VICE Guide to Karachi

[akheR]

Sure, we hear about violence in Pakistan all the time, but in 2011, more than three times as many people were killed in Karachi than the number of people killed in American drone strikes in the tribal areas. VICE explores the seedy underbelly of this ultra-violent metropolis of more than eighteen million people, and meet the players who make Karachi one of the craziest cities on earth. Hosted by VICE Founder Suroosh Alvi

Basim Usmani from The Kominas (punk rock band) as special guest. <3

[BMW Power]

The Vice has done some really interesting shows, esp on North Korea and the conflict minerals in DRC. Looking forward to this.

[ElRaja]

i remember suroosh alvi already made a mini doco in pakistan, in darra in kp a few years ago i think.

[Looney]

Will they show the famous kaala pull ?

[velu]

lol.. if the facts about karachi is true then mafia wars should include karachi too

How many people have you ... killed ?? Thirty or forty five.

guess he is a Tees Maar Khan

[humzy]

So interested in this new documentary from VICE, the last one about the Gun Markets of NWFP was also amazing..

What's everyones thoughts on Karachi at the moment, especially those living in the city?

[Saudi]

I just watched all the parts right now. Definitely showcased how mental many parts of Karachi are. Won't come as too much of a surprise for people who keep in touch with Pakistan and especially Karachi but its still an interesting piece. Worth a watch for the overseas bunch especially...

The interview with the target killer(if true) was intense. I was also very surprised and saddened by the whole Lyari episode. Seems almost fictional how this larger than life mafia boss is basically ruling an entire district.

[KingKhanWC]

This looks interesting. Is the full show available?

[Saudi]

Its 5 parts, all of them are uploaded on youtube.

[KingKhanWC]

Thanks dude. I remember a show on Channel 4 many years ago, called Karachi Cops, that was classic.

[wasim-fan]

That conversation with target killer was chilling but so incredibly sad.

I wonder how this guy managed to get this kind of access

[ElRaja]

Originally Posted by wasim-fan That conversation with target killer was chilling but so incredibly sad. I wonder how this guy managed to get this kind of access

by paying enough people, if killing somone is about £500, im pretty sure finding someone is a lot cheaper.

[wasim-fan]

Yes but he is risking his life. And not to mention when the PPP politician knows what the documentary is all about, he would be mad as hell.

[ElRaja]

Originally Posted by wasim-fan Yes but he is risking his life. And not to mention when the PPP politician knows what the documentary is all about, he would be mad as hell.

that he is, but when alls said and done he'll get on a flight to canada before the vid is released and ppp cant do anything to anyone there.

[Looney]

I am watching it now .

0.26 of first part , is that near the pehlwan goth and safoora goth area ? And i am liking the bollywood music

Part 3 Orangi Town

[Dolphins]

Should be Vice Guide to Lyari and Orangi because that's all they showed in the whole video.

[Pahari]

Thanks for linking up the vids, just finished watching.
Karachi is a pretty lawless place...

[from_da_lost_dim3nsion]

Saw this whole thing . Pretty interesting but definitely had some masala quotient in it .Did anyone else realize that the only person sorry for his action and showed a little bit of sharam was the heroin addict .

[Looney]

Originally Posted by from_da_lost_dim3nsion Saw this whole thing . Pretty interesting but definitely had some masala quotient in it .Did anyone else realize that the only person sorry for his action and showed a little bit of sharam was the heroin addict .

If these guys stop taking drugs , the crime rate will probably go up even more .

[humzy]

saddest part was to see the kids in the rubbish tips

[Farhan!]

Thought it was okay! Nothing too special. Karachi is not as bad as these guys have made it look.

Yes there are a few areas but they have pretty much just went to the worst ones i.e. Lyari etc.

Was expecting to see a bit of the positive side too when I first saw the promo - it seemed on the lighter side.

[KingKhanWC]

Watched this now. The police are a joke, putting on silly little shows for the media arresting any old person and then getting paid by the real villians.

Karachi needs a new type of police force along with banning all ethnic based parties esp the MQM and ANP. The MQM leader is sat in London and his representative in the show looks, sounds and is dressed like an Indian. If these people love India so much they should be sent back there on a donkey!

[Looney]

Pakistan might as well nuke itself to completely disassociate itself from India

[KingKhanWC]

Originally Posted by Looney Pakistan might as well nuke itself to completely disassociate itself from India

A bit drastic but perhaps some hardcore MQM supporters might see this as a reasonable proposition.

How about people just shed their old ethnic love and just define themselves as Pakistani's? Pakistan was created for Muslims of the sub-continent not only to live together but to unite under one identity, Pakistani.

[Gabbar Singh]

Originally Posted by KingKhanWC . The MQM leader is sat in London and his representative in the show looks, sounds and is dressed like an Indian. If these people love India so much they should be sent back there on a donkey!

What is a Pakistani meant to look and sound like?

[shakil]

Originally Posted by Gabbar Singh What is a Pakistani meant to look and sound like?

Like an Arab. Jokes aside there is a strict dress code in Wahabbi/Deobandi/Barelvi version of Islam.

[Gabbar Singh]

Heartbeaking to see the kids around the rubbish dump. Interesting stat when they said Karachi had a population of just 450,000 in 1947 and now its 18 million.

But *** at the Gulab Jamun eating crocs.

[KingKhanWC]

Originally Posted by PakPrince you should be ashamed of yourself! ibut then again its good to know that you are not really Pakistani so nobody really cares abt this opinion of yours

Nothing to be ashamed of. The MQM are terrorists and traitors, they should be dismantled and banned by Pakistan but this won't happen until a government with some courage comes to power.

[akheR]

Don't think that Lyari or Orangi Town represent the whole of Karachi TBH.

[wasim-fan]

Originally Posted by KingKhanWC A bit drastic but perhaps some hardcore MQM supporters might see this as a reasonable proposition. How about people just shed their old ethnic love and just define themselves as Pakistani's? Pakistan was created for Muslims of the sub-continent not only to live together but to unite under one identity, Pakistani.

Yup the world could certainly do with some more tolerance.

[PakPrince]

^^
this is where you say it

Originally Posted by KingKhanWC his representative in the show looks, sounds and is dressed like an Indian. If these people love India so much they should be sent back there on a donkey!

His representative is from the urdu speaking majority of Karachi. And this is how most people in Karachi dress and talk. and if he looks Indian then everybody does.

[KingKhanWC]

Originally Posted by PakPrince ^^ this is where you say it His representative is from the urdu speaking majority of Karachi. And this is how most people in Karachi dress and talk. and if he looks Indian then everybody does. but you're an idiot so you wouldn't know iofcourse. this is why when you dont know abt sth dont make a fool of yourself

This is your interpretation of what I wrote.

I was specifically talking about the(the one in the show) leader of the MQM and anyone in the party who holds a lot of love for India such as Altaf Hussain who once said ""The slogan of two-nation theory was raised to deceive the one hundred million muslims of the subcontinent ". If people don't believe in Pakistan's creation, are in parties who involve themselves in terrorism and target killing then yes they should ride a donkey back to Jai Hind imo.

[PakPrince]

Originally Posted by KingKhanWC This is your interpretation of what I wrote. I was specifically talking about the(the one in the show) leader of the MQM and anyone in the party who holds a lot of love for India such as Altaf Hussain who once said ""The slogan of two-nation theory was raised to deceive the one hundred million muslims of the subcontinent ". If people don't believe in Pakistan's creation, are in parties who involve themselves in terrorism and target killing then yes they should ride a donkey back to Jai Hind imo.

stop backtracking from your statement

you clearly said he looks and dresses like indian. and sounds like indian too!

[KingKhanWC]

Originally Posted by PakPrince stop backtracking from your statement you clearly said he looks and dresses like indian. and sounds like indian too!

Of course I did but I didn't suggest, quoting you "says that that majority of my city looks Indian and speak and dress Indian ".

[PakPrince]

Originally Posted by KingKhanWC Of course I did but I didn't suggest, quoting you "says that that majority of my city looks Indian and speak and dress Indian ". It's o.k I forgive your mistake.

majority of Karachi is urdu speaking and also frm the same ethnicity so they look like him and ofcourse talk and dress like him. so if he looks and dresses indian then so does the rest

[KingKhanWC]

Originally Posted by PakPrince majority of Karachi is urdu speaking and also frm the same ethnicity so they look like him and ofcourse talk and dress like him. so if he looks and dresses indian then so does the rest admit you were in the wrong and stop being a little girl

I knew what I meant and even bothered to clarify.

Let's agree to disagree.

Answer this.

Do you think people who are involved in terrorism in Karachi and who hold the view Pakistan's creation was wrong should be allowed to continue their ways in your beloved city? I don't want to argue here, just want your honest opinion.

[saadibaba]

Originally Posted by KingKhanWC Watched this now. The police are a joke, putting on silly little shows for the media arresting any old person and then getting paid by the real villians. Karachi needs a new type of police force along with banning all ethnic based parties esp the MQM and ANP. The MQM leader is sat in London and his representative in the show looks, sounds and is dressed like an Indian. If these people love India so much they should be sent back there on a donkey!

Wow...what a statement.

[PakPrince]

Originally Posted by KingKhanWC I Do you think people who are involved in terrorism in Karachi and who hold the view Pakistan's creation was wrong should be allowed to continue their ways in your beloved city? I don't want to argue here, just want your honest opinion.

No. i dont support MQM. I hate them along with ANP and several others but they are not the worst out there either.

and we all know what you meant there. Your first post just termed people who look, dress and sound like sabzwari Indian. If you dont wanna admit it then dont. doesnt make much of a difference anyway. Your views about Karachiites has been pretty clear. Having a problem with a party is fine but not the citizens of a city.

[shaykh1985]

Lol the Taliban episode was hilarious...Tariq Malik should get his own show and the slow mo of his police force was too funny...hope hes doing well capturing those killer type peoples...nice to know police like him are protecting the streets ...

[saadibaba]

Maybe Jinnah after creating Pakistan should have gone back to India too.

[KingKhanWC]

Originally Posted by saadibaba Maybe Jinnah after creating Pakistan should have gone back to India too.

lol, Jinnah was one of the founders of Pakistan's creation not someone who has spoken against the two nation theory.

[saadibaba]

^^^

Not talking about MQM but what you said about ppl who look, sound and dress like Indians.

[Watsupdoc]

Prince and KKWC, cut out on the personal insults and debate in a civilized manner.

[PakPrince]

you humor me!
you should stick to osama bin laden and the american conspiracies!

still havent answered the part of sounds, dress and look indian.. a few other posters wondering that too

[saadibaba]

Originally Posted by KingKhanWC A bit drastic but perhaps some hardcore MQM supporters might see this as a reasonable proposition. How about people just shed their old ethnic love and just define themselves as Pakistani's? Pakistan was created for Muslims of the sub-continent not only to live together but to unite under one identity, Pakistani.

Do you call yourself only British or British Pakistani ? Just curious ?

[KingKhanWC]

Originally Posted by saadibaba Do you call yourself only British or British Pakistani ? Just curious ?

I'm a Muslim British Pakistani. Your can't compare this with people who moved from India to Pakistan and then they go against the two nation theory. It's hypocritical.

Are you a 'Muhajir'? Just curious.

[Looney]

Originally Posted by Gabbar Singh Heartbeaking to see the kids around the rubbish dump. Interesting stat when they said Karachi had a population of just 450,000 in 1947 and now its 18 million. But *** at the Gulab Jamun eating crocs.

Those are at a shrine in Manghopir . People probably think feeding them gulab jamun would make their wishes come true , not feeding the poor people even 1 roti .

[saadibaba]

Originally Posted by KingKhanWC I'm a Muslim British Pakistani. Your can't compare this with people who moved from India to Pakistan and then they go against the two nation theory. It's hypocritical. Are you a 'Muhajir'? Just curious.

I'm talking about ppl. whose ancestors came from India, not specifically about MQM leaders. You made a sweeping statement about ppl who look, sound and dress like Indians.

As for me, I was born in Pakistan, my mom was born in Pakistan and my dad was born in India. My grandparents could seem to someone as looking, talking and dressing like Indians. Should they be put on a donkey and send back to India like you suggested ?

[akheR]

^^obviously no, your Indianess is only found in your pro-Najam Sethi/anti-Army rhetoric.

[KingKhanWC]

Originally Posted by saadibaba I'm talking about ppl. whose ancestors came from India, not specifically about MQM leaders. You made a sweeping statement about ppl who look, sound and dress like Indians. As for me, I was born in Pakistan, my mom was born in Pakistan and my dad was born in India. My grandparents could seem to someone as looking, talking and dressing like Indians. Should they be put on a donkey and send back to India like you suggested ?

Baaba ji, I've clarified my statement, so unless your grandparents are involved in terrorism/target killings and are against the creation of Pakistan, then no.

[Looney]

“Hate is too great a burden to bear. It injures the hater more than it injures the hated.”

Coretta Scott King

[saadibaba]

@ KKWC

So what do you think about millions of ppl in Karachi who vote for MQM, should they be sent back to India ?

[saadibaba]

Originally Posted by akheR ^^obviously no, your Indianess is only found in your pro-Najam Sethi/anti-Army rhetoric.

Is it that obvious.

[KingKhanWC]

Originally Posted by saadibaba @ KKWC So what do you think about millions of ppl in Karachi who vote for MQM, should they be sent back to India ?

No, you can't blame the ordinary citizen who is against terrorism and also 100% behind the nation of Pakistan.

However they should educate themselves on the terrorism of the MQM , other parties in Karachi and stop supporting them esp when we now have a great party in PTI. No wonder Pakistan is in such a mess when people hold loyalties to criminals and ethnic based parties.

Where does your political links lie? Just curious.

[saadibaba]

^^^

Not with MQM or anyone else. But I don't think in such absolute terms about MQM as you do. Yes, they have an idiot as their leader but they have done some good work too and with time I see them getting more mainstream and moving away from politics of ethnicity and "gunda gardi".

[saadibaba]

In short, I think its unrealistic to just expect that MQM will simply go away. They have a big base and genuine support in Karachi. People in Karachi are mostly educated and through elections they need to send the message to their party to reform itself. I think this is a much more realistic approach.

[Looney]

Interior Sindh


Rajasthan


Ladakh


Balochistan


Kalash


Punjab village in India


Punjab Pakistan

[Looney]

Originally Posted by akheR Don't think that Lyari or Orangi Town represent the whole of Karachi TBH.

They are the trouble areas in Karachi with some of the biggest slums in Asia . When Mustafa Kamal was the mayor , these areas were a lot more peaceful .

[saadibaba]

Their is a wonderful book about Karachi called "Instant City" by Steve Inskeep. Highly recommended.

[Dolphins]

Originally Posted by Looney They are the trouble areas in Karachi with some of the biggest slums in Asia . When Mustafa Kamal was the mayor , these areas were a lot more peaceful .

Thousands of IDPS fled Swat during the SWAT operation and landed in Orangi. Along with the IDPs came a lot of talibani scums. It was really after that Orangi became a criminal infested slum and a hideout for taliban filth. During MK's era a lot of schools, parks and hospitals were built in Orangi.

[Gabbar Singh]

Originally Posted by Looney Interior Sindh Rajasthan Ladakh Balochistan Kalash Punjab village in India Punjab Pakistan

Time to send these Indian wannabes home!

[withlovefrom vizag]

suroosh alvi looks like anurag kashyap........

[Looney]

Yeah , India , get ready , your population is about to go up even more

[akheR]

@Looney : Sindh-Punjab are connected to North India (Rajasthan, Punjab, Haryana and perhaps Himachal Pradesh too), whereas Muhajirs (who themselves are few millions on a pop. of nearly 200 millions, based in Karachi) were generally from Central India mainly (U.P./Bihar), so the similarities are, being generous, with less than 5% of the Indian population.

[from_da_lost_dim3nsion]

Originally Posted by akheR @Looney : Sindh-Punjab are connected to North India (Rajasthan, Punjab, Haryana and perhaps Himachal Pradesh too), whereas Muhajirs (who themselves are few millions on a pop. of nearly 200 millions, based in Karachi) were generally from Central India mainly (U.P./Bihar), so the similarities are, being generous, with less than 5% of the Indian population.

wat ? so muhajirs aren't hindutani agents ? .What next ? Punjabis aren't arab descent and Pathans no pure blooded Caucasians ? .You Kaafir.

[Looney]

Originally Posted by akheR @Looney : Sindh-Punjab are connected to North India (Rajasthan, Punjab, Haryana and perhaps Himachal Pradesh too), whereas Muhajirs (who themselves are few millions on a pop. of nearly 200 millions, based in Karachi) were generally from Central India mainly (U.P./Bihar), so the similarities are, being generous, with less than 5% of the Indian population.

All I am trying to say is that you can find many Indian looking / sounding / dressing people in Pakistan and you can also find Pakistani looking / dressing / sounding people in India .

India and Pakistan are both diverse when it comes to appearance , languages and dresses . If we were really to send people back to India for this " gunnah " , nearly all of Pakistan would be empty .

Actually while posting that , I thought it would make an interesting thread to post pictures and info of all the different cultures / people and tribes of Pakistan . What do you say ?

[akheR]

Faisal Sabzwari "looking & talking Indian" is a concept I have hard time to really grasp seeing the porous borders between some (namely, Sindh and Punjab) provinces of Pakistan and its eastern neighbours, but a non-negligible part of our population (Iranic groups found in KPK, Balochistan or even Gilgit-Baltistan) aren't connected to India by any mean (ethnically or culturally) and when some (Muhajirs, Sindhis, Punjabis, ...) are, it's so limited that we shouldn't say that they resemble "Indians" (because of its diversity), but a proportion of India so low that's its negligible, seeing the bigger picture.

So yes Looney, actually agree with you but was just making some precisions, and why not about the thread.

[Looney]

About KPK and Baloch , you are right about that but I thought those tribes in Ladakh ( India ) and Kalash people and Hazara people ( who are actually Central Asian who moved to Quetta after being discriminated against for being Shia if i am not wrong ) " looked " similar . Not saying they are , but only " looked " similar .

[Master Blaster]

hahaha fun operation this to capture killer type people !!


About sending back Indian type looking, sounding or dressing Pakistanis on donkeys, someone said this in the "Vikram syndrome" thread,

I don't like to be labelled as something I'm not. I found it offensive because the person could have asked instead of putting this label on. It would have been the same if I was called Bangladeshi.

not sure if a right candidate ??

[Invictus]

KingKhanWC man you crack me up bro. Go live in Pakistan yourself first before telling anyone else to "get-in" or "get-out".
And I dont understand your infatuation with India. Its a separate country. Don't define your identity by your hate or dis-like for India. Hating Indian doesn't make you "more-Pakistani" or more patriotic. No it just makes you a India Hater or whatever else.
Think about the absurdness (not sure if its a word) of your statement. A person who doesn't even live in a country, infact lives 1000's of miles away and hasn't even lived in the said country, is telling people living in that country to GTFO ?
Your "knowledge" of Pakistan is based on reading stuff up. You haven't experienced it. You don't become a cook by reading books bud you have to cook. Go get in the kitchen get to know the people. Because honestly your "knowledge" about Pakistan lacks dept. It sounds like someone who has read about a subject but hasn't spent a day working in the said field. All theory and no substance. Honestly go live in Pakistan for 6 months. It will change your perception completely.

[Cricketismylife]

Originally Posted by from_da_lost_dim3nsion Saw this whole thing . Pretty interesting but definitely had some masala quotient in it .Did anyone else realize that the only person sorry for his action and showed a little bit of sharam was the heroin addict .

Addicts normally are pretty sharamsaar. Also mostly when about to get high or when high. When they want a hit no sharamr left.

[wasim-fan]

Originally Posted by Invictus KingKhanWC man you crack me up bro. Go live in Pakistan yourself first before telling anyone else to "get-in" or "get-out". And I dont understand your infatuation with India. Its a separate country. Don't define your identity by your hate or dis-like for India. Hating Indian doesn't make you "more-Pakistani" or more patriotic. No it just makes you a India Hater or whatever else. Think about the absurdness (not sure if its a word) of your statement. A person who doesn't even live in a country, infact lives 1000's of miles away and hasn't even lived in the said country, is telling people living in that country to GTFO ? Your "knowledge" of Pakistan is based on reading stuff up. You haven't experienced it. You don't become a cook by reading books bud you have to cook. Go get in the kitchen get to know the people. Because honestly your "knowledge" about Pakistan lacks dept. It sounds like someone who has read about a subject but hasn't spent a day working in the said field. All theory and no substance. Honestly go live in Pakistan for 6 months. It will change your perception completely.

Yup.

Frankly this is an outdated thought process which I am convinced the coming generation of Indians and Pakistanis esp. those living in these countries will overcome and they will be sidelined. With globalization and the esp. internet we are becoming more and more aware of our similarities and it is stupid to stay in denial of it.

[akheR]

Originally Posted by wasim-fan Yup. Frankly this is an outdated thought process which I am convinced the coming generation of Indians and Pakistanis esp. those living in these countries will overcome and they will be sidelined. With globalization and the esp. internet we are becoming more and more aware of our similarities and it is stupid to stay in denial of it.

I think there's a new thought process going on amongst the new intelligentsia which now no more distances itself with Indian on religious basis (Islam) but cultural, if not wholly civilizational (Aitzaz Ahsan's theory of the "Indus man", Pakistan, versus the "Gangetic man", India.)
I find the theory interesting in the sense that it differentiates Pakistan from India not in an contradictory fashion but complementary one ("the same without being fully the same and both having our exclusivities before the Partition.)

If Pakistan's educational actors put the stress on such inclusive narrative (instead of the Muhammad bin Qasim one) it will be sane not only for both countries, but also for Pakistan itself (it will become a true federation respecting its local diversity - Pashto, Balochi, Punjabi, Sindhi, Urdu, ... will all be the mirrors of a long and complex history.)

[wasim-fan]

Originally Posted by akheR I think there's a new thought process going on amongst the new intelligentsia which now no more distances itself with Indian on religious basis (Islam) but cultural, if not wholly civilizational (Aitzaz Ahsan's theory of the "Indus man", Pakistan, versus the "Gangetic man", India.) I find the theory interesting in the sense that it differentiates Pakistan from India not in an contradictory fashion but complementary one ("the same without being fully the same and both having our exclusivities before the Partition.) If Pakistan's educational actors put the stress on such inclusive narrative (instead of the Muhammad bin Qasim one) it will be sane not only for both countries, but also for Pakistan itself (it will become a true federation respecting its local diversity - Pashto, Balochi, Punjabi, Sindhi, Urdu, ... will all be the mirrors of a long and complex history.)

But it is a thin line and quite dangerous. Personally, I think any identity that grows organically is more likely to succeed and co exist with its environment. So, if there is strong "Indianness" in sections of society, then so be it. Because Indianness be it arts or dressing as someone pointed out is a cultural and regional identity. Even the term indianness means very little given that a someone from Punjab or north India will have more in common with Pakistani than with anyone from south, east or west of India.

I agree with this striving for an identity but like you said if the process is "inclusive", it would only lead to a "richer" culture.

[akheR]

Originally Posted by wasim-fan But it is a thin line and quite dangerous. Personally, I think any identity that grows organically is more likely to succeed and co exist with its environment. So, if there is strong "Indianness" in sections of society, then so be it. Because Indianness be it arts or dressing as someone pointed out is a cultural and regional identity. Even the term indianness means very little given that a someone from Punjab or north India will have more in common with Pakistani than with anyone from south, east or west of India. I agree with this striving for an identity but like you said if the process is "inclusive", it would only lead to a "richer" culture.

Well, that's where I disagree : there's no "Indianess", but two cultures who evolved differently though with a same cultural sole.
I can develop on that, but will be pretty boring.
But in the "Indus" spectrum I do include North India.

[KingKhanWC]

Originally Posted by Invictus KingKhanWC man you crack me up bro. Go live in Pakistan yourself first before telling anyone else to "get-in" or "get-out"

lol, you're a funny guy. Every 6 months or so you return with same lame argument. Perhaps you suffer from some sort of amnesia but to remind you the response is very similar again.

What I am stating is a universal principle. It doesn't matter if it's Karachi, Pakistan, India, UK, Amreeka or any other nation on the planet. Thus you don't need to live in any of these places to hold this principle.

Now read this slowly bud.

Anyone who doesn't agree with a the nations creation and is involved/supports/sympathetic towards murders/terrorism should be punished. Imo they should charged with treason, the sitting on donkey back to their land of love was just a expressive remark. Got it bud?

[HaMmy FinE LeG StriKeR]

TBH most of the british confused pakistanis dont even know about their country nor born there, cant speak urdu, and they talk about people living in pakistan to be kicked to india, very cheap statement

[wasim-fan]

Originally Posted by akheR Well, that's where I disagree : there's no "Indianess", but two cultures who evolved differently though with a same cultural sole. I can develop on that, but will be pretty boring. But in the "Indus" spectrum I do include North India.

Indus spectrum has to include North India. In fact the word "hindu" comes from "indu". But persians when they came to these parts couldn't pronounce it. Btw the term "Indiannes" is a term I borrowed from some of the other here. There is no such thing even in India.

As for evolving differently, I wouldn't know. I only base my views on some friends from Pakistan that I have had chance to interact and stay with at times.