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Is Khalil the best we have? [Merged with Hussain0216's]
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#1
15th July 2005, 16:56
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Is Khalil the best we have? [Merged with Hussain0216's]
[sarcasm]Eversince, I first laid eyes on Khalil's world class pace, banana swing, outrageous seam movement, unbelievable bounce, and naturally and esthetically pleasing action (:31  , I have been in complete and utter awe...NOT[/sarcasm]Joking aside, whenever I see Khalil bowl his dibbly dobbly, retarded-ly slow, and excruciatingly boring left arm spin / trundler's / nearly medium pace balls, I just feel like throwing up...when I am done throwing up, I always wonder: 1- Is this the best we have; is this all we could come up with as a natural successor to Akram? 2- Are we done for in the field of left arm fast/medium bowling? 3- Did Khalil had an exceptional bowling record in our domestic cricket? 4- Who was blind enough to be able to see some talent there...which not even a blind guy can attest to? 5- Who is Khalil's chacha, mamma, phuppa, or Tayya and did he give a lot of "Tohfaas" to get Khalil in the senior side? The list of these questions is endless, but I will stop here for the benefit of those who are already dosing off reading this dribble by Moi  Today, after thinking about it for a few days, I decided to put Khalil to the test...I complied his figures and put him up against three other left armers who have better ability than Khalil, in my opinion. They might not be the best left armers in the world but are Much Better than Khalil! Before I do this comparison, I do know completely that "STATS" don't mean jack and all that but they do tell "Most" of the story! Oh, and I do know that our domestic setup is not the best out there but still a player must perform there before making it to the Senior side, with an odd exception here and there. And, also before someone says the name "Fazle Akbar", get lost if you don't like this article! Bold items in stats are as follows: Matches, wickets, average, economy, and strike rate Khalil loses to all four in almost all the categories except runs per over (by a slight margin) Mohammad Khalil Pakistan Born November 11, 1982, Lahore, Punjab Current age 22 years 246 days Major teams Pakistan, Lahore, Redco Pakistan Ltd Bowling style Left-arm medium Bowling averages class mat balls runs wkts bbi bbm ave econ sr 4 5 10 First-class 24 4147 2390 73 7/71 32.73 3.45 56.80 4 1 List A 18 878 666 15 2/25 2/25 44.39 4.55 58.53 0 0 0 Twenty-20 1 18 29 1 1/29 1/29 29.00 9.66 18.00 0 0 0 ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Najaf Shah Pakistan Born December 17, 1984, Gujranwala, Punjab Current age 20 years 210 days Major teams Pakistan International Airlines, Rawalpindi Bowling style Left-arm medium-fast Bowling averages class mat balls runs wkts bbi bbm ave econ sr 4 5 10 First-class 40 7638 3603 141 7/57 25.55 2.83 54.17 9 0 List A 30 1511 1049 36 4/35 4/35 29.13 4.16 41.97 1 0 0 ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Waqar Ahmed Pakistan Born April 1, 1980, Peshawar, North-West Frontier Province Current age 25 years 105 days Major teams Pakistan Customs, Peshawar Cricket Association, Water and Power Development Authority Bowling style Left-arm fast-medium Bowling averages class mat balls runs wkts bbi bbm ave econ sr 4 5 10 First-class 42 6969 3937 194 7/67 20.29 3.38 35.92 13 3 List A 31 1166 1064 44 4/26 4/26 24.18 5.47 26.50 3 0 0 -------------------------------------------------------------------------- Zahid Saeed Pakistan Full name Zahid Saeed Born July 5, 1981, Alo Mahar, Punjab Current age 24 years 10 days Major teams Gujranwala Cricket Association, National Bank of Pakistan, Pakistan Reserves, Sialkot Cricket Association Bowling style Left-arm fast-medium Bowling averages class mat balls runs wkts bbi bbm ave econ sr 4 5 10 First-class 67 11096 6661 266 6/77 25.04 3.60 41.71 14 4 List A 54 2625 2256 816/23 6/23 27.85 5.15 32.40 4 2 0 -------------------------------------------------------------------------- Not only the fact that Khalil is the slowest of the bunch (Zahid Saeed is close in terms of pace but has performed much better than Khalil), has the crappiest action ever (Faulty at best), can't swing the ball if his life depended on it, does not even have a good height to generate good bounce etc., he is also below par in terms of wickets per match...when compared to the other three! M. Khalil: Wickets per match = 3.04 in 4/3 day matches; 0.83 in limited overs Najaf Shah: Wickets per match = 3.53 in 4/3 day matches; 1.20 in limited overs Waqar Ahmed: Wickets per match = 4.62 in 4/3 day matches; 1.42 in limited Zahid Saeed: Wickets per match = 3.97 in 4/3 day matches; 1.50 in limited CONCLUSION: Khalil does not hold advantage in any department, against some of the best we have in the left arm fast category. He does not seem to possess any natural talent, he is a very poor fielder, less said about his batting the better...what is it that the selctors see in him to make us go through the agony of watching someone who will be slaughtered even at the club level, let alone the Big Stage of International cricket! To top it all, they recently sent him to India to train with Lillee...I am sure Lillee must have felt like killing himself after seeing the future of fast bowling! I sincerely believe that he has some sort of "Paawa or Safarish" that got him through the ranks. There seems to be no Reasonable or Unreasonable explanation besides that! What do you think? --- 
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#2
15th July 2005, 17:16
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I can understand his selection for the India series and even his sending to the MRF foundation. I've expressed my opinion on these two matters before
But WHY was he picked in the first place Very valid points Monsee
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#4
15th July 2005, 17:22
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Slightly older bloke, Sarfraz Ahmed, touching 30, but has an outstanding record and is a left arm fast medium.
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#5
15th July 2005, 17:46
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I am sure nobody can light a candle to the record that "Waqar Ahmed", in this comparison, has! He has strike rates that would even make his namesake, Waqar Younis, proud...although, Waqar Younis has better strike rates and is the "Best Bowler" in terms of Strike Rate since WWII. Out of my comparison, Khalil does not win in any single category, when pitted against all three of them. The only place where he is slightly better is "Economy Rate" and we don't need any more of these so-called economical bowlers when we already have so many of those . We need someone who can get us some quick wickets! ---
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#6
15th July 2005, 18:20
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^yeah, was just pointing out another left armer who is better than Khalil (not hard I know, even if Sami bowled left handed he would bowl better than Khalil :4: )
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#7
15th July 2005, 18:30
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I have always belived that if there is to be a next left arm pacer who will be successfull at the top it will be Najaf Shah, his action is quite similar to Nuwan Zoysa but he has very good pace and bounce because of his height why isnt he being preffered over Khalil is a mystery to me and even Bob Woolmer said that Najaf Shah is very close to being a member of Pakistan side, I hope they include him quickly as bowlers need as much time as they can have to play at the top level.
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#8
15th July 2005, 18:36
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While i ve resigned to the fact tht we will never ever get a left arm pacer like Wasim Akram
but wht i feel tht we still do possess a decent amount of talent in this left arm bowler category than having to see pathetic Khallil bowl Najaf Shah is much better than him and he still sits out (while Khalil has benn given the test as well as ODI cap)
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#9
15th July 2005, 19:51
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I think the selectors have recognised Najaf's talents which is why he has been given a retainer in the new contracts. Zahid Saeed and Waqar Ahmed have not been mentioned so it looks as though they are not in the selectors thoughts but if a time comes when the selectors are looking for some variety in the bowling and want a left armer, I hope they pick the more accomplished Najaf Shah. I don't know anyone who thinks Khalil is better than Najaf except for the Pakistan Selectors.
The selectors and BW talk about players that will be ready soon such as Irshad and Najaf but how the heck did Khalil look ready to them when these other guys did not?
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#10
15th July 2005, 20:14
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I recently watched a bit of Waqar Ahmed and Najaf Shah (Don't remember him too well though)...and can say without any personal prejudice, they are both miles ahead of Khalil!
The only guy Khalil can ever try to compete with is "Zahid Saeed", who is a line-n-length bowler and even he has a far more superior record when compared to Khalil. If there was a chance of Khalil showing some future promise, I am willing to hang upside down from a tree to dicover any trace of that "Promise"...sadly, he does not seem any better than many ordinary "Galli" bowlers in Pak. Next to Khalil, Riaz Afrid looks like the re-incarnation of Lillee:8: ---
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#11
15th July 2005, 20:45
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He seemed to have potential in the one dayers...
But in tests you got to be kidding, I'd play an extra batsman ahead of him...
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#12
15th July 2005, 21:01
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That's what I thought so at first but he is still far away from the best pick even in ODI's; biggest issue with him is that "He never ever looks threatening"...so if the batsman never makes a mistake, he will not get a wicket! We need someone who can be there for both forms of the game! We cannot make a list of 30 players, half for tests and half for ODI's ---
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#13
15th July 2005, 21:10
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lol
true!!! I want to see some proper fast bowlers. We've heard the hype about the cupboard not being empty, so nows the time to unleash these bowlers. Hopefully Irshad/Yasir Ali's career doesn't fade out as the last hyped up player Abdul Rauf...
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#14
15th July 2005, 21:55
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Rauf, still in my opinion is way better than Khalil, M. Asif, Riaz Afridi, and other trundlers...even better than Rana (definitely) in TESTS! He is Harmison/Shabbir kind of a bowler, bowls quite briskly (even after Aaqib's now famous mess up job on his action) at approx 82-85 MPH, genrates a lot of bounce, swings the ball too. Has some minor flaws in his run up and action...if they are improved on, he can be a replacement for Shabbir. Off course that's all my opinion. Yasir Ali's time should be now before Aaqib messes up his action too. Irshad might not be as ready as some here believe he is...from what I saw, in February, he is a year away from being part of the Senior team...that's what Sadiq Mohammed said too (who coaches his team)! ---
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#15
16th July 2005, 11:11
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I hope Yasir and Irshad both get a crack soon. I just cant wait to see the famous style of attacking pakistani bowling.
We were spoilt by Waqar, Wasim, Zahid etc. Now it's so painful to see Pakistan bowling.
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#16
16th July 2005, 11:41
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i agree 100% with monsee that yasir ali's time is now - i too hope he and others like irshaad stay as far away from aquib javed as possible
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#20
16th July 2005, 23:06
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Ilyas, if you have seen any of the other three bowlers, do give us your impression about them...which one merits a place in the team right now! .
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#24
18th July 2005, 14:27
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Add nasir khan from karachi to that list of emerging left armers. khalil is worst bowler ive seen play for pakistan and he was personally picked by bob woolmer to go to australia and india. 
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#25
18th July 2005, 14:55
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Did a little birdie told you about that  . Last edited by Monsee : 22nd July 2005 at 14:25.
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#26
18th July 2005, 16:07
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No Bob admitted that himself.
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#28
22nd July 2005, 14:25
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So Mr. Bradman where is the link.
Was Bob sitting in the your living room, drinking freshly made 'Lassi' that you had just made for him; was that the time when he confessed to you about Khalil 
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#29
22nd July 2005, 14:28
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you know that the testimony of a man who has downed more than the allowed legal quantity of lassi would be inadmissible in court, right?
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#30
22nd July 2005, 14:36
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HaHaHa And that too made by Mr. Bradman himself...He is the one always calling Younis, Malik, Yasir etc. the "Lassi men" and now he is involved in this Lassi consumption controversy himself...do you have no shame O Grandmaster of Lassi Makers 
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#31
22nd July 2005, 15:20
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Well Bob did admit on his own web-site that 16 players were given to him and Inzi. They had to drop either Shahid Nazir or Khalil to get the number down to the allocated 15.
So, he did pick Khalil. On top of that, the reasoning he gave was even more ridiculous!! Apparently Khalil was supposed to be there as a "net" bowler to help us prepare for Pathan, Zaheer and Nehra!!!!!!
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#32
22nd July 2005, 15:32
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waisey Ayubi bhai, one most think this through a little more. if one has been provided 16 players and has to cut that down by one to make it 15, one is not the only one making that decision alone, the selection committee have helped somewhat. also, if one has a collection of right arm medium-fast bowlers in the squad, yet only one left armer, one does tend to think that the one selected would've been the logical choice? one, however, should've realized that the one selected probably wasn't the number one left armer in the country, but one can also point the fingers at the selection committee on that one.
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#33
22nd July 2005, 15:38
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Gasher sahb,
One must concur and say that one cannot make the one decision on ones own. One must be accompanied by others. One can place the blame on the selection commitee. However, one's concern is that one who calls himself the coach of one's team, must know that more than one left armer exists in one's academy and one surely should have realised the dimensional oneness of khalil's bowling!
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#34
22nd July 2005, 15:54
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certainly at this point one can only say that its too late tonight to drag the past out into the light ... we're one but we're not the same, well we hurt each other and we do it again, you say love is a temple love a higher law, love is a temple, love the higher law, you ask me to enter but then you make me crawl, and i can't be holding on to what you got when all you got is hurt.
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#36
22nd July 2005, 16:46
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AJ its a tad ironic considering you were amongst the ppl who wanted Khalil included in the side! iirc there were many ppl who were saying Khalil shud be picked - dont start the "oh why was he picked" malarkey now when you wer actually advocating his selection
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#37
22nd July 2005, 19:47
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So AJ, here are some things to ponder now:
1- If one has been provided 16 players and has to cut that down by one to make it 15, one is not the only person making that decision alone, the selection committee have helped somewhat. also, if one has a collection of right arm medium-fast bowlers in the squad, yet only one left armer, one does tend to think that the one selected would've been the logical choice? 2- AJ its a tad ironic considering you were amongst the ppl who wanted Khalil included in the side! iirc there were many ppl who were saying Khalil shud be picked - dont start the "oh why was he picked" malarkey now when you wer actually advocating his selection Lets see what Mr. Bradman has to say...or even if he has anything to say at all! .
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#39
23rd July 2005, 14:02
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Wonder if a certain someone is busy making Lassi for Bob or if he is getting ready with some more allegations
Try answering the points raised above by some posters, Mr. I Know it All Last edited by Monsee : 23rd July 2005 at 14:03.
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#40
23rd July 2005, 14:10
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arent we going a bit overboard, monsee sahb 
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#41
23rd July 2005, 14:25
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Well that makes sense, since he is there quality.
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#42
23rd July 2005, 14:49
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You are only reading one post...read the ones by GA and others If Bob and Inzi have only been given a 16 squad and have to cut one person...how is that "Khalil" becomes their choice If selectors say to you "Here are 16 of the best we have"...how will you refute that and say we want so and so instead  It's not like Bob is from Pakistan...it's not like he has been watching our domestic cricket for years It's all bari and Co.'s fault...quite ignorant and biased to blame Bob, if you ask me Then again, AJ has always been known to hate Bob ever since that "One Liner" reply he got at Bob's site .
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#44
23rd July 2005, 15:48
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That's what I was thinking...Shahid was there in India, how could he be the one who was cut
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#46
24th July 2005, 00:14
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No we are not cause Mr. Bradman will continue this bogus attack on Bob and Inzi that they 'Selected Khalil", when the truth is they had no choice but to elect Khalil or another right hander! Going against a team (India) with three right handers, is it any surprize that Khalil was picked over Rao (We already had 4-5 right handers in the team) H knows that he is found out on this issue by several in this thread, and he will never reply again. Only if Bob had not given that famous one liner reply, only if .
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#49
25th July 2005, 18:09
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what a funny joke!i neva once asked for khalils inclusion! please dont post lies to make a point! i stated from day 1 khalil wasnt even best left armer in pakistan! pathetic stuff GA! 
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#52
25th July 2005, 18:16
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monsee, even thou i dont rate woolmer that much. khalil "the net bowler" was a good idea.
are batsmen got use to half-volleys and half trackers in nets and they gained form. also khalil was there to mimic pathan and co... he did that perfectly well done chacha bob
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#53
25th July 2005, 18:16
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yeah but that was a different country. too bad the wench is still alive ...
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#54
25th July 2005, 18:18
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what a fib!
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#56
25th July 2005, 18:32
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hell yeah! pretty pretty funny!
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#58
25th July 2005, 21:00
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me lying???  AJ i obviously cant prove it cos it was on the old PP - muddy was one of the ppl wanting his inclusion and you were agreeing with him!
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#59
25th July 2005, 21:01
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i can vouch for ga here, aj, you did ask for his inclusion as our other, now defunct selector- muddy urf billa 
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#60
25th July 2005, 21:08
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please back up ur claims!
Last edited by Amjid Javed : 25th July 2005 at 21:34.
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#61
25th July 2005, 21:13
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its funny how when asked about decent left arm bowlers in pakistan ive never mentioned khalil.
sadly ur lies seem to think otherwise!
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#63
25th July 2005, 21:15
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I wanted his inclusion? I have always backed Najaf Shah's inclusion even on the old PP.
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#64
25th July 2005, 21:19
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muddy bhai, seems like sum1 is board and is trying 2 stir up lies...! oh well MODS will ignore such things....
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#65
25th July 2005, 21:20
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only thing i remember from old PP was the posts where GA said he loved going to watch sunderland play 
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#66
25th July 2005, 21:23
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i remember u openly admiting that you love indian cricketers...! i remember those posts openly on old PP.
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#67
25th July 2005, 21:24
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Neither can you prove your claim that we supported his inclusion.
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#68
25th July 2005, 21:25
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is dat a crime? u talk as if its the most revulting act commited by a pakistani 
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#69
25th July 2005, 21:34
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i dont think to many pakistanis have pictures of indian cricketers in there room surrounded by flowers and roses. also i dont think to many people have golden statues of ganguly in there room. umar said he did on Old PP.
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#70
25th July 2005, 21:41
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now dat is childish atleast umar had made a reasonable claim even if u do contest it
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#73
25th July 2005, 22:05
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you must be suffering from alsimers disease then ...
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#75
25th July 2005, 22:08
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One problem on this board (or any board) is posters backing players without ever even having seen them play. Rao Ifi was one of those who used to have his backers. Bad idea, first watch em play and then decide. Irshad is the current one on the hot seat along with Arafat.
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#76
25th July 2005, 22:09
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we should save this post just in case
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#77
25th July 2005, 22:10
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when i first joined pp, there was all this bazid bashing going on and when asked as to how many had seen him only 10% probably and not even properly at that.
considering the amount of stick he was getting, it was damned intersting to note
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#78
25th July 2005, 22:10
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In case I back players without watching them?
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#80
25th July 2005, 22:13
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And he didn't look all that bad in his first real outing for Pakistan. Nothing that warranted all that criticism. The other problem is posters judging players on one failure or two. First give the guy a full chance, nerves, form, luck all come into play. I'd rather watch someone getting a 50 and then make up my mind (on the basis of how good the 50 was). Good or bad, all players have their ups and downs.
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