The Negatives Outweigh the Positives Despite the 3-0 Scoreline

[Saj]

A three nil scoreline should in theory be one that Pakistani fans, players and the coaching staff be satisfied with, especially away from home. However with all due respect to the opposition, such is the weak state of Bangladesh cricket that nothing other than a 3-0 scoreline was expected from an in form, united and confident Pakistan side.

The smiles and back slapping though should be rather sedate as the overall performance was not satisfactory. There is never an entirely perfect series, but the one day series in Bangladesh has left me wondering about the immediate futures of some current members of the one day squad and also whether long term planning will ever be something that the Pakistani selectors will incorporate into their thinking.

The numbers tell the story of the inept batting performances in Bangladesh, with only 3 batsmen averaging more than 22 in the series. Pakistan's batsmen were even more sluggish than the pitches, although the surfaces should be absolutely no excuse for the Pakistan top order. The pitches were difficult but not impossible and not alien to what Pakistan's batsmen play on week in, week out in domestic cricket.

The Bangladeshi bowling was honest and hard working but hardly threatening. One wonders how the Pakistani batsmen would have coped in this series had they been up against one of the top bowling attacks in world cricket.

What must really be frustrating and worrying though is the mode of dismissals. Very few of the dismissals across the series were down to inspired bowling or a great piece of fielding or a master stroke from the opposition captain. Thoughtless strokes, playing across the line, irresponsible batting and a distinct lack of planning and patience were the downfalls time and again. However the lessons just didn't seem to be learnt as the same errors occurred match after match.

Misbah, Umar Akmal and some flashes of big hitting from Afridi were the bright spots, although all three can feel disappointed with some of their shot choices too. The other batsmen looked devoid of ideas on how to bat on such surfaces, some looked like they were holding a bat for the first time if the truth be told. It doesn't take a genius to work out which players I am referring to.

I'm still yet to be convinced by Sarfraz Ahmed with the bat. Whilst his wicket keeping was mainly tidy, his batting really does need some improvement. Yes he's still a novice in international cricket but really he needs to show more credentials with the bat to convince me.

Shoaib Malik is not in the side for his bowling, he's in the side as a batting all rounder. Despite the eye catching bowling figures, Malik looks like a batsman who is mentally lacking in any self belief. He cuts a sad figure at the crease and looks like he's forgotten what the middle of the bat is for.

Asad Shafiq is another who hasn't convinced me he is ideal for one day cricket and Imran Farhat has been persevered with for too long.

Younus Khan has had an unconvincing series again in 50 over cricket and the knives are being sharpened for his exclusion from one day cricket. However with the England series around the corner I still think he should be persevered with for one more 50 over series.

None of the Pakistani bowlers can be faulted. They constantly troubled the Bangladeshi batsmen and saved the batsmen from embarrassment. The spinners were unplayable and I'm sure the England batsmen will already be thinking about what is in store for them in the UAE.

Aside from the spinners, it was good to see Umar Gul bowling with consistent pace and he looked in fine rhythm ahead of facing Strauss and co. The only negative amongst the bowlers was Sohail Tanvir who simply does not look the same bowler after his knee problems. Whether it's a psychological thing or just poor form is unclear but he needs to get back to basics and work on his form.

The next one day series is of course England and the selectors now find themselves in a situation where they have several players out of form and struggling. So, instead of fully utilising the Zimbabwe and Bangladesh series and giving some of the fringe and up and coming players a chance to show their worth, they have persevered with "senior" players.

What now? Stick with the failures of the Bangladesh and Zimbabwe series or blood some youngsters against tough opposition. It's a ridiculous position that the selectors now find themselves in, yet one that could have been avoided.

[inzy_paratha]

Farhat , Malik and Tanvir need to be out of the team ASAP. Sharjeel Khan should definitely be given a chance, and for the middle order I reckon Fawad Alam should be brought back (rotates strike nicely and most importantly stays at the wicket ) , Hammad Azam and since we seem to have decided Moyos fate for him, maybe bring in someone like Usman Salahuddin . I dont think we need to have to many big hitters, having someone like Sharjeel who could potentially give us quick starts would be enough, followed by a middle order of nudges and nurdlers+Umar Akmal with Afridi to come. Logic being that our Goal should be to reach 250+ consistently. With our batting line up thats a score we will defend 70% of the time, and with the batting resources currently available barring the odd exceptional performance aiming for 270-280 scores regularly will lead to the odd collapse as we have seen....we need to play to our strengths.

[Amjid Javed]

Best pakistan can do now is make minor changes for the England series and hope that we some how get through the series unscathed. Main problem with selectors is they have no longterm plans at all. As ive mentioned before are cricketers like Malik, Yk, Razzaq, Tanvir going to be any better come the 2015 WC? I highly doubt it. We have 3/4 years to groom players going forward players like Fawad Alam, Hammad azam, Asad shafiq etc.. yet we dont give these guys any real chances, yet we are willing to continue to picking tried and tested failures again. Until the selectos grow a pair am afraid once again pakistan will fall short come major ODI competitions.

Our bowling has always been our strength in ODIs and isnt a worry. Our batting is but its just ignored, yeah we might lose a few more ODI series with more young batsmen in side but atleast in longterm we may get some postive gains.

[talha3]

I think OP is a bit too negative.

Let's face the facts.

1. Although some of the matches had a few moments of worry, in the end all matches were won by very comfortable margins: 50 runs(t20), 5 wickets(146 balls left), 76 runs, 58 runs.

2. Bangladesh in their own backyard have recently beaten England, West Indies (who have been competitive against India in India) and most famously, NZ 4-0.

3. You mention negatives such as Tanvir and Shafiq. Well both of these will be replaced by Junaid and Farhat (who had a good series against SL).

The only real negative was the top order batting (top 3). But let's remember that the top order batting was reasonably good against SL in UAE.

A slight negative might be the wicket keeping spot, but Umar has done a great job there and it's possible that if Adnan impresses in the tests against England, he might get a recall for the ODIs.

To say 'the negatives outweigh the positives' is going too far IMO. I haven't even mentioned those in my post and I don't think I need to.

[cricmylife]

With all due respect, I don't think introducing new faces will be a good idea against England (i.e. Hammad). I think it will be unfair to him if he fails against a top opponent. I think bringing Fawad Alam in middle order will be good idea but only as a back up to YK. YK may have failed against Bangladesh but his average against English provides him a space in the middle order.

[Desi]

get rid of the obvious weak links

tanvir
malik

replace tanvir with cheema, junaid, wahab, etc
replace malik with adnan akmal

and you have a competitive team

[Watsupdoc]

^ But Malik has booked the ticket to UAE with what the Bangla commies were calling "ball of the century" (They actually called it ball of the match but yea you get the idea).

[KingKhanWC]

I agree with the OP here.

If Bangladesh had a half decent batting line up they could have won the series. The strenght of our bowlers along with their weak batting was the reason for a comfortable series win.

Sure the pitches turned but were harldy unplayable. We used to have a plan in the batting, keeps wickets in hand and then go hell for leather towards the end. At the moment there doesn't seem to be a strategy.

[W63L35]

Only one negative....... very poor team given to Misbah by the selectors.

I think, the team did a great job given some of the pathetic players (Farrhat, Malik, Sohail) given to MHK and MUH.

[Genghis]

Our batting is once again under the microscope. Umar Akmal performed this time, but the challenge will be to see how he plays against better opposition. Younis, Misbah and Shafiq - three players too similar in scoring rate and really we should be playing only one or two of them. Hafeez has also fallen back into his shell with the bat. He needs to start concentrating on his batting. Sarfraz is another one who has failed to impress with the bat (and he even had some howlers with the keeping gloves). All in all, I wouldn't have much confidence in our batting side when chasing a 250+ score. It's time we looked for a young batsmen like Umar Amin to come into the fold. He is not necessarily the short term solution, but we should benefit in the long term.

Bowling is again our strong point, but as Saj says we really need to part with Tanvir for the time being. He is clearly the weakest link in our bowling attack. As I haven't seen anything special with the bat for him, I would be tempted to play another bowler in his place.

[Cpt. Rishwat]

We should thank our lucky stars that Bangladesh have produced such spin friendly wickets. It's exposed the weakness of our batting line up very effectively. These batsmen are very ordinary for the most part. Good to see Umar Akmal shine though as he is the one player who has the ability to score in any conditions, if not the sense.

[Inswinger]

There are a handful of players who wouldn't even make it into the Bangladeshi team at this time. They need to be shown the door for good.

[ali85]

only negative exposed - selection of out-of-form players in the team.

Too many players not performing consistently (or at all):
- Shoaib Malik
- Sohail Tanvir
- Younis Khan
- Imran Farhat

Not accusing Malik but have you guys noticed how team performance has went down considerably ever since Shoaib Malik's and Imran Farhat's comeback? I mean guys like Hafeez and Shafiq aren't performing as well as they were. Coincidence?

[VolcanicAsh]

The politically backed Malik, Tanvir and Farhat have to be dropped immediately otherwise this current chairman is just another puppet for his political brethren. If these three waste of space are persisted with in expense of more deserving players it will have huge repercussions going forward.

[pakcrickfan]

what is trundler tanvir doing in the team? even vinay kumar is bowling faster and better than this guy. :facepalm

[ali85]

Originally Posted by VolcanicAsh The politically backed Malik, Tanvir and Farhat have to be dropped immediately otherwise this current chairman is just another puppet for his political brethren.

Ilyas should also be fired - this a massive conflict of interest.

[amjad_ali]

I agree with Saj Bhai.

The opening pair was poor, scoring slowly in the initial overs but more importantly, getting out once and if settled.

The big problem of rotating the strike is not going to be resolved it seems. TukTukMohali, Hafeez, Farhat, and even Younis Khan have issues with rotating the strike.

Malik...well he is Malik. Enough said.

Even in the fast bowling unit, I think we lack depth. We need a bowler who can consistently touch 145kph and Sohail is purely trash atm.

In all, Farhat, Malik, Younis, Tanvir need to be replaced, Hafeez needs to take more responsibility, and Asad need to be the free-flowing player that he is.

[Sherlock]

Agreed 100% with Saj bhai. Batting should of got some practice, unfortunately they were poor and relied upon the bowling to help them.

[MVP26]

Solution is to fire illyas

[chacha kashmiri]

bring vicki back and add azhar ali to odi squad

[hmushtaq]

Playing wrong players (Imran Farhat, Malik and Tanvir), and not having proper batting order is the issue.

Asad Shafiq only played one ODI. Both him and Umar Akmal are wasted. Asad Shafiq is one down batsman across all formats. He should be given good run with it and he would settle and score. Akmal is 2 down batsman across all formats.

Its time Younus and Misbah start rotating for ODI, and let next generation phase in.

[w8in_4_0402]

Sohail tanvir out wahab in.

Farhat out ahmed shazad in.

Sarfraz out Kami in!!!!

[w8in_4_0402]

If needed yk out fawad in.

[IM NOT YOU]

Out: Tanvir, malik, farthat

in: Sadaf, fawad alam, azhar ali

[Black Zero]

Originally Posted by ali85 only negative exposed - selection of out-of-form players in the team. Too many players not performing consistently (or at all): - Shoaib Malik - Sohail Tanvir - Younis Khan - Imran Farhat Not accusing Malik but have you guys noticed how team performance has went down considerably ever since Shoaib Malik's and Imran Farhat's comeback? I mean guys like Hafeez and Shafiq aren't performing as well as they were. Coincidence?

that's actually accusation.

[sully3]

it clear to see 4 or 5 players are carrying the whole team, its simple the tried and tested failures are struggling. our biggest problem right now is so hail Tanvir, he is blocking a few players position in the team, the guy is not an international standard bowler simple as that.

Hammad Azam should have been on the plane to UAE and Bangladesh so we could have seen if he was good enough for England. Its to risky to try him for England so i would stick with razzaq

Farhat and Malik their time is up.

maybe its time we think of bringing in Azhar Ali to the batting line up.

[Usman]

Agree with Saj. The only problem is that the selectors are totally incompetant, as usual. Certain players should be nowhere near the team, and certain disguarded players should be here. That's not just my opinion, that is performance backed fact. Azhar Ali has an even better record in limited overs cricket then he does in test cricket. Yet he is continously left out. Fawad Alam can literally do no more. Even when Junaid was in the squad against SL, Tanvir was picked instead for every match, apart from the meaningless fifth match. Malik hasn't sat out despite looking the worst player from any side, Pak, Bangla or SL. Umer is now dropped for Malik. Farhat's farther-in-law continues his destructive ways. Wahab is left out despite no actual investigation against him.

There is just too much wrong with selection. Give the job to me and I guarantee Pak will do well against England.

[Mighty Khan]

MVP6 is correct by saying Illyas needs to be fired but that is only half the problem!!! All those who think Moshin should remain ad coach this is as good as you get and don't forget batting his strongest point!!! If he continues as coach we will have a jellyfish as a coach with no ability to recognise talent and a totally corrupt chief selector.

[AZ]

The team's combination makes absolutely no sense and is all over the place.

either we are short on fast bowlers, or don't have enough batsmen.

the top order is as flaky as ever.

the wicketkeeper scenario remains as ambiguous as ever, and it hurts the team as the genuine one is a poor bat.

[taqi]

there should be someone in Middle order who can play at run a ball Misbah and YK both play too slow in middle overs that puts lots of pressure on Afridi and Umer Akmal

[Statsman]

Poor selection. Nothing else.

[Ahson Afzal]

Originally Posted by w8in_4_0402 Sohail tanvir out wahab in. Farhat out ahmed shazad in. Sarfraz out Adnan in!!!!

Fixed
For God's sake we don't want kami any more

[ash 68]

moan moan moan


what a load of little whinning girls

3-0 bottom line

Windies have shown India not to take low ranked teams lightly

Malik and Tanvir were poor no doubt but not enough praise is given to the team to pull through on stogy pitches

[Statsman]

Originally Posted by ash 68 moan moan moan what a load of little whinning girls 3-0 bottom line Windies have shown India not to take low ranked teams lightly Malik and Tanvir were poor no doubt but not enough praise is given to the team to pull through on stogy pitches

Agree. India has performed even more poorly, albeit having rested its few key players.

[Zaz]

Agree with saj The likes of tanvir, malik and younis khan have once again flattered to deceive and need replacing Questions are also around sarfraz ahmed and asad shafiq but id give them one more series They need to step up

The selectors need to do the right thing for once and bring in fresh blood immediately or we can expect more mediocre performances like the recent ones

[Ryankhan]

I totally agree with Saj. our batting was pathetic, seriously. Misbah looked like a fool yesterday just before he got out. the way he was moving back and forth and still couldnt get of the strike and on the 4th ball got out so that was very embarassing. YK was a big dissapointment for me.
he should have made his avg more better and should have atlease scored a 1oo and followed by a 50 or so but yet he was so buzy trying to occupy the crease for whole 50 overs. i dont know who to blame here, because YK was following tuk tukz order to play slow and stay on the wkt and YK normally doesnt plays like that and here our coach responsibility also comes in. as to what his approach towards the game is. so far in this series, our bowling and Umer akmall brillance saved us from our batting disaster. our bowling mashallah has been off the par, great but batting is what worry us. i agree with most of you

Malik crap
Farhat idiot
Tanvir fazool shuold really be left out of the team for good. i would replace these 3 with

Hammad Azam
Ahmed Shehzaad or Sharjeel or ovais
Riaz or Juni

that will strengthen our side a bit more . and we gota leave the defensive mind set appraoch, its killing our bating.

[TheHK16]

another worry is hafeez batting

[ash 68]

Originally Posted by Ryankhan I totally agree with Saj. our batting was pathetic, seriously. Misbah looked like a fool yesterday just before he got out. the way he was moving back and forth and still couldnt get of the strike and on the 4th ball got out so that was very embarassing. YK was a big dissapointment for me. he should have made his avg more better and should have atlease scored a 1oo and followed by a 50 or so but yet he was so buzy trying to occupy the crease for whole 50 overs. i dont know who to blame here, because YK was following tuk tukz order to play slow and stay on the wkt and YK normally doesnt plays like that and here our coach responsibility also comes in. as to what his approach towards the game is. so far in this series, our bowling and Umer akmall brillance saved us from our batting disaster. our bowling mashallah has been off the par, great but batting is what worry us. i agree with most of you Malik crap Farhat idiot Tanvir fazool shuold really be left out of the team for good. i would replace these 3 with Hammad Azam Ahmed Shehzaad or Sharjeel or ovais Riaz or Juni that will strengthen our side a bit more . and we gota leave the defensive mind set appraoch, its killing our bating.

yes yes attack even when you loose wickets

positive batting solves everything


childish analysis

To build a big score , one batter needs to hold the innings together

thats what Misbah was trying to do

unfortunately one batsman cant score 100s every single innings

[Justcrazy]

Pakistan need to find good openers up front, you need attacking openers. Just give some one a decent chance rather than repeating same discarded players again and again.

Keep an eye on next WC when selecting players. Seam bowling all rounders would be invaluable in those conditions. Its something that Pakistan need to think seriously.

Once selected need to give the players ample opportunity to show the talent.

Asad should not be in ODI, he is in the wrong format.

Umar Akmal should be WK , because that gives team the right balance for shorter formats.

YK & Misbah should rotate the strike more, they need to able to push things along at 5 - 6 runs an over without taking chances. They should not get bogged down .

[Osman]

OTT opening post...cmon at least give credit where its due for 3-0....yes we were in tricky situations many a time in the last 2 odi series but we pulled through apart from every time bar one game vs sri lanka......yes some players are evry underserving of their spot such as tanvir and farhat but despite literally playing with 9 men in both games we showed resilience to pull through against the odds...though yes admittedly 99% of this was due to the bowlers

i agree about umar akmal though....yes he got man of the series and played some top knocks but he should be told this is not enough...enough of this pretty 40/50 and not kicking on to centuries....until he does this he should not be back in the test team....a average/poor series for shafiq in the tests vs bangladesh will surely see umar back for the england series though

[alberto]

i want yousuf in for younis,azhar/ zain abbas in for tuk tuk ,shafiq in for malik and sharjeel for farhat.bhatti as allrounder

[Theo_14]

Originally Posted by Justcrazy Pakistan need to find good openers up front, you need attacking openers.

Of course, Pakistan have plenty of openers who have a approach which is nothing but pure attacking.

However... We need the type of batsman, who's aggressive and attacking as you suggested indeed BUT importantly, who does't lack a brain, maturity and doesn't throw his wicket away cheaply.

To find a opening batsman like that is fairly difficult. It's just a shame that the likes of Shehzad and Nazir are so talented in terms of scoring with a consistent offensive approach BUT fail to show maturity, good shot selection and composure despite seeing glimpses of it.

[NA]

The ODI team basically needs to be rethought.

I'd start with the indispensable members for the ODI squad..

Misbah, Hafeez, Umar Gul, Ajmal, Afridi and Umar Akmal. So this covers six players out of eleven, three of which are spinners (and in great form). If Wahab Riaz was considered, he'd be the second fast bowler and among the seven forming the core of the team. Let's say this second bowler could be one of Cheema/Junaid/Wahab. One more all-rounder spot could go to Hammad or Razzaq. For the other opener, I'd go with Ahmed Shahzad (showed temperament to score hundreds) or Awais Zia. I do believe we need a proper wicket keeper, so Sarfraz or Akmal from the current crop is needed. Last batting spot can go to YK.

The team would then be

Hafeez
Shehzad / Awais Zia / Sharjeel Khan
Younis Khan
Umar Akmal
Misbah ul Haq
Hammad Azam / Razzaq
Afridi
Sarfraz / Adnan Akmal
Umar Gul
Saeed Ajmal
Wahab/Cheema/Junaid/Talha

Those in bold, form the core of this ODI team. Ideally I'd like Wahab and Hammad to be part of this group.

Fawad Alam can step in when one of Misbah or Younis retires from ODIs.

[IMMY69]

Lots to be positive about!!!

Batting didn't deliver largely because we didn't get off to fliers as usual and this is probably down to Hafeez's form. If anything the series demonstrated how crucial Hafeez has been with the bat for past 18 months.. Hopefully he'll regain his touch with the bat, although I also think the wickets were not conducive to his stroke making.

Malik is a complete non event when it comes to batting so in reality were only playing 5 genuine batsmen the entire series one of which was Farhat!

Couple of tweaks here and there and we should be rolling!!

[Saj]

Just remember something very important and I quote one of the current selectors :-

"Our hands are tied, we cannot always select the players that we want. We are told by outside influences that some players have to be selected."

[*sallu*]

Others may see Malik's failure as a negative but I see it as a positive, better see him getting exposed when we are winning and playing weaker sides than wait for crunch situations when he still makes it to the side and then fails when each player in the 11 is needed...

[violet_may]

^^
That's why us fans get so annoyed. Here we are, writing up what the best team combination will be and who deserves a spot in the team based on talent/performance.


No changes will happen because of these 'influences'. Highly frustrating when we know there are capable players waiting in the wings.

[*sallu*]

Tbh even if Malik had all the sifarish in Pakistan surely now he won't be selected, I mean averaging 5 against Zim+Ban+SL is not even funny...

Even Farhat makes the odd 50, so you can understand from a sifarish point of view how he can be backed...

[IMMY69]

Originally Posted by Saj Just remember something very important and I quote one of the current selectors :- "Our hands are tied, we cannot always select the players that we want. We are told by outside influences that some players have to be selected."

It's a very sad state of affairs!!

How much talent must we have lost due to corruption. How many youngsters from poorer backgrounds must turn away from the game because of such corruption!

Next time an Indian or an Aussie or an English fan talks about how good they are, just point them to this thread/post and the many others here on PP!

[Saj]

Originally Posted by IMMY69 It's a very sad state of affairs!! How much talent must we have lost due to corruption. How many youngsters from poorer backgrounds must turn away from the game because of such corruption! Next time an Indian or an Aussie or an English fan talks about how good they are, just point them to this thread/post and the many others here on PP!

Just to add, it's not just the obvious selections. There are others too that the selectors don't want for one reason or another, but are forced on them.

[Mighty Khan]

I can't understand with all those who agree with Saj!!!??? Isn't he the one who thinks Moshin should continue as coach!!!??? One other suggestion was not to have specialists coaches!!!???? So why this thread!!?? Moshin is a jellyfish with an added handicap of not being able to identify talent and back them. This man has been tested many times before with A teams etc with no impact. Cracks are already appearing and we have yet to face real opposition. I have said all this numerous of times in other threads.

[Saj]

Originally Posted by Mighty Khan I can't understand with all those who agree with Saj!!!??? Isn't he the one who thinks Moshin should continue as coach!!!??? One other suggestion was not to have specialists coaches!!!???? So why this thread!!?? Moshin cannot being able to identify talent and back them. This man has been tested many times before with A teams etc with no impact. Cracks are already appearing and we have yet to face real opposition. I have said all this numerous of times in other threads.

Firstly and most importantly I have edited your post and removed the rather childish and petty name calling. In future refrain from such immature behaviour.

Now we have got that out the way, let's try and understand what you are actually tying to say.

Lets keep it simple, my thread criticises the batting performance of the Pakistani batsmen in this series. If you think the batting performances were acceptable then let's hear the reasons why !

Regarding the coaches involvement in the batting performance in this thread. These are experienced cricketers, there is absolutely no excuse for them to play some of the shots they played and the way they approached their innings'.

[IMMY69]

Originally Posted by Mighty Khan I can't understand with all those who agree with Saj!!!??? Isn't he the one who thinks Moshin should continue as coach!!!??? One other suggestion was not to have specialists coaches!!!???? So why this thread!!?? Moshin is a jellyfish with an added handicap of not being able to identify talent and back them. This man has been tested many times before with A teams etc with no impact. Cracks are already appearing and we have yet to face real opposition. I have said all this numerous of times in other threads.

Sorry are we talking about the coach or The selection process?

[BoomBoomCricket]

turned out to be right

[zulfiqar]

i agreed with this as well n i've posted bout it somewhere else. but yes, for those who think "where was the criticism before we lost?" here's ur thread. there are some glaring weaknesses in the odi batting line up, particularly that we are missing free-scoring batsmen in the top order and also that some of the oldies have to gradually go (they could at least let YK know his time is near for ODIs!!). umar akmal up the order is an easy one that the management -- for reasons known only to them -- will not listen to. Still, we should be fine in odis probably after tweaking here and there, primarly cuz we do have some talented odi bats like umar akmal and asad shafiq and our bowling is still pretty good with afridi/ajmal.

[Saj]

The writing was on the wall as I suggested in this thread, but for some reason because of the euphoria of the Test whitewash, many thought that the one dayers would be a walk in the park for Pakistan.

[farazaidi]

our one-day team was infact developing rather well up until the tour to Zimbabwe when we made another self inflicted decision by recalling Malik - the virus.

I'm not joking here, this guy is cancer to the team and sooner we get rid of him, the better.

[Zamee]

Originally Posted by farazaidi our one-day team was infact developing rather well up until the tour to Zimbabwe when we made another self inflicted decision by recalling Malik - the virus. I'm not joking here, this guy is cancer to the team and sooner we get rid of him, the better.

I agree to some extent but lets be pratical, we dont have qualtiy LOI batsmen and our seamers look average.
Our Odi team needs a major overhaul and Misbah should adapt a diffrent strategy. We cannot win with this defensive mind set.

[fight_club]

The writing was on the wall as I suggested in this thread, but for some reason because of the euphoria of the Test whitewash, many thought that the one dayers would be a walk in the park for Pakistan.

I can't agree with the notion here. A test series whitewash of England can not be overshadowed by the LOI losses which were expected.

There is no doubt that your concerns about Pak batting are valid but lets not act as if we are heading for another waterloo.

We are doing alright as a test Team, opening combination is bit of a concern but overall we have found two young talent in Ali and Asad who can server us for some time and I am sure Junior akmal will be gradually drafted in.

Limited over games were and will always be dominated by batsmen and we break our own back with fractured selection poor resource management but tell me Saj having seen Pak cricket for so many years, Is this the worst time we are facing?? I will say a firm no

Pakistan cricket is gradually evolving and in the absence of good selection, management, coaching and other bells and whistles we are not doing too bad, matter of fact doing petty good its just that we as followers should not expect miracles from this team specially in the shorter format where we will struggle for some more time to come.

You see, We don't choose right by choice but by force this ODI series defeat will have few positives

1. Mishab ODI captaincy under fire
2. Farhat may go least for few series
3. should be curtains for Malik
4. We will realize that we need different thinking for the shorter format which we will be playing a lot in near future
5. Thought is bound to be given for Team combination


In the myriad world of Pak cricket we somehow always count on some youngster to come good show brilliance become an inspired selection pity we have started treating our youngsters so shabbily for past many years and we are bearing the burnt.

You can't be too negative about Pak cricket there is some hope always around but sometime wait can be a little longer so never give up

[Saj]

I can't agree with the notion here. A test series whitewash of England can not be overshadowed by the LOI losses which were expected

I'm talking about the signs for a poor one day series against England and that the concerns were already there after a less than impressive one day series versus Bangladesh.

[KingKhanWC]

The test side is fairly settled but the ODI side isn't. Pakistan are still searching for the right combination and we have had a long history of poor batting in this format.

Sri Lanka are a good ODI side and we beat them 4-1. I think if out batters could have put more runs on the board then things could be different.

I still believe Pakistan are a very good ODI side.

[in_cutter]

Is'nt it funny. You'd expect Eng to have won the Test series & Pak the ODI series.

[gibsyhesperis]

Test matches are won by bowlers -- wehad a very powerful spin attack in the testmatches and won 3-0. An unprecedented (and unexpected !) victory againt the best team in the world (sic)

Batsmen win ODIs -- look at India's relative strength in tests vs ODIs recently.

We've got to get a stronger batting line up. Let's face it apart from one or two occasions they have rarely shown recently and the bowlers have been performing well. The totals in the first two ODIs weren't too special and shold have been chased down

[PakPosheeda]

Originally Posted by Saj The writing was on the wall as I suggested in this thread, but for some reason because of the euphoria of the Test whitewash, many thought that the one dayers would be a walk in the park for Pakistan.

Actually everyone predicted that England would walk over Pakistan in the test series and Pakistan would thrash the hopeless ODI unit from England. Quite a few pundits and fans are in a shock.

[ali85]

Originally Posted by ali85 only negative exposed - selection of out-of-form players in the team. Too many players not performing consistently (or at all): - Shoaib Malik - Sohail Tanvir - Younis Khan - Imran Farhat Not accusing Malik but have you guys noticed how team performance has went down considerably ever since Shoaib Malik's and Imran Farhat's comeback? I mean guys like Hafeez and Shafiq aren't performing as well as they were. Coincidence?

so far, my suspicions are holding true. People notice if somebody keeps on getting free lunches (Malik/Farhat/YK).

[samiakh]

Your observations were spot on Saj. Weak opposition masked a lot of our problems. However I think sarfaraz was harshly dealt with. The 2nd ODI against SL him and Umer Akmal had taken us within sight of an unlikely victory and he was very unlucky to be given LBW to a ball missing leg. I know it was only one innings but in such a young career an innings like that, one that takes a side to victory can make all the difference in building the confidence of a youngster. I think dropping him from the t20's further jolted his confidence. I know he has not done much to inspire confidence but I have watched him and Adnan live at the stadium and I can tell you there is a huge difference in batting skill. Adnan was all at sea against Finn the other day, while sarfaraz had looked a lot more composed in that ODI innings I mentioned earlier. So the changes I would make for the Asia cup.

1) Sarfaraz back as keeper
2) Ahmed Shezad back for imran farhat
3) Hammad azam in for an extended run instead of either azhar Ali or Asad shafiq
4) Mohammed Sami at 9
5) umer Akmal up the order at 4

Hafeez, Shezad, YK, Umer Akmal, Misbah, Hammad, Afridi, Sarfaraz, Sami, Ajmal, Gul