The Aloo that wouldn't Peel

[infamous9383]

congrats to inzi for showing what a major player he is. His form is questioned but when it comes to pressure situations he's the aloo that won't peal

[PlanetPakistan]

..good one lalla!

[pakistani pride]

Gayle to Inzamam-ul-Haq, FOUR, Cometh the Hour, Cometh the Man - loose delivery on the middle and leg stump line. Inzi quickly goes down on one knee and sweeps it past the diving fielder at short fine leg - that's a crucial boundary

Inzi is the master !

[Kashif]

Love the title abdul. Take away the potato power today and we'd have struggled to get to a hundred. Welcome back to form Inzi.

[ehjaz]

Originally Posted by abdul9383 congrats to inzi for showing what a major player he is. His form is questioned but when it comes to pressure situations he's the aloo that won't peal

Aloo that supposedly looks soft for the opposition but hard as rock when it comes to pressure situation(s)..

[midwicket]

Attritional innings, well paced. Should help him back to form.

[waqar_ahmad]

inzi is still our best batsman under pressure.

[Hash]

Inzy zindabaad.

He is simply the best

[Easa]

All those wrist slitters in the commentary thread once again have anda and saalan on their faces. Inzamam is a legend, the best batsman EVER to play for Pakistan.

[PlanetPakistan]

Originally Posted by Easa All those wrist slitters in the commentary thread once again have anda and saalan on their faces. Inzamam is a legend, the best batsman EVER to play for Pakistan.

Javed Miandad might have something to say to that...in fact even i have something to say to that!....Miandad was a better bat

[Hash]

Originally Posted by PlanetPakistan Javed Miandad might have something to say to that...in fact even i have something to say to that!....Miandad was a better bat

Matter of opinion.

It certainly isn't ridiculous to say Inzy is better than Miandad. I tend to agree that he is.

[PlanetPakistan]

Originally Posted by Hash Matter of opinion. It certainly isn't ridiculous to say Inzy is better than Miandad. I tend to agree that he is.

Miandad was 'obviously' a better bat....Inzi wasted his talent in the mid 90s while J Miandad was a prime batsman through out his career

[UJ]

Lets not start a Inzi vs Miandad debate here, bump an old thread if you need to

Potatos that dont peal annoy the crap out of me usually, but not today

[Easa]

You know how everyone harps on about Inzi's average against the Australians and how it is poor? Do you know Miandad's average against the West Indies, the Australia of his time? Yeah, you guessed it. 29.

But its not only that. Firstly, I am far too young to have seen Javed bat. Secondly, Inzamam has won more matches for Pakistan than perhaps Miandad, 20 of his 25 100's have come in winning/drawing matches.

[Nauman]

Originally Posted by Hash Matter of opinion. It certainly isn't ridiculous to say Inzy is better than Miandad. I tend to agree that he is.

You are saying that just because you never saw Miandad batting.

[Hash]

Originally Posted by PlanetPakistan Miandad was 'obviously' a better bat....Inzi wasted his talent in the mid 90s while J Miandad was a prime batsman through out his career

he wasted his talent yet still has more centuries and is only 200 runs behind despite not having the advantage of home umpires.

[Hash]

Originally Posted by Nauman You are saying that just because you never saw Miandad batting.

Oh yeah same old pathetic excuse which all the oldies on this forum will use and claim that it makes them automatically correct by default. I did see Miandad bat a few times as I got into cricket properly in 1992 and I have seen plenty of videos.

It's my opinion. If you don't like it you will just have to deal with it.

[Nauman]

Dont get so defensive Hash.

[Easa]

Originally Posted by Nauman You are saying that just because you never saw Miandad batting.

Ridiculous comment. How the hell can you know if he never saw Miandad batting?

[PlanetPakistan]

Originally Posted by Easa You know how everyone harps on about Inzi's average against the Australians and how it is poor? Do you know Miandad's average against the West Indies, the Australia of his time? Yeah, you guessed it. 29. But its not only that. Firstly, I am far too young to have seen Javed bat. Secondly, Inzamam has won more matches for Pakistan than perhaps Miandad, 20 of his 25 100's have come in winning/drawing matches.

there are a lot of other factors that you have to think about e.g in Javed's era only 2 or 3 batsmen averaged over 50 and Miandad was one them....Inzi on the other hand for the 1st 8 years of his career was not even in the list of top 6 or 7 batsmen

[Hash]

Originally Posted by Nauman Dont get so defensive Hash.

Not getting defensive at all.

[PlanetPakistan]

ed

[Hash]

Originally Posted by PlanetPakistan there are a lot of other factors that you have to think about e.g in Javed's era only 2 or 3 batsmen averaged over 50 and Miandad was one them....Inzi on the other hand for the 1st 8 years of his career was not even in the list of top 6 or 7 batsmen

Not to mention Pakistani umpires giving Miandad not out at every opportunity (I accept this was not just limited to Pakistan and happened everywhere in the world).....something Inzy has not been able to benefit from at all.

[PlanetPakistan]

Originally Posted by Hash Not to mention Pakistani umpires giving Miandad not out at every opportunity (I accept this was not just limited to Pakistan and happened everywhere in the world).....something Inzy has not been able to benefit from at all.

then how do you explain Miandad's 46 average AWAY from home?

[Easa]

Originally Posted by PlanetPakistan there are a lot of other factors that you have to think about e.g in Javed's era only 2 or 3 batsmen averaged over 50 and Miandad was one them....Inzi on the other hand for the 1st 8 years of his career was not even in the list of top 6 or 7 batsmen

Well, another thing YOU have to consider is that Javed had the advantage of home umpires, and as he averaged a whole lot at home, I think he used them well.

We also had a far better batting lineup in the 70's and 80's with Majid, Nazar, Imran, Mohsin Khan, Sadiq Mohammad, Asif Iqbal, Zaheer Abbas, and Mushtaq Mohammad in the team. In the 90's, Inzi only had Saleem Malik to rely on.

[PlanetPakistan]

Originally Posted by Easa Well, another thing YOU have to consider is that Javed had the advantage of home umpires, and as he averaged a whole lot at home, I think he used them well. We also had a far better batting lineup in the 70's and 80's with Majid, Nazar, Imran, Mohsin Khan, Sadiq Mohammad, Asif Iqbal, Zaheer Abbas, and Mushtaq Mohammad in the team. In the 90's, Inzi only had Saleem Malik to rely on.

you forgot about S Anwar...

[Hash]

Originally Posted by PlanetPakistan then how do you explain Miandad's 46 average AWAY from home?

Inzi has a higher away average than Miandad

[Easa]

Originally Posted by PlanetPakistan then how do you explain Miandad's 46 average AWAY from home?

How do YOU explain his average of 61 at home, one which is a good 15 points more than his away one?

[Easa]

Originally Posted by PlanetPakistan you forgot about S Anwar...

Yeah, I did. Even still, comparing three batsman to about 10 at various points in the 70's and 80's.. well it's incomparable.

[m_sohail]

Not to mention, for a brief period in the early 2000s, Inzi and Yousuf were basically all the batting we had.

[PlanetPakistan]

Originally Posted by Hash Inzi has a higher away average than Miandad

yea by what 0.45 or something.....anyways the point i am trying to make it that Miandad was class both at and away from Home!

[Nauman]

Originally Posted by m_sohail Not to mention, for a brief period in the early 2000s, Inzi and Yousuf were basically all the batting we had.

Hence the reason why we were so terrible back then if we won any matches it was due to our bowling not batting.

[PlanetPakistan]

Originally Posted by m_sohail Not to mention, for a brief period in the early 2000s, Inzi and Yousuf were basically all the batting we had.

it will also be fair to mention that at that time the bowling around the world was below par!...

[Hash]

Originally Posted by PlanetPakistan yea by what 0.45 or something.....anyways the point i am trying to make it that Miandad was class both at and away from Home!

Yes but his home average (and therefore overall average) would also have been inflated by the home umpires (same with Gavaskar and other batsman around the world at that time)......something which Inzy has not had the benefit of.

[PlanetPakistan]

Originally Posted by Hash Yes but his home average (and therefore overall average) would also have been inflated by the home umpires (same with Gavaskar and other batsman around the world at that time)......something which Inzy has not had the benefit of.

shouldn't it work both ways? the away umps cheated too...so to maintain an average of 46 with bias umps and high class bowling is quite an accomplishment

[PlanetPakistan]

if Miandad had an opportunity to play against ZIM, BAN and the 'weak' W Indian attacks he would have averaged close to 60

[Hash]

Originally Posted by PlanetPakistan shouldn't it work both ways? the away umps cheated too...so to maintain an average of 46 with bias umps and high class bowling is quite an accomplishment

Yes it would work that way as well I suppose but not as much as at home where Miandad was literally not given LBW for about 5 years.

[Hash]

Originally Posted by PlanetPakistan if Miandad had an opportunity to play against ZIM, BAN and the 'weak' W Indian attacks he would have averaged close to 60

He had five innings against Zimbabwe at an average of 28

[PlanetPakistan]

Originally Posted by Hash He had five innings against Zimbabwe at an average of 28

5 innings....tail end of the career

[Hash]

Sri Lanka were not all that great in the mid 1980s.....pretty much the minnows of the time. In 12 matches he averaged just 41 against them.

[PlanetPakistan]

Inzi's average vs ZIM isnt too hot either(42)....it's the overall combination of ZIM, BAN and the weak W Indian attack that bumps up most people's average!(compare to those of the 80s)

[Hash]

So Miandad's average was inflated by home umpires
Inzi's average inflated by playing against minnows

I still think Inzy is better and I hope that he breaks every record Miandad holds before he retires.

[qasim722]

Originally Posted by Hash So Miandad's average was inflated by home umpires Inzi's average inflated by playing against minnows I still think Inzy is better and I hope that he breaks every record Miandad holds before he retires.

I think that is not the right way to judge the greatness of Inzy.
Inzy has only 10 Odi hundreds but he is way better than some players having more than 20 ODI hundreds.



Imran judged his potential only by watching him in the nets for few minutes.


Stats are not the ONLY way to judge a players potential.

[Hash]

Originally Posted by qasim722 I think that is not the right way to judge the greatness of Inzy. Inzy has only 10 Odi hundreds but he is way better than some players having more than 20 ODI hundreds. Imran judged his potential only by watching him in the nets for few minutes. Stats are not the ONLY way to judge a players potential.

I agree

[PlanetPakistan]

Originally Posted by qasim722 I think that is not the right way to judge the greatness of Inzy. Inzy has only 10 Odi hundreds but he is way better than some players having more than 20 ODI hundreds. Imran judged his potential only by watching him in the nets for few minutes. Stats are not the ONLY way to judge a players potential.

that's true...let's just say PAK is lucky to have produced both these legends

[TurkishCricketFan]

It is ridicolous that this thread has turned into a heated and unresolvable debate about who was the greater batsman.

Be happy with what Inzy achieved today and throughout his career. The guy is a legend.

[azcali78]

Inzy is great no doubt about this fact but Javed was another class. The reason I say this we cannot compare batsmen from different time period. Javed most of time in his carrier had to carry the batting by himself. Also Javed had to play against Aussie, English and WI great bowlers. There was no limit on bouncers, pitch’s were not that flat at any part of the world ,and also in beginning part of his carrier 70's there was no helmets.

You guys should watch the cricinfo round table discussion on this topic. Also, Javed was a great tactician of the game batting, changing bowling or setting up fielding, great judge of quick singles and was hardly the case that he was involved in any runouts. I have seen many times when him and Imran used be on field discussing strategies. They never got along off the field but you have to give it to them both that on the field they were most professional as ever. I know that has nothing to do this discussion

Just admit that Inzy and Javed are both greats and we are lucky that have them when they were both needed the most..

[siddharth]

Why are you fighting for two great batsmen of different era,both of them are great ,match winners,big match players.the only difference is Inzi more talented than Javed,while Javed was an exremely hard working fighter .i mean the way of getting runs is different for both ,Javed had a way of getting runs in a shrewd cunning way while Inzi is more straight and aggressive and extremely effortless.

[PlanetPakistan]

Originally Posted by TurkishCricketFan It is ridicolous that this thread has turned into a heated and unresolvable debate about who was the greater batsman. Be happy with what Inzy achieved today and throughout his career. The guy is a legend.

anything but..

[infamous9383]

Geez i didn't my thread would turn into inzi vs maindad. Well played Inzi anyways.

[MIG]

You mean the "petulant" Inzi is being praised now ? Wasnt he supposed to be jealous of MoYo and a danger to the team and himself

Pakistanis should thank their lucky stars that they have this man in their ranks - what good are these flash-dash stars when you cant even get to 150 !

People playing all kinds of stupid strokes - filled with panic - among all these, stands a man - an immovable object - Inzi.

[infamous9383]

Originally Posted by MIG You mean the "petulant" Inzi is being praised now ? Wasnt he supposed to be jealous of MoYo and a danger to the team and himself Pakistanis should thank their lucky stars that they have this man in their ranks - what good are these flash-dash stars when you cant even get to 150 ! People playing all kinds of stupid strokes - filled with panic - among all these, stands a man - an immovable object - Inzi.

couldn't said it better

[Sultan Yusuf]

Inzi is a poor man's miandad....

[MIG]

Originally Posted by Naved Inzi is a poor man's miandad....

And believe me, we are poor!

[Sultan Yusuf]

Originally Posted by MIG And believe me, we are poor!

Clearly!

[Sultan Yusuf]

Originally Posted by Easa You know how everyone harps on about Inzi's average against the Australians and how it is poor? Do you know Miandad's average against the West Indies, the Australia of his time? Yeah, you guessed it. 29. But its not only that. Firstly, I am far too young to have seen Javed bat. Secondly, Inzamam has won more matches for Pakistan than perhaps Miandad, 20 of his 25 100's have come in winning/drawing matches.

Dear oh dear! Averages, averages, stats, stats. Except stats are excluded when comparing inzi to moyo or even other greats??

If you are trying to imply that Javed didn't perform Vs the Windies, cast your mind back to 1988, check all the tests, the bowlers involved, the results of the matches and the pitches they were played on....

In future, please don't comment on greats you haven't witnessed.

Cheers.

[Slugger]

one good inning and everyone gets behind him?

pakistanis are too emotional and sentimental

[Slugger]

don't even start comparing inzi to Master Miandad

[MIG]

Naved - no need to put down people like that Bhai.

Easa can only base his opinion on what he has seen.

[Sultan Yusuf]

Originally Posted by MIG Naved - no need to put down people like that Bhai. Easa can only base his opinion on what he has seen.

No problem, but really once in a while people need to be told...

no offence intended, but couldn't really put it differently...

[KB]

I still remember Inzamam's performance at Ahmedabad on Pakistan's last tour to India. With 4 dot balls in the final over and 1 needed, a lot of batsman would have panicked.

But Inzamam showed his coolness, by not only getting the run, but actually placing the ball into the gap by opening the face of the bat. It was a delicate shot, rather than a forced or 'big' shot, which many batsman would have attempted to play, especially with the field up.

That demonstrated the temperament he has.

[KB]

On the subject of playing under pressure, some interesting thoughts from Gideon Haigh:

http://blogs.cricinfo.com/eyeontheas...treat.php#more

The Difference Between Retreat and Surrender


From Dunkirk to Burma, from India to Hong Kong, the English used to excel in tactical retreat and strategic withdrawal. Why have their cricketers become so naff at it? Their display on Tuesday veered between transfixed inactivity to ill-timed spasms of aggression, the prosaic nature of the challenge of playing for a draw seeming to hold no appeal for them. A year ago in Perth, the South Africans Jacques Rudolph and Justin Kemp gave a superb display of positive defence to stalemate Australia. They set themselves to score in certain sectors of the field, but not others. They carefully restarted with every bowling change. They turned over the strike to exploit their left/right-hand contrast. England had noone prepared to emulate their example. Kevin Pietersen might have run himself out in getting off the mark; the sweep to his first ball from Warne then put him in the Private Pike category of stupidity.


Part of the problem, I suspect, which I have raised here before, is the nature of modern preparation for Test cricket, which has become increasingly biomechanical in its emphasis, with training dedicated to the reliable reproduction of skills and match situations simulated by drills. Players are so cosseted because of the concern about their international workloads that they play virtually no first-class cricket; coaches tinker with them in the nets as though they are no more than static mechanisms, and Test matches essentially staggered deployments of resources. How many times had Ken Barrington batted out time in first-class cricket before being expected to do it for England? How many times had Andrew Flintoff?

Nothing prepares a player for cricket matches than other cricket matches. Your skills are tested under different scenarios. Your nerve is assessed under pressure. You are accountable to teammates for your performance. Your performance is taken down on your permanent record. These days, it seems, a good many players are helpless without management telling them their ‘role’, and setting their ‘performance benchmarks’. Management has a vested interest in this: it enhances its own importance. So does the player: it enables them to evade responsibility. My favourite quote of the Champions Trophy was Steve Harmison’s response to his omission in the Daily Mail: ‘I don’t quite know why I was dropped yesterday because the management didn’t tell me, but I can only assume it was because I didn’t bowl particularly well in the first two games.’ Perhaps the memo from human resources got lost.

This won’t change, by the way. Economic forces militate against it. Be prepared for more cricketers who can hit a perfect cover drive under no pressure at all, but who fall apart on the first day of series and blame ‘nerves’.

[octavian]

Inzi is the greatest.. he has saved out ass on so many occaisions. its isnt even funny anymore. Hail King Inzi.

The BEST batsman to play for pakistan ever

[Amir]

This is where Inzi is under-rated. People speak of match winning 100s of Tendulkar and Ponting, yet fail to realzie the amount of times Inzi has won us the game witha crucial 30,40,50 or 60. The man is so calm and never is under pressure. He can turn up the heat whenever he chooses too.

Espicially int he one day game, hundreds do not come by so easily, so it is hard to believe so many people overlook this fact.

Cometh the hour, Cometh the man. Thank you Inzi once again.

[octavian]

Originally Posted by Amir This is where Inzi is under-rated. People speak of match winning 100s of Tendulkar and Ponting, yet fail to realzie the amount of times Inzi has won us the game witha crucial 30,40,50 or 60. The man is so calm and never is under pressure. He can turn up the heat whenever he chooses too. Espicially int he one day game, hundreds do not come by so easily, so it is hard to believe so many people overlook this fact. Cometh the hour, Cometh the man. Thank you Inzi once again.

who talk about those ?

[Saj]

Originally Posted by Nauman You are saying that just because you never saw Miandad batting.

Nauman, out of interest how much of Miandad did you see yaar?

You say you are 21, meaning you were born in 1985. Miandad made his debut in 1975. His last test was in 1993 when you were 8 years old and his last test ODI was played in 1996 when you were 11 ?

Inzamam is the life and blood of the Pakistani batting. Yousuf has been in fantastic form of late, Younis is good, but if you want someone to win you a match in a tight situation its Inzamam "nerves of steel" ul Haq for me.

[KB]

Of course it is easy to say that younger members will be biased in favour of Inzamam as they did not see as much of Miandad.

But that is not the only bias at work. Those who grew up watching and being inspired by Miandad, are likely to remain faithful to the old master. This is because those formative years of watching cricket, when your growing up learning about the game and being inspired by cricketers, is a highly influential period. The "first heroes" are heroes that will often remain unsurpassed with the passage of time.

[Sultan Yusuf]

Just to put things in context. Admittedly Inzi has played some great knocks in some important matches.

However, no-one is doing anyone any favours referring to the current WI match or the Ahmedabad ODI as examples. These matches were part of thousands of ODIs that are played almost too regularly now. And let's face it, even when ODIs were a "rarer" commodity, the results were quickly forgotten unless it was an important WC match or the final of a multi-nation competition. The same rule applies here.

[KB]

However, no-one is doing anyone any favours referring to the current WI match or the Ahmedabad ODI as examples. These matches were part of thousands of ODIs that are played almost too regularly now. And let's face it, even when ODIs were a "rarer" commodity, the results were quickly forgotten unless it was an important WC match or the final of a multi-nation competition. The same rule applies here.

The reason the Ahmedabad LOI match was cited was that it was a great example of Inzamam's coolness under pressure, which was apt to point out in the context of his recent perfromance against the West Indies and the discssion in this thread.

Whatever meaning is accorded to those matches now is somewhat irrelevant to the point, as it does not alter the fact that they were fine innings under pressure.