Misbah wants to captain Pakistan in all three formats

[MR__KHAN__JI]

Originally Posted by iZeeshan That was literally 5 years ago. Recently he's been losing us game and that's evident form the most recent t20s. He miscalculated, puts pressure on others, and quite simply, can no longer hit sizes at will once he's like he did in that 07 world cup. And don't give me the form is temporary class is permanent stuff again because Misbah is 38 and quite reasonable to assume he's lost his hand-eye, just like Afridi.

You may have a point with Misbah and age.

I would still give him the benefit of the doubt for this world cup.

[DeadlyVenom]

Misbah needs to be told that for this world cup he needs to step it up a gear. He does not currently look like a T20 player and is definitely not playing according to the situation in T20 cricket.

Dav Whatmore needs to sit him down and ask him seriously is he up to playing T20 or just being stubborn so that he can hold onto the captaincy. His last few t20 performances have been substandard and someone needs to remove this notion from his head that he is somehow building a platform for the team by tuk tuking. Theres no time in T20 for this style of cricket, its a game where even a run a ball is simply not good enough.


( him in test and odi though )

[James]

Misbah-ul-Haq is not overrated. The thing is, nobody really rates Misbah's batting that highly - aside from the band of strange cheerleaders that he has accumulated. And who pays attention to them?

Misbah has always been but a decent cricketer. A decent batsman, decent fielder and decent captain. That is what he is. This has been well documented over the course of his career. He is a modest fellow and would probably be the first to tell you the same.

Misbah's elevation to the captaincy then should have been no reason to consider him the best thing since sliced bread. It also should have been no reason for the emergence of an opposing hateful movement.

Misbah is a decent cricketer and people should not expect great things from him. He is very occasionaly wonderful, and in between he is solid, while sometimes failing also. Like I said. A decent cricketer.

Misbah-ul-Haq will go down as a successful Pakistan test captain, who won games because he played some important knocks and had a legendary spinner at his disposal.

Childish adulation and extreme criticism of such a cricketer are thus equally ignorant positions to take.

[iZeeshan]

Originally Posted by MR__KHAN__JI You may have a point with Misbah and age. I would still give him the benefit of the doubt for this world cup.

Maybe only because there's no one fitting enough to replace him but you gotta admit he is killing us with his approach in chasing.

Maybe if he bats higher up the order otherwise he really needs to go. Hafeez for T20 captain.

[MR__KHAN__JI]

Originally Posted by iZeeshan Maybe only because there's no one fitting enough to replace him but you gotta admit he is killing us with his approach in chasing. Maybe if he bats higher up the order otherwise he really needs to go. Hafeez for T20 captain.

The tuk tuk is bad... And needs to improve. (probably can't improve now)

But his overall game is still superior than many many others.

On balance he is worth more being in the side despite his obvious shortcoming.

I would also go so far as to say that NO ONE in the Pak side can hit a bigger 6 than Misbah.

[MR__KHAN__JI]

Hafeez is not captaincy material.

He is an ideal vice captain.

He overthinks.

[BoomBoomCricket]

Originally Posted by James Misbah-ul-Haq is not overrated. The thing is, nobody really rates Misbah's batting that highly - aside from the band of strange cheerleaders that he has accumulated. And who pays attention to them? Misbah has always been but a decent cricketer. A decent batsman, decent fielder and decent captain. That is what he is. This has been well documented over the course of his career. He is a modest fellow and would probably be the first to tell you the same. Misbah's elevation to the captaincy then should have been no reason to consider him the best thing since sliced bread. It also should have been no reason for the emergence of an opposing hateful movement. Misbah is a decent cricketer and people should not expect great things from him. He is very occasionaly wonderful, and in between he is solid, while sometimes failing also. Like I said. A decent cricketer. Misbah-ul-Haq will go down as a successful Pakistan test captain, who won games because he played some important knocks and had a legendary spinner at his disposal. Childish adulation and extreme criticism of such a cricketer are thus equally ignorant positions to take.

Who he identified, spotted & recommended

[MR__KHAN__JI]

Originally Posted by DeadlyVenom Misbah needs to be told that for this world cup he needs to step it up a gear. He does not currently look like a T20 player and is definitely not playing according to the situation in T20 cricket. Dav Whatmore needs to sit him down and ask him seriously is he up to playing T20 or just being stubborn so that he can hold onto the captaincy. His last few t20 performances have been substandard and someone needs to remove this notion from his head that he is somehow building a platform for the team by tuk tuking. Theres no time in T20 for this style of cricket, its a game where even a run a ball is simply not good enough. ( him in test and odi though )

Agree with most of that.

His last few T20s have been bad... but I would blame the pressure he is being put under. He does need to improve.

But still - he has a decent strike rate and can hit big big sixes.

He is worth more in the side than out.

You need 2 solid players that its really difficult to get out... he is the ideal candidate for one of the spots.

[iZeeshan]

Originally Posted by MR__KHAN__JI Hafeez is not captaincy material. He is an ideal vice captain. He overthinks.

What gives you that conclusion? In my opinion he's shown that he has had really good cricketing sense and certainly knows what he's doing out there when fielding/bowling. Not to mention, I'm sure he's learned from Misbah.

And lol Misbah improve. The guys 38, he's stubborn and he's not going to change his ways. Asad Shafiq does the same job as him but better. 20 overs are too short to have a player like Misbah carefully plan out every move. He plays out 4 dot balls that can change the whole complexion of the game. What's worse is that he goes in with a pre-determined mindset and goes for premeditated tuks or shots that eventually get him out. That kind of mentality is horrible for the team and puts immense pressure on the other batsmen. I don't care how big of a six he can hit, he barely hits them anymore.

[MR__KHAN__JI]

Originally Posted by James Misbah-ul-Haq is not overrated. The thing is, nobody really rates Misbah's batting that highly - aside from the band of strange cheerleaders that he has accumulated. And who pays attention to them? Misbah has always been but a decent cricketer. A decent batsman, decent fielder and decent captain. That is what he is. This has been well documented over the course of his career. He is a modest fellow and would probably be the first to tell you the same. Misbah's elevation to the captaincy then should have been no reason to consider him the best thing since sliced bread. It also should have been no reason for the emergence of an opposing hateful movement. Misbah is a decent cricketer and people should not expect great things from him. He is very occasionaly wonderful, and in between he is solid, while sometimes failing also. Like I said. A decent cricketer. Misbah-ul-Haq will go down as a successful Pakistan test captain, who won games because he played some important knocks and had a legendary spinner at his disposal. Childish adulation and extreme criticism of such a cricketer are thus equally ignorant positions to take.

Not too much wrong with this post...

As a cricketer he is good - nothing more.

I would rate the influence he has had on the team higher than you do though...... As a captain he is immense (Pakistani standards)

He has a brain - something that the Pakistan team as a colective lacks. This means the positive influence is worth even more than in a team that has plenty of cricketing nous.


Trust me - I watch Pakistani cricket very closely.

PS: Not sure if you classify me as one of the strange band of cheerleaders.... lol. I hope not!

[iZeeshan]

Originally Posted by James Misbah-ul-Haq is not overrated. The thing is, nobody really rates Misbah's batting that highly - aside from the band of strange cheerleaders that he has accumulated. And who pays attention to them? Misbah has always been but a decent cricketer. A decent batsman, decent fielder and decent captain. That is what he is. This has been well documented over the course of his career. He is a modest fellow and would probably be the first to tell you the same. Misbah's elevation to the captaincy then should have been no reason to consider him the best thing since sliced bread. It also should have been no reason for the emergence of an opposing hateful movement. Misbah is a decent cricketer and people should not expect great things from him. He is very occasionaly wonderful, and in between he is solid, while sometimes failing also. Like I said. A decent cricketer. Misbah-ul-Haq will go down as a successful Pakistan test captain, who won games because he played some important knocks and had a legendary spinner at his disposal. Childish adulation and extreme criticism of such a cricketer are thus equally ignorant positions to take.

I agree.

So in your opinion, which formats should Misbah be playing?

[MR__KHAN__JI]

Originally Posted by iZeeshan What gives you that conclusion? In my opinion he's shown that he has had really good cricketing sense and certainly knows what he's doing out there when fielding/bowling. Not to mention, I'm sure he's learned from Misbah. And lol Misbah improve. The guys 38, he's stubborn and he's not going to change his ways. Asad Shafiq does the same job as him but better. 20 overs are too short to have a player like Misbah carefully plan out every move. He plays out 4 dot balls that can change the whole complexion of the game. What's worse is that he goes in with a pre-determined mindset and goes for premeditated tuks or shots that eventually get him out. That kind of mentality is horrible for the team and puts immense pressure on the other batsmen. I don't care how big of a six he can hit, he barely hits them anymore.

1) He is called the professor for a reason (good cricket knowledge)
2) He is an introvert
3) He doesnt come across as a leader
4) He always looks lost as a batsman - a slave to the situation rather than creating a situation
5) His decision making whilst batting is awful.


He has a cricket brain - he just isnt a leader. Thats why he is the perfect vice-captain.

Some one who can give lots of useful advice - but cant make decisions.

[iZeeshan]

Originally Posted by MR__KHAN__JI Agree with most of that. His last few T20s have been bad... but I would blame the pressure he is being put under. He does need to improve. But still - he has a decent strike rate and can hit big big sixes. He is worth more in the side than out. You need 2 solid players that its really difficult to get out... he is the ideal candidate for one of the spots.

Also please name a team that has 2 of these so called solid players in their T20 team? Maybe even one solid player? Any of them have a player like Misbah? Nope.

[MR__KHAN__JI]

Originally Posted by iZeeshan And lol Misbah improve. The guys 38, he's stubborn and he's not going to change his ways. Asad Shafiq does the same job as him but better. 20 overs are too short to have a player like Misbah carefully plan out every move. He plays out 4 dot balls that can change the whole complexion of the game. What's worse is that he goes in with a pre-determined mindset and goes for premeditated tuks or shots that eventually get him out. That kind of mentality is horrible for the team and puts immense pressure on the other batsmen. I don't care how big of a six he can hit, he barely hits them anymore.

Asad do a better job? He needs to learn to do a job... before he can do a better job.

The weaknesses you highlight for Misbah are there and always have been - yet he has been a very successful T20 player. I see no reason why he cant hit big sixes any-more.

[iZeeshan]

Originally Posted by MR__KHAN__JI 1) He is called the professor for a reason (good cricket knowledge) 2) He is an introvert 3) He doesnt come across as a leader 4) He always looks lost as a batsman - a slave to the situation rather than creating a situation 5) His decision making whilst batting is awful. He has a cricket brain - he just isnt a leader. Thats why he is the perfect vice-captain. Some one who can give lots of useful advice - but cant make decisions.

I completely disagree with your first 3 points. There's no way, neither me nor you can tell what goes on in Hafeez's mind. In my opinion he can lead us in T20s where he's fixed into the side. His batting hasn't been remarkable but more often then not he's gotten us off to a good start.

[iZeeshan]

Originally Posted by MR__KHAN__JI Asad do a better job? He needs to learn to do a job... before he can do a better job. The weaknesses you highlight for Misbah are there and always have been - yet he has been a very successful T20 player. I see no reason why he cant hit big sixes any-more.

I disagree again! They have not always been there! In the 07 world cup he was not THIS stubborn in his approach and lack of rotating strike! And it's so clear that he can't hit the big sixes. More ofen then not, he goes for them now at the end of the innings when he's under pressure and it's a swing and a miss. Or he tries to play some cheeky shot because he can't hit the big six and get out. Useless.

[MR__KHAN__JI]

Originally Posted by iZeeshan Also please name a team that has 2 of these so called solid players in their T20 team? Maybe even one solid player? Any of them have a player like Misbah? Nope.

I have highlighted comparable players...

MisbahT20.JPG

Dont get me wrong - I have never said Misbah is GREAT..... just that he is extremely valuable in a team full of high risk batsmen.

[MR__KHAN__JI]

Originally Posted by iZeeshan I completely disagree with your first 3 points. There's no way, neither me nor you can tell what goes on in Hafeez's mind. In my opinion he can lead us in T20s where he's fixed into the side. His batting hasn't been remarkable but more often then not he's gotten us off to a good start.

This is something that neither of us can prove (its a judgement based on what we see)

we will just have to wait and see when he does become captain. He will be the next captain.

[iZeeshan]

You just shot yourself in the foot right there. They all bat in the top 4! If Misbah wants to bat at 3 fine, let him, we can use his captaincy, although I'm really not comfortable with him being there as he'll just decrease our potential score by 15-20 runs.

[MR__KHAN__JI]

Originally Posted by iZeeshan I disagree again! They have not always been there! In the 07 world cup he was not THIS stubborn in his approach and lack of rotating strike! And it's so clear that he can't hit the big sixes. More ofen then not, he goes for them now at the end of the innings when he's under pressure and it's a swing and a miss. Or he tries to play some cheeky shot because he can't hit the big six and get out. Useless.

He has always been tuk tuk Misbah. He was in better form in 2007 than recently. He is out of form - definitely. (But you know what I say about form.....)

He has always played cheeky (stupidly) shots - 2007 final...

[iZeeshan]

Originally Posted by MR__KHAN__JI This is something that neither of us can prove (its a judgement based on what we see) we will just have to wait and see when he does become captain. He will be the next captain.

Yup I agree. That is what I was trying to say.

[MR__KHAN__JI]

Originally Posted by iZeeshan You just shot yourself in the foot right there. They all bat in the top 4! If Misbah wants to bat at 3 fine, let him, we can use his captaincy, although I'm really not comfortable with him being there as he'll just decrease our potential score by 15-20 runs.

I am less fussed about position than I am about his place in the XI.

Our score will be 40-50 runs less if he is not there... we will collapse like a heap.

I am happy to lose 10-15 to bring solidity.

[MR__KHAN__JI]

Originally Posted by iZeeshan Yup I agree. That is what I was trying to say.

I am right though...

[iZeeshan]

Originally Posted by MR__KHAN__JI He has always been tuk tuk Misbah. He was in better form in 2007 than recently. He is out of form - definitely. (But you know what I say about form.....) He has always played cheeky (stupidly) shots - 2007 final...

I don't think thats the case but regardless, he can no longer make up for his tuk tukking with the big hits do that makes him...useless.

[iZeeshan]

Originally Posted by MR__KHAN__JI I am less fussed about position than I am about his place in the XI. Our score will be 40-50 runs less if he is not there... we will collapse like a heap. I am happy to lose 10-15 to bring solidity.

In T20? No way! Our batting will either fire or it won't. 15-20 is a HUGE deal in T20 cricket. Literally makes or breaks a win.

Even when we did collapse when Misbah was there, what could he have done? Yes the first T20 is a good example but don't forget Malik was his partner and he couldn't have done it without Malik rotating the strike and hitting lucky boundaries.

[iZeeshan]

I should also mention that a player has to have his merit in the side FIRST, then comes captaincy - not the other way around and IMO Hafeez is much more worthy of a spot than Misbah.

[MR__KHAN__JI]

Originally Posted by iZeeshan In T20? No way! Our batting will either fire or it won't. 15-20 is a HUGE deal in T20 cricket. Literally makes or breaks a win. Even when we did collapse when Misbah was there, what could he have done? Yes the first T20 is a good example but don't forget Malik was his partner and he couldn't have done it without Malik rotating the strike and hitting lucky boundaries.

Agree less so in T20.... but I am convinced we would regularly collapse.

Pakistan have played 39 matches with Misbah. Winning 25. W/L 1.92.

Pakistan have played 14 matches without Misbah. Winning 7. W/L 1.0.


We win nearly twice as many games with Misbah than without him.

[James]

Originally Posted by MR__KHAN__JI Not too much wrong with this post... As a cricketer he is good - nothing more. I would rate the influence he has had on the team higher than you do though...... As a captain he is immense (Pakistani standards) He has a brain - something that the Pakistan team as a colective lacks. This means the positive influence is worth even more than in a team that has plenty of cricketing nous. Trust me - I watch Pakistani cricket very closely. PS: Not sure if you classify me as one of the strange band of cheerleaders.... lol. I hope not!

I watch Pakistan cricket very closely too my friend.

Misbah has a calming influence and is also very intelligent.

But my argument would be that you need class bowlers to ascend the rankings. Ajmal and Rehman are the main reason for Pakistan beating England and Sri Lanka. Anyone could have set fields for them in that sort of form.

We both approach the issue objectively but just differ slightly in opinion. So no you are not in the cheerleading band. It is obvious from this thread and others who belong to it

Originally Posted by iZeeshan I agree. So in your opinion, which formats should Misbah be playing?

Test and ODI as captain. He should retire from T20s after the upcoming World Cup and give somebody else a go. Remember that Misbah is not young.

There has to be a potential replacement lined up for Misbah in the major formats, and T20 is a good arena in which to blood one. England are doing this with Stuart Broad, just to give an example. He has matured a lot as a cricketer since.

[iZeeshan]

Originally Posted by MR__KHAN__JI Agree less so in T20.... but I am convinced we would regularly collapse. Pakistan have played 39 matches with Misbah. Winning 25. W/L 1.92. Pakistan have played 14 matches without Misbah. Winning 7. W/L 1.0. We win nearly twice as many games with Misbah than without him.

Recently, we are not only losing with him but because of him. His approach in the 2nd and 3rd t20s were all the proof I needed to get him kicked out.

Maybe he was out of form, but if he plays the next series then he's gotta play the WC too because then it will be too soon to change.

[MR__KHAN__JI]

Originally Posted by MR__KHAN__JI Agree less so in T20.... but I am convinced we would regularly collapse. Pakistan have played 39 matches with Misbah. Winning 25. W/L 1.92. Pakistan have played 14 matches without Misbah. Winning 7. W/L 1.0. We win nearly twice as many games with Misbah than without him.

Since 10 Oct 2007 (Misbahs comeback)

In ODI - We have played 86 matches with Misbah. Winning 57. W/L 2.03.

We have played 24 matches without Misbah. Winning 6. W/L 0.25.

We are 8 times more likely to win with Misbah in the team than outside.

[iZeeshan]

Originally Posted by James I watch Pakistan cricket very closely too my friend. Misbah has a calming influence and is also very intelligent. But my argument would be that you need class bowlers to ascend the rankings. Ajmal and Rehman are the main reason for Pakistan beating England and Sri Lanka. Anyone could have set fields for them in that sort of form. We both approach the issue objectively but just differ slightly in opinion. So no you are not in the cheerleading band. It is obvious from this thread and others who belong to it Test and ODI as captain. He should retire from T20s after the upcoming World Cup and give somebody else a go. Remember that Misbah is not young. There has to be a potential replacement lined up for Misbah in the major formats, and T20 is a good arena in which to blood one. England are doing this with Stuart Broad, just to give an example. He has matured a lot as a cricketer since.

You would actually have him playing the T20 Wc? even after the games he lost us against England?

And yeah I guess I'm okay with him playing ODIs but PCB has to be proactive and find a replacement fast because I can't stand him in the ODI set up much longer considering he is only there because there's no one better, not because he's a phenomenal player.

[MR__KHAN__JI]

Originally Posted by James I watch Pakistan cricket very closely too my friend. Misbah has a calming influence and is also very intelligent. But my argument would be that you need class bowlers to ascend the rankings. Ajmal and Rehman are the main reason for Pakistan beating England and Sri Lanka. Anyone could have set fields for them in that sort of form. We both approach the issue objectively but just differ slightly in opinion. So no you are not in the cheerleading band. It is obvious from this thread and others who belong to it Test and ODI as captain. He should retire from T20s after the upcoming World Cup and give somebody else a go. Remember that Misbah is not young. There has to be a potential replacement lined up for Misbah in the major formats, and T20 is a good arena in which to blood one. England are doing this with Stuart Broad, just to give an example. He has matured a lot as a cricketer since.

I am glad you watch closely... its never a boring moment.

You need class bowlers AND good captaincy.

Our team is playing WELL ABOVE its individuals capabilities... that is a sign of a good captain. Especially our batsmen.

I disagree with the "anyone could set fields"...... the field settings has been a refreshing change since Misbah has been in the think tank.

I have spent years watching Pakistan with the oddest field placings... and when I mean odd I mean amateurish levels.

I agree that Misbah should retire from T20 after this world cup.

I personally would make Umar Akmal captain and Hafeez vice captain. I can see the captaincy having apositive influence on Umar Akmal like it did Ricky Ponting. It might be a little early - as in an ideal world I would wait a year - but there is no-one else I see as a leader.

Hafeez is a follower not a leader. He is a thinker (thinking about all eventualities) not a decision maker.

[MR__KHAN__JI]

Originally Posted by iZeeshan Recently, we are not only losing with him but because of him. His approach in the 2nd and 3rd t20s were all the proof I needed to get him kicked out. Maybe he was out of form, but if he plays the next series then he's gotta play the WC too because then it will be too soon to change.

like I keep saying... a couple of games is not enough to draw such big conclusions.

[James]

Originally Posted by iZeeshan You would actually have him playing the T20 Wc? even after the games he lost us against England? And yeah I guess I'm okay with him playing ODIs but PCB has to be proactive and find a replacement fast because I can't stand him in the ODI set up much longer considering he is only there because there's no one better, not because he's a phenomenal player.

I don't believe that Pakistan are playing many/any T20s before the World Cup. Changing captain now would be illogical - it might be crazy enough to work, but in all likelihood it would go very wrong.

And as nobody else is fit to do the test and ODI job, Misbah should step aside in T20s after the World Cup. His long-term replacement can learn the ropes in T20s.

[MR__KHAN__JI]

Here is another interesting stat. (Bearing in mind that Misbah and Umar AKmal are the most abused players on PP)

In ODIs.

We have played 41 games when BOTH have played together. We have won 29 and lost 11. W/L 2.63.

In the 38 games where only one or the other or neither have played. We have won 12 and lost 28. A W/L of 0.43.

YOU draw the conclusions!!!!

[Wassixpakistani]

Well , the decision is sensible and I support it but what I am unsettled about is that.... what will be our T20 squad ? because the selection is the only dilemma I see , we need some good and sensible power hitters to go along with good fast bowling options .

If that problem ain't solved soon , we might as well prepare ourselves for some blushes in September .

[BoomBoomCricket]

We have beaten Sri Lanka in all 3 formats

We have whitewashed England in a test series

We have won the Asia Cup

Yet we want to change the captain?

#onlyinPakistanfans

[style_guru]

Good intention by Misbah. I hope he remains the Kuptaan for another 2-3 years in all formats.

[cricketindiafan]

He doesn't get as much praise as he should be getting. To pull a team out of absolute abyss after the 2010 saga takes a lot of courage, intelligence and brilliant cricketing brain. Go back to the 2008-2010 period before Misbah took over to realise the kind of influence Misbah has had on the Pakistan team, especially in longer format.

Having said that, he should not be in the t20 team let alone be the captain. Perhaps, he wants to have a go at the world t20 title (closest to a WC he will lead his side in) before bidding good bye to t20s and ODIs.

[shahrukh619]

Originally Posted by BoomBoomCricket Won 3-2 vs New Zealand (WC semi finalists) leading run getter World Cup Semi Finalists (first time in 12 years) leading run getter Won 3-2 vs West Indies (3 straight wins) averaged 92 Won 2-0 vs Ireland (as captain) Won 3-0 vs Zimbabwe (as captain) averaged 83 Won 4-1 vs Sri Lanka (captain) 66 in one of the ODIs Won 3-0 vs Bangladesh (as captain) averaged 50 Lost 4-0 vs England (most runs though) Won Asia Cup (as captain) averaged 50 stop the blind hate face the facts

+1, he had the highest batting avg in the England series amongest Pakistani batsmen.

Currently the best Pakistani Batsmen!

[Bilal7]

Misbah played a fine match-winning knock of 47* against Sri Lanka so it shows that he is quite capable of the T20 format.