No Winners in this Mess !

[Saj]

Whatever the outcome of the Afridi versus PCB battle is, there are no winners irrespective of whatever is decided. People can make it an issue about Karachi against whoever else, people can turn it into a cricketer versus whoever else, people can turn it into a political issue, but sadly the whole affair stinks of the mess that is Pakistan cricket.

Sadly whatever judgment is passed and irrespective of whether Afridi gets his NOC or not, the biggest loser once again is the reputation of Pakistan cricket.

The laughing stock of world cricket and looked upon as a bit of a joke, Pakistan cricket has again given the watching world plenty to look at in amazement and curiousity.

An issue that most Boards and cricketers would have kept in house and discussed behind closed doors, has now become an issue that has divided media, divided fans, the legal profession and divided politicians, when in fact it had nothing to do with any of them.

If the Afridi versus PCB situation had occurred in any test playing nation, it would have been resolved quickly, sharply and with the minimum of fuss. If the player was going to be punished, it would have happened and been dealt with straight away. If the player was not going to be punished, then again the situation would have been sorted out efficiently, diffused quickly and dealt with in house.

I was asked on the radio a few days ago, as to who was to blame for the fiasco. My answer was that it's not about blame, it's about resolving the situation as soon as possible and making sure this sort of thing doesn't happen again.

Personally, and as much as it will upset those that see Afridi as some sort of super hero who can do no wrong, I hold both parties responsible for this farcical situation. Neither are entirely blameless and neither will come out of this smelling of roses, once the dust has settled.

My main gripe with Afridi is that he stated that his father was not well and would not be able to play for Pakistan on the Saturday or Monday in Ireland, yet turned up in England on the Sunday, ready to play a friendly match for Hampshire on the Monday. Now he'd said that he couldn't play for Pakistan, yet was prepared to play for Hampshire, which basically insinuates that he was prepared to put County before Country.

Also Afridi announced his retirement via the media, rather than contacting the PCB, which in my opinion is highly unprofessional and unforgiveable, especially given that he had been appointed captain by this Board for both the one day and test sides in the past. He had been bestowed the ultimate cricketing responsibility by the PCB, a responsibility that all cricketers around the world dream of. He repaid the trust and belief from the Board, with a "slap in the face".

Afridi pleaded guilty to the charges initially, today his legal representatives are trying to tell us that he didn't plead guilty. Now are they trying to insult our intelligence by denying the fact that Afridi pleaded guilty.

One understands the frustration of the PCB especially given that they had backed Afridi in all of his "weaker moments" and various run ins with authority. He was backed by the Board when he decided to eat a cricket ball, he was backed by the Board when he decided to do a jig on the Faisalabad wicket, he was backed by the Board when he decided to retire from the test captaincy after only one test match. Many other Boards would not have left him in charge of the one day side, after the one test retirement.

Now in no way am I saying that the PCB are entirely blameless. They unfortunately have a history of "messing" things up and their man management skills sadly don't appear to be up to the mark.

You only have to look at the list of names and the issues there have been with the current administration to see that their house is not in order.

The NOC revoking was an issue that could have been dealt with in a much better way, after all Afridi is a cricketer who has mostly served the nation with great flair and for a long period of time. To prevent a man from earning his living is harsh.

But as Alec Stewart said on the radio to me today "You can't go around criticising your repsective Board and expect them to ignore it". Whether its the PCB, BCCI, ECB or whoever else, they would not have stood for the very public criticism from any one of their employees.

Its a situation that will upset those cricket fans with a clear mind, with a neutral perspective and those that wish the best for Pakistan cricket. It's a situation that is sad, unfortunate and has predictably turned ugly. It's a situation that those damn politicians are taking full advantage off. Today those politicians that are siding with Afridi would quite easily stab him in the back tomorrow if it meant more votes for them.

Now whatever the outcome is, whether Afridi gets his NOC or he gets a lengthy ban, or a fine, or indeed if the whole situation is brushed under the carpet and forgotten about, Pakistan cricket is the loser and comes out of this mess as a laughing stock once again.

[Amjid Javed]

PCB should take major blame for appointing such a mentally unstable individual to be captain in 1st place. Afridi has only ever cared about himself and always will, the whole saga of him using his fathers illness as an excuse not to play against ireland then expecting to play T20 pretty much sums up Afridis pathetic selfish attitude.

Cant wait till he retires! good riddance!

[Fawad2010]

I think we as a fan also take a hit by this fiasco, Pakistan Cricket has seen many dark days, but we have been supporting our cricket for a long time, and quite frankly we deserve better!

[Pakhtoon_Rules]

Originally Posted by Amjid Javed PCB should take major blame for appointing such a mentally unstable individual to be captain in 1st place. Afridi has only ever cared about himself and always will, the whole saga of him using his fathers illness as an excuse not to play against ireland then expecting to play T20 pretty much sums up Afridis pathetic selfish attitude. Cant wait till he retires! good riddance!

mentaly unstable?

why getting personal man, you still can criticise him with in certain limits.

[Amjid Javed]

Originally Posted by Pakhtoon_Rules mentaly unstable? why getting personal man, you still can criticise him with in certain limits.

Why is that personal? I havent called him names. Anyone who continously breaks the cricketing rules - Moon walking on pitch, ball biting, bitching in public etc.. despite numerous warning is clearly a few screws lose in the head.

Afridi only has himself to blame.

[talha3]

Good write up Saj, although one poster made a thread similar to this last week called 'Whoever wins, Pakistan loses'

[Quick Single]

I think for Afridi to go asking politicians to help him out was a bit brainless. Apart from Zardari, none of them has anything to do with the PCB, so why interfere with any of their players or situations?

I think for the sake of Pakistan cricket and Pakistan, the PCB should say goodbye to Afridi for once and for all. However I'm not trying to say that he hasn't been a good servant for Pakistani cricket, he has helped us out on many occasions with both bat and ball, but I just think it would be better to say goodbye with as much of his dignity intact as possible, and maybe give some of the younger guys in the team an opportunity.

[freelance_cricketer]

Your cricket has become a laughing stock thanks to these cartoons.

[SameerP]

Afridi asked Zardari for help with corruption in Pcb, can someone tell me why would anybody with brain do such a thing? First of all Zardari is perhaps the most corrupt person in Pakistan and everyone knows that, secondly he is behind most corruption in pcb and he is the one who made Ijaz butt the Chairman.

[SameerP]

Originally Posted by freelance_cricketer Your cricket has become a laughing stock thanks to these cartoons.

From cornered tigers to cornered donkeys

[freelance_cricketer]

^ That's harsh, i wont say that for such a good team for people like afridi and butt

It's not about the performance as they have still been doing good. It has got more to do with the way things are going on in Pak cricket off the field these days

[zaid65]

Originally Posted by Pakhtoon_Rules mentaly unstable? why getting personal man, you still can criticise him with in certain limits.

Mentally unstable is a better word of mentally retarded ( which is a medical diagnosis), unless you want him to be called as a mentally retarded ( to avoid the personal abuse), if that is the case, you can add in your wish list, I will use this word ( or in fact I must have used this word in the past).

[zaid65]

Originally Posted by freelance_cricketer Your cricket has become a laughing stock thanks to these cartoons.

You hit on the nail, yes our cricket has become a laughing stock, beside these cartoon players and cartoon PCB officials, we have cartoon fans who support these cartoon players to put pressure on cartoon PCB to appoint these cartoon player as captain.

PS: Wait for these cartoon fans to come and attack OP for exposing these cartoon characters on forum.

[zaid65]

My main gripe with Afridi is that he stated that his father was not well and would not be able to play for Pakistan on the Saturday or Monday in Ireland, yet turned up in England on the Sunday, ready to play a friendly match for Hampshire on the Monday. Now he'd said that he couldn't play for Pakistan, yet was prepared to play for Hampshire, which basically insinuates that he was prepared to put County before Country. Also Afridi announced his retirement via the media, rather than contacting the PCB, which in my opinion is highly unprofessional and unforgiveable, especially given that he had been appointed captain by this Board for both the one day and test sides in the past. He had been bestowed the ultimate cricketing responsibility by the PCB, a responsibility that all cricketers around the world dream of. He repaid the trust and belief from the Board, with a "slap in the face". Afridi pleaded guilty to the charges initially, today his legal representatives are trying to tell us that he didn't plead guilty. Now are they trying to insult our intelligence by denying the fact that Afridi pleaded guilty. One understands the frustration of the PCB especially given that they had backed Afridi in all of his "weaker moments" and various run ins with authority. He was backed by the Board when he decided to eat a cricket ball, he was backed by the Board when he decided to do a jig on the Faisalabad wicket, he was backed by the Board when he decided to retire from the test captaincy after only one test match. Many other Boards would not have left him in charge of the one day side, after the one test retirement.

Great write up, one of the best for the current Afridi fiasco.

[PakistanCricketForever!]

I had a dream yesterday that imran khan became chairman and got rid of everyone and appointed trustworthy members! Only if!

[SameerP]

Originally Posted by freelance_cricketer ^ That's harsh, i wont say that for such a good team for people like afridi and butt It's not about the performance as they have still been doing good. It has got more to do with the way things are going on in Pak cricket off the field these days

I am not calling the whole team cornered donkeys, only some of them

[Crucifier]

Pakistan cricket doesn't come out as the "loser" if Ijaz But gets sacked. That's a win.

[Monsee]

Afridi is a khocha and it shows...the way he has been conducting himself on and off the field for the last few years reminds me of the old joke about a Pathan riding on a bike in a big parking lot; despite only having one pole in the center of the lot...khocha could not avoid running in to that pole every time he tried not to!

It does not help his case to have the most thought-less and idiotic fans who only care about a six and a few fours...who cares if Pak loses a few matches due to that very approach by their foolish hero!

[ballal10]

Nicely Written Saj Bhai..

[AZ]

quite true, once again PCB and player shenanigans leave the reputation in the dumpster.

how ironic that the man who himself proclaims of putting a tutti phutti team 'together' is now opening up old wounds again.

An embarrassing failure and immaturity from both sides, and we the fans have to suffer.

[godzilla]

finally a bit of sense written on the whole sordid affair. i think the weight of blame falls very heavily toward afridi, and quite frankly would be very happy never to see him play for pakistan again. he has no integrity, and his behaviour demonstrate just how power starved he is, and how low he will go to cling onto power. full of praise for management after the world cup, and suddenly full of hate, only when he was stripped of power.

the issue is all the more stark when afridi didnt just criticise the pcb in public, he started name calling! unacceptable under any scenario, and he, his fans and his brain dead political supporters can all go live together in some far away pixie land for all i care.

[Savak]

Not really Afridi wins. There is always a winner and a loser in every phadda.

Originally Posted by Savak Not really Afridi wins. There is always a winner and a loser in every phadda.

How exactly does he win if he doesnt get his NOC, doesnt get to play for Hampshire and is kicked out from the international team?

Or is Afridi always a winner for you ;)

[ace4rmspace]

Well said Saj, AJ, AZ and godzilla.

[Waq]

Interesting post Saj and I agree with many aspects. I do feel however that there is a winner and that winner will ultimately be Pakistan cricket. The journey will be painful and drawn out but it is necessary to ensure that Afridi no longer plays for his country.

I just feel that whilst he is at the forefront, he will always do something to embarass his country and his performances are far too inconsistent for my liking. How will the future generations develop their game if they Afridi as a role model?

[shahrukh619]

Somebody could write a book on this Afridi and PCB mess, A Tale of Two Idiots.

[zaid65]

I have to slightly disagree with the title of the thread. Yes there is no winner but there is one person who is loosing in this game and that person is Afridi.

Afridi did not play his cards smart in this time. He made a huge mistake by opening up a Pandora box. If I would be Afridi ( which I would never wish), I would have kept it cool and ask the board to release me for the county stint and other events to make money. There is nothing wrong coming up front and accepting the decision for loosing the captaincy. He knows clearly that the current board chairman is about to leave and has no credibility and once new board chairman comes in few months, start playing his cards again ( as usual).

The other interesting thing, for the next few months, Pakistan is not playing any cricket and he has missing the chance to play tamasha leagues to make money, instead he will be busy fighting the legal battle with the cricket board and in the meantime, there will be more Salman Butts, Sarfrazs, Asifs ,..will come on media and destroy his image.

One last thing, lets say if he wins this battle but once he will be back as a player or captain, he will be under lot of pressure to deliver and will be under the microscope and knife of his critics and this time he wont be able to play the victim game.

[godzilla]

btw has there been a poll set up for a a vote on whether members are pro or anti afridi in this whole saga? havent seen one yet and its astonishing that there seems to be so much vocferous support for him. i dont think any of us who are against him in this case have any love lost for the pcb and are probably no less critical of butt in general, but in this particular episode, in my very biased opinion, most pp'ers that at last attempt some form of critical, rational thinking fall into the anti-afridi camp, wheras most of the young emotional children appear to be waving their afridi flags between stints on their playstations.

[kkmix]

Of course there is a winner. And the winner is cricket.

People are standing up against the corrupt board. Board has been mistreating its players for long long time no, it was about someone stood up against the board, and it had to be someone with huge public backing, so it had to be Afridi. Now his antics don't help his cause, he is definitely an idiot but it could only have been him who stood up to save many a careers in the future. He did breach his contract but that was justified imo a the board wouldn't have ever let any player come out in public and take a stand against them.

So both Afridi and Board are in a loss, but cricket and future of Pakistan cricket is the winner in my opinion.

[ads101]

Well Zadari is in a win win situation

If Ijaz Butt loses, and zadari has to sack him, he'll gain support from the people will may help to get relected.

If Afridi loses and Ijaz Butt stays, then his old play Ijaz will carry on as PCB chairman.

[Saj]

So both Afridi and Board are in a loss, but cricket and future of Pakistan cricket is the winner in my opinion.

Exactly how is Pakistan cricket the winner in this?

The cricketing world laughing at us again.

Former cricketers like Alec Stewart criticising Afridi for his antics in this situation.

Politicians trying to make any sort of gain from this mess.

So how is Pakistan cricket the winner, care to explain?

[MC]

Originally Posted by ads101 Well Zadari is in a win win situation If Ijaz Butt loses, and zadari has to sack him, he'll gain support from the people will may help to get relected. If Afridi loses and Ijaz Butt stays, then his old play Ijaz will carry on as PCB chairman.

Zardari couldn't be bothered to condemn OBL operation or PNS Mehran attack to get into people's good books, let alone sticking up for Afridi of all the issues and people to gain support. He's really not that animated, plus now that Ijaz Butt administration is almost expired, I doubt he's really up for shaking up the system and upset his cronies before time. Afridi will probably get considerable support from regional big guns. I can see PMLN playing an important role.

[James]

Originally Posted by godzilla btw has there been a poll set up for a a vote on whether members are pro or anti afridi in this whole saga? havent seen one yet and its astonishing that there seems to be so much vocferous support for him. i dont think any of us who are against him in this case have any love lost for the pcb and are probably no less critical of butt in general, but in this particular episode, in my very biased opinion, most pp'ers that at last attempt some form of critical, rational thinking fall into the anti-afridi camp, wheras most of the young emotional children appear to be waving their afridi flags between stints on their playstations.

Top post. As an England fan who has recently spoken to other England fans, the general opinion seems to be that Afridi is a disruptive, spoilt brat and Pakistan are better off without him.

[godzilla]

for what its worth, i was with two pakistan international players the other day who both were of the opinion that although there is no doubt as to the talent that afridi has, he is a political player par exellence, seemed consistently to leak things to the press, and utilised it well for his advantage. a quote from the evening that i thought was spot on was: 'he is the zardari of pakistan cricket'.

[chacha kashmiri]

Agree with this

I can't see afridi playing for pakistan again


The pcb has obviously made some enemies in the past and they are making as much out of this as possible

[bantu]

Originally Posted by godzilla for what its worth, i was with two pakistan international players the other day who both were of the opinion that although there is no doubt as to the talent that afridi has, he is a political player par exellence, seemed consistently to leak things to the press, and utilised it well for his advantage. a quote from the evening that i thought was spot on was: 'he is the zardari of pakistan cricket'.

Oh my.....

[James]

'No man is bigger than the team' seems to work pretty well, and I'll go with that again.

[chacha kashmiri]

I don't think afridi should play for pakistan again untill he has aplogised and served a suspension.
I also think the pcb needs to set an example to make sure this does not happen again.

[hokie]

Nice write up Saj!

[kkmix]

Originally Posted by Saj Exactly how is Pakistan cricket the winner in this? The cricketing world laughing at us again. Former cricketers like Alec Stewart criticising Afridi for his antics in this situation. Politicians trying to make any sort of gain from this mess. So how is Pakistan cricket the winner, care to explain?

Yes...I see it as the fight against the corrupt board, which favors nepotism and believes in dictatorship. We can all make fun of Afridi and how stupid he is. And he rightly deserves every criticism. But sadly we have to support someone like him at this stage because he happens to be the one fighting against the board. Our ultimate goal is to fix our board, so no player is mistreated in the future, and no career is ruined. So if this fight is won by Afridi, then we can hope that the board will be put to its place, and there will be no favorism and dictatorship in the future, and they will think twice before committing a low act, which will ultimately benefit Pakistan Cricket. But of course we can't say for sure that the new chairman or board won't be corrupt, but we are at least giving ourselves a chance at this stage.

And we have been a laughing stock for the world for quite sometime now, this should just be another thing for them.

And Afridi deserve harsh punishment as well for his antics. Perhaps heavy fine and/or bans.

[godzilla]

Originally Posted by kkmix Yes...I see it as the fight against the corrupt board, which favors nepotism and believes in dictatorship. We can all make fun of Afridi and how stupid he is. And he rightly deserves every criticism. But sadly we have to support someone like him at this stage because he happens to be the one fighting against the board. Our ultimate goal is to fix our board, so no player is mistreated in the future, and no career is ruined. So if this fight is won by Afridi, then we can hope that the board will be put to its place, and there will be no favorism and dictatorship in the future, and they will think twice before committing a low act, which will ultimately benefit Pakistan Cricket. But of course we can't say for sure that the new chairman or board won't be corrupt, but we are at least giving ourselves a chance at this stage. And we have been a laughing stock for the world for quite sometime now, this should just be another thing for them. And Afridi deserve harsh punishment as well for his antics. Perhaps heavy fine and/or bans.

i dont agree, i dont think we need to support afridi just to have the pcb changed. i think we as supporters can ask for the right thing to happen, which is that afridi is severely reprimanded and disciplined for his continuous breaches of discipline, and that the board with its cronyism and stegasauro-cracy is disbanded and rebuilt. i dont think its a case of eiyjer/or, and i dont think its a case of the ends justifying the means.

as fans we should demand both, but at this moment, in the afridi vs pcb battle, the pcb is absolutely right.

[kkmix]

Originally Posted by godzilla i dont agree, i dont think we need to support afridi just to have the pcb changed. i think we as supporters can ask for the right thing to happen, which is that afridi is severely reprimanded and disciplined for his continuous breaches of discipline, and that the board with its cronyism and stegasauro-cracy is disbanded and rebuilt. i dont think its a case of eiyjer/or, and i dont think its a case of the ends justifying the means. as fans we should demand both, but at this moment, in the afridi vs pcb battle, the pcb is absolutely right.

Sure. As I said, Afridi must be punished for for his past and present behaviors. But on the other hand, do we expect the Board to automatically fix itself? Surely we can't be so naive. Something's gotta give.

[godzilla]

its absolutely disgusting, even in the face of these idiots turning up at all hours to support him at an airport he makes it very clear that all he really cares about is money. not playing for pakistan, not fixing anything, but making money:

"I am not here to fight, I am a cricketer, I want to play cricket. I want what is my right," he said. "If they don't want me to play for Pakistan, but at least let me play domestic cricket or county cricket. I want my right, my NOC."

http://www.espncricinfo.com/pakistan...ry/517963.html

i always had my suspicions about afridi, but he seems so much worse than i imagined i scarcely believe it. if you really cared about your country, would you even mention the noc, or would your every word especially in a quagmire that you created, be about the right thing for the country? even if he thinks the right thing for the country is that the pcb is disbanded, he still not saying that! all he cares about is his contract and his money.

i hope he never gets an noc, and i hope the aussises, the english and the lankans realise how intensely selfish he is: willing and ready to sell his country, make it a laughing stock and in the midst of that still only care for his precious noc and first class wage; and i hope they cancel his contracts.

[chill79]

I think most of here has a short term memory. Few months back when YK resigned from captaincy, we all knew who was to be blamed, PCB esp. Ijazz Butt. If Mr. Butt gets kicked out of PCB it's a victory for all the fans. As for Afridi, he did made a mess of this and should have been more wise and I am not saying he shouldn't have contacted the politicians or high powered individuals, mind you thats the only way you can be heard or get the verdict in your favor. Had he relied solely on PCB, don't expect justice from Butt and his gang. Mr. Butt himself is highly influenced guy backed by strong politicians, otherwise do you think he has the capability to run such a big organization.

For me, if Afridi gets a ban it would hurt Pakistan cricket and his fans, but if Mr Butt gets a boot, it would be a victory for Pakistan cricket. And if things settle down behind the doors, again its going to be a temporary solution, I am sure something new will turn up in near future.

[kkmix]

Originally Posted by chill79 I think most of here has a short term memory. Few months back when YK resigned from captaincy, we all knew who was to be blamed, PCB esp. Ijazz Butt. If Mr. Butt gets kicked out of PCB it's a victory for all the fans. As for Afridi, he did made a mess of this and should have been more wise and I am not saying he shouldn't have contacted the politicians or high powered individuals, mind you thats the only way you can be heard or get the verdict in your favor. Had he relied solely on PCB, don't expect justice from Butt and his gang. Mr. Butt himself is highly influenced guy backed by strong politicians, otherwise do you think he has the capability to run such a big organization. For me, if Afridi gets a ban it would hurt Pakistan cricket and his fans, but if Mr Butt gets a boot, it would be a victory for Pakistan cricket. And if things settle down behind the doors, again its going to be a temporary solution, I am sure something new will turn up in near future.

Top post...My sentiments exactly.

[Saj]

Originally Posted by kkmix Yes...I see it as the fight against the corrupt board, which favors nepotism and believes in dictatorship. We can all make fun of Afridi and how stupid he is. And he rightly deserves every criticism. But sadly we have to support someone like him at this stage because he happens to be the one fighting against the board. Our ultimate goal is to fix our board, so no player is mistreated in the future, and no career is ruined. So if this fight is won by Afridi, then we can hope that the board will be put to its place, and there will be no favorism and dictatorship in the future, and they will think twice before committing a low act, which will ultimately benefit Pakistan Cricket. But of course we can't say for sure that the new chairman or board won't be corrupt, but we are at least giving ourselves a chance at this stage. And we have been a laughing stock for the world for quite sometime now, this should just be another thing for them. And Afridi deserve harsh punishment as well for his antics. Perhaps heavy fine and/or bans.

I've never been a big fan of player power, even in Pakistan's golden era.

Both sides will not come out of this smelling of roses in my opinion, irrespective of whatever the outcome is.

[zaid65]

"I am not here to fight, I am a cricketer, I want to play cricket. I want what is my right," he said. "If they don't want me to play for Pakistan, but at least let me play domestic cricket or county cricket. I want my right, my NOC."

How much domestic cricket he has played for Pakistan? , even in domestic cricket when he was demoted from captaincy and Sami was appointed captain for KCCA, he started bad mouth about Dr. Mohammad Ali Shah, same Dr, who has been trying to help him out through his political affiliation with MQM.

It is all about NOC!!

[Faizan Lakhani]

Sajid,
I personally believe that this Afridi episode is turning bitter for cricket now as both parties have now made it an issue of their egos.
Though there were some mistakes on part of Afridi, but then it seems that he was forced to commit those mistakes. It is certain that Afridi was not having a good working relations with Waqar Younis and this is something which started even before Cricket World Cup.
The Ex-Captain did inform chairman PCB earlier about "some problems" but unfortunately they were not responded in a professional way, hence things went worse from bad.
You're blaming Afridi for announcing retirement in media, which according to you is something unforgivable sin (from what how you portrayed, it sounds like a bigger crime that spot-fixing), though I agree that according to central contract, he should have first contacted the PCB.
Bit, simultaneously, it was PCB who ignored to hear Afridi's "post-westindies-tour" story and sacked him as captain of Pakistan team, which was highly disrespectful act of PCB.
And as far as announcing retirement in a presser without informing PCB is concerned, then meyrey bhai Sajid, even Mohammad Yousuf did the same - he announced his retirement in a press conference at KPC - but the BUTT led PCB didn't act so harshly against him, not only that but Mr. Ejaz Butt also "requested" Mohammad Yousuf to take back his decision.
Recently, Shoaib Akhtar announced his retirement in a press conference too, and that how disrespectful the PCB was to him? they didn't allow him to play a farewell match? is this the way you treat your stars?
Sajid Bhai, You can not deny the fact that Pakistan Cricket Board under Ejaz Butt has only insulted the national heroes, remember what they did with Shoaib Malik, Younis Khan, Mohammad Yousuf and now Shahid Afridi? Do you think they all deserve what PCB did with them?
PCB's attitude with players were surely creating a bad taste in dressing room, most of the players preferred to stay silent for the sake of their career and central contract, but this volcano of frustration inside cricketers' heart had to burst sooner or later.
Without any argument in Afridi's defense, I would like to make my point here that player is not a bigger culprit in this case as the PCB is.
Now lets have a flash back of how Mr. Ejaz Butt brought embarrassment for Pakistan and Pakistan Cricket.
1) He disrespected cricketers like Malik, Younis, Yousuf and Shahid.
2) No chief selector was comfortable in working with Ejaz Butt (including Mohsin Khan)
3) He accused England cricketers of being involved in match fixing, then withdrew from allegation.
4) He "agreed" with ICC that Pakistan's cricket team will be announced only after a final green signal from ICC's anti corruption unit. (this was conveyed by Mr. Ejaz Butt himself in a meeting of board of governors) so - Pakistan team ko ICC anti corruption unit key rehm ko karram pur chorh diya gaya
5) lost close friends like Sri Lanka, Bangladesh, England and Australia in ICC.
6) Even damaged the relations between PCB and BCCI.
7) He completely mishandled the issue of spot fixing.
8) Failed in handling any crisis situation from attack on SL cricketers to recent controversy.
9) Promoting nepotism by appointing out of way overaged friends in PCB set up (Yawar Saeed & Intekhab Alam)

and there're many more - so PCB has done more damage to Pakistan Cricket than Afridi or any other cricketer.

[zaid65]

Though there were some mistakes on part of Afridi, but then it seems that he was forced to commit those mistakes.

Qurbaan jaaon aap ki masmoomiat par, it is always somebody else fault. Even the mistakes which Afridi made, he was forced to make , by who, by Alliens?

[Saj]

Faizan read the title of this article - there are no winners in this mess

Faizan take note of the part that says laughing stock

Faizan read the part that mentions blame is not the issue here

Faizan read the part that says Pakistan cricket is the loser

My love is for Pakistan cricket, it's not for Ijaz Butt, it's not for Shahid Afridi, it's not for any other individual involved in Pakistan cricket. I have never let my emotions about one player or one individual cloud my judgement and that will always be the case.

For me Pakistan winning matches is the most important thing, I couldn't care less who scored the runs, who took the wickets and who played, AS LONG AS THEY WIN.

[shahrukh619]

Funny how Faizan easily would list the idiotic stuff done by the PCB, but he won't bother to list the idiotic stuff done by Afridi. Plz try to be fair.

[AsadMalik]

The worst part is that after a long, hard fought season for Pakistan cricket, from Australia to England (and all that mess) then a tough series against South Africa then New Zealand then the World Cup then West Indies then Ireland. The team also looked like it was ending this season on a high note with a successful tour against NZ, an impressive World Cup run, a series win in Windies and Ireland. It seemed like the team would finally get the break they deserved. But then this mess happens. I'm not going to go on about who's right who's wrong, who's to blame because honestly all sides are acting like kids now.

Looking forward to the Zimbabwe series though ;)

[Faizan Lakhani]

Shahrukh - that was already done so many times by other posters, no need to recall it.

[godzilla]

faizan - honestly, i cant speak for anyone else, but for my part this is like beating a dead horse. what on earth makes you think that any of us who are critical of afridi and his behaviour the last few weeks are supportive of butt or the pcb in general?

why in your mind does it always have to be an 'us against them' mentality? is it really that difficult for you to understand that it is possible to be disgusted with afridi AND at the same time be disgusted with the pcb?

i dont disagree with any of your 9 point list, lowlightng some of the pcb's finer moments under butt - i agree with you wholeheartedly; in fact i would add that there still hasnt been any accountability either from the government, or the board, or the police about the failures of the promises of presidential security for the lankans.

however, i think youre finding it impossible to isolate this particular recent incident from a justified critique of the pcb. in this particular issue, afridi is completely wrong, and your summation of the events not only omitted a very important fact, but included a perfect example of what is most wrong with the pcb, with pakistani cricket and with pakistan in general.

the omission is that you conveniently failed to mention that afridi was stripped of the captaincy AFTER mouthing off uncontrollably to the media about internal management committee issues. everyone on the planet knows that that is unacceptable and a contravention of codes of conduct. no one in international cricket can get away with saying something like that.

now at this point, your fallacious logic would no doubt scream bloody murder at the fact that the pcb is inept. TRUE - BUT THIS DOES NOT EXCUSE AFRIDIS BEHAVIOUR. do you understand this? the ramification of afridi feeling that he is allowed to break codes of cunduct, is that it sets a precedent for other people to break codes, and we have very fresh examples of what that leads to.

the pcb were in full rights to strip him of the captaincy after that, they didnt owe him an immediate explanation. its unacceptable if he heard it from the press before he heard it from the board, but theres any number of examples of how other players have reacted to this kind of treatment with dignity and professionalism - younis, pietersen etc.

but for him to then respond with the adjective 'beghairat', what would you expect the reaction to be? not in terms of a knee jerk reaction, but from a professional institution with explicit codes of conduct for interaction with the press? what would you do if someone on television labeled you with that word?

anyway, the other major issue i have with your line of thinking is this pakistani curse of an insatiable use of the terms 'respect/disrespect', and the terminal inability to actually apply these terms correctly. respect is not given, it is earned - it is not a right; equally, once earned, it can be lost. afridi feels he was disrespected, but his behaviour in speaking to the press about waqar in spite of everything the board and management have done for him, lost him that entitlement.

just like yousuf lost his entitlement to respect in the eyes of many supporters when he jumped ship for the icl after a toys out of the pram episode about being left out of a t20 squad. what other professional sportsmen around the world behave like this? the same curse is evident amongst the pcb, specifically with butt, yawar, saleem altaf, miandad, possibly inti, etc etc

no matter what any of us think of the pcb, and pretty much most of us hate it, the pcb are irreelevent in the face of the indisputable facts that afridi:

1) has no integrity (dad illness excuse)
2) he has no control of himself
3) he is unprofessional
4) he has dragged pakistan's name through the mud innumerable times, this just being the latest
5) his last comments have been explicit about the fact that all he wants is his noc, he doesnt care a jott about what happens to the pcb - so dont mistake his stance as a crusade and self sacrifice to rid the world of the evil curse of ijaz butt

theres no denying that he is brimful of talent, thats not the issue, nor that he hasnt fulfilled his potential, nor that he is an entertainer, nor that he has won pakistan matches - in spite of all these, those 5 points still hold, and i think im right in saying that its on account of those 5 points that some of us want to see the back of him until he is appropriately admonished and receives the just punishment he deserves.

[zaid65]

Originally Posted by godzilla faizan - honestly, i cant speak for anyone else, but for my part this is like beating a dead horse. what on earth makes you think that any of us who are critical of afridi and his behaviour the last few weeks are supportive of butt or the pcb in general? why in your mind does it always have to be an 'us against them' mentality? is it really that difficult for you to understand that it is possible to be disgusted with afridi AND at the same time be disgusted with the pcb? .

Faizan is having difficulty on this forum because as a journalist in Pakistan especially working for Geo, he is used of riding on the high horse. The reason he has developed this paranoid mentality, because he has been biased towards one subject ( instead of being objective).

Look like he is new in this profession, but I am hoping he will take a leaf out of this forum and will improve his journalism skills.

I wish him best of luck.

[wasim-fan]

Originally Posted by Waq Interesting post Saj and I agree with many aspects. I do feel however that there is a winner and that winner will ultimately be Pakistan cricket. The journey will be painful and drawn out but it is necessary to ensure that Afridi no longer plays for his country. I just feel that whilst he is at the forefront, he will always do something to embarass his country and his performances are far too inconsistent for my liking. How will the future generations develop their game if they Afridi as a role model?

This This This. As painful as it is for fans of Afridi, his position is no longer tenable.

[Saj]

I still can't see any light at the end of this tunnel, like some folk can.

Afridi doesnt get his NOC and his banned, we lose a good player in ODIs and t20s

Afridi does get his NOC, it's likely that he will still get a hefty ban from international cricket.

I don't see any immediate change in the hierarchy, which isn't ideal either.

[Chocolaty Laila]

Originally Posted by godzilla faizan - honestly, i cant speak for anyone else, but for my part this is like beating a dead horse. what on earth makes you think that any of us who are critical of afridi and his behaviour the last few weeks are supportive of butt or the pcb in general? why in your mind does it always have to be an 'us against them' mentality? is it really that difficult for you to understand that it is possible to be disgusted with afridi AND at the same time be disgusted with the pcb? i dont disagree with any of your 9 point list, lowlightng some of the pcb's finer moments under butt - i agree with you wholeheartedly; in fact i would add that there still hasnt been any accountability either from the government, or the board, or the police about the failures of the promises of presidential security for the lankans. however, i think youre finding it impossible to isolate this particular recent incident from a justified critique of the pcb. in this particular issue, afridi is completely wrong, and your summation of the events not only omitted a very important fact, but included a perfect example of what is most wrong with the pcb, with pakistani cricket and with pakistan in general. the omission is that you conveniently failed to mention that afridi was stripped of the captaincy AFTER mouthing off uncontrollably to the media about internal management committee issues. everyone on the planet knows that that is unacceptable and a contravention of codes of conduct. no one in international cricket can get away with saying something like that. now at this point, your fallacious logic would no doubt scream bloody murder at the fact that the pcb is inept. TRUE - BUT THIS DOES NOT EXCUSE AFRIDIS BEHAVIOUR. do you understand this? the ramification of afridi feeling that he is allowed to break codes of cunduct, is that it sets a precedent for other people to break codes, and we have very fresh examples of what that leads to. the pcb were in full rights to strip him of the captaincy after that, they didnt owe him an immediate explanation. its unacceptable if he heard it from the press before he heard it from the board, but theres any number of examples of how other players have reacted to this kind of treatment with dignity and professionalism - younis, pietersen etc. but for him to then respond with the adjective 'beghairat', what would you expect the reaction to be? not in terms of a knee jerk reaction, but from a professional institution with explicit codes of conduct for interaction with the press? what would you do if someone on television labeled you with that word? anyway, the other major issue i have with your line of thinking is this pakistani curse of an insatiable use of the terms 'respect/disrespect', and the terminal inability to actually apply these terms correctly. respect is not given, it is earned - it is not a right; equally, once earned, it can be lost. afridi feels he was disrespected, but his behaviour in speaking to the press about waqar in spite of everything the board and management have done for him, lost him that entitlement. just like yousuf lost his entitlement to respect in the eyes of many supporters when he jumped ship for the icl after a toys out of the pram episode about being left out of a t20 squad. what other professional sportsmen around the world behave like this? the same curse is evident amongst the pcb, specifically with butt, yawar, saleem altaf, miandad, possibly inti, etc etc no matter what any of us think of the pcb, and pretty much most of us hate it, the pcb are irreelevent in the face of the indisputable facts that afridi: 1) has no integrity (dad illness excuse) 2) he has no control of himself 3) he is unprofessional 4) he has dragged pakistan's name through the mud innumerable times, this just being the latest 5) his last comments have been explicit about the fact that all he wants is his noc, he doesnt care a jott about what happens to the pcb - so dont mistake his stance as a crusade and self sacrifice to rid the world of the evil curse of ijaz butt theres no denying that he is brimful of talent, thats not the issue, nor that he hasnt fulfilled his potential, nor that he is an entertainer, nor that he has won pakistan matches - in spite of all these, those 5 points still hold, and i think im right in saying that its on account of those 5 points that some of us want to see the back of him until he is appropriately admonished and receives the just punishment he deserves.

WOW! stunning post from Godzilla bro.

has said everything and anything that needs to be said on this issue!

POTW!

[chuck]

Godzilla mate - that was an exceptional analysis. Hard to disagree with any of the five points you mentioned.

[Saj]

The biggest problem is that people take sides, don't think logically, let their egos get in the way and become selfish and thats when the issue escalates time and again in Pak cricket.

Instead of diffusing a situation, instead of thinking with a cool head, anger takes over.

[12cavalry]

Originally Posted by godzilla faizan - honestly, i cant speak for anyone else, but for my part this is like beating a dead horse. what on earth makes you think that any of us who are critical of afridi and his behaviour the last few weeks are supportive of butt or the pcb in general? why in your mind does it always have to be an 'us against them' mentality? is it really that difficult for you to understand that it is possible to be disgusted with afridi AND at the same time be disgusted with the pcb? i dont disagree with any of your 9 point list, lowlightng some of the pcb's finer moments under butt - i agree with you wholeheartedly; in fact i would add that there still hasnt been any accountability either from the government, or the board, or the police about the failures of the promises of presidential security for the lankans. however, i think youre finding it impossible to isolate this particular recent incident from a justified critique of the pcb. in this particular issue, afridi is completely wrong, and your summation of the events not only omitted a very important fact, but included a perfect example of what is most wrong with the pcb, with pakistani cricket and with pakistan in general. the omission is that you conveniently failed to mention that afridi was stripped of the captaincy AFTER mouthing off uncontrollably to the media about internal management committee issues. everyone on the planet knows that that is unacceptable and a contravention of codes of conduct. no one in international cricket can get away with saying something like that. now at this point, your fallacious logic would no doubt scream bloody murder at the fact that the pcb is inept. TRUE - BUT THIS DOES NOT EXCUSE AFRIDIS BEHAVIOUR. do you understand this? the ramification of afridi feeling that he is allowed to break codes of cunduct, is that it sets a precedent for other people to break codes, and we have very fresh examples of what that leads to. the pcb were in full rights to strip him of the captaincy after that, they didnt owe him an immediate explanation. its unacceptable if he heard it from the press before he heard it from the board, but theres any number of examples of how other players have reacted to this kind of treatment with dignity and professionalism - younis, pietersen etc. but for him to then respond with the adjective 'beghairat', what would you expect the reaction to be? not in terms of a knee jerk reaction, but from a professional institution with explicit codes of conduct for interaction with the press? what would you do if someone on television labeled you with that word? anyway, the other major issue i have with your line of thinking is this pakistani curse of an insatiable use of the terms 'respect/disrespect', and the terminal inability to actually apply these terms correctly. respect is not given, it is earned - it is not a right; equally, once earned, it can be lost. afridi feels he was disrespected, but his behaviour in speaking to the press about waqar in spite of everything the board and management have done for him, lost him that entitlement. just like yousuf lost his entitlement to respect in the eyes of many supporters when he jumped ship for the icl after a toys out of the pram episode about being left out of a t20 squad. what other professional sportsmen around the world behave like this? the same curse is evident amongst the pcb, specifically with butt, yawar, saleem altaf, miandad, possibly inti, etc etc no matter what any of us think of the pcb, and pretty much most of us hate it, the pcb are irreelevent in the face of the indisputable facts that afridi: 1) has no integrity (dad illness excuse) 2) he has no control of himself 3) he is unprofessional 4) he has dragged pakistan's name through the mud innumerable times, this just being the latest 5) his last comments have been explicit about the fact that all he wants is his noc, he doesnt care a jott about what happens to the pcb - so dont mistake his stance as a crusade and self sacrifice to rid the world of the evil curse of ijaz butt theres no denying that he is brimful of talent, thats not the issue, nor that he hasnt fulfilled his potential, nor that he is an entertainer, nor that he has won pakistan matches - in spite of all these, those 5 points still hold, and i think im right in saying that its on account of those 5 points that some of us want to see the back of him until he is appropriately admonished and receives the just punishment he deserves.

One hell of a post.
brilliant!

Brilliant post from godzilla.

Sadly some peoples on here make this A versus B issue every time. So anything said against their idol Afridi is taken personally. Even if they know that Afridi is in the wrong, they will defend him for the sake of it.

Even worse when journalist is involved who should be giving opinions that are impartial.

[Faizan Lakhani]

Originally Posted by Dodger Brilliant post from godzilla. Sadly some peoples on here make this A versus B issue every time. So anything said against their idol Afridi is taken personally. Even if they know that Afridi is in the wrong, they will defend him for the sake of it. Even worse when journalist is involved who should be giving opinions that are impartial.

Dodger, I think there is a difference between reporting facts and having an opinion, one can always have opinions based on personal assessments from quoted and unquoted facts and figures.

You don't need to be neutral always as far as your 'opinions' are concerned - like in mainstream media - you'll see different opinions and different godfathers on same topic by different personalities. Kamran Khan will defend PM but Najam Sethi will dethrone him on same issue.

I respect godzilla's point of views, buy simultaneously, I would also want to make it clear once again that disagreement with opinion should not give any one a license to pass insulting and personal remarks about any other individuals on this forum.

[godzilla]

agreed with that. for whatever its worth, i didnt mean to be insulting at all, apologies if i was or if i came across that way.

[Gabbar Singh]

There is always a winner and in this case it's the journalists, media and lawyers. The former have lots to write about and a large pot to stir and the latter are making a fortune out of it.

[Faizan Lakhani]

Originally Posted by godzilla agreed with that. for whatever its worth, i didnt mean to be insulting at all, apologies if i was or if i came across that way.

godzilla - you don't need to be apologetic, your point of views and comments are welcome because they were sane and factually correct, but few, it seems, when're short of arguments - start personality bashing.

You don't need to be neutral always

Problem is you are NEVER neutral.

Anything to do with Afridi you go straight in defending him without even listening to the other side of the argument.

I think you will get more respect if you give a more balanced and neutral view, instead of always defending Afridi.

[Faizan Lakhani]

Dodger, Like I've said - you can always have an opinion and it can be one-sided or differ with what masses feel.
I analyze Afridi situation other way, you analyze it different way, some one else would have another way to analyze it. U can not satisfy every one.
As I've cited above too, opinions can't be neutral, when there is a collision between two parties, you'll have to be with one's side, then it rests with an individual what he think is HAQ and what is BATIL.

[Faizan Lakhani]

Originally Posted by Dodger Problem is you are NEVER neutral. Anything to do with Afridi you go straight in defending him without even listening to the other side of the argument. I think you will get more respect if you give a more balanced and neutral view, instead of always defending Afridi.

& I've never claimed to be NEUTRAL, DID I say that I am unbiased? there is a group on this forum who're against Shahid Afridi for everything he does, Hope you remember there was a thread that criticized Afridi for the way he celebrated his wickets, then there were people who were criticizing his hairstyle. So, anti-Afridi element is there, though there is no war between pro and anti Afridis but I think that both needs to respect each others point of views and opinions and debate in logical way, Instead of starting personality bashing, like few individuals here have opted for.

[12cavalry]

Originally Posted by Faizan Lakhani & I've never claimed to be NEUTRAL, DID I say that I am unbiased?

You should have accepted this earlier, it would have saved others alot of trouble.
By the way after this revelation do you still call yourself a journalist?

[Faizan Lakhani]

Originally Posted by 12cavalry You should have accepted this earlier, it would have saved others alot of trouble. By the way after this revelation do you still call yourself a journalist?

oh bhai, this is every one right to have opinion, my opinions are not only based on events that are reported or are seen by masses, but also contains information I get from my sources in the board and team.
have you ever read/heard opinions of Najam Sethi, Kamran Khan, Hamid Mir, Moeed Pirzada, Irshad Haqqani?
They all have biased opinions either pro-government or anti-government (depends on events and developments).
So, in Afridi's case my opinions are not a blind faith, but they're made after analyzing both on and off the field developments and activities.

[Faizan Lakhani]

I think it is only a matter of understanding the difference between an opinion and reported facts.

[godzilla]

Originally Posted by Faizan Lakhani I think it is only a matter of understanding the difference between an opinion and reported facts.

two things with regards to this - whether or not you agree i think its fair that people might expect a journalist to be relatively unbiased, unless he is explicitly stating opinion, or if stating fact, is expressly quoting sources.

secondly, im sure youre not surprised by a little hostility to your supportive stance to afridi for two reasons:

(1) theres widespread speculation that afridi is a master at manipulating the press, he delivers exclusives, and in return is offered staunch support in the media - whether or not this is the case with you isnt as relevant to the point im making as the fact that people certainly have reason to suspect it:

(2) given that you appear to disregard any factual criticism of afridi, and instead focus your responses on a very justified albeit irrelevant critique of the pcb.

theres been any number of mysterious unnamed 'source' related leaks to the press over time, whether its bat-gate between shoaib and asif or whether its news of a rift between captain and coach.

apart from many observers including past players explicitly stating that afridi leaks information to the press for his own benefit (those are words ive heard myself, first hand), its curious that almost all of these leaks have not involved afridi, and have involved others, and if they havent exactly paved the way for afridi to his much exalted captaincy, certainly havent impeded him from this stated goal that no-one else in the pakistani team has aspired publically to - except yousuf when he was punch drunk on his own ego.

[Savak]

Originally Posted by godzilla two things with regards to this - whether or not you agree i think its fair that people might expect a journalist to be relatively unbiased, unless he is explicitly stating opinion, or if stating fact, is expressly quoting sources. secondly, im sure youre not surprised by a little hostility to your supportive stance to afridi for two reasons: (1) theres widespread speculation that afridi is a master at manipulating the press, he delivers exclusives, and in return is offered staunch support in the media - whether or not this is the case with you isnt as relevant to the point im making as the fact that people certainly have reason to suspect it: (2) given that you appear to disregard any factual criticism of afridi, and instead focus your responses on a very justified albeit irrelevant critique of the pcb. theres been any number of mysterious unnamed 'source' related leaks to the press over time, whether its bat-gate between shoaib and asif or whether its news of a rift between captain and coach. apart from many observers including past players explicitly stating that afridi leaks information to the press for his own benefit (those are words ive heard myself, first hand), its curious that almost all of these leaks have not involved afridi, and have involved others, and if they havent exactly paved the way for afridi to his much exalted captaincy, certainly havent impeded him from this stated goal that no-one else in the pakistani team has aspired publically to - except yousuf when he was punch drunk on his own ego.

I am sorry but back in 2007 during the bat gate scandal, a lot of posters were actually supporting Afridi for leaking the incident to the press. "He did the right thing, doesnt matter if its unethical as long as Akhtar is being kicked out, punished, humiliated".

Why do people over here flip flop and brand things as ethical/unethical etc whenever it suits them?

[Faizan Lakhani]

Originally Posted by godzilla two things with regards to this - whether or not you agree i think its fair that people might expect a journalist to be relatively unbiased, unless he is explicitly stating opinion, or if stating fact, is expressly quoting sources. secondly, im sure youre not surprised by a little hostility to your supportive stance to afridi for two reasons: (1) theres widespread speculation that afridi is a master at manipulating the press, he delivers exclusives, and in return is offered staunch support in the media - whether or not this is the case with you isnt as relevant to the point im making as the fact that people certainly have reason to suspect it: (2) given that you appear to disregard any factual criticism of afridi, and instead focus your responses on a very justified albeit irrelevant critique of the pcb. theres been any number of mysterious unnamed 'source' related leaks to the press over time, whether its bat-gate between shoaib and asif or whether its news of a rift between captain and coach. apart from many observers including past players explicitly stating that afridi leaks information to the press for his own benefit (those are words ive heard myself, first hand), its curious that almost all of these leaks have not involved afridi, and have involved others, and if they havent exactly paved the way for afridi to his much exalted captaincy, certainly havent impeded him from this stated goal that no-one else in the pakistani team has aspired publically to - except yousuf when he was punch drunk on his own ego.

Godzilla - No journalist is answerable to Shahid Afridi and this is not true that he manipulates news stories, there is no doubt that he has friends in media, but every other cricketer is friends with different journalists and the friendship or close relations doesn't enforce any bias. I, obviously, can not force people to make or change their opinion about me or my stance for Afridi, its their choice to suspect or believe whatever they think.

As far as his cricketing issues are concerned, I do not defend him when he is not performing, but recently he did perform and hence I supported his performance in world cup. But criticizing his hairstyle or celebration styles are totally uncalled for and reflection of hate afridi sentiments a certain numbers of members on this forum have.

As far as leaking information to press is concerned, I think even board does that, recently cricket board intentionally leaked the 'confidential' tour report of Waqar Younis and Intekhab Alam to the press, in past team management have LEAKED final XI 24 hours before the game ... So, don't blame only Afridi for leaking the news to press.

Even on this forum - there was a news item titled "all is not well during world cup" (pardon me if I am missing the actual title) and the entire stuff was based on quotes of an unnamed cricketer, so ! why not criticizing the player who leaked the stuff that all is not well ? who leaked this to media that Shoaib Akhtar was fined during World Cup? it wasn't Shahid Afridi - the news was initially leaked by the manager himself and later he publicly announced it in a press conference.

Who fueled the pre-world cup stories that Afridi is not going to be the captain for the mega-event? the same person who Afridi mentioned in his post-retirement interviews.

[Faizan Lakhani]

I shared a report of an internal PCB inquiry conducted by Justice Ejaz Yousuf - some one (and certainly not Shahid Afridi) shared the copy and is still with me. Why there was not any questions raised that how can an internal inquiry report was made public?

[Faizan Lakhani]

godzilla ..
all said and done, I don't mind if any one criticize Afridi for his performance or his behavior as fan, I respect them as a fan's opinion, but simultaneously, if I speak in favor of Afridi it should be taken as my opinion, always debate and criticize the content of article, not the individual.

I believe in freedom of expression, and I hope a majority on this forum does it too.

[zaid65]

Originally Posted by Faizan Lakhani godzilla .. all said and done, I don't mind if any one criticize Afridi for his performance or his behavior as fan, I respect them as a fan's opinion, but simultaneously, if I speak in favor of Afridi it should be taken as my opinion, always debate and criticize the content of article, not the individual. I believe in freedom of expression, and I hope a majority on this forum does it too.

In your contents, main issue is always one individual.

Good try, next time comes out with better lines.

[godzilla]

Originally Posted by Savak I am sorry but back in 2007 during the bat gate scandal, a lot of posters were actually supporting Afridi for leaking the incident to the press. "He did the right thing, doesnt matter if its unethical as long as Akhtar is being kicked out, punished, humiliated". Why do people over here flip flop and brand things as ethical/unethical etc whenever it suits them?

no need to be sorry i shouldnt think, but again whether and what people here may have said back then is completely irrelevant to the point that i was making - leaks shouldnt happen, and if the sources are found they should be disciplined. if someone is found to do it for his own benefit at the detriment of the team, they should be severely castigated.

note that i think your point on inconsistency of posters is very valid, i just think that here its irrelevant to this particular discussion, and as seems to be common in many of your responses to critiques of afridi in this whole affair, you have managed to avoid addressing any of the points being raised.

[godzilla]

Originally Posted by Faizan Lakhani Godzilla - No journalist is answerable to Shahid Afridi and this is not true that he manipulates news stories, there is no doubt that he has friends in media, but every other cricketer is friends with different journalists and the friendship or close relations doesn't enforce any bias. I, obviously, can not force people to make or change their opinion about me or my stance for Afridi, its their choice to suspect or believe whatever they think. As far as his cricketing issues are concerned, I do not defend him when he is not performing, but recently he did perform and hence I supported his performance in world cup. But criticizing his hairstyle or celebration styles are totally uncalled for and reflection of hate afridi sentiments a certain numbers of members on this forum have. As far as leaking information to press is concerned, I think even board does that, recently cricket board intentionally leaked the 'confidential' tour report of Waqar Younis and Intekhab Alam to the press, in past team management have LEAKED final XI 24 hours before the game ... So, don't blame only Afridi for leaking the news to press. Even on this forum - there was a news item titled "all is not well during world cup" (pardon me if I am missing the actual title) and the entire stuff was based on quotes of an unnamed cricketer, so ! why not criticizing the player who leaked the stuff that all is not well ? who leaked this to media that Shoaib Akhtar was fined during World Cup? it wasn't Shahid Afridi - the news was initially leaked by the manager himself and later he publicly announced it in a press conference. Who fueled the pre-world cup stories that Afridi is not going to be the captain for the mega-event? the same person who Afridi mentioned in his post-retirement interviews.

it looks like we wont see eye to eye, not just with this issue, but with regards to the way we see things in general. again here you are defending an accusation against afridi by pointing the finger elsewhere as opposed to conceding that the accusation hold merit.

its like the defence council for a burglar on trial claiming that his client is innocent because theres other people who are committing murder who should be caught first. even if other people should be brought to trial for murder, it doesnt mean a burglar shouldnt be.

its not an issue of only blaming afridi for being a snitch, and if you were to write up a thread highlighting when ilias, alam or anyone else in pcb management had been a snitch too and should be held accontable for it, id be shocked if not everyone agreed with you. this particular thread though, is about afridi. you cant ignore his attrocious behaviour just because other people might also have been behaving atrociously, it doesnt justify it.

anyway, i can see we're going round in circles, so thats probably my last word on it.