exactly his biography but instead talks in detail about his favorite players against whom he played. Each player has one chapter dedicated to them. Among Pakistani ones, I think he included Imran, Miandad and Asif Iqbal.
    I remember reading it in School. An excellent read.


    Tazimi Sirdar

  28. #668
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    Quote Originally Posted by TM Riddle View Post
    Idols by Sunil Gavaskar. It's not exactly his biography but instead talks in detail about his favorite players against whom he played. Each player has one chapter dedicated to them. Among Pakistani ones, I think he included Imran, Miandad and Asif Iqbal.
    I remember reading it in School. An excellent read.
    Thanks TM!

    The only cricket related book Iíve read is IKís ďPakistan: A Personal HistoryĒ.

    And even that was only 20% cricket.

  29. #669
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    Quote Originally Posted by TM Riddle View Post
    Idols by Sunil Gavaskar. It's not exactly his biography but instead talks in detail about his favorite players against whom he played. Each player has one chapter dedicated to them. Among Pakistani ones, I think he included Imran, Miandad and Asif Iqbal.
    I remember reading it in School. An excellent read.
    Also, what are your thoughts on Abul Kalam Azad?

  30. #670
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    Quote Originally Posted by ManFan View Post
    Also, what are your thoughts on Abul Kalam Azad?
    He was something, Wasn't He? Mind you I am not basing it on account of me being biased because of his anti partition stance but on the fact that the respect he commanded even from his rivals.

    IMO He was easily the greatest secular figure of 20th century in Indian subcontinent, more than the Gandhis or Nehrus or any other Congress leaders.

    He was highly educated in both Quran and Western philosophies. Was proactive in the Khilafat movement and His Al-Hilal published from Calcutta provided a strong critique of imperialism and exploitative character of British Raj.

    A true nationalist Muslim he felt quite betrayed by the partition as he writes in his book India wins freedom. Even after the war when it looked like, freedom was imminent he and his fellow nationalist Muslims faced the ire of communalists who launched a vicious campaign against them branding them as 'show boys' of Congress, traitors to Islam and mercenary agents of the Hindus.
    He particularly along with Khan Abdul Gaffar Khan was submitted to social terror through appeals to religious fanaticism and even to physical attacks. Despite all of these, he remained hard as rock consistent by his principles.

    Was also the first education minister of independent India and played a crucial role in shaping up our National education policy and establishing IITs and AIIMS.


    Tazimi Sirdar

  31. #671
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    Quote Originally Posted by TM Riddle View Post
    He was something, Wasn't He? Mind you I am not basing it on account of me being biased because of his anti partition stance but on the fact that the respect he commanded even from his rivals.

    IMO He was easily the greatest secular figure of 20th century in Indian subcontinent, more than the Gandhis or Nehrus or any other Congress leaders.

    He was highly educated in both Quran and Western philosophies. Was proactive in the Khilafat movement and His Al-Hilal published from Calcutta provided a strong critique of imperialism and exploitative character of British Raj.

    A true nationalist Muslim he felt quite betrayed by the partition as he writes in his book India wins freedom. Even after the war when it looked like, freedom was imminent he and his fellow nationalist Muslims faced the ire of communalists who launched a vicious campaign against them branding them as 'show boys' of Congress, traitors to Islam and mercenary agents of the Hindus.
    He particularly along with Khan Abdul Gaffar Khan was submitted to social terror through appeals to religious fanaticism and even to physical attacks. Despite all of these, he remained hard as rock consistent by his principles.

    Was also the first education minister of independent India and played a crucial role in shaping up our National education policy and establishing IITs and AIIMS.
    Fantastic. Never knew about the Al-Hilal.

    If you have not read, I suggest to look up his predictions on the state of Pakistan. It is beyond scary how accurate they were.

    India was very lucky to have him.

    He does not get the recognition that he deserves in my opinion, even if his birthday is celebrated as Education Day.

    P.S, heís Amir Khanís (actor) great grand uncle.

  32. #672
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    Quote Originally Posted by ManFan View Post
    Fantastic. Never knew about the Al-Hilal.

    If you have not read, I suggest to look up his predictions on the state of Pakistan. It is beyond scary how accurate they were.

    India was very lucky to have him.

    He does not get the recognition that he deserves in my opinion, even if his birthday is celebrated as Education Day.

    P.S, heís Amir Khanís (actor) great grand uncle.
    Amir Khan has quite a few influential relatives, If I'm not wrong a former ISI chief was a cousin of his father or something too.
    Btw can you recommend a few good modern history books from any acclaimed Pakistani writer? I have had enough of Indians and would love to read a different view point (non biased of course).


    Tazimi Sirdar

  33. #673
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    Quote Originally Posted by TM Riddle View Post
    Amir Khan has quite a few influential relatives, If I'm not wrong a former ISI chief was a cousin of his father or something too.
    Btw can you recommend a few good modern history books from any acclaimed Pakistani writer? I have had enough of Indians and would love to read a different view point (non biased of course).
    Do you want specifically Pakistani sources? If so, than unfortunately, I am not well read in that area.

    So, I do not want to name a book just to do
    so.

    But, I have heard of, ď A Murder of History: A Critique of History Textbooks Used in PakistanĒ by K.K. Aziz. It takes a look at the propaganda and misuse of historical facts and the effects they have on students.

    Once I find a few books relating to modern history by Pakistani sources, I will come back to you.

  34. #674
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    Quote Originally Posted by ManFan View Post
    Do you want specifically Pakistani sources? If so, than unfortunately, I am not well read in that area.

    So, I do not want to name a book just to do
    so.

    But, I have heard of, ď A Murder of History: A Critique of History Textbooks Used in PakistanĒ by K.K. Aziz. It takes a look at the propaganda and misuse of historical facts and the effects they have on students.

    Once I find a few books relating to modern history by Pakistani sources, I will come back to you.
    Thanks. Really appreciate it.


    Tazimi Sirdar

  35. #675
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    Quote Originally Posted by TM Riddle View Post
    Thanks. Really appreciate it.
    No problem. Enjoy the read.

  36. #676
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    Quote Originally Posted by TM Riddle View Post
    Hey KB you seem like the only genuine history buff here. Can you recommend a few books on Modern Indian History from Pakistani historians' standpoint/perspective ?
    Basically from the fall of Mughal empire after Aurangzeb till the partition.
    Would greatly appreciate it.
    Thanks.
    I am sure there are others here who could point to interesting studies and I would be keen to learn from them as well. My own perspective is that the first point to note is that regrettably, I think there has been a paucity of first class historians produced by Pakistan. Indian history pre-1947 has therefore been written mainly by British, American and now increasingly Indian historians. The Pakistanis that have written influential pieces of work on South Asian history have tended to be based in western universities and have focussed on the history of Islam in South Asia, partition and Jinnah. Aziz Ahmad wrote a work on Islamic modernism in 1967, which looked at the ideas of certain key Muslim thinkers. Ayesha Jalal - in her book called the Sole Spokesman - challenged conventional thinking by arguing that the Pakistan that emerged in 1947, was not the Pakistan that Jinnah was in fact aiming for. Farzana Shaikh in contrast argued that ideas drawn from Islam, and not just the material interests of the few, shaped the demand for Pakistan. Pakistani historians based in Pakistan writing important studies are beginning to re-emerge, for example, Ali Usman Qasmi, Yaqoob Khan Bangash and Tahir Kamran.

    On general accounts focussing on the post-Mughal period, there is a useful introduction to Indian history produced by Jalal and the Indian historian (and now member of Indian Parliament) Sugata Bose - Modern South Asia. One theme that runs through this is that the insistence by nationalists of singular allegiance to the nation and the idea of unitary and indivisible sovereignty has often been the root of many of South Asia's problems. Ian Talbot’s book A History of Modern South Asia is also a useful study. He is not a Pakistani, but unlike many Indian historians who write general histories of South Asia, Talbot has written extensively on Pakistan, so arguably comes from a slightly different angle. Unlike other histories, there is firstly, a lengthy exercise in scene setting and introduction to region, which concentrates on borders and boundaries – the argument being that ‘border anxiety’ has meant national security has triumphed over human security - on how geography has been sacralised and on the increasing importance of the diaspora and the long history of migration of South Asians. Secondly, more than many other accounts, he also stresses the importance of business interests in strengthening the conservative wing of the Congress and in shaping the Congress preference for a strong state, which made compromise with the Muslim League more difficult. Thirdly, he points to the participation of overseas Indians in the nationalist movement and how the early Congress took a great interest in the plight of overseas Indians. However such a transnational imagining was narrowed down to a more national vision as independence drew nearer and Congress began to lose interest in the concerns of overseas Indians. Finally, there is a chapter on Bangladesh - too often ignored when the history of South Asia is told and a chapter on international relations with an assessment on the impact of the rise of China.

    Lastly, we may note that whilst Pakistani nationalist historians (such as Sheikh Ikram and Ishtiaq Qureshi) in the first two decades after Pakistan’s creation made great effort to elevate the role of Islam in the creation of Pakistan, in fact ironically the most eloquent case for the importance of Islamic ideas and values in shaping, constraining and motivating Muslim separatists, came from the west through the work of Francis Robinson - Islam and Muslim History in South Asia.

  37. #677
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    Quote Originally Posted by KB View Post
    I am sure there are others here who could point to interesting studies and I would be keen to learn from them as well. My own perspective is that the first point to note is that regrettably, I think there has been a paucity of first class historians produced by Pakistan. Indian history pre-1947 has therefore been written mainly by British, American and now increasingly Indian historians. The Pakistanis that have written influential pieces of work on South Asian history have tended to be based in western universities and have focussed on the history of Islam in South Asia, partition and Jinnah. Aziz Ahmad wrote a work on Islamic modernism in 1967, which looked at the ideas of certain key Muslim thinkers. Ayesha Jalal - in her book called the Sole Spokesman - challenged conventional thinking by arguing that the Pakistan that emerged in 1947, was not the Pakistan that Jinnah was in fact aiming for. Farzana Shaikh in contrast argued that ideas drawn from Islam, and not just the material interests of the few, shaped the demand for Pakistan. Pakistani historians based in Pakistan writing important studies are beginning to re-emerge, for example, Ali Usman Qasmi, Yaqoob Khan Bangash and Tahir Kamran.

    On general accounts focussing on the post-Mughal period, there is a useful introduction to Indian history produced by Jalal and the Indian historian (and now member of Indian Parliament) Sugata Bose - Modern South Asia. One theme that runs through this is that the insistence by nationalists of singular allegiance to the nation and the idea of unitary and indivisible sovereignty has often been the root of many of South Asia's problems. Ian Talbotís book A History of Modern South Asia is also a useful study. He is not a Pakistani, but unlike many Indian historians who write general histories of South Asia, Talbot has written extensively on Pakistan, so arguably comes from a slightly different angle. Unlike other histories, there is firstly, a lengthy exercise in scene setting and introduction to region, which concentrates on borders and boundaries Ė the argument being that Ďborder anxietyí has meant national security has triumphed over human security - on how geography has been sacralised and on the increasing importance of the diaspora and the long history of migration of South Asians. Secondly, more than many other accounts, he also stresses the importance of business interests in strengthening the conservative wing of the Congress and in shaping the Congress preference for a strong state, which made compromise with the Muslim League more difficult. Thirdly, he points to the participation of overseas Indians in the nationalist movement and how the early Congress took a great interest in the plight of overseas Indians. However such a transnational imagining was narrowed down to a more national vision as independence drew nearer and Congress began to lose interest in the concerns of overseas Indians. Finally, there is a chapter on Bangladesh - too often ignored when the history of South Asia is told and a chapter on international relations with an assessment on the impact of the rise of China.

    Lastly, we may note that whilst Pakistani nationalist historians (such as Sheikh Ikram and Ishtiaq Qureshi) in the first two decades after Pakistanís creation made great effort to elevate the role of Islam in the creation of Pakistan, in fact ironically the most eloquent case for the importance of Islamic ideas and values in shaping, constraining and motivating Muslim separatists, came from the west through the work of Francis Robinson - Islam and Muslim History in South Asia.
    Thanks a ton! That was indeed quite informative and helpful.
    A few questions to you
    1. How do you view the role of Sir Syed as the chief architect in shaping up the new Muslim identity post Mutiny and do you believe the Pakistan movement trace it's ideological roots to his philosophies?

    2. What and How much role did the Islam actually play? Sure it was used as a propaganda tool to entice the common, illetrate masses but how much impact it had on the minds of the leaders of grand standing such as Jinnah and Liaqat?

    3. This I have always wondered, how come State of Pakistan never understook any land reforms in a fashion similar to India did soon after the Independence? Why does feudalism still persists in the 21st century Pakistan when in fact it should have been wiped off 70 years ago instead.


    Tazimi Sirdar

  38. #678
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    Quote Originally Posted by TM Riddle View Post
    Thanks a ton! That was indeed quite informative and helpful.
    A few questions to you
    1. How do you view the role of Sir Syed as the chief architect in shaping up the new Muslim identity post Mutiny and do you believe the Pakistan movement trace it's ideological roots to his philosophies?

    2. What and How much role did the Islam actually play? Sure it was used as a propaganda tool to entice the common, illetrate masses but how much impact it had on the minds of the leaders of grand standing such as Jinnah and Liaqat?

    3. This I have always wondered, how come State of Pakistan never understook any land reforms in a fashion similar to India did soon after the Independence? Why does feudalism still persists in the 21st century Pakistan when in fact it should have been wiped off 70 years ago instead.
    Sayyid Ahmad Khan - clearly we should not draw a simple, straight line between his ideas and the creation of Pakistan. A lot of water flowed under the bridge between his death in 1898 and the creation of Pakistan in 1947. Whilst emphasising the distinctiveness of Muslim, mainly elite, interests, he still believed that Hindus and Muslims in India should form a single nation. Nevertheless, we can acknowledge that his opposition to the Congress contributed to a generation of Muslims by and large choosing to not join the Indian nationalist movement. More significantly, he laid the foundations for separatist institutions and provided the intellectual ammunition for Muslim separatism. This was not a cause, but a precondition, for the creation of Pakistan. We should not forget, though, that his ideas were deeply contested within the Muslim community. The poet Akbar Allahabadi wrote disparagingly of the Aligarh intellectuals, ďforget your history, break all your ties with shaykh and mosque - it could not matter less. Life's short. Best not worry overmuch. Eat English bread, and push your pen, and swell with happiness.Ē

    The role of Islam - this is a hugely contested area with many different viewpoints. My perspective is that the demand for a separate Muslim state was spearhead by the modernists, whose rhetoric was in fact suffused with Islam as an ethical ideal which would guide the Pakistani state. There was an emphasis on the Ďspirit of Islamí with the view that Islam was a dynamic religion, that needed to be freed from excessively formalistic understandings and that as an ethical ideal could cure many of the worldís ills. When the modernists spoke of brotherhood, social justice, and equality, they were not grounding these ideas in some secular norms but seeing them as expressions of longstanding Islamic norms. The modernists understanding of Islamic principles was of course greatly different from the ulama and ĎIslamistsí and their vision of Islam was Ďecumenicalí and inclusive. But the language nevertheless did overlap. So unlike many I donít think the reference to religious rhetoric was mere window dressing. At the same time, the modernists idea of Islam in Pakistan was very different from the religious establishment and very different from what Zia sought to implement.

    Land reforms - firstly, it is undeniable that land reforms largely failed in Pakistan. It is however questionable to see it as wholly successful throughout India. For example, Tirthankar Roy the leading economic historian of India talks of ďthe widespread failure of land reform in the region [by which he means South Asia generally].Ē Pakistan, however, was even less effective than India in implementing meaningful reform. This was due to the historical deep rootedness of landed power. There was a close collaboration between the rural elite in Punjab and the British rulers, arguably to a degree not matched elsewhere in British India. The dominant political party in the Punjab until late in the colonial day was the landlord dominated Punjab Unionist Party. It was only as late as 1945 that the Muslim League was able to turn the tide. Britain needed the rural notables to ensure a steady supply of men for the military. They also needed the rural elite to exercise their personal influence to ensure stability in the province.

    In British India, Western Punjab was also transformed from 1890 with the commencement of the building of perennial, as opposed to seasonal, canals. This was a major event where vast swathes of arid land were transformed into areas capable of commercialised agriculture all year round. This was also accompanied with large-scale agricultural colonisation of previously uncultivated, or semi-cultivated, land. Irrigation provided a lucrative mechanism for Britain to provide patronage to the rural elite, by way of land grants and thereby bind Britain and the large landowners more closely together. But irrigated land also meant farmers from Ďstressedí over-populated tracts could migrate to new land thereby reducing the likelihood of conflict which could have made the situation far more unstable for landlords in Punjab. Landlords were also given honours, nominated to darbars and local boards and were directly involved in administration by being appointed honorary magistrates and zaildars. The Punjab Alienation of Land Act in 1900, which forbade non-agriculturalists from acquiring land in the countryside, demonstrated how far Britain was prepared to go to protect agricultural interests. In 1919 they also granted agriculturalists with a preferential right of recruitment to government service.

    In the end the Muslim League was able to overcome the Unionist Party. But many landlords, seeing the way the wind was blowing, jumped on the ML bandwagon. The ML was happy to co-opt them to maximise votes in the 1946 elections. However, post partition such elites by aligning with the dominant party ensured that their interests were protected. Compared with India, larger landlords constituted a far bigger proportion of the Muslim League than the Congress. Mian Iftikharuddin, of the political left, sensationally quit as refugee minister due to landlords preventing land reform. In March 1948, in the Punjab assembly, he would set out his reasons:

    ďBecause I was sure the big zamindars would not allow me to levy agricultural tax and introduce any sort of reforms.Ö Our rulers say to impose tax on those landlords who own more than 25 acres is unfair; at the same time they claim that they would do their best for the settlement of refugees.Ö I asked them how they would do that Ö and those who call for new system are said they are spreading fitna [chaos] Ö [and they] are dismissed as the agents of Communist and enemies of the Government. Our rulers do fear that even to debate reforms would rag the landlords who might turn against the Government.Ē

    Feudalism - I would question how useful this concept is to understanding contemporary Pakistan. Ayaz Amirís once wrote íCommentators who have never spent a night in a village or ever set eyes on a patwari, talk freely about waderas and feudal culture, ascribing all the countryís political problems to these two phenomena.í Ayaz Amir went on to argue that feudalism was a Ďmost overworked concept in Pakistaní. In his colourful piece, written in 1996, Amir derides the Ďurban misconceptionÖthat anyone who looks like a hick, dresses like one, has a rural surname, curls his moustache and rides a PajeroÖis necessarily a feudal.í As Ayaz Amir has stated large landholdings are now confined mainly to some parts of interior Sindh and the southern belt in Punjab as well as some districts in western Punjab. Pakistani economist, Mahmood Hasan Khan, who has written extensively on agriculture in Pakistan, reminds us that 96% of farms are below 10 hectares and that there has been a reduction in sharecropping tenancy and increased incidence of owner-operated farms. In 1960 there were 41.7% of tenant farms, whereas in 2010 this was only 11%. The growth in self-cultivation is important as tenant farming is more readily associated with feudalism. 78% of farm area is occupied by farm sizes below 50 acres according to the 2010 agricultural census.
    Last edited by KB; 29th March 2018 at 23:37.

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    Quote Originally Posted by KB View Post
    Sayyid Ahmad Khan - clearly we should not draw a simple, straight line between his ideas and the creation of Pakistan. A lot of water flowed under the bridge between his death in 1898 and the creation of Pakistan in 1947. Whilst emphasising the distinctiveness of Muslim, mainly elite, interests, he still believed that Hindus and Muslims in India should form a single nation. Nevertheless, we can acknowledge that his opposition to the Congress contributed to a generation of Muslims by and large choosing to not join the Indian nationalist movement. More significantly, he laid the foundations for separatist institutions and provided the intellectual ammunition for Muslim separatism. This was not a cause, but a precondition, for the creation of Pakistan. We should not forget, though, that his ideas were deeply contested within the Muslim community. The poet Akbar Allahabadi wrote disparagingly of the Aligarh intellectuals, ďforget your history, break all your ties with shaykh and mosque - it could not matter less. Life's short. Best not worry overmuch. Eat English bread, and push your pen, and swell with happiness.Ē

    The role of Islam - this is a hugely contested area with many different viewpoints. My perspective is that the demand for a separate Muslim state was spearhead by the modernists, whose rhetoric was in fact suffused with Islam as an ethical ideal which would guide the Pakistani state. There was an emphasis on the Ďspirit of Islamí with the view that Islam was a dynamic religion, that needed to be freed from excessively formalistic understandings and that as an ethical ideal could cure many of the worldís ills. When the modernists spoke of brotherhood, social justice, and equality, they were not grounding these ideas in some secular norms but seeing them as expressions of longstanding Islamic norms. The modernists understanding of Islamic principles was of course greatly different from the ulama and ĎIslamistsí and their vision of Islam was Ďecumenicalí and inclusive. But the language nevertheless did overlap. So unlike many I donít think the reference to religious rhetoric was mere window dressing. At the same time, the modernists idea of Islam in Pakistan was very different from the religious establishment and very different from what Zia sought to implement.

    Land reforms - firstly, it is undeniable that land reforms largely failed in Pakistan. It is however questionable to see it as wholly successful throughout India. For example, Tirthankar Roy the leading economic historian of India talks of ďthe widespread failure of land reform in the region [by which he means South Asia generally].Ē Pakistan, however, was even less effective than India in implementing meaningful reform. This was due to the historical deep rootedness of landed power. There was a close collaboration between the rural elite in Punjab and the British rulers, arguably to a degree not matched elsewhere in British India. The dominant political party in the Punjab until late in the colonial day was the landlord dominated Punjab Unionist Party. It was only as late as 1945 that the Muslim League was able to turn the tide. Britain needed the rural notables to ensure a steady supply of men for the military. They also needed the rural elite to exercise their personal influence to ensure stability in the province.

    In British India, Western Punjab was also transformed from 1890 with the commencement of the building of perennial, as opposed to seasonal, canals. This was a major event where vast swathes of arid land were transformed into areas capable of commercialised agriculture all year round. This was also accompanied with large-scale agricultural colonisation of previously uncultivated, or semi-cultivated, land. Irrigation provided a lucrative mechanism for Britain to provide patronage to the rural elite, by way of land grants and thereby bind Britain and the large landowners more closely together. But irrigated land also meant farmers from Ďstressedí over-populated tracts could migrate to new land thereby reducing the likelihood of conflict which could have made the situation far more unstable for landlords in Punjab. Landlords were also given honours, nominated to darbars and local boards and were directly involved in administration by being appointed honorary magistrates and zaildars. The Punjab Alienation of Land Act in 1900, which forbade non-agriculturalists from acquiring land in the countryside, demonstrated how far Britain was prepared to go to protect agricultural interests. In 1919 they also granted agriculturalists with a preferential right of recruitment to government service.

    In the end the Muslim League was able to overcome the Unionist Party. But many landlords, seeing the way the wind was blowing, jumped on the ML bandwagon. The ML was happy to co-opt them to maximise votes in the 1946 elections. However, post partition such elites by aligning with the dominant party ensured that their interests were protected. Compared with India, larger landlords constituted a far bigger proportion of the Muslim League than the Congress. Mian Iftikharuddin, of the political left, sensationally quit as refugee minister due to landlords preventing land reform. In March 1948, in the Punjab assembly, he would set out his reasons:

    ďBecause I was sure the big zamindars would not allow me to levy agricultural tax and introduce any sort of reforms.Ö Our rulers say to impose tax on those landlords who own more than 25 acres is unfair; at the same time they claim that they would do their best for the settlement of refugees.Ö I asked them how they would do that Ö and those who call for new system are said they are spreading fitna [chaos] Ö [and they] are dismissed as the agents of Communist and enemies of the Government. Our rulers do fear that even to debate reforms would rag the landlords who might turn against the Government.Ē

    Feudalism - I would question how useful this concept is to understanding contemporary Pakistan. Ayaz Amirís once wrote íCommentators who have never spent a night in a village or ever set eyes on a patwari, talk freely about waderas and feudal culture, ascribing all the countryís political problems to these two phenomena.í Ayaz Amir went on to argue that feudalism was a Ďmost overworked concept in Pakistaní. In his colourful piece, written in 1996, Amir derides the Ďurban misconceptionÖthat anyone who looks like a hick, dresses like one, has a rural surname, curls his moustache and rides a PajeroÖis necessarily a feudal.í As Ayaz Amir has stated large landholdings are now confined mainly to some parts of interior Sindh and the southern belt in Punjab as well as some districts in western Punjab. Pakistani economist, Mahmood Hasan Khan, who has written extensively on agriculture in Pakistan, reminds us that 96% of farms are below 10 hectares and that there has been a reduction in sharecropping tenancy and increased incidence of owner-operated farms. In 1960 there were 41.7% of tenant farms, whereas in 2010 this was only 11%. The growth in self-cultivation is important as tenant farming is more readily associated with feudalism. 78% of farm area is occupied by farm sizes below 50 acres according to the 2010 agricultural census.
    POTW.

    Phew! That took a while to read.

    How do you know so much about the subcontinent and itís history?

  40. #680
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    Currently reading.

    Power versus Force: An Anatomy of Consciousness. It's about human behavior.


    Gangster rap made me do it.

  41. #681
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    Quote Originally Posted by KB View Post
    Sayyid Ahmad Khan - clearly we should not draw a simple, straight line between his ideas and the creation of Pakistan. A lot of water flowed under the bridge between his death in 1898 and the creation of Pakistan in 1947. Whilst emphasising the distinctiveness of Muslim, mainly elite, interests, he still believed that Hindus and Muslims in India should form a single nation. Nevertheless, we can acknowledge that his opposition to the Congress contributed to a generation of Muslims by and large choosing to not join the Indian nationalist movement. More significantly, he laid the foundations for separatist institutions and provided the intellectual ammunition for Muslim separatism. This was not a cause, but a precondition, for the creation of Pakistan. We should not forget, though, that his ideas were deeply contested within the Muslim community. The poet Akbar Allahabadi wrote disparagingly of the Aligarh intellectuals, ďforget your history, break all your ties with shaykh and mosque - it could not matter less. Life's short. Best not worry overmuch. Eat English bread, and push your pen, and swell with happiness.Ē

    The role of Islam - this is a hugely contested area with many different viewpoints. My perspective is that the demand for a separate Muslim state was spearhead by the modernists, whose rhetoric was in fact suffused with Islam as an ethical ideal which would guide the Pakistani state. There was an emphasis on the Ďspirit of Islamí with the view that Islam was a dynamic religion, that needed to be freed from excessively formalistic understandings and that as an ethical ideal could cure many of the worldís ills. When the modernists spoke of brotherhood, social justice, and equality, they were not grounding these ideas in some secular norms but seeing them as expressions of longstanding Islamic norms. The modernists understanding of Islamic principles was of course greatly different from the ulama and ĎIslamistsí and their vision of Islam was Ďecumenicalí and inclusive. But the language nevertheless did overlap. So unlike many I donít think the reference to religious rhetoric was mere window dressing. At the same time, the modernists idea of Islam in Pakistan was very different from the religious establishment and very different from what Zia sought to implement.

    Land reforms - firstly, it is undeniable that land reforms largely failed in Pakistan. It is however questionable to see it as wholly successful throughout India. For example, Tirthankar Roy the leading economic historian of India talks of ďthe widespread failure of land reform in the region [by which he means South Asia generally].Ē Pakistan, however, was even less effective than India in implementing meaningful reform. This was due to the historical deep rootedness of landed power. There was a close collaboration between the rural elite in Punjab and the British rulers, arguably to a degree not matched elsewhere in British India. The dominant political party in the Punjab until late in the colonial day was the landlord dominated Punjab Unionist Party. It was only as late as 1945 that the Muslim League was able to turn the tide. Britain needed the rural notables to ensure a steady supply of men for the military. They also needed the rural elite to exercise their personal influence to ensure stability in the province.

    In British India, Western Punjab was also transformed from 1890 with the commencement of the building of perennial, as opposed to seasonal, canals. This was a major event where vast swathes of arid land were transformed into areas capable of commercialised agriculture all year round. This was also accompanied with large-scale agricultural colonisation of previously uncultivated, or semi-cultivated, land. Irrigation provided a lucrative mechanism for Britain to provide patronage to the rural elite, by way of land grants and thereby bind Britain and the large landowners more closely together. But irrigated land also meant farmers from Ďstressedí over-populated tracts could migrate to new land thereby reducing the likelihood of conflict which could have made the situation far more unstable for landlords in Punjab. Landlords were also given honours, nominated to darbars and local boards and were directly involved in administration by being appointed honorary magistrates and zaildars. The Punjab Alienation of Land Act in 1900, which forbade non-agriculturalists from acquiring land in the countryside, demonstrated how far Britain was prepared to go to protect agricultural interests. In 1919 they also granted agriculturalists with a preferential right of recruitment to government service.

    In the end the Muslim League was able to overcome the Unionist Party. But many landlords, seeing the way the wind was blowing, jumped on the ML bandwagon. The ML was happy to co-opt them to maximise votes in the 1946 elections. However, post partition such elites by aligning with the dominant party ensured that their interests were protected. Compared with India, larger landlords constituted a far bigger proportion of the Muslim League than the Congress. Mian Iftikharuddin, of the political left, sensationally quit as refugee minister due to landlords preventing land reform. In March 1948, in the Punjab assembly, he would set out his reasons:

    ďBecause I was sure the big zamindars would not allow me to levy agricultural tax and introduce any sort of reforms.Ö Our rulers say to impose tax on those landlords who own more than 25 acres is unfair; at the same time they claim that they would do their best for the settlement of refugees.Ö I asked them how they would do that Ö and those who call for new system are said they are spreading fitna [chaos] Ö [and they] are dismissed as the agents of Communist and enemies of the Government. Our rulers do fear that even to debate reforms would rag the landlords who might turn against the Government.Ē

    Feudalism - I would question how useful this concept is to understanding contemporary Pakistan. Ayaz Amirís once wrote íCommentators who have never spent a night in a village or ever set eyes on a patwari, talk freely about waderas and feudal culture, ascribing all the countryís political problems to these two phenomena.í Ayaz Amir went on to argue that feudalism was a Ďmost overworked concept in Pakistaní. In his colourful piece, written in 1996, Amir derides the Ďurban misconceptionÖthat anyone who looks like a hick, dresses like one, has a rural surname, curls his moustache and rides a PajeroÖis necessarily a feudal.í As Ayaz Amir has stated large landholdings are now confined mainly to some parts of interior Sindh and the southern belt in Punjab as well as some districts in western Punjab. Pakistani economist, Mahmood Hasan Khan, who has written extensively on agriculture in Pakistan, reminds us that 96% of farms are below 10 hectares and that there has been a reduction in sharecropping tenancy and increased incidence of owner-operated farms. In 1960 there were 41.7% of tenant farms, whereas in 2010 this was only 11%. The growth in self-cultivation is important as tenant farming is more readily associated with feudalism. 78% of farm area is occupied by farm sizes below 50 acres according to the 2010 agricultural census.
    Wow that was a staggering amount of information. Thank you very much.
    @DeadBall This surely deserves a POTW


    Tazimi Sirdar

  42. #682
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    KB always comes with POTW stuff. The idiom "So sonar ki, ek lohar ki" fits him perfectly.

  43. #683
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    Halfway through Ian Black's history of the Israeli-Palestinian conflict between 1917-2017. If you want a concise summation of the conflict then I'd recommend it though it may frustrate those who want more depth.

  44. #684
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    Accelerated C++



    Such is my life, that I don't get to read any fiction/non-fiction books. All I get time for are text books for school or personal development.


    #Hum apko container deingaye dharnay ke liyay

  45. #685
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    Quote Originally Posted by Markhor View Post
    Halfway through Ian Black's history of the Israeli-Palestinian conflict between 1917-2017. If you want a concise summation of the conflict then I'd recommend it though it may frustrate those who want more depth.
    You should check out, ďImage and Reality of the Israel-Palestine ConflictĒ by Norman G. Finkelstein. His parents were Jewish Holocaust survivors and he taught at Ivy League schools.


    "Preventive war is like committing suicide for fear of death" ~ Otto Von Bismarck

  46. #686
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    The New Encyclopedia of Modern Bodybuilding.


    Gangster rap made me do it.

  47. #687
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    Quote Originally Posted by Syed1 View Post
    Accelerated C++



    Such is my life, that I don't get to read any fiction/non-fiction books. All I get time for are text books for school or personal development.
    Do you write CPP also?


    Gangster rap made me do it.

  48. #688
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    Quote Originally Posted by Abdul View Post
    Do you write CPP also?
    At one point I was interested in learning it but have now reverted to C programming... most of my programming is for embedded systems for which C is the most versatile.


    #Hum apko container deingaye dharnay ke liyay

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    Finished Harry potter series 3 years ago. read none after that. but It is one of my hearty desire to read lots of stuff specially epic fantasy books in future once I settle my self from this borring daily life conflicts. wish there were reading culture from young age in subcontinent

    now I found very hard to commit my self for reading a book.

  50. #690
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    Quote Originally Posted by introvert View Post
    Finished Harry potter series 3 years ago. read none after that. but It is one of my hearty desire to read lots of stuff specially epic fantasy books in future once I settle my self from this borring daily life conflicts. wish there were reading culture from young age in subcontinent

    now I found very hard to commit my self for reading a book.
    Read The Kingkiller Chronicles.
    Not as good as Potter but definitely a better alternative in an otherwise rubbish era for fantasy genre.


    Tazimi Sirdar

  51. #691
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    Most recent ones :

    - Stranger Than We Can Imagine by John Higgs : a panoramic reading of the major intellectual and cultural trends of the last century. It's divided into many thematic chapters ("relativity", "modernism", "individualism", ...) and touches upon the key ideas of the 20th century with a lot of pedagogy, while retaining a certain minimalism.

    Encompassing philosophy, science and art, this intellectual travelogue is the best of its kind I've came across as of yet.

    - How Language Began by Daniel Everett : tries to show that language didn't begin with the homo sapiens as commonly taught, circa 200 000 years ago, but with the homo erectus, some 1.5-2 millions years ago ; says that language is born with the possibility to "symbolize", and that's what makes us different from animals ; grammar is not essential for language, which also goes against the dominant paradigm in modern linguistics, Chomsky's generative grammar (Everett is a moderate constructionist, like Piaget) ; the brain-language connection is not as causal as we might think (he gives different clinical examples, like autistic individuals), this is again a controversy against the Chomsky school.

    The prose was rather insipid and some demonstrations very volatile, but an interesting read nonetheless.

    - Islam without Europe by Ahmad S. Dallah : a study of the major Islamic reform movements in the 18th century CE. Basically the author wants to vindicate the idea that reformism in Islam is endogenous to the religious tradition itself, and that the later, better known reformist movements - as Edward Said has shown, basically an answer to Napoleon's 1798 Egyptian campaign - were a sort of betrayed of that intellectual tradition within Islam, because they imported Eurocentric ideas on an Islamic model (thus the title, "Islam without Europe" had its own vigorous reformist tradition).

    It's mainly a studies of specific figures, for instance, from South Asia, Shah Waliullah.

    The book was good but not as "revolutionary" as some hailed it to be, few months ago.

    I was expecting a book ŗ la Khaled El-Rouayheb's "Islamic Intellectual History in the Seventeenth Century", which unveils an unknown intellectual continent, but here it's mainly an in-depth yet somehow redundant analysis of authors we're already more or less familiar with (Ibn Abd al Wahhab, etc).
    Last edited by enkidu_; 11th August 2018 at 12:20.

  52. #692
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    Quote Originally Posted by Abdul View Post
    The New Encyclopedia of Modern Bodybuilding.
    I've read some of Al Kavadlo's books on calisthenics, does this encyclopedia of bodybuilding include calisthenics? I'd like to get it if it does

  53. #693
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    Quote Originally Posted by introvert View Post
    Finished Harry potter series 3 years ago. read none after that. but It is one of my hearty desire to read lots of stuff specially epic fantasy books in future once I settle my self from this borring daily life conflicts. wish there were reading culture from young age in subcontinent

    now I found very hard to commit my self for reading a book.
    Try the witcher series of books and games. The games are fun, have heard a lot of good things about the books but not read them yet

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    Quote Originally Posted by TM Riddle View Post
    Read The Kingkiller Chronicles.
    Not as good as Potter but definitely a better alternative in an otherwise rubbish era for fantasy genre.
    Do you want to recommend ASOIAF to him?
    @introvert

  55. #695
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arham_PakFan View Post
    Do you want to recommend ASOIAF to him?
    @introvert
    ASOIAF is pretty famous now so I assumed he would have already know about it.

    Another fantasy series I recommend is Malazan book of the fallen. If you are interested in world building and complexities that come with epic fantasy novels, it's for you.


    Tazimi Sirdar

  56. #696
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    Quote Originally Posted by TM Riddle View Post
    ASOIAF is pretty famous now so I assumed he would have already know about it.

    Another fantasy series I recommend is Malazan book of the fallen. If you are interested in world building and complexities that come with epic fantasy novels, it's for you.
    Have heard a lot about this series.Haven’t seen it yet in any book store or library.

    Guess I’ll have to get a PDF.

  57. #697
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arham_PakFan View Post
    Have heard a lot about this series.Havenít seen it yet in any book store or library.

    Guess Iíll have to get a PDF.
    They are for a particular niche audience hence not that famous.
    Mind you might not like it at first but if you devote enough time it grows on you.


    Tazimi Sirdar

  58. #698
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    Currently half way through ďThe 33 Strategies of WarĒ and have ďThe Ego is The EnemyĒ waiting.

  59. #699
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    Advanced CFD and Aerodynamics
    Airbreathing Propulsion
    The Motorcycle Diaries
    Bruce Lee: Change Your World
    War Stories
    People Who Changed the World


    Currently reading Bunce's Big Fat Short History of British Boxing and Sin City. Tried to read Cheating Death / Stealing Life but can't stop crying after each chapter so put it away


    Ah, so this is what it feels like

  60. #700
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    Quote Originally Posted by shaz619 View Post
    Advanced CFD and Aerodynamics
    Airbreathing Propulsion
    The Motorcycle Diaries
    Bruce Lee: Change Your World
    War Stories
    People Who Changed the World


    Currently reading Bunce's Big Fat Short History of British Boxing and Sin City. Tried to read Cheating Death / Stealing Life but can't stop crying after each chapter so put it away
    Eddie Guerrero was my favorite wrestler as a kid.

    That post-match celebration when he won the title at NWO 2004 against Brock Lesnar, I used to get teary-eyed even as a kid.

    My sister brought the DVD with the same name and after learning his entire story, he was my hero to become a pro wrestler. (I learned how to do the top rope move Kane does when he throws his hand at the opponents throat in second grade but got in trouble for doing it in the playground )

    He was genuinely the most generous man in wrestling as all his fellow co-workers attest to him literally taking his shirt off to give to a homeless man. *Sigh* Every great wrestler dies young; Eddie, Owen, British Bulldog, Bruiser Brody, etc.

  61. #701
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    Quote Originally Posted by ManFan View Post
    Eddie Guerrero was my favorite wrestler as a kid.

    That post-match celebration when he won the title at NWO 2004 against Brock Lesnar, I used to get teary-eyed even as a kid.

    My sister brought the DVD with the same name and after learning his entire story, he was my hero to become a pro wrestler. (I learned how to do the top rope move Kane does when he throws his hand at the opponents throat in second grade but got in trouble for doing it in the playground )

    He was genuinely the most generous man in wrestling as all his fellow co-workers attest to him literally taking his shirt off to give to a homeless man. *Sigh* Every great wrestler dies young; Eddie, Owen, British Bulldog, Bruiser Brody, etc.
    Et tu Manfan?
    I hope for your sake that your love for WWF subsided once you turned 11.
    We don't want more grown up kids on this forum do we?


    Tazimi Sirdar

  62. #702
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    Quote Originally Posted by TM Riddle View Post
    Et tu Manfan?
    I hope for your sake that your love for WWF subsided once you turned 11.
    We don't want more grown up kids on this forum do we?
    Ha Ha.

    No worries TM Paaji.

    I lost all interest at the age of twelve so you are not far behind from that assessment.

    But when you first turn on American television at the age of five and see a six foot five inch Batista drink milk and bounce his pecs, how can you watch anything else?

  63. #703
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    Quote Originally Posted by ManFan View Post
    Ha Ha.

    No worries TM Paaji.

    I lost all interest at the age of twelve so you are not far behind from that assessment.

    But when you first turn on American television at the age of five and see a six foot five inch Batista drink milk and bounce his pecs, how can you watch anything else?
    It's natural really. I remember losing my sleep over Undertaker's 12th fake death or the revelation of the fact that him and Kane were actually brothers who had a falling out because of some girl(?) which led to Undertaker burning his little brother's face forcing him to wear a mask over his scarred face for the rest of his life or something (sounds similar to the mountain burning hound in ASOIAF ain't it?)

    Khair thankfully I grew up.
    Last edited by Abdullah719; 11th August 2018 at 20:31.


    Tazimi Sirdar

  64. #704
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    Quote Originally Posted by TM Riddle View Post
    Read The Kingkiller Chronicles.
    Not as good as Potter but definitely a better alternative in an otherwise rubbish era for fantasy genre.
    I read the Artemis Fowl series about 8-9 years ago and although they were not HP level but still quite entertaining, gripping and above all quite funny in the vein of HP.

  65. #705
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    Quote Originally Posted by ManFan View Post
    Ha Ha.

    No worries TM Paaji.

    I lost all interest at the age of twelve so you are not far behind from that assessment.

    But when you first turn on American television at the age of five and see a six foot five inch Batista drink milk and bounce his pecs, how can you watch anything else?
    I have a very funny WWF story of my own but don't think it will be appropriate here. Btw I was 12 too.

  66. #706
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    Quote Originally Posted by DeadBall View Post
    I read the Artemis Fowl series about 8-9 years ago and although they were not HP level but still quite entertaining, gripping and above all quite funny in the vein of HP.
    Heard loads of rave reviews but haven't gotten around to reading it sadly.
    One day inshallah


    Tazimi Sirdar

  67. #707
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    Quote Originally Posted by DeadBall View Post
    I have a very funny WWF story of my own but don't think it will be appropriate here. Btw I was 12 too.
    Wait they had WWF in your time too?
    How old is this industry really?


    Tazimi Sirdar

  68. #708
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    Quote Originally Posted by DeadBall View Post
    I read the Artemis Fowl series about 8-9 years ago and although they were not HP level but still quite entertaining, gripping and above all quite funny in the vein of HP.
    Rick Riordan books were the trend ten years ago.

    Definitely worth a read if you have children in the ten to fourteen age bracket.

  69. #709
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    Quote Originally Posted by ManFan View Post
    Rick Riordan books were the trend ten years ago.

    Definitely worth a read if you have children in the ten to fourteen age bracket.
    Cheap rip off of HP tbh. There are so many similarities between the two series that sometimes it's not even funny.
    Having said that, I enjoyed reading about the world of Olympians. It could have been a lot better but still entertaining nonetheless.


    Tazimi Sirdar

  70. #710
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    Quote Originally Posted by TM Riddle View Post
    Wait they had WWF in your time too?
    How old is this industry really?
    Don't know what you mean by my time as I am only 37 years young but yes, they did, although we did not get it live but had recorded tapes which we bought/rented from the local video store. I missed the much older era of Hogan, Randy Man Savage, the original Undertaker etc. The main players during my time were Bret The Hitman Hart, British Bulldog, Yokuzona, Triple H, Steve Austin etc. It was still WWF at the time and we usually used to watch it as there was very little other options apart from renting some Bollywood movies or watching a censored Hollywood movie every Thursday night at 10 on Dubai Channel 33 before it went offline till 7 the next day.

  71. #711
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    Quote Originally Posted by DeadBall View Post
    Don't know what you mean by my time as I am only 37 years young but yes, they did, although we did not get it live but had recorded tapes which we bought/rented from the local video store. I missed the much older era of Hogan, Randy Man Savage, the original Undertaker etc. The main players during my time were Bret The Hitman Hart, British Bulldog, Yokuzona, Triple H, Steve Austin etc. It was still WWF at the time and we usually used to watch it as there was very little other options apart from renting some Bollywood movies or watching a censored Hollywood movie every Thursday night at 10 on Dubai Channel 33 before it went offline till 7 the next day.
    I was joking of course. My elder brother is around your age and used to be a huge wrestling fan back in the early 90s.
    I remember discovering his collection of WWF playing cards and other merchandise.
    He is chiefly the reason behind my adulation for Hollywood Hulk Hogan, Stone Cold Steve Austin and Shawn Michaels even though they were past their best once I started watching it.


    Tazimi Sirdar

  72. #712
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    Quote Originally Posted by TM Riddle View Post
    Cheap rip off of HP tbh. There are so many similarities between the two series that sometimes it's not even funny.
    Having said that, I enjoyed reading about the world of Olympians. It could have been a lot better but still entertaining nonetheless.
    Of course it is.

    But it has its own story-telling narrative due to the embodiment of Greek mythology.

    I stopped reading since ďThe Son of NeptuneĒ and pretty much gave up reading all together after that. Until I decided to give Malcolm Xís autobiography a second chance and fell in love with the written word again.

    The mastery of orating and recitation displayed by Hitchens and even some PP posters (@Nostalgic) got me back into the world of thinking.

    Because you know what happens in your teenage years...

  73. #713
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    Quote Originally Posted by ManFan View Post
    Of course it is.

    But it has its own story-telling narrative due to the embodiment of Greek mythology.

    I stopped reading since ďThe Son of NeptuneĒ and pretty much gave up reading all together after that. Until I decided to give Malcolm Xís autobiography a second chance and fell in love with the written word again.

    The mastery of orating and recitation displayed by Hitchens and even some PP posters (@Nostalgic) got me back into the world of thinking.

    Because you know what happens in your teenage years...
    I enjoyed reading about Greek mythology in the said series. Growing up in India we were exposed very little to the ancient civilizations of Europe unless you don't count Hercules cartoon and a token chapter on Greeks and Romans in our history textbook back in sixth grade.

    I don't read much now a days either. Work and other commitments are simply too much and not to mention internet which has significantly lowered my attention span.


    Tazimi Sirdar

  74. #714
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    Quote Originally Posted by TM Riddle View Post
    I enjoyed reading about Greek mythology in the said series. Growing up in India we were exposed very little to the ancient civilizations of Europe unless you don't count Hercules cartoon and a token chapter on Greeks and Romans in our history textbook back in sixth grade.

    I don't read much now a days either. Work and other commitments are simply too much and not to mention internet which has significantly lowered my attention span.
    It has for everyone.

    More devices for communication leads to less
    of it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Adijazz1706 View Post
    I've read some of Al Kavadlo's books on calisthenics, does this encyclopedia of bodybuilding include calisthenics? I'd like to get it if it does
    Nope, it revolves around Schwarzenegger. He is the author.

    On that note, I still have to read his autobiography.


    Gangster rap made me do it.

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    How many people here have an interest in fantasy novels?

    I am currently reading "Oathbringer" by Brandon Sanderson which is the third book in the "Stormlight Archives" series.

    I really recommend it for anyone looking for a good fantasy series. Sanderson is a highly acclaimed fantasy author and I can see why after reading his stuff.


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