I'm proud

[Slugger]

With a batting lineup that should be clueless in the English conditions and a bowling attack fit for an amateur side, Pakistan is still giving England a tough fight at home.

Shoaib Akhtar (Injured) - The spearhead of Pakistani bowling since Wasim and Waqar left. Sort of unexpectedly fell into the role and has done well.

Shabbir Ahmad (Banned) - The fastest ever Pakistani bowler to get 50 wickets and the best wicket taker for pakistan up until his ban.

Rana Naveed (Injured) - The main swing bowler for Pakistan. Ran through sides during the India tour but since then has suffered from injuries and fitness issues.

Muhammad Asif (Injured) - What do you want me to say have a look at the best test bowling averages of 2006. A serious blow not having him.


http://usa.cricinfo.com/db/STATS/BY_..._AVS_2006.html
2006 Calendar Year Test Best Bowling Averages


Based on all matches up to and including
Test # 1809: England v Pakistan at Lord's, 1st Test, 13/07/2006


Name Mat O M R W Ave Best 5 10 SR Econ Team

AG Prince 7 2 0 2 1 2.00 1-2 - - 12.0 1.00 RSA
JN Gillespie 2 43 13 90 8 11.25 3-11 - - 32.2 2.09 AUS
JM Anderson 1 31.1 10 79 6 13.16 4-40 - - 31.1 2.53 ENG
SD Udal 1 25.2 5 67 5 13.40 4-14 - - 30.4 2.64 ENG
Mohammad Asif 4 139.1 30 412 25 16.48 6-44 2 1 33.4 2.96 PAK

Shoaib Malik - A world class allrounder. Bowling, batting and fielding. The highest ranking odi bowling average for 2006 for Pakistan.

With injuries left and right Pakistan has still not surrendered and they are still making the best of a dismal situation.

[khanpuria]

agree, if we lose, we lose

its sport, it happens

people must realise we literally have no firepower (exception of danish and actually afridi)

[cavin420]

great thread sluggz....and spot on, at the end of the day, you win some , you lose some along the way, no big deal only a sport!

[Abdul Qadir 236]

u loose some?

[Billy]

Originally Posted by Slugger Shabbir Ahmad (Banned) - The fastest ever Pakistani bowler to get 50 wickets and the best wicket taker for pakistan up until his ban.

Hmmm...

[Usman Chadda]

Originally Posted by Billy Hmmm...

Eh?

[Abdul Qadir 236]

and here is me thinking Pakistan wouldnt do an England and start bringing up the injuries!
so much for the depth Pakistan are meant to have! Pakistan whoever they have really should be winning this series. time will tell.

[mooz]

Pakistan isn't really giving england a tough time in this test match so far, though hopefully we can still turn things around tomorrow am.

And England has had a score of injuries themselves, including their captain(vaughn) and their contingency captain(flintoff).

[PlanetPakistan]

well let's be fair
ENG are also missing quite a lot of decent players too

1- Flintoff: The best all rounder in the world and arguably the best player in the world!

2- Jones: Very destructive fast bowler who completely embarrassed the Aussies at OT and TB.

3- Vaughan*: The best captain in the world! Took a fairly average team and led them to 6 series wins in a row.

4- Giles: Not much of a factor!

5- Anderson/Plunkett: Anderson especially was shaping up very nicely before his injury!

So it seems to me that ENG are not far behind on the list of "casualties"!

[Muzy]

sometimes in sport even the best team needs to loose a game once in a while to find out their weaknesses, things to improve on, i know pakistan don't have the best XI players in the team at present but this is a good way of looking at which areas need improving on for the preperations leading upto the world cup...

[Billy]

Originally Posted by UsmanCHADDA Eh?

It seems that Shabbir didn't really bowl with a legal action for most of his career. Certainly in his last test against England he was only effective when he started chucking again. I wouldn't look at his absence as any real loss, nor would I imagine him coming straight back into the international reckoning when his ban does end.

[Oxy]

I back my team always 100% - but I'm not proud of the way they performed so far.

We cannot use injuries as an excuse as we accused Eng fans of doing that (before Asif/Malik/Rana/Shoaib/ cried off sick).

So - back them to the hilt - and then slap them when the games over.

[PlanetPakistan]

I reckon the problem is that ENG's bench players have really performed amazingly well while Pakistanis have been well below par!

[Saj]

So far in this test the only people the Pakistan team have given a tough time to are the Pakistani fans.

Lets be realistic here, so far in the 2 days at Old Trafford they have been rubbish, embarassing and way below the standard expected - however there are still 3 days left in this test and 2 more tests left yet

[Slugger]

you can't be serious about comparing pak injuries to eng injuries they're only missing vaughan and flintoff

jones hasn't played since the ashes... you can't call a hiatus an injury

[Abdul Qadir 236]

injuries as far as im concerned dont come into it at all.

[Billy]

Originally Posted by Slugger you can't be serious about comparing pak injuries to eng injuries they're only missing vaughan and flintoff jones hasn't played since the ashes... you can't call a hiatus an injury

Are you serious?

[Oxy]

Originally Posted by Slugger you can't be serious about comparing pak injuries to eng injuries they're only missing vaughan and flintoff jones hasn't played since the ashes... you can't call a hiatus an injury

Befor e this series started, Pak fans MOCKED Eng - we said 'hahaha lets see what excuses Fletcher comes up with this time when we whip their butts 4-0'; we said ' those English cant use injuries as an excuse when we crush them 9-0 in all the games' etc etc etc.

And then Shoaib Akhtar pulled out....and then Rana injured himself (We blamed Sussex)...then Asif went home (Derbyshire over-bowling him of course)....then Malik caught the next PIA flight out of UK - 'he's crap' we said 'He cant bat'....

So Pak then take on Eng - YIPPEEE - Captain Marvel is OUT (Vaughan)....then on the eve of the 1st test, YIPPEE (II) - Captain Fantastic is OUT (FLINTOFF).

Game, set and MATCH to Pakistan we said!

And now here we are today..................

[Oxy]

My point - Pak have been decimated by injuries - but we cant use that as an excuse. Worse, we've been DEMORALISED by a Eng team without half their Ashes (Yes those ***** Ashes) team from last year.

[naddo]

Injuries are no excuse. The simple truth is that we batted terribly in the first innings and are paying the consequences. Still, there are 2 games to go so no need to get overly despondant.

[ex-opener]

Originally Posted by Saj So far in this test the only people the Pakistan team have given a tough time to are the Pakistani fans. Lets be realistic here, so far in the 2 days at Old Trafford they have been rubbish, embarassing and way below the standard expected - however there are still 3 days left in this test and 2 more tests left yet

totally agree with you saj bhai

after the first two days my heart has been in my mouth at the disappointing way this test match has gone so far

how ever there are still three days remaining and we dont give up with out a fight. DO WE???? So let the battle begin.!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

as at lords we failed to perform adequately in the early stages of the match but came good in the second innings

[ex-opener]

Originally Posted by naddo Injuries are no excuse. The simple truth is that we batted terribly in the first innings and are paying the consequences. Still, there are 2 games to go so no need to get overly despondant.

dont give up we havent lost yet

granted we are not in a ideal position but stay optimistic the boys will inshallah perform

[mlegha1]

Nice excuse thread...Once you put your 11 people on the ground thats it...there will always be What ifs and what nots...

[Billy]

I don't think Pakistan should be afraid of pointing to injuries as the cause of some of their problems. It sounds bad when anyone uses such things as excuses but I think it's fair enough to at least assert that injuries did leave Pakistan in a less than ideal position.

[Oxy]

Originally Posted by Billy I don't think Pakistan should be afraid of pointing to injuries as the cause of some of their problems. It sounds bad when anyone uses such things as excuses but I think it's fair enough to at least assert that injuries did leave Pakistan in a less than ideal position.

Now that HURT...

[Psyduck]

Both teams are missing key players so I don't think either sets of fans can use that as an excuse. Thus far in the series England's players have performed better but I expect Pakistan will come back strongly starting tomorrow. Possibly...

[invincible]

Agree with most of the above posts ... injuries cannot be used as excuses (especially for this test) ... apart from shoaib malik, pakistan has a fit batting team with yk back and yousaf, younis and inzi in the form of their lives ... yet they put up a bad performance and are 119 all out ... if at all anything is to be said - just say a bad day and walk off ...

[iZeeshan]

You take the best 3 bowlers out of any team, and thy will struggle ahell of a lot more then Pkistan did.

[Amir]

Originally Posted by Billy I don't think Pakistan should be afraid of pointing to injuries as the cause of some of their problems. It sounds bad when anyone uses such things as excuses but I think it's fair enough to at least assert that injuries did leave Pakistan in a less than ideal position.

No our best players left us in that position. It wasn't that the bowling failed us(Well it didn't do well....ok it sucked but they were under pressure at all times).

Like invincible said, our best players are in top form and they threw it away. Our batting line is somewhat fine, however bad days happen. Plus why blame injures? England played better than us period.

[umarbeast]

Expect the unexpected tommorrow. Believe me either we will lose by a big margin or win by a big margin.

[PlanetPakistan]

Originally Posted by umarbeast Expect the unexpected tommorrow. Believe me either we will lose by a big margin or win by a big margin.

ahh now that will be one for the ages!

[Slugger]

this isn't an excuse thread

the FACT is we've lost the meat of our team and we're making due with temps!

we drew in Lords and that too without pak support!

you can't use injuries as an excuse when it's one or two players but when due to injuries the Miami Heat become the Atlanta Hawks then what happens? We're a completely depleted side

[sporticus]

Originally Posted by Slugger this isn't an excuse thread the FACT is we've lost the meat of our team and we're making due with temps! we drew in Lords and that too without pak support! you can't use injuries as an excuse when it's one or two players but when due to injuries the Miami Heat become the Atlanta Hawks then what happens? We're a completely depleted side

Just wondered if you thought England were at full strength or even more depleted than Pakistan

[Awesome Anjum]

Quit feeling sorry for yourselves. Pakistan have been nothing short of pathetic over these past two days.

[Billy]

Originally Posted by Slugger this isn't an excuse thread the FACT is we've lost the meat of our team and we're making due with temps! we drew in Lords and that too without pak support! you can't use injuries as an excuse when it's one or two players but when due to injuries the Miami Heat become the Atlanta Hawks then what happens? We're a completely depleted side

What about when it's 6?

[Blistering Barnacle]

Originally Posted by AmitMishra bowls wrongun and here is me thinking Pakistan wouldnt do an England and start bringing up the injuries! so much for the depth Pakistan are meant to have! Pakistan whoever they have really should be winning this series. time will tell.

Depth? Come on. Leaving aside Shabbir, Pakistan have 3 of their best bowlers out with injuries.

That is a huge blow for any team.

Pak can fill in 1-2 spots with their depth and not hurt too much, but trying to fill 3 spots is a big ask!

It's no excuse, but ask yourself which team is more disadvantaged by the injuries?

[crico]

both teams are missing key players so both are same condition.
by saying key players are missing is not a god one
we failed only in batting ,our batsman are not injured.

[Nauman]

Originally Posted by crico both teams are missing key players so both are same condition. by saying key players are missing is not a god one we failed only in batting ,our batsman are not injured.

England still have their 3 front line bowlers with them as compared to Pakistan who has only 1 front line bowler (who makes it to first 11).

[Billy]

Originally Posted by Nauman England still have their 3 front line bowlers with them as compared to Pakistan who has only 1 front line bowler (who makes it to first 11).

England have Harmison and Hoggard, that's two of their first choice attack.

They are however missing..

Captain and top batsman.
Vice-Captain, top bowler and top batsman.
Top Bowler.
First choice reserve bowler.
Second choice reserve bowler.
First choice spinner.

[KB]

The big difference is, England have two of its frontline bowlers available and Pakistan have none of their first 3 at their disposal.

Generally harder to replace good bowlers than good batsman.

That said, you just have to get on with it. Some things in life you just cannot change. No point complaining, and the Pakistan team have not whinged about it.

It is an opportunity for others and to build reserves.

[BAADSHAH]

Originally Posted by Slugger With a batting lineup that should be clueless in the English conditions and a bowling attack fit for an amateur side

Why should our batting line-up be clueless?!??!
Inzi for one has played all over the world, and in England numerous times
Razzaqs played county cricket here
Moyo has experience of England, as does Younis Khan - so why should they be clueless

So to use that as an excuse is a bit pathetic

Our batting line-up is almost as strong as it could be.

We are suffering in the bowling department because of injuries - but why should we whinge..........THAT'S WHAT ENGLAND DO!!!!!

play with the cards we have been dealt!

[Easa]

Pakistan have to deal with Harmison and Hoggard.

England have to deal with Sami and Gul.

England are missing three good players ~ SP Jones, Freddie Flintoff, and Michael Vaughan.

Giles is missing but Panesar is a much better bowler than him and Anderson is a reserve bowler who was not going to figure in this series unless there was an injury.

[invincible]

Originally Posted by Easa Pakistan have to deal with Harmison and Hoggard. England have to deal with Sami and Gul. England are missing three good players ~ SP Jones, Freddie Flintoff, and Michael Vaughan. Giles is missing but Panesar is a much better bowler than him and Anderson is a reserve bowler who was not going to figure in this series unless there was an injury.

harmison and hoggard have to deal with world class players (atleast according to you all) - YK, Yousaf, Inzi ...

Kaneria was supposed to make all the english batsmen his bunnies ... Afridi was as good a bowler as anyone ...

to a neutral person - all these posts seem excuses mate just like the english "whinging" was misinterpreted by you all ... it always backfires you see ...

[Oxy]

Originally Posted by invincible to a neutral person - all these posts seem excuses mate just like the english "whinging" was misinterpreted by you all ... it always backfires you see ...

We deserve it - these things always have a nasty habit of coming round and biting you on the backside!

[the Great Khan]

i would refrain from blaming things totally on injuries..ok so we have major guys out..but all our batsmen were still there..and they couldnt even make 200??...if we had made even 280 or 300 we would have been in this game...but alas it was not meant to be...i know harmi is a good bowler but the way our batsmen just succumbed was dissapointing..we need to attack bowlers like him..also i think we will eventually get the hang of monty but again he has runs to play with and can experiment..no pressure..best thing for a spinner!!...yes our bowlers are out but what could even they have done if the team had still been bowled out for 119??

[Dhondy]

This is to be expected of course.

If Pakistan were winning, it would be despite the injuries. If they lose, it's because of injuries.

England are without their talismanic captain Vaughan and Simon Jones, whose injury record rivals Shoaib's.

But Flintoff's loss was the most devastating. He is the best player in the world right now, and completely irreplaceable.

[Big Daddy]

Injuries or no injuries, Pakistan or for that matter, no team is never good enough to win everything that comes there way. There will be some meek surrenders, there will be some hard faught battles. Some times the result comes your way and some times it doesnt. Thats just the way it is. Take it or leave it.

[pacman]

Nice post slugger. I am also proud of Team Pakistan. Have we ever been undefeated for so long as this time?

I am not all that dishearted if we loose, as this is a 4 test match series. It will be our first defeat in over a year. Pakistan are known to be poor starters and get better as tours go on. Pakistan have seen all this before, and can come back hard. We will know how they fare in the next match. Would be great if its 1-1 going into the 4th and final test.

As for England, well played. No excuses. They played better cricket in this game, and that is what its all about.

[MMA]

ok the bowling attack is weak but the batting should be better

[Kamranz]

I am proud we lost! I hate draws they dont make you a good fighter!

[Oxy]

Originally Posted by Kamranz I am proud we lost! I hate draws they dont make you a good fighter!

Wise words

[invincible]

Originally Posted by Oxy™ Wise words

may be he meant -

"The higher you go, the harder you fall and the harder you fall, the higher you bounce."

[James]

Lol, the shoe is on the other foot and it's as amusing as ever. Shame some Pak fans aren't as honest and humble as Oxy is.

[Uzzy]

Congrats Whippy, we deserved to lose this as we played spineless cricket.

[James]

Thanks, one of our most dominant performances for a long time.

[HAFRIDI]

just back em lads, we will be back, were always slow starters

[Fessal]

Originally Posted by Slugger With a batting lineup that should be clueless in the English conditions and a bowling attack fit for an amateur side, Pakistan is still giving England a tough fight at home. Shoaib Akhtar (Injured) - The spearhead of Pakistani bowling since Wasim and Waqar left. Sort of unexpectedly fell into the role and has done well. Shabbir Ahmad (Banned) - The fastest ever Pakistani bowler to get 50 wickets and the best wicket taker for pakistan up until his ban. Rana Naveed (Injured) - The main swing bowler for Pakistan. Ran through sides during the India tour but since then has suffered from injuries and fitness issues. Muhammad Asif (Injured) - What do you want me to say have a look at the best test bowling averages of 2006. A serious blow not having him. http://usa.cricinfo.com/db/STATS/BY_..._AVS_2006.html 2006 Calendar Year Test Best Bowling Averages Based on all matches up to and including Test # 1809: England v Pakistan at Lord's, 1st Test, 13/07/2006 Name Mat O M R W Ave Best 5 10 SR Econ Team AG Prince 7 2 0 2 1 2.00 1-2 - - 12.0 1.00 RSA JN Gillespie 2 43 13 90 8 11.25 3-11 - - 32.2 2.09 AUS JM Anderson 1 31.1 10 79 6 13.16 4-40 - - 31.1 2.53 ENG SD Udal 1 25.2 5 67 5 13.40 4-14 - - 30.4 2.64 ENG Mohammad Asif 4 139.1 30 412 25 16.48 6-44 2 1 33.4 2.96 PAK Shoaib Malik - A world class allrounder. Bowling, batting and fielding. The highest ranking odi bowling average for 2006 for Pakistan. With injuries left and right Pakistan has still not surrendered and they are still making the best of a dismal situation.

I agree slug but sadly we gave NO fight whatsoever at Manchester. We did at Lords though.

[Long_Live_Pakistan]

Injuries or no injuries....we played like a c grade team in 2nd test match....
injurires are part of current day cricket.....you got to take it or you are always crying......
If pak cricket management, cant make use of the brilliant natural talent, that we always had in our upcomming bowlers and not prepare them for such times, we will suffer......

by the way, series is not over yet and there is every chance, that all of us who are spitting at 2nd match results, will be posting in congratulation threads....

I am confident......Inshahllah.

[Fessal]

Originally Posted by Kamranz I am proud we lost! I hate draws they dont make you a good fighter!

whats there to be proud off? with all respect to you bhai but we have nothing to be proud off from that defeat. You can only be proud of your team in defeat if they try and compete. Our performance was none of that but gutless. We surrendered tame.

[PlanetPakistan]

Originally Posted by Kamranz I am proud we lost! I hate draws they dont make you a good fighter!

[PlanetPakistan]

I am happy of the way we have played in the last 18 months or so but our performance at OT was nothing but shameful! ENG simply destroyed us from top to bottom, left to right and even diagonally!!!