South Africa vs India | Post Tour Review Thread

[dani2k]

Congratulations to SA for a hard fought series win. They were the better team mainly because of a superior bowling attack.

As far as India is concerned - one sentence to sum it up - A series of lost opportunities. Both the tests and ODI series could have been won, but opportunities were not taken and hence the stale mate in tests and loss in the ODIs.

That doesnt mean we didnt have positives.
1) The ample proof of India's comeback temperament. So crucial for a champion team - both in tests and ODIs
2) Sachin proving his class in tests - centuries under pressure and classic contests with the worlds best bowler
3) Bhajji's return to form and utility as an emerging handy batsman (note I havent used the word "All rounder" Yet )
4) Gambhir proving his mettle and shutting the mouth of his critics who doubted his ability in foreign conditions.

In the ODI leg
1) The emergence of Kohli as an all weather batsman. This series would do his confidence a world of good. Potential test material in the near future for the crucial #6 slot
2) Yousuf Pathan emerging out of his flat track shadows. What a player! Despite taking body blows literally he proved that he has the heart to fight
3) Munaf's surprisingly good performances. Zak, Praveen, Munaf and Bhajji are a decent bowling unit in Indian conditions for the WC.
4) India's young brigade had the heart to fight a superior opponent in their own conditions - though their batsmen left them down miserably..

Now the negatives
1) We are back to square one as far as the test #6 slot is concerned. Pujara though showing glimpses of his potential and staying prowess didnt grab his opportunities and show proof in the scoreboard - Should we persist with him or should Kohli be given a chance? May be the WI tour will reveal that.
2) Ishant's regression and Unadkut not grabbing his opportunity
3) India not closing the door on SA after having them 130/6 in the second innings of the last test.
4) Form of Yuvi the bowler and the part timers as a bowling unit that augurs well for the WC.

ODIs
1) Failure of Raina , MS and Yuvi in batting - though the upside of it is they are due for big scores.
2) Raina still prone to short pitched woes.
3) Nehra's lack of form
4) Rohit Sharma's consistent failures - when is he going to turn potential to performance. So frustrated about him - a complete contrast to Kohli who is less talented for sure.

What do you guys think?

[AZ]

^ that covers pretty much everything

IMO India came out with a lot more credit even though they lost the ODIs.

RSA once again flattering to deceive.

[Crazy_K]

More people realising Rohit Sharma is crap and needs to go spend 2 years in the domestic circuit.

Bhaji has been bowling a tad better than his usual and his batting is really coming along.

[dani2k]

Originally Posted by Crazy_K More people realising Rohit Sharma is crap and needs to go spend 2 years in the domestic circuit. Bhaji has been bowling a tad better than his usual and his batting is really coming along.

Good point - I will update my post.

[Sir john]

+ pathan and kohli batting

- nehra out of form

+munna+zak form

[haroonrasheed320]

the most important thing is their bowling has shown what they are capable of

[haroonrasheed320]

Zaheer Khan is a treat to watch with the new ball & his ability to york the batsmen at the depth is outstanding.

[dinakar]

Parthiv Patel is not as bad as I thought.

[Passion4Pakistan]

Originally Posted by Crazy_K More people realising Rohit Sharma is crap and needs to go spend 2 years in the domestic circuit. Bhaji has been bowling a tad better than his usual and his batting is really coming along.

Ha Ha.. But even 5yrs of Indian Domestic Cricket can't help him to improve..

Sorry..

[dinakar]

Originally Posted by Passion4Pakistan Ha Ha.. But even 5yrs of Indian Domestic Cricket can't help him to improve.. Sorry..

hope he will do pretty bad in IPL, then the franchisees who pays them millions will teach him a lesson.

[Passion4Pakistan]

Originally Posted by dinakar Parthiv Patel is not as bad as I thought.

How come He is Bad???

Technically he is 100times better batsman than your Captain..

India needs Player like him.. He is Good for Future Test Team. After,

SRT, VVS & RD era..

[Passion4Pakistan]

Originally Posted by dinakar hope he will do pretty bad in IPL, then the franchisees who pays them millions will teach him a lesson.

I don't want to wish bad for him.. But I hate these type of Over-rated players..

[ganeshran]

Indian bowling needs to come out of dependence on favourable conditions to perform. Unless they are able to perform in all weather conditions, the overall bowling is not going to improve.

[Garuda]

Indian batting looked clueless without the regular top order.

This also proved that its difficult for India to win if it has a batting off day (even if by 25%). Very rare to see bowlers winning you a low scoring match.

Also, Rohit Sharma/Vijay are not ready to take over from Viru/Sachin/Gambhir.

Raina needs a reality check.

Dhoni had a bad series with bat (happens to batsman sometime. So hope he gains form soon)

Yuvi looks like trying hard to get back to form and realizing the need to score now.

[ganeshran]

Dhoni is a good leader so I am ready to condone his failures with the bat, but it cannot become a regular feature or at some point or other he will have to start defending it.

The team rallies around him and even senior players have no problems playing under him. He rarely talks against teammates in public, and that is a good trait for a leader to have.

[Crazy_K]

I think Raina may be out of his depth on bouncy wickets - his short ball game needs a tremendous amount of work. He'll be more in his comfort zone on Indian wickets. Will have a chance to show he's worthy of a spot in the starting XI in the practice games

[cricketindiafan]

Biggest downside was Dhoni's regression as a leader. Yes we did fairly well in the tests and ODIs, but at the key moments when with some aggressive field placings, we could well have come out winning both the series.

3rd test, 2nd innings, SA were allowed to go scot free after being 130/6. MS spread the field for some unknown reason and did not attack at all!

4th ODI, India 2-1 up, SA were allowed to build a partnership after being 118/5 and looking clueless against spin. Again field was spread, easy singles allowed and the match went out of our grips.

The aggressive captain cool of yore has now become a defensive captain even though he still remains quite calm on the field. An argument can be put forward that the bowling attack is not all that potent hence the defensive tactics, but with SA struggling against spinners with attacking fields we could have achieved lot more than what we did.

Hope this is just a passing phase in MSD's captaincy career and that during the WC that aggressive streak will be back.

[AZ]

passing phase, or the beginning of the end?

waise bhi aaj kal Gauti ke liye bohot shor sharaba ho raha hai...

[cricketindiafan]

Originally Posted by AZ passing phase, or the beginning of the end? waise bhi aaj kal Gauti ke liye bohot shor sharaba ho raha hai...

Think just a passing phase. He is yet to lose a test series as a captain despite being a test captain for 2+ years. In ODIs too, we have done fairly well. But his record in ICC tournaments isn't all that flash with 2 first round exists in the t20 WC and another 1st round exit in ICC CT.

So unless the team goofs up like 2007 WC, don't see any reason why MSD will be replaced. He looks all set to be the leader for at least another 1 year perhaps till the 2012 tour of Australia after which Gauti will be the natura choice to succeed him.

[mastermind_quad]

Originally Posted by cricketindiafan Biggest downside was Dhoni's regression as a leader. Yes we did fairly well in the tests and ODIs, but at the key moments when with some aggressive field placings, we could well have come out winning both the series. 3rd test, 2nd innings, SA were allowed to go scot free after being 130/6. MS spread the field for some unknown reason and did not attack at all! 4th ODI, India 2-1 up, SA were allowed to build a partnership after being 118/5 and looking clueless against spin. Again field was spread, easy singles allowed and the match went out of our grips. The aggressive captain cool of yore has now become a defensive captain even though he still remains quite calm on the field. An argument can be put forward that the bowling attack is not all that potent hence the defensive tactics, but with SA struggling against spinners with attacking fields we could have achieved lot more than what we did. Hope this is just a passing phase in MSD's captaincy career and that during the WC that aggressive streak will be back.

+1 Agreed.

He is a brilliant captain no doubt ....but these are the points he need to think about....
and add to that his batting failures...he need to show result with bat too to be remain in the team ...otherwise we should think about better option at least in test cricket....

[mastermind_quad]

we should groom Virat Kohli for future Captaincy .....in one or two years give him Vice Captaincy post so that he can take over from Gautam or whoever Dhoni's successor will be

[cricketindiafan]

Originally Posted by mastermind_quad we should groom Virat Kohli for future Captaincy .....in one or two years give him Vice Captaincy post so that he can take over from Gautam or whoever Dhoni's successor will be

Bhai use pahle test debut to karne do.

Jhaad pe abhi se chadha to uska bantadhaar ho jayega.

[Passion4Pakistan]

^^ Virat needs to change his Show Off attitude First..

If he can do that, Then I think, he will become a good and very useful player for India..

has won U19 World Cup. That means he has some leadership quality..

[mastermind_quad]

Originally Posted by cricketindiafan Bhai use pahle test debut to karne do. Jhaad pe abhi se chadha to uska bantadhaar ho jayega.

that's why bhai i said ...after one or two years ...tab tak to kar hi lega debut ...

waise debut hi vice captaincy se karate hain iska...haha...

[mastermind_quad]

Originally Posted by Passion4Pakistan ^^ Virat needs to change his Show Off attitude First.. If he can do that, Then I think, he will become a good and very useful player for India.. has won U19 World Cup. That means he has some leadership quality..

jaane do yaar sudhar jaega waqt k sath......bachha hai abhi ...btw he having cool head so problem nahi honi chahiye jyada...

[Passion4Pakistan]

Originally Posted by mastermind_quad jaane do yaar sudhar jaega waqt k sath......bachha hai abhi ...btw he having cool head so problem nahi honi chahiye jyada...

Money blasted Rohit's Head,,,, Its very much possible with him too..

[mastermind_quad]

Originally Posted by Passion4Pakistan Money blasted Rohit's Head,,,, Its very much possible with him too..

yes definitely .....but with Rohit we never associated performance and cool head ...that's the difference ....

[Passion4Pakistan]

Originally Posted by mastermind_quad yes definitely .....but with Rohit we never associated performance and cool head ...that's the difference ....

But again Don't put too much expectations on Virat..

Look what happened to .

Virat doing good Because, He knows he is not the Key Batsman of his team. So, No extra Pressure on his shoulder.

Keep him like this as long as possible,that will do good for India..

[ganeshran]

More money for players is a good thing, not bad. Its upto them to realise their income is not guaranteed and depends on performance.

Look how Ishant's and Kevin Pietersen's IPL salaries reduced dramatically after a bad performance in the previous season. And Yuvraj Singh didnt get a A contract as well.

[mastermind_quad]

Originally Posted by Passion4Pakistan But again Don't put too much expectations on Virat.. Look what happened to . Virat doing good Because, He knows he is not the Key Batsman of his team. So, No extra Pressure on his shoulder. Keep him like this as long as possible,that will do good for India..

Agreed bro.....less expectation good results ...

he knows very well ..his spot is not fix in current XI ..so he need to perform...

[Passion4Pakistan]

Originally Posted by ganeshran More money for players is a good thing, not bad. Its upto them to realise their income is not guaranteed and depends on performance. Look how Ishant's and Kevin Pietersen's IPL salaries reduced dramatically after a bad performance in the previous season. And Yuvraj Singh didnt get a A contract as well.

Never said Money is Bad,, But If Money and Fame is the main reason for you to play cricket. then It can hamper your natural style.
They just need to key developing their Cricket and knowledge about the game, Money will Automatically follow their feet..

[mastermind_quad]

@OP dani2k bro u sums up everything

@Garuda yes UV seems to trying very hard ...and I am Happy soon result will follow

[mastermind_quad]

Originally Posted by Passion4Pakistan Never said Money is Bad,, But If Money and Fame is the main reason for you to play cricket. then It can hamper your natural style. They just need to key developing their Cricket and knowledge about the game, Money will Automatically follow their feet..

correct....

All these young millionaires need to teach the lessons about how to develop the balance between money, fame and performances ......

Sachin can really help these kids in this matter..

I think BCCI already having classes on these topics @ NCA ...but its all depends on Individuals.

[Passion4Pakistan]

Originally Posted by mastermind_quad @OP dani2k bro u sums up everything @Garuda yes UV seems to trying very hard ...and I am Happy soon result will follow

Too much of expectation hampered his Level of Performance..

Let him bat at no 6. And wait for a collapse and see what he does..

I am sure he will fight back and will win for India..

Why??? He plays better and more sensible Cricket when His plays under Pressure.

[mastermind_quad]

Originally Posted by Passion4Pakistan Too much of expectation hampered his Level of Performance.. Let him bat at no 6. And wait for a collapse and see what he does.. I am sure he will fight back and will for India.. Why??? He plays better and more sensible Cricket when His plays under Pressure.

Yaar he is coming from long list of injuries and all.....and yes expectation to hoti hi hai achhe players se bhai ..I am sure he'll come good soon ....

[Passion4Pakistan]

Originally Posted by mastermind_quad correct.... All these young millionaires need to teach the lessons about how to develop the balance between money, fame and performances ...... Sachin can really help these kids in this matter.. I think BCCI already having classes on these topics @ NCA ...but its all depends on Individuals.

Why You got Players like, Shehwag, Gambhir, UV???

Because, when They were young kids, they used to see How Famous Sachin, Kapil were because of their Brilliant Performances for India. They focused on their Performance and they were Hungry for Fame.. Not for Money.

And Sachin, Dravid, And More especially Ganguly helped them a lot to learn things so quickly...

And Now a Days, Indian Youngsters Watching Their National Cricketers, Dancing and Singing on their TV channels more often than playing Cricket. And They are trying to become more Stylish Cricketing Personality rather than More Stylish Cricketer..

Thats why I am bit Worried about Future of Indian Cricket..

[mastermind_quad]

Originally Posted by Passion4Pakistan Why You got Players like, Shehwag, Gambhir, UV??? Because, when They were young kids, they used to see How Famous Sachin, Kapil because of their Brilliant Performances for India. They focused on their Performance and they were Hungry for Fame.. Not for Money. And Sachin, Dravid, And More especially Ganguly helped them a lots to learn things so quickly... And Now a Days, Indian Youngsters Watching Their National Cricketers, Dancing and Singing on their TV channels more than playing Cricket. And They are trying to become more Stylist Cricketing Personality rather than More Stylist Cricketer.. Thats why I am bit Worried about Future of Indian Cricket..

Spot on ...

I am worried too ...I am hoping soon these kids & upcoming young players will realize the importance of performances ....

[Amjid Javed]

Originally Posted by dani2k Congratulations to SA for a hard fought series win. They were the better team mainly because of a superior bowling attack. As far as India is concerned - one sentence to sum it up - A series of lost opportunities. Both the tests and ODI series could have been won, but opportunities were not taken and hence the stale mate in tests and loss in the ODIs. That doesnt mean we didnt have positives. 1) The ample proof of India's comeback temperament. So crucial for a champion team - both in tests and ODIs 2) Sachin proving his class in tests - centuries under pressure and classic contests with the worlds best bowler 3) Bhajji's return to form and utility as an emerging handy batsman (note I havent used the word "All rounder" Yet ) 4) Gambhir proving his mettle and shutting the mouth of his critics who doubted his ability in foreign conditions. In the ODI leg 1) The emergence of Kohli as an all weather batsman. This series would do his confidence a world of good. Potential test material in the near future for the crucial #6 slot 2) Yousuf Pathan emerging out of his flat track shadows. What a player! Despite taking body blows literally he proved that he has the heart to fight 3) Munaf's surprisingly good performances. Zak, Praveen, Munaf and Bhajji are a decent bowling unit in Indian conditions for the WC. 4) India's young brigade had the heart to fight a superior opponent in their own conditions - though their batsmen left them down miserably.. Now the negatives 1) We are back to square one as far as the test #6 slot is concerned. Pujara though showing glimpses of his potential and staying prowess didnt grab his opportunities and show proof in the scoreboard - Should we persist with him or should Kohli be given a chance? May be the WI tour will reveal that. 2) Ishant's regression and Unadkut not grabbing his opportunity 3) India not closing the door on SA after having them 130/6 in the second innings of the last test. 4) Form of Yuvi the bowler and the part timers as a bowling unit that augurs well for the WC. ODIs 1) Failure of Raina , MS and Yuvi in batting - though the upside of it is they are due for big scores. 2) Raina still prone to short pitched woes. 3) Nehra's lack of form 4) Rohit Sharma's consistent failures - when is he going to turn potential to performance. So frustrated about him - a complete contrast to Kohli who is less talented for sure. What do you guys think?

Excellently summed up. I think One major negative for India was apart From Zaheer in test matches the bowling looks pretty toothless in terms of keeping scoring rates down and also taking wickets and against the better sides in world game that will need to improve.

[Rana]

RSA should have won 4-1.

[Random Aussie]

Lol at whoever called Dhoni an agressive captain. He is a defensive captain, just because you have an agressive opening batsman does not make you the daring captain. Spreads the field first chance he gets, every time. Granted if he had better bowlers he might not....

Good series for Indian credibility, they did alright.