How big is the gap of talent between England and Pakistan

[hasanmehmoodkhan]

I read in an article that there is a big gap of talent between enagland and pakistan. Te author (I think it was in the dailymirror or the guardian) said engfland were just too good for Pakistan but I believe this not the case the last two tests that Pakistan lost they lost because they dropped catches and didtn bat with confidence not because england were good . we are seeing in this match that pakistan are actually better then eng if they dont drop catches and bat normally. thoughts?

[saj001]

Being more talented don't get you anywhere..you need to word hard to fulfill your talent which unfortunatly our players don't do.

[Down2Earth]

well the thing is, their "talented" players aren't even english

[hasanmehmoodkhan]

Originally Posted by Down2Earth well the thing is, their "talented" players aren't even english

ya thats true i think they have like 7 S.A players

[Robert]

Originally Posted by hasanmehmoodkhan thoughts?

Cook was a wunderkind five years ago, hitting the Australians for 200 in their tour match with Essex, but his technique and confidence are completely shot at the moment. To an extent, the English county game tends to suppress the talented players and drill the self-expression out of them. Look at how long Swann took to emerge as a top player.

I think Broad is very talented - look at some of the shots he plays.

Overall, the Pakistan bowling attack is more talented than the England attack.

But talent gets you nowhere without hard work, planning and organisation, and that is why England are 2-0 up at the moment.

[Poison]

Don't read tabloids.

[hashbb]

Overall Pakistan is more talented than England BUT England train and work much much harder then Pakistan, and are able to apply it much better

[jeetu]

As for England , they are good side when playing in England. I like to see this team perform well in india for once. They lost test series and in ODI went down 5-0. Pakistan will perform much better than englannd in indian conditions for sure.

[Azam6380]

Originally Posted by hashbb Overall Pakistan is more talented than England BUT England train and work much much harder then Pakistan, and are able to apply it much better

We have always been the most talented players, there is no other team that has the raw talent we have, we just dont apply it because our training levels are light years behind everyone....

It doesnt matter if you are born as the most clever person on earthm it wont get you anywhere without hard work...

[Robert]

Originally Posted by jeetu As for England , they are good side when playing in England. I like to see this team perform well in india for once.

England batters are not good at playing the spinners because leg-spin died in the sixties and the pitches are no good for developing fingerspin either. We rarely see turning pitches in the UK any more. The last England batsmen who could play spin well were Gooch, Gatting and Gower, though Hick had his moments too.

[jeetu]

Originally Posted by Robert England batters are not good at playing the spinners because leg-spin died in the sixties and the pitches are no good for developing fingerspin either. We rarely see turning pitches in the UK any more. The last England batsmen who could play spin well were Gooch, Gatting and Gower, though Hick had his moments too.

You are right about that. Last good English side that really performed well in india at test level was way back in 1985. English side had pretty good spinner in Edmonds at that time.
Lack of pace in indian pitch is the main reason that indian side struggle to beat even Zims in 90's outside india.
This year ashes will be a good test for english side, i honestly don't remember when was last time England beat australia in australia for ashes since bodyline.

[Zedman]

Man for Man comparison :

1. Strauss v Butt = Strauss by a mile.

2. Cook v Farhat = Cook by a mile

3. Trott v Hameed = Trott

4. Pieterson v Moyo = Equal

5. Collingwood v Azhar = Collingwood

6. Morgan v U Akmal = Morgan by a mile

7. Prior v Kamran = Prior

8. Broad v Aamer = Aamer

9. Swann v Ajmal = Swann

10. Anderson v Asif = Asif

11. Finn v Wahab/Gul = Finn


How many Pak players would make the England team better? Moyo, Aamer and Asif.

I think we need to stop this 'Pakistan has a lot of talent' bandwagon and look at hard facts. We are a poor side overall. We have been demolished in this series so far and have not competed. We are not in the same class as England.

Once again posters are getting carried away because we have won some sessions in a test. The fact is that England are likely to set us a testing target in this test and we will lose.

[Cpt. Rishwat]

The gap isn't that big at all. If we win this test and Younis Khan is brought back for the 4th I'd back Pakistan to square the series. Poor preparation and squad disruption has as usual hamstrung our efforts in an important series.

[mbilalk90]

Originally Posted by Zedman 4. Pieterson v Moyo = Equal

WHAT!?!?!?

MOYO >>> Pieterson

[Dr. Khan]

I agree with some of the posts here.
If you talk about pure talent than england does not even come close.
However, if you talk about nurturing that talent - then we are leagues behind.

[Poison]

Originally Posted by Zedman How many Pak players would make the England team better? Moyo, Aamer and Asif. I think we need to stop this 'Pakistan has a lot of talent' bandwagon and look at hard facts. We are a poor side overall. We have been demolished in this series so far and have not competed. We are not in the same class as England. Once again posters are getting carried away because we have won some sessions in a test. The fact is that England are likely to set us a testing target in this test and we will lose.

We have won 2 days in the first 2 days of a Test match. LOL at your comparisons; Finn is CRAP.

[Zedman]

Originally Posted by Poison We have won 2 days in the first 2 days of a Test match. LOL at your comparisons; Finn is CRAP.

Why is he crap?? He is tall, very young, quite nippy, gets bounce and swing and has troubled us in the series. In comparison with Gul or Wahab he would have to get the nod based on his performances so far. When he proves to be crap, I'll agree with you. I suspect if he was Pakistani....you'd be over the moon.

[Zedman]

Originally Posted by mbilalk90 WHAT!?!?!? MOYO >>> Pieterson

Pieterson is a fantastic player bud. His average is in comparison with Moyo and he has got runs everywhere. Moyo is fantastic too. But Pieterson is the same class.

[Pakprideuk]

The difference is development from the U-19 level to the international level is poor for Pakistan, no doubt we are the best side, most talented side, whatever you want to call it at U-19 level but we fail to convert that talent to International level to the same quality as England, India, Australia and South Africa. If our camps for 19,20,21,22 year olds were better, greener wickets, tougher fielding practices then maybe we would've had a much better squad.

Our poor conversion is the reason for our poor squad at international test level.

[AZ]

Finn and Broad are garbage, Anderson in favourable conditions is lethal...other than Yousuf, all their batsmen are superior to ours.

[Vegitto1]

The only place success comes before work is in the dictionary and the Pakistanis think it works the same way in real life.

[Robert]

Originally Posted by jeetu This year ashes will be a good test for english side, i honestly don't remember when was last time England beat australia in australia for ashes since bodyline.

England won in Australia in '55, '71, '79 (though Aussies were missing their Packer players then) and '87.

Swann will be the key this time, and I expect Finn to take wickets on their hard decks.

[James]

Pakistan arguably have more talented and exciting players than anyone else, at any time. but England on the whole have a better team.

[Robert]

Originally Posted by jeetu You are right about that. Last good English side that really performed well in india at test level was way back in 1985. English side had pretty good spinner in Edmonds at that time.

Yes, and it was a really rubbish team too!

Fowler
Robinson
Gatting
Lamb
Gower (c)
Chris Cowdrey
Downton (w)
Edmonds
Ellison
Foster
Pocock

Somehow they played out of their skins and beat a much stronger Indian team.

[James]

England performed pretty well in the 2006 test series in India, given the circumstances.

[Amjid Javed]

Originally Posted by Whippy Pakistan arguably have more talented and exciting players than anyone else, at any time. but England on the whole have a better team.

Pakistan has a lot of players with good potential and Raw Talent.

England have players who are good quality who get great coaching and seem to mature alot quicker and therefore perform alot better at highest level.